Beyond Heroic Leadership: Building Systems That Actually Work

Hey, this is Tim, and welcome to the Student Life Podcast, where we explore the everyday challenges and big questions of life through a biblical lens while navigating the realities of a secular world. Enjoy. Hey yo, what's up? So it's Tim Pratt Jr., and we're going to jump into this episode today called Beyond Heroic Leadership: Building Systems That Actually Work. And so as always, I typically sometimes go deeply faith and deeply biblical, and sometimes I just stay light with it. And we, 'cause we deal with all things life, uh, but I don't separate my faith from my workplace and I don't separate the workplace from my faith. Uh, they're integrated. Uh, so let, let's jump straight into this particular episode today. So, uh, one of the things I want to talk about is this concept of heroic leadership and then systems, of course. And a lot of times what I mean by heroic leadership is when a certain person or certain group of people, they have to basically carry majority of the load or the whole entire load. And most ministries or organizations, like, they don't choose it. They end up drifting there where everything depends on a few people to work harder, you know, rescue everything and just absorb these like impossible cognitive loads that leads to chaos and it leads to burnout. And truthfully, we're honest, it leads to a lot of reactivity. And so today I want to talk about that a little bit and why it's not healthy. Like, even Jesus himself didn't even participate in systems like this. And so again, one of the things that we have to understand is that heroic leadership, it may feel spiritual, it may feel just amazing, like, oh, look at me, or look at my team, like how we're actually like carrying all of this. But again, it's actually a sign of unhealthy systems. It is not— it is just— it's, it's going to lead to just weariness. Like it's going to lead to burnout. It's going to lead to chaos. It is not healthy. And so we want to create sustainable leadership. We want to create healthy systems that's built on clarity, systems thinking, and a shared responsibility. And so for me, I was like, I really started studying this like 4 or 5 years ago when I was working on my Certified Agile Leadership certification and then enterprise coaching. And like, I was again like a Scrum Master studying like a lot of product ownership, team level coaching, team level facilitation, but I want to go like that next gear and a deeper version of the Certified Agile Leader. And again, enterprise coaching, enterprise leadership. And so I started to study like coaching systems, navigating the system and all of that type of things., with my project management background as well. And so it's this blend of agility and project management. And, uh, again, not, not like trying to make myself sound good or anything like that, but I want to give you some context because this is what I do a lot of times. I don't know everything, but I understand like this was a game changer for me when I really started to study and understand it at a deeper level. So like I said, um, one of the first things I want to point out is that Um, we often drift into this mindset. Like, most leaders don't become heroes because they want to in these type of environments. They do it because the system is unclear and underdeveloped. And so one of the things we have to understand as leaders is that when everything depends on a few people, it's chaotic for them. No matter if they say it or not, it's very chaotic from it for them because it's the cognitive load Their decision is— decisions are going to slow down, or they're not going to be well thought out. When it's a habitual practice, the rate for, like, the, the, uh, burnout, it rises. Weariness, it rises. Again, it can lead to dumb decisions, and then the ministry or the organization or team or whatever, it becomes reactive instead of proactive. Because one thing I'll say, just to be straight up with you, is that anytime people depend more on, more on my speed than our system, we're already in trouble. It should be a key indicator that we're in trouble if I have to operate and be fast in a dysfunctional system. And so, um, again, as a leader, you want to be very aware, am I drifting in that direction? Um, because I'm not evaluating, because I keep going to this conference, I keep reading these books, I keep listening to these podcasts, and I just keep throwing things and throwing things into system, but I'm not taking the time to refactor it, and I don't even know the system myself. Like, I'm not saying you're going to know everything because we have our own bias and things of that nature, but it's a way that you should be able to evaluate that. And we're going to get into that next here shortly. But as a leader, you want to be very careful, uh, with just making sure that you're creating a system. Because a lot of leaders, they, they can be really good at inspiring and motivating people, but they don't think about the system, uh, and how it's a living organism and how it supports people. I mean, people are always growing, things are always transforming. So the system again is a living organism. It has to always be evaluated and monitored, and decisions have to be made, not just people decisions, but in decisions of this, the system, modernize the system. So again, you're going to hear that word a lot, system, system, systems. But system thinking, you know, it, it helps us as leaders see what's really going on. Because this is the thing, a lot of times people do narrative controlling, and what I mean by that is that we don't get the full facts. So I'm not going to go into that in this particular episode, but what I want to say is that, uh, we can't fix what we refuse to see. We cannot fix what we refuse to see. Like, we have to create an environment, we have to create a world where people can sustain without all the heroics, consistently, consistently the habitual heroic behavior. And a lot of times this leads us into a breakdown of just essentials. Like, it just— we want to keep things light and we want to make sure that we're using simple, common language where if I say something over here, it means the same thing over here. So that's kind of at the heart. But again, we cannot fix what we refuse to see. We have to be willing to have the courage to see, okay, what type of system have we allowed? What type of system have we created? As leaders. And if it's a horrible system, that's not a bad thing, but it is a bad thing when you refuse to see it. And so number one, we want to visualize the system. Again, we want to see reality as it is, not as we think it is or what we want it to be. We want to see it as it actually is. So things like workflows, gaps, bottlenecks, and expectations and things of that nature. Number two, we want to create focus. Once you see everything, we have to choose what actually matters right now. Everything can't be a priority. It can't. One of my favorite quotes is that, especially in the ministry, if the devil can't make you sin, he'll make you busy. He'll make you distracted because it almost has the same effect. Like, it does. I mean, and again, you don't have to agree with that wholeheartedly, but if you just think about it, if you're distracted and you're just, oh, I'm going to this, I'm going this, I'm going this, I'm going to— I'm going to that, like, how are you creating a divine focus? And so that, that's something that we have to think about too, because like The reality of it is like, what's priority number 1? What's priority number 2? What's priority number 3? Because our minds and things are going to move like, what is the top priority? Is this more priority than that? And a lot of times we want like 3 priority ones, and life doesn't work like that. I'm not saying things can't work in parallel, parallel, or in tandem with one another, but for the most part, especially depending on like the team that you have and all of that, but, uh, but for the most part Priority number 1, priority number 2, priority number 3, especially when things are hot. So again, we want to do— once we see everything, we want to choose and make sure we're working on what actually matters. We want to establish a healthy rhythm. So what do I mean by this? So we want to have daily or weekly sync points. For some people, it might be weekly or biweekly. Like in the context I work, we have daily, like what we call this thing, daily sync, daily scrum. But these aren't just meetings for status updates. They're like basically to help us coordinate and clarity. So if you're in a local church where it's like a lot of people volunteering and things of that nature, um, you, you probably want to more so lean on the side of just weekly or biweekly and just have those touch points for coordination and clarity. Again, you can set up a simple to-do, in-progress, and done board, Kanban style, and just say like, okay, where are we with this? Check how long it's been sitting there. What's the updates? The frequency of the updates? Is it the same update? Like, what's going on? We blocked— just getting into things like that. I have a, um, YouTube video out there, I believe talks about flow. Uh, you can go to my YouTube page, Tim Pratt Jr. Um, and so again, we want to just establish that healthy rhythm, touch points, just to make sure that we're slowing down and addressing the right things. Uh, we want to measure progress. Now that's number 4. So not, uh, yeah, the last one was number 3, so this was number 4. Uh, not to micromanage, but to know if things are actually working. Like, I need to know again, like, if things are blocked, if things are just waiting, are we Uh, like, why is it hanging up? Are we working around it? Are we not working around it? Do we need to merge this into something else? Do we just need to cancel it? Like, have we exhausted too much manpower or women power? Like, what is it? Like, progress. Like, why isn't this flowing? Especially in the context of ministry. So again, it's not to micromanage, but to ask those questions of why isn't it flowing or why isn't it working. And number 5, we want to operate and improve. Listen, clarity comes in degrees. You want to run the system, learn from it in real time, and then improve it. Not— this is not theory, this is not wishful thinking, but it's just real-world feedback and real-world adjustments. Again, clarity comes in degrees. So that's just a light 5-point thing of what you can do as a leader, or you can listen to this podcast with your team. And also too, like the The working guide is always within the podcast itself. So you can just copy and paste that and bring it up again and use it as a working thing with your team, or you can bring me in and I can help you. So then we wanna move to the leadership mindset shift. So this one is big for me 'cause this is kind of like a posture that I take. You wanna slow things down so people can actually think. Again, a book, A Minute to Think. I, uh, I was at the Global Leadership Conference and I think it's Juliet— can't think her last name right now— but, uh, slow things down so you can actually think. Activity isn't productivity. Jim Rohn said it best, um, so many people are busy, but busy doing what? Because it's easy to get faked out. Like, busy doesn't always mean that you're progressing at something. So you want to simplify the work so it is not overwhelming for people. Because this is the thing, when things are deeply complex and people can't understand things and just it's all over the place or whatever, it destroys momentum. It does. Like, as a leader, you have to understand that. Another posture you, you want to think about is amplify signals so issues are caught early. Like, this is a posture that you have to take in your mind. This is a mindset shift as a leader. Because you don't want to wait to address problems when they're on fire. You want to address them when you know about them. Try to address them in real time or close to real time as possible. And this kind of goes back to like those daily or weekly or biweekly syncs. We call those feedback loops, um, in what I do. So again, this is the opposite of heroic leadership. This is what healthy leadership and healthy systems do. It allows you to do as a person, uh, as a leader, as an organization, as a ministry. Uh, to my faith-based people, because I know that was kind of like very organizational driven, but why, why this matters, uh, spiritually and practically. Well, for one, Jesus didn't build his ministry on a few heroes. He built a system of disciples. He built a system of disciples with shared rhythms and clarity of the mission. They knew what they was doing. Jesus, if anybody knew his purpose, it was Jesus Christ. The early church just didn't grow on heroic leaders. It grew on sustainable and relational and repeatable patterns. Now don't get me wrong, I understand James and all of that, things of that nature, but the real— Peter— but the reality of it is this thing was built on the foundation of Christ. Now I'm not trying to say Jesus is just systems. I'm not trying to like I'm not trying to get into all of that. What I'm saying is that, but if you look in the context of scripture, these things was built on community because it wasn't going to be built on where one person— even Jesus said you will go on to do greater things. Like, not that we will supersede the cross, but because he knew that together, the community, man, you're going to be able to move things. Like, you're going to be able to cover so much more ground as he was in, in the flesh, as God became man in flesh. Jesus is God. So, but he was limited in his humanity. He was because he was in the flesh. So again, I'm not trying to unpack and get all into that, but theologically though, again, we would never supersede the cross. That's not what he was talking about in greater, but it was more so in the posture of numbers, meaning the ground that we were covering, the disciples that we were making develop. So because the greatest gift that we can give our teams is not our speed, it's not, it's not our speed, it is clarity. It is clarity. I believe that's one of the greatest gifts you can give people, uh, give you the ministry that you're leading, give the organization, the teams, whatever. It's clarity. It's one of the greatest gifts you can give. Uh, matter of fact, I'm gonna just quote this real quick. Um, I can't remember where I got it from, but if everything depends on me, something is broken. 'If everything relies on the system, we can grow.' I love that. 'If everything depends on me, something is broken. If everything relies on the system, we can grow.' Um, I would say in actuality, um, yeah, because we're at the end, this is kind of a short one because I really want you to take the time to listen to this and like say download the guide, the Student Life Guide Beyond Heroic Leadership. Um, but heroic is again heroic leadership can feel good for a moment. Like, again, uh, people can be like, oh man, I'm carrying this, bravo. I mean, at times in life, yes, we have to maintain a goal line stance, but we don't want to play like that the whole game. I don't want to be in a goal line defensive posture and mindset the entire game. Like, no, I don't. And so, but we— there's moments for that. Like, so what I'm trying to say is that yes, in certain seasons it might be, you know, like where this is heavy, but let's not confuse a season with a cycle because some of us are just in cycles because seasons change, but cycles change when we do. Like, again, I come out of a season and I'm going into this season and it just happens because again, that was just a difficult season of life I'm in. But what happens when I'm actually in the cycle that I'm calling the season. No. And then it's like 4 or 5 seasons and went by, and I'm still in the same cycle, I'm still in the same rut because I'm not addressing the system. So I have to address the cycle. Oh man, I can really go there and unpack this, but I'm not. So as a leader, again, heroics can feel good for a moment, but healthy systems, like, they last for generations. So I just want to challenge you, if you're a leader listening to this, Slow down, simplify, amplify, and give your team the clarity they need to win, not survive alone. Listen, I'ma just share my heart here, and I know I'm breathing kind of heavy, but, um, as I said with Jesus, a lot of times I like to ask this question, especially to ministry leaders: do you think you're better than Jesus? Like Jesus walking on the flesh? If Jesus modeled, and often we drew, and he took Sabbaths, he took a sabbatical. And if as a leader you never get away to evaluate things, you never pray— and I understand, like, vocational, bi-vocational leaders and stuff, it could be a little bit more challenging versus people that are in full-time vocation ministry— but I'm just saying, even if it's a few hours or a moment or a vacation, like, if you never take that and get still whatever. Like, are you better than Jesus when he modeled stillness and getting away from people, the demands of ministry? Read your Bible, read the gospel. The demand was always hot. There was always a demand for Jesus. But why did he withdraw? Why do we see him healing on the Sabbath? Is this— is like, again, I, I don't— because I don't have time to unpack this, and I hate throwing things out there and then stuff becomes a soundbite. But just in this context, why— have you ever asked yourself, why did Jesus— why do we see Jesus healing on the Sabbath? Is that an indicator? Just asking the question, man, God, do you want to heal some things in my life? So I can— whether it may be seeing better, my health, all this type of stuff. Because again, a lot of times I believe that we're praying for God to do things and say, keep this, God, and help us and give us the strength But then on the side, okay, God is a God of order, and when we're not in God's order, there's always going to be chaos. And so as a leader, we have to pause and ask, okay, am I being obedient to the word of God, or I'm asking God to use me in spite of me? Am I asking him now to approve something, uh, within my life when I'm actually in the contradiction to his whole counsel of his word? Like, I know ministry and leading in these things come at a great sacrifice, But at the same time, the Bible said, okay, hey, I get all of that, but you not me. Like, that's what I always say. God didn't call me to die for the church. Jesus already did that. And yes, there's a tension, but when is this a sacrifice, and then when is it just a way of life because that's how you're programmed as a leader? What if it's not a sacrifice anymore but just your dysfunction? What if you're not helping people but you're always enabling people now? Because what if you're enabling a bad system? Like, these are things that we have to really think about in the context of our leadership. And that's between you and God and people that can look you in your face and actually tell you the truth. But you want to make sure, like, don't always just wait for a Nathan to come to you. Go seek out one. I'm not, I'm not trying to stretch the text, you know, because a lot of times it's like we preach this sermon every day, it needs a Nathan, you know, and God sent Nathan. But I'm, I'm challenging you to go find your Nathan. Go to— go talk to that person and give them, like, tell them straight up, hey man, look, just tell them like it is. You're not gonna hurt my feelings. Like, tell me straight up, don't sugarcoat it. What is it? What's going on? Because this is what's going to help you. Remember what I said, like, this narrative control? And I see it all the time in the context of ministry, uh, I mean, like, organizations in the workplace, where a lot of times the higher a leader moves up, the less that they know the truth that they know. So they can't really evaluate the system properly. Because people are narrative controlling. And so again, as a leader, you just want to go back to those things and just make sure that you're properly evaluating, you're seeing the real issue. And again, this is a living document, so when you make a change here, you're, you're trying to see what does this impact throughout the whole thing, not just an isolated switch. Again, I can get into terms of value stream mapping and value stream management, all that type of stuff. Impact mapping, but as leaders. And I will help you with this. Like, I will come into your ministry, your organization. Um, I'm, I'm qualified, you know, from a certification level and experience level. Um, and I'm willing to help. Again, I don't know it all, but I'm willing to help. I'm committed to figuring it out with you. But I, I really want to like just talk to the leaders and challenge and, you know, have you to get with your teams and just kind of go through this. And say, are we building systems that actually work? Are we building systems that actually work? Or are we building systems that lead to chaos, dysfunction, and burnout within our organization, within our ministry? And again, because as a leader or as leaders, you shape the culture. You shape it. So if you're the problem, you're also the solution. Remember, if you're the problem, you're also the solution. Be blessed, man. I love you all, and I pray this episode helped you in some kind of way. Even if it's home, forgot about that. Even if it's home, look at your system at home with your kids, yourself. If you're consistently trying to lose weight or gain weight or get in shape, look at your system. Because— and I promise you, I'll close on this— because I believe it was, um, in Atomic Habits, we don't rise to the level of our goals, we fall to the level of our systems, or we fail to live our system, something like that. So be blessed, man. I love you all, praying for you. And again, I hope this podcast touched you in some kind of way. See ya. Thanks for joining me today on the Student Life Podcast. And remember, learning never stops and wisdom grows as we seek truth in both scripture and life. And until next time, keep walking faithfully and thinking deeply. Be blessed.