How to Navigate Transitions as a Business Owner w/ Sam Altieri

Welcome to the Makeshift Happen podcast. I'm your host, Samantha Daly, entrepreneur, life coach, and your no BS bestie, here to bring you all things mindset, manifestation, and personal development. This podcast is designed to help you expand your mind and uplevel your life. So turn the volume up and roll the windows down if you're coming along for the ride. Let's go make shit happen.

What's up, guys? Welcome back to the podcast, the episodes that you're always waiting for. The one and only Sam Alteri is back. We're doing another Sam and Sam podcast.

Hi. Hi.

So many of you guys love these episodes. So I'm excited to bring Sam back and to catch you guys up on what's been going on in our lives since the last time we recorded. It's been a little bit because a lot of stuff was happening for you and for me. Like, both of our lives were just like flipped upside down. So much change and lots of, you know, positive, good stuff. But we thought we'd share with you guys, you know, what's been going on in our lives. And how we're navigating the transitions, holding it all, obviously, you know, maintaining everything in terms of being an online business owner, showing up while lots of stuff is shifting in our lives and just give you the context. Because if you listened to that episode with Sam and I, it was— I don't want to say it was like depressing. There were so many good nuggets in there, like it wasn't depressing, but we were really talking about like the how to navigate a moment or a period in your life when you feel really stuck. And both of us were stuck in our parents' homes, or you were with your in-laws. I was with my parents and feeling that like yearning for growth and expansion and a way out, but also feeling like there's so many external barriers and things that were just stopping us from being able to move forward and moving through that kind of like icky sticky, like, oh, like I just want I just want to grow. Like, I just want to get out there. I just want to do this thing. But everything feels like it's kind of happening against me where, like, I can't move forward. So just to give more context to— yes, we have. We have moved on.

We have moved on.

Things have gotten a lot better. And what that all has been like, what's going on? The energetics of it, and any lessons that we've learned. So that's the intention for this podcast. But as you guys know, when Sam and I jump on to record, we literally just talk. So who knows where this could go? We could end up talking about like relationships or sex or something. Totally. But that's what we're starting with. So stick with us.

Yeah, it's always so fun. I, I look forward to our conversation so much because it just feels so like it's literally just us besties catching up and everyone along for the ride listening and like us just sharing our lives like, yo, this is what it's like to run a business and have a life and have a relationship and have a dog and like—

The dog!

Health and like manage and balance it all. And I do think that that's such a, um, like that I feel like is a huge question I get all of the time is how do you balance it all? Like, I just don't understand. And I think it's been really interesting and I'm so grateful being in— so for those of you who don't know, I'm a full-time vanlifer. Me and my fiancé and our 90-pound dog Heffy, we live in a, like, basically the biggest Sprinter, like Mercedes Sprinter van that you can buy. It literally is the biggest. It has like a tall roof, it's long as fuck, it makes takes like 1.5 parking spots, like she's a big boy, uh, big girl. But like, it's still not that much space. And so yeah, I think moving and transitioning out of Kurt's mom's house into this, there's been so much expansion of like, oh my god, we're on the road, we're seeing these beautiful things. Um, like, I mean, we can talk about all the details of like these beautiful nature scenes that just feel so picturesque and fake. But again, it's so funny how being in this environment, oh, there's other stuff that comes up, right? It's like, oh, now I'm in 80 square feet with my fiancé. When I have to poop, I have to be like, um, you know, like, so there's always going to be something. And I think it's so easy to kind of, uh, like think that there's a perfect environment, like that doesn't exist. But I think going back to kind of the balancing of it all, I'm really excited to dig into this because I actually haven't, I guess, like, uncovered how I've done it, if that makes sense. Like, I've just been doing it. I don't know if you can relate to that.

Yeah, 100%. I think, like, if you were to ask me, like, how do you balance it all? My first answer would be like, I don't— like, I don't know what you're talking about. Like, things slip through the cracks, like, all the fucking time. Yeah. Um, but somehow I am sort of balancing it all, and as, as are you, you know what I mean? Like, of course we're not going to be perfect at everything all the time, so maybe it doesn't feel like we're succeeding or achieving in the balance area. But we are holding a lot of space for many things at once, which is, I guess, the idea of balance. But I think I've always, I've always, I don't know, I've always struggled with the idea of balance because I think the word, at least in my head, and maybe it's me creating a new— I like to create new definitions for things if I ever feel like they're not serving me. Maybe it's the definition that I have in my head of balance, but it feels like it implies that this sort of perfection of like, I'm on top of my health and also quality time with my partner, and I'm also making $100,000 a month, and I'm also running a top— like, you know what I mean? Like, it— to me, like, when people are like talking about balance, it feels like doing everything perfectly simultaneously. Mm. But I think probably what balance actually is, is prioritization and knowing that everything can't be done perfectly. So holding space for what's a priority to you and what's important to you and what's serving you, and also giving yourself grace when it doesn't work out 100% the way that maybe you intended or hoped, but knowing that you tried and you just try again.

Yeah, yeah, totally. I mean, I think what you said about the perfection piece, like 100%, I think anyone online that's telling you they've, they've reached the pinnacle of balance, run far away. Like, that's not real life.

Yeah, I just think it's fake. Like, to me, I've always felt like balance implies like perfection in all areas, which to me I'm just like, wait, but that's not real, so like what the fuck?

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I think so if we like, let's just use that word for now, or maybe the word is harmony. Like, I like the word harmony because it kind of feels more fluid. Like, it's kind of like a dance. Like, that's how I see my life. Like, my priorities are always moving around. Like, I actually just did a podcast on this, how my business is not my number one priority right now, and that's been the first time it's been that way since I've started it. And I think that in terms of managing it all, holding it all, for me anyways, I think it comes down to the belief that I can handle it. Like, it almost feels like it started with like small micro steps, right? Because it's like your nervous system, like you have to be able to be like, okay, I'm going to— for me, for example, I'm going to do van life, not really sure when I have Wi-Fi, also have my podcast, also coach, also have my member— like, I'm like holding all these things and I would be completely lying if I was like, oh yeah, like, it's, it's like, it's great, yeah, everything's like dandy. It's like, no, there's so many times where I ask myself, can I actually handle this? Like, what am I doing? Like, you need to cancel things, you need to stop things. Like, my brain is always trying to tell me that you— that I can't do it. Like, it's always telling me that. And I think because I have so much time with my thoughts being just in the van, like, we don't have a TV, like, there's so many things that we don't have, so many distractions that we don't have. So it's really forced me to face myself. And it's, it's super interesting noticing those thoughts when maybe in the past I would have just been like, "Oh, you're right, I can't handle it." But I've been really hyper-aware of my beliefs just about being like, "No, Sam, like, you are literally doing the best that you can." And I think for this season in my life right now, like, traveling and family and building, um, like, stripping away all the shit in my business that doesn't feel super sustainable or like really, really, really nurturing and like creating like sustainability and like safety. Has created a lot of like uncertainty because I'm like, wait, everything I thought I was building, I'm changing.

Ah, right?

And there's like so much change and then being in the van, that's so much. So yeah, I really believe that one of the pieces is definitely the beliefs, like making sure that I am being my own best advocate and when I'm not, forgiving myself for it because like I'm obviously not perfect and I definitely beat myself up still and it's like okay, noticing that, letting it be okay, having grace and then moving on. And I feel like that's really the biggest thing I've been learning in the attempt to air quotes "balance it all" because yo, van life, it is so tempting to just be like fuck the business, let's go to a hot spring and stay there.

You know? That's what I was saying to you. I'm like, how do you, how are you like remembering to work when you're basically just like on a vacation all the time?

Yeah, it is really, I mean, honestly it's been really challenging. Um, thank God for Google Calendar. Like that keeps me in check. But yeah, I think it's actually helped me see what I want, like the type of business I want and the type of business I don't want. Um, because like right now Kurt's not working and so that's also super hard because he's not working and I am. And so there's this like, like he has the whole day to just frolic and like hang out.

And so we're in the same, we're in the same boat.

It is like, it requires so much devotion to our why, you know?

Yeah.

And it is so easy to lose the why and just wanna fucking stay in the hot spring. Like, I was literally in a hot spring this morning. I was telling Sam before we hit record, and I was like, it was amazing. Like, the water felt so good. I did like a cold plunge, I did the hot, I did the cold, I did the hot. And then I was like, well, should probably go do some work, you know? And then I came into the van, I, you know, I washed my hair, and that felt nice. I hadn't done that in a while. And then popped on the computer, and I was like, okay, I'm gonna like get myself organized. And I think To answer your question, how do I remember? It's my feelings. When I start to notice anxiety while I'm having fun, I know it's time to get back to work. Like, yeah, because there's a, there's a moment where I'm like, Sam, you have things to do, right? And it's this like, you don't have to do that, but you will be kind of kicking yourself if you don't.

And it's almost like it's not fun anymore because if you were to continue the fun, it would turn into self-sabotage.

Yes, and guilt, and like, then I would feel so like, yeah, I mean, yes, 100% self-sabotage. So that's the point in which I notice it. I literally get this feeling in my gut that's just like, okay, it's time. And then like, I would say, I don't know if it's 100% of the time, but I've really been tuning into that because I've started to notice that like showing up in little baby ways where I have to set a boundary and be like, hey Kurt, like, I need to go do work, or I need to go get Wi-Fi, I need to go to a coffee shop, or like we need to go into town or whatever. Um, or even with working out, like I'm like, hey, like I need to go do something. Like I— so it's really required me to use my voice so much because we have one vehicle and we're tied together and it's your house. Yes. And I'm so used to being so independent and like having my own life and things and like, yeah, we live together, but like we do our own thing and like, you know, come back together. And so I think it's been holy shit. I think it's like boundaries and knowing yourself and feeling your feelings.

Yeah, but the using your voice thing is, is huge because I think even if people are living a life where they can be totally self-sufficient and independent, they may not have— that doesn't open the opportunity for them to realize that maybe it is challenging for them to share their wants or needs or desires. And I really experienced that. Like, I'm such an independent person. I always have been. My mom said when I was like 3 and she dropped me off to school, I like didn't even say goodbye to her. Like all the other kids were like crying as they're— as their parents were leaving. And she said, I literally put my arm behind me and like waved to her like this, but like wouldn't even turn back to like look at her. I was just like, bye, bitch. Like, I'm going to school later. Yeah, see you later. See you never. Thanks for everything. So always been like super independent, but I did like experience that a lot when I moved to Spain and I didn't have a car there. And then I obviously had to rely for a lot of things on Jaime, and he had a car, but it was a car that I couldn't drive because it was a European car that was, you know, manual. And I don't know how to drive a manual car.

Yeah.

Yeah. So whenever we'd need to go like grocery shopping or if I'd need to go to the doctor or like, I don't know, do any type of like errand that required the car, I would have to like ask him and have him take me. And not having the ability to just like take yourself places or understand your own needs and just fulfill them and actually rely or depend on somebody else to help you do that is a very, very, very interesting experience. So I totally get what you're saying where it's like, oh my God, like I actually, you know, I have to just tell you, like, I need to go buy tampons. So like, get in the car because like, we're going, bitch. Yeah, because like, I can't go without you.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I think like as somebody, I'm like unlearning this identity, but I think as somebody who has been so hyper independent and like always had it together and so strong and whatever, this is the first time in my entire life that I have like surrendered to a man. Like, do you know what I mean? Like, I've just been like, okay, like, I'm gonna let you take care of things. I'm gonna let you take care of me. I'm gonna let you handle stuff that I'm not able to do, or whatever, because he's always the one driving the van. Like, he loves to drive. Um, or like, okay, I'm gonna like say, hey, I'm gonna go do yoga. Like, Is that cool? You know, like, it's almost like I have to ask permission, but I know I don't. But it's just like being like, hey, like— and so it's definitely gotten me realizing how, like, when I say that, when I was saying those things, like, I would notice this level of, like, guilt show up for, like, a second of, like, you're so needy, you know, because I'm so not used to asking. I'm so used to just doing it myself, just going, right? And I think this is truly the— like, for me, I feel like the van is the vehicle, literally, into my true feminine energy, like, embodiment. Like, the journey of really being in that, uh, letting somebody else lead, letting the van kind of take us in a way, um, letting life lead and surrendering to it. And it's meant a lot of things have died personally. One of those things I wouldn't say died, but rapidly evolved and changed is my business. And that's felt so scary because what I think— because honestly, I was just attached to an identity and it's like, damn, it's letting go of so much shit, letting go of so many narratives. I have to have it all together. I have to do it, blah, blah, blah. I have to be the strong, independent one and just being like, no, actually It's exhausting doing that. It is exhausting being the— having the shell, being hyper-independent. Like, I have realized I'm not that anymore, and I think it's caused me a lot of internal, like, whoa, what is happening? Like, I am fucking surrendered. Like, holy shit. And I don't think I ever would have chosen this on purpose because it feels too scary to let go of that much control.

Yeah. Did you ever think— because you obviously wanted to do van life, but that was you just kind of wanting, wanting to like travel and adventure and be outdoors and frolic as you do. But did you ever imagine that making the choice to do van life would actually change all these other things for you, like the dynamic in your relationship, how surrendered you are to the flow of life and changing certain elements about your business and letting things go. Like, did you ever imagine that?

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No, but when you said it, I got full body goosebumps because I was just like, oh, it's so real. Like, I'm so in it right now, you know. Um, but no, totally, I probably wouldn't have chosen van life if I knew what was going to come with it. Like, yeah, like, I'm not saying that you guys shouldn't do van life. Van life literally is amazing, and it also is so fucking hard, like so hard. And Kurt and I have done a lot of work on our relationship and we are still actively doing that because shit comes up when you live in this small of a space. But like, I think for myself, I think for the business, like I've always— and I know you relate to this so hard, especially as an Enneagram 3. I have always been a high achiever. Like it's never not been who I am, right? I have always been the one that fucking went for it, you know? Like, that took the big action, that, you know, had all the accolades, like, did all the shit and, like, totally had so much pride around that. I was like, I was really proud of myself for it. But that was completely, like, such a big part of my identity.

Yeah.

And I think living in the van has helped, like, has really actually let that identity dissolve a little bit because life is forcing me to slow down and enjoy what's around me. And that's meant like, yeah, it's just meant a different version of success, not the one I thought it was going to be. I thought it was going to be, oh, a million-dollar business, a bajillion dollars, a bajillion downloads on my podcast, like all the accolades that we say are the things to work towards that I'm realizing, like, sure, those things are cool, but that's actually not my goal, like, at all. And being on the road, and even just like from the moment that I wake up to all the things that we do and like the practices that we have to maintain in the van to like you know, have power and have water and be able to go to the bathroom and like all of that. It's just, I don't know, it's kind of brought me back to like simpler times even. Like, it sounds so, I don't know, it's so old, old soul of me, but I realized how much social media has distorted my perception of what I want from— important.

Yeah, what's important. Yeah, I think it's like the difference, the difference between, you know, being the richest person in the room versus being the happiest person in the room and deciding like which one of those two things is actually success to me. And I, yeah, I get exactly what you're saying in terms of because the, you know, the identity of being a high achiever and always kind of like wanting to be the most successful version of yourself and potentially even the most successful person that you know is really exciting and it's really motivating and it gets you really, really far. But the problem with that is that it's never enough.

Yeah.

So you reach a point where you're like, do I really care to be like the next coach online that's like $1 million, $5 million in a month, like, wow, balloons. I mean, and that's not hating on any of those, any of, of, of those people that do that, because I think that's dope. Like, obviously they're making change and impacting so many people's lives, and it's incredible. But for anybody else that is, even if you're not building a business, but that you just have like ambitious goals for yourself and you feel like getting to that next big accolade or dollar amount or whatever it is, is going to be the thing that satiates you. Eventually you realize that it's like, you know, it's like eating sugar all day and expecting to feel full. You just end up wanting more sugar and then you're still starving. Yeah.

Yeah, that's a great analogy. And that feels— it's almost like I— it's funny, I think I've been getting a lot of lessons being in the van, but one of the biggest ones is like everything being stripped away. Like everything that I was attached to, whether it was an identity or physical thing or money or whatever, is being stripped away. And it's like, it's showing me how, how resilient and content I can be with so little. Mm. Like, okay, this is a really like sad example cuz I'm still like, oh fuck, it hurts me. But it'll be fine cuz like no one got hurt. But 2 days ago we were driving on a, um, a forest, like on a mountain road. And the way that those roads work, like not really many things are marked and it's all gravel. And earlier that day we had filled up our water tank. We have like a 30-gallon water tank, like fresh water so that we can obviously have like drinking water and. Water for like the dishes and whatever. So I filled up the water while Kurt was getting, I don't know, gas or something, I forget. And went— and basically what I have to do is I have to take my bike off, fill up the water, and put my bike back on. And so did that, whatever. Get back in the van, we go, and we're like, okay, we're gonna go into the forest off-grid and camp in there. And it was super fun going up the road trying to find which campsite we want to the inn, I put my window down because it was like perfect weather out. And all of a sudden I heard this noise and it sounded like the exhaust was dragging on the van. And I was like, I was like, Kurt, it's like, Kurt, do you hear that? And he was like, he was like, no. And then I'm like, all right, can you just like pull over? Because I feel like something's like I don't know, it just sounds— doesn't sound right. So he pulls over and I go in the back and I see my bike getting dragged. It had gotten dragged for I don't know how long. And I literally just burst into tears because like, okay, for, for context, biking is like my personal freedom, right? It's like I can leave the van, I can leave our home and do my own thing. And It was like, oh my God, like the handlebars. I'll send you a, I'll send you a photo. The handlebars look like a bear ate them. Like the brake wires are frayed. Like there's rocks every, like, oh my God. I don't think the frame was damaged. I think it was just the handlebars. So fingers crossed that that's the truth. But it was this feel like this feeling in my gut of like, oh man, yo, Uni ain't kidding. Like, really getting it all stripped. And it's like, how grateful can you be? Or how content can you be in the present moment even when all this shit isn't going to plan and you're living the dream life, air quotes, like you're in a van traveling the world and there's all this other stuff happening behind the scenes, you know?

Yeah. Oh my God. What is— I feel like we should talk about when you get the things that you want and then they're still hard. Yeah. And you're like, wait, like, I thought that this was supposed to be like the solution. Like, everything is fine now. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like, oh, I thought as soon as I get to van life or as soon as I get into my new house, right? Yeah. That everything will be fine now. And it's like No, there's just like a whole new set of problems, like a whole new set of challenges and normalizing that. Yeah, it's not like you never get there and just are like absolved of everything and there's nothing for you to work through and there's nothing— there's no problems. And I think a lot of people struggle with the idea of gratitude. In that context, because we can guilt or gaslight ourselves into feeling grateful for things and kind of bypassing or honoring the fact that even though it is what we wanted, that there's still hard parts about it, you know?

Yeah. I mean, I feel like even for you too, being in your— like being in your house, like it's like, cool, you got a house and then you got to furnish it. And then there's so many things that you then—

we ran into so many problems and so many things that need to get fixed and everything has to be paid for. And all of our stuff has— all of my addresses have to get moved and changed and new bank accounts and restructuring the logistical and legal sides of the business to be operating from the state of Florida. Jaime needs to get a job as a realtor and he doesn't know anybody here and we're just starting and trying to figure out how to help him through that. And he's not working, but I am. And like, yeah, like no matter what it is, you're just like, fuck, like, okay, yes, like, this is amazing. But also, like, it's still hard. Yeah.

Yeah. And I think, like, I'm so glad we're having this convo because, like, not even just for us, for everyone listening, because I really— this is what I've been writing in my journal so much, is like, we really don't get to see the truth online. Like, we are painted this picture that coaches, whoever that you're following, has a secret formula, you know, that has the answer that you don't. That has the perfect program that's going to solve all your fucking problems, right? That's— and it's like, sure, it may create solutions to some of your problems and it's not going to absolve you of life because life is not all ups. If it was, you wouldn't even appreciate fucking any of them because like we need contrast. Like contrast is so important. Um, and yeah, I mean, the bike example for me personally was such a perfect moment of both. Like, it was me being so upset at myself because I actually was the one that caused that because I didn't lock the thing in tight enough or something. And so I was upset at myself, but I didn't even— at that point, I wasn't even upset at myself. I was just— I felt so victim in that moment. I was like, why? It's my bike, like this thing, come on, you know, like we just got a bike rack for, like Kurt just literally bought a bike rack for me for the bike and I've been riding it so much and I've been so happy riding the bike.

Yeah.

And then obviously gets destroyed and like I cry and then Kurt was like, I'm sorry. Like he, he was like the sweetest. I was just like, oh my God, thank you for not saying anything and trying not to make it better literally the second it happened. Like, thank you for just being there for me. Then we get in the van and I was like, look, I don't wanna talk about it. I just don't wanna talk about it.

Morning. The loss.

I'm grieving.

Yeah.

Yeah. I was literally in grief and went through the rest of the evening and I like detached myself from it. And then I was like, you know what, Kurt? I am so grateful that the bike happened where it did because if that bike fell off and hit a car. Like, can you imagine what would have happened if a bike flew into someone's car? Like, we could have seriously injured someone. Like, I'm like, the amount of money it's gonna cost to get a new bike is nothing compared to what would happen if I had— if the bike had flown into something, like if the bike had hit someone or killed someone. Like, I was just thinking about the obviously worst-case scenario, and I feel like that brought right back to gratitude. And Kurt was like, yeah, honestly, like, I wasn't gonna say it, but I thought the same thing because like, it, it could have been so much worse. And I'm like, I know it really could have been so much worse. In the moment it felt like the worst thing ever. But I also knew like, it's a physical object. Like it is literally fine. Like we are both safe. We are both alive and nobody is hurt. It's a bike.

Yes.

It had a lot of meaning, but I can get another bike, you know? Um, And so I think, I don't know, I mean, it's like having a daily gratitude practice definitely helps me, helps my brain go there because it'd be so easy to spiral down and be like, the bike broke. Like, fuck, nothing ever works out for me. Like this whole narrative, you know what I mean? Like just making it this whole fucking thing. Yeah.

Oh my God. What was I just— something just happened where I was like so close to like going into the victim mindset. And then I was like, no, I will not be a victim to this situation. Okay. First of all, our TV arrived and I was so excited to finally have a TV. It was broken. So then I was like, oh my God, this is like so sad. But that wasn't really the one that I was thinking of last night. I guess I had created this reel and I filmed it like a while ago, but I had saved it in my drafts. But last night I was like, I'm so excited to post this reel finally. Like, I feel like I'm in the energy to share it. And so I spent like an hour, like, writing out this caption for it that, like, I don't know, just like felt so good. Like, I basically poured my heart out. I made the stupid dumb rookie mistake of actually writing the caption in the caption field and not first writing it in my notes, which is— it's beginner. It's beginner.

It is beginner, but I do it all the fucking time too.

I know. And I sometimes I go to write it in the caption field and I have the thought, you should probably put it in your notes first just in case anything weird happens. And then I'm like, it'll be fine.

I'm going to risk it. I love the little edge.

It'll be fine. I'm going to risk Skit. So I pour my heart and soul into this reel, right? I click post. I'm like, yes, I'm doing so good. I'm posting before— not like before 9:00 PM. I'm gonna like shut my phone off now. Amazing. I go to post it and Instagram like glitches or something and I don't see it show up on my feed as like loading? And then all of sudden that just goes— pshew! —and closes you know when happens like it's X'd out yeah I was this not good no-no-no-no-no-no-no-no-no-no-No No... xes-out yes and I go back into Instagram It's not posted but still on my drafts and I'm oh thank God okay But instagram being glitchy weird slow so now we're going to have some fun for an hour or two here because there were only 2 people who commented under your post which has been really cool by me if they do comment again please let them be notified about their comments cuz sometimes youtube doesn't notify us at first until after someone else replies before anyone sees our message yet another thing why TikTok exists lol haha anyways um what did y'all think wow great question Yesss anyway guys thanks everyone hope everybody had such an amazing weekend make sure that And so I try to quickly like copy the caption, but ADD, forget to paste it in my Notes app yet again because I copy it and then I'm like, okay, now I need to try and download it, save it so that it's on my camera roll because I feel like something funky is happening. Like I'm afraid I'm going to lose it. Real. Yeah. Wouldn't let— wouldn't save, wouldn't save, wouldn't save to my camera roll. That was the only button that wouldn't work. I'm like, of course. Yeah. I, I go to try and screen record just in the like editing. Yeah. Just so I, I could, I'm like, oh, I can just zoom it in. Okay. It'll be like, it'll be, yeah, crop it. I'm like, it'll be fine. I try screen recording, doesn't work. It won't let me. App closes again. So I'm doing this and I'm trying to find a way to salvage this. Suddenly my Instagram updates and it says this reel is no longer available and cannot be restored. What? Because it basically got wiped when the app closed, but it was still showing up for me in drafts as like a glitch because like Instagram hadn't like refreshed or something. Yeah. So I lost everything. I lost the whole caption that I spent an hour on. I lost the whole video that I recorded and I was like sitting there like feeling like, oh my God, like Fuck Instagram. Like, literally, I spent so much time on this. Like, I worked— the first thing I said, I go, I lost it. And he goes, what happened? I go, I worked so hard on that. It was like a sad, sad moment. But then I was like, you know what? I'm just going to make it again. Like, I guess I'm just going to make it again. And there's a reason why the original, like, maybe the next version will just be better. Yeah. And anyway, there are things like even stupid things like that that happen where you can find yourself kind of like wanting to slip into victim mindset of like, in my head I was like, Instagram literally sucks. This is the worst fucking app ever. Like, you know, like immediately went into like blaming mode of like, fuck you, Instagram. And then I was like, okay, that's canceled. Ctrl+Alt+Delete. Like, take a deep breath. Maybe this is a sign to like go eat your dinner and just like chill out.

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Yeah, yeah, but those moments are so charged, especially when it's something that's— that you create, because it feels like— like it's like a little thing you just birthed, you know, and you're like 'What? I made that,' you know? Like, it feels so personal, like a personal attack from Instagram. You're like, 'Bro,' you know? It's the same. It's like, I find myself, uh, with that. Like, I notice it too with, um, sometimes with like engagement where I'm like, 'Yo, Instagram literally hates me.' And I actually do think that that's true because I've gotten like two, uh, 2, what's it called, violations against community guidelines. They like thought one of my comments was an aggressive comment where I wrote like, fuck yes, queen.

Like, oh, I was thinking, I was like, what did you comment? Like, yes, bitch. Yeah.

And they said like, your comment violates our, our community guidelines. And I was like, oh, I didn't know that it did.

Okay. I didn't know you were against aggressive encouragement. Yeah, I was really encouraging her.

Um, but anyways, so no, but I think it's the same thing. Like, I noticed I'm like, you know what, Instagram, okay, okay, it'll just be all the more reason to pour my heart and soul into the other platforms that I really freaking love, you know? And it's like taking it that way and just being like, well, thanks for the people that do watch. Like, I really appreciate it, you know? But it can be hard when it's, uh, um what's it called when it's like a repetitive thing, you know, if it keeps happening, you're like, okay, okay, come on. Like, come on.

Yeah. I mean, and that's a whole other conversation too, just about social media in general and like the meanings that we make out of our experience on social media because like that's a whole other like mental mindset ballgame of like, how do I keep showing up and keep creating content and providing value. And, you know, I think people underestimate if you're someone online who's not a content creator or who's not trying to build something or who's not utilizing social media platforms for anything other than just, you know, sharing snippets of your life or connecting with friends like that. Everything that we create and share feels like a piece of our heart. Yeah, there's way more to it than just like, oh, you know, I posted this thing and not a lot of people liked it. It's like, yeah, I shared something vulnerable, or I was really open about something, or I expressed myself in a really like creative or beautiful or raw way. Or, you know, I took a piece of my brain or my knowledge and my wisdom and I gifted it to you. And it's kind of like love languages. And if you keep giving someone love in a way that they're not receiving it, it starts to feel like they don't love you, even though that may not be the case. But it's kind of like the same with social media. If you keep giving and giving and giving and pouring out your heart and your creativity and your wisdom onto these platforms and you feel like it's not being received, you're like, what the fuck? Like this feels like this doesn't feel like a good relationship. This doesn't feel like an equal energy exchange. It feels like I'm giving so much and people are just taking and they're not giving back to me. Mm-hmm.

Yeah. Yeah. And it's— I mean, I think— and this kind of goes back to even the beginning of like talking about how to, how to do it all right, how to keep showing up even when you're not getting the validation. Because I think that's like a— that's real— that can be really challenging. Like, and especially if you have childhood shit where you had a parent who didn't— like, who— let's say this is how— this is how it showed up for me. Um, when you have a parent that's emotionally absent or like just not there, then you can recreate that same experience with social media and be like, why am I giving so much? And this other person, or let's say social media, isn't giving back, right? Like, where's the other side? And so for me personally, it's been like my journey of creating content has had to evolve a lot because I actually think that Um, in lots of ways, the platform, like Instagram, let's say, has changed a lot. And so my relationship to it can change, our relationship to it can change, but I think it, like creating content, creating, showing up, being in your business, it always has to come from a place of like abundance, not obligation, you know, of overflow. Yeah. And I think I personally love creating, and I, I know you do too. And it's like when there's so much love for that thing, then it won't feel like obligation and it won't even— it's like, how can we let the love for our creations be so big that the feedback we get, we don't take that personally. Like, we're just like so fucking proud of a thing, you know? And if it gets engagement or if it gets whatever, great, but that's not why we're creating it, you know? Like, we're creating it because it feels good to create, it feels good to say, it feels good to share, um, to get it off your chest. Maybe it feels like therapy. I know for me, a lot of times podcasts are even the YouTube videos I'm starting, it feels like so therapeutic. And it's like, that's the point. Like, I really pray that it— hope— I hope that it helps somebody, of course. But I think the second that we try to get an outcome out of the thing, it doesn't come, you know?

Yeah, it's like loving the creation instead of loving the reaction to the creation.

Yeah, yeah. It's like the journey, not the outcome, you know? It's it, and it's like, it literally goes back to even the point that you were chatting about with like, once you get there, air quotes, you realize, oh wait, there's still more things here for me that are hard. And what? Like, I thought that was the thing. It's like, it doesn't exist. I think there's so much illusion when it comes to both of those topics— content creation, showing up, moving, your next up level— because it all is accompanied with the other side.

Yeah, I mean, like, we're always living in the duality of every situation. Social media, life, business, all of it is included in that, right? And I think what— where social media kind of comes into this conversation for everybody listening to is some, you know, what you said of realizing that it's impossible to, to get like the full story or the full context of people's lives on social media. And I don't think it's— I think, of course, there's some people that are doing it intentionally of like only show out, I'm having a bad day, but like, no, no, like can't talk about it, can't share any of it. I'm only going to show the good parts. And there is some of that, you know, highlight reel type stuff that's happening from like an intentional place of like wanting to actively hide the other stuff. But it's also just— I think that there's no— there's no— there's not enough capacity for social media to witness the fullness of our being. Yeah. Like, even if you are trying, to be really genuine and transparent and real on social media, it's only natural that like it still can't capture it all, you know, unless you literally like had a film crew like following you around every moment of your life. Like, I don't— so I don't— I also don't want to create the narrative that like, you know, we have an unrealistic expectation of what our lives should be like because these evil content creators are making us feel like they're better than us in all these ways and they have no problems. Of course, there are people, like I said, that are, are hiding the real or raw parts of their lives intentionally. But I also just think it's about knowing and always like remembering social media is never the full context. Yeah, point blank, period, finished. Even for people that are honest and real and open on social, it's still not the full context. It never could be.

No, no. It's like, have you met a person? Have you met a client in person? Have you had that experience? Yes. Yes. Okay. I had that experience like a month ago. I mean, I've had it before, but I had another one a month ago. And it's so funny. She's like, like what people see you on social media, even seeing you on Zoom. And then seeing you in real life and the energy that's there versus what's shown on social. Like, it's so funny. And I think that's it. Like, we as humans do try— air quotes, like, in bold highlight all of it— try to capture our full essence on social when that will never be able to happen. No, it's a 2D screen. Like, it's, it's flat. Like, we are not flat, you know? We are so multi-dimensional. And it's like, oh my God, I remember when I met you for the first time in real life and we were just like, ah, like we were just screaming.

Yeah, I saw you. It was in Miami too. Yeah, yeah, I saw you on the— I was getting out of my Uber and you were like walking right by us.

I rolled down the window and we were like I was like, oh my God, you're a real person.

Oh yeah. I think that's why, like, you and I both— I know that you love, like, in-person stuff and retreats, not only going on them but hosting them. But the in-person, like, I just met my assistant who's worked for me for over a year, and she was my client, like, for a long time before that. I just met her and we went to New York City together and we like stayed together and spent the whole weekend together. And it's just like, it's so hard to describe, but like everything is different in person. Yeah, like, like you said, there's just no way to capture someone's essence. You could know factually everything about them and feel like you know them, like when we met each other, we like fully felt— it didn't feel like we were meeting each other for the first time, obviously, because when you meet someone for the first time, you don't know them. But we, we knew things about each other very intimately, like we were internet friends. But meeting them in person is just like so different. I don't know, that's why I'm so excited to like host my retreat and everything, because yeah, it's just like there's no way to capture it. Online or through the podcast or any sort of like medium. Just everything changes when you're actually in the energy of being around someone.

Totally. Yeah. And I mean, I've been really feeling that so much on the road because we have met so many just cool, wise, quirky, fun like funky people, you know? Like last night I met this woman, she was a naturopath in the hot springs. And yo, we just like went so deep so fast in like, it was crazy. And I was like, wow. Like, I just like love real life so much. Like, I love social media for what it's capable of, But real life feels so good. Like, it feels so, so good. And that's really the, like, say, conundrum, but that's really the kind of, like, situation I'm in right now is like, ooh, wanting more of that, wanting even more than just a retreat a year. Like, what else does this get to look like? Like, especially while we're not grounded in one place, you know, um, because I just crave it. I love— I mean, I just randomly will go out and meet people and hang out with them, and then we'll go do stuff, you know. And Kurt's like, okay, have fun. That's just my nature, you know. Like, I'm very— wait, the lady that you went paddleboarding with? No, this is different. This is different. No, no, no, no, no, no.

I mean, like, as an example Like, I remember you saying, I just met this woman, like, randomly, and then she invited me to go paddleboarding.

So I'm going to have I given you an update on her? No. Oh my God. So we've become like the best of friends. We drink so much wine together, have had a fucking blast. It's been great. Also, she's like, she's 60 and she's dating this guy and it's like clearly not it. And I'm like, oh no, basically like Okay, here's the deal. Because she's like, what would you do? Like, I need your help. Like, literally, like, asking me all these questions about relationships. It's so funny. And it is so fun just like having a friend who's so like open about the relationship. And she's just like a super fun social butterfly, like really active and outdoorsy. And so we get along really well. But yeah, she's like become a great friend. She'll like— she texted me like 2 days ago. Like, we literally will text. She's like, give me a call on Friday. I'm like, Okay, Deb. I'm like, what is my life become? Deb.

Deb. Oh my God, I love that. This is like inspiring me. Just the idea of like when you said, I love real life so much. I think so many of us, like especially during the pandemic, we like really learned to love online and like really like had to lean into that. We were forced to. But also a lot of people were like, oh my God, like, I love staying at home. I love having my space. I love having more boundaries with, you know, my coworkers and not being around people all the time. And I think that, you know, especially for someone who was like working for myself from home during those 2 years and also living in a foreign country where I didn't have like so many friends and things like that, I really learned to, like, love my bubble. Yeah. And now I'm in a space where, like, I've just moved to this new place. I live on the beach. Like, I, I want to get back into that feeling of, like, loving real life, of, like, meeting real fucking people, like, having in-person friendships and connections. And, you know, like I said, I'm so excited for my retreat. Like, I just— yeah, I want to be in love with real life again too.

Yeah. Yeah, it's— man, I really— and I really feel like there's— there is a huge shift happening in the industry, like in the coaching industry. I feel it. I like know that like big change is coming. I think there's a lot of stuff that's ending. And it— there is a way bigger desire to me to be in real life, to be in person, to have that connection. I'm craving it. Like, I don't wanna be on Zoom calls. I don't like— and I've started to set up my business in a way that like is less Zoom calls. Like, I'm just like, nope. Like, I'm gonna have a Zoom day and maybe like a rando one later in the week, but That's it. Like, I've just decided, like, I'm not available to be on Zoom. Like, I don't want to be on my computer that much. Come on. Like, I want to be living my best life, sharing it, getting it, like, inspiring other people to go fucking get out there and like, get outside of your comfort zone, make friends with strangers, like, obviously safely, but you know what I mean? Like, use your intuition. But it's like, yo, life is out there and social media is social media. Like, I don't know. I think even just being in the van and like not having service as much too has really helped me see like, wow, there's so many people trying to build online businesses that fucking hate it, that actually don't even want to be doing it. And I think I'm becoming one of them. Like, I have certain things that I love online and I'm like, what is this becoming? What does this even mean for me? Like, it's really brought up a lot of questions and I think to anyone that is considering the online space slash is already in it, it's like, just get real with yourself. Like, actually ask yourself, do you want to do it? Because for me, and I'll just be completely honest, I have no problem being honest with where I'm at. I've had a really hard time. Like, okay, so I'll say this. The beginning of my business, beginning 2 years, I'm in year 3 now. The beginning 2 years, I like literally didn't have to try at all to like, like clients would just come to me, they'd find me, they'd fill out an application, they'd sign on. It, it was easy. It was done. The last year has been, it's been very challenging for me. Not even just business, but just like life generally. And the past 6 months specifically has been like, I'm like, do I wanna work with clients? But I'm like, what does that mean for me? Like, who am I becoming? Like, what am I becoming? Like, ah, so that's been a whole shift of, oh shit, like this is a new chapter. And I feel like so many people are in a big transition right now, whether it's the move, right? For both of us, it was a move, a business shift. But I've had to lean into it because I've been like my intuition is just like, more like over there. Like, it's, it's not where you, where you are right now. Like, it's why you're facing so much resistance. It's why it doesn't feel good anymore. Like, it's why it's been so hard. It's because it's giving you, it's giving you a clue. Like, hey, go over there. Like, stop trying so hard here. Go to a place that feels really good. And Yeah. So I think my transition from the business model I had using Instagram primarily to being like, doesn't feel good anymore, actually. Huh. Like, I love stories. I love popping on stories. I love connecting in the DMs. Like, that's so fun. I know you love that shit too.

Those are like the only two functions of Instagram that I like really use. I was just talking to our friend, our mutual friend Annelie, about this. We were talking about Instagram and I'm like, every day I'm like in stories because it's so natural for me. It feels really easy. It feels really fun. Like, it feels really nice. But I'll go like days and days and days and days without posting to my feed and then being like, oh my God, I realize I haven't been, you know, posting to my feed at all. I'm just like sharing to my stories, which is fine. But like from a business perspective, you're like, that's not generating any like new traction or like new people can't find you from your stories. So you're just like, right? Yeah, I don't know.

So yeah, we talked about that, but yeah, yeah. But I think like for, for people listening to— I mean, it's just kind of like we've talked, we've had a podcast conversation about this, like where your energy wants to be and like which platforms feel the most spacious for you and I personally am someone who loves to, like, when I built my Instagram, like, I was literally posting every day. I was creating a new infographic. Like, I loved it. I loved the process of showing up like every day at like 8:30 AM, giving a piece of knowledge about when I was teaching fitness. Like, it was so fun. It was like, it was this machine that I had really built and it was reliable and it was, it would always, like there were so many like, thank you so much for this post, this is so helpful. Like, that is the feeling that I'm like, I know that that's possible and that's what I want for my business. I wanted to feel that mutual love, right? And I know it's possible because I've created it and it's like, it's how I've created my entire, you know, account and stuff. But like, I don't get that anymore. Hmm. So felt victim for a hot minute and then I was like, no, there's something else here. And I think for anyone that is fault, like finding themselves in a place where there's resistance, not fear. Those are different. Like where there's resistance, it's often a detour. It's like, like, okay, like try something else. Where there's fear, that's where you should go. I am personally scared to go somewhere that I haven't been, of course, but I feel like that's exactly the thing I'm doing. Like I am doing it, but that's exactly the roadmap. And I think so many people are scared of fear and then stay in the resistance and try and try and try and push through when it's not the thing. And they know it's not the thing. They know they don't even like it, you know, whether— whatever it is, whether it's a job or fucking Instagram. Like, so it's like the thing that is yours is gonna feel scary, yes, but it's also gonna feel so big. It's gonna feel so expansive. And it's like you just gotta, you gotta trust that and know that you can do it and just take the messy action and don't expect perfection out of yourself right off the bat.

It's so hard. I feel like my— I was telling this to Annelie, I was like, I would love to really just like go more into TikTok because I feel like what I share on stories every day could be TikToks. Like TikTok is way more formal in that way. And since that's what I do all day long, but it like doesn't generate any, like anything like really like that helpful for my business. But it feels really similar. The idea of like maybe taking a step back from Instagram or from any platform that you've started on to focus on other things feels really similar to when I was wanting to like quit my job. Mm-hmm. Like the fear of like, Okay, wait, but I feel like I should kind of maybe try something different or like move in a different direction, but I don't feel safe enough to try this other thing without also hanging on to my safety net of what I already know. Right? So people can relate to this so much, like relationships, jobs, social media platforms, whatever. It's like what you're used to and what you're comfortable with when it's no longer serving you and you feel the nudge to go test something else or try something else. Yeah, the fear is, but how do I actually do that? And without like also hanging on to the thing that I know, right? Like, I feel that so much. I'm like, I would love to like get back on my TikTok and like really just explore like, what would it feel like for me out of even just like pure curiosity? Like maybe it doesn't even turn into anything for my business, but like, what would the difference feel like for me energetically to be on that platform versus being on Instagram all the time? But then the fear is like, but you can't— first of all, you don't have time and space to do both. So you're going to have to decide. And if you have to decide, then, you know, that feels scary to let go of the thing that, you know, and what's obviously helped run and generate so much of your business so far. And it's the same like when I was wanting to leave my job, right? It's like, yeah, I want to go try this thing, but I don't know if this other thing is going to work. Yeah. So how can I go try that other thing and, and be okay with letting go of my job that I have now that I know brings me money but that I know that I hate? Like, it's the same dilemma. Yeah, it's just like a new version of it.

Totally. Yeah. Like, I was literally saying this to Kurt, I don't know, yesterday, day before. I'm like, oh my gosh, it's that again. It's me 5 years ago. Holy shit. Like realizing I am unhappy. Holy crap. I am not happy in my business and not like I love what I've created, but as it relates to showing up, I'm not happy. I'm not. And it obviously is really hard to admit that because It is. It just is. Um, and then it requires you to take action, you know? And so I'm like, okay, fine, like, what's it gonna be? I had thoughts about TikTok. I think TikTok would be super fun, but I feel like personally it's not it for me. It feels like a distraction. And we've talked about this. I could see you thriving on TikTok. I feel like I could theoretically, but when I get on the app, I get so anxious. My ADD is just like You know, um, I literally can't. I just, I have to just hold the boundary of not even having the app. I don't even go on the app. Um, but YouTube feels very scary but very good, like, oh, juicy ripe peach. Actually, funny enough, well, you guys can't see this, you're not on video. Look at this freaking peach. We were walking to the hot springs, and this guy that we saw the night before in the hot springs was like, hey, do you guys want a peach? He's like, go on my back, I got a box back there. And so Kurt opened the door and he had a box of peaches. He's like, yeah, take one. I was like, thanks, just got the best peach ever.

Yeah, yeah.

So I'm in my receiving mode, if you can't tell, you know. But yeah, it is so crazy, and it's scary because like financially, for me personally, it's scary because It is. It's like, oh, wow. It always comes.

It always comes back to— I swear, it always comes back to the safety of money and finances. Yeah. Like, even for anybody listening, that's like in a job that you don't love, but you want to try something new. Yeah. It's like, oh, I want to do this new thing. And I would love, like, if life were just life and I didn't have responsibilities and I didn't have bills, I would go and try that thing out of curiosity because I want to know if it works for me. I want to know if I like it. I want to know if it's a better path for me. But the reason that you don't is money. Yeah. Yeah.

And, and I know we've both been this way. I've never been like, I'm going to let money hold me back. I've never— I've always been like, money will never hold me back. I even when I was— I had not done a single ounce of money mindset work. And I was in my 9 to 5. This is so bad. I had no understanding of saving money. I think we've talked about this as well. Like ADHD spender over here had no clue that savings were sexy. I was just like, I get it, I spend it. And I decided I was going to take a solo trip to Norway. And was it just Norway? Norway and Iceland. And I had— I completely drained all of my cash. I don't even know how I went on this trip. Okay. But By the end of the trip, I think I had like $15 in my bank account. Okay, I just got back from a 10-day trip. It was fucking amazing. Came back, started working. I knew I was gonna get paid again, but I was only making $2,400 a month and I was living in Boston, paying rent, paying my loans, which were like a bajillion dollars. So I didn't really have any like spending money. Um, and then what happens? The universe is so fucking funny. I get hit by a car on my bike. I'm okay. I'm completely fine. But obviously that was a huge insurance claim. Some person just literally hit me and I had to go to physical therapy too. But, and I ended up getting, I kid you not, the dollar amount back from the amount that I spent on my trip in the insurance claim. And I was like, Cool. So I always had the belief money would be there for me. And I think right now I'm personally in a position where we've spent so much money on this van. Like, I've just been like, we're doing it. Kurt's like, we're doing it, you know? And I'm like, I'm in a deep trust relationship with money right now because it's probably the least amount that I've ever had besides being like in college or, you know, being in my 9 to 5 where I didn't have any like savings. But I'm not worried, which I'm like, oh, I should be worried. I should be.

Yeah. When, when the not worrying is like worrying, you're like, should I be more concerned?

Yeah. I'm just like, no, it's going to be fine. Like, stressing about it is not going to make it better. I am taking action. I'm doing the things like I know it's working. I'm— I have faith in the process. And yeah, like, I'll be fine, you know? Like, I'll always be fine. So I don't know, I just keep going back to that of like, I can't let fear stop me. Like, I won't ever let fear stop me.

That is never an option for me because, like, because you know what's on the other side. Once you do something in your life where you're like, oh my God, I was terrified to do that, then I did it. Everything changed. It was the best thing ever. And like, you just— you can't— you can't deny that. You can't deny the truth of going outside of your comfort zone, breaking through your fears, trusting that everything will work out, believing that money will come back to you, create some of the most incredible, magical, transformational experiences of your life. You can't deny that ever again because you witnessed it, you experienced it, you know the deep truth of it. But it is so interesting feeling like because you go through these ebbs and flows of life, right? Where you're like on the, you know, on the crest of the wave where you're like, yes, like move through your fear, you guys. It's so amazing on the other side. And then next minute you are like pulled under in the riptides being like, what the fuck? Like, I better follow this fear because I don't like anything. This feels hard. It's not working, whatever it is. And then you're like, oh, I have to— like, I have to take my own advice again. We're never just like, oh, I did it. Yeah. And I'm done now. Yeah. Like continuously being hit over the head and like reminding ourselves like, oh, all the things that we teach and talk about and have learned in our own lives in the past will, will come up again. Like life is long, dude. Like, we're not going to just learn that lesson once and be like, check the box, done. Yeah, there's going to be so many opportunities to learn that lesson again and again and again in deeper and bigger and scarier ways.

Yeah. Yeah. For me personally, it always, 100% of the time, always comes down to regret. Will I regret not doing this? Like, I always fast forward to my deathbed It's so morbid, but it works so well. It's so easy to make decisions when you think about that. Well, I regret not doing this. Well, I regret doing this. Like, it's why when we got to the Mercedes dealership and the guy was like, oh, there's one van left. And Kurt and I did not go in there with the intention to buy a van that day. Yeah. And I was like, put it on my card. Let's go. He's like, what? I'm like, we are putting down a motherfucking deposit. I am not letting this go. And he was just like, oh, uh, okay. I was like, no, we're not, we're not not doing this. Like, we're either doing it now or never, and it's— the opportunity is here and we are fucking buying this van. It's like, I don't care if we don't have all the money right now, we will figure that shit out. Yeah. And it's like, that is—

that's the energy. That's the energy. Honestly, that's my favorite energy on earth, is like, oh, Oh, fuck. Like, okay, like, we're just doing it. We're just doing it. And I think, yeah, I get— I sometimes I get a little bit frustrated or I just can't relate to people that haven't found that fire within themselves yet to actually be bold enough to say, like, this is an opportunity that I don't want to let slip through my fingers. Yeah, maybe there'll be another one. Maybe I could do it in the future, maybe later, but like, it's here right fucking now and I want it, so I'm claiming it. Yeah, like, that's the vibe for life for me. Totally.

What the fuck are you waiting for? Like, for it to be easier for you to have more money? Like, uh, hello, you're talking to— like, I think this conversation in itself is a testament. Like, okay, if someone can create $750,000 online and then feel like, oh my God, where's all money and now I need to make a whole pivot and like, right, like it's like, do it because you're never going to do anything without some fear. You have to be— you have to get used to feeling fear and not letting it dictate your life. You know, life is meant to be lived, not feared. Like, yeah.

Oh, that's, that's the message, you guys. Life is meant to be lived, not feared. We are all going to die.

Yep. Grab life by the balls, kids. We're going.

Okay, we're closing on that. We're closing on that. Grab life by the balls, you guys. Or for all the feminists, for all the feminists out there, grab life by the pussy. Yeah, that works too.

I like that one, actually.

Maybe. Oh my God. Well, thank you for this conversation, Sam. This was incredible. You are always like so honest and vulnerable and real. And even just like your journey of falling back in love with real life again is inspiring me and reminding me of how much I want to make the most of this opportunity of being in this new space and actually building a community here and meeting people and getting outside of my comfort zone and doing things in person and I've created a whole other day in my calendar where I don't have clients or calls or anything. Like you said, just want to be off of Zoom more and in life more. So hopefully this conversation was supportive for you guys. Uh, thank you so much. If you enjoyed it, please take a screenshot, share it to your Instagram stories, tag Sam and me so that we can see you and repost you and maybe even just have a chat about what parts of of this conversation really resonated for you. Um, this was like, this was a good one. This was so— it was good.

I feel like our conversations always end up giving both of us clarity too, you know? Like, you're gonna go on TikTok, I'm gonna go on YouTube, I'm gonna hold you to it, bitch. You have nothing to be afraid of. And I know you'd say the same thing to me. And it's like, let's get out of our heads and just do the damn thing and stop thinking about it. Like, We're grabbing life by the pussy. Yes. Yes.

That's right, guys. Don't forget this week, go grab life by the pussy. We love you so much. And we'll talk to you soon. Bye.