Owning Your Weird, Biohacking Gone Wrong & Defying Societal Pressure w/ Angie Lee

What's up guys, welcome back to the podcast. A quick reminder, if you are listening to this episode in real time, meaning it's Wednesday for you, enrollment for Abundant and Ambitious closes tonight. A&A is the most affordable, high-touch business mastermind for early and aspiring coaches. Inside this 4-month container, you are going to have access to weekly live coaching calls with me on Zoom to answer your questions, along with 12 of my most powerful business trainings, access to our vault of top-tier guest expanders, including people like Monica Yates, Mel Wells, Alexandria Maria, Michaela Jay, and many more, true sisterhood support and collaboration opportunities with the other members, and the option to upgrade and receive a personalized content and messaging audit with me. So if you're currently earning anywhere from $0 to $5,000 a month in your coaching business, this is definitely the space that you want to be in. ANA is going to help you tackle self-doubt and imposter syndrome, magnetize your ideal clients, show up more powerfully on social media, create a signature offer that yields results, build the foundation to scale from zero to six figures and beyond, find your voice, niche down, and build a personal brand, cultivate more freedom, abundance, and flow in your business. And doors close tonight, March 29th, at 11:59 PM Eastern time. So that's the East Coast of the US, Miami. Um, I'll leave a link in the show notes for you guys with more information for you to secure your space before it's too late. I love you and can't wait to see you inside and help you grow your soul-led business over the next 16 weeks together. I'm super excited for this week's episode. It's conversational, it's honest, it's real, maybe a little controversial, definitely hilarious. I am joined by someone I've looked up to for many years and who influenced so many parts of my personal journey, Angie Lee. Angie is a highly sought-after marketing mentor, motivational speaker, professional podcaster, serial entrepreneur, and the author of Ready Is a Lie. She's the co-founder of Soul CBD, the creator of the number one female personal development and business event in the United States, Pays to Be Brave, and she's the host of the Forbes Top 100 podcast, The Angie Lee Show. Angie's genius is teaching women how to make friends with fear and make money doing what they love in a motivational, fun, and approachable way. You guys are gonna love this episode. In this episode, we get into just a really honest chat about the journey of following an unconventional path in life, navigating societal pressures to get engaged or married or have babies at a certain age, where we may have gone a little overboard with some of these crazy wellness trends and kind of bringing ourselves back a bit. And the power and freedom that building a personal brand can bring into your life. We also talk about not being afraid to pivot when you are a multi-passionate entrepreneur and how Angie did all of the things like drop out of college, start a blog, build a podcast way before any of it was as cool as it is today. So she's amazing and hilarious. You're going to love this conversation. Let's dive in. Welcome to the Makeshift Happen Podcast. I'm your host, Samantha Daly. Entrepreneur, life coach, and your no BS bestie here to bring you all things mindset, manifestation, and personal development. This podcast is designed to help you expand your mind and uplevel your life. So turn the volume up and roll the windows down if you're coming along for the ride. Let's go make shift happen. Okay. I'm so excited to have this conversation. Welcome to the show, Angie. I, I first have to, like, start by letting you know, like, how much of an influence you had on me so many years ago starting my business. We can talk about this a little bit when we get into podcasting, but like, I remember you from like the Rich Bitch days.

Oh my God.

Like, yeah. Like, like when your podcast was Rich Bitch forever ago.

I was like a fetus.

Literally feels like it was forever ago. I feel like I remember the COVID photo of you. Like, you still had your implants. I feel like you're wearing like a blue top. You had like long hair like that. I remember your house in San Diego, your pool. Like, I remember those days. You were with somebody else. You had your bulldog. Like, I'm, I'm taking this new dog.

New man. I live in Texas. I took out my boobs and my fake hair. I am just a country gal now with my chickens, you know, living the real real. And that was when I was living in LA.

And your cup says y'all.

So yeah, that's so funny. Like you had, you had like better memories right there than I did. I'm like, oh my God, you're right.

Yeah. And that feels like forever ago. So I mean, it kind of was, but it's been cool to just like see your evolution of your life and your brand and how you share online and all those things. And I kind of want to like bring that to the audience today. I'm sure lots of my listeners are already familiar with you, but if we went, if we went back even a little bit farther than that and just kind of started, because you, you quit school before it was like the cool thing to do. Like nowadays it's kind of like dope to be like college dropout or be like, I never got a job. Like, that's like cool now. But like when you were doing it, it was like What the fuck are you doing? Like, shocking, right? So take us back, like, to that time in your life when you were in college and you just kind of knew, like, I've got to get out of here. This isn't for me. Can you tell that story of how you kind of knew the traditional path in life just wasn't for you, even if you had no idea that this whole, like, online space would become what it has?

Yeah. Oh, thank you so much for that kind opening. That's It brought me some giggles and some memories. And yeah, it's funny how much we change and evolve and we should change and evolve, right? I think that's something I've been dealing with actually currently is like, okay, who is Angie now at 33 versus even 25, 26? The amount that I've changed, which you should as a woman, like you change so much in between that. You keep a lot of who you are, but that's like the pivotal years. So I— it's weird that I've had some like hesitation towards evolving and changing, but it's like Wait, if I was still teaching the same shit I taught and talked about when I was 26, like, come on, that's boring. And it's like, what? Like, I don't want to— I don't want to do that anymore. I'd rather stick a pencil in my eyeball, you know? So it's been interesting to, like, have the evolution. And then, yeah, it's just been very interesting. But I quit college at about 20 years old before it was cool to be a college dropout. I had no idea what I was going to do, but I had a blog and I would be working on this health and wellness blog during class. I would be in lecture for anatomy. I always remember it was anatomy because it was such a hard class. I'd be in the back row and everyone would be like taking notes and paying attention. And I was on my little computer. I was writing my writers, my like 5 readers on my blog. I was like, thank you. Hello, what's up? I was writing everybody. And I remember thinking like, what if one day I was a health blogger? That would be cool. Is that like a thing? And I called my mom one day and I'm like, you know what? College is a joke. It's a scam. I'm paying so much money. Let's be honest, I'm not going to get out and work for corporate. We all know I can't work for anyone. I'm too stubborn. I'm too ADHD. I'm too like— I'm not— I'm not employable, you know? She's like, well, just get the degree, you know, be safe. You're already $100,000 in debt, so you might as well. And then I remember one day I was in anatomy class and I asked the girl next to me— I want to be a dietitian— and I was like, hey, how much are we going to make when we get out of here? And she told me how much we were going to make.. And I was like, oh shit, this is a trap. I got on my calculator and I was like, that's not enough to live. I was in Chicago and I was like, no, this can't be the rest of my life. I'm working 60 hours a week to make like $50,000 a year. No, just no. And be in a hospital under fluorescent lights all day. Get me out of here. So I was like, I got to go. What am I going to do? And I was like, I got to go. I got to go somewhere. But where do I go? I'm $100,000 in debt. I'm like, I was a personal trainer at the time, a nutritionist. I had the health blog. I was making random money here and there, just enough to pay my bills and for my food. And I was like, all right, I'm just going to try random things and we'll see what happens. And I, I kind of work well under that pressure. So I just believed in myself and I trusted that I would figure it out. And I was like, I'm 20 years old. I don't have kids, I don't have a family. Who cares? Those are the years to like Be in debt, be poor, be scrappy, be creative. So when people are like, were you afraid? I'm like, no, I was so— what was I afraid of? You're acting like I had 6 kids and like a mortgage. Like, no, that, that those were the years to be stupid. So I was like, let's go. I remember I walked into the office and I was like, hey lady, I'm out of here, to my counselor. And she's like, what are you going to do? I was like, I think I'm going to make money on the internet. And she was like, okay, I think she probably thought something else a little bit more X-rated.

She was probably like, drugs are bad, Angie.

Yeah, she's probably like, drugs or sex. Okay, good for you. Live your life, live your truth. And I took my book bag and I think I burned my books, went down the elevator, called my mom, and I was like, hey, I'm out. And it was really cute because I'll always remember that moment. It was one of the happiest moments of my life because I felt so free. I was like, I don't have a test tomorrow. I don't have homework. And for any fellow entrepreneur, you know, rebellious people listening, you resonate with that moment of like, I'm out of the cage. I'm out. Like, school was jail for me since kindergarten. So I was like, I'm out. And my mom was so sweet and supportive. She's like, I knew this phone call was coming since kindergarten. I was like, what do you mean? She's like, Angie, I knew you'd actually never finish college. I was like, what? And she's like, just fly, fly, Angie. Like, take your wings, fly. I'm not worried about you because you have this quality in you where you just figure things out even though it's really messy. You just figure it out. So that's kind of my story. And now 13 years later, I've just been doing a lot of random things in my entrepreneurial journey, all because that one day I was broke and in debt and I was like, I'm out of here.

Oh, your mom's just like simultaneously not believing in you at all, but like totally believing you. You're like, yeah, thanks, Mom.

She's like, I knew this phone call was coming. I'm like, what do you mean? She's like, I just always knew. Like, you just know with your kids. You'll know one day. Like, you just— I knew you wouldn't be able to finish.

Yeah.

Oh my God.

I just knew you wouldn't be able to finish. That's hilarious. My brother was kind of the same way. My mom, when he ultimately decided to leave college, my mom was like, I should have known this because from kindergarten the teacher was like, he's really good at playing. Like, that was like his strong suit, was like he loves to play and like hang out and be social, but like paying attention, not so much.

So what does your brother do now?

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Oh my gosh, I love it! That's so funny. It's like he loves to play.

Yeah, he just loves to be outside, so now he's outside all the time and that just worked way better for him. But yeah, I think like we grew up in an era where it was very much like the responsible thing for our parents to do was to guide us towards like the college path. Now things are kind of shifting a little bit, but I love what you said about like that was the time to be stupid because I think A lot of people are so afraid to make big decisions or take big risks like that in the years of your life where you actually— that's when you are afforded that opportunity to kind of like be a little bit reckless. That was the exact same time in my life where I was like, I'm not taking this corporate job in Chicago. I'm going to go move back to Spain and date this guy that I met on Tinder. And I literally just moved to a foreign country and was like earning poverty-level wage teaching English in schools, like teaching kids English. And I'm like, whatever. I don't know. I'm going to travel. I'm going to learn a language. I'm going to date this guy and like, see what happens. But like, I don't have— I didn't have anything at that time, right?

I didn't—

like you said, I didn't have a mortgage and have kids. I didn't have anything. All my friends were leaving to go other places and pursue their careers. I was like, this is the one moment in my life where it's like no strings attached. So I— yeah, similar to you, I kind of just jumped on that and I was like, fuck it, I guess we're going to find out, you know.

Oh, I love that. I love your story. That's like so cute and romantic. You're like, let's go, I'm just gonna go teach English. That's awesome. I love that.

Yeah, it was a fun journey. So I lived— I ended up living in Spain for 6 years after that. Yeah, yeah.

So I guess you'll have to offline— you'll have to tell me because I want to go visit Spain, so you'll have to give me the, the deets.

Yeah, I'll give you guys— if you're planning on doing a trip, I'll give you my recommendations of places and things. Yeah. But yeah, it was like such a fun journey of my life, and I'm so glad I had that experience in my young 20s. So I really try to like encourage, you know, young women who are in this space who are ambitious, they want to do something different, they want to deviate from the traditional path. Like you, you owe it to yourself to figure out what could happen for you or what you could create out of your life. You know, I think like a lot of people are really unhappy because they wake up and they look back and they're like, oh, I knew that didn't feel good for me. I knew that that was somebody else's dream that I was living out, but I got dragged into it and I'm here now. And then it's like the, the lost cost fallacy or whatever it's called, where you're like, oh, I put so much time in, so now I have to stay here. Yeah, yeah.

And I think we, we live in a time where we have more options than ever to make money and to monetize. It's, it's endless. The optionality is actually really beautiful. And so I think more than ever, we have the opportunity to do really cool things. I mean, this is everything from Etsy to DoorDash to being an online entrepreneur to starting a DTC physical product brand to whatever the cheeseballs you want to do, become an author, self-publish and get your book up on Amazon in 24 hours. Like, we've never lived in a time like this where there's no gatekeepers. You don't need a permission slip, you don't need a degree. You can create incredible work, art, whatever it is. Online. You can be a teacher in some capacity, coaching, whatever the heck you want to do. And that's really cool because our parents didn't have that. So of course they have a little bit— they have a little bit more fear around the unknown and this uncertainty. But it's really cool to grow up in this time. I know a lot of people hate social media and there's a lot of negative to it, but there's also so much beauty and opportunity to it. So I think, heck, if you're going to do it, this is the time to to go crazy and try something.

Yeah. And I think one of the best ways to, to kind of do that is by building a personal brand because it affords you the ability to be able to then pivot or shift what you want to talk about or bring out a product someday or launch a book or kind of like be in this multi-passionate space, which I know you're super familiar with. So building a personal brand is something that I help you know, my clients with. And I know it's something that you've done for yourself because you've been able to kind of bring in all these different pieces of yourself, these elements, facets of your personality. But I think like the idea of building a personal brand is really glamorized nowadays and it's kind of like, oh, everybody can do it, which is true. Like anybody could do it. But we've also kind of lost touch with the reality of how hard most people with strong personal brands had to work in order to really cultivate that, right? To have the ability to, you know, have an audience that allows you to go, oh, I'm not going to do this anymore. I'm going to come over here and do this other thing. And they just like follow along. Like, that takes a lot of time and building and effort and intentionality. And yeah, I think people maybe underestimate how long these things have taken. They might look at someone like you and be like, oh, I can just start posting and it should happen for me like that, right? We want everything instantly. So I'd love if you could share like about your journey of building the personal brand of Angie Lee and, you know, how, how long of a process that actually was and where you started versus like where you are now.

Yeah, one of my favorite things to talk about because I didn't really know what a personal brand was at 19, 20 years old when I started posting on the internet, on Facebook, Instagram. Instagram was brand new. I was like, what is this app? Do we just show pictures of our kale salad and just put like hashtag kale salad? Like, I didn't— I didn't know what was going on and I was just figuring it out. But the power of a personal brand does allow you a lot of optionality. And I think that is what's ideal for a multi-passionate woman like me and like many of the women listening. I assume they want to do a multitude of things from courses to live events to speaking to physical products. Now I'm getting more into comedy, brand deals, podcasting. You name it, it all is from the epicenter of I have a personal brand, which means I have a loyal community. And for me, yeah, it started— gosh, that was 13 years ago. So when people do— when people see it, I do think they think it's an overnight thing and they don't realize that cultivating an intimate community takes so much nurturing. It takes so much time. It is a full-time job. That's why I ask a lot for brand deals. And I do believe that influencers and content creators and personal brand should be paid really well because it is a— it's a lot. I'm answering pretty much every single DM. I'm asking questions. I'm putting out interesting content. I'm constantly asking myself, what will they find entertaining or educational or both? Every single piece of content has intentionality behind it, even when it seems like it doesn't. I'm very, very like strategic with it in a sense, even though it feels really fun and flowy. And so I do think that that in itself has been a lot. That has been a lot. Of freaking work, and it's required a lot of patience. It's not sexy, it's not an overnight thing. And if you, if you do get viral overnight, that usually doesn't last. Uh, let's say, let's say you make a video and it goes viral overnight. Just because you got a ton of followers or likes doesn't mean that you're necessarily going to be able to keep those people unless you've really built the ability to communicate with them, listen to them. I treat my community like they're my friends. I answer the DMs, I ask them questions. I know their sense of humor. It's very similar to mine. I know who I'm attracting. I know who I'm speaking to. And so getting really clear on that has helped me to create content. And like I said about patience, you know, it takes time. I think the way I've played it is the long game where I'm saying no to money now, or I've said no to money, especially in the past. So in a year or two or years later, it ended up paying me fivefold, tenfold, because I didn't take a brand deal with a skinny tea to make 5 extra hundred bucks when I wanted to be honest with my audience and actually just create relatable, fun content and for them to feel like I'm their friend they're hanging out with and not make the money. So then later I get a brand deal that feels more aligned and it's a win-win. But I don't think people want to do that. I think they want to say yes to the cash now. So I think it's for the person who has patience, who's willing to communicate, who loves being a community builder. I don't think it's for everyone. If you don't want to communicate and be social with people, if you don't really want to know what your community cares about or what like and answered your DMs, I don't think it's for you. I think more so just physical products or being a CEO of a physical product brand. I love being a community builder. It comes very naturally, natural to me. It's very fun. It's my favorite part of my job. So I do think it's kind of either in you or it's not. I would never force someone to go into content creation or building a personal brand unless it came natural in a sense, because I do think there's a lot of women now who want to do it because they think it looks cool or sexy. And then they're forcing themselves when they don't have the passion or the personality or the, the ambition really to do that. And that's when I— well, that's when my advice is find other ways to make money online where you don't have to show your face. There's tons of different ways. And so, yeah, it's everything though, building a personal brand. If, if you want to be a content creator, influencer, coach in some capacity, I do believe it's necessary. It's the number one thing you should focus on before making money.

Yeah, yeah, I think that's an important point. I mean, the same applies whether it's, you know, being a creator, a content creator, or even with like the podcasting space, the same thing that you said about saying no to money now so that you can say yes to really aligned partnerships in the future once you build that super strong community. But it definitely is like a long game. And I think a lot of people look at it now from the outside and are like, oh, all these people are online. And I think it's part of the way that we paint it in the industry as well too. Like there's some responsibility in the industry of making it look really easy and flashy and, you know, the, oh, it gets to be easy. Like, you can just make money doing this. Like, we also kind of like amp it up to be like that. So then people, they take that bait and they're like, oh, I could just like post and like make $100,000 a month. And it's like, well, it's actually like the hardest fucking job I've ever done is, you know, building a consistent community. Like, you know, it's been years and years of work. So in terms of like the podcasting space, because you— another thing that you started before it was cool was podcasting. Like, not a lot of people had podcasts. Not a lot of people were listening to podcasts back then, back in like the Rich Bitch days. So now you've got two shows. You have The Angie Lee Show and The Best Medicine, your new show with your brother Mike, who's the co-founder of Soul CBD, which we can talk about. So it's obviously a medium that you love and you thrive in. What do you think is special about the podcasting space? Or like, what makes people listen? Why has it gotten so big? Hey, don't forget that every month we are picking a listener of the month to win $50 in cash just for showing love to the show. All you have to do is leave an epic review of the podcast on Apple Podcasts, screenshot the review before you hit submit, and DM that screenshot to us on Instagram @makeshifthappenpodcast. And that's it. I want to thank you for being such a loyal listener and show my appreciation by putting a little extra cash in your pocket. I know it's super easy not to do it, but every single rating and review seriously helps the show rank higher and reach new people, so we appreciate them more than you know. We'll announce the next winner at the end of the month and slide into your DMs if it's you. So keep an eye out and good luck. Love you guys and thanks for supporting Makeshift Happen.

Yeah, here's what I think it is. It's a medium that allows you to multitask, which is really respectful of people's time. And so for me, I'm listening to a podcast while I'm driving, I'm doing laundry, I'm working out, I'm doing 5 different things. And I love being able to learn or be entertained while I'm doing those things. So it's one of the only mediums where you could do that because With YouTube, I have to watch the video. A lot of times I'll minimize it just so I can listen to it. So I do think that that's why it's a very, very attractive medium. I do believe it's also a great— it can be a great long-form, uh, long-form. It can be great long-form content, which is essentially right now we're able to have a more in-depth conversation than we would be able to have on stories, where in stories you can only say so much. So it's— what's nice about podcasting is we're able to go deeper, we're able to actually have a a conversation that has depth to it and we're able to explain something that maybe we wouldn't be able to on Instagram. So I do think it's a nice complement to short-form content because short-form content is really hot right now. People want quick videos, they want quick reels, they want TikTok. We're in the TikTok era, but it's nice to have things that are a little bit slower and more in-depth as well, just so we're able to hear those conversations. I think that it's a— I think it's a mix. Here's my honest, honest answer. I think that If audio is for you, you'll know fairly quickly if you have the ability to engage people with your voice. If, if not, that's totally fine. Go find a medium that works better for you. Some people are exceptional writers. I have a lot of friends who are incredible writers, authors, bloggers. They have Substack. That's how they make their money. They love it. I don't wake up and want to write. I've never been that way. I want to make skits. I want to entertain people. I want to be on video. I want to talk. That's how I communicate. So you have to find out how you communicate best. So I don't think podcasting is for everyone just because it's trendy. I think you have to figure out where do you communicate best and match that with where are your people hanging out. I know that the woman I'm looking to attract is probably on podcast, on listening to podcasts and on Instagram. So that's where I spend my time. So it's a mix. It's a blend between where am I, where do I have gifts, where can I, where do I actually have skill set, and then where's my audience hanging out. And ideally, where's the place where those two merge? It doesn't mean I won't still do some emails or writing here and there.

I have to with captions.

Questions and things like that, but it's not my primary. It's not the thing that I naturally find myself doing. And so step one is find how you express. If you're a content creator or you want to have any personal brand, you're either writing, speaking, you're on video, audio— there's only really so many. So find out where you really, really thrive and double down on that. But yeah, I think podcasting's still only growing. I think we've only hit the tip of the iceberg, and I think that, uh, it's just now getting more and more popular. But I think if you know how to articulate and synthesize complex things and make it easy and digestible and fun. That is the future of podcasting. I also think, and maybe I'm a little biased on this just because it's the direction I'm going, but I do think it's collectively what's happening is I think people are really burnt out with a lot of really heavy, serious stuff. I think the business world, the life coaching world, the wellness world, it's all about doing more and being— it's just so intense. And after being it for so long, I was like, I don't want to be in this anymore. Like, this is not where I thrive. I don't feel good here. It feels heavy. It feels masculine. It feels intense. I work in levity. So especially for me, I've noticed that the content that does the best for me and then the one— and the content that I love to consume is, is light, it's conversational. It's like this podcast, we're just chatting. You didn't have like specific questions necessarily. It feels fun, it feels unedited, it feels conversational. That's what people are really craving next. So I think for gals who are listening who are like wanting to do these highly produced super edited. Step 1, eat your healthy fats. Step 2, get in your 10,000 steps. It's like people don't go to a podcast to listen to an audiobook. That's an audiobook. Go, go write an audiobook then. People are coming to podcasts to feel two friends hanging out or two people having an interesting conversation. That's why Joe Rogan's the best in the world at what he does. There's a reason, there's a science behind it. So I think that people are also taking it too seriously and they're trying to make it too polished. And I'm like, dude, and they'll be like, listen to this. I'm like, yeah, it's so boring. It's so polished. I'm like falling asleep. So, but that's my take. Someone could come on and say something different, but that's my stance of where it's kind of going.

I totally agree with you. I actually had a season where I started to get literal anxiety listening to podcasts. Like, I've described this before, but it's like, this is how I always typically feel anxiety anyway, but it's like a sharp pain, like in the center of my chest. And I would start to feel that that while I'm like on a neighborhood walk, like listening to podcasts, because it was like so much of like, this is what you need to do and how you need to change yourself and 5 tips to do this and 6 ways to do that. And I was like, oh my God. And I was like in my Notes app, like trying to be like, okay, I need to write this down and then do this and try this. And then I need— I need to integrate it and then I need to learn it and then I need to teach it to other people and then I need to make it part of my lifestyle, my brand, and I need to be the embodiment and do more, do more, do more.

Which as a woman, not to be like too woo, it's very the masculine energy, which we need some of, of course, but it's like Oh my God, it's like I'm not enough, must keep doing more.

I literally was like, I think I'm like having anxiety from this podcast. Like, I literally have to turn this off. So I went through a phase where I was like, no more personal development podcast, no more personal development books. Like, I just like went full on, like anything that I listen to or consume because my work is— was— and I'm sure you can relate to that. My work was like in that world a lot. So outside of that, it needed to be way lighter. So it was like, I just want to listen to people shoot the shit and have conversations. And I started to listen to shows like Call Her Daddy and like things like that where it's just like, it's fun, it's girl talk, like it's light. And so I like, you know, even though we're bringing— because I know you do this as well, I think you do this well with Mike on The Best Medicine. You still bring like really interesting guests and you have meaningful conversations, but it's the flow of the conversation that's really casual and asking about their life and their story and just being curious instead of trying to get, like, an outcome or a tangible result for people out of the podcast. For me, it's like, it should be entertaining more than anything. But I think something else in there that kind of leads me to something that I wanted to touch on with you is that same energy when it comes to health and wellness and the biohacking gone wrong, which is like the more, more, more, more, more. Everything is hurting you. Everything is toxic. Your Wi-Fi router is giving you brain cancer. Your mouth is open when you're sleeping. You need to tape it shut. Like, you need to be like all the things where now it's almost like that we're kind of reaching that place with the wellness stuff where it's like, okay, I thought this was like making me better, but now it's kind of like giving me anxiety, you know what I mean? Like, I'm getting like fucked up from like trying to do all these crazy wellness trends and like be my best self in a way, which is That's exactly what I went through in the, in the self-help era was like, oh, I'm trying to be my best self to the point where I'm— I actually have anxiety. Like, I'm— I think I'm trying to do too much potentially. And I know you just recently shared about— which is why I thought it would be good to bring this up, because I know you recently shared about trying to be a little less crazy with these things and like bring back your toxic mascara that just works really well and looks good. And the Gwyneth Paltrow interview that's going viral right now of fast— she was like saying, for anyone who has missing context there, she was interviewed on a podcast recently. I believe he's a doctor that she works with, but he kind of asked her to describe her wellness routine. And she said that she fasts until noon and then she eats bone broth for lunch and works out for an hour and dry brushes and saunas and does a paleo dinner of vegetables and all these things. It's kind of giving, like, orthorexic almost, the obsession with the health things or fearing things that are not super strictly named healthy. Right. So, yeah, I thought this would be like an interesting conversation because I think a lot of us have been there in one capacity or another. I know I definitely have. I know you have of just like, have we gone too far with the biohacking?

Yeah, yeah, we definitely have. I think there is a small percentage. We went hard. Yeah, there's a small percentage of women who definitely have. And I'm laughing because I'm actually recording this episode for my show today all about— it's literally going to be called like something about Gwyneth Paltrow's coffee and have we gone too far in orthorexia? Because it's like, yeah, I definitely got there and I didn't know I was in it till people around you tell you. And Clay was like, hey, yeah, you're psycho.. And I was like, oh, okay. Like, I'm doing all the things and it's costing me so much time and so much money. Like, it's insane. You name it, I've probably done the biohack. It's probably here at the house. Turn off the Wi-Fi. I mean, I'm just like psycho. And so it got to the point where I was like, how do I actually, like, have less stress about this stuff? Because the reality is the people who live the longest don't stress about every calorie or Oh my gosh, is the Wi-Fi on at night? And it's just— it just— yeah, it went too far. And then you have celebrities who obviously look super malnourished and should not be promoting to women that bone broth is enough for lunch. It's so crazy and silly, right? So I think, of course, it's gone way too far. And yeah, once I really realized that stress is the thing that's going to kill me before anything else, and I got really honest with myself, that's when I was like, oh my God, Angie, how much of this are you doing because you love yourself and you love your body? And how much of it are you— how much of it are you doing because you're afraid to die and you're afraid to age, or you're just afraid? Like, that's real talk. And I was like, oh wow, I, I'm afraid. I'm just afraid. And that's not good for my system and my central nervous system. So yeah, you can meditate 6 hours a day, but if you're a psychopath because you had a bite of chocolate, who cares that you meditated and you're a monk? Like, it doesn't— it actually, I think it negates like the happiest people I know who are like in their 80s, who like look good, haven't had really work, haven't had work done. They're just like living their life, look more balanced, you know, have a drink here and there, have a great social life. They sleep well. They have a sense of purpose, whether it's familyhood, career, whatever. And you ask them, what's the secret? I've asked this for years. I'm like, how do you look like that? What do you know? You just look glowing. You look happy. They always say the same thing. They're just like, oh, I just live a good life. Like, I just, I laugh a lot. Like, I just have fun. And somewhere along the way, even me as a comedian, I like got so intense about all these biohacks. And then I started to get more into my masculine and I want to be a mom soon. And I was like, I don't think this is the energy I want to get pregnant with. Like, this is actually so intense. And then you take these fertility courses and they're like, they tell you all this stuff to do. And this is super controversial, but whatever. Like, the irony is a lot of times women— a lot of times, sometimes not, of course, there's different situations— but a lot of times women get pregnant when they weren't trying because they were just like letting go, aka the feminine energy of receiving. Like, oh, duh. So it's just like, it's got me thinking a lot. So the last few months I've been like, hmm, what would it look like if I wasn't as psycho about it? And it's actually hard. Like, last night I was out with my friends and I was like, oh, I want a sip of this mocktail that has like a gram of sugar. And usually I'd be like, no. And I had it and I was like, okay, had it. It was great. Move on. That's very hard for me. I know I sound psycho, but I'm just being honest about how far it got for me. And so I'm actually trying to have more balance. And I think a lot of women now are scrolling Instagram and social and feeling behind. And I've even had women DM me and they're like, I love your stuff, but yeah, some of your stuff with health is really unrelatable because it's like all day long you're just doing all this stuff and I don't have the time or the money for that. And I was like, oh my God, I'm actually preaching like some— wow, I don't want to do that. I just want women to like be healthy and have a good time and laugh and just have a good time. So I'm like, shit, what am I doing? So I don't know, you're catching me in the revelation right now, but I'm like, that was never my intention. I just got so obsessed with it. Especially in the nontoxic space, man, if you go down that rabbit hole, the next thing you know, you're like, I'm going to die if I once a year use a shampoo that has some coloring in it. I literally thought that. And so I'm trying to calm down now. I know you're laughing. And then I just— yeah, I'm like, wow, who is this new version of me who, like, 90% of me is super clean and then 10% or 5% is like, I'm going to have a glass of organic red wine once a month and I'm not going to die. I need to calm my tits, you know? So coming from the queen of calm your tits, I need to calm. I don't know. That's where I'm at. I do think it's orthorexia. I just— that word sounds so intense, but it definitely is. I mean, I used to compete in bikini shows. I mean, I've been through all of it. So it's like I traded 800 calories a day and 2 hours of cardio and eating chicken breasts for now. Ooh, if I have a sip of, you know, 1 gram of sugar, I'm going to die. It's like, isn't that kind of— they're both obsessions. They're both kind of neurotic. For the female brain or any brain to be obsessing about more than 5 seconds a day, because then I don't have that energy to put into my work. I don't have the energy to put into my passion. And I've realized I haven't had the creative energy I need to get things done. And I'm like, oh, it's because I'm exhausting myself so much in trying to be perfect. So that's been really interesting. It's like, oh, do we need to have this conversation with women who've gone too far in wellness?

Yeah, it's just another—

there is a section of people that do need to get healthier, right? So I don't want the woman who's like, like, obviously very unhealthy right now, feels like shit, doesn't move her body, doesn't even nourish herself. I don't want her to be like, oh, I can just eat donuts all day and drink beer. No, that's not what I'm saying. I'm saying you'll know. You'll know if you're at the place where you're like, I'm doing red light therapy and cold plunging 6 times a day, and I'm shitting my pants 3 times a week because I'm doing an enema and doing 6 enemas a day and cold plunging. And you'll know. But for the general woman who's like, I need to get healthier, yeah, be honest with yourself. You need to get healthier. But then years down the road, if you've gone too far, know when to stop and know when to have balance. And balance is hard. I don't know if you like how it works with you. It's hard. That sounds so, like, icky to even say and admit, but it's actually harder for me to go out and just, like, have a bite of something I want and, like, move on the next day and not be like, oh, no, was there seed oils in that? Am I going to die?

Am I going to die?

Yeah, that's me.

Yeah, I've worked on— because I've had different things with my skin and acne and liver stuff. And doing the whole holistic route of trying to fix everything. And I'm so grateful that we have so much more information and there are so many beautiful healing modalities and things that are actually helpful and that do work. But I feel like I've gotten pretty good at now seeing for myself when I'm going too far and I'm going into the fear, right? I notice if I start to look at the ingredients of something, I'm looking for the seed oils. I'm always looking for canola oil because I'm convinced canola oil canola oil is going to give me acne. So I'm like, fuck, this has canola oil, like I can't eat it. And I just— I noticed that that was happening and I was like, okay, I'm going to stop then. And I just literally went— I was like, I'm just going to eat whatever I want now. And I kind of like, I feel like it's this, you know, we're talking about feminine energy a little bit, but when I talk about masculine and feminine energy as it relates to business or life or anything, we're typically like on this pendulum and you swing hard, really, really hard one way. And a lot— for a lot of us, that was in the old fitness era that was really like into the masculine or in like the girl boss era with like building your business and stuff. Everything went really hard masculine, which was like hustle, do, build, create, whatever. And then you get to a point where you're like, fuck, like this feels really hard and I don't want to do it in this way anymore either. And so then the pendulum swings. If you let go of it over here on the right, it's going to go all the way over to the left, which is where you're like, I don't do anything and like no work and no calls and all white space in the calendar. And I mean, the same, the same process happens for wellness. I think if you go really hard in like the working out and the eating and the counting calories, a very masculine way of trying to achieve health, quote unquote health, and then you go over to the feminine side and you're like, oh, it's like all natural and herbs. But then you can get dragged into that as well of like the lion's mane and the ashwagandha and the red light and the this and that and the dry brushing And the— but it's another version of the same thing, which is exactly what you were saying is like it's obsession and any type of obsession is unhealthy. And so I think this— it's hard to have these conversations online, of course, because, you know, there's nuance to everything. And exactly as you were saying, it's like it's the responsibility of the listener to know where they fall and to be able to take the pieces of this conversation that feel true for them and create their own path because, yes, Yes. Are we saying that any of these things are bad singularly on their own? No. Right. Like meditation is great. Red light therapy is great. Mouth taping is great if you want to do it, you know what I mean? Like turning off your Wi-Fi router at night, great if you want to do it. But it's the obsession of feeling like you have to do these things. You're living in fear. I think that's the part is like when you can feel— and that's what I notice for myself. If I'm looking at a label and I can tell that I'm going to make a choice based out of fear, I either choose to just walk away from that situation, or I just literally don't even read the label and I just let myself eat it. And I'm like, I would rather not know what's in it. You could try. I know it'll be tough, but sometimes I can sense myself. I pick up the box of whatever it is I'm about to read the label, and I'm like, no, you already decided that you wanted to eat this, and it doesn't matter. It's one snack. In this moment of your life, like it's not going to change anything. Like, don't fucking read the label, just eat it. And I just force myself.

Don't read the fucking label. Yeah, it's, it's hard. You're right. It's just you just, you just swapped one obsession for the other, right? And finding that middle ground is, is everything. That's like the season of my life for business, for wellness. I'm like, how do I be right in the middle? I'm like, because either side I'm not happy. Me, like too much and just like airy fairy feminine. Yeah, do nothing and just smell herbs all day. It's like, no, I have like some fire in me. But then if I go way too far, I was so like, yeah, once 2020 hit and the world slowed down, I was like, oh my God, I was working so much. I don't want to do that again either. So it's almost like, who is this now in my 30s? And that is usually the years where it hits you, where it's like, wow, what really matters? What's the middle ground? What's balance? And I hate that word because it's so cheesy and it seems so like, you know, gitchy. And like, what does that even mean? But I think that is what I'm trying to find, is constantly that the rest and the push and the— I care enough about wellness more than the everyday person who's eating Taco Bell and drinking beer. Obviously, yes, I'll always be a super healthy woman, but also, like, can I have a glass of organic wine once a month and not be a psycho about it? Yeah, come on. Like, get a life, Angie. So, like, it's hard because I think us all-or-nothing type of women are like, we're either all or nothing because that feels safe. Actually, it's probably a protective mechanism of perfectionism. Probably. I don't know. I'm not a therapist, but I assume that's what's going on. Yeah.

And I think we like to know where we fall. We like to be able to define things. We like to be able to categorize. We like labels. I struggled with this for so long with food. I was always trying to figure out what I wanted to be like. Yeah, as if it was like a paleo, literally, like as if it was a career path or something else. I have to choose what I'm going to be. Am I going to be vegetarian? Am I going to be vegan? Am I going to be gluten-free? I'm going to be dairy-free? Am I going to be both? I'm like, I can't choose. I can't do gluten-free and dairy-free, so I got to pick one.

Oh my God. Even right there, the fact that you're even stressing about that. What do you think our ancestors at the time even sit and stress about that? That's such a privilege to be able to just sit and for us to do that. What the heck? We're just like, oh my God, should be gluten-free and dairy-free. And they're over there like, what are you doing with your life today? It's like, oh my God, I don't know. That obsession right there, that's what I would love to study, how that on the brain affects affects your central nervous system, which affects your stress, which stress is the number one killer. It's the number one thing that's going to age you. It's the number one thing that's going to do all of it. So I'm like, oh, shit. I'm curious how many of these big biohackers, some of these big guys in the space, they're looking older than they are, but they're doing all this stuff. And I'm like, interesting. It's like they have all the machines, they've got all the whatever, the wonky shit they're doing all day.

And I'm like, they look old and saggy.

Yeah. So I'm like, what's going on? I'm like, that's when I was like, hmm. And then I see people who just like live a more like quote unquote normal life and like they seem a little happier. So I'm like, hmm. So I don't know, I'm just kind of like looking at what's going on, you know?

I mean, we know, we know that stress is the root of like almost all disease, right, in the body. And so if, if what if you're able to do all of these crazy routines and not be worried about what happens if you don't do it? Yeah. Then I think that's one story. But a lot of us are like, it becomes like obsessive. And so then there is a full-time job. Job.

It's a full-time job. I realized it's like doing all of it is a full-time job. So that's when I was like, wow, once I have kids, I'm not going to be able to have this amount of time to do all of these wonky, weird things all day. So like, why don't I just condense it down to what really matters? Sunlight, movement, great sleep, a sense of community, a sense of purpose, stress management, eat as non-processed as possible. Done. There you go. It's not— there's no sexy course for that. There's no magic bullet pill.

That's it.

Like, it's the basics. Basics, you know, and walking every day. Like, just move your body in any way you like. Like, it's not— it's not sexy, it's not marketable, but like, let's be honest, we all know the basics is really what works.

So, you know, and— and butt sunning.

Oh, and yeah, and you got it, you got to do your butthole sunning or you're gonna die early if you don't butthole sun. Of course, yes. But you know, that's me fearmongering.

But—

but yeah, like, it's really basic. It's like, we're a plant, we need sunlight, we need We need light, we need sleep, we need good friends around us, we need a sense of somewhat of purpose each day. You know, we need the basics as these little organisms, but yet we're like, I need red light every day for 15. I don't have a red light machine. That's the one I don't, because I'm like, you know what? I don't. I go outside.

I don't care.

You just— you got to pick. You got to pick because there's so much and it's very expensive. So I realized I was like really giving my audience a disservice when I was like, you got to do this treatment and this treatment. And it's like, unless she's ill and needs that support right now, I'm like, I think a lot of things are— you can get in nature, you know, like even a fancy gym membership. Some of these gyms, it's like, well, can we do it at home? Or could you just go outside? Like, I just really rethinking everything.

I can tell we are—

my entire life over here, we're rethinking everything right now on this podcast.

No, but I think this is an important conversation because no matter what side of the spectrum you're on right now, it's valuable to just like be able to look at it from both points of view and think for yourself. Like, hmm, How does this show up for me? You know, so I think it's a really valuable conversation. I also think there's another element of this in that, you know, you own a wellness brand. Yeah. And people who are actively in the wellness space and you have a, you have a real stake in that, I think there is an additional pressure to like be this wellness guru or to like be on top of all the trends or know all the things or be doing all the things, you know, the same, which is what I say about the thing with Gwyneth. It's like she owns an entire huge, massive company brand existence that revolves around like wellness and being the guinea pig. Like a lot of her documentaries and all those things are about like trying all the things and doing all the things. Like we know that about her, we know that about her life. And I'm sure that she does feel this pressure not only from, you know, growing up in the Hollywood and the acting space to look a certain way, but also now being really deep in the wellness space of like you have to be like a leader in this space or like know all the things or be doing all the things. So I think that adds another element to it. But I definitely want to talk about Sol just as on its own and kind of the story and the inception of it because it's a brand that I love. It's products that I've used for years. My mom is like a super fan. She's like obsessed with, with all the Sol stuff. She like writes you guys reviews.

What's your mom's name?

Her name is Lynn. She's going to die. She's going to die when she hears this episode. She's like, you have to try the new Alert Caps. She's like telling me how she takes them and all this stuff. I originally— so I got her— I gifted her some Sol stuff for her birthday one year. She was kind of starting to have this arthritic pain in her hands, and she also deals with mental health and anxiety and things like that. So I got her a few products, and then she was hooked and loves it. And it's the only CBD that we've been able to try that actually tastes good and we all love it. Like, our whole family is hooked on it. My partner is like, whenever he's stressed or something, he's like, I need some of the CBD. I give it to him before he goes to bed at night. He has a great night's sleep. So, yeah, it's a brand that's, like, changed my life and my family's life. It's the thing that alleviates anxiety for me, like, within 20 minutes. So it's been such a blessing. But, yeah, it would be a shame if we didn't talk about this amazing thing that you and Mike have built. While you're here on the show. So tell us about the journey of founding Soul CBD and how it came into— how it came to life.

Oh, Lynn, we need to send Lynn some free product just for the shout out. That's so sweet. It's always everybody's mom. I'm like, that's like so my demo. I'm always like, my demo is like cool young college girls. And then my DMs are always like, my daughter follows you and I love your products and think you're funny. It's always like Cheryl or Lynn. I'm like, that's my demo. They love my shit. Literally. I love the moms. The moms relate to me. So, yeah, Mike and I started it. Gosh, it's been almost 5 years ago was the original idea in LA, in my kitchen. Started as a little idea, was kind of a joke. I was like, hey, I'm loving CBD for anxiety. And Mike was loving it as an athlete for pain, inflammation. And I said, what if we started a business around this? And he was like, oh, shit, maybe. Should we give this to more people? And we just started brainstorming and it started with us packaging our own stuff. My guest bedroom was where we were labeling every single box. We were going to UPS. I was the delivery woman. I was the— I was— you name it, I've played every role in the business in the beginning. Now I do not. But in the beginning we did and we just wanted to first see if there was proof of concept, if it was a thing that really helped people. And it was insane. We started to see incredible testimonials of how much CBD Helps people with anxiety, sleep, pain, focus. And what started as a little idea in my guest bedroom, which was our office and shipping station, and my mom was one of our OG assistants who was helping us out. My other friend in LA would come over and help us box stuff. Now it's turned into a massive brand and we have a warehouse. We have like 20 employees now. It's, it's really grown into something bigger than we anticipated, but we just kept riding the wave. And it's been really exciting. And Mike is the CEO. I help more with the creative, the marketing, collaborations, things like that. And yeah, this is where we're at now. I was like, anything you want to know. But it is great. It's a great plant. We really, really love it. For anybody listening, CBD is the non-hallucinogenic form of cannabis, so you will not get high or zero THC, even though we're thinking of actually coming out with a THC blend gummy. Well, stay tuned for that. But we— for now, our shop is completely zero THC. We have sleep gummies, we have Alert Caps with adaptogens in them. We have our regular gummies. That's our biggest seller, which are essentially very delicious. We're the best tasting CBD there is. Very delicious flavors of 10 to 25 milligrams of CBD, which help with just general anxiety, stress, racing thoughts. I take one before bed. I love our Chill Caps. Those feel like a glass of wine. Like kind of mellow you out a little bit. So yeah, what started as our passion just to help people feel better and get out of anxiety and pain turned into now Mike's full-time job. So it's kind of crazy. So he's running the day-to-day. It's cute when people think I am. They're like, oh, are you the CEO? And they'll like email me questions. I'm like, oh my God, no, no, I am not customer service. I am not the CEO. I'm none of that anymore. Okay, that was years ago. But you know, that's the reality of a startup for any entrepreneur listening. The reality of any startup is you are You're the mailman, you're the boxer, you're the shipper, you're the customer service, you are the face of it, you are everything until you have the money to hire people. And once we got that, then we started hiring and now we're hopefully going to sell in the next year or two. So it's been very— it's been very exciting.

Yeah, I love how you said that. You're like, now that's Mike's full-time job.

Yeah, now it's Mike's full-time job. It's not mine full-time, but it's his. It's his. And yeah, he's working hard. Victoria Ward. Our marketing team's great. Everybody's really come together now, but it's been— it's, you know, it has its ups and downs. I mean, it's a physical product brand, is a lot of work. It's very different than a personal brand. Going back to what we said in the beginning, um, a personal brand, you don't have product, you don't have inventory, you don't have to go into a lab and formulate things. Uh, gosh, you don't need the customer service. There's a lot of headaches, but there's a lot of potential, uh, financially and things like that. And with, with helping people, it's been so nice. Like we had a meetup last night here in Austin and to meet people in person who are like, your product changed my life. Like, it makes me emotional. It's so awesome. It's the coolest feeling. So there's a lot of pros to physical products. But let me tell you, like courses and masterminds and events, all of that, so easy. Like, that was so easy compared to physical products. Like, I'm nervous to launch a course. I'm like, dude, it's like, just launch it. Like, make some videos, make some— it's, it's fine. You're like, get over it. You can edit it. Try a physical product that has to ship to someone's house. It has to taste good. It has to work. It has to be safe. It's just so much more of a headache.

And you need so much legal— the legal, the regulations. And oh my God, like, I think about physical products and I am like, I need 20 gummies because I'm like, going to— my hair is going to fall out with how—

yeah, unless you have a real big passion for one, like one that you're like, I have to put this out in the world, I, I wouldn't really suggest it.

You're like, I zero out of 10 recommend.

No, there's a lot easier things out there. Keep going back to stress. Keep your stress levels low.

Yes, totally. We'll leave a link in the show notes for you guys to check out Soul CBD. They've given me a discount code so you guys can save 15% off. So we'll leave that in the show notes if you want to check it out. It's a brand that I love. It has helped me, my family. We're obsessed with it. Tastes so freaking good. It's an amazing solution. And I'm grateful that you went through the headache and heartache of putting it out there and all the work and everything. So, yeah, thanks so much. So I want to talk to you about your recent engagement, which is very exciting.

Congratulations. I forgot to wear my ring right now. Oops.

She's showing the excitement.

I'm showing the excitement. I forgot. It's like on the kitchen counter. I just— it's weird wearing jewelry every day, so I just actually don't wear it all the time.

But you are engaged. You are in fact engaged. And you shared some, some really valuable things around the experience that I think is, again, just something that the audience will be able to take so much value from in terms of these— like, you don't have to tell a whole story, but yeah, if you guys want to hear the whole story, it's on Angie's podcast, so you can listen to her tell the whole, whole detailed story of how it all went down. But just around the societal pressure to get married and have kids and how that kind of impacted the moment of you getting engaged. I know there's so many women in my audience that— and everywhere— that I just think life and society is changing so much and we're doing things much later than we used to do them, which then brings in the biological clock conversation. But we don't want to get married at 23 anymore. My parents were 23 and 24 when they got married. When my mom was my age, she had 2 kids and they were done already.

29. Okay.

Yeah. But the trend is just everything is trending a little bit later, but it's bringing in this layer of stress and pressure of am I going to get there? Is it going to happen for me? When is it going to happen? All of that. So I think it's a super relatable conversation and it's something that a lot of women are feeling, but maybe feel like shame or embarrassment around admitting, like, I just want this to happen, or when is it going I'm scared that it's not. And so bringing that into the light, I think, is like really helpful. So yeah, I'd love to just hear your take on what it was like to have those fears or pressures and how it kind of like impacted your journey of, of enjoying the engagement or actually arriving to the moment of getting engaged.

Oh my God, it's such a roller coaster. Oh my gosh, such a blur. I don't even remember it because I was like so out of it. But yeah, it is very interesting because half of me feels very strongly about like, screw societal timelines, screw, screw society, you know, it's very like women empowerment. And I feel that way. And then the other part of me is like, if it's right and you truly desire something, there's nothing wrong with wanting it. Like, I'm very honest in that episode. I'm like, no, that was something I wanted. It's a value of mine. It's very important to me. To me, family is like number one and something that I want. And so I I don't want work to come before that. Like, I always really want to prioritize that. So I think it's like there's this— there's both sides of the story that you could see. But I do think that for women who feel behind or feel like there's something wrong with them, I do think a lot of that you do have to recognize is this. Yeah, this silly societal pressure that makes you feel like there's something wrong with you if you're not. And then, you know, social media makes it worse, right? Because what do you see all day long on social media? Everyone's— this year on the holidays, everyone and their grandma's getting married. Have the perfect wedding, everyone's getting engaged at the Eiffel Tower, having their 6th kid. Woo! Life's perfect, you know? So you see that, and so then you start to think like, oh my God, what if I don't? Subconsciously— I don't think I ever really consciously, but subconsciously I think our brain is like, well, I should be doing that then. Am I behind? And then biologically, as women, our body's like, what's going on? Am I behind? What am I doing? And so I do think it's like, you're just— it's a, it's a big mix of just confusion. And so, yeah, it was very interesting because my experience, I think a lot of women only share like the glitzy glammy, like I said on Instagram of, oh, me and Chad just got engaged and we're just so in love, you know? And then you don't really hear like, was she looking for, waiting for it? Was she anxious about it? And yeah, for me it was something that it wasn't like a fairy tale before it. Like, I was pissed and I was like, let's go, come on. I just thought to myself, why don't I share that with people? Yeah, it's embarrassing, but I'm going to share it. And then people responded well, of course, because it's real, right? And so I'm just curious how many other women had that experience, yet they're not posting that part on the internet. They're just like, oh, we've been in love and it was perfect timing and da da da. It's like, well, no, sometimes the guy just needs to get his shit together and let's go, you know? So I think that Yeah, only you will know, ladies in the relationship, when is the right time. But don't— try as best you can to not do what I did and flip your tits before, because then it does kind of take away from the special moment in a way. So you do have to like get yourself together. But honestly, it was my experience. It was what it was, you know, I can't look back with regret. That's how I felt before it. I was just like, what the heck? And I was very upset with him. And so, yeah, my experience was kind of crazy. I don't know. I'm torn on how to explain it to women because it's like part of me for the girls DM'd me. I got so— oh my God, it was like one of the highest converting pieces of content. So many women were like, well, you know, I've been with Chad for 8 years and he hasn't. I'm like, well, tell Chad to get it together. Like, I'm all about female independence, but also like, no, like, get it together, Chad. So then I was like kind of mad at these guys. But then the other part of me for the women who it's recent, it hasn't been that long, I'm like, well, like, it's okay, you know? Like, wait a bit, or don't feel like there's a rush.

Every—

everybody's different though. Some women care about that, some women don't. Like, I know women who've been with someone for 9 years and they're still like partners, you know? Like, they don't— some people don't care. So it's like, it also is very individual. And then there's girls who DM me and they're like, me and Johnny got engaged after 2 months and we're 22. And I'm like, oh God, you know? But that's like my internal judgment, right? Who am I to know? I shouldn't be judging that. But I'm like, oh God, you've known him for 8 weeks and you're 22. This is not going to end well. But again, I shouldn't be saying that, you know, but maybe they're lovers and they'll be together till they're 100, you know. So there is no right or wrong way to do love. There is no right or wrong time to do anything. I have best friends here who just got pregnant for the first time at 42, extremely healthy and fine. I have friends who had kids when they were 20 and it was a surprise and it was the best thing that ever happened to them then as well. So it's weird. This spectrum between 20 to 40 now is like, it's just there's so much that happens that it's just crazy, you know? So I don't know, these years are interesting. The 28 to like 35 is like very interesting. I don't know if you're experiencing this with your friends or the internet, the societal pressure of marriage and kids and all that. You got to really be clear on what you want. Like, you got to turn off social for like a few weeks and like go in, do some meditation, whatever the heck you got to do, you know, cleanse your chakras, whatever, do an enema. You got to like be like, what do I want as a woman? Do I want marriage and kids, or do I think I do because society is telling me? You just got to like really check in with yourself, which is hard because you're scrolling and you're like, oh, Susie Smith seems happy. She's got this right. But it's no different than entrepreneurship. It's like a girl following me and being like, oh, she did events, so I need to do events. Like, girls would always DM me that I want to do what you do. I'm like, you don't know what my life is like though behind, and you don't know what that took to do that. Like, you should do what you want to do. Like, nothing's as glamorous as it seems. And so I think it's no different, you know, it's no different.

So I feel like—

I don't know if that was helpful or it's just like a therapy session.

So helpful. No, I think it's helpful for everybody because you can relate regardless of where you are. And I think the common thread through this entire conversation is discernment. Every single thing that we've talked about is like, you have to know yourself yourself and know what's true for you and be willing to say yes to that no matter what the implications are, or if it's a deviation from everyone else, from what everyone else is doing.

Yeah.

Or if it's kind of falling in line and doing what everyone else is doing and not making that mean anything weird about you either. Like, it's okay to want things that other people have or that they've created. And so, yeah, I think it's really exactly what you said. You've got to know yourself, which is challenging to do when we're bombarded with, you know, what everyone else is doing and what everybody else wants. And I think that is such a common theme for so many people is that we— this is how we find ourselves living in lives that are unfulfilling.

Yeah.

Is because we have thought that we've wanted something, but it's because it's what other people were wanting. And so we thought that maybe that would fill a hole for us or that that would make us happy. It was never actually what you wanted. You know, I realized at one point, like, my vision of being this, like, corporate woman, like, in in a really cute, like, you know, awesome suit with like my handbag and my heels, like in Chicago. Like, do it. Like, I don't think that was ever like mine. I mean, of course it wasn't mine, right? No thought that we've ever had is original to us. It always comes from somewhere, right? All of our thoughts are informed by things that we see, hear, experience, whatever. And so I realized at one point, like, oh, that's why when I started working in a corporate internship, I I like felt so— I was just making playlists all day and texting my boyfriend from— who was in another country, because I was like, this— I don't— this was never my vision. And so I think that's a really important message for us to close with for everybody, whether it's about engage— like getting engaged or having kids or starting a business or what kind of business you want to do, or personal branding or podcasting or any of the things that we've talked about. It's knowing who you are and figuring out what you actually want outside of what everybody else is making you think that you want.

Yeah. Amen. It's hard. It's very hard. I think discernment is very hard. But once you hit it, I think it's a constant practice of coming back to what's true for me. What's true for me? Wait, what do I actually want? Wait. Okay. Delete social media. It doesn't exist. Like, it's almost like, like be in a vacuum with yourself. Like, what do you want? What would you— what would your dream life look like? Like closing your eyes and getting real with yourself. Yourself. Because the coolest place to be at is you can scroll and go, oh, I love that for her. Like, that's so cool for her. But like, I don't want that, you know? I see that all the time now with different things in entrepreneurship. So I know I'm in a really healthy place with that where I'm like, oh, I— that's awesome. I love that she's crushing that. But I know what that takes to do that. I do not want to do that again. Like, I, I'm good. So that, that's like really cool. So I think the same thing with anything else in womanhood, you got to be able to be like, oh, cool, she had that at her wedding. Like, I don't want that. Or I don't want to even get married. It's— you almost have to be able to be like happy, cool, free, like be happy for others and then know if that is a heck yes for you or a heck no. But like you said, it's hard. It's really hard because we're living in times that are so different. Think of our moms. They didn't have a thing on their, on their, you know, attached to their hand that they could go like this with their thumb and literally, you know, 50,000— see 50,000 other people's lives in about 10 minutes and then question your own. And I also have that they just like live their life and just did what they wanted to do.

Yeah. And part of that is like the dopamine hit of being able to share those things online and be like, look at me, I'm doing this. Like, which wasn't a thing before either. You know, like you got engaged in private, like maybe someone took a photo of you, but now it's like this whole elaborate thing. The photographer pops out of the bush, like, you know, it's this whole fucking thing. And, you know, there's a million parties involved leading up to the wedding. So many things that our parents are just like, what? Like, this is so bizarre. Like, you're paying thousands of dollars to go to Cabo for like an engagement party or for like a bachelor party, like we literally like went to the bar and like chugged a beer or something.

You know what I mean?

Like, we— everything has changed. And I think we're almost seeking to do these things for the dopamine of being able to show other people that we're doing them. It's not even like, oh, the act in and of itself is going to satisfy me. It's like, I want to share this act. Like, I want to show to people, look, I'm engaged, and then everybody's going to go crazy and be like, I'm so happy for you. And that's going to give me like a dopamine rush and I'm going to be so excited, you know?

And it's like, it's the— why is the darn dopamine? Or these women, you know, who— and I mean this in like comedic fun, but it's, you know, it's their first— it's always the first kid's birthday. It's their first birthday party. Okay. It's the 1-year-old. They're never going to remember. Like, my 1-year-old one day is never going to know if we went to Chuck E. Cheese down the street or I spent $100,000 on a whatever. And they do these elaborate, very expensive theme parties just so they can show on social not because that's what the kid genuinely wanted. Well, they're 1 year old, so they don't know what a party really is yet, you know? And that's where I'm like, okay, social's gotten a little like, what's going on here? You know? So I get what you mean. It's like been exacerbated because we're like, what are we doing? Because we genuinely want to and it feels good and it's what's best for our family or what matters versus like, let me show them that I spent $100,000 on these, you know, dinosaur-themed balloons so people know I'm rich. Like, that's sad, you know? But I get it. I've been in it. I've even 5, 6 years ago, I was like so much more about that. I was like, oh, if I share this, then it makes me look like this. And now once your ego dies, you're just kind of like, oh, I like my life offline. So that's all that really matters.

Yeah, yeah. That's a, that's a real conversation too. Like, do you like your life outside of what it looks like online? And I think the— I guess the last piece that I'll say about this whole, like, you know, engagement thing is like we see all these things happening for other people and it applies to anything. It applies to businesses, it applies to fitness, it applies to how people's bodies body's look, it applies to everything. You see something and you think that that's the whole story and it never is, right? Like, I could see you could have easily, like, made it so— made it look like this amazing glamor, which it was. It was an incredible engagement. Like, shout out Clay, like, really went all out for it. But like, there was another very real piece behind that, that if— but if you were to never share that, everybody would just be like, oh my God, Angie got like the most fairytale engagement ever and have this, again, unrealistic expectation of like, must have been like most amazing moment of her life, when in reality you were kind of like in shock, shitting your pants, like kind of pissed at him.

Yeah.

Yeah. So you guys have to go listen to the episode on Angie's show if you want to hear the whole story. But just a last reminder to remember what you see on social media is never the full story.

And that's just facts. Amen. It is not. But then once you know that, you're like, oh, okay, I'm free. You set yourself free. You're like, cool, love her hair, love her body, but like, I don't know, one, you just don't know. You see like, oh, she's got a six-pack, cool. Is it edited? Is she healthy? Who knows? Like, you just like scroll with this new discernment of like, you know, that. And that's like a— I think it's a huge sign of maturity, honestly. I think that happens only in your late 20s and 30s. I don't think in your early 20s most women have that level of discernment yet. You almost have to go through the phase of comparison and you have to go through that to like flush it out in a sense.

Yeah.

Part of growing up, right?

Yeah. Be able to realize like, oh shit, like I really thought that was real and then it wasn't. Like when, when the, when you start to pull the curtain back on all of the online bullshit, you're like, oh, like that happened for me in business and it was so freeing. I no longer had to like pedestal people or idealize them or be like, oh my God, like everything that I'm like, they're literally on a call with their coach right now, like shitting their pants, like so scared and like sad and they have no free time and they like, hate their life half the time. Like, I'm not yet.

Yeah, I'm not worried about that for sure. For sure. I'm like, yeah, facts. I'm like, I'm glad you had that epiphany because, yeah, a lot of people think like, yeah, all that glitters is gold or whatever the saying is. And then you realize everyone's a human, everyone's going through stuff. And the people are like, I made $1 million this month from this launch. You're just like, one, no, you didn't. You're lying. And two, what? What did that look like? You know? So, yeah, once you can just like look at it through a lens of like, okay, next, like, it's fine. Fine.

Do me. Yeah. Grain of salt. Everything with a grain of salt. Absolutely everything. Yes. So thank you so much, Angie. This has been a really fun conversation. I think it's super relatable. There's so many good just pieces of things that we hit on that I know so many people are going to resonate with deeply. Let everyone know where they can come find you if they want to hear more of your amazing comedic genius. I'm looking forward to more of the comedy content.

Thank you. That makes me so happy. Woo! Yeah, I'm writing a script right now, so I'm like, oof. And I got to— I got to finish it today. But I think I'm going to do like a reply to the Gwyneth video. My— yeah, I'm going to do my version with a blonde wig on. It's going to be good. So yeah, you guys can find me at Angie Lee Show, angielee.com, Angie Lee Show Podcast. And yeah, that's kind of the interesting season I'm at right now with the show is I'm, I'm anticipating to turn it into a comedy podcast. So it's kind of like, what does that look like? And, you know, that transition. Because, I mean, gosh, my podcast started with, like, health and wellness, and then I freaking taught online marketing, and now I'm like, call in about your best, you know, penis story or your best, you know, pooping on a date story. So it's like crazy how much it's changed, but it feels so good and it feels so right and it feels so fun and light and what I need and what my people need. So I'm just like, let's go. But I'm also like, oh my God, is this what's happening?

I will have to call in and tell you about the story where I almost shit my pants in front of two comedians in New York City.

Wait, I'm about to air this one. I'm going to— after this, I'm going to tell you to send it in so you can make it in time while I'm still editing it because it's almost done. I'm like, yes, I want to add this one in. I'm doing all these horror poop stories. But yeah, my vision for it, for sure. For any of you want to come over and listen, it's definitely not serious personal development anymore. My vision is kind of like a— yeah, more of like a Call Her Daddy, but a Call Me Your Tits. Yeah, we'll see. We'll see what happens with it, but I just know it's going to be fun.

So yeah, and that's important. We're going for fun. I love it. Thank you so much, Angie. We'll leave everything linked in the show notes for you guys if you want to go check her out. If you enjoyed this episode, make sure you take a screenshot, share it to your Instagram stories, and tag both me and Angie so that we can see. And thank you guys so much for listening. I will talk to you next week.

Bye. Thank you. Bye, guys.