Episode 9: Rising up with David Weale

All right, here we are. Thanks for joining me.

No problem. Thank you.

Sitting down today with my good friend David Wheel, fellow Canadian. And we met, I'm gonna say six. Six years ago in Vancouver at Parlor. Yeah, yeah.

Good memory.

Yeah, I have a great memory when it comes to pizza. Yes. We met in Parlor and that time I was out there, I think, because I was competing or something fitness related. And you had a healthy snack bar.

Yep. Something that was when I was still in Grind Bar days.

Grind Bar, okay.

It was a CBD infused energy bar.

Right, right.

Which was. That's a whole other chapter that I'm on now.

Yeah. And now here we are both living in Nosara, Costa Rica. Love it.

Totally.

So I wanted to sit down and have this conversation with you because you have a very inspiring story and you've been through some serious shit. Yeah, yeah. And like most people who end up here, they've gone through some real adversity, some real breakdown and breakthrough moment that has them choosing a new life. So I would love for you to share a bit about, you know, who was David Weil 10, 15 years ago? That or you know, leading up to certain events that had you really take a step back and say, okay, am I really living the life that I want to live? Do I want to continue being this guy? And ultimately, what led you to the path that you're on now?

Awesome. Big question.

Yeah. Let's start light, you know, some casual small talk.

Well, there's actually kind of two moments of big times of that in my life. The one going way back, you know, the kind of 10, 15ish years ago now. I was originally living in Whistler. I was a pro skier. Not pro. I was like, I had some sponsors, but I competed a little bit and still did other things. I was on that journey to becoming that and coached and did all that stuff as well. And until I broke my neck and a mountain biking accident, which as you can imagine, would change that path, derail.

Your career a little bit.

Yeah, exactly so. And caused everything to get questioned, everything to, you know, like a lot of my worldviews, all the things, you know, like, it really changed a lot of stuff. But it was also a really beautiful time of learning, time of opening. Like, that was when I started going down more of the spiritual path, learning more about nutrition and the power of mindset and, and meditation and how we can actually heal our bodies. Not like there's so much that came from that. It was, it was awesome to like, not awesome in the moment, but like a lot of really awesome shit came out of it.

Yeah. And, you know, and to just that point, it's like when you're in the moment and you're dealing with that stuff, you're questioning, why me? Oh, God, poor me, why'd this happen? The anger, the frustration, the sadness. Years later, you look back and you're like, thank God that happened.

Totally.

You know, like, if you hadn't broken your neck, where would you have been? Right. I mean, you might have gone on to become a pro. You might have been down a very different path, living a very different life.

You've still been bartending and hanging out in Whistler and skiing and waiting for the next POW day, you know.

Yeah.

And nothing wrong with that. I just, you know, I'm very grateful to be on the path now that I'm on and getting to help people and getting to, like, transform lives. Yeah. You know, it's pretty awesome. So that was like, the first big change that made me reconsider my whole life path. I had been coaching skiing most of my life before then, but then learning so much about spirituality and nutrition and all, like, the way the body works and all this and the power of mindset and got into, like, the personal growth world at that point as well. That kind of set me more on that path of, like, okay, like, I found out about coaching. I didn't even know there was, like, actual, like, life coaching was a thing before then. I went through landmarks programs around that, and I had a coach in there and found out, you know, and just kind of. I was like, oh, like, I already know how to coach. I already like working with people. I'm really patient. I was like, maybe I can just take all this shit that I'm learning and help other people make their lives better.

Beautiful. Now, how old were you at that point?

I was about 28.

Okay.

So I was already pretty young, but also, like, pretty young in the grand scheme, but also. Or pretty. I don't know, like, I was young to start getting into coaching at that point. Like, when I went through school for it and everything, it was like me and a bunch of empty nesters. Yeah. You know, like a lot of, you know, and trying to build a business. Like, oh, yeah, mid-20s guy. Like, I can tell you how to make your life better.

Yeah.

And I didn't have a lot of experience in business at that point either, so. And I had a lot of. I didn't know it at this at that point, but I had a lot of inner work to do as far as actually believing in Myself and having confidence and like being able to go out and make money and charge what I need to charge, like there's so much that I had no idea how to do. And just, you know, I was, I was pretty good at coaching even way back then because you know, just like I have a lot of the natural skills for it. But being a good coach and building a successful business are two very different skill sets, which I'm sure you know obviously from your experience too. And you had a bit of the opposite path actually of like super into business first and then getting into coaching. But it's like, but that created its.

Own set of problems. Not problems, but let's say blockages. Because yes, I was very successful as nightlife hospitality entertainment guy, being self taught through 25 years in the business. But when it came time to now change, it's like then deciding, okay, it's time to change it up. But then it's like, okay, yeah, I'm great at that. But how am I going to teach people or coach people and ask them to pay me to change their life or guide them when I'm just a high school dropout and I'm a nightlife guy, I'm a restaurant guy and how am I going to teach someone how to be more conscious? You know, it was like I had to go through my own journey and as you said before, heal what you didn't even know was there so that.

You can, I've done that part yet.

Yeah, so you can work through it and then be the example in that sense. And you know, even though I had a, you know, large community network through my former career, a lot of people were even skeptical, like, okay, like, right? Oh yeah, Zark, the nightlife King street guy is a coach now. Yeah, okay, sure. And you know, even some of my really close friends doubted me and even a few till today. And I know who you are, still question whether or not, you know, this is the real deal or not. You know, so it was interesting. I, you know, even having built successful businesses in the past, it's very humbling because I could open a new club or restaurant to Toronto and like, yeah, we would pack it, no problem because we had that track record and that history. But now it's like, okay, I'm starting a business that I really am learning about day to day from scratch with no support, without the team behind me. And it was very humbling and definitely had to get over my own insecurities. Insecurities and the imposter syndrome in order to step into okay, yeah, I'm a coach and I could support you in changing your life. And pay me.

Yeah. It's gonna cost this much.

Exactly.

Yeah, totally. And. And just the confidence that you're able to deliver that value, you know, like you are. You knew that you could make money, obviously, and you knew that, you know, there's value in like the food and the drinks that you were serving and like getting the experiences for. In that way, but like a whole different thing. So it's another journey in itself. So, you know, fast forward, I started getting into coaching. I moved down to Vancouver, away from Whistler, where I was living at the time, and kind of started surrounding myself with more entrepreneurs and getting more into that scene. And at one point I realized through some training, like, you know, another self development program, I was going through it talked about this idea of like, there was a lot of guys out there just teaching people to be rich, that it only made money by teaching people to be rich. You know, like they read a book and they did a workshop on it and they hadn't actually like gone and done it. They improved it for themselves. And that really hit me in that, you know, like, I haven't, although I am. I knew, I knew, I knew I was good at coaching in that moment. I wasn't. Like, I felt like I needed to go build more life experience. I needed to go and fucking get my hands dirty.

Really embody it.

Yeah. So I put all of the coaching stuff on hold for a while and started a business in the cannabis space, actually, which I didn't intend to do that. I kind of just blew everything up. And then I needed a job and I went and worked at a dispensary for a little bit and saw that there was. This was like 2014ish when in Vancouver, cannabis was not legal yet, but there was dispensaries everywhere. And it was like the writing was on the wall that it was going to become legal, it was going to become this big thing. And I just kind of didn't plan on starting a business at first. I just wanted to be safe and kind of like I had a huge big blow up and I almost launched a retreat center. And then that all fell apart and like, that was the whole fucking thing. But it was more just like, I need to be safe for a minute and like get a fucking job and chill out. And then the entrepreneurial mind was there still and wanted. Like, I saw this gap of. There was a lot of edibles, but they were all just like brownies. It was all just like sugary garbage and lots of weed. And there was. I learned about CBD as well for the first time there. And long story short, I saw this whole. No one was making anything healthy with just cbd. So I created my own line of energy bars that I wanted to eat for like hiking and skiing and doing all the things that also had cbd. So they would help me focus because I learned a lot through experiencing CBD that I'd had anxiety my whole life and I didn't even really realized it as well. And it really helped me a lot with that. So started that journey, raised a bunch of money and kind of like got my product in stores and almost. We went on Dragons Den actually as well company and almost sold it to one of the big licensed producer groups. But then, you know, a bunch of stuff happened right around that and it all ended up, I got a little bit taken advantage of and the whole thing actually fell apart. I lost, I was lost. The whole company kind of basically like started working with them to like create new products, but edibles weren't going to be legal for another year. So we, we wrapped everything up, packed everything up, laid off all of our staff. And then after two months of starting to work with this company, they pulled the rug out and they were like, sorry, no deal, like you're fired. And like all the things.

Wow.

So it was like, that was the second as I mentioned, like moment of like, like now, you know, and as well, like in that time, you know, like I went, I, my ego got huge in that moment. Like I had a like almost million dollar buyout for this thing and went in, fucking bought a Tesla and did all the shit and like spent the.

Money before you had it.

The money before I had it. And then yeah, like I, we had an LOI sign. But like my naive brain was like, it's done deal. Like the LOI sign and working for them, like, what could go wrong? Yeah, apparently that could go wrong. But in that time I also had a bit of a like a Golden Handcuffs kind of a feeling because I, part of the deal was I had to work with them for three years and I had to like go to the office and do the corporate 9 to 5 thing. And I was like, what the fuck? Like I built this whole company so I didn't have to do that, you know, like now I'm being like trapped and there was like an hour commute, commute. Even though I was in a Tesla, it was still a shitty commute. And like, and I got really depressed and shitty and, and I also realized in that moment, I was like, I built this whole company just to prove to myself that I can do business so I can go and be a coach. And. And like, all I could think about while I was starting this job was also just going and starting my coaching or consulting stuff on the side. Right. And. And then. So when it blew up, I was like, well, I could go and raise more money. I could build it back up again and then sell it again or the couple years that it would take to do that. I could just, you know, cut my losses and start diving into myself.

Focus on what you really want to do. Yeah. And, you know, someone shared this quote with me once, and it's always stuck. It's sometimes the best deals we do are the ones we don't. Because had that deal gone through, had you been stuck there nine to five, three years. Totally three years of your life. Yeah. That you could have been doing.

Like, I was getting real shitty real quick, even in like a couple months.

Yeah.

You know, I can't imagine three years of doing that. Like, it would have broken my soul a fair bit. And. And that company, it was a full stock deal as well.

Okay.

And the. Their stock tanked. It went from like, it was like, it was about three bucks a share. We did the deal, it jumped up to like seven. So I was like, fucking stoked.

Yeah.

And then after it all fell apart in like, you know, maybe the next six months, it dropped down to like 15 cents.

Damn.

So, like, I would have lost everything anyways. Like, I would have had nothing as well.

Universe. Divine intervention, right? Yeah.

So wild.

Okay.

So I went through that. It was a bit of a dark night of the soul going through, but I was still in the space. I was still doing men's work. I got into. I got involved with ARCA Brotherhood around the time that I started that company. And so I was leading men's groups and doing a little bit of coaching related stuff throughout, but it was just on the side. And then. So still doing that and got more into that, I launched another group I started. You know, I hired a coach myself to learn more about marketing and the business side of building a coaching business. And then just. Just kind of went for it and. And around. Just after Covid started, my wife's business, like, got put on hold and she was launching her coaching stuff as well outside of her other business. So we just decided to pick up and come down here, and now we're making it work down here and just bought a house and buying it. Just bought a truck. Making our life here happen.

Yeah.

Yeah.

You know, super happy for you guys.

And helping, you know, it's like, it's been a. It's been a crazy journey, but, like, now that we're here and I've. I've invested enough into, like, myself and the business to, like, you know, choose powerfully for myself to make this work and to charge what I'm worth and to, like, now I'm actually helping people fucking transform their lives. And it's really cool, you know, it's so cool, like, saving marriages and fucking just like, the. It's so wild. Especially so I, you know, I do breath work as well as, like, helping guys with a lot of the inner work stuff and just, like, seeing the lightness and seeing, like, when they have the insights and the ahas and, like, the other side like, when, like, you. When you got back from that retreat, like, that's what I do, like, on a regular basis with guys is, like, cracking them open and, like, helping them really feel and, like, get comfortable with all of them themselves.

Yeah.

And because we need that.

Because as men, we push everything down. We numb ourselves, we distract. We keep ourselves busy grinding all the time, chasing that next goal. Never in the moment, never in the stillness. Because we don't want to feel what we've been pushing down.

Because it's scary. Yeah.

Especially if you've been running from it for the last 30, 40 years of your life, and then you find yourself in a place where you're still possibly alone in quiet. All that shit starts coming up. And that's what really Covid did for a lot of people.

Oh, it brought everything to the table.

Covid has created on one side, you know, a real pandemic of depression and suicide and also a mass awakening because many people sitting at home for months and months on end, all the shit coming up, realizing you're trapped in a.

Little box with your wife and your kids.

Yeah. Realizing I don't. I don't love my life. I don't love how I feel. I don't want to go back to that nine to five, or to that job or to that position. And that's. That's been a powerful catalyst for people stepping into the work.

Totally. And also, like, I don't know how to like you that there's already, like, a high level of frustration, all these things. And so many people have no idea how to deal with that. Yeah. How to, like, move energy or how to, like, express any sort of emotion, so they just keep stuffing it all down and eventually it blows up totally. And.

Or shows up as cancer, shows up, as disease, shows up in a physical illness. Yeah, yeah.

Turns inward. Yeah. And anxiety and depression and like, all of it. Right. So that energy's got to go somewhere. Yeah. If you don't know how to move it, it moves on its own, and it fucks you up totally.

And if you don't pay attention to signs, the universe will give you a sign that you can't not notice.

Yeah, yeah.

And, you know, one thing you. You touched on that I would love for you to just elaborate a bit more about, because I speak about men's circles and talk about, you know, these retreats where they're intentionally designed to hold space for men. And you hold these circles, and on the Last Alive retreat, you led the men's circle for our group. And I loved watching you in action. I loved the different tools and tricks you pulled out of your hat. That was super fun. And, you know, for a guy who's watching or listening to this or to a woman who's watching, listening, and wants to suggest this, maybe for her partner.

Or brother, that's actually where almost all of my clients come from. From the circles. Yeah, from the women. Like, they send their men to do the work.

Yeah, yeah. 100%.

So thank you.

Yeah, yeah. Keep it coming. So for someone who is listening and be like, okay, like, what the hell is a men's circle? Like, what happens? Like, can you share a bit about what. What that experience is? Like, you know, what's the intention? Why would someone want to join a men's circle?

So we all stand up and we drop our pants.

That's a different.

Just kidding. It's. It's a space to. We. We drop our emotional pants, essentially.

You know, drop our masks.

Yeah, drop our masks. Take off the arm or whatever analogy you want to use. Like, most men have a real solid story that it's not okay. It's not safe to be emotional at all. It's not safe to be angry. It's not safe to be sad.

Don't be a bro.

Like, don't. Boys, don't cry. All these things. Right?

Man up.

Man up. You know, and. And there's a. So it's not just each guy, but it's like a cultural programming thing right now. And, you know, there's a whole history of that that you can go into if you start reading the literature and stuff. But we're at a time where it's starting. We're starting to unwire some of that. We're starting to deprogram and teach because it's like, that's not sustainable. It's not like there was a time when that was a thing. But that's also like, if you look at the stats now, like, suicides are like, like five times higher for men. This was before the pandemic too. Like, probably way higher now.

Especially men over the age of 40.

Totally. Yeah. Like, there's. There's a lot of men that are hurting.

Yeah.

And. And it's also, it's very normal for men to try to deal with all of that on their own. You know, they might open up to their women, but most men don't feel safe opening up to their guy friends, even.

Yeah. And because they don't want to be judged.

They don't want to be judged. They don't want to all the things. So a men's circle is a space where it's safe to do that and encouraged to do that. So we actually talk about our feelings, we talk about the things that are going on in our lives. You know, most conversations, you know, imagine like a hockey locker room conversation, you know, like, that's the typical conversation for most of men. It's just talking about, like beer babes and blood sports. Kind of the like, you know, surface level stuff or like, you know, interesting things or cars or like, there's all these like, acceptable things to talk about as guys. Whereas, like, it's pretty out of the ordinary for someone to be like, man, like, I'm really like, struggling in my relationship. Could I throw something at you? And we like, talk through this, like, what the fuck? No. I don't know. Just figure it out.

Yeah.

You know, whereas, like, this is a space to get feedback from other men, to just talk about the things that are going on in your life and to get support on it. And. And then we also add in elements of. So there's most of the time, like, pretty much every meeting has two components. There's one piece where we do that. We get everyone to check in and just like, share regularly how their week's going, how they're doing. And then there's space to be like, what do I do this? And then we also end up doing some kind of process type stuff. So there'll always be something going in the background where we just invite guys to speak more deeply about some aspect of their life or do some emotional processing. We might do some breath work, or we might do some. Some like anger processing kind of work. We'll do like, some use and like, help guys get into their anger and.

Move it through the body, move that energy and go have permission to. To do that. Yeah.

Which is a. It's a big. That's a big piece of it that's like, so valuable because anger is just so demonized in society. But it's.

It's really thing called healthy rage. You know, you. You got to let it out.

100.

Yeah.

And like, we're talking before, it's like, it just hurts you if you don't, but it's. If you don't have spaces to. It's hard to do that. So. Yeah, so that's in a nutshell, what we do. And over time, you know, you open up more. You learn to trust men. You learn to share your secrets and not. And people don't turn away from you or judge you or run away. Like, they come closer, they trust you more. And you start to learn that it's actually. Not only is it safe safe, but it's actually really helpful to build relationships at that deeper level when you can, you know, and you have eventually. So all of our groups with. With arca, at least different groups do it different ways. But within arca, you join a group and you're with that same group indefinitely. You meet every week, and you just have your core group of like 10 to 15 guys, and you just. You carry each other through all the things that are going on. And I run a couple other groups outside of that as well that are slightly different formats, but it's all revolving around that kind of idea of just. It's like masterminding, but masterminding about, like, our life. Not like men are used to using that terminology for business. They're like, oh, I've got this, like, business problem that I need to, like, workshop and solve. But, like, where do they go to do that for their marriage or for, like, the fact that they can't get a fucking erection to save their life anymore. The fact that, like, they're really struggling with their. Their dad died and they don't know what. They're just fucking balled up with grief, and they don't know what to do with it. You know, it's like there's. There's all these things that you get a space to deal with. You get a space to fucking let it out and. And just. It's. Yeah, so it's. It's powerful.

Yeah. Yeah, it's powerful. And so necessary because a lot of these men, especially, like, you know, in around the age of 40, 50, 60, they grew up with that old school mentality that was passed on to them from their dad, that was passed on to them from their grandfather. And you know, there's, it's only been in recent years that therapy or coaching has become more acceptable. Whereas before even I remember when my friend Mireille, you know, about almost eight years ago, suggested therapy or coaching for me, like right away I was like.

No, what are you trying to say?

You know, and, and it was the landmark form that she had bought me for my birthday. And I will say best gift ever. And there's this, this negative stigma to coaching or therapy that most people, especially a lot of men, resist the work. And there is this for obviously a number of reasons. One being first off, admitting, yeah, what do you mean? Like, I don't understand it, I'm self aware, I get it. But again, we can only see the world through the glasses we're wearing, through the perspective that we have. And often we need to step out of that perspective in order to see the situation for what it really is. But we can't do that on our own. And even if you read all the books, watch all the documentaries, you're still consuming that content from the current perspective. And until you have a shift in the way you perceive things, a shift in your beliefs, you're going to continue to have the same outcome or same, you know, result from it. And working with a coach, attending a retreat, attending a men's circle, this, these are new type of, I'll call it options, modalities, processes that people can use. And what I'm finding is that younger people, like guys who are like, even in their mid-20s, early-30s, are joining retreats and signing up for the coaching because it seems like they're almost a little bit more conscious or open minded to see that, okay, I don't want to repeat the patterns, behaviors that my father has passed on to me, you know, and they're disrupting the cycle of growing up with parents who don't know how to communicate, who don't ask them how they're feeling, father to son, sit down and be like, what's going on in your world? What's happening? How are you feeling? You know, being able to hold space for their own son. You know, when I think about my upbringing, my father never really asked me, like, hey, son, how are you feeling? What's going on? How's your relationship? You know, and that's because his father.

Didn'T ask that, his father never did.

And he actually almost felt embarrassed to do that. He didn't even know how to And a result of not being able to communicate in that way. Also never heard, son, I love you. I'm proud of you. I support you. You know, like, those. Those words from your father are so important. And I talked to my father about this. He's like, you should know that I love you. You should know that I'm proud of you. I'm like, yeah, I like, dummy. A part of me wants to believe that, of course, but a part of me needs to hear it, really needs to hear it. And working with men now as well, father wounds, you know, how our dads show up and don't show up for us are so important, you know, and that's why, you know, for any of the fathers who are watching or listening to this podcast, it's so important to show up as a father you wish you were. You had, you know, and, yeah, it might be uncomfortable to sit down with your son and ask, how are you feeling? Or to open up and share something really personal about yourself, but if your son doesn't feel safe coming to you, he's not going to know how to express himself, you know, and if he doesn't know how to express himself, he's going to hold those emotions and hold those feelings inside. And that's why, like, a men's circle or like, the retreat that I went on is so important, because you learn to trust other men and you learn that you can be open and vulnerable and say what needs to be said. You've pushed down for decades, and it's okay. You know, there's no judgment there. You're in a safe space, and. And it's something that I wish more people knew about. And that's why, you know, I really was looking forward to having this conversation with you because you do this work and you've been doing it for quite some time and experiencing your leadership and, you know, how you hold space in a men's circle. I truly wish that more men who are doing this work see themselves as a potential leader, or call it, you know, someone who can also step into that role. And what's happening with some of the clients that I've been working with, which is so beautiful to see, is they're taking the lessons or the modalities or the tools that I'm teaching them, and they're actually bringing it to work. They're bringing it to their men's golf event, like where the boys get together. You know, they're now showing up as leaders in their communities and for their families, which is so beautiful to see because you know, when we do the inner work and we start to become more complete with the parts of us that we've needed to really make peace with, when we can be more whole and complete, we now show up for our loved ones, for our associates, for employees in a different way. And, you know, that's why it's like doing this work. It's not just for you, it's for everyone in your life. And yeah, it can be uncomfortable and it can be painful and it can be scary, but on the other side of that fear, I know it sounds super cliche, but on the other side of fear, on the other side of all that resistance and the pain is your liberation is your freedom. You know, and I know, you know, we had a chance to talk after I came back from that men's retreat about a month ago and I just felt that there had been like some heavy weights that had been dragging along for the last 30 years or longer that had just been like cut off. It was just like, I just feel lighter. I feel more in love with myself. You know, I feel like I, I can look in the mirror and I really like what I see. And you know, we talked about that.

Ever not been the case for you?

Well, like my hair, you know, but that's the other thing. You can, you can do all the things. You can have the nice car, the fancy clothes, you can even have a lot of money and you can feel good about that stuff. But like, I know, let's say cognitively, okay, I'm not a bad looking guy. I'm, I'm fit, I'm successful, I'm smart, I'm worldly, I've got some great attributes. But do I really, deep down, when you go below, deeper than all of that, do I actually believe I'm worthy of love? Do I actually love every inch of myself? Because yeah, the car, the clothes, the wash, the money, the titles, the status, all that, yeah, can make you feel good, make you feel accomplished. But on a deep, deep, deep subconscious level, do you actually really love and accept yourself? And that's where I feel most people get stuck where they are held back from really, truly achieving their greatness in life because they can do all this stuff. They can show up or appear to be a certain way in the world, but deep down there's this kernel of self doubt or that's the lack of self love that will sabotage everything. And you know, we talked about this earlier. The amount of money you'll make in life is directly correlated to the amount of self love. And Acceptance you have for yourself. Because especially in going from, you know, in the journey of becoming a coach or, or whatever, or even, you know, launching a business, you know, and now you're going to be the boss. If you don't really love yourself, if you don't really feel confident that you love and accept yourself, you believe in who you are, there's always going to be that frequency of self doubt and fear in your energy field. And other people will feel it, your staff will feel it, your clients will feel it, your wife will feel it, your partner will feel it. And it requires getting really, really, really fucking deep to remove those beliefs, to let go of that old story. And you got to be willing to go there. And that's why this work is so important, because it's not a one and done. I go to a retreat or I work with a coach for three months and okay, like, yeah, it's years and years and years. You know, I've been in the work since 2015 now and it was just this last retreat that I went on, I was like, oh, wow, okay, wow. There's something that was let go of that I didn't even know was there still. But once it's gone, it's like, oh, wow, okay. Holy shit. That, that, that was good. That was good. But you gotta be, you gotta be willing, you gotta be committed and.

You.

Gotta ask for help and be open to receiving it. And I think that's where a lot of men get stuck. They don't know how to ask for help. They're, they're doing what I've done for years. Lone wolf, you, I don't need you. I got this. I'll figure it out. And you just keep grinding away on your own. But we know that that'll only take you so far.

Yeah, 100%. And that's why when we get into these groups, that's the first thing that we do within the arc of brotherhood groups is we talk about our relationships with our dads. That's the first kind of deep, processy type thing we do with everyone is once we've gotten to know each other a little bit, open up and talk about how was your relationship with your dad? How was his life? How was his relationship with his dad? Cause there's so many patterns that you can see when you start to look at all that that show up in your life. And it's only by looking at these things and dissecting them. And then if it's not like if you've done things a certain way, if this is how you learn, and you've created the results of your life right now. And it sucks. It's like, you're gonna have to change some shit. And it's powerful because you can heal a lot of that stuff with other men. It doesn't necessarily have to be going and, like, doing therapy with your dad to heal these dad wounds or the worthiness piece or any of this stuff. A lot of that can be done. Just a lot of it is your relationship with the masculine in general. There's a lot of guys that just, you know, they're not. They either hate their dad or hate structure or, like, they're super. There's so many different ways that it can show up in life. But, you know, when you're willing to lean in and a big piece. The. The first. Like when I. Whenever I start with a new client, the first piece of my program that I take them through is kind of this twofold thing of a. It's like, you have to take responsibility for everything. You have to be willing to, like, set aside. You have to be willing to be wrong, essentially, and you have to take 100% responsibility for everything that you've done in your life. Because a lot of people blame a lot of shit on other people. They're like, oh, yeah, but, like, the economy or. But this or, but I got screwed over or I got whatever. And it's like every time you do that, you. You give your power away. Yeah, right. And. And a lot of guys also, like, this is why. A big part of why you have to pay for coaching as well. Because, like, you can. I could give someone advice for free, but if they're not invested, if they're not willing to be coachable, then they'll just be like, whatever, I know better, you know? And like, that piece is one of the biggest things that I think blocks a lot of people from actually improving in their life.

Yeah.

Because they think they have all the answers.

Yeah. Yeah, absolutely.

Well, then why the fuck haven't you figured it out yet? You know, if what you're doing is so good, why haven't you achieved the results you're trying to achieve? Why do you still feel like a bag of shit when you look in the mirror? Why is your relationship such a struggle? Why have you been divorced fucking three times? Why is. Why is. Why do you have that huge gut?

Why do you not talk to you? Yeah.

100%. Right.

And, you know, the thing is, it.

Takes a lot of courage. Sorry. Just to finish that thought. It's like, that's real fucking scary for most guys is to admit that they're wrong. Or like it's that ego piece.

Yep.

And people have to be willing, guys and girls, but it's usually a little stronger with men, I find. It's like you have to be willing to set down that ego and be like, yeah, like maybe I'm wrong about some shit. Maybe like the way I see the world and the way I look by the beliefs that I have are flawed.

Or maybe that worked at one point in time in my life and it helped me get to where I am now. But for me to move beyond this point, that shit's not gonna fly because.

It got me to here, but it's not gonna get me to where I wanna be.

And that's often what I hear from guys when it comes to coaching. It's like, yeah, my life's not perfect. No one's perfect. You know, my life's great, it's good, you know, yeah, there's some things I could change. But they say if it ain't broke, don't fix it, you know, and they don't necessarily, because they're in their own bubble, in their own perspective. They don't necessarily see the long term repercussions, ramifications of what their life looks like if they continue on for the next 20, 30 years being that way. And it's also scary for men to think about, what if I change? What if I don't need to grind as hard anymore? Or what if I let go of the attachment of needing to be the CEO or the nine figure, whatever, you know, work everyone, then, then who am I if I'm not that guy anymore? And, you know, I remember once I spoke to a friend and he said, you know, like, What happens if I lose the demons that drive me? You know, then what? And I said, well, what if you don't? Because those demons will ultimately destroy you. And it's about. Coming to peace with the parts of you that you know are wounded, that are holding on to the pain that no longer serve you, and being able to work through them with love and compassion, understanding that that's who you were and that's part of your journey that's gotten you to where you are. And for you to go from good to great, you're gonna have to let that shit go. And you have to be open and raw and real and be open to asking for help. Because we can't figure it out on our own. Yes, eventually, after many, many, many, many, many years and lots of deep Work you could figure out on your own. But for most people, they don't have the patience, they don't have the resources, and they don't have the time.

And that demons piece, you know, like, I had a conversation with someone about this a little while ago. Like, some guys, like Kelly Slater, it's like, what the fuck is driving him? Like, he's probably got some shit going on inside to be like, that competitive, to go for his 13th world champ at almost 50 or whatever, you know, like crazy. Like, why? You know, like, what is this? What are you getting out of this? You know? And a lot of guys, those demons can drive them to success. And I feel like the uncertainty or the craziness in their mind at that point is like, they think that the success is the recipe for happiness. You know, it's like they think, like, if I just achieve enough, if I, like, win the ego game hard enough, then that equals being happy. But like you said, it's like they got there, they have achieved a lot of shit. It's like, it hasn't made them happy. They're fucking everything. Like, maybe you made success, but, like, all the other things in your life are blowing up or whatever. You know, it's like, so again, you gotta set a new chart. You gotta chart a new course and set new goals for. Actually, happiness needs to be the goal at some point if you want to achieve that. Yeah. Not just going to magically come when there's a certain number or a certain multiple of a number in a bank account. You know, it's like, you gotta. You gotta create it. You gotta go through a lot of this process and the work and build the relationship, you know, there's so much to it. It's not just fucking success.

Yeah. And to your point, about someone who's uber successful, who's known as being one of the world's best at whatever, that's their identity. That's who they think they need to be. And if they aren't that thing anymore, if they're not that role, not that position, that title, well, then, then who are they? You know? And that's where a lot of CEOs or founders sell their companies. And they go into massive depression after. Even though they might have millions of billions after they go into depression because they just don't know who they are anymore. And that's why I think also holds a lot of men back. And women, because we're speaking about men, will stick to that from making that departure. And I remember I felt that because when I closed Blowfish. Out of all my companies, Blowfish was the one I was probably best known for. It was open for 15 years, and it was very successful, catering to people from all over. And I remember one day I was in Miami and I was speaking to someone who lived in Miami, originally from Toronto, and I said, yeah, did you ever go to Blowfish? She's like, oh, my God, yeah, I love that restaurant. My husband and I went on our first date there. I'm like, oh, cool. I'm like, I used to own Blowfish. I used to own Blowfish. I used to own Blow. I. I don't own Blowfish anymore. Oh, yeah. And to me, it felt like I was speaking about someone who had passed away, like, because Blowfish for me was like, being the owner was like my claim to fame or like my. My credibility, you know, and that role and that identity of being Zark, the King Street Club guy, with all the different bars and restaurants, businesses. It's like, that's who I thought I was, you know, That's. That's who I thought the world knew me to be. And you are not your identity. And if anything, you and myself are living proof that you can wake up one day and say, I don't want to be that guy anymore. I don't want to live that life. I don't want to do those things. I don't want to have to.

Put.

My time and energy into things and people that don't make me feel truly alive. And if you want that change bad enough, anything is possible. But you gotta be willing to take that first step.

Yeah. And. And also, like, there's the want, there's. Sometimes you'll have the desire to make that change. Sometimes you don't get to live that life anymore. You know, like, sometimes life decides for you.

Yeah. Universe gives you the big shove with.

The company, like, backing out and, you know, like there's. And either way, whether you choose it or not, it still sucks. And it's still fucking gut wrenching to go through reinventing yourself and letting go of, like, you literally go through a death, this whole life dies. And you have to grieve that. You have to go through the muck of letting that move through, and you have to rebuild from scratch or some version of that. And for, you know, for guys like you and me that have gone through that in their lives, it's not as scary. Like, I know now, it's like if I needed to blow the speed up and start something else, it would suck again. But I also know that it would be, I've done it before, I can do it again. Whereas like a lot of guys and people in general haven't done that. They've, if you follow the little, you know, check all the boxes and go to school, go to university, get a job, stay in your job, you know, like to then think about blowing up your life for the first time or like restarting from scratch for the first time. That is horribly terrifying.

Yeah, yeah.

So, you know, it's, and that's, that's part of the, you know, it's, it's easy to say, like, for sure, you just got to change everything in your life. You're like.

And what made it, I want to say easy for me, but what really fueled and inspired me was I knew that I was walking away from something that I'm very proud of. And I feel very complete with my 25 year career in entertainment nightlife. And I knew that I was walking away from that to begin something that was of much greater purpose. See, I thankfully knew that I was going to transition into retreats and eventually coaching and that what I was going to create for people was going to have truly life changing results. And I had to take that first step and try hosting a retreat to be like, wow, this feels good, I want to do more of this. And that's where I say, if you want the change, you have to be willing to step out of your comfort zone and take that first step. Even though it may not be exactly what you want, you may not know which direction you want to go, but at least take a step and try something new. Put yourself out there and see what that experience is like to disrupt your usual routine and the way you feel about your life, your career when you get up every day. And taking that first step also shows the universe, like, hey, I'm ready to go. I'm ready to try something different, you know, and definitely finding my purpose. And even though I didn't know exactly what it was going to look like, I just knew that I really want to help other people to discover for themselves the possibility that lies beyond this average life that they're living. And it's in being of service to other people that really gave me the courage and the inspiration to step off the ledge and make the big move. Because I remember people like, you're going to move to Costa Rica. Why you're like walking away from your companies, like, what if it doesn't work? And like, what if it does? And if it doesn't work, I'll just come back. It's okay, you know, or I'll figure it out, you know. And again and again, when you're an entrepreneur and you know how to start something from scratch, you have that resilience and you have that belief in yourself. And for anybody who's watching or listening, who maybe, you know, hasn't been an entrepreneur before, and you know that there's something greater out there for you, You really have to listen to your intuitive guidance. You have to be able to go within and really trust what your gut, what your heart is telling you and be willing to shut out the naysayers and be willing to get beyond that saboteur, that voice in our heads that tries to keep us playing small and tries to hold us back from stepping into our greatness. And, you know, when we are able to really find that true purpose, our divine calling, or, you know, the reason we were born, life is just different. You know, it really, it's. Yeah, it's. It's a beautiful feeling to know that you're doing what you were born to do. Yeah.

And to help people.

Yeah.

And getting to make the world a better place, that's a big part of what it all boils down to. A lot of people, you know, back to that ego conversation. A lot of people are just out trying to make themselves looks good, trying to amass as much money for themselves as possible, to take care of themselves. But you know, usually for most people, they like being more of service for the world. Like trying to make the world a better place, trying to help people, trying to do something that's not just for yourself is very fulfilling. Absolutely.

And the universe supports that and gives you whatever you need, you know? Yeah. Yeah. So share a bit of your offerings, you know. What do you got going on these days?

I work primarily one on one with mostly men. I do the odd breath session here and there for women. I actually had one this morning with the lady. But most of my stuff is around men. I have a six month deep dive program that I take guys through that's kind of a culmination of a lot of the stuff we've been talking about today. So it's like a kind of past, present, future type of look at your life of like digging deep into all of your shit, your family history, your relationships with men, money or romantic relationships, all that kind of stuff. Getting clear on, like, who you've been and all of your internal patterns. Then taking some time to really, like, be in the present, to connect with people, to fine tune your body, your mind, things like meditation and diet. And exercise all that, like, making this work really well and then moving into the future of, like, where do you actually want to go in life? What do you want to create? You know, what's the life you want to live into and how do you get there? So it's. And then with the. I do a lot of breath work with my clients throughout this process as well, because, like, we kind of touched on in there. There's. We all have a lot of blocks for achieving these things. You might have ideas, you might have goals, but, like, you also have a lot of internal beliefs that are keeping you in the life you're in right now. So being able to, like, move this stuff and move the emotions, move the stuck energy, heal the trauma that has kind of caused you to be in the state that you're in right now is. Is a part of the process. And for a lot of guys as well, it's connecting with. With their power and with their emotions and with their. With the whole range of them. Not just, you know, most guys suck at kind of crying, but also most guys suck at expressing anger and, like, really being fully expressed in general. Most guys are kind of geared towards, like, be stoic. Don't show emotions. Be a fucking robot. Like, being a robot is almost, like, idealized by a lot of guys and just like, make lots of money and period.

Never get too sad, but never be too happy.

Just kind of. You can be happy. Happy is, like, I feel, like, fairly allowed as long as you're not, like, showboating or being egotistical.

But what, like, what I've learned, though, is when you suppress your sadness, you suppress your pain, you also suppress your joy and your ability to express that happiness, you know, because a range. You're.

You clip both ends.

Yeah, you, you, You. You've kind of numbed yourself. And I believe to be alive means to feel the full range of emotions. And as you say that, I'm like, yep, sounds like me, because I can see that I've really numbed myself from feeling pain and anger in my life. And I chose to do that unconsciously at a young age because there are things that I experienced that I didn't know how to process. I. I didn't know who to talk to. I didn't know how to move through that. So I just shut it down and locked it in there. And I don't fucking want that in me anymore. I want to be free of that. And that is the inner work that is getting deep into those layers to feel that pain, to feel that Fear and discomfort that you locked in so long ago and to be willing to experience it even though it's fucking scary so that you can let it move through you. And yeah, it's not easy.

100%.

Yeah.

And that's, it's a process. And as you can imagine for a lot of people, they have no idea where to even fucking start on something like that. So that's where guys like us come in. We help kind of guide people through that. For me personally in my practice, I tend to attract guys that are like either hard guys needing to learn soft skills or guys that are already connected to their hearts, connected to their emotions, but they don't have the confidence to really go and build a business or become a coach or do the thing that they want to do. So it's like helping guys on either end of that spectrum move towards that kind of balanced middle where you can be fucking strong and confident, but also be able to flow, be able to, you know, hold space for people to be able to just understand and be with the range of, you know, all of it. It's that kind of, you know, if you've read any of David Data's stuff, he talks about it as the kind of third stage masculinity. Yeah, that's, that essentially is what I help guys do.

Beautiful.

Because you need both a lot. You have to have a good balance of masculine and feminine and, and understand and how to work with all of them in order to experience joy and happiness.

Yeah. And a lot of alpha driven male entrepreneurs are so in their masculine, which is why they know how to make shit happen. But they're not nurturing their feminine, the inner feminine. They're not, they don't know how to allow.

Not even nurturing it. They don't even understand it.

Yeah, they don't even have awareness.

They're idiots when it comes to that. And I hope that pissed some people off during that just now, because that's the whole thing. It's like it's better, but it's just a skill set. You haven't learned about it, you haven't understand it. Like you understand business, you understand making money, but like in order to be happy, there's a whole bunch more shit that you need to learn about. And it's being, like I said before, it's being willing to admit that you don't know everything and that you've got shit to learn so that you can get to that place.

And if there's one thing that will motivate men to understand what it means to tap into their inner feminine is you'll never know how to really show up and hold the divine feminine until you could hold. Hold the divine feminine within yourself. Until you know how the feminine within you wants to be nurtured and held. You won't know how to do that for another. And I mean, we could have a whole podcast on masculine feminine energy. However, it's like, you know, we all have the masculine feminine energy alive within us, and there are things that very masculine men can do to nurture, stimulate, Make, I would say, like bring her to life. Whether that be through singing, dancing, art, whether it be through breath work. Breath work? Yeah. Through things that allow you.

Connecting with that side of you.

Yeah.

There's all sorts of ways of, like embodying, embody, practicing kind of being in that energy and. And learning to accept it. That's a big piece of it. Because most men have a lot of judgment towards the feminine. You know, they think it's just dumb and silly and like, why do I need to learn about emotions?

That's stupid. Because that's what their father taught them and that's what was passed on to them. Yeah. And society. And if it ain't broke, why, why fix it?

Right.

But they don't. They don't actually see what's missing because if you, if you don't have an awareness or understanding of what that means to be in balance with your masculine feminine energy, then you wouldn't even comprehend what out of balance means in that way. Right. So, yeah, it's powerful, necessary work. It's. It's a beautiful journey. And I do believe that there is. We're. We're. I believe, at the beginning of a new stage in call humanity, where the paradigm of what it means to be a successful man is shifting. I feel we're at the beginning stages of redefining what it means to be a man who's successful, abundant, strong, showing up as a leader because that old model that is. Is unhealthy, it's toxic, and it's not true leadership. Because the world, the state of the planet is an example of that gone too far. Yeah. Of the current masculine leadership has created the world that we currently live in. And I think one thing everybody could agree on, there's some things that need to change.

We're not.

We're not in the best situation right now on planet Earth. And you know, I've often said that the future is feminine. And I mean that by saying that men need to tap into their feminine energy so they're not so ego driven. They're not so in the doing all the time, but they actually tap into their heart and be more in the being, being more in. In flow, I suppose, and just shifting.

The goal posts because I feel like a big, A big part of why everything is so fucked right now is that somewhat toxic masculine approach of like the bottom line is the bottom line, you know, like all these companies out there just trying to make a buck. At the expense of the world.

Yeah.

At the expense of our people. And, you know, we're seeing that and the control and all the stuff that's being implemented right now, it's like none of it is for this, the betterment of us and the planet and all.

These things for a handful of Old Richmond to get richer.

Yeah. And. And we're seeing that break down right now, which is awesome. And it's, and it's, it's gonna be bumpy. And, and while the feminine is there, I also, I see the future as balanced because the feminine on its own, like, you know, you can't run a meeting or you can't like get anything done without bringing in the masculine.

Absolutely.

Like, you know, we need both. That's, that's actually what the, this means. The, the Sri Sri Yantra, I believe it's called, like the balance of the masculine and the feminine. Because they need each other. Absolutely. We all need each other.

I thank you for doing the work that you do.

Thank you.

You know, thank you for, you know, being committed to helping men find that balance within themselves and for supporting them on this journey.

Because.

The world needs more men who are living from a balanced place, honoring their heart, honoring their brilliant minds, but at the same time choosing love over fear and really just showing up as leaders in the world, because that's what we need more now than ever before is real heart led leaders who want to see the planet, humanity, our animals thrive.

The world needs better men. And that's the name of my program is Better Men.

I like that subtle plug there.

There you go. And that's the working title for the podcast too. Nice. Which is coming out.

Yeah, Nice. Love it. Well, yeah, congratulations on that. Look forward to seeing you launch yet another aspect of your business and just.

Get this message out because it's like, it's important. More people need to be having these conversations and questioning the way they do things.

For sure.

Yeah. So we can keep our species alive.

That's it. Yeah. More men need to know that it's okay. You're not alone. Lots of other men are feeling the same pressure, stress, anxiety, and it's all good.

Dealing with the same shit.

Yeah.

In our own way.

Yeah. Cool. Thank you for joining. I appreciate you being here.

Thank you, my man.

And, yeah, man, it's a pleasure to see your evolution and growth, and I appreciate all your support and looking forward to more future collaborations.

Yeah.

Yep.

Same here, man.

All right.