PMAX, AI MAX & The Future of Google Ads

When do you start to say, I'm now going to introduce Performance Max? What are the kind of metrics you're looking at inside of an account?

It's so case by case, but my, my general structure will be—

but would there ever be a scenario where you only run Performance Max, or you always think you still need some search there?

As long as search campaigns are around, I think I will always use them.

Are you guys actively using any AI tools? All right, so we've got a bit of a different one today. We want to do a little bit of a, a a round table. I won't call us anything like the, I don't know, the marketplace of the minds or anything like that, but obviously everyone knows, should know, we're on the channel. We've got Johann and we've got Brent. Both of these guys are some of our senior Google Ads coaches inside of Define Digital Academy. And what we wanted to do is that we get a lot of questions all the time at Define Digital Academy about some top common trends, what we think about Google Ads, and what we want to do here is I just wanted to throw it to individual Brent and Johann we'll get your viewpoints, we'll have a bit of an open discussion. And what you'll probably find throughout this process is that some of us do have some different views on how things work. So don't think that we're all just one way, because ultimately what we're looking for is what's most successful for the business. Firstly, what I want to talk about is let's talk about the relationship between Performance Max and your more traditional campaigns. So I'll throw it to you first, Brent. So we're talking about For so long, e-commerce was built on search and shopping. How do you deal now with Performance Max in the mix? When do you use it? When do you not use it?

I am a massive advocate of Performance Max. I think it's a really strong campaign type. And I think that it is something that can either make or break all your results. And it comes down to pretty much one thing, which always comes down to data. If you're creating a fresh account, you have no data in there and you start with Performance Max campaign. It's going to have to trial on every single different platform or channel before it eventually understands a bit more about what works for your brand. However, if you're, say, an e-commerce brand and you're looking towards PMAX, start with a shopping campaign. Start with what you know will work well for your business. If you're an e-commerce brand, you're promoting products. There is no better way to promote your products than on shopping. Gain some really high-quality conversion data through that. And then once you have that into a position where you're getting enough consistency and it's fairly fluent, I suppose, then you can start to introduce things like Performance Max where we have way more difference of channels and more complex advertiser experience. So I think that Performance Max is amazing, but it really comes down to how you introduce it and also how you layer your PMax campaigns in your account, making sure you're not essentially doubling up, cannibalizing other efforts.

Yeah, I do love that thought and I'm still a big believer in starting with a search and shopping format inside for e-commerce. And even if you're not getting the conversions, the beauty is that you're getting a really quick feedback loop on, say for example, with your ad copies, what ad copies are not working. Inside of the shopping network, you're getting a much faster feedback loop on are your product titles set right, are your attributes and everything set right in the Merchant Center because you're only going on the shopping feed. It's not worrying about display, YouTube and all of those other things. So that's why I do love that.

All right.

What happens down the track? Like when do you start to say, I'm now going to introduce Performance Max? What are the kind of metrics you're looking at inside of an account?

Conversion does always number one. So if I'm getting enough consistency with my conversions and I am seeing multiple products convert as well, it's not just like one champion product and everything else is either getting no spend or just not performing well. Pretty much what I want to say is something that is, I'm confident that we are getting some consistent and reliable data coming through, then let's start introducing PMAX. And I'm also that sort of person where I want to try and get to PMAX as quick as I possibly can. So I'm not trying to wait for 3 years of consistent data. I'm waiting for, you know, 1 month of say 30+ purchases for a smaller account. Perfect PMAX. If an account has already matured and it's been running for quite a while, then I'll start looking at how do we structure our PMAX campaigns better if we can? What are some common sort of structuring strategies? I guess we can call it that, or methods and techniques that I think could better the account. So really I'm trying to build my entire account structure around PMAX. I am trying to include it and introduce as much as I possibly can, but I do know that if I don't have enough consistency, then there's no point in looking at PMAX. At all until I have that conversion data.

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It's so case by case, but my general structure will be, first of all, make sure that shopping is in a really strong position. And when I say shopping, I mean like a feed-only PMAX campaign or a shopping campaign. I personally prefer feed-only PMAX just because it does layer in audience signals as well as search query signals. So I know that there's just a, it's a much more effective way of approaching someone in the they query in the search results. But once we've got our shopping or our fundamental, like our core campaign structure set up, then I like to layer on top of that. So now I might go towards a full build Performance Max campaign and start testing those up and use it. Then I might introduce some search campaigns just to have a little bit of consistency and control around search. And same situation, like if I've been only running feed only and, you know, shopping campaigns, then I haven't done anything for search, then I might start with a search campaign and then I'll look at the full build Performance Max campaign and rely on it a bit more to approach more of my search efforts.

And I think it's a key thing for me because I think that's the issue I have with moving direct to Performance Max without doing shopping first. For Performance Max to work, you need to have a really good feed because if you don't have a good feed, that's where it starts going into you know, Discover and Gmail and you're seeing just because it can't get enough spend inside of the shopping campaign because the ranking's too low.

Exactly.

All right, we'll come back and circle back with some more things around that. I do want to jump over to Johann now and say same question to you, but in a lead generation example, like how do you, where do you start and then when do you move to Performance Max and how does that look?

Yeah, of course.

So I mean, obviously the PMax is the same for lead gen when it comes to do not introduce it in a new account if you don't have past conversion history because just like Brent was saying, it's gonna go down a path of a lot of testing before it maybe finds the right, you know, approach to getting your conversions. Now, the problem if you compare lead generation to e-commerce is that with lead generation, you don't have an actual purchase being the guardrail in between the conversion. So with PMax, you don't wanna introduce it unless you don't have, either offline conversions, a way to push your backend data to Google as the way of, you know, showing Google what a conversion is. Or if you have really good, let's say multi-step forms or some sort of guardrail in the frontend. So you can like pre-filter the leads before they even reach Google that way. When it comes to starting out with this, I always start with search campaigns. They are the meat and potatoes of your Google Ads account. So, We want to start with search campaigns, you know, get conversions, get a good understanding of, you know, which keywords works the best, what copy works the best. And once we have that in order and we're starting to almost, you know, saturate the search campaigns, not necessarily, but I mean, I think it's good to scale the search campaigns as much as possible first before you introduce the PMax. Once we've reached that level, then we can start introducing a PMax. I would structure it around, you know, starting with the core services per asset group. And I think it's perfectly fine to start with the main keywords as well, because ultimately with the PMax, you're getting a lot of that search term discoverability on top of that. So in a way, it doesn't really matter which keywords you add in a search terms. If you add the main ones, they're still going to go beyond it anyways. So I think that's a strong, solid start with PMax.

We won't go down the path of offline conversions because at the end of this video, Johan and I have spoken at length about this before.

Yeah.

We'll put some extra links in there. I do want to talk to both of you about the concept of— there's a lot of people, and I think this is a bit of an older concept that I'm becoming less and less worried about, but the whole thought of keyword cannibalization inside of an account. Do you guys want to just both give me your viewpoints where it's a bad thing, where you don't care, and you know, how you kind of approach that? So let's throw it back to you, Brent.

Um, keyword cannibalization, I I think this is probably where most people actually don't realize, because we're using basically the same term in a completely different way, which is redundant versus cannibalized. The amount of accounts that I still see where you've got 15 different keywords, which are literally just saying the exact same thing. They're all going to be targeting the exact same thing. So I think what most people struggle with in accounts at the moment is ensuring that their keywords are unique enough ensure that they don't overlap with whatever that intent is. So if I'm looking for, I don't know, blue bath mat, and then I've got navy bath mat, Google's going to register that to be basically the exact same term, even though, yeah, it is a little bit different. But that person searching, it can come across as basically the same sort of search intent. So essentially what I want to do is just ensure that my— so for example, like blue cotton bath mat, that's still different enough for me to think, cool, let's add this in as as a keyword because now we're starting to include cotton into that mix as well. Now you can come up with all these different variations around that as well. So just understand that Google is going to be loosely fitting whatever your keyword is. If you're trying to create a keyword because it's rearranged differently or it's got different punctuation, you're cannibalizing your own keywords, which is primarily really bad for organizing and understanding what's working, what isn't working in the account. You're splitting up all that performance data across so many different keywords. And two is you're getting less keyword-level data, which is just going to hinder how quickly Google can learn and understand what seems to work and what doesn't.

And the big thing I would like to point just before I throw it at Johan, my issue with it, it all comes for me, it all comes back down to, for me, the fastest way to see success in Google Ads is really controlling the budget and forcing Google to spend money in the right area. So if that keyword theme is performing or product theme is performing well, the reason we want it only in one type of campaign and not across multiple campaigns is so so that we can push more money into it, or if it's underperforming so that we can stop the more money. And if we stop it and it's targeting 3 other campaigns, you haven't solved the problem. It's really, really hard to scale and stop the waste. I'll come back to you, Brent, because I do want to talk about how that works between the different campaign types. But Johan, did you want to throw your viewpoint on it? Because I know it is different, especially in a lead gen theme.

Yeah, I think the biggest problem comes with, with, you know, overlap where you have, let's say, 2 ad groups targeting I wouldn't say wildly different services, but it's different services in your business. And you have that cross-triggering on search terms. You know, if you're doing lawn care and you're doing tree felling or tree cutting, whatever, and you have some sort of like overlap because you're a landscaper essentially of some sort. And when you have that overlap, that's going to be a big problem because it's, you're not going to have alignment with your ads and your landing pages and all that stuff. But if you have, let's say, a PMax running long-term and you have a search campaign running long-term and they are overlapping or more cannibalizing from each other, I don't think that's necessarily a problem as long as you're seeing good performance in both and you're not leaking. Like you mentioned, if you're leaking budget towards one of the campaigns and it's not performing well, well, you don't want that obviously. But I mean, ultimately it comes down to the auction, selecting the best choice for each. User doing the search. So in that scenario, I think it's no worries as long as you're getting the overall good performance you're looking for.

Yeah, I know this is something we've spoken about off camera as well, is that I'm less concerned about it the more and more we move down this path. Not only I'm listening to the Google announcements that are coming out about like even inside of search campaigns, they're not talking about keyword targeting anymore. They're talking about keyword signals. So which is something that'll move more and more. Let's talk a little bit about, do you, So let's just say you said you've got a search campaign, a Performance Max campaign targeting the same keyword themes. Are you looking at anything around bidding strategies or anything around that place so that you can kind of push, say, potentially more bottom of the funnel traffic to search and what we'll call traditional top of the funnel to Performance Max, or you're not considering that at all?

No, I'm not considering that. However, what I, I mean, if you are able to, let's say, introduce some value with your conversions. So let's say that you have your PMax relying on offline conversions and you can introduce the value with that, well, why not go down the path of maximize conversion value to try and utilize the PMAX to focus more on, let's say, high-value projects or cases or whatever it is that you are trying to achieve with your advertising? Because overall, search traffic is good as long as you're staying in your lane, in your service lane you're trying to advertise for. Search traffic is overall good quality, but the big benefit of PMax is that you're getting that wider net that you can cast, you know, across all of Google's channels. And if you can couple that with maximize conversion value in some ways, I think that's a good, it's a good power couple because you can have the PMax focusing way more energy towards getting you those higher value opportunities in that scenario.

I know when, because I mean, Performance Max is becoming quite a mature product, and I know when it first launched, um, one of the concerns we had internally, and we would see in the data, was there would be these fluctuations in Performance Max. So everything would be working fine for, for 3 or 4 months, and then it could drop down for, for a month, and then it would come back up. And that's why we would always have a lot more, I guess, segmentation around the search campaign. The way that I used to explain it, I would think about it, is that obviously the search campaign is feeding in accurate data all the time of what is converting, and it lets kind of Performance Max jump around to do what it needs to do. Just in the accounts you're managing, are you still seeing that? Is that something you're not as concerned about anymore? Like, are you— probably a better way to ask it would be, do you ever see a world where you only run Performance Max? I know there's some campaigns where you only run search, but would there ever be a scenario where you only run Performance Max, or you always think you still need some search there?

No, as long as search campaigns are around, I think I will always use them because they provide such a straight way of like, this is the thing I want to go after. And that's, you know, that's the way it is. I mean, in a way, if you were to enable AI Max on your search campaigns, I guess the search campaigns becomes a little bit more like PMax, you know, without the audience signaling and stuff. But yeah, I mean, as long as search campaigns are around, I will always use them as the foundation for sure. I think the only way that's going to stop it is if Google decides to sunset those campaigns.

Yeah, I agree. I've been on the record that I'm still not a fan of AI Max. I like it as a product and I like it as a concept. For me, I just don't have the confidence yet to recommend it for most businesses. Yeah, I'd like to know your feedback. Have you done any extra testing on it? Where are you kind of seeing it at the moment?

No, I haven't actually tried them yet. In that extent. But what I would recommend, if you want to do it, just do it as a custom experiment. So you're separating it from your, you know, original campaign. So you're not just like flipping it over.

Yeah, yeah. As a product, I'm actually, because I know Google has just also mentioned that they are going to be sunsetting Dynamic Search Campaigns. So essentially we are going to have to go in and use AI Max. I'm hoping that coming up this Google Marketing Live announcements that they will give some data around it. Ultimately it's still in beta testing. I think it's got a lot of potential, but I just think at the moment, and this is recording April 2026, it's just something I'm still not prepared to put my name behind.

So to speak.

Yeah, yeah.

But, but also I'd say too, the vast majority of businesses, you don't need AI Max yet. So let's, let's be, let's be realistic. You can scale with broad match inside of your search campaigns and then Performance Max, and then if you want to go demand gen, I just don't think it's, it's 100% required yet. And for businesses that are maxing out on everything, Hey, yeah, go for your life, but you're going to be spending quite a lot of money to be able to be at that level where AI Max is the last thing that you need to be using.

That's, by the way, a good question for you, Brent. Have you tried AI Max for e-commerce? Because that's a scenario I can think about AI Max fulfilling a purpose where you have tons of product pages and you want to have AI being able to crawl those and pull titles and information about the products and stuff.

It's a good question. It's kind of funny. I was creating a LinkedIn post about this just the other day in a very different way. I haven't had any real success or any meaningful success with AI Max. There is a new approach that I've been hearing that people are getting some pretty good results from, which is you're starting with a, basically like you do a search campaign with the intent of it going towards AI Max, but you're starting with like your exact match and then you'll, I don't think anyone here is a fan of phrase match or has been for a little while, but introducing a little bit of phrase into that as well just to start broadening. Going towards broad, going towards DSAs, and then eventually going towards AI Max. So you're essentially just going down this whole broadening experience the same way that we have historically with other search campaigns. But how long until I can really believe that AI Max is actually going to do anything meaningful? It's going to be like years, probably 2 years, something like that. So I have no real hopes.

And we just mentioned that off camera too, is I think the vast majority of brands, vast majority of businesses, like I'm saying, like 95% plus that are listening to this, there's so many other levers they can pull before they pull AI Max in terms of increasing search budgets, going into broad match, Performance Max, Demand Gen, campaign segmentations. There's so many other things you can do that I just don't think we need to pull that trigger on AI Max yet as a recommended strategy.

Yeah, if you need to go towards AI Max, it's because you have completely capped out where you're at. You're not hitting diminishing returns. You're basically recreating the definition of it. There is nothing more you can possibly do on Google and you're spending more than $1 million a month on YouTube.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

No, and that's exactly right. And that's my view on it. I think it will get better as a product. I mean, one of the things that I thought when AMAX first came out, my initial thought was, and I don't know whether it'll still go down this path, is that I could see a world for a lot of brands where, especially in lead generation, probably not e-commerce, where it's Search and AOMax rather than Search and Performance Max. Now, don't, please anyone, don't run off with that because I'm not recommending that, but I'm just saying I could see a world where that could potentially be a good campaign strategy for some campaigns.

Yeah, in all fairness, one thing I'm actually really keen on to do more testing with is smart bidding exploration because you've got AI and smart bidding exploration, which initially is kind of like What's the difference? And the main difference is smart bidding exploration is going to go out with a whole lot of terms that you would never really think would be like a convertible term, but it's also hitting users at that slightly higher stage of the funnel. So I could definitely see smart bidding exploration playing a bit more role as AI Max, because the whole idea is that you're feeding business tomorrow as well as business today. And I think that that's a really smart sort of split. With your, with your budget.

So if we were just kind of finish up this AI Max conversation, I think it'd be fair to say that we're all open to it as a product, but at the moment, vast majority of businesses are not going to be going down that path.

All right.

We've spoken about Performance Max. We also spoke about how it kind of works in between the two. Let's finish off with there is some data hitting the market that there's been some increases in CPCs and also some changing market trends, obviously, just with AIO views and AI mode. Sorry, too many AIs. I mean, have you guys noticed anything differently or are you changing anything in terms of your strategies at the moment? And this can be a simple yes/no answer.

I would say what I'm noticing with lead generation is that CTRs are getting a little bit worse than what they were before. I think people aren't as easy to click the ads or search Google the first thing they do when they need a service maybe. This is just speculating. I don't have any confirmation on that, but I think there's a conversation taking place with an AI-first quite a lot before they decide to actually convert. Which might also put way more strain on the bottom funnel keywords. Because a lot of the research and a lot of the upper funnel stuff that was taking place before came in like a natural glide towards the bottom. But now with AI, you can very quickly, very efficiently get a good educated answer about your problem, whether it be to install a new heating fan or, you know, change your roof, you can basically become fully educated on the thing before you even reach out to the service or the, you know, the business that performs the service. So I think that the way from like discovery to like wanting the service or the thing is becoming shorter. That's just my input on this. I mean, just as an example, we're building a house and we need to make the choice between two different heating solutions in the building. So we told AI to become like a, like an energy consultant. So we inputted our place where we live and the energy calculation for the two different, you know, heaters and the house descriptions and everything. And it could just spit out the full like 30-year expectancy of the two different choices in terms of like cost. What are like the life expectancy of the different, you know, units? So what are the replacement costs? It could calculate everything. And also like the weather in the town where I live, you know, during the winter. What's like the average cold season like and how's that's going to, you know, affect electricity pricing and, and all that stuff. So we could get out and get a complete answer for something that probably no one could answer. I mean, at least, at least not the contractors. That would be like a separate consultation we would have paid probably in the thousands for to get that information. So that kind of thing educates us very, very well. So we can quickly, more quickly get to the choice, uh, than what we would where I would do before.

And yeah, given that you live in Sweden, was the response just build a massive sauna and live in the sauna for your winters?

Yeah, yeah, yeah, of course.

No, no, I do, I do see what you're saying. Yeah. No, and it's something I think— what is another thing I'm interested to see what rollouts are going to be coming out over the coming months. Now we're coming into Google's announcement season. I still think that they're holding— we know they haven't— there's going to be more ads appearing in our overviews and our max over this year. So it'd be interesting to see what happens once those ads do start appearing more in the AI mode and AI overviews.

Yeah, sorry, Brent. To actually add to that, because you hit a point that was insanely accurate. If we're talking about AI overviews, I find that AI overviews are still just a summary of— it's just like an SEO summary as opposed to an AI LLM sort of conversation you'd have with ChatGPT, Claude, or Gemini. So when you're looking at the actual LLMs for an e-commerce standpoint, the most important thing that you can possibly do for your business to make sure that you're showing the same is Google Merchant Center. You need to make sure you have every single product attribute at 100%. You don't leave anything to blank. You've got your GTINs, you've got your titles filled out correctly, but you also have detailed and non-jargon and just sort of, you know, I don't know what you call it, like a over-elaborated description. It's concise, it has the information that is needed to be in there to be able to ensure you get the character count, but it's actually needed information because AI is still going to be interpreting that data. So AI overview would look at that data and be like, oh, these guys have this, this, this, this, this. But you're not going to, you know, ChatGPT or Gemini or anything like that saying, what should I do with this, this, this? You're giving it way more information about, okay, this is where we're moving to, say, like a heater system. Live in Brisbane, there's not a lot of research that goes behind heater systems. It's just open a door. But I can imagine there'd be a lot of, you know, climate is, you've probably got, whether you guys have ice or snow or something like that, you know, what's your house made out of? There's a lot of questions that would go into it and it would need to really understand your situation to provide the best sort of output. And we give it that information. So it's going to be, AI overview will be like, this is what everyone seems to be going for. And then ChatGPT will actually analyze a lot of the information that it does have through most likely Google Merchant Center and other areas such as product pages and everything else and provide the best recommendation based on the information that you actually give it. So that's probably one area that a lot of businesses can focus on, but that is definitely much more the SEO side than paid ads. Google Merchant Center paid ads, but yeah, web optimization, SEO.

All right. Hey, last thing, and we'll finish up, we'll be quickly with this one. And that we are talking about AI. Are you guys actively using any AI tools? And if so, It just gives us a quick summary on how you're using it and how you find it's improving your workflow.

Yeah.

I'm actually going down the rabbit hole of videos with AI. I think that's a really cool tool. You can do some amazing stuff right now with videos. There's actually people doing complete like series and movies with AI. That's looking really good. So I think that's something that will really, really evolve in the next couple of years where, you know, I wouldn't say amateurs, but people with not as many resources can get cinema-like ads or short films or informationals, whatever, about their business that just wasn't available before. You would need to put together a 6-figure budget to get that kind of, you know, moviemaking before, but now you can make it with your own just AI tools, essentially. I'm not going to mention any tools here, but there are some good tools out there to, to do this.

So Brent, are you using anything in your workflow, or what's, uh, anything you're looking at at the moment in this, this sphere? So much.

Yeah, my, my current situation with AI will be so different 6 months down the line from now, but currently there is no AI tool that I can truly rely on, on just kind of— it'll fully automate anything. So for example, videos, like you get some videos which are really, really good, but always find that there's still a lot of tweaks and adjustments where it doesn't quite get it right. So I will use it more so for like video analysis and, you know, hey, here's our top XYZ creators. What are the commonalities? What are the personas? What should we do for the next round of copy or creatives? So I do it for a lot of analysis side of things. I do it for a lot of helping with just like heavy lifting, which I think a lot of people have been doing for a while, such as provide a whole lot of ad copy again. How you prompt it is insanely important. They're probably the main area. So right now it's a lot of the grunt work and a lot of the analysis. But myself, like probably so many other marketers out there, I'm still playing around with things like, you know, Claude Code and trying to figure out what are some better solutions that we can get that are going to be more accessible for not just my clients, but also people that I work with and help with the whole measurement side of things. This is something that computers do through mathematical calculations. There's no reason why every business should have access to something like that. So that's where a lot of my time and additional sort of time and research goes towards.

I'm using very much down on the Claude train at the moment. I do use quite a bit of Gemini as well, but very much I'm just using it as a diagnostic tool. I can't see anytime soon where I'll be linking any AI tool to start making live changes in my account. And that's just fundamentally, I don't, look, I don't believe anyone should be in an account every single day making changes to your account as well. And I think there's too many different things that we need to be thinking about as well. Like all the points— so perfect example is all the points could lead to you need to change the budget or turn off some keyword themes or change bidding strategies that make sense from a data point of view, but they just make no sense from a business point of view. And I think that's where, for me, even if you put all those inputs in, yes, definitely get the heavy work for the data, but I still think in terms of where we're sitting as, as like account strategists and media buyers, we should be maintaining that and managing that level of control.

Yeah, 100%.

I think the AI, you know, does a good job with the grunt work where you're like analyze these search terms or provide the, you know, inspiration for ad copy or whatever. Those kinds of, you know, aspects of like narrow aspects of, you know, creating campaigns and the account. That's where it really feels a good purpose right now.

But like strategizing, you know, your account, I don't think that's where it Does that?

No, no. And I know like with core tools that we released, like we've been getting it to like landing page builders going out into Reddit forums and getting data that would take days to collect and pulling that in. Like we've even, I know internally as you guys know, we're even like when we're putting together strategies for businesses, we're actually using the sales calls, the meeting core transcripts, putting that into the prompts so that we're getting brand personas, marketing personas, legal personas, everything that we need. It's saving a heap of time with that. But yeah, I think for me, very much diagnostic tool. Use it as much as possible. It's saving heaps and heaps of time, but just keep it away from making active changes in the account.

Yeah, I'm seeing a lot of lead magnets on LinkedIn for people that are like, you know, giving away skills and cloud, you know, solutions where they, you know, manage the whole account for you basically. And I don't think that's a good idea. No, I've even heard like, you know, examples of Meta banning your account for giving AI access to the account and doing too many sort of like changes or access to the account that's basically not allowed.

Yeah.

So I think you should tread that place with some caution right now. Don't just go blindly letting an AI manage your account for you.

The other thing I'd be scared about too with that is just account access. And obviously as well, if you're using a tool that's linked up to, you know, thousands, potentially thousands of accounts, are similar to what was happening with plugins in WordPress sites. Like, you know, once they get that weakness there. But, but for me as well, the amount of time you can save, and I think the increased productivity for it to do the grunt work, I just don't see the need to actually connect it because you can, you got all the data, it just becomes really, really quickly to then make those, make those connections through there as well.

Yeah. Yeah. And I think you hit the nail on the head before. It's, it's AI doesn't understand people, people understand people. So in what situation will the AI, and I like, it's gaining a better understanding of people, but like, have you seen most of the TikTok trends? Who could ever see any of those trends coming? You can't predict any of that sort of stuff.

Yeah.

People react to that naturally and fast in very unexplainable ways. So AI is not going to really understand that. There's always going to be a human element to ensure that the strategy and the application of things is done right. But yeah, you can probably put everything in front of you to the point that you say yes or no, but you're still the CEO of that decision.

I know what I've really enjoyed in my workflow is that I used to always struggle going from really, really heavy data analysis to really, really creative work. And I found that's what I've really enjoyed about this whole increase in AI tools that we've got is it's taken that data work out so that I can just focus on the more the strategy and the creative work. And maybe it's because I'm a, you know, my brain's a little bit older, but it's, I'm finding it a lot easier rather than have to switch between two, you know, that left side, right side brain, that we can just go into the creative and strategy straight away. Alrighty guys, hey, thanks for joining me and hope you guys all have a good day. We'll see you again here soon.

Yeah, see you soon.

Let's have a nice day.