Homeless To Health Insurance Success | The Inspiring Story of Tommy Gaffney

Get over it, man. Honestly, get over yourself. It's not because it's not about you anyway. Because when you make that video, are you going to make it about you anyway? No. You're literally trying to reach an audience to let them know that you probably have a solution to their problem.

Hey. Hey. Welcome back to the Accelerate your insurance sales podcast. My name is Andy Neary and this is episode seven. Today I am joined by Tommy Gaffney, vice president of national sales at Evolve Benefits. Tommy brings over 23 years of of experience to the table in the employee benefit space. He is an energetic powerhouse. You are going to love this guy. Not only does he have over 27,000 followers on LinkedIn, he's doing some amazing work to help employee benefit advisors serve a very underserved part of the market. I wanted to have Tommy on to tell his story. He has got a powerful story from being homeless just 15 years ago to creating an extremely successful employee benefits career. So you're gonna love this man's energy. You're gonna love this man's story. We're gonna talk about what Evolved Benefits is doing to insert to serve markets that are full of part time and seasonal employees. It's an area most brokers overlook. And we're also gonna talk about some sales mindset. Cause Tommy is a big believer in sales mindset. You're gonna love his thoughts. In fact, for the first time ever on my podcast and you're going to see Tommy do something on video you've never seen before. So you make sure to listen or watch this episode all the way to the end. All right, let's dive in. Episode seven. This is Tommy Gaffney, Vice president of national sales at Evolve Benefits. This episode is brought to you by True Captive Insurance. What if you could take full control of your healthcare strategy without the financial burdens of traditional insurance? At True Captive Insurance they they make that possible. As the only captive in the nation that puts up the majority of collateral on your behalf, they provide financial flexibility from day one, making them an advocating partner for their customer success. True Captives fully customizable plans and cost saving strategies ensure you never have to choose between affordability and quality care. It's time to break free from the limitations of conventional insurance. Take the next step today. Visit TrueCaptive.com and discover a smarter way to manage healthcare that is True Captive.com. tommy, welcome back to the show.

Happy to be here. Thank you.

I'm excited to have you back on because you. I had you on broker's voice, right. And I thought Your story was super impactful. People got a lot out of that. So I wanted to have you on this show as well. So we're going to break this into three parts. We're going to talk about your backstory a little bit. I think it's very powerful. I can't wait for people to hear it. We're going to talk about what you guys are doing at Evolved and then we'll even get into some things. Sales mindset, because I know you're a big believer. In fact, if you're tuning in, you might want to go watch the video because you're going to see a first on on this episode today. So, Tommy, for the folks who have no clue who Tommy Gaffney is, introduce yourself.

Thank you. Yeah, my name is Tommy Gaffney, and as far as insurance goes, I've been in the industry for almost 24 years. My first, I guess what you call it a gig was farmers insurance. Brand new. Not knowing what I wanted to do with my life. So the recruiter says you need to go get all these licenses. Fire, casualty, life and health and series 6 and 63, because we were doing those V wells and 401k rollovers and things like that, while you're also trying to do car insurance. So anyway, you know, a couple years grinding, I actually built a decent book of business where I could afford an apartment. And in 2008, the House of cards fall. Everyone lost their home on the liar loans. And in a month and a half, two plus years of grinding vaporized. I lost my entire book of business and started living. I had to live out of my car for about six months. And I had a membership at 24 Hour Fitness. And so that's where I was taking my showers and doing what I call the poor demand dry cleaning, Febreze fabric spray, and you whisk it out in the steam room and there's your laundry. Wow.

Yeah. So. So you had a good farmer's agency going until I did.

Oh, wait, yeah, until that.

House of cards, homeowners insurance, auto insurance.

You lose the home, you lose the autos, you lose the life insurance.

Here in California, I assume they got hit hard.

Very hard.

Yeah.

Yeah. I mean, stated income loans, you could just say, I'm Joe Blow and I make this much. And then they gave you this. The balloon interest comes up and it smoked everybody.

Wow.

And including my book of business.

Wow. Yeah. So, folks tuning in, by the way, if you're wondering where the heck we are, we're in San Diego live. We're at the C3 offices. So C3, thank you for giving us an opportunity to record here. So that's. That is really interesting. You know, what was that like? You know, at some point, at that point when you lost your. Your agency, your office, and. And literally living out of your car and showering at 24 Hour Fitness. Why. Why not just give up? I mean, a lot of people at that, at that point would just be like, I'm done.

Sure. Well, you know, a lot of people actually ask me that. And you're either wired one way or you or you're not. And you also, if you have a dream and you're really focused on that and you want it no matter what, that'll be the difference of whether you're going to quit or not. Because I could easily wouldn't got a job at a warehouse or done something that was, you know, easy. But what's interesting is that sick that because I lived out of my car twice, okay? Because something else happened down the road. All right? So. But in that six months of living out of my car, which, by the way, I only had a budget where I can only afford two Del Taco burritos in a day. So I had to wait till I was just hungry. Like, I wanted to eat my own arm off. I eat the first burrito real slow, and I'd wait till I was gonna eat my other arm off in the evening and then eat that burrito. And I was rolling like that for six months.

But I started after. You're in the business.

Yeah, I lost it. And then I started reading personal development books because I knew I needed a mentor. I knew I needed to level up from there. I knew there was a lesson in this. I couldn't afford a mentor. So I had an idea. Let me go to the used bookstore. Let me grab how to Win Friends and Influence People. And that author's my mentor right now. He just doesn't know it yet. And so what I was doing is I'm reading the book. Sometimes I'd have panic attacks about my life and I'd be crying while I was reading the book.

In your car?

In my car, just crying, but wanting to read the book. Like, what are you going to do, man? You got to do something about it. So you know how you have a mirror in the rear view mirror, like your flip down? I was like, you know, I got to start leveling up. I read. I would read a few sentences and then look in the rear view mirror and stare at myself and just practice talking like that. So I Use that failure to personally develop, to learn a whole new vernacular, to learn how to stop feeling sorry for myself and stop acting like such a victim. Learn how to not feel like, why me? Because you know what the answer to that is? Why not you? You obviously need to earn your way here. So I looked at that as. As tuition to pay my dues, as the right to be in this industry.

Wow, Man. Now, please correct me if I'm not accurate on this.

Sure.

When you look at that moment where, again, most people would have given up or just gone to do something else or anything to make money. Right. Do you think your childhood had any impact on that? Because you didn't have the easiest childhood either.

No. In fact, you know, it's funny. Bring that up because you know my story.

Yeah.

That wasn't the first time I've been homeless. I ran away from home when I was 14. We don't need to dive into why everyone has the reason why they run away, but it's not one of those where you run it right down the street to your buddy's house and live in the garage until the parents find out. I lived on the street to downtown Denver, Colorado, for almost two years.

Wow.

Just me and my skateboard.

And at age 14.

At age 14, yeah. Lots. I can write three different books on what happened down there. Lots of unmentionables, lots of mentionables. You just. You learn a lot about human nature down there. You learn how people truly are at just the rawest level. You see things that you can't unsee. Like all kinds of things happen to you that maybe one day you'll talk about or maybe you'll never talk about, you know? So lots of things happen. But from that experience, I believe I already had kind of some scar tissue. So being homeless, living out of my car was an upgrade from sleeping on the streets. You've been to downtown Denver. I can show you so many alleys where I knew how to rig the ladders to where they look like they weren't working. Just so like the predators that go around at night that try to rape kids when they're sleeping think that a kid's not going to be on that building because there's no way he can reach that ladder. I would rig them to make them look like they weren't working.

Wow.

And then I would have to take the weirdest route to that spot to make sure I wasn't followed. And. And then get that ladder down and then pull it back up and then try to fall asleep for just A couple hours on the roof because you always got to stay on the move, so you don't really get that much rest because you're basically trying to protect your body and all the parts of your body that people are after during the witching hours. Yeah.

Oh, you know, when I think about bringing you back then to 2008, living out of your car, you know, you said something that is music to my ears. Your first mentor was somebody you've never met. And I think people, when they think about mentors, they think it has to be a coach, somebody that they work with, they sit across the table from, break bread with, whatever it is. But often your best mentors are people you never met because of the books you read and things like that. So I would love for you because I'm kind of a personal development junkie, too. When you think about all the books you read, especially during that time frame in your. Your life, are there any that stand out that had a huge impact on the success you are today?

Yeah, I'd say in the beginning, a lot of the John Maxwell books I went to, actually, I got. I would say, kind of blessed. I got to go to one of his boot camps for free, and so I really liked his books. There's another book called the 77 Mental Toughness Strategies of the Elite. That's a great book. The Subtle Art of Not Giving a F. That's a great book. Harvey Mackay, Swim with the Sharks Without Being Eaten Alive. Wonderful book. I mean, you know what's rad about that book? Every chapter is maybe a page or three words. And my favorite part of that book, the chapter is just this line right here. The best thing you can do is make the other person believe it was their idea. I love that, man, that whole book. So when it comes to books, like, you want to be careful with books, okay? There's some people who are like, oh, yeah, I just going to start reading a bunch of books, but there's no practical application. You know, I'll have a pile of books. I mean, I might. I might have three books on deck this month, but that doesn't mean I'm going to finish every book. Because if I grab a solid nugget out of that book early on, I might just put it away and go to the next book, or I might actually just finish the book. It's all about the flow and everything. But no matter what, these books are meant for practical application. You know, some people, they almost just want to go through the process of it, almost like it's protocol. We should always be personally developing. And so I've always used those books because I literally. I didn't get to go to college. I didn't get to be around a family that spoke. Well, we didn't. I wasn't taught how to manage money. I wasn't taught a lot of things. And so I'd say one of the things, one of the common themes that you'll see depending on what personal development books you gravitate. I happen to gravitate towards books that somehow the theme was all about empathy and altruism, which is a great way to go about your business. Anyway.

Yeah. What are you reading right now?

Right now, it's actually the second book of the Subtle Art of Not.

Not Giving an F. Yeah.

It's the second book of that. So I actually going to start it tomorrow.

And I had just got done reading Atomic Habits again.

Oh, yeah?

Yeah. And that's another thing about books. I read Atomic Habits a long time ago, but I'm way further along in my career and my development. So I decided to read it again and just reapply those because sometimes you got to go back to the basics.

I have books that I read every. Every year, once a year. And you're.

You're. You're in the. You're a professional athlete. You know that there's always the most redundant, basic warmups you must do to make sure the bruising your joints and everything. I kind of look at it like that.

The work you put off the field. There's nothing sexy to it. Yeah. It's, you know, the couple hacks I've been taught and I use once in a while with books. Number one, I actually will at times buy a book and buy the audio book.

I'm the same way.

I'll read it. And while I'm reading it, I'll listen to it. And people might say, well, you bought it twice. I'm like, yeah, but I'm digesting it twice as much.

Yeah. And so what if I bought it twice? And like, you ever get anybody to finish that sentence? Yeah. And.

And yeah. What's your point? Yeah. The other thing though, I got from Tim Ferriss is because I used to be really our workweek. I used to be guilty of reading a book.

Yeah.

Not really taking notes from it and not digesting any or applying anything from it. But what I started doing, he suggests, like, you go to the front of the book where there's no. It's this white pages.

Yep.

And as you're reading and you see it, you Know, there's a spot in the book you want to take a note on or highlight. He goes back to the beginning of the book, where it's just white paper, and you write the number of the page, and then like, what did you learn? So it's almost like you're creating your own index.

I love that, man. Can I talk about the white part of that book real quick? It's kind of a pro. I've told you about a process I go through that I know we're gonna do it a little bit on the camera. You know what I do with every single book, it's a process, too. Because just about every book that you buy, you open it up, and it's just white right there. I tell myself, here's what you know about the information that's about to be given to you in this book. Nothing. There's nothing on this pages right here. So you have an empty cup right now. You have nothing. So you're going to set aside everything you think you know about this subject and open your mind for a new experience. Let's go.

That's awesome.

So I use those white pages to put my mind in the right place in order to get what I need out of this book. Instead of just thinking, oh, I could skip these chapters. I already know that. Yeah, right?

Yeah. Dare I possibly have you repeat yourself here? But, you know, it's 25. 20, 25. 17 years removed from that. Living out of car, trying to figure it out. What. What if you had to look back at that time to where you are today? I got to believe personal development's part of it. But what do you think has led to you. Led you to get to the point where you are today where you're just have. You're having a ton of success running sales for evolved benefits? I mean, when you. Do you ever go back and kind of look back at 2008 and just realize how far you've come? Dude.

That. That I do. And, you know, it gets emotional. In fact, I do it every year. Because, you know, what comes with me looking back is also my sobriety day. I've been sober for 23 years as well. I've been sober the whole time in this industry, you know, so when I reflect on my sobriety, I reflect on all kinds of things as well. And so, you know, looking back at those times, I'm going to go back to. At some point, you just got to get rid of all the excuses, man. I mean, I've always loved an underdog story because I am an underdog. You know, I was never voted the valedictorian. I'm not the prom king. You know, I'm a skateboarder, straight up. Since I was three years old, I've been on a skateboarder. That's all I cared about. I didn't care what anybody thought. I was always in the principal's office at school for not paying attention to class because I was thinking about why am I not on my skateboard right now? I just. Every skateboarder out there that's hearing this, they understand it is the obsession, but it's a healthy one, believe it or not. But like I just believe that at some point you are sick and tired of being sick and tired of being mediocre. And it doesn't matter what your story is. You got to throw the excuses away. And if you want it, you got to go get it, man. It's a merit thing. It's no different than if you can't do pull ups. You can't read about that, man. If you want to learn pull ups, you need to go to that pull up bar and start learning how to yank pull ups. There's no other way to do it. If you want to get into any type of sales or any specific industry, you need 10,000 hours or 10 years of strict, disciplined.

Guided work. And your work ethic needs to be solid because at the end of the day you are who you are when no one's looking. And when no one's looking is when you should be working the hardest.

Yeah, I just heard this the other day. You know the true definition of an integrity is what you do when no one is watching. And one of the things I see in our industry is, is is new producers come into the industry and they see what their agency owner, the success he or she is having and the agency owners form of training is just do what I do. And the part of that training that they don't include in that is, oh by the way, it took me 20 years to get where I am and I think they, they, these new producers just want to fast track to success. They're forgetting that it takes time. No, no one in this industry tells you oh by the way, it takes time and you're going to have to work your face off.

I'm glad you brought that up because you're so right. These days everyone wants to look at the event and they don't want to consider the process. Now that agency, you know you're talking about, that doesn't just because he hired that person doesn't mean he said he was going to mentor them.

Right.

I mean, if that person did say they were going to mentor, then they should have broken down those 20 years. But the. The other person didn't ask either. So I think that if you're new in this industry or you finally want to get your you know what together, you need to start advocating for yourself, for real. If you need help, ask for it. If you need guidance, ask for it. If you want to get better at your craft and you don't know where to look, ask somebody. I mean, there's tech. You can go on a chatgpt and ask where to look. It'll tell you right where to look. Like, you know what's interesting is there is literally no excuses on this planet that are worth anything. Because technology. There's so much technology out there. You couldn't give me an excuse right now why you didn't work hard today? I won't buy it.

Yep.

Not with my story, for sure. Honestly, I'm the last person anyone should come with excuses to use that, though.

As a competitive advantage. Like, if you think about being again, going back to 08.

Sure.

Back against the wall. I gotta believe, number one, you operate pretty well with your back against the wall and actually prefer it. I was just gonna say, and we live in a society where people can't handle that most people can't handle. They want easy, they want convenient. And I gotta believe a guy like you operates pretty dang well in stress, chaos, and that feeling like your back is against the wall.

Yeah. And that's why. That's why, like, what you do, that's why people need you. And other people like you, they need mentors. Because you can't do this alone. There's not one. In all the books you've read and all the successful people you've met and even some of the guys here at C3, I know these guys. Not one of these guys or gals in here will say they did it alone. At some point, there was a mentor. At some point when they were low, someone bought them lunch that day because they were hungry. At some point, somebody came along right when they needed it. And so, like, I think what's missing is the entitlement. And also just like, what is it? Pride? Why aren't you asking for help? Because. Because, honestly, successful people want to help you. You know that. Seriously, I would love it if 10 people asked me for help walking out the door, I would say, sure, but you better be ready, because when I help, we're all going to be working around here. Right. But like, seriously, I would love someone to come up and ask me for help because that's what successful people do. So why aren't these people after that, that's. That's kind of the last.

Pride and a lot of ego in that, I think. And to your point, what, what I see as well is people wait until their back is against the wall to seek a coach or a mentor where there's nothing wrong with that. However, it's when things get going and things are good again, they don't think they need them anymore and that's where they make the mistake.

I'd say no different than someone that takes medication. They think they' feeling better, they stop taking it and then they're 5,000, 150 again.

Exactly. Think of the best athletes in. In sports today. Do you think they stopped working with a coach because they're playing well now?

Kobe Bryant, a thousand jump shots a.

Day and he still had Tim Garver by his. Tim, is it? Tim Grover. Tim Grover. Excuse me, Tim Grover. By his side all the way.

That's another. What was his book?

I just read it. I'm forgetting the name.

So am I. But yeah, I read that book twice as well. Great book, man. That guy. See, those are the kind of guys that's a tough love guy.

Yeah.

Okay. Those are the kind of guys that we're not here to bs, man. I'm going to tell you when you're full of it, and I'm probably not going to tell you when you're doing well. We're just going to work on your weaknesses. Your strengths are already there.

Yep.

Let's get your weaknesses on point so you can become whole and go out there and crush it.

Well, and I think you just brought up another point. A lot of people, when they seek a mentor or coach, they're. They're looking. How do I say this? They want the coach to validate what they're already doing versus telling them that what they're doing is wrong and they need to change.

They want them to cosign on their bs. The crazy thing is they're willing to pay you to do that.

I'll tell you, we get this all the time with our coaching and our consulting is what's the guarantee? What can we. What guarantee do you have on roi? And I say, number one, I don't guarantee any ROI because I'm not doing the work for you. But number two, the reason you're asking for a guarantee is because you're Already looking for an alibi when you don't put in the work.

I love that. I couldn't even said it better.

Yeah, that's 100% true. Yeah, you and I speak the same language, man. That's. That's why I love your story. Again, I want to hear everybody what, What? What? What Tommy just said. Seventeen years ago, this guy was living out of his car, showering in 24 Hour Fitness, doing his laundry in the locker room. Essentially, this is 98% of the people Tommy in this industry would have given up. You didn't. And here you are 17 years later, VP of National Sales for evolved benefits. Hyper successful, recently engaged. Right? Still skateboard. Talk about that. You still skateboard? If you don't mind. How old are you?

52.

52. You still get you on, by the way, if you want to go see it, go to Tommy's Instagram and you can see all of his skateboarding there. Hey, it's Andy Neary. Thank you for listening to the Accelerate your insurance podcast. Did you know the ideas we share on the show are things we actually specialize in helping you implement? If you want to increase your sales, make more money, and be the thought leader your prospects, reach out to, please go to my LinkedIn profile DM me and sign up for a free discovery call. Again, go to my LinkedIn profile DM me and we'll get you set up for a free discovery call. All right, now back to the show. Do you use that? I know you said you. You've basically grown up with a skateboard in your hand. You still. Is that your way of kind of just mentally getting away from the job, the work?

Yeah. And a lot of things, like, you know, skateboarding. It's funny, jokingly, I can say I gladly ruined my life for skateboarding, but let's talk about living on the streets. Okay? My skateboard saved my life because when I was out on the streets during the day and in the evening looking for new spots to skate, a lot of the other street kids were figuring out who to rob, who to rape, who to kill, who to do all these things to where there's a revolving door on the streets. I could think I was friends with a kid, and he disappears. And I don't know if he was dead or if he went to jail or if he just caught a trip. You just don't know. And I saw a lot of people do a lot of horrible things. And my skateboard, for some reason, has always either kept me out of trouble, it's never let me Down. I used to go to bed with that thing. And so these days, yeah, I'm a weak warrior. But you know, I think what makes a true skateboarder is the skateboarder that just can't stop skateboarding. You know, some guys go play pickup basketball on the weekend. I think pickleball is a big thing. I've messed around pickleball. It's kind of fun. It's challenging. You know, some people like to play golf. I just, I'm lucky enough to where I've been on a skateboard my whole life. I can still handle the slams. I don't like the slams.

I've seen you do plenty of them in front of a bunch of 20 somethings.

Oh yeah. I sent you a picture of my leg all busted up the other day. Oh my gosh, man. I wanted to Advil Slurpee when I got home times 10. 10 it was, in fact, I, I now it's a big bruise. It looks like six solar systems combining on my shin. But it was worth it.

Yeah, absolutely. That's awesome. That's awesome.

So I get the let out, man.

Yeah, well, no, you got to have that, you got to have that hobby. I struggle sometimes with hobbies away from works. I like working. But you got to have that thing that allows you to break away not just physically, but mentally. Let's talk a little bit about what you're doing that evolved. You know, you guys work in an area of the business. I actually, it's, I think there's a kind of a tie here. You know, we, when you're out on the streets, you're homeless, living out of your car, it's easy to be overlooked, right? Absolutely. And it's ironic. Now you're with Evolved and you guys, I really believe you guys are helping advisors focus on a part of the market that is very overlooked. You know, those businesses that have seasonal part time people who aren't typically either eligible for benefits or can afford major medical or full benefits. Talk to us a little bit about what you're doing at Evolve because I think, I think you guys have a very cool niche and again, you're targeted on a very underserved market.

Yeah, we are in, you know that, that there's a lot of industries that are underserved and a lot of the reasons is because they have such large populations of part time and seasonal employees. And right now I think the theme, if you turn on any news channel, it's dei, you know, people want to be feel included. Okay. So this isn't a DEI comment. This is actually. People don't want to feel excluded when it comes to the benefits. So in the industries that, that we've created a solution for, it actually all started out with the staffing industry. We realized that the staffing industry was heavily underserved. And I'm not taking a shot at any traditional major medical broker out there. I understand that you're gonna look at every company with the 8020 rule. Is this person going to be on the good end of the 80:20 rule or the not so good end? But here, here's where I believe this separates one benefit broker from the other. Is the one that's like, nope, I'm not messing around with that, it's not worth my time, blah, blah, blah, blah. The other, the other broker over here is like, well, maybe there's just not a solution that we found for these folks yet. Let's get out there and look. And so what Evolved Benefits has done is, has evolved the minimum essential coverage and minimum value plan world. So I will be fully transparent on this and I agree. Because I was back in the benefit world when MEC plans were straight up snake oil. And the reason why they were is because the one carrier that was actually coming out heavy in the marketplace, they were training these brokers that did not know how to really talk about it. They were literally training them to go out in the market and use it as a replacement to the major medical plan. Well, all so all that's doing is just turning that broker into a commodity peddler. Because the main focus was, look how much cheaper this health plan is. I'm going to save you so much money. And if that employer on the other side, they're, they're like, this guy's a licensed agent in front of me, he must know what he's talking about. And the agent I have right now didn't show me this bor.

Right away they're hearing big savings.

That's right now a minimum essential coverage plan is a minimum essential coverage plan. It does not have hospitalization services. It has very robust acute care primary care specialist, urgent care lab, X ray, a full prescription program with Teladoc. That's how most people use their day to days. But back in, and I'm going to say around 2014, it really had a snake oil type of connotation. So evolve benefits. We evolve that by first and foremost creating the tpa because these industries that we work with, there's a lot of high turnover. Think of restaurant franchises, think of the hospitality industry, the landscaping industry. And Think about how competitive it is when it comes to poaching good employees from the companies within the same industry. So you, when you approach these employers, it's not just about showing them that you can get affordable health care into the hands of their employees. You're actually mitigating the costs of losing good employees and having to retrain new ones.

Well, you're right. I mean, you're in it. You're talking about industries where somebody may leave for another employer for a dollar more an hour. Right. And any kind of quality benefit can be a great retention attraction tool in those industries. And I always think back to my time as an advisor. Those were the groups that people get frustrated with. Oh, they have 200 employees, but they have 32 on the plan on the major medical. And number one, I think a lot of advisors just ignore that type of prospect because, well, I have. There's 200 employees, which is only 32 on the plan. They don't think, well, what can I do for the other 170.

In?

My question is, why wouldn't they ask that about their own client?

Because they care about one thing, their revenue.

And they're very jaded in that there's only a major medical plan available.

Well, they think that's it. And what's interesting, the irony in my opinion, because I used to think this way, 200 life group, there's only 40 on the plan. We're only going to make like 15, 10,000. $15,000 on this, but we're going to end up having to do the work for 200, even though we only get paid for 40 and we forget to think, but what if we had a benefit for the other 160? If you're focused on your revenue, there's an opportunity to optimize your revenue also.

That's organic growth. How much does it cost in your marketing to get a new group? If you're anybody that's out there prospecting, getting new business, whatever you spent on getting that new group, you could literally analyze your existing book of business, see the delta on a census of any one of your clients and say, hey, I've got this many people here. Only this many people are on the major medical plan. What are we doing with these other folks? The thing is, is I'm going to call a lot of people out right now and I don't care. They're lazy. They don't want to learn that. They'd rather go play another round of golf then learn about another solution. And this is why a lot of brokers are getting displaced right now. There's so many hungry, younger kind of brokers out there that are using technology. They're collaborating with payroll companies, HRIS systems, they're collaborating with the commercial side of things. There's a lot of collaboration going on and people are getting warm handoffs to these opportunities and they're literally displacing incumbent broker that's been a legacy broker, a 10 year, 15 year broker.

And you bring up a good point. I know you said younger. I mean you're 52, dude, but you still get technology because you're all over LinkedIn. You have what, 27,000?

Yeah, I'm sniffing 28.

You're crushing it there. And your content, you're all over the place. And I gotta believe that has an impact on how the broker market that you work with perceives you because they see you all the time.

Well, you know, it goes back to, we talked about this before we started recording. You know, some people shut it down at 4pm and go home and they're all about the TV remote. Yeah, I'm not that person. So I will take a little break and give myself a little Tommy time, I call it. But no matter what, there's going to be a couple hours where I'm staying current on what's going on in the industry, what new technologies out there. It's not just for me. It's again, we talked about altruism. When I talked about the themes of these books that I'm always attracted to. I'm always asking myself, am I being a maximum service to the brokers I work with?

Yeah.

And one of the ways I can always be a maximum service is do some research that they don't have time to do and help them out with some knowledge that they can use to maybe go win a group. Because I already did that research for them and also for myself.

Well, one thing I love too, especially with your content, you know, if you haven't followed Tommy on LinkedIn, make sure you do. You put out a lot of video content, which I love a lot. You, you constantly teach brokers about what you're selling, the mechs, the, you know, the MVP plans, whatever they might be. You're constantly talking about it and that's, you're one of the few that really get what it means to use content to drive value. Because you have an attitude of I'm here to serve, I'm going to give away the good stuff. And that's why you've, you're at, you guys are having the success you Are.

It's the go giver mentality, which is another great book.

Another great book.

I'm so glad you said this because anybody listening right now, if you're going to start doing your LinkedIn marketing, don't ever make it about you. This is. I'm not going to mention the company. I got to say this in a way where I don't call somebody out. There's a national company. Okay. They're national. I saw a post that said something like.

Our marketing department is the best ever. We did this.

This.

And I am.

Yeah, A lot of degrees in here.

And by the way, we're here to serve you. You read that. You're like you.

Yeah, no, I get it.

Literally just served herself. If you look at. If you look at the content that I make, you'll never hear me once talk about myself. We're getting right into what the subject is. Okay. Talk about today because we're educating people 100. And sometimes it might seem redundant if you see it every day, but guess What? The same. There's 28, 000 people in my feed. Somebody might not even see my feed for two weeks. So they might have missed it. So I'll just talk about it in a different way. But there's so much stuff to talk about, not only in this space, but around it. Because as health insurance keeps getting more expensive and these renewals keep coming in higher and these brokers are now scrambling because especially in the large group space, you know this because you were a broker. When you get a 52% renewal and then you go out to market with RFPs and you all get DTQ'd because they look at the high claims, now you're in a spot, and now you're very vulnerable to get displaced. So you need to come up with a solution. And I'm not going to give that way. On this podcast, I'm going to encourage you to get into my contact information and schedule a call.

I'll tell you, I'll teach you how.

To get out of that action. Oh, yeah, I'll teach you how to get out of that mess real quick. I've helped over a hundred brokers last year get out of that exact situation. And I'm not just talking about the boutique brokers. We're talking about all the major.

So what you're telling me is if you're. If your back's against the wall and you got a renewal that you can't do anything about finding, find the guy who knows a thing or two about having his back against the wall.

And trust me, this isn't an idea and you won't be a guinea pig. I've helped over 100 brokers get out of this, this very scenario. Not only did they keep the business, they didn't get displaced, but guess what? They ended up casting a larger net over the entire population of employees because again, they only had those 15 people on the plan. Now they have 115 people on a couple different plans.

Yeah, I, I have a feeling you're going to get a lot of emails and potential calls after that comment, because I'm sure there's plenty of people listening to this episode that have been in that position, especially about a month and a half ago when they were dealing with their January 1st.

Absolutely. It's been happening more and more, so it's actually 20 you're gonna see. So. So just to show you, we, we actually grew almost 140 this last year. Okay. Because of what's happening.

Congratulations.

Thank you. That one scenario right there is one of the major reasons why we grew. And it's getting worse in that way, which means our solution is more relevant.

Yep. 100. Let's, let's talk sales mindset here. Wrap the show up with that, because I know you're a huge believer in that and you talk about the, the broker who's got that big renewal increase, and they're, they're kind of stuck and trapped. There's a lot of people out there right now in this industry that I think, you know, I preach sales is 80% mindset. If you were to, you know, think about people on the other end of this microphone right now that are listening in, and I were to ask you, you know, what would be two or three sales tips, mindset tips you would give producers in our industry to help them either be more confident in the conversation with a prospect or just more confident in how they go about prospecting. What, what would those tip?

First and foremost, know your information cold.

I can name 500 carrier reps, okay. From all the carriers you know out there that they're the carrier rep. Right. They should know their own health plans. I've gone to some of these meetings where you'll see a broker in the first or second row ask questions, and you could tell it's rhetorical, and they'll ask questions about that carrier rep's own health plan, and that carrier rep won't even know their own health plan well enough to even answer that question. So baseline, know your information cold, no matter what. Here's the deal, though. Do not learn that information during green time. What's green time? Green times. The hours when you should be prospecting, making those calls, and then carving out a little time to make the follow up calls and make sure you set yourself up for success the next day. Tip number two, plan your week on Sunday night.

Amen, brother.

Sunday night. You plan your week because that gives you time to do a little mini meditation. Because while you're planning your week, you're kind of imagining how things could go. So if you're imagining how things can go, take the power that your mind has and imagine them going, well, it's amazing.

Is that how that happens?

Like, you know, it's so easy for people to start imagining stuff and they imagine the worst. Like, oh, objections like, why are you doing that? You literally have the power to think you just crushed it.

My favorite, Tommy, is when somebody's about to win like a 203 in our life group. Yeah. They're already starting to talk about what happens if we lose it. You haven't even won it yet.

You haven't even won it yet. You know, that was, that's very similar to the conversation we had about folks that are thinking about starting to do their videos on LinkedIn. We talked about that. How quickly they take themselves out where they haven't even pressed record yet in their whole life.

Any other tips?

I would say so let's back up. Know your information cold. Plan your week on Sunday night. And no matter if you're gonna win the deal or not, you always stay transparent. And don't lie. Do not lie to get business ever. It's not worth it. Reputation.

Yep.

Is your commodity. So if you think you have. It's so tempting to lie.

Yep.

And let me talk about other forms of lying. Sprinkling pixie dust on the DE9C to get that thing in the door to meet participation. That's a form of lying too. So, like, I know some people do that. Whatever. I'm not judging you, but if you're asking me what my tips are, the third one is don't lie to win business.

When I'm doing workshops with agencies, one of the first thing we do, the first exercise is help each producer develop their personal brand. And right at the end of the exercise, I ask, you know, if your best clients were talking to your top prospects, what would you want them saying to you? And I make them write down a list of things and then they got to narrow it down to four.

We went through that exercise.

And then after, after they find their four I look at them and I say, that's your judge and your jury. You never go off brand.

That's right.

There's too many people in this industry who are willing to be whoever they have to be to win business, do whatever they have to do to win business. Lie.

Yep.

Never do that.

Never do that. You know, I would say if you want to go tip, let's go with the fourth tip real quick. Take advantage of LinkedIn.

Yeah.

I, I know you're going to agree with this right now. So no one's too good to make some cold calls. But that shouldn't be your only channel.

Correct.

Because the, the system that I run, which I learned from you and you know, I practice it like it's breathing while I'm with you right now. I've actually got some technology that's automated right now that's making connection requests and setting appointments on my calendar. Okay. And I already know that I'm here with you. So guess what? I actually made 10 extra calls before I came here and I'm going to make 10 extra calls before I shut it down today to make sure I make my call goal today. So another tip is develop a system that is a system that you only do income producing activities for in the beginning of the day and every other activity you do better be based on income producing and follow up and customer service. Block out your time. Make it non negotiable. If you're doing outbound call time, put your phone on do not disturb so you don't take incoming calls. Do not look at your email screen over here. Do not have Instagram up on your other second phone that you have your burner phone or whatever you want to call it. But like no matter what, what's going on in that block of time, people make this thing so hard. You know what, you know what's interesting? When I take a little inventory on how hard I used to think I worked before I met you and really got into your system and took what you taught me and almost honed it into my own. I don't know how to say this without sounding like, like I almost think I do a little bit less. But I get way more done, if that makes sense.

100. You're more effective, you're more efficient.

Because I'm doing.

Only you're doing more with less. You're doing. You're getting more done with each activity.

Absolutely. And it's non negotiable.

Well, and the other thing I want people to hear is you said before you got here, knowing you were going to be here. You made 10 calls. You're going to make 10 calls after 10 more. 10 more. Yeah, because I got to make it.

For the time I'm here.

But what I. What I want people to hear is you don't need a sales manager to tell you, Tommy, you must make your calls. It's because you're self accountable.

Yeah. And if you work at an agency, be an intrapreneur, treat it like it's yours. And that way you think. Because it's the mindset.

Yeah. Well, you said there's. You gave away four tips there. I'm gonna say there's a fifth. And you said something back that, you know, in 2008, when you were living out of your car, you were reading the books, crying. You would put your mirror down.

Yeah.

And actually read aloud what you're reading to yourself. Almost. Almost like.

You were trying to become what you were reading. Right. You said offline. There's a little tip, in fact, Joe Earl's in the same room with us right now with C3 that you actually taught Joe when it comes to building sales confidence. Walk us through that a little bit.

Sure. And it's funny. Joe's right here. We had this conversation, and I told Joe, hey, someone might think you're weird for doing this, but if you're in sales, you better be a little weird and not care what anybody thinks. So. So I think what you're asking me to do is tell you how I seduce myself.

Seduce yourself?

Camera. Every single time. It's a little ritual I go through. Okay, so this is for the person out there who hasn't made a video yet because they're scared. This is for the person that the reason why they're scared is because they told themselves they suck. They don't know what to say. Everyone's gonna hate it. Well, let me tell you, first of all, it didn't suck because you didn't make it it. Secondly, everyone's not gonna hate it because no one saw it. And thirdly, who are these people? They're phantoms you made up. In my mind, they don't even exist, though. You haven't even hit record yet. You took yourself out of the game. Right. So you want me to be weird? I'm gonna be weird right now.

By the way, this is the moment you might want to convert over to video if you are, what, listening to the audio.

I'll give you the way I do it every single time. Right now. I'm gonna look at the camera right now. I Stare at the camera a little bit. And I'm talking to that camera, and I'm just saying, you know, you're very easy on the eyes. I feel very, very comfortable with you. In fact, sitting here right now, I feel like I could take every mask off that I've ever worn in a day and just be myself. In fact, I can already feel my breathing coming down. I can already feel my cadence. I'm speaking clearly. And you know what? I think it's time to record this video.

Boom. That was a sales master class in about 20 seconds.

Seriously, like, I don't care how weird someone thinks I am. Go look at how consistent I am on my videos. In four years, I haven't missed a post five days a week. Okay. It's. I'm not tooting my heart. I'm telling you, don't. So this is part of the no excuses world. If you think you're stuck, that's not an excuse.

Yeah.

In fact, if you watch this video, copy what I just did looking at that camera, and guess what? Do it in the privacy of your own home, go ahead and think yourself is weird. Get over it, man. Honestly, get over yourself. It's not because it's not about you anyway. Because when you make that video, are you going to make it about you anyway? No. You're literally trying to reach an audience to let them know that you probably have a solution to their problem.

Yep.

So what is it about you anyway? You just need to get the heebie jeebies out. You need to learn your breathing. And you also need to. You know the book by Dr. Joe Dispenza, Becoming Supernatural? That. That process right there. You want to know how I got that? Through his meditation practice on shutting your eyes. Learning a breathing cadence to where you're. You're generating enough melatonin in your body to where you're almost half asleep, but you're still also half awake because that activates your pineal gland, which transmits you out to that space where there's nowhere, there's nobody in no time, in no space, and you're no one. And you're looking for that image of yourself out in that darkness. And this image is the one you build of this, the best version of yourself. And you start practicing every day to reach that image. And you start learning how to smell like it, walk like it, talk like. What happens? Your brain actually develops new cells. And your brain believes that that's you. And one day, that actually becomes you. And he proves that in that book, Becoming Quantum.

It's quantum physics, right? It is, yeah.

I literally just gave you with that little seduction right there. That's part of the artist seduction. I literally just showed you how to produce enough melatonin to get your breathing down, to get your cadence down, to get you ready.

Well, and you talked about, if you're going to be in sales, gotta be a little weird, like. Yeah, I believe in this because, you know, the re. The. The only. You know how I got good at public speaking is the hours I spent giving a talk. Because one of the things you got to do in your public speaking is look people in the eye. If you're on stage, you got to, like, put, put, put your eyes on certain people, lock in on them, speak to one at a time. You can't just try to speak to an entire room. You know what I used to do for years, I would literally give a keynote talk in my living room, looking my dog in the eyes. Perfect.

Why not? Oh, he thinks you're ready to give him a beef jerky.

I hear that.

Cheese wrapper. But seriously, like, that's an example of what I just did.

Yep.

You know, like, so I could. So if you're the pet owner, act like that camera that you're that. Act like that's your dog. Yep. Right. Seriously, like, whatever you do, stop with the excuses.

Stop with the excuses. Exactly. Well, Tommy, this has been awesome, man. And I know you gotta. You gotta get on the road here so you can avoid traffic, but, you know, for the people who are tuning in, who are just getting a taste for you the first time, I got two last questions. Number one, where can people reach you if they want to get ahold of you, learn more about what you're doing or what Evolved Benefits is doing? So I'm sure we're have people who want to learn more about what you.

You can go on to evolve benefits.com and go to the contact page. Fill that out. That will come directly to me. Or go on to my LinkedIn page and send me a message. My email address is Tommy. T o m n yvolved. Evolved is past tense. Benefits is pluralvolved. Benefits.com direct email me. If you hit the contact tab in my LinkedIn profile, it'll give you everything. My cell phone number, my email address, website, everything.

So there's.

There's actually no excuse why you can't.

Get a hold of me. Well, last question. You know, look at where you are today. Super successful, having a lot of fun in this industry. I want you to go back to the guy sitting in his car in 2008, reading the personal development books. What would you tell that guy today, knowing what you know now and the journey you've been through?

Honestly, I tell that guy, I'm so glad you never gave up, and I'm so glad you never quit.

You know, like.

Yeah, that's good, man. That's good.

A lot of people have no idea what it's like to be homeless like that and feel like a failure. Yeah, Tommy, a lot of people don't know that, but.