2025 Market Forecasts | 7 Figure Annuity Sales Podcast | Ep. 322

Hello, everyone. Welcome to Seven Figure annuity sales. I am Chad Owen, your host with the most, and Caleb with the. I don't. You. You always laugh at that. I. Now I'm starting to feel self conscious. It's like, you don't really think I had the most now I don't even know. I don't know. I mean, think about it. I always had the most. Like, my wife ends up liking these little squeezable applesauce things. Yeah. And she. She. She said the other day, she goes, I'm running out of those. Can I get more of those? And I buy two huge boxes of them. And she goes, that's gonna take me forever. And said, when do I ever just get you the one thing you ask? I'm always gonna go more. And so when we're building our house, people are asking, they're like, should we do the bigger one or the small one? I'm like, what do you think? Always the bigger one. Always the bigger one. So. So, yeah. But now I lack confidence because you don't think I have the most anymore because you always.

Oh, I just was curious what you meant by the most. Like, the most of what?

But if anybody wants to make in the comments section the recommendation for a good therapist in Colorado, I need it because I. I work with Caleb. This is now, what, seven years I've worked with you.

Golly. This will be. Well, I've known you for over 10 years.

Yeah.

I mean, over a decade, but, yeah, working together started in 19. So this will be. This will be my sixth. Sixth anniversary in August this year.

It feels like forever.

Yeah.

If you guys forget how that story went. I. I've always know. Caleb's always like, I want to be a pastor. I want to be a pastor. And mine's in the marketplace or the church. And he's like, oh, the church. And I'm like, nope, you're a marketplace person. The reason why is because he does have a business mind. And I did recognize this when he was working on a ranch and he's in blue jeans. His jeans. Oh, no, there's probably. He was wearing jorts at the time with his boots. And I still recognize, even through the massive, screaming, redneck.

Uneducated, you know, kind of slurring kind of speech, you know, being out in the sun all day. I've timed it in August. I was like, what are you doing, Caleb? I'm building a fence. Oh, that's got to be hot out there. Is it? Oh, yeah, it is. How would you like to come Work in a cool air conditioned office.

And now I get to tease my brother and my dad about it because yeah, you know, it'll be, it'll be June or July or August here in Texas and they're, they're both ranchers and I'll tell them, yeah, it got a little hot in there today. I think the thermostat got up to 72.

And then your brother goes, oh, Woodrow. Yeah. Like, okay, so what's our topic today?

Well, man, it's been, it's been a pretty awesome start to the year. I, I think, I mean you had a awesome week. Couple weeks ago and anyways, I think that's worth talking about. I think our industry trends are worth talking about. One of the super cool things in my opinion is we've had three, three record years in the industry for the last three years in a row. And I haven't seen Q1 data yet, but I would not be surprised in the slightest if 2025 is already off to a potential another record year. In the last three years we've had a new record annually and We've done over $1.1 trillion into annuity products in just the last three years.

That's crazy. And that's going to get. This is without the adoption from. With 401ks and other institutions, could you imagine if they ever truly started at adopt annuities what it would take off to.

And I do that over time. They will.

Yeah, I do agree with you. I do. And don't freak out about that. People, I mean people. Oh no, there's more institutions do it. No, that just means there's more opportunity because they will never be able to compete with the product line we have as individual agents. They just won't.

Well, and look even at pensions. Yeah, people who have pensions, often what they get in pension income for the amount of premium that's there is not, is not as good as what they could get in an annuity with the same amount of premium.

That's true. I tell people that all the time. I say, hey, if you're going to take a pension, always look at the lump sum option versus what they'll actually pay you out. And let's compare. And I've gotten a lot of deals by doing that is just look at the numbers. It's not about anything other than which one. Well, also I take the fact if, if a pension pays, let's just say 1,000 more dollars a year, but it's an immediate annuity and you lose control of it versus an indexed annuity where you could have a death benefit if you pass away prematurely, plus other benefits that come with indexed annuities, then obviously it still can be better, even though the one may pay you a little higher.

Well, I check survivorship on that, too, because if it's paying that much more, you might not have. But 50% survivorship, sometimes 0% survivorship on those.

Yeah. In our joint lifetime payout, how much survivorship do we have, Caleb? 100. 100.

So that's right.

You know, I. Yeah, I do think this year is going to be a record year. I do. I think the market is going to fall. I don't know. 100% for sure. But, you know, when I look, do you hear my dog whimpering?

I do hear your dog.

Yeah. He's flipping his lid out because my wife is.

Barrett, he sounds a little bit like you when you get upset.

You're the one that doesn't have a voice, man. You know what? And this dog could kick your tail.

And if you were right here, I.

Would sic him on you right now.

He's a beast. He's just.

He's. He's just, like, flipping. Well, what happened is my wife took her dog out for a walk, and so he's stuck here with me in the basement. So it's like he's now flipping his lid because he wants to go.

What does he weigh now?

80 over 80 pounds. And he's 10 months old. Yeah. He's not even. He might.

He might be scratching at £100 when he's full grown.

Probably more than that.

You think Over a hundred.

There.

Anybody that's watching the YouTube, they saw you yell and heard nothing.

Yeah, he's like. He's just. I don't usually see him get like that. I can do this. Watch. I can do this here, Foose. And that means come here. And he'll lay down.

And then he teaches his German shepherd's German.

Stein.

Steig. Blythe. There. That's how we teach people how to. To be a good annuity agent. Stein Blythe. They're going, what is going on here? See, as you guys know, we're not polished in these podcasts. We love to have fun, and I bet you have never had an annuity sales training podcast where someone's correcting their German shepherd. I. I bet.

Yeah.

Because they definitely not Chihuahua. Because they don't listen at all.

Oh, gosh, man.

Yeah. But I. I think the market is definitely going to have a rough year because there's a lot of things that have to be corrected. And the amazing thing that blows me away is you have all these people flipping out on the cutting and the savings. When it's going to hit our pocketbooks, it's going to help us. But you have these companies literally that are going to be losing some of these billions of dollars because they're going, why do you. A place In San Antonio, $18 billion to build this facility, $16 billion a year to manage it. And guess how many people were there? 0. 0. It was an overflow in case there were too many illegals. There was an overflow for a place that has never been used. That's crazy if you think about that. All these companies now that are getting exposed for wasteful money is now it's going to hit their bottom line. And so you have to have a market correction. Plus, we all know that companies are way overvalued right now. If you look at PE ratios, they're way high. We know this. So in this type of arena, for us, this is phenomenal. This is like perfect situation because people run to us for safety and security. Yeah. And it goes back to the two questions. Nobody can answer it. I say this all the time. How long are you going to live for? And where's the stock market going to be tomorrow, let alone five or 10 years from now, 20 years from now? You can't do that. We have the only product that will give you that peace of mind during a crazy market. So that being said, this is the time we start to thrive and the time we start to do really well is when people are worried or concerned. Now we don't feed on that. I have to preface that you don't use it as a fear mongering to get people to buy your annuity. We are hope. We're about hope, safety and security. That's what we're about. Do not start to get a point. Oh, you could wake up and the market's down tomorrow, could drop 50%. You know, that's not a good tactic that, that creates fear. And nobody ever do does good in a do is good. No, no we ever do is good in it.

You're still in the German.

Yeah, doesn't do do good. But nobody ever does good when you're trying to sell from a fear standpoint. Always safety and security.

Yeah, that's good stuff. And you know, if the market does correct at any point this year, if we can keep interest rates pretty good, it's going to make, it's going to make a transition for people into annuity products. Extremely Attractive.

And then anybody that's had already over the last year or two that's purchased an annuity product with these really great rates we've had when we do have that market correction and we're staying flat, but now the market's got a new floor and we're able to participate in that recovery with these awesome rates. We could see some really, really cool interest crediting going on in these policies over the next year or two.

You know that was interesting that that Ocean View annuity you just sent me the Safe Harbor. That was an interesting product that just for straight accumulation. It's phenomenal how high that first year rate is in the fixed. And we know it's going to drop in lower but that it looks like the cap rate should stay pretty close to that. We hope so.

What's cool about that design is that that fixed rate almost acts like a little bit of a bonus in that first year. But it's not actually a bonus because the way a bonus works, you get the bonus and then you still pick your index allocations. Yeah, well, because they're giving you the bonus in year one and you can still get some interest crediting, they reduce the rates on the indexes. So if you've got, if you go get a product that's got a 10 or a 12% bonus, you're probably going to see a six to a six and a half percent cap rate on the S&P 500. That that's going to. Your indexes are going to be lower rates as a result of getting that bonus. This fixed rate, if you get it, you have to allocate to it. So you're not getting that rate plus extra but you're guaranteeing that currently nine and a quarter percent interest for one year. But because again it's not a bonus, it doesn't reduce the index rates. So in subsequent years you still have really, really nice rates. Obviously there will be renewals. We might see some fluctuation there, but it shouldn't be much fluctuation at all. And we're getting those higher rates because it's still not technically a bonus product even though the fixed rate kind of operates like one.

I have a love hate.

It is a cool product.

It is. I have a love hate relationship right now with the market and with the annuity companies. The thing I love is the stability. The thing I hate with annuity companies. But the thing I hate is now it's no longer like that Equitrust Market 10 Market 7. That was pretty good. Whether you did index or you did income, that's really good. But now all. Everything's changed. If I have a client this age, I'm using a different company, different product. If I have another client that age, I have to use a different company, different product. I mean, I am now bouncing all over the place with companies. And that, that is very. It definitely takes more of my time. And as you have found out the past few days, it takes more of your time, too, because you and I are now trying to figure out. Because it's not just me trying to figure this out. This is you and me trying to figure out so we can help our agents.

Right.

And you and I are constantly bouncing back on the products. Does this product really do what it says it's going to do? What is the index strategy, truly? What's the rate integrity on this company? How long have they been around? You know, because you may help a lot of agents, you know, as, as the head of the whole marketing thing, virtually a lot of our company, but I'm talking to a lot of people on LinkedIn and Facebook, you know, agents that reach out to me. And I got to make sure, you know, we're. We're giving the right information about these products because it is no longer. I at least prove me wrong. But it's so. Especially when you're talking income, it's all over the place which company is the best.

There's a lot of parity in the products right now.

Yeah.

I mean, you change a deferral by two years, you change the difference in the spouse's age by three years. You know, things like that. And all of a sudden, what was showing up at the top for one situation is now fifth, seventh, eighth on the list. Yeah.

I mean, I saw one the other day. We changed it by five years, and it went from the number two product down to. It wasn't even the top 20 anymore. Yeah. And I'm like, what is going on? It's so I. I mean, if you can learn anything on this podcast, it's literally remembering. Never take for granted that your product that was. Is still the best. You know, you, you've got to constantly check, make sure. Because this market volatility can be a phenomenal opportunity for us to have a great, great year. But when you're just. I'm. I mean, these, these institutional product pushers drive me nuts because it's like, same product, same product. Don't tell me that. That. And I know some of these agents, they have written the same company, same product, or same type of product. From the company for 10 years. And it's just because they're number one, they're lazy. They don't want to study different products. Well, let me rephrase that. Some, some institutional sellers, that's all they're allowed to do. So they're still giving them the best product that they have available. It's just not the best product out there. So I don't want to say they're automatically lazy because if they're being honorable and they're doing what they're supposed to be doing, they have to do what their, their upline tells them or their, their boss tells them to do. But as an independent agent, there's no excuse to know, not know which company is the best out there for each person's situation. I mean, annuity rate watches is actually when he first got us like, dang, this is pretty intensive. But I think I've finally got it figured out to where most of the time, you know, except that one time, it was a couple days ago, I had enhanced benefits, click, clicked on it. And this other company didn't have enhanced benefits till the fourth year. So it made it, it didn't even show up when in reality it still had the best income, it just didn't have a benefit on it until the fourth year. So, you know, you, you just have to know these products inside and out and this is where you can hold yourself accountable to that. Because you know what? Nobody can come behind me and say they have a better product because I know who's the best. But if you go to someone's house and you find out, you know, you do this five hundred thousand dollar deal and somebody comes behind you, AKA me, and I find out that the one you said is not the best, I'll just tell them. So. Yeah, yep, you got, you gotta, you gotta know this. It's no as of right now because I have people ask this all the time on LinkedIn and Facebook. They say, what's the best company out there?

Okay, what's the situation? This is where you come into play, I think very, very well. Because if I'm writing 30 plus 35 million a year in annuities and I'm still counting on you sometimes to get the right product information out, especially when there's a new one. This is why having a good marketer is so important. And Caleb doesn't do anything during the day anyway. He just sits around on his couch eating bon bons and drinking whiskey. That's kind of all he does. He actually drops the bon bon in the whiskey that's working like you always.

Makes me thirsty.

And it's the water will not help that will. It has to be a little stronger, so. Well, this is awesome. Well, this is a good episode. If you guys need anything, reach out to Caleb. And we have a lot of great companies, great products, so I hope this helps you and have a great day. Happy selling.