Chad Doing Virtual Appointments!? | 7 Figure Annuity Sales Podcast | Ep. 294

Yes, the face to face guy, Chad Owen himself is in fact doing virtual appointments now. It's hilarious to me, but it's so true. I mean, historically, Chad, you have been all face to face and now you're doing about 50, 50 split between virtual and face to face. And I'll tell you the numbers, back it up. But I'm curious, what are your, what are you just right off the bat thoughts on the matter?

I'm ashamed and embarrassed and, you know, I can't believe I went to the dark side. I don't know what's going on there, but it, it is true. It is true. And actually I've had a lot of fun doing it because I've had shorter days, the more shorter days than I have in, in the past. I mean, I can't even think about when the last time I had multiple 7 o' clock appointments or being not getting home till 10 o' clock at night. It just hardly ever happens anymore. And that's because if I do of course have to have a appointment later, I'll do it where it's, where it's face to face. But I mean, even if I have a virtual appointment at my home office, I'm done at seven o'. Clock, right. I'm actually enjoying dinner with my family and stuff. It's just I, I think I'm kind of turning, I think slowly but surely now. I still love face to face appointments and I still love meeting people in their homes. I mean, I went to a client's home the other day and, and the home was filled. Basically their whole retirement is she. They have this big area. It's probably, I don't know, I'd say probably 35 foot by 20 foot. And they added onto their house and she does a whole bunch of crafts and things like that. Like she's just all sorts of antiques, beautiful things he works on. He makes pens, fly rods, you know, things like that. He makes flies. And that's literally their retirement. And when I looked at that, I was just so blown away by the skill set of these two. And they choose to be right by each other, side by side, one on the one side of their room, the other on the other side of the room. And you can tell they just, that's what they love doing during retirement. And it's such a joy to see that. That's something I got to see face to face. As a matter of fact, I even bought my wife a pen because I was just like, this is beautiful. And so that's things you get Face to face that you will never get virtually. But virtually, there's also people right now, I talked to this guy virtually the other day, say, hey, I could come out there and meet you. He goes, no, we don't need to do that. If I like it and it makes sense, we'll just do everything.

Over the Zoom. And he only lives about 35 minutes from me. And so for a former Texas person under 35 minutes, that's like, you know, so. So, yeah, gold right there. Oh, yeah. Anything under two hours for a Texan is like, no big deal. Just making a quick trip, you know. Now granted, we can go 85. Actually, I'll take that back here. I'm telling you, people stinking drive faster here than I've seen anywhere. And I mean, Colorado, they're nuts. I was literally going 92 miles an hour on the freeway because I was in my wife's aviator and that thing just glides. I didn't. She goes, do you know you're going 92 miles an hour? I'm like, not at all. I was just following the guy in front of me and I'm still being passed.

So, yeah, virtual, it's pretty, pretty amazing. It does help, though, that the leads, you know, we've been targeting, you know, with retirement realized financial, right now we target leads that literally are a lot easier to. To get and a lot cheaper to get.

Right.

And the quality has not been compromised. And that does allow me to do more virtual appointments. So, yeah, Yeah, I feel like I should. Like, I am your father, you know.

You know, the whole Darth Vader thing, you know, But I'm actually, I'm. I'm really liking it. Like, we're going through some pretty tough times right now in our family. Um, you know, and I'm, I'm pretty raw with people, you know, people. I don't hide things. But literally today, my wife is actually at her dad's long term care facility, which was moved to hospice, and they just gave him like 24 to 48 hours to live. And I literally am sitting there going, you know, what if I was out running appointments and stuff and I was an hour and a half away and something bad happened, you know, I could, I. I would be an hour and a half to two hours away here. I mean, I could just go, okay, you know, whoever I have a Zoom call with, hey, I'm sorry, I need to reschedule. And it's not like somebody was sitting around waiting for me necessarily. It's a lot more flexible. And even, even sending A zoom link and somebody can go, hey, I need to reschedule. And they just click on the link to reschedule and it pulls up your calendar of what you have available. And so I think we really as agents and I cannot believe I'm saying this, it's like, you know in the Bible where I think it was Isaiah takes the scroll and he puts it in a Su. Then it's bitter, it turned bitter. That's how I feel right now.

Saying some sweet things, but it's still kind of bitter. But you know these another lead system I'm working with right now and I'm not releasing it yet. Number one, you can't get it unless you're part of retirement realized financial. But I'm testing out a lead system right now and I'll let you know if it works. But they literally schedule the call with me. In other words, they have to click on my link and they schedule the call with me. I'm like, what would it be like if I didn't have to make calls anymore? Outgoing calls. In other words, they're saying, hey, I need a call, I'm ready at this time. And supposedly they have a 15 to 20% no show rate which if you're just making a call and it's a half an hour block, you just take one day, which is normally my Mondays and my Fridays you're making calls and scheduled anyway. If you miss a half an hour, there's a big difference than driving to appointment that you're blocking three and a half to four hours out for.

Yeah.

So yeah, yeah.

I, I don't just truth be told, jet in your, in your processes. I don't think it's crazy to. This is going to sound crazy numerically, but I don't think it's that crazy. I don't think we're far off from you writing 30 to 35 million a year in 30 to 35 hours a week and then the remainder of the week being able to be training in retirement realized financial and all that kind of stuff.

I agree with that. I actually agree with that. I mean I have. The problem is right now is we're still, you know, there's a lot of things I've been working on. I just worked on a full blown stress and rocking chairs presentation which I did it for the first time last week. I'm telling you, it, I think it went really, really well. I think it went really, really well. And so it's, it's kind of cool because it's a way, it's not like the seminar where you, you sound like you're rehearsed or.

Salesy. It's just education. And you know, I think if we can get to that in the industry, I think we've kind of really made a big difference now. Wait till we actually get the webcams and then we have a hologram as well. And then I'll literally be standing right there talking to them and we can have a face to face interaction. So.

Yeah. Well, I've got some numbers for you regarding the virtual side of things. And it, it's funny because since COVID okay, you go back to 2020 and it kind of forced people's hands to some degree. They start doing the virtual side of things. We were telling agents, hey, listen, you're going to have a lower sit rate and you're going to have a lower average case size. And that's just going to be kind of the nature of doing things virtually. And you might, if you have more opportunities, you get to run more appointments. Great. You might end up actually writing more business. That's okay. But just recognize like what you could write with those leads face to face versus what you probably will write. Doing things virtually is going to be a little bit less on the virtual side. Well, when I look at the numbers, it reflects that sentiment almost perfectly. You have a slightly lower sit rate virtually and you've got a smaller average case size.

Yeah. What is just a little over 300,000 right now, correct? Yeah. And part of that though is. And I will say part of that though is I've just, I've gotten some very low cases, like a lot of just small ones. That is not usual. And part of those are people that maybe reach back out. Yeah, I got 50,000 I want to move. And that's not that common to where you see those small, that many small ones coming in. And I also have not had many really big ones this year. And it's just. It does. That does. I, I truly. And I, I think big cases are a lot harder to get virtually than you would be face to face. As a matter of fact, I have a lady that we're looking at 660 some thousand and it's, it was virtual and I had it like I've wrote written application. But then her daughter's like, well, well, he doesn't even live by you. She still wants to do it, but now I need to reset up another zoom. I had to send her all the physical information. I sent a copy of my book and illustration for her daughter. And then we're all going to do a zoom together. But if I was face to face, that would have been a done deal, 100%.

Right.

So there are some downsides to it, too.

Well, there are. And, and. But on the other side of that coin, those cases that are a little bit smaller in. In just size, doing things virtually, you might end up being able to maintain the same profitability margin again.

Sure.

Guys, hear my. Hear my heart. And I hope you already know our heart. We are not commission chasers. But you still have to. You still have to make a living doing it. You still have to be able to actually afford the time to do it. And if you were going to write a $50,000 annuity and you had to drive three hours away twice or three times to do it, it's like, even.

If it's an hour away, the appointment's two hours, then it's an hour back, that's four hours.

Yep.

So, exactly.

Yeah, you're right, exactly. So even though they might. There might be a smaller average case size because of the efficiency of the virtual as opposed to the drive time added on top of the face to face, you could end up working out similar or better margins. And the other thing to consider, too, is a lot of. If you have repeat clients adding more premium or, you know, a new client or the same client that you already had once, but they've got another small chunk that they're putting a lot of that's counted on the virtual side, so that skews it a little bit as well. But one thing that I found extremely interesting is that you actually had a higher application rate, so slightly lower sit rate, slightly lower case size. But the percentage of people that end up converting from an appointment into a deal is actually higher, virtually. I think it's maybe just because they can't see you as clearly. Your face is a little bit more.

Really? Really? I'm supposed to tease you that way? You're not supposed to tease. Honor your elders, man. Yeah, half this gray hair on my head is from you. So let's. Let's respect this crown of wisdom. Okay.

I've known you almost a decade and a half.

I can tell you that easy.

It is.

Yeah.

Your hair was.

That means you were just born, like, you know, pretty much.

You were.

You were an ugly baby.

Oh, somebody's got to be somebody's.

I don't know. There's very rarely. When babies first come out, they are rarely cute.

Like, it's pretty much any. Any little creature.

Yeah, well, because they're still about A.

Week or so and they start getting cute.

Yeah, they've got, they've got to get out of the crunch factor, man. But anyway, yeah.

Are there any, any things. Just real quick before we wrap this one up, Anything that you've picked up on already on the virtual side that you say these are absolute necessities. If you're going to be doing things.

Virtually, oh, 100%, you have to be knowledgeable, you have to have a smooth flow. You can't be. Well, you've got to be confident in what you're saying, hands down. I mean, I can tell you from a huge amount of experience and this is face to face. But virtual is even more. Because you have got to be knowledgeable in your products. Because you know what, if you have. And here's the other thing you have to remember too, this world starts to go virtual, they're going to be meeting with more, more agents, you know, face to face. They may not, you know, I don't want that many people in my house virtual. Like, I got a half an hour, 45 minutes to kill. I'll listen to another person. So I your refinement of the process and I'm go, go back to it. You know, sign up for Annuity Architects. It's our entire process from beginning in. And we have Jesse Black, the king of virtual. I mean the guy, the guy we talked about that did 1.3 million, I think in about a month. That was a brand new agent under Jesse's mentorship. And then he has this other guy, Stephen, which, you know, I'm not going to teach David yet because I don't know him well enough yet. I wanted to, I wanted to preach it like Stephen was, was Jesse's Caleb, but I can't do that yet because I don't know Stephen that well. But I'm sure he's got a good, good personality. But Stephen, what he do 7 million or something? 8 million in, in his first four years.

Second year, I think it was his first, his first full year. So it was his second, second year. But the first full one, I believe was the way that shook out. Yeah.

And then Jesse, I, and I mean this with all my heart, I actually think Jesse has a chance to give me a run for my money. I really do.

And total production.

Oh, total production. No, just his like, not well.

Right, that's what I'm saying. But just like total production.

Yeah. Over the years, Jesse has, has a chance. His, the way he's mastered the virtual appointment, literally when I was creating my virtual presentation Stress and rocking chairs. I started, I haven't done it yet, but I started thinking about how can I add this to my virtual presentation. And one of them is his analogy with Mount Everest, you know, and I mean, if you want that, you're going to have to pay. But, you know, he's just got, I'm telling you, when he explains Mount Everest. And then of course, you know, my brain gets going and I start using examples and of the ascent up and, you know, start adding to it. And when him and I got going on that thought process, it was really cool. It was really cool. So, you know, Jesse Black is a master at the virtual. And, and I attribute all of our success in our business is going to be, you know, me and him coming together, you, Josh, you know, we're literally all kind of figuring out because of course, Josh is always trying to figure out, okay, what's the best way to try and get the business side of this going? And you're going, okay, we got to the case design and all the product knowledge going and the training and so, and Jesse's got all the marketing. And then myself, I'm just gonna sit in a palm tree and sip my ties and retire.

Josh and I have, have said for, for months, our goal is to retire Chad.

I know, and I don't know if I should take that as a compliment or an insult. I'm just like, I'm going, okay. They either really want me to stop working the way I've been working, which, in all seriousness, you guys have been very genuine about. Chad, you need to take it easy, man. I mean, 70 hours a week is not necessarily healthy. And I, and I agree with that. I do agree with that. And now that we have stinking three incredible guys, I mean, in all seriousness, you know, Caleb, you're, I've said this many times. You're, you're one of the top case designers I've ever seen in my entire life. Josh is incredible business. Jesse is phenomenal at, you know, his virtual and his marketing and his sales. I mean, just so many now I feel like for the first time, honestly, I can, I can kind of see that. I could see that in five years if I wanted to. I don't see if I ever could because the passion to help others, like we just went to a marriage conference or non marriage conference. It was only a small group. John, Lisa Bevere, they invited out these, these group. I think there's nine couples. And they paid for all the hotel everything. Every, all that is a resort was in a hotel. It was beautiful. And their sole goal was to help leaders have healthy marriages. And I've been married for 31 years, and I have what I consider a dream marriage. I really do. My wife is incredible. She's just the sweetest thing ever. Both of us have flaws. But even through that, though, I still. There's multiple things of going, yeah, I could do better at this. I could do better. I could do better at this. And, you know, there's so many things I look at and, you know, in our. In our growth side of things. And I know I'm getting a little off track here, but from the virtual side of things. But I want to share this with people that listen to our podcast. An overnight success, or, excuse me, a public success and a private failure is an overall failure. If you have money, but money has you, it's a messed up situation. If you value money over relationships, it's a messed up situation. So it's. It's important to understand that everything we are training and trying to teach you is to create legacy. Whether that's legacy, a living legacy where you're able to take your kids, your wife, your. Your spouse, whatever, on family vacations, whether you're able to buy kind of the dream things that you've just always wanted to do. When I'm saying dream things, I'm not. I'm talking about like, your favorite gun. I'm talking about like, you know, a purse someone's always wanted, you know, for you, Caleb, you've always wanted that over the shoulder purse that, the pink one that you really.

Oh, yeah.

I was matched with a cowboy hat. Yeah.

Oh, man.

But you know, when. When you look at that, it's about creating lifestyle. And I'll tell you what, virtually, I actually kind of see that as helping with.

Sure.

Being able to have some more family time, which is very important to me. Absolutely. I hope that helps you guys. And of course, as always, happy selling.

Sam.