How to Build Trust with Clients when Selling Annuities | 7 Figure Annuity Sales Podcast | Ep. 248

One of the things I've had to overcome over the years is the word annuity. It used to be a bad word.

Yeah.

And now it's not anymore. But you still find agents hiding behind. I don't want to tell them in its annuity.

Oh, my goodness.

I lead with that now, so. And as you could tell, I mean, it works pretty well for me.

I mean, it hasn't slowed you down.

If you haven't followed me for a while. I mean, I just. In the past few weeks, I've written five, six, seven million dollars. It works. Using the word annuity works. And when they say, well, it sounds like some sort of annuity. Well, absolutely, it is. Would you rather have that or would you rather. Yeah, yeah, this is an annuity. No, yeah, this is. It's the greatest product out there. But let me tell you, there's nine different types of annuities. I only use two of them. And so it's important that we structure this. Right? So I'm Chad Owen. I'm the host of the show. This is Caleb North. He's my sidekick. He is the best case designer, always in the top 1,000. I mean, I know 900. So you're in the top 1,000.

That escalated quickly.

I would say top three. I would. And actually, I would say you're probably getting neck and neck with a couple of those. You might take that number two spot in my eyes.

Me, a couple years here. I'll.

I'm hoping it doesn't take you a couple years.

Couple years to beat guys that have been doing this thing.

What, you waiting for them to retire? I mean, yeah, I'll be the top one once these other two people retire. So. Yeah. But let's go back to what we were originally talking about.

Yeah. Trust.

Do not hide behind or get worried when someone says the word annuity. I love annuities. No, I'd rather not die and go to hell than sell an annuity. That's someone else that you might hear from time to time. And so, yes. You know what, man? When people are stupid out there and they say stupid things, what is it? What a. Stupid things get stupid prizes, right?

Yeah, there you go. And so when you do stupid things or say that, it's just. It's idiotic. It's like, I don't hate stocks. I don't hate bonds. I don't hate mutual funds.

Right.

I do hate when somebody uses those to try and provide guaranteed income for life. But there is nothing. Nothing. Find me challenge right now. Anybody? Challenge. Find me anything. Else out there that has safety, security, guaranteed income you can never outlive with no risk to the market. Find me anything.

Right?

I've never been able to do it and I've never had anybody been able to find me something. Well, I got a rental property. What happens when the government says, you know what, you don't have to pay? Rent, landlord, you still have to pay everything, right. You. You don't have to pay or you know something as simple as they just can't afford anymore, they lose their job or they, they decide you to leave and you don't have someone coming in. Rentals don't do that. Oil royalties, they don't do that.

Dividend stocks.

Dividend stocks. Oh, yeah. Let's talk about GE. You know, I mean, it used to pay what, 12 cents a share? Now it's down to penny. And if you talk to almost any broker, I never would have put clients in GE 10 years ago. Lie.

That was the hot thing.

Oh my gosh, it was the hot thing. And it's like, you know, the reality is everybody can look back and say they never would have when they really did.

Right.

And I would love to have access to the book of brokers who have made the implications of what their stocks, bonds and mutual funds could do versus what they really did.

Sure.

Now balance. I'd also love to do that with annuity agents too.

That's true.

And life insurance. Iuls. Oh, this is average 17%. No, it hasn't. I mean, even these index strategies are out right now. Don't be quoting these as gospel. I focus on the guarantee. This is the worst case scenario. The index is if you get something great. This is what it could do. But focus on the guarantee. And the reason why annuities have had the bad name or bad implication is number one, the types of annuities that used to be out there. But number two, it's how agents even today represent them.

Right.

And so yeah, there's my rant.

Yeah, that's good. I want to go back to something you talked about.

I kind of like that you weren't talking for a while. So I'm just going to keep going.

Just taking it in.

Yeah. You know what? There is a team Caleb and there's a team Chad and we're clearly having that right now. We've had some funny emails and no, I'm not dropping dead. Just so you know, I know who you are that said that it's okay, I'm not going anywhere. Yeah, but. And yes, that mustache did take him 27 years to build. So, yeah, okay. But that's a whole inside thing from our agents.

Yes, it is. You mentioned not being afraid to say the word annuity. And I've had, I mean, handfuls of conversations with handfuls of different agents about this topic because they're concerned that if they use the word annuity, they're going to lose a client right out of the gate. And here's why. It's actually the opposite.

Well, actually, if you think that you will.

Well, yes, because you're probably not going to handle the objection the right way and you're not going to explain things the right way, and you're going to end up losing them. But if you talk about annuities on the front end and they come back with, well, I don't like annuities, wonderful. This is a perfect scenario because now you have an opportunity to help recreate a perception that's actually based on fact. If you ask them, why don't you like annuities? Why do you hate annuities?

They have high fees, Caleb.

Right? Yeah.

That's a variable annuity, Caleb. If you die a couple of years later, the money's gone. No, that's an immediate annuity. There's nine different types. Which one are we going to be talking about? And I said this in the beginning. We have two that we use. Why? Because those are the best.

So don't be afraid to talk about annuities. Because if you're afraid to talk about annuities on the front end, there is no chance.

You.

You cannot. There's not a chance that you can sell the annuity and get it through the application process, through the initial review, through suitability, money transferred, policy issued, pass the free look without them realizing that it's an annuity. So don't even attempt to get to the application.

That's a good. Without talking about it being you hand the application out. Why are you covering that up? Don't worry about it, bro. You know, just fill out, sign on the dotted line. What's that brochure say? Nothing. Just, you know, don't worry. Well, a lot of them don't leave brochures. So, I mean, that's, you know, good point.

But it has to come. It's going to come out at some point. And if you actually have a client that is, for whatever reason they think they don't like annuities, and you're afraid of addressing it being an annuity because you think they might not like annuities, you're kicking that down the road. And by you kicking it down the road, you're giving them ammo. To think that maybe you're embarrassed about what you're selling and maybe you don't like annuities, too. Yeah.

You're deceptive. I mean, you know what I mean? That's why I walk into a car lot or truck lot, and if I see Chevy or gmc, I'm like, I don't want that. But what if it didn't have an emblem you. And then I'm driving around and I bought it, and then I open up the glove box and I see a Chevy emblem or gmc, I'm going to be like, what's going on here? I'm going to lose my mind.

You're going to be like, this is crazy. This is the best truck I've ever driven. All this time I've been hating on these trucks, and it's just the greatest.

Teeny, tiny little wheel wells. But that's a whole nother thing. You've got to be open and honest up front. Nobody likes. I think the term is called hoodwinked or something. It's like where you. You think you're getting something, you find out that's not the case. That is the worst thing to ever do to a client.

Right.

I mean, you've got to be upfront. This is what it is. I'm proud that I'm an annuity person.

Yeah.

I mean, it used to be the joke as an insurance salesperson tries to sell everybody. And it's true, because you have institutions out there that the first way they train you how to do annuities or life insurance is you call up every family member and you screw them over and then figure out why you put them in the wrong product later.

Right.

You know, and that's why. Why wouldn't you get a bad perception? You know, and so that's why it's so important that you're an expert in talking about an annuity. In the last episode, we talked about purpose. Well, here's your purpose. Here's why I chose this product. And I go back to the thing I said. It's the only product I know of that can do what it does without any market risk. And no matter how long you live, you cannot run out of income.

Right.

It's the only thing.

Right.

So when I look at that scenario, I am very honored to be in this industry. Like I said, I'm not a hater of stocks, bonds, mutual funds. I own them. But the point is, is what is the purpose of the Money. And don't hide behind the solution to the purpose. Because if you have the purpose of the money out there, but you're afraid or are ashamed or embarrassed of the solution. I mean, I think of weight loss, Right. You know what, you're fat, you're overweight. I was told that as 262 pounds. He said, you fat, you always be fat. That's why you have heart problems. The solution is when I get in front of some something, I have to literally count calories or not necessarily count calories, but I've got to realize I need to get out and exercise. Well, when I was overweight and I got out and exercised, that's embarrassing.

Sure.

You know, but I had, I had this kind of shame to that. And I think often people that sell annuities or they are trying to get into the annuity business, they have that shame about saying, I'm an annuity salesperson. My mentor flat out said that. What was his title? I am an annuity salesperson. That's what they said. Yeah, yeah.

Don't hide. Just be what you are and tell them what you do and what you use. And if they have incorrect perceptions, have the expertise to be able to set it straight and have the confidence to actually have that conversation with them. I think that's a whole nother conversation in and of itself of agents that don't want to actually contradict or challenge or oppose a client or the mentality or the perceptions or the ideas they have because they think, oh, I'm going to just push them away. It's like, no, if they're wrong, you need to be able to correct that. Correct it gently. Sure. Until, you know, Chad, unless there are times it's a little bit more direct.

I flat out told, well, this annuity has high fees. No, it doesn't.

Right.

Well, I heard they're like three and a half percent. No. This is once again why I go back into why I don't like fees on indices. I just think it's foolish.

Right.

But yeah, another thing, another topic for another conversation.

If you think about trust as the ability to influence someone on the sheer basis of your character, your knowledge or your expertise, think about those three things. Character, knowledge, expertise. Okay.

What's the more important, the most important out of those?

I would say character.

100%.

Yeah.

Because there's a lot of people that are experts that are idiots.

Well.

And if you have good character, if they don't have good character, I mean, you think about Bernie Madoff, that guy. I'm sure was pretty smart.

Oh, yeah, he had the knowledge.

He had the knowledge and he had the expertise, but he did not have the character.

Yep, that's exactly right. You do a great job of developing their trust in all of those areas. Um, I think about just practically in your process. Right. To develop trust. One of the things that you do, and I don't even think it's a conscious thing, you tell people exactly what the next thing is, you know, so what I do and you explain exactly what you do. And then when you go meet with them, you do exactly what you described.

And I think the kiss of death too is what I would like to do is I'd like to come out and if it's okay, I'd like to find out a little bit of information. And if that's okay, then I'll tell you about how it works. No, no, what I do is I come out there and meet with you, I explain how the products work. I bring you my kit, my book. I go over everything and depend on the product. I leave, I leave you the product brochures and illustrations. That way you could do your research and your own due diligence. That's the same thing I say every single time.

Yeah, yeah, that's a good little freebie there. If y' all need to pause or re rewind that.

Yes. Because I'm not saying anything. Rewind.

Yeah, that's like, what the heck. No, that's a throwback there.

That's a term I would use. That's a, that's a kind rewind. What's that from?

I don't know.

Be kind rewind. There's people right now yelling at the screen. Yeah, I don't know. Blockbuster.

I've went to like a Blockbuster ever.

Ah, dude, you're way too young. Yeah, yeah. They would tell you when you rented a movie, be kind rewind. Because you go to want to watch the movie and you get the tape and somebody didn't rewind.

Yeah. And then you have to sit there and oh, that's frustrating.

Yeah, it would be frustrating because then you hope when you hit rewind, you hope it rewinds and doesn't get eaten up because then you already went there. Then you'd have to go back to Blockbuster. Yeah. Wow.

Classics.

Us old people. Woo hoo. We rule. Be kind rewind. Okay.

It's the gray team.

Yeah. The gray team rules the world. My wife has gray hair. We rule the world. We do. Okay, go.

So you can build, you can build that trust in character by telling them exactly what you do and then doing it. Right. Just keep your word. If you tell them it's going to be something, make sure it's going to be that. If you tell them it's going to take a certain amount of time. Make sure it takes that amount of time.

Yeah, there's a big trust thing. Yeah, yeah, I tell them I take 35 to 40 minutes to explain everything. The rest depends on how many questions you have for me. I assure you in 35 to 40 minutes I have explained everything. And it's often way before that. Right. I mean, I could probably do full fact finder explanation of how the product works in 20 minutes. Very effective. Depending on the client and depending on the age and how they're responding, sometimes I have to slow it down a lot. And it's not because they're illiterate or they're just, they don't get. It's because the age, the hearing, you know, whatever. I just have to be more deliberate, more pronunciated and. Oh, I'm glad I said that word right. Pronunciated.

That'd be an ironic word pronounced wrong.

Pronounced it on. Yeah, pronunciated. So, you know, it's very important to not be in a rush to get to that. I told you, 35 minutes. But when you have a routine, a system and a process, I know for a fact I can get it done in that time on any shadow of a doubt.

Yeah, absolutely. So just do, do what you say you're going to do.

Why would they trust you as an annuity person if you're not going to, if you're not going to live up to the word you said you were going to do, then they are automatically going to tie that back to the annuity.

Right?

That's true. And people know, man, they got this like little sixth sense when something doesn't feel right or you're hiding something. And that's why we're hitting this so hard. Because if you're hiding the fact that you don't like annuities, I, I've, I actually, I had an agent, we talked about this a few episodes ago. This guy was such a stinking dodo, he's like going, I don't care what the annuity is. I'll sell a bad product if you just get me the leads. I'm like, you just lost any chance of ever working with me ever. I don't care if you had to come to Jesus moment, you are not working with me again. Because that fact you said right there that you're willing to misrepresent our products and get something that's not the best for them just so you could get leads. We're done. And it's people like that that cause the mistrust in our industry.

So, yeah, you're absolutely right.

I'm fired up and I haven't even had an energy drink since 7 o' clock in the morning.

When you look at knowledge and expertise, a lot of times they're kind of synonymous terms. Right. You have knowledge and you have expertise. I think of expertise in our industry as kind of like wisdom. It's like knowledge applied.

Right.

It's like, you know what to do, how to do it. But then it's like, actually a lot.

Of people that are knowledgeable, but they're not experts because they don't know how to communicate.

Sure. So it's like the mixture of being able to educate.

Yeah. Because you can have all that knowledge, but if you can't give it to a client in a way that they can relate, expertise means nothing.

Right.

So I think being expertise would be someone who is able to communicate how to do, like Elon Musk. I like listening to him talk because even though the dude is crazy smart, he explains things in a way, depending on the base he's talking to in a way they can understand.

Right.

You know mine, you know what fuel ignites, rocket goes up, we have little thrusters that keep it from going from side to side. Or if he's given a meeting with engineers and aerospace engineers, he's going to talk in a totally different language. I appreciate that.

Right. He speaks to the level of his audience and helps them understand what it is that he's communicating. Yes.

And that, to me, is an expert.

Yep. Yeah. So the ability to take something that could be perceived as complex and communicated in an effective way, for it to be communicated in an effective way, ultimately what it is is that the message you're intending to send is received the way you intended it to be received.

Yeah. Have you ever talked to someone that's super smart and they explain a way where you feel more confused is something so simple and they make it so complicated that you feel like an idiot and you don't understand what anything. Now you actually had an idea when you first met with them what you were going to do, and by the time you're done, you're going, yeah, I can't do that anymore. I want my clients to know that they are now an expert. Now we're not talking an expert. Like, you know what? I could Go up to a pilot and they could explain to me what every little button does. But we get up and hit a windshield or something, I'm not going to know what I'm doing there. An expert is also someone that can handle situations during turbulent times. To me, an expert is someone that can also, you know, they're pretty steady, level headed, no matter what's going on. I had someone tell, you know, this good friend of mine, they said your name came up a few times this last week from multiple people. And I said, well, what was the topic? And they said, who would it. I can't remember, but it was multiple times during the week. But it came up, if there was a crisis situation, who would you want around? And they said, chad. I'm like, well, that's why. And they go, because whether it's super crazy or it's calm, you have the same demeanor.

Right.

And it's true. I mean, if I run into a client situation and they are 78 years old and it is the most complicated situation I've ever seen, I'm not going to be frazzled. I'm going to figure it out and make it work. If I walk in a client situation and they have more than enough money to retire and more than income, I'm not going to be frazzled. I'm going to be the same.

Yeah.

And I think that's an expert.

It is, it is. One last trust building topic or area that I want to hit on is due diligence.

I have one more analogy. You ever listen to the people in the cockpit when a plane's about to crash?

Oh, they're just right here.

Yeah. What? Throttle up. Left flap, Larry.

Right.

You know, I mean, that's an expert, man. I mean, you know, and a lot of them don't crash because of that.

Right.

They're able to just methodically go through the process. And you watch these air disasters and you're like going, if that guy was not an expert or that gal was not an expert, that plane would have been done.

Totally.

And yeah, so don't crash your client's retirement. Crash. Did I say clash or crash?

Crash.

Don't clash with your crash. Never mind, go.

Another one I want to hit on is due diligence. And I want to equate this. My, my analogy here is a doctor. If you as an individual go into a doctor and you say, hey doc, write me a prescription for this medicine, I've decided this is what I need because of, you know, my issue. And that doctor just does that without any Tests or examination or due diligence or idea you might get the prescription for the thing that you think you need, but it might be the wrong thing. And how much trust are you going to have in that doctor in the future versus a doctor who says, well, that's great, but I actually need to make sure that that prescription is what you need. I love that you did your research, I love that you did your due diligence. But it's my, it's my responsibility to ensure that what I actually prescribe you is the best thing for you. You're going to trust that doctor more because they were willing to challenge you a little bit on your idea and ultimately protect you better in the long run. So with clients, it's not uncommon to have clients say, this is what I'm looking to do, this is what I'm looking for. Whatever I get, agents reach out to me all the time. Hey, I've got a client looking for xyz and I'm looking at this case going, I don't see how this product is actually what's best for this client. Right? This is actually what's right.

I mean, you think about parenting, how often do the kids think their way is right? We build trust with our kids because they realize something dumb happens and go, man, if I would have done that, I would have been in deep trouble. Or they see one of their friends do that and they realize that their parents said that's not a good idea. So they watch their friends have the consequences and they didn't. And man, I see that in retirees all the time. You know, I, through coaching, through mentoring, through helping them understand how the products work, they don't suffer the consequences that their friends did. And then when it comes to, you know, we moved an IRA, now they're 65 and they're officially retiring and they have a drop pension or they have something like that. That trust that I built with them back 10 years ago, I just got a $774,000 deal from someone I've written 14 years ago because they trust that I will put them in the right situation. But what did I do? I actually had about 2 million I could have moved total. And because of health situations, her husband's health situation, I was like, you know what, let's just move yours right now. Let's keep his completely liquid. We don't want any surrender charges because he's 92 years old. I said, we want his to stay completely liquid because his had more than enough to cover any long term care. But if I would have put them into moved his money that would have restarted a surrender schedule again. And at that age you're not getting any sort of long term care benefits. So she trusted that. Yeah we're not. Chad could make a lot more money doing this but he's not moving this money. And I picked very short products because you know they're annuities. You want to go 1035 to 1035. But she trusted that and that's what's that going to tell the kids when if because he is kind of diminishing where he does have to go in a long term care facility and Chad made sure money was available for that they trust and it's so important. Your word is everything. Your action behind your word even makes that farther.

So yeah.

Yeah.

So good.

That's it right?

That's it.

Good. No nothing else White Those are the.

The three main areas of building trust. Your character, your expertise and your due diligence.

Awesome. Well you guys have a great day and as always, happy selling.

Sam.