The Power of Divine Femininity with April Mason

What are your views on double standards?

I personally am okay with the double standard because I've learned how to make the patriarchal system work for me.

Gotcha.

Yeah, you can get equality, but go for more equity. Yeah, that's different. That's, that's a different ball game. But I believe we— women think that, um, this whole patriarchal thing and, oh, I got to be submissive equals subservient, being subservient, and it doesn't. And I believe as women, we give y'all way too much credit than we should in the romance area. Most men, ladies, don't know romance.

No.

And it's like, well, he needs to plan a romantic— most men aren't romantic.

Peace and blessings. Welcome back to the channel once again where we talk all things health and healing. From a holistic perspective. And today will be no different. Actually, today is going to be glorious. Today is going to be regal. Today is going to be queendom today with my guest today. My guest today is a feminine lifestyle strategist and dating mindset coach. She's the president and owner of April Mason Enterprises, which includes all things feminine and feminine CEO brands. She actually coined the phrase feminine CEO. She's a bestselling author of multiple books, including Identity Switch, which you got thousands of 5-star reviews. I see she's a former talk show host, TEDx speaker, and over 2 decades as an entrepreneur. Did I mention that she's a— has an honorary doctorate in psychology? So I guess I gotta call her Dr. April Mason, my friend and dear confidant.

Oh, hello, my love. Is that me you're talking about?

Ah, man. So thank you, thank you, thank you so much for making the arrangements to come here to be with us. I felt like having the conversation with you was gonna be vital to all the conversations that we're gonna be having here, and I thought that You know, once we get into the conversation, people will start to understand how we can really impact the relationships. Not only the relationship that we have with others, but the relationship that we actually have with ourselves as well too.

Absolutely. Thank you for having me. I could not miss this. This— I'm so proud of you, friend. I'm like, look at you. You got your little suit on, your little muscles showing and everything.

Wait, muscles?

Oh, just a little bit. Eh, flex a little bit more to people. Uh, thank you for having me, and it's really great to be here. So, thank you. That people— we can have the conversations that you and I have behind the scenes.

Yeah.

You know, we talk certain stuff, but we don't— we've never— I think this is our first time actually having a dialogue about what we talk about on the phone. And, you know, the stuff that— how we dive deep. So it makes it easier for us to understand certain things. And I think, you know, this is— I believe this is going to be a good conversation.

I know it is. I know it is. Because I think if people could be a fly on the wall to the conversations that we have, I think not only would they be informed, but they will be entertained.

Definitely entertained. All I'm gonna say is, Dr. Know Where the Bodies Is Buried. Yes.

Indeed, indeed. You know, you know, we met about 4 years ago, and I'll tell you, I don't have a lot of female friends. And what I will say is you are undoubtedly my closest female friend.

Aw.

And I value you so much because not only from the perspective of I get to understand females from a different standpoint because of the expertise that you have, but also I think it's very valuable for men to get women in their lives that are on, on par with the type of woman that they would want to spend the rest of their lives with because it's like the best practice.

Yes.

It is the, like, the best practice to have good women around you so that first, you know, they exist.

Yes.

And secondarily, you can have another perspective on how women think because I think both men and women make this mistake where they think that they know how the other party thinks. But as you know, men are from Mars and women are from Venus when it comes to that.

Yes. And I always tell people, because people always ask about our relationship, and I said, you know, I said, Bobby is like my knight. And I told you this before, it's like, I know that I— dependable, you know, brain is just amazing. But I believe it goes back to something that you and I talked about before. When women aren't— don't have even strong masculine friendships, when it's time for that leader, that man that they want to lead, to come in, they haven't had any practice because nobody around them operates in that true masculinity. So if you don't even have masculine friends and men that are upright. Because I think back in 2019, I had a situation, and you walked me through that situation. I was— you let me fuss, you let me say whatever I needed to say about men. I was— it was a lot. And I have— I think it was the cognitive dissonance that I had to deal with that during that time. And you let me fuss, and I said some stuff about men because I was so angry about how this whole thing blew up.

Yeah.

And you ain't say nothing. You just like, you need something? I'm like, I need some vegan, raw vegan sweet potato pie. And I need you to go down here to get— and you said, I got it. And you let me vent. I think it was like a week. And so after I got— I came to, I was cool. But having you there to be able to even vent about the situation that happened was a blessing. And I believe that so many women don't know how to even choose men because they don't even have male friends in their life that are platonic and that they can actually have good dialogue and know the difference between a toxic masculinity and true masculine leadership.

Indeed. Yes, indeed. You know what's, um, it's funny, I put you in the same category as like a Felicia Rashad, AKA Claire Huxtable, and like a Diahann Carroll, because you, since the day we met, you've always had this regalness about you and this effortless command for respect. And some people think that sometimes you're in this like presence with men, they think that it's something that you're acting out.

Yeah.

When it's just something that you're actually being. It's like an it factor.

Ah.

I think the French call it a je ne sais quoi.

Yeah, okay, okay, okay.

And so tell us a little bit about your superhero origin story because I always say I always say this, like, you know, for people to be amazing, they always have a beautiful origin story that has different types of inflections in it to share with the audience.

Well, first of all, let me say it's an honor to be compared to those ladies. My mother calls me Diahann Carroll. That's so crazy, 'cause she'll send me stuff on Instagram. I'm like, "Ma, what you doing on Instagram?" But she'll send me little pictures of Diahann Carroll, and she say, "That's you." I said, "Well, you know what?" It took me going through some things to even get to that. For those that don't know my story, I dealt with 12 years of sexual abuse from the age of 5 to 17. I dealt with 2 rapes. I dealt with domestic violence where you wouldn't recognize the left side of my face, homelessness and everything else in between. So my hero story is that I had to take accountability for how I was going to end up. Now, I can't say that anything that happened in the past was 100% my fault. Yeah. But I can determine who I still want to become regardless of that. So it took me deciding, you know, April, what kind of woman do you want to be? How do you— how do you want to show up in the world?

Yeah.

And I made a choice of how I wanted to show up in the world. I always wanted to be a woman that was well-respected but very relatable, you know, kind of like the sister girl. But yet we can be a little bougie if we need to be, can ride first class only. But at the end of the day, we can go to the hood and go to the little hole in the wall.

I don't think people know that side of you.

You know, I tell everybody, you know, this is what I tell folks. They don't know my middle name. I'm like, it depends on who I am today. You can get April, you can get Ms. Mason, or you can get Ebony. Which one you want? You know? And Ebony is— that's my urban girl, you know? And I had to decide that I was going to be comfortable in my skin, you know? And I think what people get from me, because one of the biggest compliments that I get is, Ms. April, you're the same in person as you are online. And that came from— I remember 2018, someone asked me, what's your biggest accomplishment? And I said, being the same across the board.

Yeah.

And I had to learn that I'm okay being who I am. I— my brand of femininity, as I call it, refined hood a little bit. You know, I'm not always pink. I like to dive into the dark feminine, but then I can just be, you know, the princess at the same time. So there's not one thing that you can, you know, pin me down and say, you're just this one thing. And femininity is not just the color pink. Or it's not even the color pink. Long hair, walking, you know, with your heels on and dressed. That don't have nothing to do with femininity, child. And so I became comfortable in my own skin.

Yeah.

After I went through all of those things, I made a choice to assess the situation, to accept what they are, and then decide how I would move forward.

Yeah. And I think that's so important because what people try to do is skip the healing and get to the results.

Yes.

And one of the things that you always say is you don't need to heal the man, you need to heal the little boy.

Ooh.

You don't need to heal the woman, you need to heal the little girl. 'Cause most of our trauma happens when we're children, but it plays out in our adulthood when it comes to our decision making. And that's very true for me too.

Mm-hmm.

You know, by the age of 12, I had witnessed so much death, had so many experiences that only a grown person should have. I had a son by the time I was 15. So I had been through a lot. And a lot of that was very traumatic for me. And it wasn't until I sat down with myself and realized that what I had gone through, I didn't heal from that. And all of the decisions that I was making was based upon a lot of those traumas that I had went through. And as I began to heal myself, what I began to see was all my decisions started to change. And I always say, I always say to people, like, when you become the highest version of you, that is the healed version of you.

Yes.

So what are some of the things you had to heal from to become the amazing person that you are today?

One of those things was being able to accept. I believe acceptance is key because sometimes we want the answer to the why.

Yeah.

And what if there is no answer? Yeah. You know, and all of the things that I've gone through, I would ask myself, what if I never have an opportunity to tell these people how I feel? And what if I do and they say, oh, I don't even remember doing that to you. I don't remember saying this or being here. And you sitting there like, I've held all of this for so long and these jokers can't even give me an answer.

Yeah.

So what happens when there is no answer to the why? Typically what we do is we continue to replay what could have been and we continue to keep ourselves in that past place. Yeah. And so for me, I just— it was It was a decision. I believe that when you make the decision to be a better person or make that identity switch, you have to decide. Nobody can tell you who you want to become. You have to say, look, these are the situations I keep going through.

Yeah.

What is the common denominator in this? It's me.

Yeah.

You know, and I remember when I was married, when I got married, I was a size 6 when I got married. Shouldn't have been married. I had no business. Being married. Yeah, but I got depressed. I went through a really horrible bout of depression and I still in my mind was a size 6 in my head. But I wasn't paying attention that I was buying jeggings. I wasn't even buying jeans no more. My shirts became— went from medium to extra large and I wasn't paying attention until one day I was in Walmart and I walked past the mirror and I literally got to see myself. Well, I'm only 5'3" without shoes. Me and I had got up to a size 16. Yeah, that you wouldn't even know me. No, you would have walked right on past me. But I had to make a decision. April, what's caused this? Because this is not you. And I was in a not a good marriage. Like I always tell people, you never hear me talking negatively about my ex-husband because I chose him based on where I was. He was being— he was a match to who I was at the time.

The unhealed version.

The unhealed version of me. So I have— I don't have anything negative to say about him because He came into my life because I welcomed him. I always tell people it's not what you— it's not what you attract, it's what you entertain. Because I can have a glass of water and in this glass of water could be good men, bad men, indifferent men, toxic masculinity and all other foolishness that they say now. Yeah, but what I choose to pull out of there is a reflection of where I am.

Yeah.

Doesn't mean that there's not good men in that, that water, that cup of water. So I never have anything negative to say about that other than April, if you were a healed, more healed version of you, he would've got a hello and you would've just kept on walking. But my traumas was an attraction.

Yeah.

And he mirrored everything.

So it was trauma bonding.

It was trauma bonding. Right. It was trauma bonding. So can you blame somebody else for you choosing them out of your trauma? Right. Right.

And I think that that goes back to my point. The highest version of you is the healed version of you. And the healed version of you makes very different decisions from the unhealed version of you.

Yes.

And it's all about taking that accountability in your healing journey.

Yes.

Yeah.

Yes.

Now you've been in the relationship space for 10 to 15 years.

Yeah.

And you've helped both men and women cultivate relationships and marriages, and you got the receipts to prove it.

Oh yeah, they long and strong.

I mean, I come to your events and I hear people stand up with testimonies. I'm getting married in June.

Yeah.

I got married last year and it's, it's a beautiful thing to see. But you've been in the game so long and now you're starting to see all of these people who were in other industries switch to becoming relationship coaches and you starting to see on the internet a lot of the narrative around relationships is very negative.

Mm-hmm.

And it sounds crazy because people want to be together. Women are saying they're trying to find good men and men are saying they're trying to find with women.

Yeah.

How has the landscape of dating changed, or what was it like when you first started in this space versus what is it like today?

Well, to be honest with you, today— what it is today is why I quit. It's why I retired and I quit in 2021. Um, the thing is, what men and women want has not changed, and it will never change. It's like, like I tell folks— I'm— which camera do I look at? I'm just look at that camera. I don't make the rules. I didn't say it was fair. It just is what it is. So nothing has changed as far as what the wants are. What has changed is how people believe they should go about getting it and what they think their value is to the opposite sex.

Okay, gotcha.

That plays a huge part. And it's like, no, that ain't what women value. No, that ain't what men value. But instead of people listening to say, wait a minute, I'm going to study the psychology of how men work. I'm going to study the psychology of how women work. But I got to say this, though. Y'all know how we work. The issue that I have, and, you know, the ladies, I go hard on the ladies because I understand the power that we have. Yeah. Y'all know what to do to get us. It's from you doing this work for so long. And honestly, I really wasn't a dating coach. I, I had to use that as bait because they weren't going to come to me by themselves.

Yeah.

So I really teach womad. Is what I teach, woman and femininity. And that connects them to the type of men that they want. I just use y'all, you know, put a little sugar in the medicine, you know? So that's— so people always thought, oh my gosh, she's a dating coach. But anyone that actually have taken my courses or been in my academies, I teach more about them and becoming the woman than I ever teach about a man.

I mean, the highest version of them.

Yes. But I just, like I said, I just got to use the man as the bait to get them in because they don't be coming in by theyself. I'm like, girl, the man is the— I always say the man is the Bible. Product, the type of man most women want, you have to be a different version of yourself to get that kind of guy and vice versa, you know, to the men. Because I was coaching men just as much as I was coaching women.

Gotcha.

Same issues, but nobody wanted to make an identity switch because it was easier to blame everybody else.

Gotcha.

You know, so for me, seeing what I see now, it's a cesspool, but the desire of what they want hasn't changed.

Yeah.

That's the crazy part. It's like, you still, girl, if you Tell the truth. Girl, you know you want some biceps and triceps in your bed, child. You know you do not want to be out there during another pandemic looking for toilet paper. You don't want to do that. And if we honest, we don't want to open our own doors. We don't want to take out no garbage. We don't— we want somebody that we can vent to. We really want and desire deep connection. We just don't know how to get to it. But the thing is, although we may have evolved in certain areas, The core connection of what we want has not changed.

Gotcha, gotcha. All right, so it's my belief that men have this innate divine masculine nature, and then women have this innate divine feminine nature. And we see this both in biology, psychology, and even in spirituality too. Yes, the yin and yang is always present. Would you agree with that?

I agree.

You agree? Okay. So if that's being the case, how do we get to a point where you're now coaching women or having the necessity to coach women to actually be feminine, what it is, their divine nature?

Ooh, chile. First of all, ladies, thank y'all so much for helping me take care of my family, because I never would have thought that I would have had a job teaching women how to get back to their femininity. But here's why. We have to take into account that prior, women didn't have rights. There was a lot of things that we had to suffer with. Yeah, at the hands of men.

Yeah.

So in my opinion, this is just my opinion, what happened was we have our grandmothers and great-grandmothers and women that came before us that were stuck in a position to where even if they were mistreated, they could not leave. No education, no money, nowhere to go. Women could not even get a credit card, a single woman, until the 1960s. And a A woman couldn't even get a business loan until 1988. So there was so many barriers that we had as women. So what happened was the women that came before us, although they— what men, modern men— I hate that term— modern men today call, you know, say we want women to go back to the olden days. What you're not understanding is there were— there was a lot of oppression on women in the older days, and a lot of times women were overly submissive because you got to make sure you got to keep that house, you know, your survival intact.

Yeah.

And then the term, she can't keep a man, that was looked at as derogatory toward a woman because keeping a man was your survival.

Yeah.

So you looked at as your ability to keep a man, you know, that's where your value came from. So now we go through decades of women fighting for their rights, right? We finally get a certain level of rights, right? But what happened was, are the women that came before us pushed us, get educated, get educated, get educated, right? But they did not teach us the woman part. So now we have a lot of women who are, especially in the African-American community, Black women that are the most educated and the least married. Yeah, it's not because they can't be wives, it's because we weren't given that same, um, push to learn how to be the wife. We were giving the same push to learn how to be worker bees. So now the type of men that most women come to me for, those men are okay with you being educated, but they're looking looking more for the wife qualities. So we don't— we're not taught to put the same effort into developing as feminine women as we are to, girl, go get the bag and be a boss chick and be a bad bitch, girl. We, you know, we don't— we don't get— we get that thrown at us. So then when women come to me and say, Miss April, I make $300,000 a year. I have my own this, that, and the third, my own house, my own car, and my little dog, you know, little outfits for my little dog, you know, all of that. I can't seem to get a date to save my life.

And I'm like, I hear that a lot. Not only, not only at your events, but even at Stephan's events. I like, that's, that is exactly how when the questions come, that's exactly how it's actually put.

Yes. And so I'm like, do y'all want me to be, do you want me to keep it 100 with you, or do you want me to sugarcoat it? Because I know why that is. As a woman that has dated in the top 10 to 1% of men, especially Black men.

Yeah.

I've gone— I've, you know, even though I wouldn't look for no relationship, I was always dating them kind of guys at the time. I said, do you want the answer? Because I know that man very, very well.

Yeah. And he is different from the average man.

Yes. Yes. Um, and if you have it— don't have experience with that guy, you might be— get your feelings hurt for what you think it will be versus what it actually is. And so the women that I ended up coaching— well, when I was coaching before y'all made me retire because y'all was too much work, honey.

I tried to make her stop.

He tried. And I was like, I can't do it no more. I can't. Because it was like fighting. And I had to be in my masculine more to coach the women. I'm like, I'm just trying to get you to what you say you want. I don't make the rules. I didn't say it was fair. A lot of it's not fair, but this is what you say you want. And I'm just an accepting person, you know. I look at the bottom line. If I— I remember my son, um, my middle son, he was complaining about getting his driver's license test, taking the test. Ma, these questions are stupid. And he going through all of this stuff, right? Well, you're right, son. This one really don't make no sense. Guess what? This is what you have to pass in order to get that license. So like I always say, it's not fair. It just is what it is. So I found that women wanted me to give them a formula to make the men that they wanted want something different. Yeah, I can't do that. I'm like, girl, I says, I get you, but that man He likes the fact that you are educated and that you have all of these letters behind your name. That's wonderful. But that's not what he's going to decide on if you are going to make a good wife for him. And the problem is because we've spent so much time over in the education sector and not in the cultivating the intrinsic value of the woman sector, you're having a problem connecting.

Yeah.

That's what it is. So it's not that a man is always intimidated. Now you do have those that are, but when you walk walk in the woman energy in addition, I call it the queen and the princess energy.

Yeah.

When you walk in both of those, it's different. You can be that feminine CEO because feminine CEO is a woman that her lifestyle, her business is around her lifestyle, not her lifestyle around her business. And she doesn't lead with what she can do. She lead with who she is. Well, most of us—

As opposed to what you were just saying earlier.

Yes.

Make $300,000. I have these degrees, I have this car, blah, blah, blah.

That's what they tend to lead with when they come to me and I'm like, I get it. And no, you should not have to downplay what you are. But guess what? You're not just that. Yeah, that's the thing I said. So let's take off this pseudo-confidence. What you mean? You have confidence in what you can do, but not confidence in who you can be. Yeah, that's the difference. I said the feminine, when you walk in a room, it changes the temperature in the room. You are the temperature, not the thermostat. You set the tone in the room. I said, but what we see is a lot of women having confidence because of what they've accomplished. But if you take all of that away from you, who are you? Tell me who you are.

And especially when you're walking into a relationship with a person has the very same thing.

Yes. And that's, that's another thing. That's, that's another thing. They be killing me with this. It's like, I hear women say all the time, I make sure I tell him, you know, I don't, I'm not after him for his money and trying to just make it so he take care of me. Girl, Be quiet.

He never asked about the money.

Shut up. Because guess what? You can't say out of your mouth, I want a provider, but you saying, I'm letting them know, I had to let them know I can provide for myself. No, I can't. I can't do nothing. I can't do nothing. When I'm with you, I can't even see right. I don't, I'm following whatever, wherever you taking me.

Wrist are broke.

Yeah. When men are around, my wrists are broke. I'm like, you don't have, it's like you have to, they want to say that to make sure you know that I'm not after trying to get what's in your bank account. But here's the thing. Provider men understand that they have to take care of their woman. You don't have to show them that you can do it. They, they like that because what they get from you, which I call the feminine exchange, makes them want to continue to give to you. Yeah, but a lot of women don't have the feminine exchange. They want the man— where, Miss April, where these men at that pay bills? Sissy, not gonna want you because you don't give the feminine exchange. Men take care of women that give them from the feminine exchange.

Yeah. And I always say this, it's important that women understand that when, when women get money, a lot of times it's for their own independence.

Mm-hmm.

It's to make sure that they're secure, et cetera. But when men achieve a certain level of success, it's not to be independent. It's actually to create an opportunity for their family to be solely dependent on them.

Yes.

And so that's a very different understanding. So if you come in to a relationship or to a meeting with a man, or like meeting a man for a first time, he's not looking for what you have in that sense, because that's what he's looking to provide. That's why they call a man a provider. So that's why there's probably a misunderstanding or miscommunication even from the beginning.

Yes.

Now I got a question for you.

Oh, boy.

Can you remember from like your earliest memories, like the first time you're embracing your femininity as a superpower. Do you know when that started for you?

I do, but I was on the dark side of it during that time. So—

What is dark side of femininity?

Well, it depends on how you use it. So, I always say a woman should walk in her light and dark. Feminine, you know, and the dark feminine transformation happens in the dark.

Okay.

You know, and part of that dark sometimes can be deep in your sensuality. Like when I realized I had this thing, it was like you couldn't tell me nothing. My friends would be like, how in the world are you? I'm like, girl, watch this, watch this, watch this. But I didn't know exactly what it was. I just knew it worked. It worked. And so I remember the first time, and this is was used based upon the broken part of who I was at the time.

Gotcha.

My negative with my femininity and how I used it in the improper way, darling.

I'm on with it now.

I knew that how men responded to me from an early age, from the time I remember from middle school, boys always responded to me in a particular way. I didn't know why that was, but they did. And so once I started messing around with this thing, this, this kind of like magic that I felt like I had when I got into my 20s and by that time I had gone through the sexual abuse and all of the, you know, the one, at least one of the rapes I had gone through.

Yeah.

I, there was a part of me that was like, I'm gonna get them before they get me. And but I, some way I knew how to use that thing I had to do it. So I remember when I first like used it intentionally. I was at a club back in Oakland, California, and there was this guy. He walked in with this girl and he was dancing with her on the dance floor. And I was kind of— her back was to me and he was looking and we locked eyes. And I said, "Got him," immediately. I went to the ladies' room and all of a sudden he was by the door and I came out. He looked at me. I said, "I knew you'd be here." Yeah. And he said, how did you know? I said, I watched you watch me. He said, are you single? I said, depends. And so all of this dialogue was going on and my girlfriends was like, they was just like they was watching a Venus and Serena match. And so he said, he said something to me which prompted me to say, you're too easy. And I walked off.

Yeah.

And that was my thing. So for a while, when I was in that healing space and using my femininity to crush, kind of, I would say that, because we can all do that.

Yeah, you can use it for good or evil.

And so my vice with it was, I knew I could have you if I wanted you. It was like a— it's actually a 6-second stare that I teach my clients to do, but I teach them how to use it for good.

Yeah.

But I understood what I was. And so it was just like, all right, when I walk in a room, I already knew. And so people would say, well, you know, how do you do this as a darker-skinned woman? I'm like, it never crossed my mind. You know, it was, I'm girl and I can have whatever I want when I walk in this room.

Gotcha.

Gotcha. That was it. That was so— that was, that was my first sort of like aha moment. Yes.

I got a superpower here.

Yes.

So you, you spoke earlier about walking in your divine femininity. First, can you tell us what what that is? And then secondly, can you tell us about the difference between being feminine and acting feminine? Because I'm— I think people— what people often struggle with is the difference between being and acting.

Well, the thing is, to be with divine femininity is being exactly what you are as a woman. We have to remember that a lot of things were stripped away from our ability to— don't feel. We live in an unbothered culture. We're disconnected from our sensuality. We're disconnected from real wisdom. We're disconnected from sensuality. These things are what make us, in my opinion, the core nature of what women are. Also being able to embrace our darker side as well, because I look at femininity as Mother Nature. Mother Nature nurtures us, brings us the sunshine, brings us the rain, provides resources, feeds us. Mother Nature is also destructive. Mother Nature can also cause catastrophe and will destroy anything in its path.

Hurricanes, earthquakes. Everything.

All of that. But at the same time, after it's all over, Mother Nature calms down and you get back to getting your resources and you're nurtured again. That's what I view femininity as. It's not this, this pseudo performance femininity. Most women, when I was in this work heavy, they came to me for strategies. I don't teach strategies. I teach becoming and being comfortable in your skin, whether you're a size 2 or whether you're a size 32. It's not about a particular look. If you look at through history, the women that were deemed the most feminine, that had the most influence, were not not traditionally beautiful women.

Yeah, for sure.

They were not. So what I see now and what I see all over, I say Beyoncé's internet, is performance femininity. The hair, the makeup, things that can be purchased at a beauty supply store.

Yeah.

Class and decorum is now being described as feminine. The color pink, wearing dresses, all that has nothing to do with femininity. Can it enhance Yes. Okay, but that's not what it is. It's you being in your authentic self, walking in your femininity, your spirituality, your sensuality, and your womanly wisdom. God calls wisdom her for a reason. But we live so much so in a disconnected world that women don't even feel anymore. We literally have had to turn our natural, instinctual, biological makeup to connect and say, I don't want that. I, you know, I don't— I would rather be by myself. And you're lying. And I'm like, you can be okay with saying, yeah, I want a husband.

I've never heard a man say, you don't need no woman. I don't need no woman.

He not going to.

Like, if I was with— in a group of men and I heard a man say that, yeah, I think every man in the circle would look at him crazy.

Yes.

Because like, in our minds, it's like, nope, not living without that.

Yes. And that goes back to what I said earlier. Men know what to do to get women.

Yeah.

It's women who won't take down the pride and ego to be able to get the type of man that they want. And I know they gonna come for me for this one, but it's the truth. Men, you guys are wired to look good. Okay. Let me get some money. Get the man with the money, get the girl.

Yeah.

You know, let me go get career. Let me, y'all get lineups for us. If it wasn't for us, y'all wouldn't be doing all of the stuff that y'all do.

For what? You—

it's for us. We know that. I know that. But the thing is, the stuff that I suggest that women do— "Ah, Ms. A'Ryan doing that." Okay, then don't talk to me then. I don't know what to tell you because men have mastered what women want, which is why they can play the representative even for a short amount of time. And we fall for it because they've learned what it takes to at least get us. Maybe not keep us, but they at least know the foundational stuff of how to get our attention.

Yeah, gotcha, gotcha. Now, moving on, there's been a lot of inequality for women since the beginning of time that of course needs to be accounted for. And so that's why I understand the push for women to get certain, you know, equality, so to speak. But there are also some double standards that are in favor of women. And so things like her hypergamy.

Yes.

You know, the idea of never dating down. I know that's a big thing on the internet now. And, you know, I always say when people say, well, a woman should never date down, and they tend to focus on finances when it comes to dating down, not character.

Yeah.

And so I'm like, well, isn't that what men have been doing for a very long time?

Mm-hmm. Yeah, from a financial standpoint. Yeah.

And then things like the military draft, like that, the situation that was happening in the Ukraine, the country said all women and children can leave. All the men had to stay and they were bombing the entire country and still are to this day.

Yeah.

You know, some of the most dangerous jobs in the world. I mean, it sounds great to wanna be a doctor or a lawyer, but then like the jobs like the miners, the oil rig workers, these are like jobs to where it's 98% men, some of the most dangerous jobs. Construction workers who are walking on these little bars.

Yeah.

150 floors up in the, in the, in the sky.

Mm-hmm.

You know, a burglar comes into the house, you're not going downstairs. I would never ask you to go downstairs. You know? And so there are some double standards that are in favor of women. So the, you know, I always think to myself, the idea of eliminating double standards, it would eliminate yours too. So what are your views on double standards?

I personally am okay with the double standard because I've learned how to make the patriarchal system work for me.

Gotcha.

So I'm okay with it, you know? And when I say that, I don't mean that being a doormat, you know, because that's the last thing. I'm from Oakland. Ain't nobody running over me, child. You know, that ain't it. But what I understand is this world was built on men leading or men being in charge, whether they got there by force, whether, you know, or if it was, you know, honest, which a lot of it was not.

Yeah.

But at the same time, the things as women that women are asking for as far as taking care of— where these men take care of us, right? Well, men are often looked down upon if they don't take care of their families. So I've learned how to make that work for me. That's a double standard. Oh, well, why? Why she can't go to work? Well, because even in y'all's Bible it said a man that don't take care of his, uh, family is less than an infidel. So yeah, if that means you will take care of me, and because, because if you don't, you look down upon, and I can't go out here, I'm looked at as less than because I— if I sleep with a bunch of guys or if I do masculine things, I'll take that for a thousand, Alex. Yeah, you mean to tell me that, you know, So the double standard can work for me too, because everybody always talks about a man that doesn't take care of his family. Also, in divorce, typically the woman, you know, gets paid really well. She makes out really well. Why? Because of the double standard of, well, you was taking care of her, so you got to keep on doing it. I'll take that for $3,000, Alex. So when you understand and stop fighting and understand And yeah, you can get equality, but go for more equity. Yeah, that's different. That's, that's a different ball game. But I believe we— women think that, um, this whole patriarchal thing and, oh, I got to be submissive equals subservient, being subservient, and it doesn't. So I don't have a problem with the double standard because I understand the double standard, it plays on, on y'all's side too.

Yeah, yeah. And I think, I think our our mothers and grandmothers had a different, had an understanding like you do of that. They understood what double standards were in their favor and which ones were not in their favor. But when you look at today, you start to see there's a huge difference between the thinking of women today versus before. And some of it needed to change, to be honest with you.

Yes, absolutely.

You know, it just wasn't, not only was it not fair, but it was just, improper. Yes, to say the least. So do you believe a traditional man or woman can successfully date a modern man or woman? Do the— are the values the same? Uh, can the dynamic work?

It all depends what that modern individual is requiring, because what I find is a lot of people that talk about they modern, they still want traditional things.

Yeah.

And I'm like, wait, it's like a guy that says, I want a traditional woman, but you want her to go 50/50. Boy, if you do not go get out of here and go pay this mortgage by yourself, you want to extract my feminine experience you get from me, and I got to go to work 12 hours a day? Pick a side.

Yeah.

You got to pick a side. So it's interesting. I don't think— honestly, I don't think people realize what they saying, to be honest with you, because most of the people I hear about this traditional talk— I mean, of this modern talk— they're still asking for traditional things. If you listen to some of those little clips that I see on TikTok, men talking about the modern— I mean, the modern woman ain't like X, Y, and Z. Well, you're the same guy saying that you want a traditional woman like Leave It to Beaver's mama, like Miss June, but yet you're still saying, no, um, you know, we got to go 50/50 and she gotta, you know, do X, Y, and Z. No, them women, even though those women might have been under a little bondage a little bit, they still didn't have to go to work. So you can't— you got— you gotta pick and choose. Yeah, you know. So I don't think people really know what they are saying and what they're really asking for. I just think a lot of people have microphones and it sound good, and it— what they're spewing hits other people's traumas.

Gotcha.

Right. And so they're speaking to these traumas and it gets them a lot of clicks Gotcha, gotcha, gotcha.

Because, you know, my thing is, is that the, when I see the values, the values are represented very differently when you look at the two dynamics. And I believe that that's where the conflict comes into play. How you raise your children, how things are handled in the home, how money is handled, which are all things that end up causing divorce.

Yes.

And if you're not on the same page, because a man and a woman are gonna be a team.

Mm-hmm.

That's the only way it works.

Yes.

If, and it's, and it's not like a team where it's like, you know, two unequal partners. Yes. This is Shaq and Kobe. You can't win without the other.

Yes.

And so I find that when the values are very different, you essentially have two teammates that just can't win together.

Yes.

So if, if that's the case, if it's very difficult for that dynamic to work, and we spoke about the importance of like the feem, the feminine masculine dynamic, how important that is from a natural standpoint. What advice do you give these beautiful, successful females who are independent and, you know, essentially winning in life? What, what advice do you give them? Because I hear a lot of them are having problems, you know, when it comes to finding either their equal or above, especially for these women who are very successful, you know, going out making $300,000, $500,000, and then they go into the dating market and they're not getting success. What do you— what advice did you— do you give them?

First of all, we have to look at what are you determining— what are they determining as equal?

Yeah.

So just because you can make $300,000 a year doesn't mean you have woman skills. You're showing you have work skills, right?

So that doesn't translate into a relationship.

Exactly. So I think— well, I know that that's one of the bigger problems. It's like I tell a lot of my ladies, and I— and these are women that are doing very well— I said, sis, you already settling. Yeah, what you mean? You already settling because number one, you don't know who you are, so you can't choose a man based upon your core needs, which means you don't know how to vet. So you and all of the things that you've acquired, that's beautiful, but you're still settling because one of the things that I've learned dating extremely successful men is that, yes, they might have a lot of money and success, but they not always got it up here.

Yeah.

Right? They don't always have it emotionally. They're not always emotionally intelligent and have intellectual maturity because they spent their time grinding and hustling, trying to be successful in the world. So even if you do meet a man that matches you on paper, Does he match your values, your standards, or is it just the six figures? Now, I'm not telling nobody to go get nobody broke because, you know, we don't do broke. Broke make me itch, child. But I believe we should be looking for more than what's on in a checking account. Because like I said, I find that a lot of these guys that these women want that are up here, you might not want them when you realize that the little boy in them is not healed. You might not want them when you realize that he's more more than likely, 98% of the time, he's Clark Kent versus Superman. Can you still respect him as Clark Kent as you can Superman? See, in the world, he— you see him on TV, you see him doing his thing, you know, in the community, all of that. Can you handle the fact that there's a whole nother level of insecurity that his little boy within him is running? Are you going to look at him now as, wait a minute, You're not the man that I signed up for.

Yeah.

That's a whole different ballgame dealing with that level of emotional damage that a lot of these men have because they have arrested development. They've been dealing with women who only wanted them for their money. And those men value themselves strictly on their accomplishments. Can you deal with the fact that he can buy you a Birkin bag, girl, but you can't go deep with him emotionally? They don't want to have those conversations because they're only looking at paper. And as someone that has been in that pool, child, that's a whole nother level of emotional drainage as a woman that you have to say, you know what, this man is worth it to me to do this. I don't think people, women understand what comes with the guy that everybody seems to want. Typically, me coaching with them, we have another division of a company called The Feminine Ear, and I work with a lot of your celebrity people, the men. From athletes to politicians and all of that. And a lot of these men, you know, they're damaged little boys looking for that little boy in them to be healed. Yes, they have their own healing to do, but a feminine presence, just the presence of a feminine woman, can heal that.

Gotcha.

Without her ever having to say a word.

Gotcha, gotcha. You know, one of the things I also really respect about you is, um, your daughter.

Ah. Yeah.

You know, I think, you know, one of the greatest representations of your work is how your daughter lives her life. Mm. Like, if you can heal everybody out here in terms of like showing them how to be in their divine femininity, but then your daughter's not living in hers, then what does that say about you? And so that's one of the things I really, really respect about you. Your daughter knows how to show up in her relationship.

Yes.

So it's a reflection of you.

Yes.

And so I really respect that about you.

Thank you.

And so can we talk about the, well, let's first, let me first say this. What I, what I hear again, like, you know me, I don't go out a lot.

Yes.

I stay in my hole.

Hole. Yo, old man, old man Bobby.

I do, you know, if I— if I'm either in my hole, which I call my home, or I'm traveling, you know what I'm saying? But other than that, I'm going to bed. My goal is to stay away from the foolishness, which is to me is bad energy.

Yes.

And, um, as I look out and scour this internet, I'm constantly hearing the conversation about what women want, what women want, what women want. And then they're getting into these relationships and they're not working because quite often, as you described to me, women don't know how to show up in the relationship as the woman for the man.

Yes.

And although the man has great, a great idea about how you want to show up for him, they don't necessarily have a really good idea about how to show up for them.

Yes.

So how are women supposed to show up in the relationship with their partner?

First of all, you have to show up selfless. See, the reason why my daughter got it right this time— so everybody, people that know the story, they know the first time I was like, "Uh-uh, don't get married." And she went against me, and I'm like, "No, but you let her hit her head." She came back. She's like, "Ma, everything you say I'mma do, tell me to do, I'mma do it." Yeah. Love my son-in-law. He's amazing, right? But one of the things that I taught my daughter is is first know yourself and then take the time to find out what you need to find out about a man in a selfless way. Meaning, stop going on dates trying to figure out if he husband material because you're checking off to see if he meets your needs, but you haven't even asked any questions about him to find out about who this man is at his core. Women tend to go in more selfish, I, I, I, about me, versus, you You know, let me study him. Let me— there's something about him. I don't know what it is just yet, but let me take the time to study this man.

Yeah, that— and that was one thing I was telling you one time. We was having a conversation, and this girl I was dating at the time, she said, hey, so where are we going in this relationship? Now mind you, we have been on like a couple of dates, and the first thing I asked, I was like, do you know my son's name? And she did not know my son's name. Now I had brought it up a few times and she said, "I can't remember it." I said, "So how can you want to be in a relationship with me when one of the most important people in my life, you don't even know their name?" Exactly. You know, and so I think a lot of times what happens is a lot of, a lot of women get into situations where, and this is just the male perspective here, where they're on a date and they have relinquished all the doing to the man.

Yeah.

It's like, we're on a date, you gotta pick the place, you gotta pick me up, you gotta take me there, you gotta engage in the conversation and initiate the conversation. But it's not, it's a monologue, not a dialogue. It's the guy asking. I even had a time where I was literally asking all these questions to this girl. And then she said, "So you don't like to share." And I was like, "What do you mean?" She's like, "Why didn't you answer your own questions for me?" And I thought to myself, wait, what? So you want me to do the job of getting to know me for you? That sounds crazy. And so like, you know, just from my perspective, I think, I think this is one of the biggest issues why nobody's really getting connection. What people are really getting a lot of is attachment.

Ooh, that's good. Yeah. Yeah. I would agree with that and even go as far as saying the reason why a lot of that is, is 'cause as from little girls, we're told we're the prize, right? Yeah. But what people don't understand is there's different size prize. Prizes.

Yeah.

Child, you know, when you go to the fair, you got the little starfish you could win for a couple, you know, you thump the little thing and you can win. Then, you know, the prize, the prizes go up. And then we have to decide what prize we're going to be. And are we going to be that jumbo bear that somebody had to put the effort in? Somebody had to, they put their time, effort, and money into winning that prize. So who you have to become to be a prize worth winning. And I believe a lot of times women don't believe that they should bring anything other than themselves. And I hate to tell y'all, camera right here, yeah, relationships are transactional. Always have been and always will be. But the transaction is typically the man gets the feminine experience from the woman in exchange He protects and provides for her. I don't know where we live— where we got to a place where we live where we don't believe that love is conditional and that it's not transactional. It's always been that way, and I'll prove it to you. When a man asks a woman to marry him, he's going through his mind of every condition that this woman meets and standard within Yeah. Because of who she's being to him and the asset that she is that he views her as in his life. In exchange, I'm going to give you this ring and ask you to be mine forever because I like what you bring to my life.

Yeah.

Men always choose a woman based on emotion, how she makes him feel. So that's a transaction. When I think when people think transaction, they think money only.

Yeah.

No, the feminine experience is a beautiful, a beautiful transaction to be able to give to a man, but you have to give it to yourself first. That's how you become it. You don't become it for a man. You walk in it every day and he gets to experience it. And it's like, ooh, I like that. Wait a minute. Hold up. You know, wait. I need to be in your presence now. Now I'm eager to see you and hesitant to leave you now. Now, you know, I'm calling all the time. I want to take you out all the time. Now it's like, wait a minute. Wait a minute, but I haven't done anything. But who you're being in your body and operating in your girl energy, that's what does it. So I believe that we have to get back to that as women. That's why I always talk about reawakening your femininity. It's not that you don't have it. It just need to be shook up a little bit, you know, to get what you want.

Now, here's the thing though, because a lot of times when you're talking to your April Mason high, you tell them, and I have to check you on this sometimes. Yes, you do.

Yes, you do.

When you say, "All I gotta do is show up, my presence." Oh, yes. And I have to tell you, like, I have to check you on that because your presence isn't the only thing that you bring.

Very true.

And I think you mislead them greatly because—

So what should I be telling them?

Well, my thing is, is that I get to experience you as a friend.

Yes.

And how you show up for me.

Mm-hmm.

But I also get to hear about how you show up for the men you date as well too. And you add so much value other than just showing up, because that's a big thing now where a lot of women are saying, all I gotta do is show up, I'm the table. And I think it gives them this preconceived notion that presence is all that is required of women. And I think it's really important that you share with them how you show up in a man's life that not only brings peace, but it makes his life go up like this. Because every woman of any man who's been of any value, it wasn't just her showing up.

Mm-hmm.

And I think it's really important you share that with women.

So when I say show up, uh, understand I'm talking about a woman showing up that's in her femininity. Her spirituality, her sensuality, and her wisdom.

Yeah.

Those are the 3, 4 components that I talk about when I'm talking about showing up. So what does spirituality bring? Spirituality allows you discernment. It allows you to see things and feel things that you wouldn't if you weren't there. What does wisdom do? Wisdom shows you how to execute all of those things.

Yeah.

You know, your sensuality allows you to flow. Right now, women live in a time where they know how to be sexual, but they don't know how to be sensual. Sexual, right? So when I say that, um, I'm coming from a selfless woman because I understand the psychology and how men work, right? And I've always told women, make sure you pick up a book on some— learn some stuff about some men and get some men in your life that can school you. Not just, you know, the people that you grew up with, but some true men that you can say, okay, he's an upright guy. So I know my value and what I bring to a man's life, and It's— but because it comes in the— it's wrapped up in the presence, right? All of those things that you named, it's a part of who I am. So I can't help but say, like, you text me something the other day to send to someone, and I was sending it to him, but I reread it first, and then I fixed it.

Yeah.

And I said, okay, let me put this, and let me add this to it. And then I sent it.

Because you know how men communicate, but you also know how men respond.

Exactly.

Yeah.

So I had said, let me fix this, and then I sent it over. And so it's, it's a part of being an individual that has no problem kicking in. I am the side mirrors, you know. One of the stories that I often tell is, um, uh, as far as showing up and what does that look like with, um, a relationship I was in. He's a, um, very well-known guy, and we used to do bit— we did great business together. I had to learn learned on my journey that just because you do good biz, business with someone and y'all have the same business energy doesn't mean you should be in a romantic relationship. Something I had to learn. So in this particular relationship, we were great friends. We were, you know, did great business. He had to do a book signing one day and he was nervous. But when he get on stage, it's like he is— he was that dude. I'm like, you better go ahead and tell these people. So he got off stage. The moment that he got off stage, it had to be about 5,000, 6,000 people in the room. Room. I'm in the lobby area. And before he even went in, he said, "You think we gonna sell books?" I said, "I got this." I said, "Why you think I wore this black dress?" I said, "My hair is together." I said, "Look at these shoes you bought. Why you think I told you to go get these shoes?" He's like, "The shoes gonna do it." I said, "Watch me work. We about to sell every last one of these books." Right? So, I knew my position. So, I said, "You just go up there and you kill 'em." I said, "You kill 'em with your words and I'm gonna get every dime out the people, child." rap.

Yeah.

So he comes out and he, he comes and sits. He walks up to me the moment he left that stage and he got to me. I saw the 15-year-old boy all over again immediately. He said, well, how did I do? I said, you did good. I said, I got you a special pen. That's what you're gonna sign these books with, right? Because I already knew he was nervous. And so he said, you didn't even do anything. I said, I think I need you to sit down and look sexy. I said, these people getting ready to come out, watch me work. He had his assistant on one end and another one on the other end, and I was in the middle. So all I did was have him sit and when I tell you, everybody that walked by, they complimented me on my hair, my shoes, the dress, everything to draw them over. And I was very friendly. So he sold every last one of those books. And I said, well, honey, I said, guess what I got? He said, what you got? I said, a bag of money. Yeah. He said, what? And so both of his assistants came to me and I said, how did you guys do? They were like, well, we did all right. I said, give me these books. And so what ended up happening is from That experience, watching him go from Superman immediately to Clark Kent, to be all in his insecurities, for me to say, I got this. So no, you don't just like me because I showed up and I'm pretty. No, it's, oh, I'm good for your peace, legacy, and your portfolio. So right after that, he sent his team home. He said, I'm gonna put them on a flight. He said, you want to stay in LA an extra day? I was like, yeah, what we gonna do? He said, you want to go shopping? I said, oh, Yes. And we went shopping just simply because I was there to make his life better in that moment. Even— it was a lot of different dynamics that happened. I became the business partner. I became the accountant. But I also became that soft place to land when he came off that stage. And it was like I could just— I mean, his whole face. I'm like, how did he just get up here in front of all of these people? But because I understand and he functioned in Clark Kent, I was able to still respect him in that space and say, "I got it. Here's your special pen I ordered you with your name on it." Gotcha.

And that's important because a lot of times when women— when men are vulnerable with women, they make the mistake of seeing it as weakness.

Yes.

And then what happens is you lose his trust.

Yes.

And he'll never be vulnerable with you again.

Yes.

There's 3 things that you get. I'm going to give you the sauce here, ladies. All right?

OK.

There's 3 things you have to do continually in a relationship, and you did a really good job with doing that. One, you have to forever be dropping your handkerchief.

Yes.

What that means is you're telling a man, this is good. Come, please.

Yes.

OK?

Yes.

You don't just do that when you meet.

Yes.

You do that in a bedroom, throughout the house. In business, every day of your life, you're gonna have to do that with your man. You're gonna have to drop handkerchiefs, okay, to let him know things are good. Come on over.

Yes.

All right, the second thing is you found gaps. Every man, no matter how successful or unsuccessful he is, he has gaps. And sometimes he can't see those gaps. As you said before, you're the rearview mirrors.

Yeah.

Okay, you could look in your rearview and see what's behind you. Okay? But if you can't see what's on the side of you, you can never change lanes.

Yes.

And so your woman is that. She's that ability for you to see what's going on on the side of you. You got to find those gaps. The other thing that's really important, I'm not going to give them all the sauce, okay, is you have to create peace for a man. Because a man is, a man is always driven towards you know, ambition, which is gonna create some level of chaos.

Yes.

And as this chaos is being created, you're gonna be the soft landing spot for him. So when he's that boy coming off the stage and being vulnerable, he needs to know that you can bring him that peace. Yes. And if you can bring him those pe— that peace and drop that handkerchief and find those gaps, that is just 3 ways that you can show up for a man. And you did that in just one instant.

Ah, very good observation. Good. Very good observation, Doc.

Yeah, indeed, indeed. Now, so how do women become better at vetting, vetting men? Now, the reason why I'm asking you this is because there seems to be zero to little accountability on the actual experience that many women are having. You know, when we're on the, on tour, we constantly hear women saying there's no men to date here, or the men that I have dated they weren't worth dating. And it's so— in life for me, it's so important to first look in the mirror and understand what is my level of accountability? Because I'm a law of attraction person. Yes. If I'm getting what I'm getting, it's because of what I'm putting out. That's how I always see things. So if business isn't going well, I ask myself, how are you showing up?

Yeah.

How do you feel on the inside? And so, So can you give us a little bit of, you know, some tips on what women can do to better vet men so that they don't then have these horrible experiences, end up in these marriages that they're not supposed to be in, and then as a result of that, they're traumatized, and then they take that trauma into the next relationship?

Well, the number one thing women can do to be better at vetting— it's not a strategy, it's what they really don't want to do. Got you. Get connected to their femininity, their spirituality, their sensuality, and their wisdom. These 4 components, ladies, this is the secret sauce.

Yeah.

Because these 4 things allows you to see and have insight very quickly. Like, I can see through the BS pretty quick. And if I just decide to play over there because I want to play, it ain't because I didn't know. I see it and just decided, okay, let me, let me, let me play with this a little bit.

Yeah.

You know, because I'm bored. That was the old version of me, y'all. That was the old version of me. But that's what I used to do. But it's like, once you understand those 4 components, it's hard for a man to run game on you when you have those 4 components. Secondly is, once you get those 4 components, you got to know what your core needs are. One of the things I get asked all the time is, Ms. April, what questions do you ask on a first date? I said, I ain't telling you. I said, I'm not telling you because these are my core things. I know what I need and who I am. So Y'all go get these lists off of the internet and you asking these random questions and they guys might be answering them correctly, but there's an unfulfillment that you have because you have not gotten to know you. So you'll know the proper questions to ask that are in alignment with what you want.

Got you.

And I believe if women really tapped into that, those 4 components and finding their core needs, and typically your core needs your list of things typically isn't maybe about 4 or 5 things when you get in connection with those 4 other components. But your core needs typically, typically aren't a lot. Yeah, uh, your list of wants is a lot, but your core stuff— and how do you get to that core stuff? One way is to look at the things you did not get in the relationship previously and what things you used to complain about.

Gotcha.

You'll start learning what your standards and your value is if you go back through your past and look at the things that really made you angry or made you feel like you weren't unwanted or didn't feel valued. Those things, that's how you start finding your, your value and what you— your standards.

Gotcha, gotcha. Because I always say this also, there are things that are negotiable and non-negotiable.

Yes.

And you need to know what your non-negotiables are.

Yes.

Your negotiables, don't even worry about those, they're negotiable.

Mm-hmm.

But your non-negotiables, those are the things that you really need to be focused on. Because say for instance, if in a relationship, sex is very important.

Mm-hmm.

You meet a man and he has diabetes and he has problems with erectile dysfunction, then you know that that's gonna be a problem.

But he a good man, Dr. Bobby.

Now, now here's the, I will say this as devil's advocate, a lot of women step over a lot of good men you know, to get after the men who is not gonna be any good for them in the end anyway. And so what I always tell people is, again, non-negotiable is negotiable. Is it non-negotiable for you to help him recover his health? If you say, I can help this man recover his health, and if he's willing to do that, then—

Why not?

Then why not? You know, because that's something that can change.

Yes.

You understand? Now, this man is on his deathbed, then there ain't nothing you could do for this man. You're not a doctor. You're not God.

He can't take none of your detox.

Well, he could do the detox if you know Dr. Bobby. But the point I'm trying to say is if you have that nurturing in you to say, hey, I think I can help this man. His diet is very poor. He doesn't take care of himself. I love him enough at this point to say, let's do this together and he's willing to do it, let's take a try at it. But I think it's really important to know what those non-negotiables are, because if you're not willing to do that, walk away.

Yes, yes. I, I believe that a lot of women are holding out for this guy, this, this imaginary guy, 6-foot, 6-figure, and 6-pack, honey. You know, I, I tell him all the time, Women stay in my DMs asking me to hook them up with Bobby Ray. And I'm like, oh, you ain't eat, sis. I don't know. I don't know. I don't know if you ready for that. Ready for that. Because of their perception, you know, of, oh my God, Ms. April, he looks like, you know, he listen to sound bowls and he put his feet in the grass and he be grounding. I'm like, he do that, but he do some other stuff too. So, and I believe women get caught up in that. This fantasy of what something looks like. And this— what happens is why they don't vet properly, because you, you like the aesthetic and you want it to be what you want it to be versus what it really is.

Yeah.

And I'd be like, girl, all right. I said, Bobby, don't play.

Yeah, because it's like, you know, you know an example I give, give my friends? I tell them, I was like, all right, so you like a man that protect you, right? You like a man that got some hands on him just in case something happens. Well, you gotta understand, it took something for him to be able to get them hands on him.

All right?

So that's the kind of man you got. You got a warrior. Are you cool with having a warrior? That don't mean he gonna disrespect you, hit you, or anything like that. But like, the rope is short. You know? So like, he's in protection mode. That means that you ain't gonna be able to be gyrating and naked on the internet. That. That's part of the protection.

Yes, yes.

I'm saying, so like, a lot of, a lot of people don't understand what comes with what they're asking for.

Yes, they don't look at the other side. It's like, it's all of the warm and fuzzy stuff, but for everything that you want in a man, like you said, it took something for him to get that. So you got to be— you got to be ready for what you're asking for, which is why it's imperative for women to, even if they are single, to really solid masculine men in their life so they can know what that looks like. Even going out with you, when we would go out and eat and stuff or hang out, it's a look that you get. It's like, I already know, okay, yeah, he ain't playing. It's a look. And it's like, it's not that you're not the man that I know. I just know that look. And it's like, okay, yeah, yeah, I'mma just sit back, child. I'mma let him handle that. I ain't in that. But I don't— and I think sometimes when women are not around men that really function in all of their man, yeah, it can be like, oh my God, that was too much. No, that—

he too extra.

Yeah, he's too extra. It's like, no, the other parts that you like, it took this over here for him to be this way. I remember going out, I think I told you about the date I went on with the guy, um, and I got a little nervous. He's like 6'6" and he was just fine. All the women was looking at him in the restaurant when we walked in, right? But I didn't know he was so intense. So when we get to the restaurant, the lady said, "Do you have a reservation?" He said, "No, do we need one?" It was like his whole face and everything was just like in her face. He was just that guy. And so I'm sitting there and I'm watching his presence. He can do this face thing that he does, and it can be very intimidating to people. And so everybody was walking around, they was kind of scared of him a little bit. But then And then what was funny was when we sat down at the table, he turned into a teddy bear. He texted me from across the table and said, you're so sexy. I'm like, he couldn't tell me that. But in front of all these people, you rah-rah. And so that's what I mean by that, knowing that you got this part, but you going to deal with something over here too.

You're his safe space.

Yes. Yeah.

Are women prepared for a man who's walking in his divine masculinity, evolved and emotionally intelligent?

No.

Why do you say that?

Because women are connected to their femininity, their spirituality, their sensuality, and their wisdom.

Yeah.

If you're not connected to those things and you don't have men around you all the time on a regular basis that walk in that same energy that you say you want in a man, how can you receive it? Yeah, you're not functioning in it, you're not practicing in it, you're not operating in the divine feminine so much that it's become your lifestyle. So here's the thing, when you walk in that girl energy, you crave masculine leadership. Yeah, you need it. It's not like you view it as, um, you being, uh, controlled. No, when you really operate in your divine feminine, you're very whimsical. I tell you all the time, I'm Peter Pan. No, I tell you, I'm the fairy. I'm a little butterfly. I'm just the lady that I have to have— I have to be reeled in. You're like, what you doing today? Ah, you'd be like, what you doing? Oh, I'm just going over here. I'm doing this. I'm doing that. We can't be in that energy all the time. Yeah. So true femininity craves masculine containment and vice versa. We need it. So we We can't push against that, 'cause child, if you wanted women to be in their femininity all the time, nothing would get done. 'Cause we just floaty and la la la la la. We like the lady on the Summer's Eve commercial on the beach with our little white dresses, just, oh, what day is it?

I like the video, the memes that you're seeing going around of girls saying, whenever I'm with my boyfriend, my masculine boyfriend, I'm dumb as hell and I don't know what's going on.

I don't know what the plans are.

Nothing.

That's what we do. So femininity isn't a bad thing. Femininity, it doesn't mean you're a doormat. It doesn't mean you have to, um, acquiesce all the time, because we have in-depth conversations where we agree and we disagree, you know, often. But it's not like it's a—

we've never had an argument, like, because I respect your, your opinion and I, I value your opinion as well too. So, and it's just like that with any woman I date, it's going I'm looking for your opinion. I don't want somebody I can run over. I don't want somebody who's dumb, somebody who's not gonna show up for me, somebody I can't confide into, somebody I can't come to and say, "Baby, what do you think about this?" Right.

Right. And I think that's probably why we've never had an argument, 'cause I value what you say. And I was like, you'll say, "Wait, wait, wait. Just listen. Just listen." I'm—

That's exactly how you are too.

So, I believe that when you can have dialogue, dialogue, you know, and have conversation versus everybody's trying to get their point, you know. Everybody's listening to respond versus to actually hear what's being said. And I, I just, I hope men and women can get it together because we definitely need each other. And I tell my ladies, be honest. Say you want a husband. It'd be so hard for them to say. I said, say it. Just, just say it. Say you want a husband. Don't put a comma in it. I desire a husband, period. They do. I desire a husband. But Miss April Mason, I'm not dealing with that. I didn't say that. I didn't say that. I said, because when you put that comma in there and you go on this tangent, I want a husband is 4 words. After that comma, you done put 72 words. That's your dominant.

Yeah.

So let's not do that. Let— it's okay, because women have been taught that if they say they want and need a man in their life, we're taught that it's being desperate. Separate. And it's just because you want and need something don't mean you're gonna take whatever one comes your way. You still got to vet it to make sure it's in alignment with the lifestyle that you want. And, and that's, that's a big thing, um, as well, that I believe everybody's all, all caught up in this he got to make six figures. I'm not. Um, like I said, we don't do broke, but I look at it more so as a lifestyle. Yeah, you know, does this person want to live the same lifestyle or live the same lifestyle that I do. Yeah, I look at it from more that perspective than, than anything else. And I think that's the, the bigger thing, because say you had— you're a woman making $250,000 and this man's making $150,000, y'all still in the same tax bracket. Yeah, for the most part.

And that whatever your needs are, like, can be met with that.

Yeah, so it's like and most of your wants. Yeah, it's like, so I'm looking at more so lifestyle. And also, um, lifestyle— sometimes people may not know what they, what they need until you come into their life and they adapt— adopt, excuse me— they adopt, well, actually, this is better for me. Yeah, you know, I might not have come to that realization on my own, but women, as women, I believe we got to stop making the decision within our brains that y'all know everything right now. Fellas, I love y'all, I really do, but y'all be Simple Simons. And I believe as women, we give y'all way too much credit than we should in the romance area. Most men, ladies, don't know romance.

No.

And it's like, well, he needs to plan a romantic— most men are not romantic. We house the romance. Like, you— I remember you said one day you planned the most, the most sexiest dates, even if it's something that I'm doing for by myself.

Yeah, I'll be looking at it like, damn, let me copy this. I got a whole note in my iPhone, stuff you send me. I'm like, what? Let me put that in there.

And I believe women don't understand that a lot of the things that we want you all to do, you get through us. The Tinder man that you want, the man that's romantic, and all of these things that we have that we desire, they learn those things through the women that came before them. Yeah, I believe that if you find somebody that meets your core needs and say he's lacking in the romance area, you become romance. You be the romance, and then you, you guide him into that. Now, he ain't gonna get it right for the first several times, understand that. He's not gonna get it right. You tell him you like yellow roses, all you're gonna get is yellow roses until you tell them you like peach roses. That's when it's going to change. But I believe sometimes— well, most of the times, we as women give y'all more power when it comes to knowing certain stuff that you don't know, and we think you should know it. And it's like, girl, he don't know that. Is he good to you? Yeah. He take care of you and y'all good? Yeah. But Miss April, he not romantic and he don't plan the best dates. I said, do he give you his credit card? Yeah. You plan it and you take his credit card and you pay You paid for it.

Yeah, 100%.

And then you drop little hints. Oh, honey, it was amazing. That date was amazing that you planned. Well, Miss April, I planned it. I know that.

Yeah.

I know you planned it, but you're dropping a seed. Honey, I had such an amazing time with you last night. I love when you plan stuff like this. Well, baby, you plan— but no, you paid for it. I love when it's— you makes you so much more sexier to me. So it's learning. I'm actually getting ready to teach a course all about feminine language is learning how I gotta say these things. But women be like, why I gotta say it like that? Why I gotta do all that? I'm like, you don't, you don't. Yeah, but that's why you got what you got, or you don't have what you want.

Exactly. Now I can't get out of here without— I gotta tap into the fellas too.

What's that?

A lot of men are making a lot of very poor decisions when it comes to women as well too.

Yes.

So it's not just women. Okay, so it's the fellas too. They're, they're choosing women who don't love them, who don't truly want to be with them. And whenever they leave, they get upset. And I believe one of the most important decisions that a man will ever make in his life is the woman he chooses to spend his life with, because he's a She's not only a representation of him, but she's a reflection of all his values.

Mm-hmm.

But today I'm looking like, you know, you got a situation with, I won't say names. You got a singer who last year people were tearing him up on the internet because he was emotional about his divorce.

Mm-hmm.

And losing his wife and losing his kids and crying on the internet because he was heartbroken. Broken. And most people tore him up, went in on him. And now all of a sudden you look and you see that, you know, his ex-wife is saying like, you know, I probably should have made a different decision. If I could think about it now, I probably would've stayed with my husband. And I hear this a lot from women. Like, I should have stayed with my last guy. He was much better than what's out here in these streets.

Ain't nothing in these streets, girls. Yeah.

And then you're, I'm starting to look at the young generation too. Like, there's an NBA player, I think he got a porn star pregnant.

Yeah.

You know, another NBA player gets this girl who's also well-known pregnant, doesn't love or care about him like that. They break it off. He ends up getting married a year later, a year or two later, and it looks like he's in a very similar situation. And so a lot of men are making a lot of bad decisions when it comes to the women that they're choosing because they're not properly vetting. So what advice do you have for men, you know, in terms of like, what are some of those signs that they should pay attention to and they can recognize when a woman really isn't into you? Because what I find is, is that, um, a woman will marry a good dude and later on find out a good dude isn't enough for her and then leave him and, and take the kids, take the resources, and leave them heartbroken?

Well, I'll tell the men just the same thing I tell the women. There's nothing that you can do to look for, or things that you can look for until you make an identity switch. So I can give you all kind of, a list of all kind of things. Make sure she does this, and if she does this, then don't do that. I could give you a whole list of that, but it doesn't count if you have not made a mental identity switch within yourself. Because what we see and like I said, we have a division of the company called the Feminine Ear, and I work with a lot of celebs, celebrity men. And one of the hardest things that we have to do, the challenges is getting them to understand. I'm like, baby, look, the last 5 women you showed me, they're all the same in a different body.

Yeah.

Why do you keep choosing them? And so I can typically figure it out rather quickly. But I want them to try to, you know, figure it out. And I'm like, everybody's the same. I said, why you got to cap and save them spirit on you? Why do you feel the need? Let's talk about what happened. Let's talk about, you know, your past. What was your relationship like with your mother? And a lot of those guys also have what I call arrested development. They're used to only paying.

Yeah.

They don't get with women that challenge them emotionally, intellectually to rise higher because all they got to do is buy a Birkin bag, a G-Wagon, bragging, you know, take them on a trip. That's it. So when you surround yourself with people like that, you can't expect to really find a good relationship, and you really can't complain about what you're getting because you're the common denominator. I just go harder on women because I understand the girl power that we have, but the men are doing the same thing that the women are doing and complaining. Every man that complains about women, are they being gold diggers and all of this stuff. Yeah, stay in your lane.

Yep. Typically leading with your resources.

You're leading with your resources and you're leading with your resources to a demographic of women that your resources aren't enough.

Yeah.

And then you complain, bruh, stay in your lane. If you are a J— um, what do you call it, a Walmart dude? Stay at Walmart.

Yeah.

If you're JCPenney's, your Macy's, your Dillard's, your Saks, Stay in your lane. And I believe people would not have so many issues and having these negative conversations about what other people want if they stayed in their lane. It's just like the single mothers that say, you know, it's not fair to— men don't want single mothers. Well, go— there's a demographic of men that are okay with you having children. Go over there with them. You know, and so I just believe that until we make a mental shift, we got to change the motherboard. We got to figure out how did we get here? Here because there's no real advice I can give a man on what to look for when his motherboard hasn't changed. So we totally have to reprogram that.

Yeah, I agree with that 100%.

You know, because anything that I tell you, it's just like when I would share with women, one of the things that caused me to retire is the fact that women wanted to take what I taught as strategy.

Yeah.

It worked to attract, but it doesn't work to maintain.

Yeah.

So now it's like, wait a minute, Miss April Mason, now what do I do? What you mean? If you would have become the thing that you're trying to sell this man on, you would know what to do.

Yeah.

And it's the same thing.

Acting.

Yeah, it's acting. It's performance. And it's the same thing with the men. It's like, if you want a woman that don't want you more, wants you more for just what you have, yes. Get over it, fellas. Women like men with resources.

Sure.

Doesn't matter where you come from.

Hmm? Provision and feeling secure.

Yes. It's what it is. All of this, women don't love us unconditionally. No, we don't love you unconditionally.

And we don't love you unconditionally.

Exactly. So the thing is, find somebody within your tax bracket and be okay with that. But when you lead with what you have, like I I'm around quite a few successful men, including yourself. Not one time have you ever led with— we don't even really talk about resources unless we having this business powwow.

Yeah.

Other than that, I wouldn't have known all of this other stuff because our relationship wasn't built on that. So I believe that a lot of times people lead with what they think their value is. And a lot of times you'll hear men say, well, I gave her everything and she's still not happy and she still left. And I always ask them, did you give her what she needed? Did you ever ask what she needed? Sometimes it's not just the money. Yes, we want you to be able to protect and provide. Absolutely. But it's not just that.

Yeah.

You know, because if it was just that, it's easy, you know, for a woman to just go get those things because we can get it for ourselves.

Yeah.

What else do you have other than— they say they be having, they be throwing it down in the bedroom. That's what they say. Okay, but that, that is important. Yeah, it's important, it's important. However, if you ain't got no sense, it's like, what did I just lay down with, a dummy?

I don't know, because I'll be seeing a lot of women can't let go that toxic eggplant.

Yes, and that's the thing, it's only the eggplant. It's like you're not getting anything else, you know. But the fact, the funny thing is they always say the toxic man has the best sex. I'm like, yeah, because I ain't got nothing else to do but perfect They're not out here working. They're not out here doing all of the stuff that you say you want. And now you hooked on a man that you have an emotional connection to that can't give you the lifestyle that you want. And you hooked on that. But yet, and you're going to try to make him become this other guy. And that's what the men do that I coach. They bring me women and I've gone to several dinner parties. Miss April, I want you to meet her. I want you to give me your assessment. I'll go in the room. Room, and then they'll look at me after about maybe 30 minutes, an hour. What you think? I'll be like, April, you ain't it. For what you told me you wanted in our sessions, baby girl, it's not it. But you gotta listen. Yeah, you have to be willing to listen to that. But everybody has their own thing. I just believe that identity switching is required. If once people get get to the understanding that they're their own issue. Yeah, I believe that's when we will see a change instead of blaming everybody else. But where are these men at, Miss April? They're not checking for you because your, your antenna is not up. Your, your switched, um, identity isn't up. So there's a lot of great men out there, but you won't be able to— they won't be able to see you. Yeah, because you're on the wrong frequency.

Yeah, for sure. Before we get out of here, tell people how they can stay connected with you and also tell them about identity. Identity Switch that you've been talking about this whole interview.

Oh, yes, yes, yes. So you can always find me on Instagram under Miss April Mason, our website AprilMason.com. But Identity Switch is a book that after I retired— and what caused me to retire is because I realized, April, all the information that you're giving, people may have a hard time receiving it because they haven't made an identity switch within themselves first. So I paused all of the other love stuff because in order to receive, you got to change the motherboard. So Identity Switch, Becoming the Woman Who Gets What She Wants, bestseller on Amazon. You can listen to it on Audible. The fellas listen to it a lot too. They're like, Miss April, what you teaching? I know you teaching the women, but when you teach the women, that's the kind of woman that I want. So it let me feel— make me feel like I need to become a type of man that that kind of woman— so the fellas are loving the book.

And as you say, men are just more used to being coached.

Yes.

And women are more used to being coddled.

Coddled, yes.

So men grew up in sports and having mentors, and so they're used to getting the coaching. So that's probably why they show up for you like that.

Yeah, the fellas definitely show up, the ones that want to be evolved. Now, you know, there's a whole 'nother demographic of the males, but I'm talking to the ones that say, Ms. April, and they're honest with themselves, I really do want a good woman. Like, who do I need to become in order to get the type of woman that I hear you talking about?

About.

And I always tell them, you got to remember, she, she wants you to be able to provide, but remember, that girl, she can take care of herself too. So what can you bring to her life that money can't buy?

Absolutely. Absolutely.

So, so that's why we came up with the book. And I just believe if people made an identity switch, they'll stop playing.

Yeah, with themselves and others.

Yeah, with themselves and others. And girl, go get you a husband and quit playing and act like you don't want one. Go stop playing.

All right, got you. Now, but I've, man, one of my goals in life is I believe love is medicine.

I do too.

And I want to see us come together. I want to see beautiful relationships. The woman find the man of her dreams and the man find the man of her dream, his dreams. And so I'm going to give you this question. If you rule the world, Mm-hmm. How would you heal our relationships and love in our community?

It goes back to what I just said. I would help as many people as I can make that mental identity switch. Yeah. So that they know that they're deserving, they're worthy, and what's out there that they're looking for is actually looking for them too. Yeah. That's what I would say.

Gotcha, gotcha, gotcha. Got you. I love that. Thank you so much for joining us with this session. This has been an amazing conversation that we've had today. I hope your heart is filled with love and I hope your mind is filled with more understanding and wisdom so that you can find the love not only in relationships outside of yourself, but the relationship with yourself. Until the next time, peace and blessings and Godspeed.

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