Fundamentals To Focus On While Building A Multi 8 Figure Business Using Funnels - Law Payne | TNS 02

What's going on? What's going on, boys and girls, and everyone who's watching this show, all the entrepreneurs? Guess what's going on, guys? This is me, the Nikhil Sai, back again, back again with another rocking interview. First of all, everyone who's watching this, welcome to the Nikhil Sai Show, which is hosted by me, the Nikhil Sai. And guess what? We are interviewing another 2 comma C winner, not 2 comma Club winner this time. Pretty big guy. You can call him a shark and call him a whale. Whatever, super crazy guys, one of the top guys I've ever seen in the industry right now. And I can really speak out about his accomplishments for more than an hour right now. He really needs a big 100-square-foot wall to attach all of his awards. But yeah, like to mention, he is a 9-time 2 Comma Club Award winner, 3 times 2 Comma X winner, and 1 time 2 Comma C winner. And he has done more than $50 million in sales in just 1 year of span. He was just a fitness entrepreneur, now turned helping big businesses scale to 6, 7, and 8 figures, delivering crazy results. If you listen to his offer, it's damn irresistible. Like, you cannot resist yourself to get in. And let's not waste any time, and please, please, please welcome Law Payne, who is CEO at Online Empire Course.

Hey, Law, what's up everybody?

Absolutely, brother, super excited. We are, we are grateful that you actually joined on time, brother. Thank you so much for your time. And how was your day so far, brother?

Uh, a little hectic. Me and my wife recently had twins that just turned 1, so our life has kind of been all over the place. They basically run the show, as you know, uh, being a parent. And it's, it's been, it's been incredible. Sunday, so it's a church day.

Hope everything will be fine.

Yeah, it's always a good day on Sunday when we get to, you know, worship and have the kids at church, and it's awesome, man. It's been a beautiful day.

Absolutely. Appreciate it, brother, and hope everything will be fine with everything which is going in your personal life. And brother, like, your business accomplishments, that's crazy to talk about. Can we just start with your backstory? Like, how did all this happen? Like, from being scratch to starting your own business to scaling to multiple 8 figures in sales. Can you talk about it? How did you start in your business?

Yeah. Yeah. So I guess I'll kind of give you guys kind of the, the short version of kind of my story. So I come from a small place here located centrally in the United States called Muskogee, Oklahoma. I was raised by my mom, who was an extremely, extremely hard worker. And I guess what I, what I, what I learned watching her work like 3 jobs, like in a day, that, that's kind of how my brain was wired as I grew up and as I started to take on more jobs. And that's kind of how I am today. Like I own 6 companies, like I never stop working. So it's very, I'm very similar to how my mom or what I saw growing up. But I was one of the first, I was actually the first person in my family to go to college and graduate. And I told my mom, or we made this little pact that, hey, I'll help you get through college, but I want you to be the guy in our family to change things. So that was one of the things that me and my mom agreed on. And I was lucky enough to actually finish with two bachelor's and a master's degree in business. And I took a lot of that stuff that I learned in school, and I'm a business owner now. But it didn't always— wasn't always peaches and sunshine. After college, I ended up getting fired from a job, actually, that kind of started me into the online space. I was a regional manager at one of the local gyms here, and I was managing 5 different fitness clubs. I had a really, really good salary. I had outperformed my, or I felt like I outperformed my performance in terms of like hitting the numbers and all the clubs that I was managing. But the boss, they said no to me asking for a raise. And I ended up just walking out of the place with my box. And this was right, this, yeah, this is crazy. This is right before I had asked my wife to marry me. And we were, we were both really competitive drug-free bodybuilders. We also won world titles in drug-free bodybuilding, and we were getting ready for the world championships like right around the same time. So there was like a tremendous amount of pressure on my shoulders at this time. So I ended up losing a job, trying to figure out, hey, what's my next steps? Quickly, and I thank God. So I'm a faith-based person. I felt like God was looking out for me because at that time I had a really good friend that was really into marketing who was my mentor at the time and still is my mentor. He was the guy that said, hey, why not just take what you do right now and put it online? And in my mind, I was training some clients online anyway, but it was like probably like 4 or 5 clients at the time where I was just doing nutritional plans and stuff like that. But he was like, let's really do it. Like, let's just create a website, let's make an offer. And at this time, I'm like, I'm trying to figure stuff out. I'm just trying to make sure that I can, I can pay the bills and take care of the responsibilities. And salvage this marriage that, you know, I just asked my wife to marry me and still do good at this world championships, this competition that I committed to. So like I said, I feel like God's always looking out for you because I put my faith in my best friend at the time and he literally mentored and coached me and taught me so much. So many things about what real advertisement was. Um, and this is well before ClickFunnels. This is probably like year 2009, uh, our first year, uh, taking our business online. We were doing 7 figures, and this was the time where nobody was in the space. So there was, there was no online coaches, there was nobody to mimic, uh, there was really no, nobody to like look at and say, hey, I like to make a my business somewhat like that model. Uh, but I, I, I feel like at the beginning, man, I got really, really lucky. And yes, I'm a really, really hard worker, but I feel like I got really, really lucky. Like, God was really blessing me and looking out for me because, you know, without the help of somebody that actually knew what they were doing, I don't feel like I would be in the position that I am in today. Like, I honestly feel like that. But yeah, so my story kind of started there in the online space. And then obviously I learned so much and then I got so obsessed with how things were, like the processes, the systems. And then this new thing called ClickFunnels came out, like I think in 2014, like we were literally some of the first people to actually sign up. And yeah, I'll tell you a quick story. Like, this is funny because my mentor at the time, my best friend, was like, hey, there's this new software coming out. We need to jump on this. And I'm like, well, first of all, how much is this? And he tells me the price. He says, I think at the time, like $99, $97 a month. And I was like, oh no, there's no way. I was like, I don't even pay that much for my WordPress website. You're telling me we have to pay that every month? So long story short, he ended up paying for the ClickFunnels account because I was so cheap. I was like, no, I'm not paying that, that's too much. He's like, he said, trust me, trust me, it's gonna work. And literally, like, it made things so easy. And I don't want to pitch ClickFunnels, but it was, it was one of the things that was a real game changer in terms of, like, making just making your life easier in terms of— because I didn't go to website— I didn't go to college to like code or build websites or do any of that stuff. True. ClickFunnels made it not just easy with the tools that you can add on, but the learning things that they just gave for free. Because, you know, at that time I was like a sponge, man. I was willing to do anything to learn. To continue to grow my businesses. 'Cause I was always like looking at, okay, we're doing 7 figures this year. Okay, next year, let's try to double that. The next year, okay, let's do 8 figures. And you know, I was always chasing that. Not because that stuff was important, but it gave me a clear path. It gave me a goal. And I've always been kind of a, I've always been like that in sports, you know? Growing up in high school, like, hey, let's win a state title. Okay, done that. Let's, let's, let's win another state title. So that, that's always kind of how my mindset was, was a lot of great attitude. Yeah. So yeah, I don't know where I went with that, but yeah, I kind of started, uh, from humble beginnings, grew up in like a small place, um, kind of a place, man, if you guys look this up on the map, like it's a place where literally 95% of the people that live there, they're all in poverty. So no one really— yeah, no one really makes it out of this place. I honestly feel like, again, God was looking out for me. I got really, really lucky, and I always surrounded myself around people that were wanting to do things. So I think that's one of the reasons that I'm in the position that I am. I choose really good friends that have really good impact and influences on me because I believe your behavior can be impacted by what you see on a day-to-day basis. So I wanted to break away from, you know, this place that I grew up in because I already knew that if I stayed, I was not going to be successful. And I wanted to do something different. Remember, the pact that I made with my mom was, hey, you're going to be the person that changes everything for our whole family. And that started with going to college, getting an education, and magically you get a job from that.

So that's awesome, love. That's a really, really true story. Like, I really understand, you know, the depth inside the story. Like, starting from scratch, from nowhere, to living in a different place, to actually having a great vision and actually matching that vision right now, and having amazing people around you with the right mindset, and especially action you took, and going through all the rashes. That's amazing. And I really said that— I really see that you're a tough person, actually, really, really, really strong person, not just physically but mentally. I really see that. And like, you have been coaching, consulting a lot of businesses and helped multiple, like dozens of dozens of your clients scale 7 figures, 8 figures, and beyond. And I really believe like fundamentals are the roots of any business. They should be super strong, right? So to scale any business, right, to scale any business, like how to scale a business fundamentally strong in a quick way?

How to scale a business? Well, I always look at it like, well, when I get an entrepreneur that comes to me that says, hey, well, I want to scale, like, these are my numbers right now. For instance, let's just say hypothetically they'll say, hey, I'm doing six figures, I'd like to, you know, get a Two Comma Club Award, I'd like to do a million in sales. My question right off the bat is always why. Like, why do you want to sit? Why do you want to scale? Do you know what your KPIs are? So when I ask entrepreneurs that, 9 times out of 10, they have no clue what the numbers are. And what I mean by that, they don't know their true KPIs. They don't know what it, what it costs to acquire an actual client. They don't know the lifetime value of their client, and they don't really have a lot of offers that they're, that they're actually offering. They don't really know the margins. But the ones that do and the ones that truly, truly are in position to scale, I think, I think that the, the things that they have, the characteristics that they have, is they know their numbers, man. You got to know how much wiggle room you have to actually invest. And then you have to have a solid team, because if you want to scale, you got to have— and we're talking about consulting businesses Um, you gotta have closers, you gotta have a good clear path as to who your, who your client is, uh, who your avatar is. You gotta have a good copywriter, and you have to have a good product and service. If you have all those things in place, um, depending on how crazy you want to get, how high you want to scale, uh, you just, you just want to— I always tell people, take it slow, man. 'Cause a lot of people, they see me and they get the wrong impression. They're like, oh, this guy's doing $50 million, but they don't really know the true details of that. Like that is like half of the story and not all net profit. 'Cause a lot of people think, oh, you make the same money as LeBron James. I'm like, guys, no, no, not even close. Running a business is, uh, it's exciting. It's exciting. It's exhilarating, especially when you are doing what you love. Uh, and if it's something that you're just doing to just make money, you won't want to do it like every single day. So when you, when you are in a position where, hey, I want to just make— I get a lot of people that contact me to say, hey, I want to live a backpack lifestyle. I want to work from my laptop. I want to make a couple hundred K, but I'm ready to scale because I get so many people that reach out and say, hey, I want to, I want to do X, Y, Z. But when you ask real business questions, they're not in position. They don't really understand the little details that it takes. And it always goes back to, hey, you need to have a coach, you need to have a mentor. That's going to be the number one thing that gets you from, from where you are now to if you are one of— want to mimic the person that you're seeing in like TV ads or something like that. Or if you see like an ad of me, whether people reach out and they say, hey, I'm looking for a coach, like I recommend so many other coaches because if I feel like I can't help a client, let's say for instance, I get a lot of people that are not in my niche, uh, not in the exact area that I want to serve. I recommend them to people that I know for a fact can help them, because as a coach, it's your responsibility to make sure that, uh, that one, you can get clients results and you're being true, and, and you don't want to overexert yourself, because a lot of times clients think that you're magic They really think that when they hire you, like a flip is going to switch and they're going to magically make $10 million. And that's not the case because it takes so much time, energy, and work, and testing to even get to the process where you're positioned to scale. I'm kind of going all over the place, but feel free to jump in.

Absolutely, brother. Yeah, like that's really important, right? The fundamentals of business is Nothing but knowing their KPIs, knowing their why, having the right team, right? Like that's the fundamental strength of any business. And absolutely what you just mentioned, looking at these awards and thinking that everything is profit, that's not real true for anyone, honestly, anyone you can see, right? So they should really understand the core principles and the profit margins in a business. Then they should decide how they can scale. In a nutshell, what you exactly mentioned. And a lot, like you've been seeing a lot of offers, you know, like low ticket offers, high ticket offers, coaching at very low price to even charging clients at $55,000, even $100,000 for consultations, right? So what do you think is the main difference between selling at normal price and selling at high ticket? Like what is the main difference between the sales process, especially while we're talking about?

I would equate more of like a normal process, like, hey, you see an ad and then you go to a website, you click and then you go buy. And we're talking like low-ticket things that, that don't make you feel uncomfortable when you spend. So I'm talking like, hey, you see an ad for like a shirt, like that takes little thought, uh, where people, people go through the process like seamless. Uh, when it comes to high-ticket stuff, there's literally like a whole different process where there's whole— not just a process from like the, the funnel and where, where people go. But the advertising, the retargeting, the fact that you got to see this person like 10, 15 times before you actually take action, because, because mainly the price makes you feel uncomfortable and you're going to want to ask questions. So that requires like a sales process, that requires a closer, that requires, uh, systems in place to make sure that, you know, people go where they need to go in a funnel. And then the follow-up. And yeah, as you said, I would say high ticket is more from $5,000 to about, you know, our stuff goes up to $250K is probably the highest ticket thing that we sell.

Absolutely. So yeah, that's really it. Like you can simply listen to what Los say and depending on your offer, you can craft the sales process. Now, low ticket, just make it more irresistible. Normal price point, just make sure you use the right KPIs and right retargeting. High ticket, get your niche clarity and only get people who are apt fit for your exact product or service you offer. And that's awesome, brother. So let's get into the next question quickly, Law. Like, you know, when we are talking about high ticket sales, what's happening in the market right now? Everything about appointments, like it's, it's all about getting high tier appointments over and over again, right? So what do you think is the best way to get highly qualified appointments online? Like in a nutshell, like in a quick process? How does that look like?

Uh, the best way that we have found is really making sure that your message is, is on point. First of all, making sure you know who you're advertising to, and then taking them through more of a pre-qualifying type step where you can ask additional questions to make sure that that's the right person. Uh, and you know, they're, they're obviously getting, uh, the right information for the right product. So you would ask them, you know, 10 questions and ask them if they're willing to invest, if it's a high-ticket offer. And then also do something else where we follow up where somebody physically reaches out, where we can nurture and also do like a second pre-qualification where we ask them the same type of questions and get them to commit, uh, from there. Then we set up the actual call. If we don't take it right then and there, then we kind of go through the process so we're not— so both parties are not wasting their time. This person's ready to take action or at least hear the pitch.

True. And everyone, everyone who is actually making excuses about getting appointments, like 8-figure business owner explained the simplest way, right? Like people really complicate it with all these crazy funnels, ads, emails, follow-ups, CRMs, and all the crazy stuff. But in a nutshell, like, that's what you exactly mentioned— knowing avatar, getting clarity on the offer, solving a real problem, then just making sure if they have the ability to invest, if that's a real burning desire or not, right? And that's awesome. I appreciate it. And brother, like, we really see, like, there's a huge mindset difference of every single entrepreneur, right? Like, it's completely up and down, like, completely different, right? So when we talk about running a multiple 8-figure business, Like, can you talk about like the mindset, like how it should be, how abundant should we think, like how long vision should we have to know to actually have the capacity to run an 8-figure business or manage everything which is happening on the plate? Because when you're doing big business, you have so many things on the plate that you really need big capacity to think and manage everything, right?

Yeah. So, so let me make sure I'm understanding the question. So the mindset of, uh, an 8-figure business owner? Is that the question?

Yep.

I think, I think the mindset of an 8-figure business owner is they're crazy. Like, they're crazy obsessed. Most of them, if they're like me, they have a ton of conviction in what they're doing, meaning they know exactly why they're doing it and they believe it 100% with all their heart, body, and soul. Uh, those guys, again, they're a little crazy. They're a little crazy. Anybody that has like an 8-figure, uh, company, they're like ADD, uh, because they're, they're so focused helping people, man. It's like, it's like an obsession. I know me personally, like, if I did— if I could— if I, if I didn't have to sleep, I would never sleep because when I'm sleeping, I feel like I'm wasting time that I could be helping people. And I know a lot of 8-figure business owners are the same way because we know this, this ability to help people. It doesn't matter if you're 8-figure, 7-figure, like, you'll get more obsessed about it. I think the mindset is they're just a little more determined, and it could be they have more focus, they have more tunnel vision, and just really a target.

Absolutely. And that's absolutely amazing. Like, what we really see is a driven force in the back end. Like, that's crazy. That's nuts completely. Like, if you cannot sleep, if you have an ability to not sleep, you choose not to sleep. You choose not to rest. You choose to work 24/7. And that's what really makes the difference of, you know, being a normal guy to actually being and running a business successfully. And that's awesome. But, and no, like, I really wonder, like, you're managing big things at a big level scale, you know, running 6 companies at a time, doing all this crazy revenue, like can you a little bit talk about like a checklist of the tools you mainly use to manage projects, make sure that you're productive enough for your day? So like list out like maybe 5 tools if possible.

Yeah, right now we have, I would say around 50 contractors/employees that work for all the companies that we have. And we use tools, we use 2 tools. We use Asana, And then we use Slack to basically manage everybody. I'm in like a role now where I don't really do a whole lot besides just get different messages from like the, the virtual assistant that actually speaks directly with me when something's really important. I'm kind of on the back end where I really work about 3 to 4 hours between the 6 different companies per week. And the team really manages the different companies. But at the beginning, as I was building all the businesses up, of course I'm, I'm doing the grinding, I'm doing the recordings so that I can train and build out, you know, the tools so everybody can know exactly what expectations are, uh, the processes, fulfillments, and things like that. But I'm in a role now where I don't really Honestly, my day is kind of weird. I wake up. The biggest, most exciting thing is I get about an hour with my wife where we kind of have a little bit of time where we pray, we meditate about an hour before we wake up our twins. Then we get the twins up, we feed them, give them their bottles, play with them a little bit. I check a few emails. And then our nanny comes and then we get to go to the gym together, spend some more time, go work out for about 2 hours, come back, check emails. And we kind of repeat that where we're feeding the babies. You know, it's all about the kids because we're like, our whole day's built around these guys. But, but our team really runs everything because you got to understand, I'm in like chapter, chapter 50. You know, I'm in chapter 50, so I see that. Just getting a little chance, making sure things are going where they need to, and, you know, uh, responding on ads and making sure all the ads are optimized, and little new products we're working on.

Absolutely. And everyone is watching this, this is not the day 1, this is probably the day 10,000. So you're gonna make it, just stick to the process and stay in the line, right? Stay in the line, stay grinding. And you know how hard Law worked when he started first company or second company from scratch? It's crazy. Now everything is done for him. He's literally managing. And like, you've been doing crazy stuff so far. So like, what will be your suggestion to a 20-year-old you or someone who is just getting started right now? A simple suggestion: get a mentor.

Get a mentor, get a coach, get somebody to help you. Figure out what you wanna do in life. If I was to go back, I wish I would've spoke to somebody and just asked real questions because what I know now, I didn't know anything when I was 20 years old, man. I really was like, my mindset was, hey, let me get out of this shithole that I live in. Let me get as far away as possible let me go to college because that, that is the answer. This was like my mindset. And I thought when I finished, somebody was going to tap me on the shoulder and say, hey, here's this magic job. But that did not happen. Like, none of that happened. So I'm trying to figure it out as I go. And I had something instilled in me because of my mom, watching her work 3 jobs. No matter what, I was going to figure life out. And that's kind of how my story was. But if I was to go back and, you know, I have, I have kids. So the things that I'm going to tell them is make sure that you have a mentor, a coach in something that you want to do, like a specialist, somebody that is an expert. And if you're blessed enough to be able to actually get help with them, that's how you get the answers, like right there, like real answers, like And that's the best thing you can do to get to the next level, whether you're 20 or 30.

Yeah, no matter the age. And like, that's a real point right there. Like, no matter how old you are, if you have a real vision, like, just look at people who already achieved that vision and go and try to get some help from them. And I believe genuinely that getting coaching from someone who already done it is the fastest way to fast-track the road track of your own business or your own life whatever you want to achieve, for sure. That's awesome, love. And let's get into the next question, brother. What was your biggest mistake in life so far, uh, you know, running big businesses?

Oh, I got so many, we'll be here all day. No, like, so many mistakes. Um, let's see, let me think. What is the biggest mistake? Hmm, lacking courage. Uh, would be one of the biggest mistakes. A lot of times it's really hard for me to give up on people. Uh, sometimes, I mean, I'm just talking about like consulting side where I would have a closer that's not performing. It's hard for me to give up on people, man. I have a big heart, uh, and that takes courage, you know. And doing, doing the things that you need to do. Sometimes you just need courage to fire people and do what bosses do. I've made— I will be here all day. I can just keep going.

Absolutely.

Yeah, yeah. Let's just, let's just say that. Not being strong enough in terms of, you know, not feeling that you're gonna let somebody down, um, or hurt somebody's feelings.

So absolutely, you got a ton actually. But yeah, that's awesome, brother. And you know how— let's get into the next quick question. So far, let's wrap up. So like, your life's biggest achievement so far and any bigger next goals? Like anything else?

Uh, biggest achievement, biggest achievement would probably be, uh, my wife. She's the reason that I think I'm in this position, because without her, I didn't really have, uh, the direction or even want— wanting to be this successful. But when you find your partner, um, it's clear because you kind of see where you want to be in the future. And then when we have kids, it just got magnified. Um, and then obviously the things that we want to do to impact, uh, people that are struggling. Uh, we started different programs just to kind of give back. And, uh, yeah, being able to give more than we receive. We're pretty big when it comes to, uh, uh, helping, uh, the charities that we believe in. Yeah, one of the things that we did this past year is we gave in the mid-seven figures back to some of the charities that really, really moved us.

Awesome, awesome.

We'll just continue doing that. So that'll be one of our big goals is to continue to give back more than we receive, 'cause we can't keep it all.

Absolutely, and I think that's one of the biggest achievements so far. Like, that really feels grateful to leave and to be impactful to give back and, you know, to impact someone else's life in a positive way. And that's really why we're here, right? That's really why we're here. We have a vision and that's awesome. Thank you so much for that. And, but you are awesome guy. Like, this is something amazing. Now everyone who's watching this may need your help. So where our audience can find you mentoring?

Uh, you guys can find me on Instagram. I'm typically on there, not really on Facebook a lot. It's normally one of my virtual assistants running the account, responding back to people. Instagram, I have that on my phone, so I typically respond back to people. So yeah, you can go to IG, and if you do, you're gonna get retargeted with lots of ads, so expect that. And if you wanna, you know, connect with me, just opt in on one of the funnels on one of the ads that you get, and you'll see a lot of different pitches from a lot of the content that we're we're pushing out there.

Absolutely, and that's a real pitch right there. That's awesome. That's an 8-figure pitch, honestly, to say that. So yeah, and brother, any last words before we conclude the whole session?

Yeah, if you guys are watching this and you're, you know, lacking motivation, inspiration, just always believe you can do anything. It starts with you. Of course, you got to believe it. You got to be a little crazy. To where you have that focus, that tunnel vision, and you got to have the mindset that no matter what, you're going to be relentless, you're not going to stop, and you're going to do everything possible to make sure that that becomes your— that's going to come true. I know for me, thinking that I can actually put my business online at the time that I did it, man, I was telling this to so many different trainers back in the day. And everybody would look at me and say, you're crazy, because nobody was doing it. But yet, yep, here I am.

Absolutely. And yeah, that's where everyone who's a misfit— actually, they look like a misfit, but that's a real fit, right? So you turn it out well and you show and be a real proof for everyone who never took action and inspired them to take action. And that's awesome. That's really sweet words, Law. Thank you so much. And again, Law, Thanks for this amazing opportunity, brother. Thank you so much for taking out your time and hopping on this quick episode today, and we really appreciate it. And everyone who watched this so far, I hope you enjoyed so much, and, uh, stay tuned for the next episode, guys. I'll be back with another great entrepreneur to add value, just, just like I did with Law. And Law, thank you so much, and peace out, guys. Hope you enjoyed this, and connect with Law if you need any more help. Have a great day.

Peace.