Money Talks:  What is your money saying about how you can live the rest of your life and do you have time to change it?

Hey, I'm Camille D. Jamerson, and this is Life at the Half, my midlife style podcast about shifting the over-40 crowd from midlife crisis to midlife clarity. Over the course of this limited season, Life at the Half will make you laugh, think, cry, feel, and it will inspire you to intentionally design this funky in-between season in our lives. Midlife doesn't who it's messing with. We are Gen X, baby, and it's just halftime for us. There is still so much more game for us left to live. So let's figure out our next play together, okay? Here on Life at the Half. Hey and welcome to Life at the Half. I am your host Camille D. Jamerson, and I can't wait to jump into today's episode. I'm calling this episode Money Talks, which, yes, okay, it's a Gen X movie from the '90s starring Chris Tucker and Charlie Sheen, but it's also a truth. Your money does talk, and it tells you every day what you can and what you can't do. Now, what is your money saying about how you can live the rest of your life, and do you have time to change it? I have the perfect person to discuss this with. If there's anybody that is going to help us secure the bag, it is my guest Stephanie Bott. Let me tell you a little bit about her. Stephanie is an attorney from Detroit, Michigan. She earned a bachelor's degree from Michigan State University— go green! She has a Juris Doctorate from Cooley Law School. She spent the bulk of her career working in law and community advocacy until around 2015, and then After spending years learning financial literacy and money management to improve her own financial knowledge, Stephanie decided to make a career shift into personal finance and became a certified financial coach. She founded Social Money Finance, a personal finance company that specializes in helping Gen X women make empowered financial decisions through the principles of effective money management. And if that wasn't fire by itself, Stephanie was just featured in December 2022 of Oprah Magazine in the famous Oprah's Favorite Things issue. Would you guys help me welcome to Life at the Half my friend Stephanie Bott. Hey, hey, hey, Stephanie! Hey, Camille!

I'm so excited to be here.

Oh gosh, I'm so glad you're here. I'm, I'm like, if anybody can get us on the right path as it relates to money, it would be you, um, because not only are you everything finance, but you also have a very special heart for the Gen X generation, which I love that about you. Um, so let's, let's just jump in right off the bat. Why in the world is money such a hard conversation? Why do we— what's the problem?

You know what is the problem?

Yes, why is that such a hard thing for us to talk about?

Yeah, I love this question, Camille D. Jamerson. Well, again, thank you so much for having me. You know, I love this topic, especially as it relates to Gen X and all the things. So why is money such a hard topic? Well, first of all, we got to go back in time a little bit. Money is hard because the means by which we got it was hard. Think about our— and this is only a few generations ago, this may even be a generation ago, but think about what it took to get money from our parents, our grandparents, and so on. The conversation was it's hard to get money because the means in which was hard. A lot of our folks worked labor-intensive jobs. A lot of folks, it was hard work. And so often you weren't even compensated for the level of work that you performed. So you got to think about when you, when you go back in time and you really think about where this conversation stemmed from, a lot of it was because the way in which we got money was hard. So that's the first thing. That's the first thing. Secondly, it wasn't considered ladylike to talk about that, right? It was considered rude or impolite to talk about money because who does that? Who talks about money they make, what they're doing with their money? It's nobody's business. And so that conversation certainly floated around in many households among Gen Xers about keep the house business in the house.

And so what goes on in this house stays in this house.

That contributes to why this topic still, even in 2023, yes, remains a taboo topic. And so I think, you know, it's two of those things working together.

So as a Gen Xer, what are some of the biggest misconceptions that our generation has about money, and, and where did that come from?

Yeah, so first of all, I think people you know, Gen Xers in particular and others, right? They think that money is finite. It isn't. Money is infinite. Money is infinite because it's always circulating. Money is energy that always circulates. So money is always flowing. And I think, you know, we have it in our mind that money is finite. What is finite is time. Time is finite. The time in which you have to get the money is finite. All of us have a limited time on this earth, right?

Right.

And so I think that, you know, people— the biggest misnomer that I have certainly seen in my career in talking with Gen Xers, you know, is that money's finite. It's, it's, it's only so much, you know, like it's hard to come by and it's only so much. And right, that's not true.

And I love what you said about it, um, being circular where it's always circulating and that is probably why it's called currency, you know, because a current, you know, is constantly moving, constantly flowing. That makes sense. Where did those misconceptions come from?

I think it came from, again, kind of going back into what we were taught, you know, our upbringing and the way we were socialized. When you think that money is finite, going back to what, what I said earlier in that how generations before us got money and the way in which they got money typically was very hard work and most often not compensated for the labor. When you match labor to compensation, it didn't add up. The math didn't math. And so I think in a lot of ways, that is what's contributed to money being finite. And you think about those conversations that they were having in your household, then you adopted those beliefs. Because a lot of that thinking, our own thinking, comes from what we observe, what we learned in childhood. It is the beliefs that we adopted, because all of this is learned. All of it is learned behavior and learned beliefs. So if you were— if you grew up seeing that, if you were growing up talk— you know, being taught that, then you adopted that belief, and it stays with you until you choose to believe something different.

So yeah, And that's where I was going next. It's like, okay, because Stephanie, we're 40, 50-ish years old now, you know? So how do we change the game at this late state?

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think again, it's choosing to believe something different. And here's what's interesting, you know, when I do work with my peers, I love to say my Gen X peers, most of us are at life at the half And we're thinking about, you and I have this similar language in calling it the second act, the second phase, the next phase. Right. And so what's happening, the movement, if you will, that I've seen among our generation is discovering things that were kind of buried, right? Whether that's dreams realized, whether that's now having the courage to do something that you didn't have the courage to do before. Maybe it is looking at your life now and saying, what is it that I want to do before I get out of here? Or what is it that— it is that thinking of what's next for me. And so I think when you think about it like that, usually it means doing something different. And so in order to do something different, you got to believe something different. If you want to take some different actions, you want to make some bold moves, some courageous acts. You want to step into who you know you are, who you believe you were meant to be, live out a greater and deeper purpose for your life. Because life looks different now than it did at 25. It looks different. You want different things. And so in order to do that, it's going to require you to think differently and believe something different. So that's how you change it.

Now here's an off the cuff, um, because I was wondering whether I was going to ask you this or not, but Okay, so should our mindset be more along the line of, okay, I need to focus on securing the bag, living my life big, and whatever that looks like— the things that I didn't get to do, the traveling, the, um, taking classes, whatever that is— and kind of forget them kids? Or, I mean, seriously, or is it Or is it, um, you know, I really need to sow back into my children, I need to, um, get them set off on the right track, I need to help them buy their first house, or their whatever, you know, you want to do to kind of get them on the right foot? Where should the focus lie? Is it either/or or both/and? Or forget them kids, which one we doing?

Listen, it is both/and. Okay, put your money where your care is.

Oh, that's good.

Your money where your care is, because you can do both. You care about your kids, Gen Xers and others. I say that because it's not to say nobody else, but we're talking about Gen X today, right? Gen Xers love their kids. They love, they love their families. We have a loyalty. We have, yes, you know, we were brought up that way. We have a loyalty to our children, to our parents, to our families. So honor that, right? That's— that isn't— it's not taking anything away from you to honor that. However, do not leave yourself out of the list of priorities. I think that's what a lot of Gen Xers do. They don't add themselves to the list. So make it a both-and. You can look after your children by wanting to, depending on what age they are, wanting to provide some kind of legacy or leave some kind of legacy for them. Wanting to set them up for their future, whether that's college or houses or whatever that looks like. Yeah, you— but you want to empower them, and the best way that you can empower them is by being empowered. They are looking at you. So rather than leaving them a whole bunch of stuff, you know, leave them some knowledge, leave them some tools. Yes, that they can use, you know, to empower themselves and to, to make their life look like what they want their life to look like. Look like— I think too, we don't want to get too caught up in, you know, sort of manufacturing what our children's life looks like, because they may not want that. So I think the best thing we could do, if we're talking about money, is leaving them, you know, some money or something that they can tap into in order to create their own lives. But even more importantly than that is being a whole empowered individual yourself that they can glean from, that they can look at, you know, and be inspired by. And you can pour into them, you know, knowledge and wisdom and tools that they can then use to create their lives. And in addition to that, Camille D. Jamerson, in addition to that, when we're talking about family, is enjoy your life. Set your money up so that you can enjoy your life as well. Put your money where your care is.

Love that. We've got to get ready to take a quick break, but when we come back, I want you to get ready to talk about what are things that we should stop doing as we get older as it relates to finances. So you guys tune in, stay right where you are, we'll be right back, um, and Stephanie's gonna give us an idea of things that we should stop doing as Gen Xers as it relates to our money. Be right back. Life of the Half is sponsored in part by the award-winning firm CDJ and Associates. With CDJ and Associates, bringing on a consultant to help pull your business together doesn't have to be overwhelming and stressful. Our firm is dedicated to bringing innovative, out-of-the-box creativity to every single project, creating dynamic, doable solutions for every client. Our unique expertise in branding, PR, communications, and strategic planning will catapult your brand into brilliance and boost your bottom line. Contact our squad of gladiators today at info@cdjandassociates.com. Again, that's info@cdjandassociates.com. And Associates.com. And welcome back. We are here with Stephanie Vaught of Social Money Finance, and before the break, we were just about to discuss some things that we should stop doing as it relates to finances as we get older. What do you think, Stephanie? What are some things we need to just stop doing? You know, you know, when a sentence starts out like that, it can go either way.

No, you know, listen, I'm gonna say impulse spending, impulse buying. Now here's the thing with that, you know, we deserve— we deserve nice things. We deserve nice things.

Come on, say it again for the people.

Okay, we deserve nice things. You deserve to live a life you want. You deserve to live a life you enjoy that brings you lots of peace and happiness and contentment. So that's the foundational statement, right?

Does anybody else hear the but that's about to come?

Anybody else?

Just me? I can just like feel it, like, oh, there's a caveat.

Okay, because here's the thing, when you impulse buy— and it doesn't mean completely stop it, right? It just means when you do that primarily, you, you limit your ability to do the things that you really, really enjoy. So here's what I'm saying, just like we talked about before the break, put your money where your care is. When you're a primarily— remember, the word is primarily— an impulse shopper, impulse buyer, Do you even care about the things you're buying? Think about— so this happened in the pandemic, right? When COVID first hit, all of us were thrown for a loop, bamboozled, didn't really know what to do, right? And so sort of you saw those, those jokes circulating about just Amazon blowing up. There were companies that blew up in the pandemic. Amazon was one of them. And people just having loads of Amazon boxes you know, sent to their door. And some of this was necessities, or some of these were things that people wanted, needed, what have you. But a lot of people were doing a lot of impulse buying, and so they had stacks of Amazon boxes just lined up, never opened, right? Shoes and clothes with tags on it, never worn. There's all sorts of products and things like that. So what I'm saying is, is not so much being such a zealous participant in a consumer culture Meaning, if you don't even care about the thing, you don't even use it, you don't even like it, why are you buying it? It's like, I saw so-and-so with this bag and it was cute on her and I thought I'd get me one. You don't even like that, right? I saw so-and-so with these shoes on and they was, they was slapping, you know, they had diamonds on them and this and this, and I bought that. Your face still in the box, right? So it is, it is really thinking about taking a beat before you buy and say, is this something I care about? Is this something I even want? It's really just asking those questions. Is this something I even want? Is this something I care about? If the answer is yes, then, you know, by all means, enjoy yourself. But what we're talking about It's when you are just consuming for the sake of consuming, right? And it is, you know, these are things you hadn't even thought about, you don't particularly care about, you don't even know if you like, they're still in the box. It's that type of habit. And here's why it's important to stop it or really reduce it. It's because it's taking money away from the things that you really want, the things you really care about. And think about if you are a predominantly impulsive shopper or buyer or what have you, think about putting that money into something that will grow you wealth, that will support a dream, that will, right, you know, do something that is closer to what you care about.

That makes sense. You know, when we met, um, it was over an event that you were gonna have for Gen Xers, and one of the things that, um, really connected us was the fact that um, your brand, um, was really honed in on our generation. Um, but what was interesting to me, I'm like, well, would we be the generation to really seek out a financial coach? But then the more that I got to know you, the more I understood how critical it is at this stage in the game. So can you share a little bit about, um, people who may be thinking, well, you know, I've already made all the mistakes, I've already you know, jacked up my credit or whatever the situation is. Why is it critical at this stage in the game to really get your arms around your finances and get someone to help you through that?

Yeah, well, first of all, I love that you're saying critical at this stage. And are we the generation to really, you know, utilize the skills and services of a financial coach? And I think we are. I think it comes down to, again, doing something differently. And so in order to take different action, in order to see different results, it's about taking, taking different action. But it's about— yeah, it's about doing something differently. So here's why I think it's really important at this agent stage. First of all, it offers objectivity. When you hire a coach, financial coach, that is able to offer a different perspective on your situation. That right there is going to help you, because if you're in your 40s, 50s, you've been doing your thing for a long time, you know. You've, you're— you've got a lot of skills, a lot of experience, a wealth of knowledge, and that should not be lost, because that's the asset. That's one of your assets, is your wealth of knowledge and experience. But what can happen is you're so accustomed to what you already have, you're not— to some extent, we take it for granted. We don't see always the value. We don't always see our greatness. We don't always see how we can utilize what we've already got to build wealth, you know, to create more abundance in our lives and for our families. We don't always see that because we're knee-deep, we're already in it, right? This is normal for us. But if you get the, the consult of a financial coach that knows what he or she is talking about and is good at what she does, she can offer objectivity. She can offer a different perspective that shows you, hey, you've got this set of skills or experience, or you offer this to the world that you can perhaps monetize, or you didn't even realize, you know, is sitting here on the table waiting for you to use. So there's that part, objectivity. Secondly is accountability. Let's say you do go ahead and utilize her services, then it is giving you a person that's on your side that wants you to win but will hold you accountable to what you say you want.

You're gonna do— yeah, that's good.

So it's accountability too. So yes, having somebody to be able to help you go and go faster because they're working as your accountability and they're on your team, because we don't always have that even in our circle.

That's true. No, that's true. And that's gonna be honest.

That's honest.

Yeah.

Having that objectivity and having that accountability is gonna serve you so well at this stage of your life.

Wow, I love that. Um, so let me see where I am. Uh, how much money should we have saved for that quote-unquote rainy day? Yeah, if you had to throw a number out there or a percentage or however you, you gauge that.

Yes, that's the rule of thumb, right? Percentages, you hear that all the time. Save 10% of your monthly income into a savings account, have 3 to 6 months worth of, you know, expenses saved. That's what you hear all the time. But here's what I'm going to tell you. Typically, let's look at real life. Let's look at what happens in life. Because we could— again, we can go back, we could take an audit of things that have occurred in our lives, and we, we got some, we got some, some life under our belt. So we kind of know, and we can't predict everything that's going to happen. Nobody can. But what I'm saying is you have some experience with the unexpected.

Yes.

And so typically, it— typically emergencies or unexpected expenses cost you about $1,000, typically. So if you— now it can go higher than that, of course. Yeah, it depends on the emergency. But if you all of a sudden got to replace 4 new tires, you've got to repair something, you need a new water heater, if you need— you know, it's something generally it costs around that much. If you have insurance, your deductible more than likely is about $1,000. Yeah, right. So you want to at minimum have that in a savings account, at minimum. That's ideal. If you don't have it, I would highly encourage you to grow it to that because you can. It's okay, you can do that. Start there and then multiply that by, you know, how many people are in your household, right? How many people are in your household? How much does it cost per month to pay all your bills, right? We're talking mortgage, car payment, utilities, all the necessities, right? Food. How much is that? And this is why it's important to, to understand what your lifestyle costs are. But let's say it costs about $3,000 a month. Let's say it's that. Okay, so you want to take that $1,000 that we're saying at minimum you should have and multiply it by how much it takes per month to live your lifestyle, right? And so if it's $3,000, like, yeah, it cost me about $3,000 or $4,000 or $5,000, whatever it is, then you want to get to the point where you have that in your savings account. Again, if you don't, don't think like, oh my God, I've done everything wrong, I don't have that, because you can always work toward it and you can make it a priority, right, with that number in your account. And when I say multiply by the times the people in your household is because that adds a cushion. Yeah, it adds a cushion. Okay, so think about it that way. You can do the percentages, right? Take 10% of your income and just do that consistently, you know. Or you can take what's left over after you pay your bills and put that into a savings account, right? You can do it that way to grow it.

Or you can get rid of some people in your house. I don't know, like, what's the best way, right? Kind of downsize a couple people.

You can do that too.

Yeah, I just want to put that on the table for those who are looking at other options. We can downsize, people.

Yeah.

Um, now what are the— speaking of, of those kids, God bless them, um, what, what do the kids get right? What, as far as how they're looking at money now, as far as our millennials or Gen Zers, um, do you have any insight as to how they're looking at money and, and what things are they getting right and what things are are they getting wrong that you see could be a problem if they don't get their arms around it?

Yes, this is such a great question, Camille. So I think the things that the younger folks are getting right is they are not burdened with the same baggage. So they're going out naming their worth. Listen, listen, and they're unafraid. That's what they're doing right.

Whether that—

it's all relative whether we can see that that is accurate or not. Yeah, they're unafraid to name their worth. They are unafraid to put a value on their skill set. Again, regardless of what we think about it, what is— what they're getting right is they're unafraid to do it. They're doing it. And so that's what they're getting right, because they're developing the habit now to ask for what they want. Wow. That's what they're doing right. They're asking for it. They're going for it. They're shooting their shot. Listen, they taking all the shots. That's what they're doing right. Right. And I sit back and I have to just say, I have to applaud it. I have to applaud it.

Wow.

I can say that perhaps they're getting wrong, if you will, is undervaluing work ethic. Undervaluing work ethic. Because there's something to be said, and Gen Xers, Gen Xers specifically, are masters by and large at work ethic. We know how to work. We know how to get it done. We know how to, you know, put our big girl pants on when, when stuff hits the fan and we need to get something done. By and large, Gen Xers know how to do that because we've had to do it.

That's right.

We're, we're the generation that was left home alone at 5 and 6 and 7 years old, period. You know, had to take care of our younger siblings, had to get the chicken out the freezer and put that chicken on before your parent got home.

That's right.

Look, we had— and we were 9 and 10 years old doing that. So that's right, that's our generation doing that. So we learned work ethic at a younger age, which I will never say is a bad thing.

That's right.

So I think to some degree the younger generations undervalue work ethic in that if something hits the fan, if something doesn't go your way, because that's going to happen, if you fail, if, you know, it's really knowing how to have the ability to get up and try again.

Yeah, that bounce back ability, that bounce back.

And it's not to say that no, no younger folks know this, right? We're not saying that, but it's do not undervalue that skill because as you continue in life, as you, as you know, if you are fortunate and blessed enough to continue living, you're going to have it where you need to bounce back.

That's it.

Do not undervalue that skill of work ethic.

Awesome. Well, as we wrap up, I'm going to ask you couple of questions that I plan to ask every guest. So first of all, um, what book are you reading or what book do you recommend?

You know, I am really enjoying Michelle Obama's book The Light We Carry.

I just finished it. I won't tell you, it was good.

Yes, I am really enjoying that book. Um, and, and you know, I'm on this soul journey, you know. So now money related, there's a money related book that I really like. Where's two, if you don't mind? Sure, I really love The Psychology of Money. That's by Morgan Housel. I think that's a great book. It really helps people really understand how they behave, behave with money. Okay, also like Atomic Habits. Those are like by James Clear. Atomic Habits by James Clear. Those are like mainstays, um, but the reason why they're so good and why they've done so well is because they really do tap into behavior and habits because that really is on having that understanding of yourself and how it relates to money really serves you and helps you implement strategies that you may learn, right? But those two books are really good as it relates to money.

That's awesome. Now I want you to think about yourself at 16 years old and think about 3 quick words right off the top of your head that would describe you at that age.

Industrious. Inquisitive and creative.

Well, I won't tell you mine because I sound trash compared to that. So, okay, so thinking about that 16-year-old, what would you tell her now?

I would tell her that her industriousness serves her now in the fact that she's relentless, that her Inquisitiveness served her well in being very analytical and took her to law school and was able to utilize those skills and serve in a legal and financial capacity. I would tell her that her creative ability and her quiet nature allows her to be a great writer and very intuitive and allows her to do things creatively in a way that serves these sort of nerdy professions. I would tell her that she was always enough. She was— she is more than enough. And being just how she was back then serves her at the age she is now.

That's awesome. Well, Stephanie, do you have any final words? I want you to tell folks what you have going on and where they can find you.

Yes. Well, first of all, Camille, thank you so much for this amazing interview. This was so fun.

I know, I love chopping it up with you.

Thank you so, so much. So where to find me? You can go to my website, socialmoneyfinance.com, and look at all the ways in which to work with us if that's what you so choose. Socialmoneyfinance.com, that's also our handle on social media. So Social Money Finance. You can find me on Instagram, Facebook at Social Money Finance. And if I had to drop one word of wisdom, is keep going, keep going. That's good.

I love that. Well, thank you so much, Stephanie Vaught, attorney and financial coach of Social Money Finance. Thank you so much for joining me today. It has been such an honor chatting it up with you. Thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you. You're welcome. Listen, everybody, the, the second half of your life can be fire, right? But it's not gonna fall in your lap. You have to create it. That's what we've been talking about today. And I know that might sound scary at this stage, but, um, you've got to remember who you are. Like we talked about in this episode, you are Gen X, baby. And together with this community We are going to change the game. We're going to secure the bag, and we're going to enjoy life in a brand new way in this season. You guys in? Good, good, good. Now listen, if you or someone that you know would make a great fit for a guest spot on Life at the Half, you need to let me know. Shoot me a message at camille@thecamillecompany.com. That's Camille, C-A-M-I-L-L-E, @thecamillecompany.com, and I will circle back with you. And we would love to have you on. So make sure that you shoot me a message. Now with that, thank you so much for joining Life at the Half, where we shift Gen Xers from midlife crisis to midlife clarity. I'll see you next time.