Staci Wilson: Chapter 20 - Sharpening Your Mental Edge

And in the lead up, we were down with not a lot of time left, something that was very rare. And somehow, you know, he coached us to a victory. And I remember, I think he actually got a red card in that game. And I was so confused and, you know, disappointed. Like he normally shows such great emotion, you know, the right type of.

Like, it was like, we need him for the next game. Why would he do that? And it basically turned out, you know, I would agree that game didn't have the greatest officiating at all. And, you know, he didn't want to complain with the, in the press afterwards. So that was the only way to kind of show a public disapproval. And he knew the rules of the game, of course, and that all the cards were resetting so he would be with us the next game, everything would be okay. And he made kind of a, I guess you could say a nice protest.

You're listening to the Vision of a Champion podcast with Anson Dorrance, eight time coach of the year, 22 time national champion, coach of the 1991 Women's World Cup Team hall of Famer, leader and mentor to so many in the soccer community. On this podcast, Anson brings on players and coaches to discuss what it means to be a champion. The drive, the passion, the desire, and yes, the stories.

Here's your host, Voice of the North Carolina Courage in North Carolina fc. Dean Linke.

Hello everyone, and welcome to the final chapter of the Vision of a Champion podcast. I'm your host, Dean Linke, longtime voice of the North Carolina Courage. And today we have a three time UNC women's soccer national champion and a US women's national team 1996 Olympic champion. On the online studio to talk about Chapter 20 of the vision of a Champion podcast, it's titled Sharpening youg Mental Edge, a key focus of several of our guests during this amazing Vision of a Champion Podcast series. But today we dive right in. Our special guest is former U.S. women's National Team standout, Stacy Wilson. In 2001, the University of North Carolina retired her number 27 jersey and she is remembered as one of the best defensive players ever to play for UNC Chapel Hill. I also had the great honor of calling some of her professional games as she was a member of the original Carolina Courage team that won the second ever WSA championship. And she remains, even to this day, one of the fittest soccer players, fittest athletes, just flat out fittest person in the world. The one, the only, Stacy Wilson. Welcome, Stacy.

Thanks for having me, Anson. Dean. I appreciate that a Very kind intro. Thank you.

Yeah, my pleasure. Well, let's get started by each of you telling the world about your favorite moment on the field during your national championship runs. We'll start with the storyteller of all storytellers, Anson. Take it away.

Well, I love having Stacey jump into this chapter. In fact, if I picked up the book and showed it to you, her picture's in there. So, obviously, Stacy exemplifies what we're trying.

To teach in this chapter. I don't know whether there are particular moments, but I think one of my favorites, and I don't know if this was during a national championship run or just a regular season game, but I think it was actually out west. And Stacy can certainly correct me, but she got. I mean, she's involved in collisions all game. That's the nature of who she is. I mean, she's a very combative defender. And even though she's not a very large player or tall or wide, she's incredibly fierce, which is what I consider critical if you want to become an elite player. And in one of the collisions on the field, I think she broke her nose. And so obviously we had to take her off the field, you know, check it out, make sure she wasn't going to die or something. So trainer's looking at her, and I'm, of course, a little bit impatient, and I just want her back in the game. And so I turned to the trainer and I said, when are you going to put her back in? When can we put her back in? And I'm a little agitated because it's taking a little bit of time for the trainer to diagnose this broken nose and then to make the decision to put her back in. And I look over at Stacy and she's horrified. I'm just going to throw her back in the game. And of course, it's just a broken nose. It's no big deal. So, of course we're throwing her back in the game. And so she looked at me sort of horrified that I was going to put her back in. And then, you know, I could see her face change from this look of horror to this look of, yeah, you know what? I think I can go back in because I knew Stacey Wilson. She had an incredibly high pain threshold. I mean, once you break your nose, it's not like you're going to break it again or make it worse. You've already messed it up. You know, it's just been smashed into the middle of your face. And so. And she sort of, you know, then we put these plugs, I think, up her nostrils to make sure she didn't bleed to death. And then she goes to the fourth official and says, okay, I'm ready. And look like she had survived the battle of the bulge. I mean, you know, she's blood is still all caked all over her in a way, and she's got these two things stuffed up her nostrils. And then of course, we put her back in and she just continued where she left off. No hesitation, you know, no issues with the pain. The bleeding was stopped, which is all that was, I guess, absolutely critical.

And.

And the game sort of wore on. So for me, that was the picture of Wilson, but there was this sort of. What I like most about it is this symbiotic relationship between me and Stacy. When I asked the trainer if she was going to put her back in immediately, Stacy was a little shocked at first. Then I could see her sort of changing her mind and, yeah, I think I can go back in. And then, of course, she lines up and then we sub her back in. So for me, that's the iconic Stacy Wilson image in my mind, that live in there comfortably and joyously for the rest of my life.

What a great way to start Stacy. Now it's your turn. Your greatest moment during your run at North Carolina with Anson.

Yeah, I'd say, like Anson, it's kind of hard to pick a moment. You know, he was kind of a master of motivation speeches, so there are many, I'd say, pre game speeches that it was great when he was giving out assignments or maybe a halftime speech where he's dissecting the opponent and getting us motivated.

You know, there's so many of those. But I would say probably what he named would be definitely a memorable moment because I guess the way he approached me was counterintuitive, but it actually was, you know, that was just what I needed, that type of approach, you know, kind of a, you know, wake yourself up type of, you know, not a literal slap, but, you know, hey. And that actually was perfect. Definitely would have regretted not going back in that game. So I appreciate that.

Can you confirm if you broke your nose? Did you actually break it?

Oh, yeah, yeah, it was broken. Yeah.

So, yeah. But I'd say another moment was. And probably this was a cool moment for two reasons. One, we were in the tournament and this was, I think, the same year it was leading up to that game because that was the finals game that he mentions. And in the lead up, we were down with not a lot of time left. Something that Was very rare. And somehow, you know, he coached us to a victory. And I remember, I think he actually got a red card in that game. And I was so confused and, you know, disappointed. Like he normally shows such great emotion, you know, the right type of role. Like, it was like, we need him for the next game. Why would he do that? And it basically turned out, you know, I would agree that you game didn't have the greatest officiating at all. And, you know, he didn't want to complain with the. In the press afterwards. So that was the only way to kind of show a public disapproval. And he knew the rules of the game, of course, and that all the cards were resetting so he would be with us the next game, everything would be okay. And he made kind of a, I guess you could say a nice protest without being, you know, too obnoxious about it.

So, actually, I'll tee off on this.

Stacy.

Yeah, you did remind me of that. It was the only way for me to make sure that official wasn't going to referee our next game, because obviously the committee would not let that referee referee the next game if I had just been ejected. So that was a statement to make sure the referee was eliminated. So Stacey's absolutely right, because I have great impulse control. I mean, it's like I'm going to fly off the handle and be totally without control. No, I was in control. But I was saying, how do I get rid of this referee for the next game? And so, sure enough, and I can't remember, you know, what the moment was that I attacked the referee with in order to get ejected. But I knew that what would happen now is the referee was not going to be serving as our referee in the next round. Because back in those days, you, you know, the NCAA didn't have a lot of money, so they would fly in a team of referees and they would rotate maybe four or five referees among the games over a Final Four weekend. And the last thing I wanted was for that referee to be in the middle again during the, you know, whatever it was, the semifinal or final or whatever. So this is a statement to make sure that didn't happen. Actually, I just recalled another wonderful moment, Dean, that I have to share with you. And this has to be one of the greatest moments of all time. Next to Meredith Proust subbing herself into a game on her own without being subbed in by me.

This is a moment this goalkeeper we had decided to sub herself in. She subs herself in. I turned and I look at Dino. I said, dino, did you sub in Meredy? And he said, no. And I said, oh, my gosh, it's unbelievable. There's anarchy on the team. And, you know, we've got to take care of this moment right now. So we subbed her out immediately, and we had all these sanctions for. And obviously a lot of it was tongue in cheek. But with Stacy Wilson, there were some games. We're trying to keep her alive because she was so fierce. I just didn't want her to get hurt or to get possibly ejected. So in this one particular game, she knew I was going to sub her out. And so what she did is. And Stacy, please fill in the holes in this story.

She had this paper bag on the sideline with her, and she opened it up in front of me and said, this is gonna be you if you sub me out during this game. And there was this skull in the base of this paper bag. And so I'm looking down at this paper bag thinking, oh, my gosh. You know, I guess Stacy wants to play maximum minutes in this game. And it was. It was some sort of skull. Maybe she ripped it off from a, you know, a biology lab or something.

But.

But it was absolutely hilarious. So please put the finishing touches on that one. Stacey. I can't remember the game, but I do remember the moment because it was absolutely hilarious. And we've coached, you know, anarchies before. And by the way, I'm incredibly comfortable in an anarchy. When the team takes over, I'm completely fine because if they want to take over, great. I want the game in their hands anyway. But, Stacy, fill in, cross the T's and dot the eyes on that story, because I know you've got some detail that I've skipped.

Yeah, definitely need to add context to that.

Part of it is the skull part of that idea came because it was around Halloween time, so they were selling them pretty, you know, more often. But, yeah.

You had put a schedule together for us because we needed a challenge. So, you know, it was something like five or seven games and not a lot of days. And with that, you wanted to make sure that we were rested, so you began this rotation. And, yeah, it's amazing how personal I took coming out of the game back then. I, you know, loved every minute of playing and, you know, felt like I was earning my playing time. And, yeah, I knew that the rotation was coming, so, yeah, I decided to make a joke out of it. Hopefully it would sway you with a little bit of humor.

But, yeah, I was not happy. Not happy to say the least.

Well, let's dive into this chapter right here, and we'll start with you, Anson. What are the characteristics of a winning mentality, and can these characteristics be coached in players?

Well, I genuinely feel that you've got to basically recruit it, if possible, so I don't have any delusions or illusions of grandeur. You know, I think there are some people that are extraordinarily competitive, and so you've got to recruit it if you can. And Wilson, gosh, I mean, she was just a wonderful warrior. I loved everything about her. I loved, you know, the way she played for me. But also her mentality, what this chapter is all about. And she was there during another player with extraordinary mentality by the name of Cindy Parlo. And what was really interesting about this combination of Wilson and Parlo is Wilson's small and Cindy's massive. And yet Stacy would not back off on any challenge against Cindy. And, of course, a huge fear a coach would have in practice is losing one or both players to injury because they were never going to back off on a 5050 challenge. These were incredibly brave players. So I was just trying to figure out a way to keep both alive while they competed against each other in practice and then unleash them on the rest of the country in a game. And it's the old, you know, cliche steel, sharpen steel. And to have those two in our program at the same time, they were wonderful examples for each other. So, yeah, I mean, we did everything we could to encourage competition. Obviously, competition within the, you know, the, I guess, restraints of not injuring your teammates. And also, obviously, we don't want to go around injuring our opponents. I mean, even though I've always said 50, 50 is fair game, I'm going to sprint at it. If you're going to sprint at it, you know, you might be in trouble because we're going to collide. I know I'm going to get up, but you might not get up. It might be too painful for you. So 50 50s are a different kettle of fish. You've got to make a decision on how much this means to you. And then basically, Wilson and Parlor always made the decision that, you know what this is. You're endangering your life if you're not stopping when I'm going after this ball. And I just loved watching them compete. There's so many elements of our game I absolutely love. Physical courage is near the top, and Stacy Wilson and Cindy Parlo exemplified that. But I've now got the book open, actually. I've got it. Sharpening youg Mental, chapter 20. And I want to read this section because in between what I am reading is the picture of Stacy Wilson on page 244 of the book. And underneath her wonderful picture, it says Stacy Wilson, 94 to 97, the human embodiment of the gift of fury. And she was so let me read this because I can't ad lib this better than Gloria and I wrote this in the book. So let me read it because I really like the words here. Mentality defines the strength of your psychological dimension, which is your capacity to reach down inside yourself and find your inner hardness in any physical duel or combative situation. Ultimate triumph doesn't come down to skill or tactics. What it boils down to is your will. This mentality is characterized by a combative, aggressive posture. Your outlook should be that you dominate this zone, this player, you own this game. This is your time. You are the reason your team wins. Mentality is partially optimism, but for the most part, it's a combination of focus, combative rage, relentlessness, hardness, and courage. All the words that define combative athletics. One of my favorite aspects of the game that Stacy and I absolutely love is is this element. Because this element carries beyond the field. There are going to be moments in your life when it's going to take incredible courage to make the correct decision. And even though it's not always going to be a physical environment where you're taking a physical risk, there are other risks you've got to take to basically maintain your own sanity and integrity. But I love the fact that in athletics you have this opportunity to demonstrate who you are in the middle of a game, in environments like that, in fact, and Haas was there. We celebrated this yesterday with my team. We've advanced. We're now in the third round. There was this moment where one of my kids on a set piece had to sort of run across way outside the post to redirect the ball back towards the goal. And then my starting center back, Abby Allen, had to make a decision because as this ball was redirected back, it was going right towards the goalkeeper. And the goalkeeper was only about a yard or two away from the near post where this ball was coming back from. And she had to make a decision on where she was going to go to try to meet this ball. There was only one space, and that was between the goalkeeper and the post. And she launched her body in there, redirected the ball into the goal, and then smashed into the post. So basically, this is the classic between a rock and a Hard place. And that put us one goal up. Well, Wilson and Parlo made those decisions all the time, and it was just extraordinary. And it was a mentality. It was unique. And I'm just so glad that Stacy agreed to be with us on this podcast because her picture is literally in the middle of the. Of what I just read to you, which I think is a perfect description of what I'm trying to get across in this chapter.

Stacy, as you hear that description, particularly Anson's notion of combative competition, which I love the way he says that, what would you say about how Anson instilled the importance of winning at UNC Soccer?

Well, as what you here, he just described a lot of things. Physical courage, you know, willingness to. To do what it takes, etc. But you didn't really hear winning, you know, So I think one of the big things that he did was he actually, you know, physical courage. That. When I hear that, that's more. I consider we. We had something there, a sign. And it didn't say a tradition of winning. It said a tradition of excellence. And I think that he kind of got us more committed on the process of becoming a warrior, of becoming a champion, of how to show physical courage, what I guess those that are big Wooten fans would call the pyramid of success. So there are so many things that go into building the pyramid of success, and at the very top of it is competitive greatness. So.

You know, I think we all understood everyone has the. Everyone has the will to win, you know, but who has the will to prepare to win and to do all of the things and to, you know, at those moments, step up and show the right characteristics. So I think that's what Anselm was good at, is kind of getting you to exhibit those qualities that go into winning.

Anson talk to us about having a tough mentality, and if this is not an Anson word, I don't know what is. But an indomitable will also. Anson is an indomitable will. A talent or a choice.

Everything, I think, are choices. And I think what you've got to convince everyone of is to make the choice. They don't have to make the choice. In fact, in the thin air of Stacy Wilson and Cindy Parlor, very few people are in that thin air. And you can see it throughout a practice and certainly throughout a game and throughout a run and throughout their careers, there are qualities that absolutely separate them.

And I just love these kinds of players. And they know I love them. They can hear my love for them through the things I talk about. Because when I'm talking about these different things, they can feel it because they know I'm describing them. Every now and again, I will mention the names. Like, as I said yesterday in practice, I talked about Abby Allen and the decision she had to make.

And so I'm using these people as examples for the rest of the roster to try to make choices like that, to make a difference. But the indomitable Will, it's just. It's this relentless force that can't be broken because eventually someone's going to break. And honestly, sometimes that's the margin of victory at the highest level. And honestly, this is the element that still has the United States winning at the highest possible level. The rest of the world, this is their game. We're dominating their game. Are you kidding me? Are we dominating it because of our incredible soccer culture of technical preparation like the Spaniards and the Italians? Are we doing it the way the German would organize a tactical environment and the Dutch would do the same? Are we doing it with the French would. Where, Holy cow, are they athletic? Are we doing it with all those different pieces? No, we are doing it with what we're talking about right now, an indomitable will. And it's in the water. And I absolutely love it for our country. And I love having athletes like Stacy Wilson that have been a part of this. She was a part of that gold medal team in 96, the first time women's soccer was in the Olympics. And it's that mentality that I think still separates the United States. And it's that mentality that I'm trying to inject into the choice of every player. I want them to choose it. And I joke about the different things that occur while you're making these choices.

And.

And as Stacy knows, I mean, a lot of my motivation is laced with humor. And so I talk about, you know, you've got to put your face in there. I know you're going to get it kicked off or it's going to get smashed in. But trust me with, you know, the sort of stuff that we can do in plastic surgery now, in 20 years, no one's going to know that you're absolutely hideous from destroying your face against that post. And so I try to lace in humor because I know the different fears in everyone's mind, and certainly one of them, you know, for the women we're coaching, has to be about the way they're going to look. So I, you know, I throw in every, you know, humorous piece I can, but then obviously, when I see it I celebrate it and I do because one of the biggest transitions, and here's sort of the initial shot into this, it's heading most girls that come into collegiate programs right now, with some exceptions obviously, and there's some extraordinary exceptions, they don't head. And obviously I bet these youth coaches are afraid, as they should be, about the different issues with concussions and these are completely legitimate concerns. But because they don't head and at my level you have to head, it's the biggest transition. And usually the problem in lack of heading for these girls coming in isn't lack of technique. I think if you ask them to describe the correct technique, almost every girl that can't head can tell you the technique. So it's not like, oh, I've got to coach them with the correct technique. No, it's basically they don't want to get their head stuck in and smashed on the back of someone else's skull where their teeth are in and out, Chiclets lying beneath their feet in the middle of a game. So these are all the different fears they have or, and I'm sure Wilson's smashed nose in that game was a head to head or, you know, getting their nose smashed in. And so what I'm trying to get them to do is to make the choice to not be afraid, to embrace the possibility it is going to hurt, but it's, you're not going to die, you're going to be fine. Will there be blood? Yes, possibly. But you know, you're not going to bleed to death. We're going to be there to grab these two little white things and stuff them up your nostrils to make sure, you know, you don't bleed out. And yeah, we lace it with that sort of humor, but we're trying to get them to make that courageous choice. And again, the thing about Stacy, she came in with it and yes, you have to try to recruit it, but then a part of the process is trying to get them to choose to be this sort of person with the indomitable will to have the courage to take those kinds of risks.

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This is Dean Linke. I hope you've been enjoying the podcast, and I wanted to make you aware that Anson just released a new audiobook version of his hardcover book, the Vision of a Champion. Now you can listen to the book, narrated by Anson Dorrance, and switch back to the free podcast to hear the stars of the women's game discuss each chapter. The Vision of a Champion audiobook is available on Apple Books, Amazon's, Audible, Google Play, or wherever you get your audiobooks. To find it, simply search the Vision of a Champion audiobook. Now, let's get back to the show.

Stacy, I feel like you already talked about your ability to overcome pain and deal with your pain threshold, so I wanted to move to the mental side of this chapter. How did Anson Dorrance push you to find your potential, and how did he motivate you to expand your mental toughness? We know that you weren't afraid to put your nose out there, but your mental toughness.

Well, just real quick, since he's mentioned, you know, Parlo and I having a similar.

Competition style a couple of times, it would be worth mentioning that.

You know, I loved doing 4v4, and we would do that a lot. That was kind of a game where he got some fitness in, but also it was highly competitive and, you know, everyone took it seriously. You know, you can't hide. And 4v4 was kind of the mentality. And, you know.

I remember Anson saying that I was pretty good at picking teams, you know, Cause I did generally didn't go with necessarily with my friends. I tried to the team.

And I know, I remember by the time Parlo got to school, it was pretty easy. My strategy, which, you know, I usually just was able to pick her first. And with that, then we could just plan the team based on kind of what was left, what positions we needed. As long as she and I were together, like, yeah, we pretty much dominated the 4v4. Like.

I would bet if we were to look at the stats, if she and I were on the same team, we wanted, you know, so it is equality and going in a battle with someone like that, you know, that. That. That was great.

In terms of pushing to meet the potential. I guess it's kind of like what Anson said is he tries to recruit it. And I would have to give a lot of credit to my parents if you're talking about, you know, you know, how. How I got, how I am, because, you know, they didn't really coddle me, you know, they. They supported me. You know, they were there. They put me in great positions. But, you know, if a coach said I needed to work on something, they, well, I guess you need to work on that, you know, so, you know, they. They. I played basketball in the backyard with my dad a lot. You know, he was very, you know, competitive. So that those. Those type of things were. Were there. And.

You know, but what Anson did was I think he definitely kept me interested, you know, during a time where, you know, these days, so many kids go to school and they have an experience that they.

Don'T enjoy. And so maybe, you know, at a time where I'm off going to school, total new environment, I was just thrilled with, I guess, the program that he had set up, you know, and I think I was really motivated to play in the program. Anthony was really fair with everyone, a lot of coaches. I think he appreciated the qualities that I brought. Something simple like, I think he used to say, players are dime a dozen, but 1v1 players are special. And with that, he wasn't ignoring the defensive side of things. So many coaches growing up only look at players that can score goals and that side of the game. But he really recognized the different skills and things that went into defense. You know, he was a teacher of the game. You know, just because I'd played on a national level, I still found, okay, I'm coming into a program where, wow, the game is like new. I'm learning so much. So I think.

That'S what he did to.

Motivate me, and that helped expand my mental toughness.

Great answer, Stace. Anson, another word in this chapter is self tank self talk. Rather. Can you explain self talk and what that means to different players?

Yeah. First of all, self talk is a tool that I think all of us can use if we want to get to a different level. And the way I divide self talk up into, I divide it into affirmations and mantras. And a mantra, the way I describe it and the way I try to use it in. Try to. Driving a player to her potential is a mantra is who you are. So a mantra is something you review in your head just before the game begins. And even now, at the advanced age of 70, I have a mantra whenever I go into anything. Of course I can't move anymore. I've torn my left hip, labrum, my left knee is deteriorating. You know, I just. I'm physically falling apart. And unfortunately, I can't play soccer anymore. I can't play inline hockey anymore. And I'm just so, you know, I'm left with almost nothing, but I am left with pickleball. Here's what I know before I play pickle. And the mantra is the same that it was when I was an athlete at unc. I know I'm going to be more competitive than whoever it is across the net. I know this. And I don't care how young the person is, how athletic, how good they are. I know I'm going to be more competitive. So my mantra is that I also know I'm going to be more focused, and I know this is going to mean more to me than the person across the net. So even to this day, I check all these different boxes before I compete. So the mantra is who you are and it's the truth. The affirmation is who you're not, but who you aspire to be. So the affirmation is a positive statement about yourself that you make before you go to sleep at night, but also what you do when you wake up in the morning to have a wonderful day. And so for me, this self talk should be a part of every great athlete's life. If you aspire to be a certain kind of athlete, make sure that's in your affirmation and that's who you aspire to be. And it's got to be a positive statement about who you want to be. Now, does it have to be the truth, the affirmation? No, it's a statement about where you want to go, but it's got to be positive. It's got to be present tense. And then you've got to believe it, because the first step in becoming something is to believe that that's who you are. And this isn't just a psychological trick. This is the truth. Anyone that's achieved something that's extraordinary has gone through this process, whether or not they're aware of it or not, you've got to go through that process. You've got to decide that this is who you are, and then you're going to become it by first believing that's who you are. Because then the decisions you make throughout the day, but also throughout the week, the month, the year, your life, are going to be made in that direction because you believe that's who you are. But the mantra is something that's got to be powerful just before you compete, and that's got to be the truth, because that's what you want to rely on right out of the gate. So for me, this self talk is a critical part of the landscape. If you want to become absolutely Extraordinary.

Stacy, moving back to you on this chapter, how did you prepare yourself to compete? I'd love to watch that. And did you need motivation? And how did you, the competitive cauldron, push you to your potential.

In terms of preparing to compete? I'd say like every other player, I had a pregame routine.

Tried not to be too superstitious about it. Something that served, you know, just got me kind of in a normal state of mind. In general, I would say I was more. I considered myself more of a calm before the storm. I was trying to get very internal.

Kind of like, you know, Anson said, I think.

Kind of relying on. That's the time. I think that internal would be a time where I'm saying more mantras. I can do this. You know, I will have an impact, whatever, whatever I was feeling that day. So.

Yeah, there were some days where I would say if we normally, I think it was easy to get motivated because everyone was always giving us their best shot. So that to me, you know, I always wanted to maintain the team status. So winning I really took seriously. So I was always motivated to try to keep the tradition going.

If for some reason.

Maybe it was a game where we probably, if you looked at the record of the other team, we probably would be winning 9 0, you know, I found something to motivate me, you know, so, yeah, I think it was a great program. And Anson, if did a good job. Like I said, it's pre game speeches. We're great for that if we somehow were lacking.

So, Anson, balancing this notion of bashing your face into a post, how do you also teach composure? And then tell us about how you use John Wooden's philosophy of go fast but don't rush.

First of all, Dean, wonderful question, because one of the biggest challenges in the way we play is to go from this furious bull hunting, high pressure defense into the composure. All right, now we've won the ball. And now move quickly, but don't hurry. That's the famous John Wooden expression. And it is tough to do that because usually to have this furious bull hunting personality, that's not the most composed personality. That's a. You're closing an opponent at a sprint and then you're waiting to bite. Bite is our word for tackle. And it's very difficult to flip the switch from that to this composed person that makes it look like they're in absolutely no rush. But still the ball is moving very quickly. So it's very tough to, you know, switch from that to composure. And that is a challenge. And there are Some players that really struggle with this, and a part of it is the challenge of playing, you know, a high press and then to fold into composure. Obviously, the rehearsal is what we do in practice, and obviously it's something that we emphasize on a consistent basis because that is the challenge. Because most teams in this country at a collegiate level play a low line of confrontation. So they're actually in a shape where they are composed and they're not sort of, you know, hell bent for leather sprinting at other teams and their players trying to win the ball back. And so they're probably in a better position to flip the switch from, you know, winning the ball to playing with composure. So for us, this is one of the biggest challenges. But obviously, if you can manage that, I think what you're then doing is you're preparing this kid to play at the highest possible level. Because as you go from one level to the next, you've got basically, you've got to work. I mean, one of the many things I love about Vladko, our current national coach, is he's not letting any player on the field that's not defending, which is our philosophy as well. And I really appreciate something that Stacy said, and she's absolutely spot on, which is, yeah, we coach the kids to defend. Now, obviously, we want to recruit a player that's complete, that can attack and defend, and playmakers. But a lot of what we do in practice is we're reviewing the hunters, and we're not just talking about the composure of the hunted, how to solve this pressure and solve this problem. We're also patting the backs of the Stacy Wilsons that are closing at speed. And believe it or not, that intensity and practice that Stacy's bringing against a Parlo who was my nine is good for Parlo, because all of a sudden she goes from practice where Stacy Wilson making it incredibly difficult for her to keep possession, to a game where the person that's marking Parlo is not as good as Wilson. And so what has prepared Parlo to play at the highest possible level in the next match? Well, it's what Stacy's doing in practice. And so this balance between the two, I think, is absolutely critical, and it's not easy. So I don't want to pretend that anything I'm sharing right now, Dean, is just perfunctory. Oh, yes. And then we do this and then that happens, and here's the formula, and then there's. Here's the right answer. Here's success. No, it's never that sort of never ending ascension. Line. It's a jagged line and it's not easy. But you don't want something that's extraordinary to be easy. So we sort of, I guess, initiate it in practice to make it hard so that eventually you're used to being accustomed to solving the hard problems in a match.

Stacy, talk about what you have taken from your experiences from playing under ants endurance to help develop the talents of the players that you coach today. This should be fascinating.

Perhaps, but it's actually pretty simple, I'd say, like I said, it was definitely an environment of. Of learning. And I think when you're in an environment of learning, there is players, like, feeling empowered, they're starting to now understand the process, feel like they can kind of control their future. So with that, you know, Anson was a teacher, and the qualities that made him effective, I think, was that he was competent in the craft, understood the game, obviously, the little aspects of it, positional details, analyzing an opponent to formations, etc. So you have to be competent at the craft, period. So now I work with players of different ages, so I have to flip from 7v7 tactics to 11v11 to 9v9. So it's very important that I'm making sure that I'm competent in knowing.

And not.

Misusing.

Using the wrong tactics at the wrong. Using tactics at the wrong time. I would say also a good teacher connects, and I think from some of the stories you can tell, he knows how to motivate players, takes an interest, ask questions, listens.

I think that was one of the things that actually made me choose to go to North Carolina. I've gone on a recruiting trip or two, and the connection that the players had at UNC seemed really unique. Just seeing the way players hung out and I believe it was the hut back then and just came there to relax and, you know, it was a place to. To, I guess, get a good place socially. Whereas other schools, I felt like here and there, sometimes the environment was a little bit stiff, so it didn't seem like enough of a connection with the coach for if that person was supposed to be motivating you.

And then obviously I try to instill with them this confidence, this competitiveness.

The fire as best I can. And I've had a couple of incidents, instances where maybe a team has come back from the most crazy comeback in the last minutes. And I felt like that was something that is in my coaching style because I got that from UNC or about a couple of teams that maybe achieved, you know, made it further than a team in program History. And I'm certain it's because, you know, we took this competitive approach like, like we did at unc.

Taking care of the details. Never say die. So, yeah.

Now, Anson, you've spent a lot of time already on this hour talk with Stacy Wilson talking about the importance of taking physical risk. But let's get a little bit deeper into that. Talk to us about taking physical risks and its importance and becoming a dominant elite level player.

Yeah, thank you, Dean, for that question. Because there are all sorts of different levels and obviously a player like Stacy was dominant because you can impact without being dominant. You can score a goal or two here or there, you can make a goal saving tackle, you can do all these different things, moments in a game. And those players are obviously critical, but very rarely do you end up with a player that just takes a game over. But those of us that coach for a living, you can see those kinds of players. They are incredibly rare. And it's the sort of player that does intimidate opponents is a player that the opponent knows that, you know what, if I do challenge on this ball, I might get hurt. So you can see them slowing down just a little. And obviously the mom and dad can't see this, but a quality coach can see the player that decides, you know what? I choose life. So in this 50, 50 ball, they slow down just a hair to get there just a second late to make sure they can live to see the sunrise in the next day. The dominant player doesn't think of these things. The dominant player thinks about taking the game over. And there are these moments in a game that the dominant player sort of establishes dominance, but then plays with a consistency throughout. And these players are extraordinarily rare, but Stacy was certainly one of them. My ability to rely on her was extraordinary, and I did rely on her. And what I also love right now is Stacy still comes back and works my camps. And I love it. I love it for all the right reasons. I mean, here's this extraordinary black athlete that comes back, and I want this to be a part of the culture of the black athletes because obviously most of them are playing other sports, basketball, track and field. But I love it in my sport because I would love to see this to be the first choice of all the athletes in the country and to have her come back and be a role model for me is extraordinary. And you can see how well she explains anything. And a part of coaching is motivating. It is communication. And you can tell from listening to her that she would also have this Incredible capacity to motivate and inspire because she communicates incredibly well. So for all these different reasons, my admiration for her is.

Beyond anything because she still comes back and she's also a teacher, and you can hear it in the way she explains things. And so I love that. I love that she enjoyed her experience enough at UNC to decide, you know what? This is what I want to do, because she's still doing it.

Stacy, as we wrap up our time with you, one of the things that we all know about you is you set goals. So can you just give us a brief synopsis about concrete goal setting?

Well, concrete goal setting is obviously something that.

A champion athlete will be able to do.

The basics you always hear about smart goal setting. Of course, you have to be specific, measurable, achievable, relevant, time based. You know, all of that. But I think with. With the goal setting, I think what's. What's more important about it is.

Not.

Necessarily having the outcome goal. Again, of course we all want to win, but understanding the process to get there and understanding the smaller steps and figuring out a way to enjoy that process. So, you know, you know, I think when we were at unc, Anson and Dino, they designed the season in a specific way.

Set up a culture in a certain way, and really had it where there was player buy in, where we.

Wanted to be there. You know, everyone was improving individually, improving as a team, and having fun along the way. So. So, yeah, I think that concrete goal setting that.

Is key if you want to improve.

Stacy, it's so great having you share your memories with North Carolina and your continued success. Anson, as we wrap it up and you reflect on everything that Stacy brought, not only to this discussion, but I know she brought great memories. As you think about that broken nose and her taking on Cindy Parlo, I'd love to see those battles today. Right now, I feel like Anson, I could watch those all day long on film. Can you just explain why developing a tough mentality can help a player excel on the field and other areas of their lives like Stacy Wilson has done.

Well, yeah. First of all, we can use Stacy as an example. I've heard her speak at all levels. She's a compelling speaker. As you can tell. She doesn't have to look at notes to recite the sort of route into achieving things. And you could see that, I mean, without notes, it was almost like she was speaking in paragraphs about how to construct these different platforms. And so you can see that a lot of this stuff is translated into her life off the field. And since we've been using Parlo as another example, she's another great example of this. I mean, here's this. A woman that, like Stacy in practice, would just demonstrate wonderful courage. And now talk about going from the frying pan into the fire. She decided to take the US Presidency in one of the most volatile periods in American soccer history, because obviously, with the lawsuit that she's having to navigate as a woman, I mean, it's incredibly challenging where, you know, there's a percentage of her population within U.S. soccer that are suing U.S. soccer for equal pay. And she's got to figure out a way to navigate this because obviously, as a woman, she's completely empathetic towards this fight. But she also understands the business side.

If they start to pay everyone equally.

Then the bankruptcy notices have to start to go out. And so she's trying to balance all these different things. And so these are two extraordinary women that were at UNC during the same period that are demonstrating this, taking the stuff that they exhibited as athletes on the field and applying it to their lives outside it. And this, again, is. I have an opportunity in a couple of years to teach a course at unc. It's going to be talking about elite performance and the value it has for all of us outside of the sporting environment, outside of the artistic environment, the music environment, et cetera. And these are going to be extraordinary lessons. And they're lessons that Stacy understands fully because you could hear her articulate it throughout our conversation today. So I think all this stuff has huge value, and I think athletics has huge value, and it has value beyond the field. And I'm so excited that a university like ours is going to commit itself to this study because it's going to demonstrate that, yes, we have value even within the academy, within the ivory tower. And I'm very excited about that. And it's because of the successful lives of people like Stacey Wilson, like Cindy Parlow, and the other great ones that have come through unc, but also all the other wonderful collegiate programs across the country that are committed to educating their kids in the most positive way, and not just through the academic side, but through the athletic side as well.

Stacy Wilson, I feel like I speak for Anson and Hassan Pinto and everybody at Creative Allies when I say it's been an honor watching you play and continue your career as you share what you learned during your time at North Carolina and other places with the future stars of our game. Stacy Wilson, thanks so much for being with us.

No, the honor is mine. Thanks for having me.

All right, that was Stacy Wilson talking about sharpening your mental edge on the Vision of a Champion Podcast. If you like this show, one way you can support our work is to subscribe to the podcast on Apple Podcasts or wherever you listen and leave us a rating and review as well. This show was edited and produced by Creative Allies. If you're looking for information on full service podcast production, head on over to creativeallies.com for Stacey Wilson and the great legend Anson Dorrance. I'm Dean Linke and we'll see you next time on the Vision of a Champion Podcast.

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