Keith Yackey - The Recipe For Attraction In Long Term Relationships

Appreciate you having me on.

Of course, man. Welcome, welcome, Keith. How you doing today?

I am pumped and excited to reconnect, be on the show with you, and share some of the stuff that I've been through that can help some people.

Yeah, man, I'm excited to have you on. I'm excited to have you here. It's been a hot minute since we connected, since we last hung out. We had one of those funny experiences where you go to an event together or we met at an event, but we actually happened to be sharing a room together, and we haven't really chatted too much since. It's been a while. We've kind of kept in touch here and there. But I've been watching your work, and I think you've been following along with man talks, and so it's cool to have you on the show. So for the people that don't know you, let's just start with the question that I ask everybody, which is tell us a story about a defining moment in your life that made you who you are today.

Awesome, man. Well, this defining moment has set my last five years into a totally different direction than I ever thought. It was five years ago.

Where we were about ready to move into our dream house, Jesse and I, and she says, I'm going to help you move in, but I'm not moving in with you. And I was like, wait, what? She's like, you run your business, you come home, talk about your business, and you fall asleep on the couch. And that's not what we signed up for. And I've asked you to change, and you don't want to change, and it's over. So I will help you move in because I know you kind of suck at that stuff, but I'm not staying. And it was at that moment, literally, like, I was in a dark room, and a light switch went on, and I realized I just ran the most amazing woman I've ever met in my life out of my life. And basically I interpreted her as saying, keith, my life would be better without you in it.

And I realized, dude, I need to change. Because if you got the best woman you've ever met, and I'd been with a lot of women up to that point. I mean, I had sex with hundreds of women before I met the girl that I really wanted to be with me forever. So it's like, I'm so good at this thing, but I'm so horrible at keeping them. And this is the one I want to keep. This is the mother of my daughter.

I Couldn't have been at any lower spot. And that's what changed and really set the whole tone for the next five years, which has led us up here today.

Yeah, I mean, it's interesting, man. I can't tell you how many guys coming into.

Whatever we want to call it, the work, the personal development space, the betterment industry, the wellness, et cetera.

Because of their marriage, because of their relationship, you know, because they have taken for granted, they have shied away from doing the work on themselves. The relationship, or whatever it is. Right. Whatever aspect it is. And it's almost like not until they risk losing that thing that they really care about, that change starts to happen, which is really, really interesting. And so. Okay, so that transpired. Then what. What happened after that? Right? So she says, I'm out. You know, I'm gonna. I wanna leave. And it's interesting. Cause I was just working with a client, like, two weeks ago that went through this exact situation. And I was like, here's the play by play. Here's what you're gonna do. It was, like, very. Dude, very tactical. But I'm curious, like, how did you respond to that?

Okay, well, first of all, I did everything wrong. I created a PowerPoint presentation, I wrote a song. I tried to catch up for five years of neglect in, like, five days.

Yeah.

And it only pushed her further away. So I literally hired three coaches. How to get my ex back. How do I get her back? Because the light bulb went on. It made me realize, all right, 95% of this is my fault, and I need to fix that. So I hired this lady, I hired this other guy, and I hired this other guy. I'm like, I want to get three perspectives. And they taught me the kind of. The play by play of what to do. And interestingly enough, after a couple of weeks, I said, wait a second. Am I hearing this right? If I want to move on, I need to move on, and if I want to get her back, I need to move on. Am I hearing this right? They're like, yeah. I'm like, but that's only one play. They're like, exactly. I'm like, okay, I got one play. I can do one play. I've got to move on. And I've got to become the most attractive version for me. And one of the things I actually said to Jesse, because, you know, being that I had a daughter that was about two and a half. My daughter's seven now. She's about two and a half. Right. At that time, Jesse moved to another state reconnected with a guy that, you know, she loved in high school, and they were going to start. I mean, I was. It wasn't like this separate. It's. We're done. Done. And I hired these people. I realized, wait a second, dude, I can't do this to get her back. I need to do this to get me back. And I would tell Jesse, I said, wow, the next lady in my life is literally going to cash in on all of your hard work. And I'm so sorry and so grateful. And I had to get to that point where I literally realized, man, you've got to do this for you. There's got to come a point in time in man's life where he's like, you know what? I got to stop doing all this for everybody else. I got to do this for, literally, me and become the best man. But what was interesting in talking to those three coaches, they all had great hearts. They were wonderful human beings. I just never believed. I just never believed. Hold on one second. I. I just never believed that any of them actually went, like, through it to the same degree that I did. And I eventually got Jesse back. And here was the interesting. We didn't even have sex for the first six weeks. She came back just because we were still feeling it out. And it was just a weird thing. She's back, but she is. She moved her things in, but I'm thinking, is it really going to stay in the closet, or is it. And is there any boxes that are unpacked? Like, what does this mean? Like, you know what I mean? You're going through all these things, and you're like, well, what the heck's really happening? And I remember we were laying in bed, and her foot touched my foot.

And I just started crying.

And I felt like I was at the lowest. I'm like, okay, I got her back, but yet still, like, I'm still working on me. I'm trying to figure this thing out. And she's back because. She's back because she wants to be in a relationship where her daughter, you know, has a mom and a dad in the same house. So it's like. It was, like, that awkward, clunky phase, and I felt right. Then my creator speak to me and says, I'm going to help you. I'm not. I'm going to help you. I'm going to use you to help men get through exactly what you've been through. And you would think that that would have been, like, some enlightening uplifting moment, but my first thought Was. And I know this is going to sound crazy, and it's. But this is what I said in my head. I'm like, I think you came to the wrong house. Because when you're that low, like, when it's really that dark, like, I didn't realize that I would end up in. Within the next, you know, couple of years, but then obviously in the next five years, like, have the most amazing relationship that I've ever had in my entire life, where things are just firing on all cylinders. Like, you don't know that that's coming when you're in that deep pit. So I remember just. I just remember crying my eyes out going, like, I think you got the wrong house, but let's see what happens. So that was the biggest defining moment, bro.

Yeah, it's big, man. I mean, I feel like so many guys can relate to that, where they feel like they're at rock bottom in their marriage or their relationship. They're trying to make it work. They're not too sure how to do it. So I think where I want to begin is, from the work that you've done, from the men that you've worked with, where do you see guys going wrong in their relationships? Because I think that there's some pretty obvious ones, like the nice guy that just lives for his partner or is a complete yes man. And that leads to all sorts of complications. But what are some of the things that you see as.

Not the problem, but the symptoms within the relationship and how a man's showing up and what he's contributing to, to the sort of erosion of that connection and intimacy and desire?

Dude, I love that you use the word erosion, because I actually use that word. It's the third step and what I call the decline of the attraction or the erosion of the attraction. So I believe it starts over here, where a lot of men feel entitled to sex, connection, and intimacy because they provide, they protect, they produce. So it's almost like, hey. And a lot of guys say this, I'm doing this for us. The reason I work so much is I'm building this thing for us. And yet. And they go, but I'm not getting sex. I go, well, no shit, Casanova. Providing, protecting, and producing doesn't. It's, yeah, you're putting food on the table, making sure if anybody barges in, you know, you can protect them. But when was the last time you really took her out on a date and made her feel sexy? And so ultimately, I believe the entitlement leads to apathy, so they stop doing the things like if every guy still acted the same way they acted when they were first trying to get laid by this new girl, that they started texting if were they, if they acted that way. Dude, I'm telling you, that's how I act in my relationship now. And our sex is off the charts. Our intimacy, our connection, our openness and honesty. It's like I'm with my best friend and we like to get naked. Like it's like the best of both worlds. So we've got the entitlement that leads to apathy. And then the apathy just totally leads. And that's why I love to use the word the erosion of attraction. And it just starts eroding. Eroding. And here's where that you said the word symptom. Here's what it looks like. The wife will say, I love you, but I'm not in love with you. Or which means. Which is I think code for I'm just not attracted to you. I believe kind of the punchline for a lot of it. Other than if a girl, a lady really has hormone issues or some sort of trauma that she's working through, that's pretty deep seated. I believe 95% of the men are just, they're no longer attractive to their wives. And so that's why for me, kind of the punchline has always been how do I help a guy become the most attractive version of him? And if he can get to the most attractive version, even if she doesn't want him, he can have the mentality of, well, you're lost because this is as good as I get. If you don't like me, then that's okay. But there's a hundred thousand other women out there that probably would like to be with me. And that's a test. I always ask guys, I go, hey, listen, if your wife leaves you, do you think a Hunter woman will be at your front door trying to be the next misses You? If you're not confident of that, then you probably have some work to do.

Yeah.

So as far as symptoms, another symptom is that, that a lot of guys, when you know, in our marketing or stuff that people recognize, they go, is your, is, has your wife stopped initiating? Is she no longer enthusiastically participating? Because a lot of times they'll just lay there and like do their, their civic duty. And then I go, if she's more into spreadsheets than the bed sheets.

Then you've got a problem. I love that.

I love that it's going to be on a T shirt Keith, if she's more into the spreadsheets than the bed sheets, you got a problem. Hashtag man talks. Hashtag yeah. Hashtag married game.

I love it. But that's. But. And. And I want to be able to answer your question, but I'm kind of. There's a couple of things I want to say to this, if you're cool with that, please. Yeah. So one of the things that I noticed is most women have the reason they shut down sexually is because they're no longer attracted to the man. And then the man starts to. He, he, he, he, he. He senses there's a weakness in the force, as it were, right? And he's like, oh, my God, she's no longer initiating. We used to have so much fun. And a lot of times this happens when people have kids. And I say, like, kids are the most unromantic thing ever. They're the biggest blocks known to man, Right? Because guys aren't separating their wives from the children on a regular basis to remind them, dude, you're a sexy goddess and you turn me on. And, oh, by the way, I'm a looker myself. Let's go out and remind you of what it means to be sexually date, you know, sexily. I don't even know that's the word. But just being sexy and dating and having alone time. And I found that a lot of times women just don't trust their men anymore, because a lot of times they go, they say they're going to change. They say they're going to do this. And it led me to quote a phrase where I go, you know, when the trust is up, the lust is up. And I believe that's really true, because deeply, a woman's just like, you know what? And I can't trust that you're going to do what you're going to say, and I can't trust what you change. And so guys start grasping at all these things, like, hey, I need to start doing more around the house, or I need to start giving her gifts, or I need to start agreeing with her more. And I go, guys, it's not that the action is wrong. It's that the attitude behind the action is wrong. You're doing this just to get something from her. And now you remind her of her kids.

Yeah, she can. And I can feel it, right? She can feel like. Because women, I mean, like, they have such a sixth sense for your intentions, you know, and if your intentions are astray, right? You're just. It's like, I bought you these Flowers so that we can have sex later. Or like, I made you dinner so that you'll do this for me. You know, it's like they feel that, and it's like. And that's not attractive. I know. Like, I've had. I've had a few sex therapists on the show, and they've talked about how a lot of women have predominantly. Most women have what's called a responsive sexual desire, right? So their arousal responds to a man's. A man's turn on a man's, like, advance and those types of pieces. But not when it's from a place of entitlement, right? Not when it's from a place of, like, well, I made a grand today, and. And so I put food on the table, and so we should have sex. It's like, well, that's not attractive, right? That's. That is a transaction, right? It's like, I did X, you should give me Y, and that's not intimacy, right? But for us, in our rational brains, it's like, somewhere along the lines. That makes sense, right? It's like, that makes total sense. So, okay, so I hear you saying complacency can start to erode it. Entitlement can start to erode it. What. What else? And I didn't mean to cut you off there, but maybe I'll just let you keep going. But are there other things that you've seeing that start to erode and diminish that connection 100%?

And just to finish that thought, about what, like, you're saying, like, we think it's all logical. And I tell guys, I go, have you tried all the logical answers? Like, yeah, but it's not working. And I say, do you know why? And they'll go, no. Or they'll come up with a reason. I say the reason is, is you're not fighting a logical battle. You're fighting a psychological one. Your woman's most sexual organ is her brain. And. And in her brain, she fucking hates you, she resents you, and she's not attracted to you for a lot of reasons. A lot of guys, you know, they let themselves go. You know what I mean? Like, oh, I gained 30 pounds. Yeah. But, dude, when we were signed up for this thing, till death do us part, I was married to a lean, trim, athletic dude. And now you got a dad bod. And honestly, it's not all the rage. And so a lot of guys let their standards slip, and, like, it's. It's. To me, it's like the weirdest thing. And I've been guilty of it. So it's. I'm not sitting here on a high horse. I just told you. My wife found me so unattractive, she decided to leave me. So, you know, I've had to do everything to get that back and then some. But what I noticed was that I go, like, why don't you want to date your wife? Like, why won't you? Actually, people say they want to invest and they want to build something, but they're not willing to get dirty or put any. Any effort, time, or money into something. It's like, that's not invest, not building. You can't say, I'm building a good relationship as you're sitting back passively just waiting for it to change. And so I go, why don't you date your wife? And every. Every group in the manosphere talks about date night. It's not like date night's this, wow, revolutionary thing, but yet I go, when was the last time you took her on a date? They're like, well, dude, you know, we went to Lowe's and we did this. I'm like, no, bro, this isn't chore time. Chore time is bore time, bro. Like, come on. And I go, well. They're like, well, what should I do? I go, all right, let's imagine a scenario. The scenario is this. Every guy, there was this hot chick in high school that every guy wanted to be with. Whether it was the head cheerleader or is the, you know, head of the mean girls. There's always that hot lady, right? I go, imagine you're single right now, and she shows up in your DMs on Facebook, and she's just as hot as she was, and you're just you. And she's like, wow, I would love to go on a date with you. I go, what would you do? How clean would you smell? How clean would you be? How thoughtful and how planned out? Would you. Would you have a gift? Would you wear clothes that fit? Or would you be wearing your older brother's suit coat? Like, what level of, like, attention and effort and intention we put into it? And they're like, oh, I'd go crazy. I'm like, well, there you go. That's the level you need to be focused and intentional with your wife. And that's while she'll want to then focus and put attention and attention on you. So that's the one last thing that I think that was a big aha for me over these last couple years working with couples and now exclusively with just Dudes for like the last eight months was actually, I think men and women want the exact same thing. And it's presence. A woman wants you to put your phone down, treat her like a priority. And she'd be a priority enough where you actually, like, look her in the eyes and listen to her and have a conversation and go back and forth, right? The second thing the guy wants, he also wants presence. What I mean, most of the guys that call me up, that want to work with me and that have a problem that I can fix, they're always saying, dude, my wife just gives me pity sex. It just feels like she's checking a box off a to do list. You know, she's not present, she's not participating, she's not engaging in this thing. So I've kind of realized that both people want the other one present. And there's a lot of distractions that people have gotten in the way, assuming that the relationship's going to stay on fire, yet they never throw logs onto the fire to keep it going.

Yeah, I mean, I really appreciate the comment on presence and distractions because I think in our modern world, it is so distracted. Like, look, it's hard to maintain a really good, high caliber, high quality marriage or relationship, period, full stop. And anybody else that tells you that it's not is like selling you snake oil. You know, it takes work, right? It takes effort. And I think, you know, that's part of what I hear you saying is like, at some point we become complacent and we can stop putting in any kind of effort. And that's felt. And I also heard you didn't use the word, but I would like him to maybe go into this is the. Is resentment. You know, that resentment starts to build up, whether it's on our partner's side or on our side. You know, I see a lot of guys that are in relationships with women that they, you know, that they have built up a lot of resentment towards, you know, they despise them, they're angry at them, they're bitter and jaded in some way. And it's like, well, of course you're not attracted to her, right? You don't even like her. And vice versa, maybe, right? Like, how can she be attracted to you? Why would she want to have sex with you if you're constantly complaining about her or telling her that she's not good enough or whatever the case may be? And so can you just speak to resentment and how it shows up in relationships and why some of those things start to Manifest.

I think it boils down to.

Guys not stopping and being aware that they have actually they're 95% at fault in putting their wife in this box that they no longer like her in and getting over the resentment. I think first and foremost, you have to own some culpability in that, in yourself. And it's like, for me.

Dude, Jesse and I, when we first got together 10 years ago, it's actually going to be 10 years tomorrow. We got. I got some cool plans 10 years ago tomorrow. And, yeah, we got together on 11, 11, 11. Who knew we would make it to 11, 11, 21. And five years ago, we didn't. But this last five years, we've been till death do us part. We're in it to win it. And I'd say the resentment piece, you got to understand that. Listen, we use the word grace a lot in our relationship because I think you should extend some grace to your partner. If you can see this. Like my. In my relationship, I think Jesse would look at me and say, Keith is really putting in the effort and trying and doing the best he can to be the most attractive version for himself and for me. And when I mess up, it's like, dude, that's. That's the human part. So she'll have some grace on me. And it's the same way and.

Owning it and then saying, you know what? I need to give some grace to my partner, because they're working through shit the same way I'm working through shit. And not only that, but I also feel like a lot of the resentment on women's side, and I don't know if this is going to be real popular, but I feel like this is really, really true. Even though it's not being talked about much. I feel like a lot of women end up resenting their men because they lose their individual identity, and they get all wrapped up in this dude's life, and they no longer feel like their independent, free self. And they're like, dang it. Like, for Jesse, she's like, dude, I became a stepmom to three kids right away. I used to like to party and feel sexy and go out. And then Keith was all this business stuff, so I kind of lost that. And then next thing you know, Keith's boring and I'm boring. And that's when the resentment really builds up. And then the last thing, I think the solution to get over resentment ultimately is forgiveness. And I think that that is a very deep topic that most people don't understand. For me, it changed from Being a feeling and a one time event to being a one time event. Forgiveness means to wipe the debt away of. And so I go, I'm wiping the debt away. Even though I still feel like I want to keep sending you new invoices, I'm not allowed to. And I can't keep showing up new invoices from different companies saying you owe me. It's like, no, I forgave you for that. And I'm going to have to work through the emotion of getting over and recognizing, dude, you've taken massive steps forward to show me that that behavior is no longer something that you want to be a part of. It might be a struggle of yours. I go, okay, I still struggle. You know what? You know what? Here's the funny thing. You know what Jesse names the old Keith. I got name for the old Keith that she phone got rid of five years ago. It's Trevor. So we named the old guy who was selfish, you know, didn't care about Jesse. Jesse wasn't a priority. Jesse's lucky to be around me for who knows, God, what reason, right. So we named him Trevor. And so like, like, if, if I start acting kind of like a dick or whatever, she'll be like, that reminds me a lot of Trevor. And like that's that instant word where I'm like, dude, even if I don't see it right now, I gotta step back and be like, hey, I'm really sorry. Let me. And. But now I've graduated to the new name. So I got Trevor's. The old guy. Keith is just good old Keith. He's doing his thing. But I've. I've moved into. The new name is Sancho.

Sancho.

And Sancho is Mexican for side piece.

So she treats me like her side piece. And I love it. And it's fun. Because what happens now? Because I know that Jesse really resented me for kind of like squashing her and making her mold into my life where she was no longer that individual free woman who was making decisions on her own. I didn't abuse her or like hold her down. But, you know, it just kind of naturally happens. You know what I'm talking about, right? Yep. And now we do something that we created. We call it the Disney moment. And the Disney moment is. And I think everybody should do this. It's, it's. It will shock you how amazing this works. The Disney moment is what boy meets girl, they fall in love, they start to enjoy their life, and then they're radically ripped apart from each other. And then they do everything they can to get back to each other and tell each other the tales of what happened to get back to each other. Right. So every Disney arc is similar to that. Well, what we do, Jesse, probably three weeks out of the month is her brother and mom and her dad and her family live about an hour away. So she'll go out like on an Friday afternoon, she likes to go dancing with her mom and her brother. They like to do karaoke. They like to do a lot of stuff as a family. And then I stay home with Jovi and me and Jovi ride our bikes all over Dana Point and get ice cream and go on daddy daughter dates. And what happens is it separates us like three or four times a month for like a day, maybe day and a half to where we start to actually miss each other. And then she's living real time experiences. I'm living real time experiences. So when we come back together, our individual lives, we're feeling independent, free spirited, like doing our thing. But then when we come back, it's like, tell me about what happened. Oh my God, that's amazing. And so it creates this really cool missing and wanting and desired dynamic that we actually have artificially baked into our relationship where it wasn't before.

Yeah, I love that man. Because I think that's been one of the big challenges a lot of people have experienced over the pandemic, right. Is like all of a sudden your social network has collapsed. You can't go out. Depending on where you're living, that can be quite strict. And then all of a sudden, if you're in a relationship or you're married, who are you around, right? You're around your partner just non stop 24 hours a day. And so you have one person.

That has to play the role of everything and everyone for you. Now, for some people and for some couples, it didn't take a pandemic for that to happen, Right? For some people, they fall into that dynamic, whatever you want to label that, right. Codependency, or it's just where one or both people start to rely on the other person more than maybe is required or necessary. But that can really collapse in on the relationship. And so I love that idea. Like, when my wife, Vienna and I started dating, I was living in Vancouver and she was in New York, you know, and it was, it worked really well for us because we were both building businesses and careers. And I would come out for two weeks and then I would go back to Vancouver for a week and then I'd come out for a week and I'd go back for two or three weeks and it was like, it was great. And so when we moved in together, my travel schedule still maintained. Right. I still kept, you know, going to different cities and doing what I was doing. And that kept this sort of like, wonderful tension within the relationship, like, where are you and what are you doing? And there's like this excitement, you know, that we can get into. I think when people get into a marriage, especially long term, that's the thing that suffers, is that excitement. It really starts to suffer. So talk to me a little bit about this idea of Married Game, because when you first told me about it, I was like a. I love that. What Incredible. I don't know if it was intentional branding, but just what a great concept because I think we, especially within the quote unquote manosphere guys, learn a lot about.

How to approach a woman and how to talk to them and whatnot. But there really isn't a lot about, like, how do you actually keep that vibrancy alive in a marriage, you know, in our long term relationship. And so a lot of men are blocked from, well, do I really want to be in a marriage? Do I want to commit? Because all I've heard and all I know is that shit goes downhill pretty quick, you know?

Yeah. So, yeah, exactly.

Talk to me a little bit about what is Married Game? What are some of the pieces that go into that? What is it? What does it look like?

I got like three things I want to say at once and I feel this when I'm talking to, like, my good friends. And like we were talking earlier, like, you're like the one of five dudes I've ever shared a hotel room with just for the fun of it. Right? So I'm, I'm, I'm amped up and excited because I'm like, oh, my God, Connor, I want to say this, this and this. So I'm going to try and piece it together. But so here, first and foremost, a, I love that you and I are having this conversation because we're young dudes and I say young. I'm 42. And you're, you know, you're probably mid.

Mid 37. Y.

37. Okay. So what I've found in you said, not a lot of guys are talking about this, and I think you're right. And actually most people that talk about sex or keeping the, the fire stoked, this, this isn't all of them, but I, I think I can genuinely say that most of them are 50, frumpy and unfuckable for the most part. So I love the fact that you and I are dudes, that we're attractive dudes. We've got amazing lives where we're building businesses, we're living abundant lives. We're living lives that guys can look at and go, dude, I feel like I want to live that life. And I feel like what you are doing and what I'm doing is we're showing up as the new generation of beacons saying, hey, dude, guys, you can actually get your wife to literally crave you and want you and text you, I'm coming home, you better be ready because mom is coming in hot. Like, and we can show that. That's the first thing I want to say. Second thing I want to say is I have a fundamental belief that I don't think sex should get worse. I think it should get better. Because ultimately, great sexual connection has to do with being vulnerable, intimate, and knowing each other so well that we're almost like, we can almost know what each other's thinking. And dude, no lie, no lie. I'm starting to sound like my late teens and early 20 kids now. No, lie down, low key. No, dude. Jesse and I, we were in Dallas. I was doing stand up comedy with a couple of my buddies, Garrett Gunderson and a couple other guys, and Jesse and I had sex on October 25th. That was the greatest sex her and I have ever had. And it was the greatest sexual experience I've ever had in my entire life. Now, having been with a couple hundred women, like, I'm telling you, I've got a big sample size of what we're doing, and we looked at each other when it was all said and done, we're like, that, that was number one. You should like, that was definitely number one. And so I'm like, But I want to say that in another five years or like, I if. And I have a system and specifically in place to be able to do this. And so when you say, what is Married Game? Ultimately, I have four dials that equal what I call the provocateur. The provocateur is the man that can provoke his wife to want him again, to desire him, to initiate, to participate, and to care. And so I'll explain these dials roughly. But ultimately our mantra is, I'm a provocateur. Every day I'm. Every day I'm a provocateur. That's like the, the. The identity of, of what? If you come into Married Game, that's what you are. You're A man who provokes his wife to want you. And the. The dials are simple. It's a parenting dial, there's a partnering dial, there's a producing dial, and there's a player dial that when you're. Those dials are all dialed in, you become the provocateur. So I'll explain those because it's a lot of actually what married game and actually think attraction in is a lot of nuance. It's because me and you could say the exact same thing, but if I say it with a different tone, with a different cheeky look on my face, it actually means something to my lady, or any lady, way different than if you said it. Just maybe more cold tone and nuance. And all this is. It's so textured and so beautiful. So here's the dials. Number one, the parenting dial. Not everybody's a parent, so this dial might not play into everybody's hands, but for me, Jesse literally is like, I don't want to have another kid with you because you're such a shitty dad with our first one. So that was a huge one. And I'll give you a quick example. Let's say, you know, I've always kind of had my office in my house, and I'll go, hey, let's go on a family date tonight at 5:15. Well, what would I do? I would show up at 5:14 and 45 seconds, throw my shoes on, be like, I'm ready to go, expecting the car to be ready. Jovi to be in the car. Jesse to be in the car, everybody ready. And I'm like, dude. And Jesse literally goes, I feel like a single parent around you sometimes. Which is a huge indictment against how shitty of a dad I used to be. And now I go, you know what? We got to be out of here by 5:15. I'm going to show. I'm going to come down here at 5:05 and see, hey, how can I help Joby get her shoes on, help put her in the car, buckle her up, get the car going so the temperature is good. And let Jesse come down at 5:14 and 45 seconds. Like, what if I switch that? So again, it's these little nuances where she's like, wow, he's really helping me. Like, he's. Because that was her indictment, was like, dude, you know this is your kid too, right? Like, I know you're providing and building this big kingdom, but we don't even want to be in the kingdom anymore because you're such a shitty dude. So the parenting dial, the partnering dial means that, you know, partnering is like, it's like when people like, you're my pic, you're my partner in crime, you're my, you're my best friend. What that means is that you take interest, you care about, and you listen to what they say, they want, desire, need, those types of things and you take action on it. Not just listen, but you take action. So I'll give you an example. We love. We. We've kind of had the party house for pretty much our whole relationship. But out here in Southern California, we are definitely the couple that invites everybody over for shooting pool, sitting in the jacuzzi, talking shit, like all the fun stuff. The UFC fight nights are usually at my house. Right, well, that always devolves into at, you know, 9:30, 10:00pm Jesse wants to sing karaoke. And she's got a great voice. And with two shots under her, three shots under her belt, dude, she is pretty much Cyndi Lauper. Okay? So we had this little thing with this shitty ass microphone and it kept going out and it was always a thing. And I said, you know what, dude, fuck that. I went and bought her a full on PA system, dude, like microphone stand, speakers, mixing board, the whole thing. And now her and my close friends like Garrett and my buddy Wade, they all, when it, when it's karaoke time, like, everything shuts down. Everybody gathers around the PA system and they just go to town. But for me, I'm like, well, dude, here's my partner. I want to invest in her and show her what you love. I love. Like it's important to you because it's important to you now. It became important to me and I'm in the producing one. You don't have to be a millionaire to produce, but you got ambition. You're going somewhere. You're on a mission to build something and not just sit back and just hope that everything's gonna be okay. And then the fourth dial is the player dial, which is, this is the one that most guys really drop the ball on. They start, they stop taking their wives on dates. They start or they stop working out, they stop dressing like, with clothes that fit, smelling good, becoming like a player. Because a player's got like a neg connotation out in the world. Like a player means he's just going to do one night stand type stuff, right? But in your marriage, you're saying, I want to play again, I want to have fun. And that's why I love quoting the I, who I think is the greatest American poet Cyndi Lauper when she says, girls just want to have fun. And I've discovered and working, I probably. I've had about a hundred guys go through the program in the last eight months. And.

So many of them, like, I've become boring. Like, I've just bored my wife to be non attracted to me. No girl ever said, I can't wait to be in a marriage that's sexless, non intimate, totally boring. And I just watch kids all day. You turn this full on sexy goddess vixen and basically to Cinderella, and you've become the stepmom and the evil twin sisters. No wonder she doesn't want to be around you. So that player is like, how do we have fun again? That's why going on dates isn't like, I got to go on date, dude. I'm thinking of shit that's going to be like, fun that I'm like, well, like this last Sunday, like, let's go shoot guns at the gun range and let's go to that try out that New Mexican restaurant without anybody but just you and me. So the players like, dude, I want to be as attractive as possible and I want to be what my wife craves because she may say she doesn't want to have sex, but dude, when Grey's Anatomy comes on or Game of Thrones comes on, she's thinking about sex. Okay, so there's that. That girl wants to come out, but she just doesn't want to come out with you because you're not a provocateur. Your parenting's off, your partnering's off, your producing's off, you being a player is off. Nobody's having fun. And yet guys go, I want wild, passionate sex. And I'm like, you're not a wild, passionate guy. You're as boring as watching grass. What do you think is magically going to make her be crazy for you? So that's what Mary came.

It's good, man. It's good. I love the framework and the four dials. I think it's true. I think that the big challenge with that excitement piece at the end, that wild, crazy part, is that a lot of guys, as they get into their 30s or into their 40s and they, you know, maybe kids come into the play and they have lots of bills. It's almost like the more responsibility we have, the less imagination that we allow ourselves permission to engage with. And it's like, that's the part of you, I think that's the part of us as men that we often underestimate it's like that imagination that you had when you're dating, right? When you're single, it's like, you know, you have to use your imagination to think up something fun and exciting and engaging. And it's. You know, there's. There is. There's something about that that's rewarding for you as a man as well, because it's creation, right? You're providing direction, you're providing an experience. But we lose that somewhere along the way, and it becomes a burden. And that's, I think, a big sign that there's probably erosion happening in the relationship, especially sexually or within the intimacy, is that if you look at planning a date and you think, like, oh, this is such a burden. I just don't have time for this. And, like, outside of everything that I have to do, it's like, nah, man, that should be play. That should be freedom, you know, that should be fun. That should be, like, your moment to let go of the weight of the responsibilities that you're carrying in your life so that you can go and engage in your life with your partner. Right. With your wife, whatever.

So, yeah, man.

Cool, man. I love that. Tell me a little bit more about, you know, where. Where do men begin with this? Because they're. Maybe they're listening to, like, this four. These, like, four dials, and maybe one of them stuck out over the other. Like, where do guys actually begin? If they're like, okay, this resonates with me. I've been lazy in my relationship. Where. Where do they start? What do you recommend.

In terms of. Well, like, where to go to find more resources, or if they're just. If that's only thing they heard, where do they start? Right now? In their room.

That's right. Y. Yeah. In their relationship, if they're listening to this podcast and they're like, okay, cool, I got some of this. Where do I begin? How do I execute on this? Because I think.

Got it.

Usually. Usually what I've noticed is from my listeners, that they like the tactical stuff.

Yeah. Well, dude. Yeah, we're looking for a recipe or a blueprint, right? And I always look at attraction like a recipe, and then I'll explain what I think they should start. Because we all have the same ingredients, but not everybody's putting them in the right order, the right amount. And so I always look at, like, if you're baking a cake, if you mix all the ingredients together, put it in the pan and put it in the oven, close the oven, and then halfway through, you realize, oh, shit, we forgot the eggs. You don't just open the door, crack two eggs on top, and then close the door and be like, wow, we're gonna have a great cake. No, you got a shitty cake with eggs on top. And I think what happens with a lot of guys, whether they go to counseling or whatever they do, oftentimes they're not actually working on the ingredients of the cake. They're just trying to throw shit on top, and it still tastes like dog. And so I would say, take a real wholesale look at yourself and go, all right, if I was to judge myself, you can do this alone or you can ask your spouse. Sometimes the marriages are so, like, fractured and barely hanging on that if you ask your wife this, she'll just be like, you're a one on everything, and go yourself. And he's like, well, okay. But if he has to ask him for himself, it might be all right. When it comes to my parenting, like, if I was to take an objective approach to this, like, where do I really score? And some dudes are really great dads, and they can be like, I'm a 10 out of 10 on that one. Some guys would probably recognize, and you'd ask the hard questions, like, how much quality one on one time? Like, for me, I have a standard. I will spend at least 30 minutes a day with Jovi every day, one on one time. And it's usually a lot longer than that. But I won't go below that because I heard a stat that dude, most dads spend. I think it was either 27 minutes or 37 minutes a week of one on one time. And it's like, you're their biggest hero, you're the biggest influence, and you're not. What are you doing that you're not pouring into your kid? So I would ask, on a scale of 1 to 10, where do I think I'm as a parent? On a scale of 1 to 10, how am I actually showing up as a partner? You know what I mean? Like, am I having to be reminded to do all this stuff? That's the other thing. It's like, a lot of guys fall into the mom matrix, and it's like, dude, moms don't think about having sex with their kids. Yeah. You know what I mean? Like, that's whole. You don't want that. So ask. I would just take out a piece of paper, look at the four dials. How am I as a parent? How am I as a partner? How am I as a producer? And then how am I as a player? And then think about like what, what those things equal. And I'm sure, because this is an exercise we do in Married Game, I go in each of those exercises, in each of those silos.

Who is the best example of what that is? When you think about that, who's the best parent, you know, who's the best partner, you know, who's the best producer, you know, who's the best player, you know, well, what are they doing and what can you replicate and duplicate and be like, you know what? Like my buddy Garrett J. White, he dresses really well because his wife at one point said, dude, you are your brand. Are you a nice Apple box that people are excited to open? Are you just a full on bag of Cheetos? Like what are you, you know what I'm saying? And I thought that was such an interesting way of viewing that. So I think everybody has like a way of looking and going, well, what am I? What is my brand to the world? What is my brand to my wife? And then they can just Simply out of 1 out of 10 on those areas and see which one they might be low on. And if they have a wife that's real honest, they can do that. We also have an assessment that we give out for free to anybody to just take to see where they're low and what score is not going so well for them.

Yeah. And I think just to add to that is like, look at where you can remove distractions. There's a lot of research that shows that one of the biggest challenges for women is that they're over inundated. They're like inundated, not over inundated. They're just inundated with distractions constantly. Right. Kids, chores to do lists, like everything that they see becomes a distraction of what needs to be done around the house. And so if you as a man can support in removing distractions from yourself, because I think, you know, distractions disempower us in many ways. They steal our attention. If you can begin there and then you can start to remove distractions from your partner, that's going to serve you and the relationship. Keith, listen, man, we're going to have to wrap, unfortunately. I literally feel like we just got started and we're going to have to pause for today. But I think I'm, you know, definitely going to have you back on. Maybe we'll have you on in the new year and do a bit of like a live conversation or Q and A where people can, you know, guys can like dig into this with us because I think that the modern dating scene and modern relationships have changed, but stayed the same in a lot of ways. And I think there's a much broader conversation to have about what a modern marriage look like and modern relationships look like. And so, yeah, where can people go to learn more about you and the work that you're doing?

The best place is to just go to marriedgame.com I mean, I have a 30 minute video that breaks the dials down and like, what the symptoms and what the cures are. It's, it's, it's a lot more thorough than what we talked about today. And. Or they can just follow me on my Instagram. I have like two or three videos every single week that are about three to five minutes where I break down a problem and a solution that guys are facing. And I really just talk about a lot of my mistakes and how I overcame them. And it was a lot of. It was a perspective change for me and realizing, oh, man, I didn't see that. Correct. Like, I'll give you one example before we go. And that's like, a lot of guys are like, dude, my wife is so obsessed with her kids. Like, dude, her DNA is. She's biologically wired to care more about those young than she is about you. Like, you've never heard of a mom divorcing kids, but you hear of mom divorcing dads all the time. So it's like, don't fight that. Be a part of it. So, like, one of the things that my wife says, like, the more you spend time with Jovi, the better dad you are, the more I'm just massively turned on by you. So I'm not doing it. So she's turned on by me. I'm doing it because that's what a good dad would do. That's what a man's supposed to do, step up being great for his kids. So there's so many little things that are intertwined and they can go there and we can explain all that to them. And I just got a really ton of cool emails I can send them that are really provocative, awesome.

I love it, man. I love it. I agree on the dad front. I had that experience. I took eight weeks off when my son was born, and it was so funny. It was probably about two months in and I was just playing with him and my wife was like, it's so hot the way that you take care of our son. And I was like, what?

I was like, what are you talking about?

I was like, I was just loving my time with her, right? And she was just like, seriously, like, it's. It's really sexy. And it was like, huh, okay. You know, like, not having been a father before, I haven't thought about that. But. All right, everyone out there listening, go check out Keith's work. If you enjoyed our conversation, definitely share it with somebody in your life that you will know will benefit from it. Don't forget to leave us a rating and review wherever you are listening to us. And if you're watching this on YouTube, then put your questions and comments in the comment box below, and we'll do our best to get back to you. But until next week, this is Connor Beaton signing off.