Science & Spirituality Talks with Madiha Saeed, MD

Hello everyone. Welcome to another episode of Science and Spirituality Talks. Today our guest is Dr. Medea Saeed. Dr. Medea said is known as holistic mom MD. So if you're looking for her online, that's how to find her Holistic Mom MD She's a board certified family physician. She's an international speaker and I'm talking about in front of thousands and thousands of people. She's also a globally best selling author. She's written nine books and one of her first ones that I knew about is called the Holistic Rx. And then she has brought her five children into the picture. So they just recently launched the teen health revolution, which is great. We really need to get those younger generations healthy and healthy earlier. And she's now working on her 10th book. I mean the woman doesn't stop. So she's been on television. She's active in all things medicine. She lives in the Chicagoland area. I know Medea a bit because I'll just give you a little bit of a personal side note, some things that you may not see with her just through holistic mom, MD. But she is super creative and I see that creativity come out just not in her children. But she's actually made me an art piece. She has made my niece a colorful whole food birthday cake. I mean there her creativity knows no end. So Medea, welcome. It's such a pleasure to finally have this conversation.

Oh my God, I am so incredibly thankful and so incredibly honored to be here. Having spending time with you in any capacity is like, oh, such a blessing. So thank you so much for having me.

Well, I feel the same about you. And before we jumped on, we were just talking about our birthdays, which we just had this week. Our birthdays are separated by one day, but different year obviously. And you know, you and I really connect to so many different themes and we're going to talk about some of those themes today. The first thing that I like to ask everybody is for us to put our toes into the sea of science and to talk about your professional life and how you came to be Holistic mom md. How did that happen? How did you decide to be a physician?

It started one, my grandfather was a homeopath. Actually he was the first one that was ever educated in our entire family. So before then they were all workers in Pakistan and at this time, India, Pakistan were one country in the 20s and 1920s. And he actually got his, he ran away from home. You know, nobody wanted him to get an education. He went and got a certification in homeopathy in the 1920s that was associated with the University of Michigan, which was. I found his plaque, which is, I thought was so cool. I know, right?

Even in that time, cutting edge.

So we knew we've had it. So as we were growing up with my dad also like, you know, giving us homeopathics for every ailment. So I sort of grew up in that holistic world. Not specific nutrition, more like, you know, integrate like different integrative approaches. But I got sick. I started developing lupus and Hashimoto's and severe digestive issues and acne and eczema and seborrheic dermatitis in residency. And I was like, there has to be a different way. Because I was just told by everybody else, sorry, just sit back and let this disease take its course. But I continued on that hamster wheel, right? I continued on that hamster wheel until one day my, my husband had this gut inclination and he says, can you go check up on our baby in daycare and remind you I was a new mom, a new wife, a new resident, both of. My husband was also an intern, I'm an intern, both working 80 hour work weeks. And I, it blew my mind because I walked into every mother's worst nightmare. The daycare provider was rocking back and forth in his chair and eerie silence is broken by my child in the back. And I saw that he was being suffocated almost to death. And I immediately picked him up and I ran out. And on that day, I promised I would take care of these kids the best that I know how. Because I'm like, God saved my child. I promise I'm going to take care of these kids the best that I know how. And I. But then I had to take a step back as a family physician. I didn't even know how to take care of myself. My sister is an interventional. My brother's an interventional cardiologist. My sister's a pediatric ICU physician. I have every doctor in my family. We didn't know how to take care of ourselves. But before this, why, sorry, I jumped into why I wanted to integrate holistic functional medicine. But before that, I did have all these chronic health conditions growing up even. And I saw that I loved to take care of people and loved to help them. Like, it was just my, like, it gave me so much joy to see a smile to help them in any way. So I'm like, you know what? My great grand. My grandfather was a doctor, a homeopath. But let's go through this route. My Actually, my brother, my sister and I both wanted to do medicine. All three of us wanted to do medicine. My dad was like, we are, you know, can't if I can't afford it. He's a cpa, even though he had a really great job as the CFO of American Trans Air at the time. And he's like, we're gonna have to. I don't want you guys to end up with loans or debt. So we quit our job, we sold our house. The entire family picked up and moved to Pakistan. So my dad and mom had, like. My dad and mom were the type of people that can't even. My dad can't even go to the grocery store without my mom. Like, like that much love. And yes, they flirt to this day. It's so, so adorable. But the fact that they sacrificed, you know, spreading separately for a year or so while we were trying, was studying in a different country. But actually, that was probably what changed my life forever. The way that I view the land, the view the world, because, I mean, I'm in a suburb of Chicago, and I grew up in a suburb of Chicago, but now you're going and living in a world that's, you know, third world country, where the electricity would go. We would have to study under lamps and lights, and then, you know, there was no light when the. When it would rain. Every time it would rain, all the electricity would go, and they would just sit outside and just. And connect and listen to the rain. And my mom at that time would bring out, like, radishes and carrots, and we would dip them in spices and all the different vegetables, and we would eat that. That was like our trad. And so then I was obviously learning about homeopathy a little bit in Pakistan and all these integrative approaches. I brought home a souvenir, my husband from Pakistan. We immediately came back, and that's when I started residency. But the thing is, again, you're just thrown into the. Into the hamster wheel, right? Just trying to keep my head above water. And I had lost some of those, you know, traditions that I had grown up, grown up with until this happened with my son. And I had to take a step back and look, and I'm like, my gosh, what am I doing here? My body is screaming out for help, and I'm not listening. And as. As a family physician, I don't have the solution. If I don't even know how to take care of myself, how am I going to take care of these kids? So that's when I Started taking a deep dive in integrative, holistic functional medicine. I joined this medical practice. We're under one roof. There was me, an OB gyn, an internal medical physician, acupressure, acupuncture, chiropractic, massage therapy, homeopathy, Chinese medicine, all under one roof in right after when I graduated residency. And I was like, oh my God, why did they teach me this sooner? This is all that I have been. And I fell in love with the. With all integrative holistic health. And that is. And then as I was on my journey, I was educating the kids, and now they have started their journey. So I really did start with my grandfather and the way that I opened up my eyes to this entire world. We were using it when we were kids and then went to Pakistan, saw this totally different world, came back, and then got thrown into conventional medicine and said, no, this is not where my heart is. And so this is. This is how I've gotten here today.

Somehow it started with your grandfather and the connection to homeopathy and, you know, to think that he was such a disruptor, like a positive disruptor during his. That time, the 1920s. So I'm kind of curious. Let's just wax on homeopathy for a second. Why do you think homeopathy came into his purview and why do you think it didn't come more into your path? I mean, I know it was there in that clinic, but it wasn't something that you decided to focus on. So is there any reason why.

That time. So conventional medicine, specifically in the 1920s was really expensive. And so like the drugs and the pharmaceuticals and my. I remember going back to his house and I saw the actual machine he. He made the homeopathics on. So he used to do that. It was more cost effective. I never asked specifically why homeopathy, but I know that it is very traditional to Pakistan and India. Even though it was developed in Germany, it had made its way into Pakistan and India and a lot of people were using it. No side effects, less drug interactions. It was easy. It was more cost effective for patients to use at that time. And I think my. Actually my. My grandfather was very holistic. So homeopathy is one of those, you know, that actually looks at the whole person and dives deep into even, like if somebody's dealing with a symptom, like what happened when it started, like, what are your symptoms? What makes it worse, what makes it better? I mean, the interview alone is only. It can be like hours on end to just understand the what medication to give this the person. So I know that's probably where he dove into because I know he was very holistic. He loved to talk to people and go get to the underlining root cause, what's going on and then to make these remedies from scratch in his own house. Um, it was more cost effective, less side effects. I know that's where I, I believe that's where he really tried and that's why he wasn't doing it.

You know, homeopathy. I, I have a personal intrigue with it, which is why I'm asking you about it as well. Because it's something that is so ancient, something that is just like you said, it's on many levels of the person. And if you think of the day and the age that we're living in now in the 21st century, it's actually connected to more of the, the quantum aspects, the subtle field before disease even comes into the physical body. So in some ways it's such a, it's both ancient and incredibly futuristic at the same time. So that's why I was kind of curious about your take on homeopathy.

Yeah, no, that's, it is. And then the, the fact that, I mean the science behind it has always intrigued me. Right. Because it's like basically the way that it changes the water and like that you're just like diluting it and diluting it and diluting and diluting it. It's been, and I have seen it work and I think that's where we've, I mean I've had patients, specifically when I first reintroduced it back into my life, patients with, I remember a 70 year old with the severe psoriasis all over his body. He tried everything, just, I started this homeopathic. It was, it disappeared, you know, so it's just like. You're right, it's the futuristic and then it's like ancient all at the same time. And then the results and then the, the, the, the theories behind it, it's been, I know, I, I, it's been something that I've been intrigued with for years.

Yeah, I love that it's in your lineage. You know, one of the things that you mentioned when you went back to pa, you went from living in this very modern Chicago suburb into what felt like it was less modern. And so like you said, no electricity, you know, just connecting to the elements. If it rained, you went outside. Do you think that that window of exposure into some other ways of living eventually informed you when you came back to the States and Then you were feeling like, well, wait a minute, maybe we have a disconnection in this way of life. Do you think that there was something to that?

Absolutely. I could do not. Like, that's probably the best time of my life and the worst time of my life. It was because it was hard. It was really, really difficult, one, to change to a different culture, that even I may look the same as them, but my culture was different. But the fact that, you know, here, the thought of not having electricity and the thought of not having, like, running water and the thought of not having, like, these are, like, you know, blessings we take advantage of. And then what are you going to do now if you're put into that situation and now you have an exam, that's the next day. Like, what are you gonna do?

Yeah.

With this world? And so I was. What I remember in Pakistan specifically was how time slowed down when you truly connected with people at a level where we didn't have technology. Remember, lights would go a lot because it would rain a lot. It's not like something that would happen just once a month. It would, like, happen multiple times a week. That's when it really hit to me, like, you know, time here, people would take siestas in the middle of the day. You know, like, we can't even think of. It was so fun. It's like, you know, they're working all day long in the hot sun. They come back, they're actually having lunch together as a family. Then we're having dinner together as a family. Then the lights would go, and we would sit together as a family outside. We would. The entire neighborhood, actually, would come to our house. Well, here in America, I mean, that was never the case, right? That sense of community. We knew everybody that was in front of us on the side of us on each, you know, what was going on in people's lives and how we can help out. So that true sense of community and love and gratitude for the things that we take for granted every single day was what I gained most out of my trip to Pakistan. Plus, on top of that, like, actually another caveat was my last year while I was there, I experienced that horrific earthquake. And we were the actual medical students that were on as the, you know, taking care of all of these patients that were coming from, you know, northern Pakistan. And actually, we felt it. It was, like, really, you know, really scary in our own house. It really caused destruction. But then to see the. How people were, their, like, attitudes towards this huge destruction, because here I'm like, okay, I'm gonna go back to America. You know, I'm gonna. I. I was. Throughout this entire time I was studying for the United States medical licensing exam. And so I knew I was gonna go back to America. America. But then to see these like to. So it's like, oh, there's these people don't have anything now. They've lost everything. Like they have their. Their kids and the happiness and the joy they still felt that changed. That's what really, really, you know, locked it in for me. I'm like, oh my gosh. The more that we have, sometimes the less that we are thankful for, but the less that we have with the increased thankfulness and the joy and the love for the little things that we have in our lives. Those people there really taught me a lot also. And to coming back that I did I think this entire. And then the fact that my parents had sacrificed everything that they had had for us and that spent that quality time. My dad was actually like retired for five years while we were there. He just picked us and dropped us from medical school. I mean it was a completely different world because I went to an army medical college in Pakistan. So it was like discipline, which I am not. And so I wasn't.

In a way almost 10 books discipline.

But as in like they wanted you quiet. They wanted you like to follow what they did. They weren't. And so my. It was like. So I had to wear a sari for five years of my life Craziness even in Pakistan now this is just a caveat and this is where it just builds to my love and passion was and specifically on things that I believed I had started my headscarf in America when I was the first one in my entire family. No one had ever started wore a headscarf before. And I. It was something that I really truly wanted to do. So people looked at me for what I am on the inside, not my physical features. And in Pakistan here I'm in a Muslim country and they used to stand us up outside and tell us to take every. Take it all off. So here in a Muslim country I was not allowed so that I was like, no, are you kidding me? This is something that in America I was able to do. So would you. When I said that it was like Pakistan was the worst and the best case. It was hard and all different levels in my spirituality.

More about that.

Yeah. And so. Yeah. And all of that. And because it's disrupted what I knew and because in America I was taught these. And then here in Pakistan there said no, you they would actually, because they forced us at one time, at one point, they forced us to take the headscarf off. They would stand us up in lines outside and when we didn't, to face the sun. Because in Pakistan, our biggest punishment for, for women is the change of their complexion. It could be from the colonization, whatever that they. So they would literally stand us up outside, staring at the sun for hours on end if we didn't. So that was. I'm like, no, I am not going to move from what I believe in physically, mentally, emotionally, psychologically, spiritually. And so that Pakistan had taught me a lot. And now bringing those things here back into this conventional medical system where there were like, this is the way you're taught. This is what we're going to. I'm like, no, this is not what I believe in. I am not going to go beyond what I feel is needed for my body, for myself or my children. And this. I don't. So it's really like I've never been the type to, you know, whipped in one direction and just like her, following her mentality, using my thoughts, using my intellect, using my heart to really guide me into how I take care of my patients today, guide me to how I take care of my body, myself, my world around me.

Do you think that you were always kind of an independent, fiery, free type as you're describing, or do you think that having the contrast of being in the United States, going to Pakistan, coming back, it's like you were living between two worlds and who is Medea and how you were finding yourself in that process?

Absolutely, absolutely. Because of the fact that again, we're, we're dictated, right? Either what our parents have told us, what this. But then when you, when you, you take in your ethics and all the things that you believe in and now you disrupt them, that's when it truly, when you truly can find what brings you out of these situations. Like, well, that's, that's who you truly are. You know, after you've taken like your, your core beliefs and ethics. And then when I went to Pakistan, it sort of disrupted a lot of it. We didn't have access to the pla. The, the blessings. Unfortunately, even here in America, I was, I could wear what I wanted to wear. While in Pakistan, that was disrupted. I was like, what? Right. And so these things were disrupted to understand, okay, this is what I truly believe. This is why I truly believe these. And it comes out stronger in the long run.

It's so fascinating now that angle. I wasn't, I didn't have that window in to you as an individual. That's so interesting because it makes you who you are and.

Absolutely.

Yeah. And I see it through your work with health and through disrupting. Disrupting the space in a really good way. Medea, just to go back to your upbringing a little bit, because you're alluding to so the difference in perhaps how Islam was portrayed in Pakistan versus the United States. And maybe even if there was a. I don't know if it was different if you were a woman, but maybe you can back up into your upbringing and talk a little bit more about the spirituality or the religion that your family raised you in and then what happened later on.

Absolutely. So another, you know, being born and raised as a Muslim. So my parents were, they were first gen. We were, I was first generation. So they came in and my dad actually, you know, had a sib, had a brother here in America. So therefore he was like, they, my, my, my grandfather sent them all to go get higher education because remember, he was educated and got higher education in America. I remember my dad was like, I was a textile engineer. I was happy over there. So dad for to come over America. And so we, when we came to America, specifically in Naperville, Illinois, there was not even a single mosque. So we, I remember having our, my dad was sort of that disruptor where like, you know, we need to come together and form this and build this together and getting people in the community. And so I had been part of that, you know, building community, love, connection, spirituality from the very beginning. And so I, I remember I was like my favorite thing to do when we finally got our first mosque. And like it was in Naperville. Now, just to give you context, Naperville, within like a 20 minute distance. There's probably 10 different mosques now, right? Like 20 minute radius. Like there's a lot now. So this time there were, there was nothing here. And, and I remember when we first got the thing, I even, you know, I was the one that did all of the landscaping around. Cause I love to play with the dirt. And that's a side note. But I had been, you know, this had been ingrained in me from the very beginning trying to build this. And this is where when I learned more about it, I started the head scarf. But. Okay, we're going to back up for just a little bit. We used to go to Pakistan. Okay, now I'm going to get personal here because this is stuff I've never shared with anybody before because why am I. And I. And it does have Something to do with my drive and taking care of my kids and the way that people are now is that in America I was. What you. What you're. The question that you had asked in America, I was free to practice the way that I wanted. Yes, there were some looks here and there, but in Pakistan, because my parents family was still in Pakistan. So we would go and spend three months at a time every couple years. My dad would save up all the money and spend three months every other year to go, like, spend our summer vacation in Pakistan. And there it was more cultural. So the religion was taken into a cultural sense. They had never really seen women the way that. So the way that the respect of women in Pakistan was horrific, and it still is horrific. And I'm going to say this over and over because again, the culture. There's a difference between religion and culture. And that's when unfortunately, what's going on in the world today is portrayed that the way that they treat women, I personally felt that, that it was wrong because in. In our religion, women are put on a pedestal. Like, it's really like, I mean, with Mary and like we literally have an entire book, like a chapter in our book titled Mary, right, All about her. Like, the women are put on pedestal. Like the way that our income our. Like, we like there's a lot of pieces there that were put on a pedestal. But when we go into these cultural places where they're forcing women to put things on or they're looking at women a certain way, I always felt like whenever I went to Pakistan, I had been more sexually abused in Pakistan than I had been in America by my multiple different relatives. And I would come back and I'm like, what is going on? And that's why I'm like, no, I do not want anybody to treat me this way. So this is where I'm like started to understand the. The importance of the headscarf to cover modesty, right? Covering my body, making sure that no one takes advantage of me. But because of those, my growing up and being abused in Pakistan that way, I. That literally, that has. What's. Has changed and my trajectory of my life and to the point where I'm raising men that will kiss the ground women walk on, that will be mindful of what they put in their bodies, that they're going to be mindful of the people that. Mindful of their surroundings, mindful of who they are. Like, that was. I feel like, because I kept on going back and forth to Pakistan and seeing this firsthand and then living this Living this through, you know, all these terrible experiences that I had had and then living it for five years during medical school and saw the way that women were treated. Again, not religion. It was just completely cultural. I'm like, this is wrong. We need to now and then raise men and leaders that will respect and love life and love, love themselves, because if they can take care of their own bodies, then what is the chance they're going to hurt somebody else? Right? And that's where my biggest goal was, that I want to make sure that I raise a future generation that is not just going to follow the social nor I want to raise a future generation that is going to use their brain to think about what they have been given and what is going on in the world around them and start to ask questions. And that's why we started the podcast, because I'm like, we are not going to just follow her mentality. We need to wake up and start thinking for ourselves, mind, body, and soul. And so that has been because of my past experiences when I lived there and when I used to visit is really where has projected me to make sure no one, you know, to create a world of leaders and that think for themselves and connect with mind, body, and soul. I know that was also. So you were throwing lots of stuff out there today.

Thank you for sharing that. I have goosebumps. I feel. You know, I feel this sense of emotion in me as you speak about it, and yet at the same time, I feel the sense of empowerment. I feel like you've got this because I remember when you were pregnant with your fifth son and you were like, it's a boy. You know, there must be a message why I keep getting boys.

No, seriously. Because I had hated men up to this point because, you know, because of all my past. And then it's like, okay, even. Okay, so even my husband, the. So in our traditional culture, we don't physically interact with our spouses until after marriage, Right? And so my. My dad's a class fellow, so it was like we found him through, like, a mutual friend. My husband, he was already in America looking for residency. He's about five years older than. And the mutual friends. My parents really loved each other. They connected. They sat down, and then my. My husband would come, and he would be like, okay, I just want to marry this woman. And I was like, you're crazy, because you're probably just gonna, you know, run off with. Go to America. You know, just take my visa and run off with some white chick. No offense to white chicks, but I was like, what, are you crazy? And so even that I was. I got married because I saw that I could potentially love him. You know, the way that he took care of his family, the way he took care of his mother, the way that he took care of his family. Now we were celebrating our 20th, even though it has been ups and downs, the 20th anniversary. But even then I was like, no, I'm not doing this. I've. I've always. I think I've had these, like. Like, which I've tried. I had to sort of break down. And then. And it's been like. And my body has been telling me, like, for the first, you know, 15 years of our marriage, I've had severe vaginismus because of all of that craziness. And then, like, having kids was very difficult. Getting checked for kids was very difficult. Like, it was just until I had to get rid of. I had to, like, deal with the trauma of the past. But then it was one boy after another boy after another boy. And I'm like, I hate boys. Like, what is happening now? You know what I mean? But you have this, like, your subconscious, like, immediately is like, oh, my God, men destroyed my life when I was getting up, growing up. And I'm like, no, I'm not gonna make. We gotta make sure that I. So if God, you have blessed me with these children and I had to have to have come to. Like, I really did. I was like, okay, five boys. What are you trying to tell me? Like, you know, either you can take. Your perspective can either be your pain, or your perspective can be your power. And I have taken that pain that I had dealt with as growing up, and I have turned it into my power where I have taken that, like, what I had felt. And I want him, like, I am putting all my energy into myself, taking care of first this and then my family, specifically these boys, where again to raise them as leaders, as someone who doesn't just follow the status quo, who is asking questions, who are disruptors of the industry also. And not just taking my word for it, they're doing their own research, educating themselves and. And connecting them, mind, body and soul. So my oldest now has memorized our holy book, right, Just for fun, he wanted to do this during the pandemic. And so to know what does. Don't listen to what everybody else is telling you. Don't listen to what the people of culture are telling you. Go back to the source and come up with your own answers and answers to the questions that you have. And so I'VE always done that. And I really believe it started from my past that has now brought me to this future.

Wow. Your upbringing adds and listening to your story of how your Persona developed is just. There's so much there, and I feel like it's continuing to unfold. It's really beautiful to see your path. And I feel like your five boys, I've met them and you know, they are embodiments of finding their truth and speaking their truth. You know, you really have cultivated that with them. Medea, I want to go back to something you said. I even made kind of a side note here because I think it's so important because there's so much division in the world around religions and what people think and feel. And you made a distinction between the spiritual aspects of a religion, holy books, practices, and the culture and how they can be very distinct things. And sometimes those. Those waters get muddied. Right. And so I'm curious, now that you are in the United States and you have your day in the life of, you know, being a mom, being a physician, and being a thought leader in this space, how do you bring in more of the spiritual practice into your everyday? I noticed that you were using the word soul as you were talking about your boys and what they're doing. So what do you do as a family now, now that you're separated from the cultural aspects, I would say. And now you have this container of a spiritual reserve. How does that show up within your family and with your boys?

Again, very similar to what I did with my parents as they have been really my role models in this, all this and the gratitud and the positivity. And that is we just had ritual. What do I do with my boys? We focus on gratitude right to the is key. I mean now science with like heart math and all these amazing things. We know that. And the way that, you know, you walk into a room and you can feel who you people's energies is. Gratitude is a very important piece of our everyday lives. Immediately when you wake up in the morning, say 10 things that they were thankful for. And the other piece of this puzzle is that obviously I am religious, spiritual, religious. And so we, we practice our through. So we, we pray five times a day sitting down. And then that one, you know, cultural, it's like, oh, just get it done with. But it's like the religion, it's like actually meditate during those times and connect with your creator. Stop everything what we're doing and then five times a day connect with our creator. Deep breathe, be mindful. We've actually incorporated our, our mindfulness rituals and routines during that time. So we'll take deep breaths, we'll you know, parasympathetic as sympathetic to parasympathetic. Take deep breaths and then be mindful and, and then pray, do our five daily prayers and then the next thing that we do after that is that end was more gratitude and positivity. Right. So that's five times a day. We could do it outside, we do it inside, we go out in nature, we talk about it. As I said the my oldest has memorized our holy book. Right. And if anybody knows that is 660 pages of you are not where we're, we're not really, we're not Arabic. We're back from Pakistan, so we don't understand Arabic. So to now memorize something that we had never, you know, we don't truly understand. And then we go take a deeper dive into the scripture almost on a regular daily basis, but specifically on what it means, what it means to live holistically and eat. And we've done this through the food that we eat. Okay. So now we are. So you had mentioned I'm writing my 10th book. So we have really taken a deeper dive and nobody has done this worldwide that I have known on a known of deeper dive on what it means to eat real food specifically for the Muslim world and, and the importance of it. And so I think this is one thing that has connected all of us and why we are all so passionate in one being mindful and to eat real food and take care of the body that God has given us through these foods and our lifestyles is because we believe that this is the one biggest gift from God. Because we believe that this food that we've been blessed with when we go we took deeper dives in the scripture. The book that I'm writing right now is actually redefining halal eating for the Muslim world. It's going to blow everybody's mind because the way that the halal industry is currently is that red number 40, yellow number 5, sodium benzoate, all of these additives and preservatives are, are halal. And that which we know now in clear science is these things cause harm to the body. And so the things that cause harm to the body should not be halal. And actually in the word that God has used in, in over and over and over, if we truly are enslaved to God, we have to eat real food. And then in God, like actually God has specified what real Food, the definition of real food, the real food is what I throw. Water, like rain falls from the sky, the ground bursts open, and then you have all of this vegetation in all varying different colors over and over and over. In our scripture, it talks about the importance of color. And look at all the colors I've given you and look at the vegetation and the color. And it's because. And then. But nobody has taken a seat. Nobody has really looked.

Looked at this.

And we're just eating white, white and maybe some brown. Right. And so this is where so now go diving into trying to get Muslims even to one, take care of their bodies, the biggest blessings on their planet. And then two, how? By being mindful. Actually, the book that the Quran was sent down was actually for. It's literally the first line is for those that are mindful. And so if we're not mindful, guess what? We're not going to be able to understand. We're not going to be able to truly absorb the relationship or the verses of the Quran if we are not mindful. So these are things that what you're saying connect with my kids because of the fact that, you know, we started off in this, you know, conventional. I didn't really look at it in a lens with religion or spirituality as much until we started to dive into the food and the Quran and how we have to, like, eat and why we need to eat this way. And that has really, like, connected us all together as a spiritual where the kids won't even touch anything artificial. Not even, like to the point where they will not. Yeah, they will not touch an artificial and one. Yes, they know what it does to their body, but because of the fact that they truly know that this body is a gift. And I think this is what we talk about on a daily basis, is that one of the biggest blessings that we have is our bodies and our minds and our souls and our connections and the people around us and our communities. Right. And so those are. That is what we truly need to take care of. So the kids won't even look at artificial fake food in that way. Like, oh, it's okay. Once in a while. They're like, no, we're not going to destroy the body that God has. We have been blessed with. Right. And. And I think that's where I have felt that that's where we have connected as a family together with this and trying to find this new understanding about, you know, how food actually impacts our soul. And that's what our biggest. And that's what we're doing with. So actually the. The kids will go. And they were like, oh, let's go dive into this verse. And this is what this. Oh, my God. Because in Arabic, it's really cool. Okay. In Arabic, one actually has like an ocean of meaning, right? So like one word so that. In English, it's like, you know, the word just has the meaning. But Arabic and all. Some of these other, like, I think Hebrew and all these, like, all of them have like, the word actually has then an ocean of meaning. So it's like the root word. And so for. In a. In. In Arabic, the word for food is. And that underlining. Actually the underlining root of that word means nourishment, right? In. In Arabic. So that's what we've been to see how. What I'm saying. So when you're saying connecting wise, spiritually. Yes, it's everything that we're learning, you know, from all these amazing scholars from all over the world and the. And the medical doctors and Harvard professors. But then it's also taking a deeper dive in like, what have we as a human been taught by our creator from the Quran? Because it's like, I mean, we are all this beautiful masterpiece, and we're just all a piece of the master, you know, so it's like, it's just. I love it. So then we just. Because of that, that's. We do that on a daily basis. I know it's crazy, but we all love it so much. We go. We take dive. We take deeper dives in understanding this. And that's how. What connects us as a family.

It definitely does. Minda, I have been to your home, and I have witnessed your children actually being on that straight line to. You know, I'm not deviating from that. If I go to a party, I am not going to partake and have that cake. They are so. They're not even disciplined. It's just part of who they are. They don't even see another way. You know, I. I love.

Yeah. And I really think this is why. This is why. Because it's like they are so convicted to the fact that this body is our gift from our creator. And so to even like, take a morsel. So they. What they've done and what we've been taught is to. When we eat real food, it connects us to ultimate gratitude that we are ultimately grateful for this body that we have been blessed with. But when we start eating, even taking a bite of this artificial, fake junk food that we know can have consequences, then are we truly grateful for the body that we've been blessed with. And so that is because, remember, we start off each one, each one of our days with gratitude. So I, even my baby right now will wake up and I'll just start singing the grateful song. Thank you for my eyes. Thank you for my eyes. It's so cute. He goes, oh, mama, let's clean the bed. And he'll start thinking like, grateful song. It's really adorable. So I've been doing that with them from the beginning. So gratitude is, you know, we try to weave it in deep and then now connected to spiritual and then in our daily action. So it does. It makes a big difference.

You know, I remember when you and I were in Chicago for the PLMI Orthomolecular Conference. I think it was April 2024. You and I were walking to the color factory. You were taking me out. I wasn't feeling well, and we had this whole conversation of what you just unpacked very eloquently. And I remember the passion that you had of, you know, here we are, our body is a temple. Our body's a gift from our creator. And we are just using halal foods. But they're not pure. Like, people don't understand that. And I think the word that you used, if I have it right, is tayib. How do you. Okay, so that would be like the next level of purity with food, right? Did I.

So, okay, so what it is is that there's halal, that means lawful and tayyab means pure, tranquil, nutritious, safe. Then no doubt about it, this food is good for you. This means good for you. That if there's any inkling of harm in it, that it's no longer tayyib, or if it's been changed by human hands, that is no longer tayyib. So, and this is where over and over and over in the Quran, for us, God is directly connected, that if we truly worship our creator, if we truly are enslaved to our Lord, then we will have where we will truly eat. We have to eat tayyib and be grateful. So we focus on the halal piece. But now in this world, you're going to see like we've, we've. This is where, remember, culture, religion, like, is intertwining. We talked about the beginning. We have been obsessed with the slaughter part of it, which that right now we believe that the culture that zabiha equals halal, where in the Quran actually ta'. Al. So if I know this is what I'm disrupting with my book. So the People are not going to like me. It's because the fact that if it's not real food, then we should not be consuming it. But unfortunately, I came from a conference of, what, 60,000 people this weekend. And, like, I went to even the most, you know, religious, spiritual place for Muslims is Mecca. I could not find real food there. I, me and my kids, I had to take two luggages worth of food for two weeks. I cooked two weeks worth of food because I knew. I already knew because I'd been there once or twice before. I knew I had to. I could not. But specifically during Hajj. Hajj is like that one. That one thing every Muslim needs to do before they die. Just go on one pilgrimage, and you are literally stripped of your worldly desire, worldly things. You're just wearing simple clothes. You're praying all day long. You're taking care of your spiritual health. But then they give you Subway and McDonald's, and they're passing out Coca Cola, right? And this is when, in 2018, when they saw this, I'm like, what are we doing? As a physician, I know that this is destroying our bodies. We're all praying for health. Like, that's one of the main prayers that all of us have is like, pray, pray for health. And here what we're doing is destroying our bodies. And then when I went back again with my kids in 2024 last year, I could not find any real food there. The McDonald's is actually in the Haram. So, like, in the actual McDonald's, Subway, Pizza Hut, Dunkin Donuts, and Baskin Robbins is what people are eating while they're there. I could not. I'm telling you, even on the grocery stores, I could not find any real food. I could barely found fruits and vegetables while I was there. And so that's why I'm like, this is a problem here. We're, like, optimizing our spiritual health, but there's some disconnect where we're not also taking care of the physical, but not recognizing that. That's. I mean, one of the. This is the one thing that I've opened up because all religions, I mean, you know, Adam and Eve, right? Like, we were tested. If we're specifically Muslim, we were like, God's like, you can eat everything else in. In the. In heaven. You can eat everything else. Just don't touch this tree or apple or whatever. And so food even was our first test as a humanity. We had never. And this is something that we continue to overlook. So why are we continuing to overlook this. And then even with the children of Israel, right, they had passed the waters, and this is stuff that I'm talking about, but they passed the waters. And where Moses, you know, saved them from the Pharaoh and God gave them manna and salwa and like, you know, these birds and things. And then they were like, can we have the food of the people when we were enslaved? And God was like, no. In multiple places, was like, no, eat the food that I have given you. Because if we truly believe that God is our provider, then why are we eating foods that man has provided, right? If we. And pushing away the foods that God has provided us. And so that's where like, even the children of Israel were told to eat dieb, to eat real food. Even, you know, Adam was told to eat, you can eat everything else, but just don't touch what harms you. And this is something that, again, unites us all, is that the foods that we eat and to truly take care of ourselves and our bodies. So, yes, the Toyah piece is really important. And that's what we're taking a deeper dive in now with my new book.

Love this. And I was waiting for you to actually crystallize your thinking on it. Because listening to you and feeling your passion, I could really get a sense of that disconnection that is out there. I mean, I even see it. You know, I was raised Christian, and, you know, you go to church and what, what do you see after the service? Orange juice, donuts, pastries. And it's like, what are we, a glycemic machine? Like, why is there no connection to, like, you're saying, like, all religions have a connection with food, whether it is the ceremony of eating, the ritual of eating, and you're taking it to the next level. Especially for Muslims in terms of, okay, let's take this to the next level. Because we are shortcutting the process. And in those shortcuts and in those decisions we're making, we're not honoring and being grateful to this body that we are. That we are living within. Right?

So absolutely. And. And one thing I just wanted to, like, in the Quran, for us specifically, it's like, every living thing worships God, right? He says that over and over. Every living thing worships God. So when we eat that orange, when I look at that orange, for me, that is a masterpiece. So, like, all. That's why I think I've connected with you for so long. It's like, like all these little, like, oh, my God, look at how beautiful this looks. Look how Like, I, I look at all of this fruits, I bring all the fruits and vegetables that I have, and I'm like, thank you. Right? And I look at the masterpiece that this is, and then, and then so when I open that orange and I know that nothing has touched us orange, besides for the divine. And now I'm putting this in, this in my mouth, and it's connecting with my cells. It can now connect our spiritual connection like that energy, our spiritual energy can now that if we've eaten something and our cells have been now cultivated and are being made out of something that has also been a part of the Creator, right? This orange or this, the. This real food that we're eating, we can, are. The spiritual energy can flow within us to a level that no one else can understand. And then this is where I feel like I connect with people so much on a spiritual level. Because especially when you, when you, when you see this person that eats real food, you can connect, like, you can totally connect at a level that is. You can't even describe. So eating real food then really helps us to improve our spiritual connection through those ways too. So I love it. I love it.

Beautifully said. You know, it's so interesting because I was just talking with Dr. David Perlmutter yesterday in a similar conversation, and he said so many similar things to what you're saying. The gratitude piece, he also talked about a sunflower and stopping to look at a sunflower to look at the perfection of almost like the sacredness of how those seeds are arranged. Right. And so when we connect to that, he was also talking about how when we're connected to the source of Creator or whatever name we're giving that source, that we stay in alignment, we stay in health. And so some of what you're saying, I'm just feeling like, wow, you know, such a similar way of looking at the world. And your connection is through food primarily. I mean, you look at all of the lifestyle, like, with gratitude and stress and. But the food piece is.

That's where it's really connected. So this is why, you know, when you were like, oh, you're here. And I'm like, I would love to make you a rainbow cake, please. That would be my dream come true. And it was like I had. So you're like, what is the woman wanting to make connections? Because for me, it was like that color, that love when you're looking at it, when you're creating with it, when you're, like, seeing the beauty of that fruits and vegetables and then like, what you can and so, you know, whenever I go to conferences, I take food because I feel like that's where it connects us. Like, we are all connected through the food. Like, there's no bigger blessing that I have that I can take every nutrient that the God the universe has created and put it in this delicious, beautiful meal and then share it with others so that it can. To optimize their biology, to optimize their physical, mental, emotional, psychological, spiritual health. For me, that's like the ultimate being becoming the ultimate, you know, healer and friend and is to, like, not just, like here. I don't just love to nourish and take care of you, but I love to nourish each one of your cells, right? Like, that look makes that so it gives me joy and a friendship and connection and to love, to feed people who understand the power of that is powerful. So that's how I've, you know, you talked about, you know, creativity and love and connection and gratitude, and it all intertwines right there, you know, with this, with feeding people and taking care of others and, you know, and not just being like, oh, here's just Subway sandwich or whatever, just like, something. But it's like the actual thought that goes into every ingredient and the phytonutrients. Like, that's what gives me pure joy.

Wish the audience could see this picture of the cake that you made for my niece, because it was the only cake I've ever had for dinner and not anything else. It was, like, so healthy, just on its own, and it brought us so much joy. So, Medea, I. I thank you for your friendship because I've actually experienced and been on the receiving end of your love creations through food, right? They're colorful. It's like the embodiment of spirituality and creativity and health. It's like everything combined. And then we all eat it and we feel that.

Oh, my God. I know. And this is where I think. I think what I look at it as, and I heard this great analogy from one of the podcasts people the kids interviewed, is that, you know, God, the universe is like electricity, right? The electricity is always on and God is looking to pour into each one of us, right? It's like a light bulb. Like, so each one of us is a light bulb. So depending on what we're nourishing this light bulb with or what we're, you know, like, if it's muggy, you know, you. The light's not going to be able to go through it as much. But it depends on what we're Nourishing this ourselves with. Because each one of us has the ability to pour infinite creativity and love and gratitude into the world. I mean our heart is electromagnetic. So can you imagine, I mean we've done studies where that love and that spirituality and the gratitude can change plans in the room, right? Like those connections. So can you imagine what it's going to have if all of us were connected into this, into this, like you know, in, in on one sphere, right? If we're, if each one of us is the sum of one, like we're all the sum of this one. And so if we can look through these lenses and know that each one of us has that capability to pouring so much love and light into the world and if we took care of the vessel that it was coming through, can you imagine where the world would be if we were all living our true purpose, our true self and taking care of our bodies, mind, body, soul. Something that again, doctors do not pay attention to. Most medical doctors do not touch the soul. That was something we were taught to only touch where from like a, like a ten foot pole, like. But it is so important because how you show up in the world can really translate into how the world, you know, evolves. And how, what, what, what, like what the energy that you generate and the love that you pour out into the world can really create that change.

Well, on that note, my final question to you is so you just had a birthday and you're one year older and you've got five kids and they're all becoming older and moving into their later teens, but you've got some younger boys as well. Let's just Fast forward in 20 years. Where is Medea? Do you have 20 books? Are you lecturing to a hundred thousand people in an audience? Like where, where is your trajectory? Your science, your medicine, your healing, your spiritual sense of connecting food to spirituality? Where is that? In 20 years.

I envision entire world where each one of us is eating real food, connecting at a level and soul, because I cannot, because that's where I truly. And so I'm going to continue to work towards that. I mean you've seen those heart math studies where they even like we've, you know, can cause world peace. Like if we were all energetically right, if we were all energetically the same, like you know, pouring out with love and gratitude. Heartmath has done those studies and I'm like, we're going to try to get there, right? We're gonna try to get, teach and educate people the importance of love and gratitude. And spirituality and taking care of the body with God foods. Right, the foods that God made. And can you imagine where we would be able to accomplish when our prefrontal cortex are working appropriately? Right. When we're not creating limbic system driven decisions? And so I know now that we're gonna talk about Dr. Perlman, but like world peace. And I'm going to continue to create that ripple effect, right? And that's where I see this. I'm working towards world peace where we are not just focusing on our differences, but we're focusing on our similarities and our love and our connection. And I can't even imagine what we'd be able to pour into the world and our planet and Mother Earth if we truly were able to, you know, embody that. All of us, to continue to lead by example and to educate the world about the importance and why we need to, if we truly want to save this planet, to save humanity, to save our future, and really continue to work on helping people with our perspective. Because again, perspective can either be your pain or your power. And then so we can truly create that ripple effect that can heal the world from the inside out. That is my goal.

Medea, thank you so much. I mean, we are well on our way, thanks to you and thanks to your five boys. Thanks to the podcast, the books that you've been putting out in the world, the lectures that you've been giving. So I feel like, yeah, I mean, you have shown us such a great example of what it means to be in service to this bigger mission and overturning adversity for alignment. And so thank you. You know, I have got goosebumps. I've had goosebumps this whole interview because you're just hitting on so many beautiful things that, you know, many of us think about, but you're actually putting them into action.

Oh, my gosh, absolutely. This is a one of a kind. Oh, you poured so much into me. Thank you so much for having me on. This is so beautiful.

My pleasure. Thanks so much.