MINI-SERIES: CAREER CATALYST - Networking Genius

After all, all art is experience. Hello, welcome to The Company Doctor and the third and final part of our Career Catalyst miniseries, marking the release of Gary's new book, Career Catalyst: 10 Secret Job Skills They Don't Teach You in School. We're ending the series with an absolute classic from the archives, Networking Genius, in which Gary takes me through the techniques needed to make your networks collide and the benefits of staying curious. There aren't many industries or careers aren't powered by successful networking. By adding this skill to your arsenal, you'll find yourself well on the way to becoming a career catalyst. Gary and George, from podcasts past, it's over to you.

We're talking networking today, and it's something that we have covered before, but this time we're doing advanced networking, and we're talking about how to be the Einstein of networking. So I guess to start off, I'll ask you, what is networking really, sort of distilled? Is it still important in this day and age when we can sort of call up people and send unsolicited emails and, you know, we're all sort of digitally connected? Do we still need to go through the same practices that maybe have helped you in the past in terms of networking?

Yeah, I think there's never been a better time to talk about it. So our very first episode was the most popular episode and we always said that we'd do an advanced version. So here we are. Yeah. Interestingly enough, if you look up the sort of standard text about what the hell is networking, it's something bland like the act of interacting with others to exchange information and develop professional social contacts, blah, blah, blah, blah.

Yeah, yeah.

But actually, I've been thinking about this. I'd like to think about it as an infinite loop because I think that does a disjustice to the topic of networking. I do think it's massively important. And actually, if you think about it, we've been stuck indoors. We've lost the human connection. We've had it taken away, if you like, over the last couple of years. And I think now it's time to reconnect and indulge in what we lost, don't you?

Yeah, I do. And I imagine people are probably quite nervous about it, as you say, having not been able to do it for so long. It's probably— it hasn't become, you know, it stopped being second nature, which for so long it was. Now we're sort of more reliant on what we're doing, which is just chatting digitally. And you're right. I think now's the time to get out and double our efforts when it comes to networking.

Double double. Double double. Yeah. I mean, you know, it is one of those things that probably scares people. Some people that are listening were scared before. Before COVID about the word networking, because I think it conjures up all these things. So here's my, yeah, so my view is infinite loop. Do you know what an infinite loop is?

I guess it's just a loop that just goes on forever.

It's infinite. Yeah, yeah. There's no getting past you today.

I'm the network, I'm the genius.

You are the genius, forget me. But yeah, so, but an infinite loop is in like a figure of 8 for those of you that are not aware of it. So it is continuous, but think of an 8 on its side and think of it as a rail track actually. A rail track. So our job is to kind of go around this rail track all the time and find different chess moves and different ways to nudge our little train. Yeah, but we're driving. We need to be driving the train across the rail track.

Okay.

Is that the worst description of networking you've ever heard?

There's a lot of different moving parts to that.

There's moving parts and chess moves.

Trains, figure of eights. But yes, I actually know that symbol, the infinite loop. It's got a name like It sounds a bit like Aurora Borealis, but it's not, it's something else. But anyway, I am familiar with that.

No, I like that.

I like the engine. I like the Steam Engine.

Well, all of this, I'm going to fill it all the detail, all the color into this throughout this episode, hopefully. And by the end of it, you'll know what's inside my infinite loop.

Okay.

Networking is the ultimate infinite loop.

That's so much more exciting, isn't it? Than that bland description. Because it shouldn't be boring networking, should it? It should be an exciting thing.

Yeah, and it's not a thing. Well, that's the thing. It's not a thing. 'Cause you know, when you read the description again, the act of interacting with others to exchange blah blah, really? Yeah. I mean, you know, it's not good, is it? So let's start off. So why the hell do you care? Why do people care? So if you are gonna network, why do people care that you want to approach them? And the truth is they probably don't. Yeah. And that's people's fear is like, you know, you've got imposter syndrome. Why would someone want to meet me? And the truth is that might be true, but you need to find a reason why they might want to meet with you. And I think it starts with, what do you want to be famous for? You know, why would they want to meet you? And I think you can create that why. You know, we talked about personal brand before, but by standing for something, to be famous for something— if you think about whatever job you do, whatever you do in life, you've got something interesting about you. Yeah. And it's trying to leverage that.

Is it as simple as having a strong opinion on something and sort of— so you become known as the person who thinks this sort of slightly controversial way about something in particular?

Yeah, I think that's a good— it's a great place to start. I mean, I would say that you want to have a polarized opinion, right? Even if you don't have a polarized opinion, you want to kind of create one. We talked about being a disruptor before. Yeah, you need to be a disruptor, and having a polarized opinion means that it gets people talking and thinking and wondering, okay, what does that mean? But how do you get a polarized opinion? Well, I think, you know, you've got to get out there a little bit. So You've got to be maybe writing the odd blog or making posts or talking to people about a topic that's interesting to you at the moment and just get practice on it. You've got to be famous for something. So that's the first thing I would say. And then the other thing is I've got a bit of a pet hate at the moment. I'm probably going to upset a lot of people that are listening to this, but I've noticed on LinkedIn there's a fashionable thing about people with this ring around their neck and it says open to network.

Really? Yeah.

When I see that, you know, the ring around your neck, it looks like one of those lifebuoys to me. Yeah. Like it actually says, I'm drowning, I'm in trouble here.

I'm desperate.

I'm desperate and I'm drowning. So if you've got a ring around the neck and I'm sorry, I don't want to be disrespectful, but take it off. It's the opposite. Take it off. It's the networking is the opposite of that. It's not about, yes, hello, I'm open to network. Actually, it's the other way around. It's actually your think of it as a big, there's a big green button in front of you and it says go on the button. And your job is to press the button, the big green button, and you're open to network. Yes, you're open to network, but you're driving the train, you're driving the network because you've got to take the initiative otherwise. And what's going to happen? Someone's not going to come knock on your door and go, hey, George, I noticed you were open to network. And I thought as I was passing, I come in and say hi.

You're setting yourself up for a fool, aren't you? Because you'll put that ring around your neck and say you're open to networking. No one will get in contact with you and you'll start feeling depressed and think, you know, what's wrong with me? No one speaks to me. Yeah, but no one's going to, no one's going to proactively approach you. You need to, you need to be the one that's driving it, as you say.

Exactly. So be open to networking, but as in you are taking the initiative. So you're pressing the green, think of the green button. So we've got my little train track. I've pressed the go button, so now things are moving and it's in my, in my control. I'm in charge here, right? Not me personally, but you are, people listening, you're in charge of it. And now we talk a lot about make it part of your DNA, and I think I've overused that saying. So I just want to make it part of your life and make it part of your being, because there's an excitement about creating that kind of energy and contact. You know, we've been locked at home, we want to get out. But more importantly, we're designed to communicate with people and bounce off each other and create an energy around it, don't you think?

I do. And I think sort of being open to networking should be a given, right? Everyone is and should be. I don't think you need to— you don't need to have a sign saying that you are, because as you say, it's part of all of our natures to communicate and network to some extent. So with you, for example, I know that you are a natural at that sort of thing, and that's where you thrive. So it would be bizarre if you had a thing saying, I'm open to networking, because it's just everyone knows it.

But that's an interesting one though, George, because you say I'm a natural. I'm actually not a natural. I've pushed myself to do it. And I think we've spoken on other episodes about creating a habit. And if you do the last episode, we talked about the 23-day challenge. The purpose of that was if you do something for 23 days consecutively, it becomes a habit. Yeah. And I think as part of this, you know, getting your head in the right space, uh, that for the people are listening, I think if you can, although it's uncomfortable, we have to push ourselves, particularly if you're an introvert. We're not saying you're going out there with your jazz hands, you're just being a normal person, like we're having an adult-to-adult conversation.

Yeah.

And, and just be normal person, you know, when we're in a social interaction, most people are normal when they have a conversation about whatever, football or work or relationships. It's a normal thing. But then in the work environment, it doesn't seem to happen in the same way. I don't understand why.

It's odd, isn't it? You know, as soon as you see someone who you consider to be important or senior and who you want to talk to, you suddenly— well, I know that in the past I've suddenly turned into a completely different person, which is not the aim, is it? You don't want to put on a pretense necessarily.

You don't have to put your pants over your trousers and go, hey, networking man. Yeah, woman. So anyway, so I think the starting point is the best way to land if you are going to network and you're putting yourself through the pain of it. I'm going to tell you how you're going to be in a better place if you're interesting enough that someone wants to meet you. And the way to become interesting enough is to steep yourself in things that are interesting to you and be willing to share them. It doesn't necessarily mean you have to be blogging like crazy, but just get steeped in something that's interesting to you that you can share with people that would be relevant to them. So I think that will make you a better companion if you're networking with me and it'll make you slightly more interesting. I think the second thing is I want people to think about becoming a networking magnet. Okay.

Yeah.

Yeah. Because you know that when you put the other side of the magnet with the wrong side of the magnet, it repels. That's when you've got your Lifebuoy around your neck.

Right. Okay.

There's two types of networking. Yeah, actually, or two types of chances to connect. The first one I would call intentional networking, where I'm going to build a plan, I'm going to get out there and get together with people. We're going to talk quite a lot about that today. And the second one is more spontaneous networking, which is you are open to network, but it means you are taking the initiative. So when you're sitting next to someone on a train or you're in a meeting somewhere, you're not just looking at your shoes, you're kind of doing the uncomfortable thing and pushing yourself forward or just saying hi, at least.

Yeah. And, you know, I know that you've made some connections doing that, and I know people from work who have that same sort of energy, and they'll just chat to someone at a bar or in a cafe, and they'll end up doing some sort of work together in the future. And it is amazing how it happens once you, uh, once you start pursuing that.

Definitely is. And so I'm going to give people the raw material, the raw material to becoming a magnet. There's a word I'm going to use that will be devastating to people. No, I'm devastated. The word is curiosity. Okay. Curiosity is the key skill for networking.

It didn't kill the cat.

It definitely didn't kill the cat. It could have killed the cat. And cats are kind of on the news right now. We want to go there. But curiosity is about asking questions and taking a genuine interest. When kids are younger, when they get to the age of 4 or 5, they start asking why. Yeah. I remember talking to someone's kid when they were young and they said, why is a dog not a cat? What do you mean? Ask your mum. You know, they ask me ridiculous questions. And then so because we do that as parents, we kind of go, what? People start asking why. But the key skill of being a networking genius is to be good at asking questions that show a genuine interest in the other person. The mistake people make is networking is not about you. It's about them. Yeah, it's normally the wrong way around. So people are thinking, what can I get? And will I get a meeting? Will I get a business deal out of this? Forget it. Yeah, hopefully you will. So, and actually, to help explain that, George, there's kind of 3, you know, on my infinite loop, there's 3 parts of it. The first one is curiosity. So get good at asking questions. But if you think about it, the more actively interested you are in me and my business, let's say, the more I'm interested to talk to you. The second one is trust or credibility. So the better I feel you understand my needs and my business, let's say, then the more I will trust you. And the third one is, is a word I've struggled to say, but it's reciprocity. Do you know what that means?

Giving back?

Yeah, it's kind of the idea is you reap what you sow, you give and hopefully get back. It doesn't mean if you give, you should expect to get back. Yeah, here's my example. At Christmas, my lovely young lady has a Christmas list and she sends the cards to people, blah, blah, blah. And then if we receive a Christmas card from someone who's not on the list, she kind of panics. Oh my God, it gets really upset. So she sends them a gift. By the way, for people listening, don't send my wife Christmas cards. It's not the idea of this because we'll be in trouble. Be really expensive. But you understand what I mean? So people feel guilty to give something more. If you started a new job and let's say you said, right, I've gone to the drinks machine, I bought a Coca-Cola for you. It's my first day at the job. Here's a Coke. You might go, listen, I'll buy lunch. Yeah, you understand? So you kind of, if you give, you might get back at some point, but you shouldn't expect to get back. So if you add the three together, if you're curious and you create trust and credibility and you give, you think about the value you can offer to your network. Then at some point you'll get back.

Yeah.

Does that make sense?

Yeah, that's a good formula.

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And I just wanted to ask about the curiosity aspect of things, because I— it's something which I, I don't struggle with, but it's something which, you know, I try to be good at. But I noticed that when I'm talking to people, I'm trying to ask questions and and be curious about them. I'm not listening to the answer because I'm too busy thinking about the question I'm next going to ask. So I'm trying to pick up on one thing that they say, which I can then base my next question on. And I guess it's all about practice, isn't it? You just have to get out there and get used to doing it.

Yeah, no, that's a good point because I think a lot of people struggle with— they're so busy thinking about, as you said, the next question, they're not listening to the answer of the one, the previous one. So here's a little tip: forget the next question and just focus on what the person's saying to you, and then ask a question based on their response. So whatever they've just said, ask a question. Well, tell me more about that. And how did that work for you? And what did it mean to you? And what was the impact? And would you have done anything differently if that happened again? Just anything about the question they've just answered. Yeah. And then all of a sudden you've— it shows you're listening because you have to listen to ask that question and you're not wandering off thinking about, I'm gonna ask a super cool question next.

Yeah, yeah. No, no, I like that. That's good.

Then the other thing is connected to being a magnet, because the magnet can repel I like to give visuals, right? I might have given this visual before, but if you ran into Trafalgar Square with a loaf of bread and chucked it at the pigeons, they would fly away even though they actually wanted the bread. Does that make sense? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So if you can break the bread into small pieces and put it in your hand and open your hand in Trafalgar Square, they're coming out of your hand. That's the, the way you network. You think about the person and you work out what you can offer for them.

That's a great visual.

It's a good visual. And I want to give people the how-to part. So if you are intentionally networking, which is you are planning to expand your connectivity with human beings, which I hope you are, what I will do is I always research the person and the company they work in in enough depth, not spend hours on it, maybe 15 minutes, just so I'm looking for some smoking guns, things like, ah, okay, interesting. I wonder if I can find out a bit more about that just to show I'm genuinely interested in them. And what they're up to. And I've got some nous about me because if you're curious, it makes you look smart. If you ask good questions, people think, you know what, that's a really good question. And if you can make other people think, then you've connected, you've created a little kind of a little explosion where they've gone, you know what, that's a really good question. And then that makes you look smart. But you can only do that by doing some research on the person and the company. And whenever I meet anyone, I do that. If I'm not an associate, if we're going for a beer, I'm not going to do it. Hey, George, I noticed— no, won't do that. But in a kind of a business context, if I'm networking, I will always— and my family are the same. If we're going for an interview or there's anything going on in our work life, we always research the person or the people that are going to be there as much as we can and think about the company they work in. Then we have a better conversation. Yeah, because we're looking to join the dots. Do you remember being a kid?

No, I do.

Long time for me. But when kids are younger, they do something called join the dots. Yeah. And then you put the dots together and go, that's a cat, it's a dog. It's amazing. Didn't know that. Didn't see that coming. Your job in networking is to join the dots. So when you're talking to someone, you can go, oh, well, you said that. And did you mean this? Yeah, it was amazing. And we've seen other people. And if you can join together your conversations with someone else, then all of a sudden, you know, you're adding a lot of value to them.

So is that you're sort of helping other people network by your own networking?

Definitely. And you're you're getting them to think, so you're adding value to them. And then the most important thing is to be able to do something with it. So if you just go around chatting to people and not following through— think of it as chess moves. What can I do next? Now, you know, if you're in a— if you're trying to get business or a job or something, don't ask for one, but just stay lightly in touch with someone. Maybe send them an article that was relevant to the conversation, maybe send them a book, or connect them to someone in your network not because you want something out of it, because it's what's in it for them. That's what is in it for you. Yeah. I'm often introducing people to other people. So you guys really get on, I'm going to connect you together. And, you know, that's the, uh, the rest— I can't even say the word. That's the bit where you give something, you get something back, you know, at some point, hopefully. But you don't do it because of that, if that makes sense. Yeah, yeah. So that's my second bit. So that's how you become a magnet— curiosity, Trust, giving, thinking, adding value to the person, doing the research, joining the dots. Don't throw bread at the pigeons. Hopefully you remember that. People don't get— I like that one. And the spontaneous bit is basically— and it's the hard thing, particularly if you're an introvert. It's doing what's uncomfortable. If you're in an environment, it's you taking the initiative to say, hi, my name's Gary Gamp. We use your own name. Generally is better. My name's Gary. Most people have— I do it all the time. You've seen me do it in the supermarket and people have name badges on. So, hi John, how are you?

Yeah, yeah.

Good to see you today. And when people ask me how I am, what do I say? Fantastic. I'm fantastic.

Yeah, it's a really good practice to get into and it's something which I definitely need to work on because I've been going back to the office recently and there are people there who I haven't met before. And rather than go over and say, hi, I'm George, you know, I work in this part of the business and we haven't met before, but it's very nice to meet you, which is very easy to say. I tend to sort of just close off and sort of shuffle past them and hope that no one asks.

Yeah, exactly. And sometimes you're busy and you can do without it. But overall, if you don't, you know, if you go out of your way, it becomes— again, if you do it regularly, it becomes a habit. Once it becomes a habit, it'll be natural. Don't be annoying and go, hi, I'm George.

Yeah, we know, we've met you 5 times.

Yeah, you know, you keep saying this every day.

We know you're George.

It was funny, actually, it was a quick story. I always like to remember people's names. So I'm normally quite good at it, but there was a situation once where I'd asked the guy about 3 times and he told me his name and I generally wasn't listening because I was thinking about the next question. Oops. And I said, so I learned that if you want to find out someone's name, you can't remember it, just ask them how they spell it. So basically I said to the guy, listen, tell me how you spell your name. And he went, Ian, I-A-N. Doesn't always work. Sometimes it backfires. Yeah. Anyway. The third part is what I call Work It, Baby.

Yeah, I was looking forward to this one. You were.

I want you to become a rainmaker. Okay. You were interested, intrigued in that, weren't you?

I was, yeah, yeah. I think I emailed you and said that these two were the ones which I was intrigued by.

It's funny, isn't it? Now, in the early days of us doing the podcast, I'd send you a scruffy bit of paper. Now I'm sending you very professional notes, and then you get excited about some of the topics.

It's true. It's often a bit abstract, so I have to try and guess what they're going to be about. And Rainmaker was definitely one.

Rainmaker, actually, when you get underneath it, it is what it sounds like. So a rainmaker is someone who makes rain when there isn't any, right? So if you think, I'm in the desert, I need water, it's someone who— not doing a rain dance, but someone who creates rain when there isn't any. And so working it is, if you buy into being— the networking being a helpful thing, and that's, you know, something that, you know, hopefully people have got by now. Your job is to create range. You're the rainmaker. It's up to you. If it's going to be, it's up to me. And I'm going to create rain. And I create rain because I've got my infinite loop in my mind. I know that curiosity, trust, adding value is going to drive it. But the way I'm going to do it is I've got the 3 Ps. Okay. Yeah. You're confused by that. What are they? Good question. The first one is purpose. You've got to have a purpose. Because purpose gives you confidence and energy. If you know why, you know where you're going, why you're meeting them, what's the reason, the reason why, the usual stuff that we talk about, then it creates energy. The second one is you've got to like people. It's quite hard to network if you don't like people. And some people will be listening to this and thinking, well, I actually don't like people. And I'm going, well, you might need to fake it till you make it then, but you've got to generally be interested in people. And the third one is, is pass, pass it on. Now, one way to look at this is that when you meet with people, they tell you stuff about their industry, about them, about life, and you acquire new knowledge. When you move to the next person, you can add the knowledge you've already received and pass it on. Right. And then you take the knowledge from the second person, pass on to the third person. By the time you've gone to 10 people, you've got some really interesting stuff to talk about.

Right.

And maybe you can ask the next person what they think about some discussion you've had somewhere else, not without portraying confidence. So if you think, yeah, the way to work it to create the 3 Ps is if you've got a sense of purpose, it gives you energy. If you get into the habit of meeting with people and think about passing on the information that you learn, then you can share things with people that are interesting and people get a wider perspective beyond what you think at home.

And I guess that also helps connect them as well, doesn't it? It helps connect those people.

It feels like you could connect them. I mean, that's something I've tried to do as much as I can. I'm not fully forcing people on people, but I just think if it's relevant, I would always introduce someone to someone else. And the other thing is you meet people through people. It's a bit of a small world. You know, it's very often that I meet someone who knows someone I know. I look up on LinkedIn and I find out, oh, that's interesting. I know someone I really know really well. And that's an important part of networking. So when you're doing your research about the people and the company, find out who they're connected to that you know, because actually you might want to speak to them or you might want to reference them in the conversation. Yeah, but all that, it makes people feel more comfortable if you know common people or you have common interests.

It makes them a bit of a warm contact, doesn't it? I think to use a phrase that we've used before.

Absolutely warm. Yeah. You've got, if you're networking, warm contact is the best way. We're not cold calling people. There needs to be a connection to that person. And if you've got some reference to someone that you know, then you've got, you know, there's a warm contact. You can really leverage your own reputation through someone else.

Yeah, it's often the most powerful one I found, just having someone in common that you can both talk about or whatever.

Yeah, it happens to me all the time. I mean, because I'm old, I seem to know a lot of people. And I met with someone the other day, and before I went to see them, I noticed they knew someone that I used to work with, I know, 15 years ago. And I said to them, you know John So-and-so, don't you? And they went, yeah, he's a really good friend of mine. How do you know him? I said, he used to work for me years ago. Yeah, just after that we were like best buddies. I mean, I just referenced someone. I mean, I hadn't seen him for 15 years, probably doesn't even like me.

That's the danger, isn't it, if they turn around and say, yeah, I hate that guy, I can't believe you're friendly with him, how dare you.

But I think the important thing is on my infinite loop, I want to kind of think of it as nudging my way along the tracks. What are the next chess moves I can make? So I've been in front of someone I'll give you a plan of action in a second. And what can I do as a result of that conversation? Can I introduce them to someone? Can I stay loosely in touch with them? Should I do nothing? I mean, decide what to do over time. Don't drive them mad and don't be annoying. But what's the next chess move I can make to keep that moving around the track? Think of it that way. And how can I nudge it forward, but not without being an annoying person? So I've got a bit of a game plan. Great. Yeah, we've used this before internally, but I want to use a similar idea externally. So we've talked about the unintentional networking, but the spontaneous networking. But the intentional networking, I highly recommend people think of meeting at least— and this is a small number— 10 people a month intentionally.

It doesn't sound like a small number. It sounds like, especially if you're not used to it, it sounds like quite a big number. If You're sort of just getting started in the world of networking.

Okay, well then let's say 5 to 10. Let's say 6 to 10 because 5 is an odd number. I'd like to do 6 to 10. So 2 a week. Anyway, never good at maths. Who cares, right? Whatever number is comfortable for you. And I'd like you to take a piece of paper, draw a circle in the middle and put you in the middle. And then I'd like you to draw the number of circles that you feel comfortable talking to. So if it's 6 or 5 or 4, I'd like you to draw draw a number of circles. This is for people listening because George is clearly not doing it.

And then I actually don't have a pencil. I usually have a pen.

We don't have pens anymore. This is the 21st century, mate. We have iPads, you know, with digital pens. Yeah. So for people listening, draw a circle in the middle of the paper. Do the number of circles around that circle connected to the middle of people you're willing to speak to in the next 30 days. I'd like to build a 30-day plan. Start small so that you're going to do it. Say 6, and look through your contacts on LinkedIn, or think about people you know that you're comfortable to talk to, and put their names in those circles. And then I'd like you to rate the relationship between 0 and 10. 0 is you don't know each other very well, or you don't like each other, so you probably take them off. It's probably anyone who's a 3 upwards. So a 3 is someone that you know quite well, but you don't have a great relationship because you haven't had a chance to build one. 5 is a good stable relationship, and an 8 to 10 is a very solid relationship. So, you know, maybe go 5 up, 5 up in that. And out of those 6 people, I'd like you to arrange to get them in the diary over the next 30 days. And here's my advice. I know that we're coming out of COVID and when I say meet someone, I think you should meet them physically. Yeah, you could do it online, and there is a whole discussion about online networking. But for the purpose of this, because it's Networking Genius Advanced, I want you to be face to face. And my recommendation is do not meet them in the office if they are in the office. Why not? Because basically people are not normal in the office. I don't know why. They become very formal. Hello, Mr. Gamp, very nice to see you. And then if I go to the coffee bar over the road, they kind of become normal person. When we leave the building, I see them relaxing. Hello, normal person. And then when we come back in the building, they, hello, Mr. Gamp. Hello, hello Gary. When we go out the building, hello Gary. Hello Mr. Gamp. And I do a lot of coaching and I find that people are much more open if they're in an informal setting outside of the office, if you can.

Yeah, it feels a bit more like a level playing field almost, doesn't it?

Yeah, absolutely. So 6 people in the diary next 30 days. The goal is to get in front of 6 people. Before you go and see them, I'd like you to research online, LinkedIn, Google, or whatever, the company and the person to give you a couple of smoking guns, interesting topics to talk to them about. Nothing too heavy. I call it a blank piece of paper meeting. You write the notes, the things you want to ask, but don't, don't go in with a presentation and just have an adult-to-adult chat with those people. And then when you've come out, think about what value can you add for them? Not what can they do for you? What value can you add to them? Do that for 30 days because it will become a habit. And then do it the second 30 days, do another 6 or whatever number you've chosen. Do it for 3 months. If you do it for 3 months, it will become a habit. But out of those conversations, so if it's 6, out of the 18 conversations, you're going to find out interesting things. If you're looking for work, you might find opportunities. Don't ask. If you're looking for business, you'll find stuff. Don't ask. And it will open the world to you and you'll be much more confident because as you're doing it, you're going to go, yeah, this is quite good fun. I'm enjoying this. Quite good.

Yeah, I've got to say that I did do this, actually, because I think when I started my recent job, it's not that recent now, but when I did start it, we had this conversation, and I think you told me this, you gave me the same advice, and I did it, and it helped enormously. Just, you know, not necessarily in terms of, well, I suppose it was networking, but it was talking to people within the business that I didn't necessarily know, or I knew of, or I'd had a brief conversation with. And then set up these meetings to chat to them. And it was just, it was very useful in terms of getting my name better known in a business that I just started.

Absolutely. And I think that it creates a lot of interest. I mean, it gets you on the radar because part of this is in order to be famous or something, you've got to be on the radar. And what happens is your networks collide. So you met someone who met someone else that knows you and all of a sudden your name's out there. George is doing loads of things. It's really interesting. George is seems to be moving on in life. And also you feel great because you learn so many things from different people and what they tell you. And it just makes life a bit more interesting, to be honest. I do it socially. So let's do it in a work environment as well. And then it opens the doors to other things, ideas or business ideas or social things that you just hadn't thought about. I'm often finding out things I just hadn't even thought about.

And on the whole, people like being asked as well, don't they? I mean, I've had it a couple of times recently where It doesn't happen often to me, but when it does, it's nice. You know, someone will come to me and say, oh, can we have a quick chat? Because I'd love to hear more about what you do and, you know, get some advice on this, that, and the other. You know, it feels like, wow, I'm—

Someone cares about what I do.

I'm a big deal to this person. Yeah, exactly.

Yeah, no, definitely. It's definitely true. So I've got the 3 takeaways. Yeah.

Is it actually secretly 4 takeaways?

Yeah, there is a 4th hidden in the first one. That's true.

You get to know me well, right?

The first one is curiosity. Curiosity is the key to networking. Working. You've got to be able to add value. It's not about you, it's about them. That would be my first takeaway. The second one is you've got to be famous for something. You need the credibility, you need to be interesting enough. You've got to have an opinion about something. You've got to be, you know, a bit of a disruptor or just be polarizing in a view about something because you want people to have a reason to meet you. And not just because you might be senior or you might not be senior, it doesn't matter what, but it's because it's about you and they're open to meet you. And the third one is, it's about pressing the go button. Networking is not about people coming to you. It's like a job. People don't come to you and offer a job. I mean, now and then they do. You have to be proactive. So think about that infinite loop, the train track, press the go button, make those chess moves, get the train going round and keep it going round because it's about the consistency that makes the biggest difference. The more consistent, the more often you do it, the more things spin off the end of it. And that would be my advice, Mr. George, in a nutshell.

Don't throw bread at the pigeons.

Don't throw bread at the pigeons. That's key.

Exactly.

Thanks very much, Gary. That's terrific. I feel more like a networking genius.

You are a networking genius, George.

And thanks very much for listening, and we'll see you all next time.

See you soon.

Thanks for listening to this episode and indeed our whole 3-part career catalog miniseries. If you haven't heard part 1 and 2, no judgment here, but you can immediately rectify that sorry situation by visiting thecompanydoctor.com and catching up. And if you really want to get ahead, you can go to amazon.co.uk and purchase your very own copy of Gary's book, Career Catalyst: 10 Secret Job Skills They Don't Teach You in School, for the very handsome price of £6.99. We appreciate all your support, and we'll see you next time.