Ironman Champion Tim Van Berkel

Welcome to another episode of the Get Fast podcast, brought to you by Trivelo Coaching, where we help triathletes and cyclists like you train smarter to race faster. You are joined as always by your hosts, Australian Ironman champion and four times Nationals Master cycling champion, Jarred Donnelly. And I am Jordan Donnelly. Before we get into the episode, if you want to get our expert secrets cheat sheet, that is a cheat sheet of the very best tips and advice the experts on our podcast have said to help you train smarter and race faster, just go to getfastpodcast.com that's getfastpodcast. So in today's episode, we had current professional triathlete giant, sponsored triathlete, Tim Van Berkel. Tim has been a professional triathlete for the last 15 years. He's 36 years of age. He started his pro career at the end of 2006 after getting into triathlons. He was a AFL footballer. Like you'll hear in the podcast episode that he switched across triathlon and since then he's had a pretty decorated career. He's had some great wins across Ironman, Half Ironman events and championships. And he gave a really good insight into what his career has been like, the mindset, the trials, tribulations. And it was a really good insight into his perspective on his triathlon career in the triathlon world. What did you find the best part about the episode? Dad?

Yeah. Look, we've interviewed quite a varied group.

Of athletes, cyclists, triathletes, just humans in general.

And it's, it's always interesting and intriguing.

For me to hear how they go about it. And for me, this is another example of someone from a different perspective. And he's identified in his career what works for him and what doesn't. And for him, having focus, structure, training, concentration, motivation, they're all really key things that are important. But if he goes too far, it's at the detriment of his result. And having a balance, that's the key thing I got out of listening to Tim with his career. The minute he put too much pressure on himself, the outcome was poor. And having a really good balance of family and perspective of what you know, sure, it's your job as a professional, but if you make it too serious for some people, that's what they need. But for Tim, it didn't work.

So for our listeners, you've got to.

Find what works for you. And if you need someone to make it a little bit more serious about getting a result, then that's what you need to do. But if that doesn't work, then don't go down that track.

Absolutely. So listen to the episode. It was a great one. And he did provide that insight into exactly what worked for him, the different things that worked for him. He had some little nuggets in there of what. What he finds works, getting that balance right. He spoke about, again, some of the highs of his career, some of the harder points and what's probably kept him successful for the last 15 years. And at 36 years of age, some might say that your career is slowing down, but he gave some awesome insight into his goals and aspirations going forward, and he still got that hunger to get some really good results. So you'll hear that in the episode. So without further ado, here is Tim Van Berkel. All right, we've got professional athlete Tim Van Berkel on the line. Tim, welcome to the podcast.

Thanks, guys. Yeah, thank you for having me. And look forward to having a chat.

No worries. So, to start off with, before we get into your professional career as a triathlete, we wanted to ask you, what were you like as a kid growing up? What got you into sport? And, I mean, what did you enjoy.

As a kid, actually, growing up? I grew up in a town called Albury Wodonga, and it was very, very big on football, so I played a lot of Aussie rules football and I wanted to be an AFL player and my footy team at the time, we did a triathlon in the summer to. Keep fit for footy. So, yeah, we did this triathlon and I just kind of caught the bug, really, and I started to follow triathlon a lot more and, yeah, and I just got the bug. And then I saw the Hawaiian Iron man on TV and I just thought that what those guys, the distances they covered, and I just thought that was crazy, insane and how fit these guys were, and I was just in awe. And I'm like, yeah. And that's. Ever since then, I wanted to do. Do Iron man and go to Hawaii. And, yeah, I kind of haven't looked back since.

Who were the guys that were inspiring you on the telly? Who were the legends there?

Oh, like, I was a big Greg Walsh fan. Craig Alexander.

Great.

You know, growing up, watching those guys. You know, remember watching my first Iron man experience was at foster when Chris McCormack and Luke. Luke Bell went at it head to head. That was my first time I actually witnessed a triathlon in person. So, yeah, it was just. Yeah, I was. Just got the bug and. Yeah, haven't. Yeah, it's been. It's been a. It's been a pretty crazy ride.

Fantastic. So that sort of brings us to the question, have you been in love with triathlon since that point or is there days where you think, oh, why did I pick this sport? I mean, obviously you've got talent as a swimmer, a rider and a runner. A footballer. Yeah. Looking back.

Yeah.

What do you think about triathlon as a sport?

I, I certainly don't love it like I used to. Like I used to be a full frother. I would like I'm ever being younger. I was, you know, like in my early 20s, mid-20s. I would like look up every result, find out who was racing and you know, I'd be on Ironman life finding, you know, all the results, not so much now. Don't get me wrong, I'm passionate about my job and I love what I do. Just things have kind of changed for me now. I've got a family, I've got, I've kind of got other interests, but I treat it more as my job now than my then. Like I absolutely love and involve my whole life around it. I don't certainly don't do that anymore. But yeah, I still, I still enjoy the process. I still enjoy, I still enjoy racing. I enjoy building up to a race racing and yeah, I just enjoy the process of it really. You know, the training and pushing my body to see, you know, to get the max out of it and, and just trying new things all the time and, and traveling the world and all that thing, all that stuff and the people I've met along the way, the relationship, relationships that I've built along the way has just been, it's been awesome. So I definitely love that side of the part. But I'm not a prosper as I would like look up results of every race now. I've definitely got other interests now, but yeah, I still enjoy what I do.

Well, that would have to happen. You've been in a pro since what, 2005?

Yeah, 2006. End of 2006, I turned pro. I did the age group world championship in Honolulu, Hawaii and then two weeks later was the Ironman World championships in Kona. So we went over all our boys, went over and, and watched it and yeah, it was just, it was so unreal and I learned a lot just watching it that day and yep. And that, yeah, that's what really got fire in the belly to go race in Hawaii.

Well, it didn't take you long before you had your first victory in 2008, I think at Iman Walter. Yeah.

Yeah, that's correct. I, yeah. One Iron Man, West Australia. As I was 24 years of age and was my third Iron Man. Yeah, I'm actually in my, in my pain cave now. I'm looking at the photo and I can, I can remember it like yesterday and yeah, it was such a, such a. Awesome experience and one I will very old treasure for the rest of my life.

So Tim, would that be a highlight of your career? Yeah, I'd really like to hear what are the biggest highlights that you've. You can look.

Yeah, it's definitely, it's definitely up there. You know, my four, I've only had four Ironman wins and they're all pretty special. But probably my biggest win today and to. To my name is probably Ironman Cairns, which was the Asia Pacific champ.

Yes.

I think why it's so special obviously because it was an Asia package title and it was my first big title that I won. But the way I did it, I, I think I got off the bike 15 minutes down that day and I took the lead around 18K and I think I won by maybe four, four minutes or something. And you know, just getting off the bike so far down thinking that my day's over and you know, yeah, if I can just have a decent run and salvage a, you know, a podium at best. But to walk away with the wind that day was, ah, it was, it was, it was awesome. I, yeah, that's such a great story.

And it's really good for, you know, our listeners that, you know, it's never over, is it?

That's, that's really important, especially in Ironman. It's such a long day and anything can happen. You know, if you just mess one little thing up like you're fueling or you're pacing, you can pay a big price and, and you can go from hero to zero like that in an Ironman. And I think that's what I like about, I really like about it compared to, you know, 70.3 Olympic, you know, it's not over till the last kind of 10k. And even then you can still have a massive explosion and lose a podium spot or lose the lead or something like that. It really appeals to me especially, you know, I'm not the, the best swimmer. That's my Achilles heel. And cycling, I'm, you know, I'm okay, I'm not, I'm not uber bike or anything like that, but I can ride all right. And obviously running's my, running's my, my favorite leg, my specialty. So yeah, that those Ironman races, they really suit me and I really enjoy doing Ironman.

So you, you mentioned then you've had some pretty big Ironman wins and I know you've had a lot of 70.3 good results as well. Top three finishes, a few wins. But in terms of looking back at your career, what are some highlights that stand out that don't necessarily result in a win or a podium finish?

Yeah, a lot of, you know, my wife gives me a bit of a hard time that like I haven't won a race since 2017, but I've had a lot of podiums and I still find them very special. You know, it's hard to win races these days and the quality of field you get to these races is awesome. You're racing some big superstars and I don't consider myself like, you know, one of these superstar guys. I'm just kind of just a dad that does triathlon and been doing it a long time and just enjoy what I do. I don't think I'm like a superstar or anything like that. But whenever I could get a podium, especially, you know, last year I didn't win a race at all, but I podied in a couple of championship races. Both Asia Pac titles. 70.39, man, I got second in both of them. Yeah, they're still very special to me. You know the one in Vietnam which was the Asia Pac 70.3 champs. I came second to Patrick Langer, who was the, at the time, the current Ironman, to finish second him like a minute. You know, that, that's, that's special to me. But everyone just kind of looks at it as, oh, you're second again kind of thing. And my wife gives me a hard time. She's like, oh, another second, another third. And I'm like, well, it's better than getting fourth and fifth. You know, at the end of the day I'm getting a paycheck and you know, that's, you know, a big part of why I'm doing it, you know, to avoid a real 9 to 5 job. So yeah, I find all those little things special and yeah, and plus traveling some of the places I get to travel, I get to travel a lot in Asia and I've been to some amazing places and experience some awesome cultures and just experiences like that that I would never even got if I was a normal, you know, tradie or an ASL footballer. You know, experiences like that.

Strategy wise, this is, you know, I'll just touch on, you know, you're putting Yourself in the biggest races. You haven't shied away from any of those races. You've, you've wanted to race the best and you've beaten the best. You know, you've won a lot of races. Strategy wise, would you think now as you're getting older to select races where you've got more of an opportunity to win. Is that important to you or are you happy?

Yes and no. Yes. Like obviously the big goal of mine every year for the past six, seven years has been Hawaii. And that's, that's the pinnacle of our sport, it's Kona. So every year I base my year around that and I really wanted to get back there and I was seventh on my debut year and even in the late part of the marathon I was running in fourth. That it was the last five kites, 5K. I kind of the old grand, grand piano fell on my shoulders and I faded. But I really want to get back there and, and better that result. And I haven't, I haven't done it yet. Like 2018, I would have been close. I was 12, but I had a five minute penalty which would have put me fifth.

Yep.

Yeah, I felt like I had an awesome day and I just, I keep having these bad luck. Like last year I was in really good shape and then three weeks out I caught a, I got a chest infection from my son from bloody daycare and it just, it just absolutely killed me. I was in bed for two weeks and I got to Hawaii. Just got, I just came good the day I got to the island. And yeah, even race week I just didn't feel, I just didn't feel like I was in world championship form. But anyway, I did the race. Yeah, I did the race. I just feel like I just keep having this bad luck but I really want to get back there and try to better that, try to get back in the top 10. So obviously that's the big race that motivates me. But now as I get older and I've got a family and I'm not traveling as much as I used to. So I used to try to plan my season and pick off these big races like, like South Africa, which is the African championship. Always get the Gunfield. You know, I always wanted to go race the world's best, but now I definitely would like to stay home a little bit more. And this year I was planning on racing Ironman Australia, which I haven't done since 2012. That's another race that really motivates me. I lived in Port Macquarie for Six years. My parents live in Port Macquarie. You know it's another race I really, really enjoy doing. But yeah, I'm just really, I'm enjoying staying home racing races like Cairns, Ironman, Western Australia, you know just doing races like that and then you know the 70.3 scene, it's not as big as it used to be but you know there's definitely some still good races going around. So yeah, I would, I would like to stay home more often. I obviously do race a little bit in Asia but I think that that's probably going to improve finish up next year. But yeah, I just, I'm just enjoying being at home. Yeah, I just, it's hard to, hard to be away from the little fella.

Oh that's great. And look there's you know obviously the challenges you've set yourself. Australian Ironman that that was would have been in three or four weeks time.

And.

Yeah and it's still a race that attracts a good feel. It doesn't attract a world class feel but this year you know they rumors they had as they had Matt Hansen who won the North American Championships. Reedy was returning like it was getting still gets a good field and your.

Form going in before the coronavirus hit. How was your form in preparation for that?

Yeah, so this year I started with a new coach at the start of this year I started with Mitch Anderson.

Yep.

I finished up with Dan Flew who I worked with since 2015 and Dan was great. We, you know I was with Grant Giles prior to that for like eight years and then I went to Dan and I really learned a whole. I kind of learned the scientific side of training and I really enjoyed it for a few years but I just kind of you know as I had a family and I, you know it was a lot of training and I kind of had to start to. I just felt like I needed another change. I just felt a little bit stale towards the end with Dan but you know I really got some good results with Dan at the start. Just changing a new method of training. But this year I was really pumped to be working with Mitch. We kicked off the year at Geelong 70.3 and you know for me I had a pretty decent swim. That's probably about the best I can get for a swim. And then the bike, I was a little bit rough but I felt like things were starting to get a little bit better. And then on the run I had probably one of my career best 70.3 runs. So yeah, you know that was really motivating. And then we started Working towards Ironman Australia and I just felt really good. I was enjoying some different training and, and yeah I was really pumped by Ironman Oz. And then obviously the coronavirus hit and yeah we're all in lockdown now.

So on that note what you just mentioned before how having goals like Ironman Australia and Kona set you year round in these in between periods what's most motivates you to train? It's you know we really want to get an insight into especially in the mind of a pro athlete. What?

Yeah with the coronavirus happening especially.

Yeah especially with coronavirus happening.

Yeah. So when kind of hit I'm just like I one morning I had to do this hard ergo and I'm on the bike going like Iron Man OZ has just been cancelled. I'm trying to do these hard five minutes and I'm like what am I doing? Like they're so racist. So I'm just like stuff this and, and then I kind of the next kind of five days I just, I didn't train, I did nothing. I was boozing heat, I was eating shit. Like I was just kind of and I'm like what am I going to do? I was chatting to my wife and I'm like starting to stress like because I've got a mortgage, I've got a family to feed like there's no racing, you know big part of my income like prize money. So I started to really stress and then I'm kind of one of the lucky ones. Like I've got great sponsors, you know I've got Giant who have supported me through thick and thin for the past eight years and I'm very lucky to have those guys still in my corner. Alaska, you know, a few good sponsors. So I'm like stop, stop stressing. You know you've got good sponsors who are going to look after you. Let's just, let's just focus on the positives out of it. So I'm like okay, no rate. So it was a good chance to you know let the body rest, let the mind rest because I've been at it for, I've been doing this for 14, 15 years now.

Yeah.

And I haven't really, you know I have little breaks after Iron man or at the end of the year I have a Christmas break. But no, you know, two, three weeks it's not, it's not really like a good proper rest is it? Like you need to really. So I'm like let's just, let's just chill out. So I absolutely got rid of My program just, just did things the way, like if I felt like going for a ride, I would go for a ride. I felt like going for a run, I'd take the dog and go for a run. Just like no structure. And it's been good. It's been, you know, it's been nice to be at home and hanging with the family and really backing my training off and giving my family some attention which, you know, they, you know, they wouldn't be getting at this time because I'd be doing Ironman training and, and I'm a prick to be around in the middle of an Ironman block. Like, I'm tired, I'm cranky and you know, my wife, she doesn't really like hanging out with me when I'm training for an Ironman.

Do you think this could be a real turning point even though it's a real negative for the majority of the world? You know, just giving you that hunger and desire and motivation when something's taken away from you.

Yeah.

Fear of missing out sort of thing.

Yeah, definitely. Like I, I've really, it's really put the hunger back in to get back racing. I'm like looking forward to win a race that's back and I'm kind of like, I've had a bit of a breather now and I feel, I feel good mentally. The body feels good. And now I'm thinking, okay, now's a good chance to work on some of my weaknesses. Like let's, let's focus on the swim, let's focus on some bike stuff and really put the run on the back burner. So I'm kind of, you know, I'm back in the gym. Like I'm, you know, those little niggles that I have, my hip, my glute. I'm really working on exercising, on strengthening that. So, you know, this is a good time to work on those weaknesses. You know, there's no racing. Let's just, you know, if you're a good swimmer or you could, let's put that on the back burner and let's focus on your weaknesses. And yeah, so that's what I've been doing. I'm back in the gym two or three times a week. I'm trying to swim in as much as I can. And yeah, and I'm going to start probably next week. I'm going to focusing on the bike stuff and trying to build some strength. And for when the season does kick off, we're being given a date now with Ironman Oz, which will be September it looks like racing is all going to kick off September. So, you know, I'm just thinking of that, that date and yeah, I'm going to work on some weaknesses over the winter months. And yeah, yeah, I'm really motivated again and I think this, this break will be really good. And yeah, I'm. I think it's. Yeah, I think it's going to be good.

So on that, some of the things you just said then, you know, you. You've got. Identified your weaknesses and do you look at, you know, the guys like Frodeno and what they're doing off the bike and all the stuff that makes the guy win a race and win comfortably, is that something that inspires you to, you know, so the question would be, what reaction does a poor result, you know, do to you? Does it make you more determined? When you see guys performing, you know, at the, at the top of their game, does that inspire you or does that, you know, put you in a depressed state?

No, definitely, Definitely inspires me. Like, guys like yarn.

I just.

I don't even consider myself in the same league as those guys. They're just next level. Like, he's just, he does everything to perfection. Like, he's just. I'm just like, amazed that he can, like, live, like, live like that. Like, he, you know, he focused. He's just so focused. Yeah, like, I, I can be focused, but I'm focused for a good four to six weeks before a big race. But after that, I need to, yeah, I need to let my head down. I need to have some fun. Like, I, I like having beers with mates. I like, you know, doing other things. Like, I just, yeah, those guys. Lionel's another one. He's just, you know. Yep, he's out smashing Strava. Comes up Mount Lemmon in Arizona. Like, just things like I just, just next level. Like, I, you know, I can. I can really hone it in for five or six weeks before a big race where I can, you know, sleep properly, diet properly, you know, everything's just triathlon. But, yeah, I can't live all year round. I'd be. I reckon I'd be burnt out. And. And then, yeah, for me, that's not a healthy way to live, like. And plus, I'd probably end up in divorce.

You're not far off, especially if you want to go for another top 10 finish at Kona. I mean, you're just there. What are you. What do you think you want to focus on or change to get back there?

I think for me, in Hawaii, what's let me down. The last couple of years is probably the bike, the swim a little bit. Like I've had some good swims there where I positioned myself well. But you know, you lose a little bit of time or you're at the back of that front pack, which I have been the last couple years, or not last year, but the years before that. But you just, it's a positioning game and then you're really burning a lot of candles in the first 40, 50k to try to move up in the group and position you out because you know, you got 20, 30 plus guys coming out together and you're always going to be 12 meters apart and you don't want to, you know, going out towards Harvey, you don't want to be at the back because that's when it all starts splitting. But you, you want to kind of be towards the front. But yeah, you know that the previous years I've really burnt some biscuits, you know, moving right in the right position and even up Harvey. Like I find the Harvey climb really tough. I felt like last year I rode it pretty, pretty steady and within my power. But some years I've seen some numbers, you know, I've had some of my 20 minute best power going up Harvey, which is, you know, not ideal in an iron man. But you know, that's, that's the race, that's, that's the race going up the road. You got to go with it. If you want to be in the mix, you've got, you got to go with it. But, but yeah, and it's just, it's just getting quicker and quicker there every year. The first year I rode there, you know, I got off pretty much in the main group. You know, obviously Kinlay was up the road, but you know, the time we rode that year and what they're riding now is 20 minutes. It's 20 minutes faster now. Like, it's just, I think with these uber bikers coming across, like Cameron Worth and, and all these guys, I think everyone's just stepped up their cycling and everyone's just riding amazing now. And Lionel Sanders is another one. Like there's just so many good bike riders there now and you just can't, you just can't go there relying on a good run. You got to be, you got to be in good bike, short, in bike shape. So that I think that's a big thing that I want to improve this year. I don't even know if Hawaii is going to happen this year. They saying it is, but I don't.

See it happening with everything.

I can't see it. I can't see. No. Well, yeah, look at us. Like, they're. They're struggling and. Yeah, I just can't see it happening. But, yeah, this is. I'm going to use this year to really. I really want to focus on that. And that was a big part of me going with Mitch Anderson, too, is. He was such an axe on the bike in his career and I really. I raced a lot with Mitch. He was kind of towards the end of his career when I was kind of starting and I did a lot of races with Mitch and I was always a big fan of Mitch and I've always really, really liked Mitch and part of the Giant family as well. So that was a big part of going with him this year, was to really try to improve my bike.

Well, you're in great hands. He's part of the trivelo family as the main man.

Yeah, that's right.

That we send all our injured athletes to, and we don't have many injured athletes, but the ones that we do.

But when it does. Yep.

Yeah. So, yeah, it's great that you're so inspired by Kona and you want to really improve there. And it is such a tough race, isn't it? Do you find that the temperature in where you're training is similar to the race that you're going to race in? I know Hawaii at Kona is an exceptionally hot and humid place in the lava fields, but how much do you place on training in the similar style that's going to happen in. In the. In the actual race day?

Yeah. Like our. Our summer is very similar to Kona and I even find some of the days here. Absolutely. That can be hotter than Kona. Like, it's. Summer's brutal here. We had a brutal summer and I do a bit of training in my shed and it's. And I can. I can get my shit, like 40 degrees. Like, it's. Yeah, it's brutal, but when you're getting ready for Kona, it's like September here and it's so much cooler. So it's kind of. It's kind of a little bit hard. I was. I've always done a lot of sauna going into Kona.

Yep.

The year I did a lot of it, I got to Kona, I didn't even really feel the heat. I find it. But I've always been pretty good with racing in the heat.

Yep.

Anyway, like, I'm not. I'm a smaller guy. I. My sweat rate's not Yeah, I don't, I'm not a big sweater or anything like that. So I've never really had much dramas racing in the heat. But, but when we're getting ready for the race, being at home, not necessarily ideal as it, it can be. It can be hit and miss. It can be really nice August, September, or it can be really, it can be cold, but nothing like you guys in Melbourne. But it can be. Yeah, it can be hit and miss. Like, one I've got ready for Hawaii here at home maybe twice. Twice in my career and the rest I've been overseas, I've been in Colorado. But when I've been home, I've kind of. If it's been a bit cool, I've gone further north and, and done little heat camps. But. But yeah, yeah, the kind of, kind of hate can be. Can be pretty, pretty brutal.

So on that note, coming into a race, when you're trying to acclimatize physically as well as tapering, how do you prepare mentally for a race? How do you specifically prepare mentally?

Yeah, basically I'm just a big believer of being in the now. Like, I just, I don't worry if I'm on the start line. I don't think about I've got to do 3 8k and ride 180k and then run a marathon. I don't think about that. I just worry about what I'm doing that very minute. So, you know, I'm putting my goggles on, I'm getting ready. Okay, where I'm going to start on the start line. I just worry about the now and I don't worry about outcomes or anything like that. So. And also I also do a lot of visualization of the races. Like, I picture myself, I visualize myself in the race and where I want to be during the swim, where I want to be during the bike and when am I going to have my nutrition, when am I going to drink? Like, I just kind of visualize the whole day. And once I can kind of visualize and see it all, it kind of just helps. During races, like race time, when I know when, you know, I've got to drink or eat or positioning and stuff like that and what part of the course, like just visualizing, I just find that really helps. And yeah, that's how I kind of get ready. But yeah, I try not to think about outcomes or yeah, I try not to read into it too much.

And that leads to the next question. And you know, from a coaching point of view, a lot of the listeners, you know, they could be back of the packers, middle packers, or at the pointy end of their age group race plan. Have you got a really good idea on the bike and your run pace as soon as you start riding? You mentioned before you have to go with the race. And if you look down and you see you're doing your best 20 minute power, is it going through your mind that I've got a race but this is going to end in tears if I keep this going? How do you work that out in your mind?

Yeah, definitely, definitely. I really try as I'm older too, I really try to stick to those plans now. Like, I know my numbers, you know, I have a certain number on the bike that I know if I'm, you know, between 250 to 280, like I'm gonna run fine. When I start pushing that 300 watt plus range, I know that I'm digging into my reserve to my run. And at the end of the day, my run's my weapon. So if I lose a bit of time on the bike, I lose a bit of time on the bike. I've got to make sure I have enough in the tank to run well. And if you can have a good run, you're going to place up there. So I really try, I really try to be careful on my numbers on the bike. Obviously I don't want to let the race go up the road too much, but, you know, I'm willing to let time go to some of the uber bikers now. Like before when I was younger, I'd be like, oh, we've got to be up there, got to be up there. And I would bury myself and then just wreck my race. But yeah, you know, I'm not necessarily, you know, for Hawaii. I'm not there to go to the win. I'm there to get a good result.

Yeah.

So I just, I need to be smart so I definitely don't bury myself on the bike. And then I have a certain pace for the run that I know that I can, that I, I know that I'm running, that I'm still burning fat and there's a certain number that it ticks over then and I start burning glycogen and I don't want to be dipping into my glycogen stores, you know, towards during the bike at all and then towards the run as well. Like I want to be saving that for the back end of the marathon.

That's great. So talk to us about, you've talked to us about some career highlights. Talk to us about maybe one of the hardest points of your career and how did you get through it?

Probably the, one of the hardest obviously one of them would be obviously injury. I had a pretty bad injury really early on my career. I was lucky I was still working so it wasn't as bad. I still had a part time job at the time, so it wasn't as bad. I was living at home. But yeah, it's always, I don't know, you just put so much pressure on yourself to perform all the time and you know, it's just not possible to be at your physical peak shape all year round and hold that form enough. Dumb Aussies try, you know we try to race every season. We try to race the Aussie season, then we go this season, try to race the American season so you can't be at your peak all year round. You know it's and you want to be, you know, you want to be poking, you want to be winning races. But yeah, as I've got older I really try not to let it races get to me and get me down and then dwell on it for ages and then affect my whole life. I, you know, once a bad race has happened, I tried, okay, you know, you know, it was a bad day, learn from it and then, and then move on. I've gotten a lot better with that dealing with bad races. But yeah, you know, races like Hawaii especially like last year when you put your whole year into it and chasing all these races to qualify. Like I didn't qualify my first race, I then I had to go do another race to qualify and I've got that like it's just a whole year process and you put your family through all this and being away from them and you know, effort to all go run but just getting sick like just things like that, it's just really hard to deal with. But as I said, as I've gotten older I just kind of put it down to an experience and try to move on. But yeah, I try not to beat myself up about it too much these days.

Yeah. So that's a question I'd like to ask about that is putting pressure on yourself. Does that create a lot of nervous tension and anxiety pre start, the day before, the week before? How do you go about coping and what's your strategy on to keep yourself calm and as you said, try and race the race in the moment?

Yeah, totally. That's another reason why I don't do it anymore is because I was putting, I remember Hawaii 2015, I just got 7th the year before you know, I was going in as someone to keep an eye on, like, not a favorite, but like, you know, a guy that would be up there. And we just launched the new Giant Trinity. So we had the Giant Global team out there. And I put a lot of pressure on, you know, I put a lot of pressure on myself for that race, obviously, because I did well the year before. I'm here with my biggest sponsor, Giant. You know, we did a lot launching this bike. We put, we did a lot into it and we're there launching it all week. It was a fun week, but I put a lot of my pressure on myself. And the night before the race, I was so shitting myself that I couldn't sleep. I was totally stressed myself out big time. Like, I think I slept three hours that night. And the next day I'm just like, oh my God, what have I done? I've just, I've blown my chances, blame my chances. And I've never been so nervous or put so much pressure on myself before a race. And then after that I vowed that I'll never do that to myself again.

So, yeah, great learning experience, isn't it?

Oh, totally. But yeah, I just do, I just do little things like, you know, some, like just a little meditating, just getting in, you know, if, say if I'm at a race, you know, the night before, I'll, when I go do my little pre race run the night before, I'll find a little quiet spot and just sit down for like 10, 15 minutes and just chill out and yeah, just kind of just little things like that. Like, you know, it's triathlon, you know, the sun's gonna come up tomorrow. Like, you know, you still have a family that love you. Like, it's, do you know what I mean? Like, it's not a big deal. Like, you know, no one cares how you go except for yourself. So yeah, I just try to think like that and, you know, it seems to work.

Spot on. And look, a lot of the listeners, you know, they get nervous. Guys are trying to win their age group.

Oh, totally. And I still think getting nervous is a good thing. You know, if you're getting nervous, it means, you know, you love what you're doing. You are, you know, excited to race, excited to be there, and you're excited to get the best result as you could possibly get. So I still think that's good. But to the point where you can't sleep and you're having little panic attacks, like that's just not healthy for you. And I'm done with that shit. So I. Yeah, I just, I still get nervous and that's a good thing.

And look, a lot of the guys we coach are definitely, you know, they have that idea that I'm standing on the beach. I've done all the training I can. There's nothing to be nervous about. I have a race plan. And if you've got all those things in your mind ticked off, it's certainly got to help with the execution.

The preparation is kindly. Yeah, totally, totally agree.

Well, that's a great insight, Tim. Really appreciate everything that you've said in terms of your whole career so far and what you've done. The last question that we always finish off with our guest is not necessarily triathlon related, but what is the biggest lesson you've learned in the last 12 months that you would like to pass on to others?

Oh, the biggest lesson.

Tough question.

Yeah. Basically it is what it is. Yeah, that's pretty much it. Yeah, it is what it is.

Nice and easy. That's good. I like that.

Nice and easy. Yeah. Thanks now.

Awesome. Really appreciate it, Tim. Your insight is invaluable. It always is getting into the mindset of a pro athlete. So we really appreciate it from our point of view. Good luck. Once the races start up again, we can't wait to see both triathlon and cycling races. Startup. I'm sure everyone's hanging out for it and we'll be looking out for you at Ironman Australia and Kona again to see how you can go.

Yeah, we really wish you luck, mate. And you've got a good man in charge at the moment with Mitch and I'm sure he'll get you on the straight and narrow and get that bike to where you want it. You're a weapon runner, so, yeah, really looking forward to seeing. Seeing how you go and there's no pressure from us at all.

Awesome. Thanks, guys. No, I really appreciate it. And chief, for the chat, awesome.

Thanks, Tim.

Cheers.