The Business Side of Bikes

This episode of the Get Fast podcast is brought to you by Trivelo Coaching, where we help triathletes and cyclists like you train smarter to race faster. You are joined, as always, by your hosts, former Australian Ironman champion and head coach of Trivelo Coaching, Gerard Donnelly. And I am Jordan Donnelly. Before we get into the episode, if you want to download our expert secrets cheat sheet, that is a cheat sheet of the very best tips and advice all the professional athletes and former athletes and experts on our podcast have said to help you train smarter and race faster. Go to getfastpodcast.com Again, we have had pro athletes, former pros, olympians, elite cyclists and triathletes and successful age groupers all come on the podcast and give their best tips to help you train smarter and race faster. So if you want to see what they all said, go to get fastpodcast. So on today's episode, we have a very different type of guest. We don't have a professional athlete, not a doctor or a nutrition expert, but a man who is has an inspiring story nonetheless and is a very dear friend of Tribello, someone who's been here with us from the start, a good friend of yours, dad, and also happens to head one of the biggest bike brands in Australia and the world, and that is Darren Rutherford from Giant Australia. Darren has been involved in bikes for over 30 years. He's worked at Giant for 25 years now. It's no secret that Giant is a huge supporter and big sponsor of Trivelo and we are very proud to partner with them and that's because of people like Darren. So in today's episode, we are getting a behind the scenes insight into what the bike world is like from the other side of the business. Darren's story to the top of Giant is a great one. He had a vision of reinventing the Giant brand into one of the leading bike brands in the world, paving the way in research, development, technology and most of all, value. And we, we can't wait for you to hear some of his insights onto business, bike riding and life in general. With that, we'll get into the episode. We've got Darren Rutherford on the line. Darren, welcome to the Trivello Coaching Podcast.

G', day, guys. How are you going? It wouldn't be very cold up in Belgrade south right now, would it?

I think It's a balmy 7 degrees.

We're both in jumpers.

Yeah. Really great to have you on board, mate. And for those who don't know Darren very well, he's an exceptionally talented man, and I call him the Pied Piper a lot because he manages to get people to follow him. So welcome mate on board. And really just want to start off the podcast by asking you, what sort of a kid were you like growing up?

Thanks for having me, guys. I suppose I was actually born in Dandenong and then not long after we actually moved out to Clyde, which is a very small town about 60 kilometers southeast of Melbourne. And I was actually really lucky enough to have parents that let me pursue motocross for about nine or 10 years, which were absolutely awesome years. And it was, you know, the people that I met traveling all over Victoria and we actually ventured to South Australia a couple of times as well. And in fact, that's actually where I. Where I was introduced to sort of proper cycling as cross training for my motocross.

Darren, did you have an area out the back at Clyde where you could practice the motocross? Were you on some property there?

Yeah, we're on acreage, so I think we're on three acres and we had a small practice track on our property, but it was pretty much go to Hallam or to Dandenong to actually do your proper training, you know? Yeah, I was, as I said, I was very fortunate to have generally as my mum on a Wednesday would pick me up from school in Cranbourne and we drive to Dandenong straight after to school and we do a practice session. Yeah, it was great. And I would say I really enjoyed sport, but I wasn't super competitive. Like, I was a really decent B grade rider and I was really happy with that. And I think my parents were as well. And I overheard my mum saying so many times, at least I know where my kid is on the weekends. And I think as much as it was an expensive sport, I'm pretty thankful that I got the opportunity to be honest with you.

And some of those skills that you learned as a motocross rider, I can see when I see you ride the bike, I don't think you've hit the deck since I've known you. Only one, except for one massive one.

Just that one time.

It was. That was an unfortunate one, wasn't it, in Listerfield Lake.

Yeah. No. Good.

So go from there to how did you get into the bike scene? From a business perspective, I know that your story, you started as a. As a bike salesman, as a teenager, is that correct?

Yeah.

Just go. Just go back a step there, Rudy, to what you were doing before you ended up in a bike shop.

Sure. So I suppose if I look at. If I look at my first, My first job in the industry was with Bicycle Superstore in Dandenong. And it was such an amazing bike shop back then. There weren't as many bike shops as there are now. So it was really a true destination store. It would capture consumers from all over, like probably all the way down the peninsula, down out past Pakenham, but also eastern suburbs like ngunnawaddy, etc. And draw. Draw people out from virtually the city as well. So it was really that true destination store. And, you know, with the big bike on the roof, like every it was, everyone really knew about it, you know, and that's probably where. Where Bill Abbott, he was sort of the guy who took me under his wing and he really taught me about sales and the importance of a really good customer service. Positive word of mouth and referred customers and then those customers telling their friends about it and them coming in. And that was actually a really important step for me because before that I was pretty rudderless. And he sort of put me on the track that, using probably a lot of those skills that I learned from him early on onwards to when I started working at Giant.

Okay, so basically the feel good experience is something you've continued as a trait all through your business career, which is something that's really, really been a standout to me. And that was learned really early on from Bill, wasn't it?

Oh, absolutely. I think. I think one of the things that he used to push with us is that really good customer experience. People want to come back and then they'll tell their friends about it because everyone loves to air their knowledge and say, hey, I know this guy at the bike shop, or I know this. And we were really early adopters to, you know, bike shop rides, you know, weekend loops with our customers. You know, the range that they had at that store was amazing at the time. And yeah, I think they were really the first ones to step up that professionalism.

Were you straight away out on the store floor or how did that all pan out? How did you.

So no. So a friend of mine actually worked at the bike store and he said to come along and help build some bikes in my spare time, which I did. And I was absolutely hopeless at it. I was just really bad. And Bill said to me, look, we've got a Fox FM sale on Saturday. We're like with a couple of salespeople. Can you. Can you come downstairs and help us? And I was really reluctant to because I was pretty shy, but it didn't take me long to Work out. Hey, this is actually, this is my forte. Like this is something that I really enjoy. It didn't matter if I was selling a kid's bike or talking to someone about mountain bikes or road. I really love, I just loved it and I picked it up straight away and so yeah, that's probably how it all started.

Awesome. So where did you go from there? What was your next step?

So pretty much from Bicycle Superstore. Giant had only pretty much started a couple of years before that. And I had some good connections at Giant. They approached me about coming and joining their team, which is of the third staff member. And I started with them. I'd been at Superstore four years.

What year is this, Rudy?

1994. And then yeah, that's when I started at Giant, which was we're just pretty much straight off. I mean I pretty much left Superstore and then it was a couple of weeks later I had a little break and a couple of weeks later started at Giant. We're in Moorabbin and that stuff.

And what was your role?

What was the role you were offered from customer service? So we were relatively small at that stage. It was about 12 to 15 models in our range, but the brand was growing relatively quickly and I was pretty much customer service supporting our reps that were on the road and supporting our dealer base as well.

What was your impression of the brand when you started and over those first few years?

Well, as far as the brand goes, it was really the first true global brand, one of the first true global brands in the marketplace that offered high end value. So when I got there, they just started sponsoring the AIs road program and that really kicked us into gear. Like people really wanted to get around the CFR 1, CFR 2, you know, those high end and road offerings. And then, and then from there, only a short few years later, the TCR was launched. And that really, really stepped us up another gear because it showed that Giant were innovative and that they take a chance. And that's when things really started taking off.

And was that part of the global direction with how it is now? Was it the same then back in the 1999?

So in those early days we would basically draw off the Giant USA range. And then if we fast forward a few years, Taiwan then allowed us to make some modifications to the USA range, which was really good because there are subtle differences with consumer needs between the American and the Australian market. So it was really good. And actually the relationships we formed with Taiwan back then and still still go on today, you Know, they allowed us to make subtle changes, whether it be color, whether it be drivetrain, and that's actually when the brand went up another gear again because suddenly we were doing, we were producing product that was really specific for our own market and then it made it so much more desirable.

And how did your personal role develop in all this? Starting in the bike store from Bicycle Superstore, then coming into customer relations in Giant, and then pretty much being the forerunner for developing Giant. How did you personally develop through that period?

Yeah, I mean, I've just gone 25 years at Giant in January. And I think that the thing that's kept me fresh is that my role has changed a lot over the journey. So started in customer service and then I had four years out on the road repping. Then I came inside and I was the sales manager and then I was promoted up to sales and marketing manager and then onto the role that I've got at the moment, which I've had for eight or nine years, which is, which is the gm. I think, I think that having those different roles has been able to let me understand different parts of the business so much better and how I'm able to support people that are currently doing those roles.

Perfect. So what kind of brand would you say if you fast forward now, have you created now, what kind of brand and company? So there's kind of two factors of that. The brand that everyone sees, but then the internals of the company that you, you've had a vision to create.

Sure. Look, I know it sounds broad, but I think it's a brand for everybody. We have a product map that we call Giant Cycling World and that goes across on road X road and off road and then across different price offerings as well. So everything from recreational sport and performance. So we're able to follow a rider's journey. So whether it's a family out riding, enjoying, outside enjoying time together, or commuters. So you know, switching from trains, trams, buses to commuting, you know, your daily to and fro work or someone is using it for sport or competition, a mountain bike or road, we've got a bike for someone's journey all the way along. Because as your life changes, the bicycle that you require changes as well. You know, if you're commuting, it's a flat road bike, but if you're out on beach road, you know, you want to be on a TCR or propel, so we've got the product there for you.

Is that a deliberate strategy that you thought of that, you know, giving, giving Everybody the option to go from basically little kids riding to commuting to racing, to mountain biking. You know, it's as you said, very broad. Is that hard to manage so many different areas of product development?

Yeah, I think that, I mean the bottom line is we want to see more people on, you know, the more people on bikes, the better, let's face it. But I think that what we do is you can't have every different bike for every different person. So what we do is we set up our Giant cycling world, we drop a big roadmap and we go through and look at where the trends are, where the sales are, where the demand is. And then we do have to be careful that we're not adding too many, too many models because then it all gets a bit out of control. But what we actually look for is product that suits the demands of what consumers need. So when I have a look at where we are at the moment, we know that commuting is actually going really well. So we make sure that we've got product offering for that. E bike is booming at the moment. So we're making sure that it's a fast paced trend that we're trying to innovate and keep up with those trends.

So what about internally? I think a word used associated with Giant a lot and something you're very proud of is you talk about the Giant family and you've been there since the start. So how is that represented internally and then I guess externally as well, that family notion of Giant.

Sure. I think, you know, something that we've been incredibly proud to build is that community. It takes a really long time to build that. And sure people come and go, but it's really hard to imitate that true family feel. Now. You know, we set that up from, from Giant Australia, from the wholesale arm, setting a really positive culture. We hope that flows onto the dealers. And we've got really close relationships with our dealers all around Australia and New Zealand. And then even if you fast forward now that real connection with consumers and you call them consumers, but I like to call them riders, I feel as though with social media we're closer to consumers than ever before. And those riders are actually great because they give you real time feedback. Sometimes our dealers are reluctant to give us feedback because we're almost too close to them. But it's fantastic when you get an opportunity to talk to real consumers, real riders out there and they give you that brutally honest feedback that sometimes hard to take but is actually welcomed. If I look at probably one promotion that we did a few years ago, I thought worked quite well, was we did. There's a lot of TV advertising around the Tour de France, and we felt that it was white noise. So it was basically people saying, we've got the best bike, we've got the lightest bike, we've got the stiffest bike. So we took a different approach and we did a campaign called Real Riders. We partnered with Leo Burnett, and basically we put it out there and said, you know, yep, we sponsor the world's greatest athletes, but we want to sponsor real riders as well. And then it was your opportunity to jump online, fill out a form on why we should sponsor you. And we got seven, just over 7,000 applicants. And then what we did is we had to shortlist it, which was really difficult, and we had 30 winners. And basically we'd go through and tried to make sure it was fair, that we spread it all around Australia. But the interesting thing was that we ended up giving away 42 bikes in the end because we would ring people and we'd say, hey, you're a winner. And. And they're like, oh, awesome. My son's going to be so stoked. I don't know if you know, though, but he's a twin. And we're like, oh, well, we better give away. We better give a second bike there, otherwise it's not fair. And then it was also really hard to stop because there were a short list of people that were going to miss out that just really, truly deserved to win. So we expanded that out and a lot of the relationships from that Real Riders, we're actually still connected with those consumers or riders today, which is something that I'm really proud of.

Yeah, that is a big part of Giant is not just professional athlete sponsorship, but sponsoring the age group as well. What's your position and Giant's position and philosophy on sponsorship from that regard?

Yeah, it's an interesting question because obviously, at a global level, we always have a World Tour team. So at the moment, it's ccc. And I think that's really important for our brand because, you know, we want consumers to see that our product is tested by the toughest in the toughest conditions. But I think that the local sponsorship is really good as well, because it gives us a personality. But we also have people out in the community that are like, you know, although they're ambassadors, but they're like salespeople for us and out in the community. And that's been a really good program that we've had now for maybe 12 13, 14, 15 years. And again, we've grown some amazing relationships with those people. And I look at sponsorship and I think sponsoring the pros is great, but sometimes the pros are inaccessible. So you go to a race and the pros have got to put their feet up, and they're probably not out talking to consumers or they're not at the expo booths, whereas a lot of the age groupers, they're out and about and they're soaking up the vibes and they're at expo booths and they're talking to people. And I think that they're in coaching groups and they're in training groups, and if they're having a good experience with our product, well, they're telling their friends and then they're leveraging those friends to go in and purchase Giant.

It seems like there's almost two things happening here, isn't it? You want to give the world the impression that the bike product is world class. And examples would be Tom Dumoulin. He wins the time trial at the world title, and yet you still want to have the age grouper understanding that he's on a really good product, but enjoying the product as well. There seems to be two things happening, doesn't it?

Yeah, for sure. Absolutely.

So if you look back on your career with Giant so far, with everything you've just set in mind, what we want to do on this podcast is we've interviewed a range of professional athletes, former athletes, even age groupers as well, and we're just trying to get inside the mind of how they've been successful in their field. So how do you think you've been successful? I think like we said before, you know, you really, you really promote the Giant family and community. And one of your strengths is, like dad said at the start, is being the Pied Piper and getting people to follow your vision and getting a team working, working together on a vision. So what is. What is your. How do you. How do you make this happen? How do you make that strength of yours happen and I guess be successful in your field?

Sure. Like in business, it's all about forming a team that have their own unique strengths. So I look and it's at how we get the best out of each of those people who are all very different but can work seamlessly together. So for me, it's more important than ever to bring those different personality types together. So whether that be product or marketing, your sales team, finance, it all has to work closely aligned for the benefit of the business. If I were to give an example like Any launch of a new product, you know, first of all you've got the product, but then we've got to plan how we're going to tell people about it. And then we have to give the information to our sales team so that they know what's going on. But then also we've got to have accurate forecasting so that there's that, you know, supply, demand challenge. So if everyone's off doing their own thing and disconnected, well, you're really only guessing. So my opinion is that you bring these different, these different parts of our business together, get them working really closely together, and then the sky's the limit. And, you know, there's always different personality types and different personalities. So that's my job, to bring them together, knowing that, yeah, everyone has different strengths. Ultimately, if we work closely together, it's going to benefit the business in the long run and ultimately then as well.

And how much time and energy do you spend working on that side?

Yeah, yeah, for sure. You know, that that's something that's really, you know, if I look at my journey at Giant, my, my priorities have changed. You know, when I was customer service, you know, the priority was, was giving your customers the very best level of service and making sure you're following things up. Then when you're outside, same thing, you know, making sure that our dealers are really well supported. And then when I moved into more the product side of things, you know, identifying that the need for specific Australian spec'd product was really important. And then now it's really about a team making sure that team's really cohesive and working together and just overseeing that, but then also not being disconnected from the real world, like making sure that I'm still in really close contact with our dealers because a lot of them have been with us all along the journey. And I have great respect for a lot of our dealers because 30 plus of them have changed their name to be, you know, GS or Giant Location. So we have a great responsibility to make sure that we're doing everything we can to make sure that the business is humming along because our success is their success as well.

There's an incredible amount of people involved in your team, as you've mentioned, from, you know, from one area to another. Getting the right people in that team is the key thing that's going to make that function. Well, what are the things you're looking at when you're deciding who should be in what position in your business?

I think without sounding cocky, it probably comes easy to me because I'm a people person. So I'm fairly good at understanding people's strengths. And the other thing that we've been really good at at Giant is promoting from within. So people have started at a base level, and then their strengths, really, the cream rises to the top, so their strengths are highlighted. And then if we have a particular role that is available, whether it's product, whether it's marketing, whether it's in our quality assurance, if they're suitable for that role, well, you know, we're really open to promoting from within.

Yeah. Awesome. So what are you most proud of with your career at Giant?

Could be one. What am I most proud of? See, that's a hard one, I'd say. I'd say that. I'd say that the thing I'm most proud of is probably the people that are coming through behind me or beside me, you know, that young, that next generation that's coming through. I hate to individualize, but, you know, people like Marty Klukas, who are our sales and marketing manager, he's not even 40 years old, but he's been in the industry. You know, he's been around bikes since he was, you know, a kid, and you just can't buy that experience. I think he's been with us about 18 years. So I think the thing that I'm most proud of is to be inclusive and to bring. To bring those people through. I'm sort of anti tall poppy syndrome. I love seeing people do well. And I think I'm also really proud of the dealer base that we've nurtured. You know, when we do dealer visits and we go visit stores and we see that, you know, bicycle store going from, like a hobbyist store through to being a really professional retail store, it gives me. Gives me a pretty warm feeling because I think, jeez, we've got a lot of feeding a lot of families here, so there's a lot of responsibility. But I'm definitely proud of it and take it really seriously.

With you putting so much work into it over such a long period of time, over 25 years is one of the key things that you're trying to achieve is to get people into positions where if. If you're no longer running the ship, there's really strong quality people who can continue your vision into the future. So the succession plan you're creating with inclusiveness of understanding how the whole model works, is that something that's really important to you?

Yeah. Well, our original gm, Graham west, he always told me, you know, when you employ someone, you know, you've got to employ someone who has strengths that are different to yours and someone who's really ambitious and wants to do the right thing by the company. And that's what we've always done, because they're the people that get things done and you don't have to micromanage those people. You can give them some direction and then let them go with it, let them go for it, you know, And I'm. I'm really old school. Like, I've. I've still got. I've still got a diary that I write things down in and highlight when they're done. And to be honest with you, you know, that crew that's coming through now, they're so much. They're so much more digital savvy than what I am, believe me.

Sounds like me with dad.

Yeah, exactly.

I resemble that.

So, on the flip side of the coin, what are some of the biggest challenges you've faced?

Yeah, challenges. I would say time management, because there's only so many hours in the day. So I suppose, echoing a little bit of what I said before, is you've only got a limited amount of time, so making sure you employ the right people in the right roles so that it's not a babysitting service, and then prioritising what's important in the day. So making sure that you're meeting with different department heads, that you're still in the real world talking to dealers. And I think that the big thing from that is always trying to stay present in what's happening in whatever particular meeting I'm in. So, you know, I'm never a fan of one of those guys that's got their phone next to them and it's always lighting up and, you know, they're only kind of like 70% in the room. I like to be that person who, if I'm meeting with you, I'm here, I'm in the room, I'm focused, and then I can make notes. And I'm kind of famous for making notes and then putting them up my diary later on so that. So that the person that I'm with feels respected and feels like, hey, I'm. I'm getting Darren's time at the moment and he's. And he's getting what I'm talking about. And then they can get on with their job. And I try and do that at home as well. Like, when I get home, I try and put the phone down, engage with Soph, play with Pip, whatever I'm doing at that particular time, instead of kind of like being home, but your mind's half at the office, or if you're at home, you mind half at home. And that's kind of what I try and do anyway.

Absolutely. So on a more personal level, what does riding a bike mean to you?

What does riding a bike mean to me? I think if you go back to a really early age. Let's go back 49 years. I think going back to a really early age, I think your first bike is your freedom machine. So it's like I was really fortunate that when I was growing up, that was the 80s and it was that BMX build, we had a lot of tracks around near where I live. So it was that connection with your mates and, you know, you had that. Those boundaries that you could. You could go. If I fast forward now, it's actually, you know, everyone has busy lives with their family or with their work. And I look at it as my. As pretty much my fitness tool, but also mental health benefits as well. Because, you know, if I look at our Saturday morning ride, it's a great workout, but it also keeps us really well connected. Connected and, you know, like discussions and business are sometimes face to face, but they're also side by side as well. And I tend to find, you know, when you get out on the bike, people want to have a chat. As long as it's not too much about work, but people want to have a chat. And our Saturday group can be like 12 to 18 people. And then if we've got, you know, we'll have people that will come and go, people from Interstate, if they're from. They're in town, they'll jump in the bunch. And I think it's just really a good connector. And I find, you know, my. I've got different rides that I do during the week, but that Saturday morning is like a great setup to my weekend. It's like, you're up nice and early, have a coffee, stretch the legs, do a few turns in the bunch, and then it sets up your weekend, you know, from there. I think, unfortunately, I used to really like golf, but I think I probably like the accessories more about golf and dressing up in yellow pants. But I think I also love that about bikes as well. Over the journey, just, you know, putting cool things on your bikes or the latest technology and like now wearing different kit and the progression with, you know, with trends and things like that, I think I really are getting to that pretty much as well.

It's so true what you say about, you know, the bike means so much more than just riding it. It's all the other interactions. And it's been a pretty tough period, as we all know, right at this particular time. Have you, has it impacted you? Have you felt the lack of socialization on the Saturday ride? Has that affected your state of mind and how have you copied that?

Yeah, definitely. I think that when we, when this happened, you know, I really sat down and said, okay, I need to, I need to still structure some writing. So I, I have a Watt bike at home, so I jump on that a couple of times a week, but it's really just a half an hour stretch of the legs. And then on the weekend I'll do a ride where I'll ride to a coffee shop on say the Saturday morning and then Sunday morning I've actually been chucking the headphones in and jumping on a bike path and doing a big sort of 90 minute loop, which I've really enjoyed actually and sort of above and beyond that, just a little mental health ride where when I'm leaving the office every day I'll head home, I'll just jump on my mountain bike. It's got lights on the back and front and I'll just do a little roll, maybe five to eight kilometers just along the beach path. And I feel that it's just at the moment with the pressure and what's happening in the community, it's a really great way just to wash the day off and then say, okay, now let's hit a reset, organise some dinner and then maybe watch a couple of bit of Netflix.

It's really great hearing the way you go about things, both as a personal writer and as a business in one of the biggest bike brands in the world. The structure seems to come through to me loud and clear. You've got your strategies and you put that in your structures of a daily, hourly, almost minute by minute. It's something that all the listeners who are really faced with the same issues every day at work with trying to deal with their family, their work situation and of course how they can keep their health and fitness going. And I think the lessons you've been telling us about how you've managed to do this and do it very successfully. Would structure be one of the key things that you think enabled you to fulfill a lot of your goals and ambitions?

Yeah, definitely. But it's taken me a long time to get there because through different roles that I had at Giant, sometimes, you know, it's hard to structure up because it's quite dynamic and things are changing all the time. Whereas probably now, in my role, it is a lot more structured because, you know, we're working sometimes 18 months, two years ahead of what's happening. You know, our marketing programs and so on. We're working almost a calendar year in advance, which is what you need to do. You need to be. You have to be ahead of it and you need to be organized. So I think that's something that is super important. I've never been an athlete in any description at all, but I'd imagine that's exactly what I have to do, is, you know, they need to prepare. If you're doing Ironman, I mean, the day before, it should be just everything set and you're ready to go, and that is that, you know, you've done all the hard work up to there. And I don't mean just the training, but you know that your bike is service ready to go, that your wetsuit's ready to go, that, you know, you've got. I mean, even the smallest thing like that, your tires are, you know, you've got a foot pump to get your tyres to the exact pressure on the morning, you've got someone to give your pump to. I think if you've got to be super organized, then it's not going to. You're not going to have any guesswork on the day. And I think that's what I try and avoid, is any big shocks. If we're prepared from every different angle of the business, well, it takes out a lot of the guesswork.

It's such a great feeling, isn't it, getting the example you're using, getting to the race, looking back, going, I think I've got a really good plan in place. I've done all the preparation and no different to what you're experiencing in your business. Is there anybody in particular who has been a role model to you that you've kind of looked up to and thought, far out, that guy's a real. A real leader. And is it in that same sentence, is there a mentor that you have used over the years?

It's an interesting question because I wouldn't say that there is any one particular person that I'd say, hey, look, I really want to model myself off that person because I think you've got to have your own individual. You've got to bring your own individual personality to things. But there's definitely lots of different people who I pull a little bit, a little bit of what they do. I know that Graham west, who is our original gm, was an amazing influence on me because it doesn't happen very often that someone pulls you aside and says, hey, we're grooming you for this role. And then these are the steps that you, this is where you need to be. These are the steps you need to take and you're like, wow, this is pretty serious now, you know, so then you, you have to gear up for that.

Was that a turning point for you?

Yeah, definitely, for sure. And I'm a big believer in act as if. So act as if you are being groomed to be the gm. So if you act in that way, well, the outcome is going to be hopefully becomes reality that if you act as if you just a clown, well that's, that's the outcome ultimately. So I think Graham west was a really big influence. And then through, through the journey, lots of, lots of other people where I look at them and say I really like the way they do that or I like the way they carry themselves there, you know, and, and I think if you, I don't ever think it's one particular person, but if you can draw off lots of different people, their strengths, then it's only going to put you in an advantage.

Absolutely. I love that. So what's next for you? What are your next goals over the next period?

Lunch, I reckon. I think for me obviously post COVID 19 is to come out for the brand to come out the other side of this stronger. And I think, you know, the short term goal is going to be to, for myself to get really actively involved with getting around our dealers and making sure they're okay, support them as much as I can, make sure that we've got some really good marketing and promotional tools, that we've got some really good product, innovative product coming their way so that they can come out of this. You know, I think that it's also a good opportunity for me to look at every part of our business at the moment and there might be certain parts of the business that we can reboot or we can change or alter so for constant improvement. And I think that's really important.

Is there any standout thing that due to the virus has changed a lot of the workplace situations for many people across the world? Is there any standout thing that you would do differently due to the virus exposing that that's a flaw in the way you've been doing things? Is there anything that stands out to you?

You know, it's been interesting the last eight weeks, things change have changed so dramatically and it's really been a roller coaster ride because we went from thinking business is going to really flatline, to then not being able to keep up because, you know, people were reluctant to get on public transport, gyms closed, people wanted to get outside with their family. So all of a sudden we saw a mini boom there of recreational and sport level bikes. I don't think I would have done anything differently because, Gerry, I think that you can only act on the information you've got at the time and try and make the best decision. So to be what I'd call that hindsight analyst expert, which is Monday's expert, it's really hard. But certainly during it, we can learn from it about moving forward. One of the things that I really want to work on as we come out of this is how do we change the perception with the Australian public that instead of taking your car for a six kilometer trip with your family to lunch or to soccer practice or footy or whatever it might be, why couldn't that be on a bicycle? Because it seems like people are enjoying getting outside to me. How can you, instead of getting the tram to work, ride a bicycle? And I think that there's two ways we can do that. That is, there's a really great gateway product now, which is E Bikes. So the number one concern with most commuters is, I don't want to get to work all sweaty. I live in a hilly area. So we can actually remove those and say, okay, well, here's an E bike. You can actually wear a suit on this bike, get to work sweat free, probably don't even need to have a shower. And I think if we can, if we can get out there and sell the virtues on buying a better bike, maybe we can transition people, a few more people out of cars and onto bicycles.

I think you're absolutely spot on there, especially what you touched on earlier with seeing a bike ride when you get home from work, or even if it's a run or a ride for some people we've seen in this isolation period, I mean, Strava has gone through the roof with the amount of signups it's been having. People are turning to exercise as a form of relief and mental health relief. And that should hopefully continue even once the virus is over. And hopefully, like you're saying, we can see less cars on the road and more bikes. I think an insight into your mindset has been so valuable because what you touched on with the organizational thing. It's funny that we do podcast episodes and videos on exactly what you said the day before your race. Why aren't you getting organized? And it comes naturally to Someone like you, that's just your mindset. And you're saying, of course you should have your bike serviced and all your gear laid out. But, dad, for a lot of people, you're consistently reminding them that they have to do that because they're so focused on the race, their mindset just isn't there. I would ask you, as a final question, Radi, to finish us off, what is a life lesson that you have learned or a piece of advice that you would like to pass on to others?

Interesting question. Well, I think. I think that what I would say to people coming up, if in business, or even a has to, to translate through to athletes as well, is do the extras. So I don't actually mean you don't have to be the first one into the office and you don't need to be the last one to leave. But what I mean by that is, you know, look for opportunity. So if I look at it in a business sense, you know, if you're, if you're working for a company and there's an event on go, if there's a trade show on go, get involved. If there's a demo day, put your hand up and say, I really want to help, you know, because, you know, if there's a promotion or if there's, you know, if there's an opportunity in the future, people know that you're. That you're a goer. People know that you're keen and you become a natural choice. And maybe that's the same for athletes as well. And maybe when I say do extras, well, I'm sure Gerry sets up a program and says, this is what I want you to do. And that doesn't necessarily mean run 5Ks longer, but what it means is maybe there's work to be done outside of just that, running and riding, which is making sure that you're stretching, making sure that the product that you've got is serviced and running well, because there's nothing worse than Jerry saying, okay, I want you to ride to Mount Eliza and back and, you know, you've got parish tyres, so you're calling an Uber. I think it's. My advice would be do the extras. No one's going to get in trouble for wanting to put their hand up and, and help more, you know, and I think sometimes people feel as though that they're, that they'll get passed over or that no one notices. But what I can tell you is, from our business, we know the people doing the extras, we know the people that are presenting. And because we think so long term, we identify them and say, I think he or she would be really good for that role in the future because things change really quickly.

Unbelievably spot on there. And there's so many things you've just said in the last five minutes that resonate not only with athletes, but for people in general. And it's unbelievably good value to hear how if we're talking about an athlete, trying to do the extras is so, so spot on. We really encourage all of our guys. You know, just doing extra volume is. People sometimes think that's the way around it, but it's not. It's actually doing extra stuff that's quality rather than. And specific to what your improvement's about, rather than, you know, spending another six hours on the bike just aimlessly riding. That's not what we're about. And. And you've hit the nail on the head with that last summary, I think.

Cool.

Well, thanks very much for joining us, Roddy. We've really appreciated you having on here. We've loved having your insight. As dad just said, we really appreciate everything you've said so far and thanks for coming on.

No worries, guys. Have a great day. I think it'll probably snow a little bit later on in Belgrade south, literally almost.

I think it's the top of seven tomorrow or something. Ridiculous.

Yeah.

Have a great day, guys.

Thanks for having me on. Good to talk.

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