House of Wolves Episode Six - Goal Setting

You should be a monster, an absolute monster, and then you should learn how to control it. There's an intensity to what we're trying to accomplish, and, um, you know, if you want to be truly great, you've got to bring it every day. Do you enjoy pain? Pain don't hurt. You blitz all night. Standing out is a long-term strategy, takes guts, and produces results. If you care enough about your work to be willing to be criticized for it, then you have done A good day's work. And then that was the second time I got in trouble with the law.

Oh, that's not true.

So we should probably stop that conversation now that we're recording.

Go ahead and edit all this out. Good morning, good day everyone. Thank you for making it back for another episode with us. Uh, we're facing down the end of the year and that is a perfect time to start— actually, let's be honest, any time is a perfect time to start talking about goals. Goal setting, goal achieving, goal crushing. Um, and that's one of our favorite things. I think that's one of the— actually is one of the first things that we found that we really liked about each other and had in common. I don't know if you recall that.

You sound like Forrest Gump. Shrimp tacos, shrimp sandwiches, you've said that before. Yeah, okay. I like it though, it's a compliment. Thank you, makes me smile.

Oh good, thank you.

Um, goal setting goals.

Yeah, I don't know if you remember one day we sat in the car, we were had met after work and we were like listing off things that we each had hoped to achieve one day.

Like, that was just the conversation, like back when we had jobs, like after work.

I mean, I don't know about you, but I feel like I work. I have a job now. But yeah, like after Enterprise when you were at the airport and I was at the agency and we met at a restaurant nearby in that area and we just sat in the car talking about goals and then you picked me up and put me on top of the car.

I, I remember that.

Yeah.

Um, do you feel like you have a job? I feel like I kind of just like have fun and hang out.

Oh, okay.

Like, it's work, don't get me wrong, it's right, but so it's work that we enjoy.

What do you consider a job then? Let's start with the definition.

Like somewhere you have to show up as opposed you want to show up?

Yes.

So I want to show up, so it doesn't really seem like a job to me. They're not mutually exclusive.

They're not mutually exclusive.

What do you think?

I think—

what, what do you think is the difference between, uh, a job and, and doing what we do, like being entrepreneurs?

So you're saying what we're doing is not a job?

It doesn't feel like it. It doesn't feel like a job to me.

I guess it kind of just goes down to what you think a job is. Definition of a job, I would say, like something that you are tasked with doing, you must do. And I think there are many things of our work of what we do that is job. And there are many things that in our lives it's a job, and there are many things that, you know, I enjoy but I also must get done. So like, say if it's been like a long day with the kids and we decided to stay out on the trails longer, or if I'm not feeling well, or if I've got a lot to do already— building a website, something like that takes a lot of time, or, you know, building out a whole new sales funnel path, that's great. But on top of that, there may be other things that I must do still, like I must check on the ads, I must run payroll, I must submit forms and do some of the reports out to the government that they require, you know what I mean? Things like that. Yes, well, the government. So I must file our taxes, which I need to make our appointment. I'm already behind on that. So yeah, so is it— it is a job, it is work because it requires intentional effort and labor, whether mentally and/or physically. Um, and we also use it to support our livelihood. So yeah, it's a job.

Yeah, I mean, I guess somewhere in the back of my mind I know it's a job. It just doesn't feel like a job because I guess your def— my definition of a job is like something you have to show up to. Like back when I was working—

you are working!

I know I'm working now, but it just doesn't feel like— in my mind it feels like I'm like a mercenary and I'm just taking all these like different—

guess what, mercenaries are hired for jobs, but it's fun.

Okay, I like— in my mind, I like—

they also may think that their job is fun.

Yeah, yeah, that's what I was just about to say, that in my mind I like to think mercenaries really like their jobs too, like Expendables.

Or they may be as good at it.

Yeah.

And therefore it is not really trained to do so. I don't know, work is anything that requires effort.

Yeah, I don't know. Just weird. It's feel— I feel like I've had some really difficult and laborious physical jobs in the past, so I would definitely think of those as work. Or I feel like waking up in the mornings in our home with our little ones in bed and me getting to go write these stories isn't work. Like, I've done work before. I've done labor-intensive jobs. There's a lot of people out there who work really hard.

Yes.

So it's hard for me to justify in my mind putting myself on the same level as, like, people who are laying bricks. I think that seems like hard work. I think what I get to do is just a difference.

One, we should not put ourselves on the same level as anyone. No one should put the same— themselves on the same level as anyone, because everyone has a different path and is carrying different burdens. But to the bricklayer, writing a 100,000-word novel may be more laborious than laying bricks.

Is that a word? Yeah, laborious.

Laborious. Laborious.

Sounds like a laboratory.

I know, like a scientist. I've had clients use the word. I'm gonna go ahead and trust my clients. So anyway, but you missed the point. The point being, to everyone, different types of work is more challenging, so it requires different physical effort.

And I think it goes back to, I don't think about myself very much at all. I just think about the task, like what's the task that needs to be completed next. There's not a yesterday or tomorrow, there's now, and there's the task, and that's all that exists. So I know for me, since I don't really think about myself at all, like not that I'm trying to be humble, so don't give me any credit, I just don't think of myself at all.

That is the true definition of humility.

But it's not like I'm trying to be humble, right? I'm not intentionally trying to play it down.

Shout out to your mom and dad for that.

But it's just like, I don't care about what I did yesterday. I care what I'm doing now, like today. So it's— I don't know where some people might think it's humbleness. I think it's like just beating myself down consistently to be better. Like, I don't want to hang my hat— I never want to hang my hat on anything in this life.

Is that why you refuse to use the titles? USA Today bestselling author, international bestselling, international selling author, some of that stuff.

So for people who may not know what we're doing right now is as we get into this next realm of TV shows and movies and much larger deals, there's agents and managers and lawyers involved now who are asking us kind of what we've done, what accolades that we have accomplished over the years. So as these proposals are being built, we're having to dig back in the past and see kind of what we've accomplished over the last 10, almost 11 years. So we're like, oh yeah, I was on the USA Today bestseller list. But to me, for me, that's not really important. Like that's in the past. That's something already like accomplished and done. I'm not somebody who's going to keep on thinking about telling other people like, oh, well, I was, I'm a USA Today bestseller. I was on the USA Today list. That doesn't mean anything.

You're an award-winning author.

Yeah, like I've won awards, but that doesn't mean anything to me. Like, that's done in the past. Like, what means something to me is what we're trying to accomplish now, today. So that's what I— we're kind of talking about as these book proposals and different things are being put together, and it's kind of made me reevaluate myself. But it's not humility. I'm not trying to be humble. I'm just fixated and focused on being better. But that could be to my detriment as well, because now as we are in these meetings, these things keep on coming up like, oh yeah, I was on the USA Today bestseller list. And they're probably like, well, you should have led with that, you know, like months ago when we started these meetings. So I think it's me evolving and being better at talking about myself, not because I don't mind talking about myself.

You can talk about it as your brand. So it's not you personally, I mean, it is something you personally put into it, but it's something that, like, if you're thinking about it as a tool, for me, I don't think, oh, my husband's a USA, you know, it's more like, hey, this is a matter of fact, you were on this list, you have these specific accolades, and they are tools to use in our marketing and advertising to readers as well as to investors. And so if we think about it that way, when we say this title or this series has sold X amount of copies, that is a matter of fact.

Well, I think too it might be because I don't get out very much, ladies and gentlemen. I'm just, uh, with my characters all day in my head and my lovely wife and our two children who are 6 and 2. So I'm not, uh, talking to other people besides myself, or if I am talking to other people, it's other authors who have my same mindset, right? Because they just have like super tight, like I can count them on one hand, of authors that I would reach out to.

Consider yourself blessed.

Of authors who I would reach out to with questions. And we're all the same way. Like, I'm not— these authors and I aren't talking about, you know, hitting lists and being Amazon bestsellers and USA Today bestsellers. Uh, we're not talking about awards we win. We're trying to get better. We're trying to find that next thing. We're trying to, um, accomplish and tackle much larger goals. And that's where all our attention is, not on anything else. So it's, yeah, definitely a, I need to learn to have different conversations with different people. So somebody who's maybe like a new agent or a new manager who's interested in my work, I have to remember like, okay, they might, they don't have any context. They don't know what we've done over the last 10 years. So I need to talk about kind of what we've built over the last 10 years. Before I can get them really excited on what we're doing today, because all I want to do is talk about what we're doing today, not what we've done over the last 10 years.

Yeah. So what are you doing, working towards today that you want to accomplish?

Goals?

Yeah.

So I don't know if we've talked about this before. I know I've talked to you about this before, but I'm not sure we talked about the podcast, what Michael Crichton did.

No.

So Michael Crichton, at the same time that he had his book out, Timeline, which was a New York Times bestseller. He also had Jurassic Park out, which was the number one movie in the world. And then he also had ER out, which was the number one TV show. So at the same time, he was a bestselling author, his movie was number one, and his TV show was number one. And that sounds like it would be a challenge. So I think I want to try to do that next. And we've kind of had just a little small, tiny, tiny little, tiny little drop, drop of that nectar recently when we had Infinity System winning awards.

And that was a TV show, right?

Our TV show Infinity System, we filmed the first pilot, we filmed the pilot episode. And while that was winning awards, we were also with my latest book on Amazon as an Amazon number one seller. So not the same, not same, same, but just like a little taste of kind of what it could mean to be a New York Times bestseller and then have your TV show at number 1 and then have a movie at number 1.

Why is that important to you?

I think that it would be difficult. I only want to do hard things. I want to challenge myself, make myself intentionally go out in places to grow. That's another thing too. Oh man, let me tell you, I've had a lot of coffee this morning.

We should put that down.

Had a lot of coffee this morning, so I've got a lot to say.

You drink some water.

Got a lot to say. Uh, another thing that kind of helps is I'm not afraid to go out and talk to people. So let's just establish that.

I don't like it.

Let's just establish that I'm not afraid. I can go out and have conversations. I was in sales and management, just surrounded by people for years and years.

You were also—

I can thrive. Yes, I could thrive in that environment. But it's more comfortable for me just to wake up in the mornings, sit behind my computer, and work on my next book. That's comfortable. That's what I know. It's fun. It's more difficult for me to book tickets to an event or go out to one of our premieres or go to a speaking engagement and then all day be shaking babies and kissing hands. Nope.

Nope, that's how you get sick. That's how you go to jail.

Oh, that's how I got sick and went to jail at the same time.

No, sorry.

So I need to grow, that's opportunity of growth for me. So my goal would be to go out more, whether it's to more film events where our Infinity System is being shown across the country, whether it's more, Speaking engagements like being on panels or going to conventions. And again, just not that because that is, I'm scared of it, but it is more difficult. It takes me out of my comfort zone of just being behind my computer. So that's a goal for myself.

It's a balance. I think the networking aspect is what will help promote you into getting the trifecta, the screenwriters, the writers, author trifecta.

And I know it's something that we should do because every time we go out and do that, good things come of it. Yeah, good things happen.

But I think we're selective and intentional about it. How many times people run into people when they're like, this is my 20th one, and we're like, wow, that's amazing. And then we ask what else they're doing in between those 20 events in that year, and it's like, oh, more events, or you know what I mean? It's not like they're moving the dial.

Yeah, we don't want to go to an event every month.

Well, we'll see, we'll see what happens.

No, I do not want—

I know you may not want to. We will see what 2023 brings.

But also too, riddle me this: should we want to— like, everything's a balance, right? So even though yes, I think that I should probably go out to maybe 3 or 4 events in 2023, we also have to remember the kids. Like, no, for sure, they're only going to be this age once. This is all we get.

Well, we're with them 24/7, and we are with them already more than, like, probably— I'm gonna just guess— 70 to 80% of parents in a traditional working household. So it's not as though if we miss one weekend with them here and there, even once a month— but probably not a month, once a quarter— once a quarter, it's not going to be like we missed out on their childhood.

Yeah, yeah, once a quarter seems fine. That's what I'm thinking.

No, so we know my birthday is next month, so we're going to be doing something, probably gone. Then you've got another event in March. Now we've got an event in April, in June, May, June, then in June, and then November, and then in November.

So maybe 4, 4 is good. That's something.

Well, we'll see what happens. We'll see what happens. Maybe having to go to New York. Oh, maybe going to filming in Dallas or Austin. Yes.

Yeah.

So you see what I'm saying? Like, yeah, we're not put a cap on it, but the goal— if the goal is to be intentional about our time, and are we choosing events that are worthwhile? So you only want to do hard things. I only want to do worthwhile things. If it's easy and worthwhile, so be it. If it's hard and worthwhile, so be it. If it's hard just to push me out of my comfort zone, but it's really at the end, like What is the end goal of that? Nothing. You've done something hard. That's not worthwhile to me. There are many hard things that are worthwhile that move me towards the bigger goals that I have for myself and for us, for our family. So, um, yeah, so I think that's the filtration process we have to kind of put everything through as we say yes and no and maybe and maybe. Yeah, so in the upcoming year, years, ahead of us.

And maybe some of the events we could take our kids with us, if it makes sense. Maybe that'd be fun. I like my kids.

I know, I love our kids too. I like hanging out with them.

I think some people— I'm not gonna name names, but I feel like, uh, some parents, I feel like a lot of times they don't even want to hang out with their own kids. I'm thinking to myself, why would you even have kids if you didn't want to hang out with them? So I understand that your wife wanted to have kids, maybe. And I understand that, you know, like, uh, alone time for parents is important, like, you know, date nights or maybe like a vacation and stuff like that. But on the other hand, I know parents who are like, oh, you know, dropping off the kids at every opportunity they can to kind of get away from them. And I feel like that's sad.

Maybe the kids don't want to hang out with their parents.

Maybe.

I can't imagine our kids not wanting to hang out with us.

No, neither.

So anyways, this is not the parenting episode. I want to bring us back in.

Goals. No, while I was talking about goals, my goal is to put to only do hard things, to hit New York Times, have a bestselling movie and TV show out at the same time. Okay. My goal is to get out more and do more in-person events. And I will stop there.

So you have 3?

3 goals.

3 goals. Now, does that mean you're trying to get those this coming year? How do you set a timeframe for this stuff? Because people may be like, oh my gosh, because on average, like in the next year. So they're thinking you're talking about the trifecta in 2023 or the next year, or, uh, yeah, like, what does that look like, time span for you?

Oh, I think so. Each year what I do is I write down 5 things that I want to accomplish that year, but then also I kind of have a larger, grander goal in mind. So for this year, it'd be getting out more, which could mean, you know, maybe like 4 times.

Okay.

That we're getting out and actually doing events. And overall overarching goal could be hitting the trifecta of a bestselling book and a movie and a TV show.

Like in any time that it takes to get there.

Right. One of my favorite stories, I think I've told you before, I don't know if you know this about me, but I'm a bit of a storyteller.

How are you?

But this isn't my story. This is somebody else's I heard, and I can't remember where I heard it or else I would give them credit.

Okay.

So there, it's World War II. There's a POW camp. Yes, there is a, uh, captured soldier in the POW camp. When eventually, when the war is over, the POW camp is liberated and there's only one surviving soldier.

I know this.

And the only surviving soldier, they get to him and they're like, how were you able to hang on when everybody else didn't make it around you? Like, how did you manage to do it? So he told them that all the other surrounding prisoners would always hinge their hope on a certain date. So they would say like, okay, just hang in there, we're gonna get liberated by Christmas. Christmas is going to come around and we're going to be liberated. But then Christmas would come and go and they wouldn't be liberated, and some of those soldiers would pass away, not necessarily because they couldn't physically make it, but because their hope had died. And then Easter would come around, so they'd be like, okay, Easter's coming, we just gotta hang in there to Easter, we're gonna be liberated by Easter. But then Easter would come and go and more of those prisoners would pass away. So what this surviving prisoner realized was that all these people were hinging their hope on a certain date, and when that date came and went, they perished. Again, not because they necessarily couldn't survive it any longer, but because their hope had been taken from them. And I feel like hope is something that you have to surrender. I don't know if hope can be taken from you, actually. So when I'm setting long-term goals, I don't really put a date on, okay, this has to happen by the end of 2023 or else I failed. I just have faith that it will happen.

Okay, that guy's name is Viktor Frankl, and he wrote a fabulous book called The Meaning of Life. Yes, yes, it's one of those like, um, it's going to give you a lot of insights for someone who underwent some terrible things. But I'm pretty sure it's Viktor Frankl. Yeah, I don't know, probably. Okay, well, okay, so, uh, hard eye roll. Um, Yes. How do you not have that timeline so nebulous that you're not moving forward towards it? Because some people may have like an aspiration or a lofty big goal, um, or a bodacious goal, a big— they have these, these lots of different things like bodacious, big, like, or lofty would be something that is like just a lot more soft. Um, there I did it again.

Um, some big words— bodacious and laborious.

Well, it's how I roll.

Well, that's just how I roll.

That's just how I roll this morning. It's been a morning. Um, okay, stop. So what I'm trying to say is, how do you make sure that it's not something that always just kind of stays out there? You're making progress.

Well, Idris Elba once told me, in way of you hearing it from him on a podcast or something, that, uh, grinding towards your goal is a lot like swimming. Or with like swimming, something, it may be like a freestyle, or you're swimming towards a certain point. I guess there are certain strokes you could do this, but most strokes you would swim and every once in a while pause and look up and to see how close you are. And then you would put your head down and you would keep on swimming for some time and then maybe pause and look up. So I think grinding towards a goal looks a lot like swimming.

For you?

Yes, for me. So Idris, if you're listening to this, I want you to know I'm giving you full credit. This is your analogy, not mine. But I feel like I'm swimming towards a goal and that's like every day I'm kind of like taking a stroke. So I wake up on Monday, I'm like, okay, What do I need to do today to win the day? And then Tuesday, what do I need to do to win this day? And then Wednesday, because ladies and gentlemen, I don't know if you know this, but there is a lot going on. There is a lot happening. Like, I can list like 10 things going on right now where if I were to take a step back and think about all that's happening, it would be overwhelming. But if I just focus on the day, a day seems manageable. Like today, all I have to do is X, Y, and Z. That's it. And then tomorrow, X, Y, and Z. So I think it was Apollo Creed, he was talking to Rocky. I forget which Rocky it is. Somebody, if you know what Rocky it is, let me know. But he was telling Rocky that there is no tomorrow, that there's today, there's right now. That's what I kind of think of too. Then that goes back to me not worrying about like what we did for the last 10 years. Like there wasn't a yesterday, there's not a tomorrow, there's right now, there's today. And that helps me focus too, focus on what we need to do.

Good. I think that's helpful.

How about you? We should talk about your goals.

Oh, my goals are a bunch different.

Well, no, we, uh, already said that you wanted to do things that are worthwhile, not necessarily hard.

Yes. And that's not a goal.

That's not a goal. So what are your goals?

That's a filter. So my process has evolved over the years. I think as maturity, life seasons, lifestyles, and also just as I've grown, the way I could operate has changed. So I used to just, you know, write them down, pick different things, and then kind of work towards it. My birthday's in January, so instead of hinging it all on New Year's or something like that, it would be, as I enter this new age of me, what are some things I would like to see done? It's more like a roadmap. And so instead of just saying I'm going on a road trip and we're going to end up wherever we end up, I'm hinging on specific points, some places of points of interest to hit along the way. And then as I grew a little bit older, I used to do a map, almost like a mind map, and pick out things of who— how I, how I wanted my beat to be, who I wanted to be, how I wanted to be in different areas of my life, to sculpt like the person that I am intentionally becoming. So that would be, what are some financial areas, in the fi— my financial aspect of my life, spiritual, as a wife, relationship-wise, in my workplace, professionally, physically. What are some things that, that I wanted to do in terms of strength training or body mass or health, whatever those 5 pillars were? And then maybe mentally, How do I want to grow my mind? And so as I would pick out an overarching goal for those topics, and I would have subpoints of these are the 3 things that if I continue to build these in as habits or accomplish these mini goals, they will work me towards the bigger goal by the end of the time period. And at the end of that year, some things would carry over because some things are bigger, some things are a different process and have different paces of progress. So that's something that I did for a while, and I would map that out and kind of create an interesting design or layout and then post that up on my side of our room. Now, for more recently, what I've been doing is choosing something similar but using images. So if anyone's ever done like a vision board, it's more similar to that because we're all visual and we're moving so quickly. I'm like, hardly spend any time in my— in our room where I could look up and see that I have a big whiteboard for like a to-do list for managing business stuff in the section for household management. But it's not the same as when I worked at an— in an office at the ad agency, and I would be at my desk so much where I had like my space, and I'm working there all day long, and I would see it. Or I had my planner, and that would be like the first page of my planner. So I find that something that helps me to make my decisions go towards my goals every day, or all, you know, all the moments of the day, most moments of the day, would be something visual. And so what I've done is created a mood board and set it as the wallpaper on my phone. So that was how I constructed them. And so I can tell you some of the things that were this year if you'd like.

Sure.

Okay, let me grab my phone. Look at them again. So some of the things were, uh, some of the accomplishments for school with our daughter in karate. I wanted to work towards my purple belt. I wanted to have reminders for what my reading goal would be this year. And, um, I have a picture of The Rock and Danny Garcia because we've done all our film stuff this year. And 1,000 hours outside. Also, this is more of a—

we should touch on the 1,000 hours outside because that's a lot.

Okay, yeah, let's go back. I have pictures of some French pastries because I wanted to work on baking this year. And also I have a quote about— from Tolkien, because it's that— this— that house was a perfect house whether you like food or sleep or storytelling or singing or just sitting and thinking best, or a pleasant rest— excuse me— or a pleasant miniature of them all. Merely to be there was a cure for weariness, fear, and sadness. And to me, that was the tone that I wanted to make sure to set in our home. So for our family, as we entered into the space, we would always find that peace and rest. And visitors, as they came here, they would also find that it wouldn't be frenetic or frantic or sterile or dirty, but warm and inviting and a place of peace. So these things I selected as ways to help with my mental sharpness. Books I knew that I would read, one, make it— it's a priority to read, but two, the things that I would select would help with spiritual growth, would help with motherhood, would help specifically with homeschooling, uh, film and advertising, understanding the market, understanding psychology of purchase behavior, understanding the way movie money is exchanged, contracts. So ran the, the gamut, and some fiction because help creating more worlds and entertainment and understanding and loving storytelling. And all of that also feeds into setting an example for the kids and to develop a love of reading.

Oh yeah, we should do an episode on what we consume as far as like either entertainment or reading, because you've been doing a lot of like mystery and thrillers, right?

I did more of that this year than I had in previous years. Yeah, because they're easier, because the way the story is paced out, it makes you jump into like the next page. Every chapter kind of ends on like a whodunit kind of moment or a new revealing of the clue, so it paces you along. So when I'm tired and I need something to kind of settle the mind before bed, a thriller is easier to do than a book on movie contracts and royalties and backend defined turn profit royalty splitting.

So yeah, I think I've stayed with mostly science fiction, fantasy, and we both do nonfiction.

Yes, tons of nonfiction.

But there's two things you should hit on— the 1,000 Hours, because that was one of your goals. So 1,000 Hours Outside, yeah, where'd you get that from? What does that mean? And then also tell them about coyotes.

Coyotes.

So you tell them about what that means, and then I'll tell them the coyote story.

Okay, okay. So, uh, 1,000 Hours Outside is a podcast run by Ginny Urich. Um, one of the reasons I love that podcast is it's not just about going outside. It's about how, um, doing things in a different manner than traditional, conventional— I guess it would be the original traditional— um, helps our brain development. It helps our psychosis. It helps with just even development for the kids. And so that's how it started. She wanted to find a way to stimulate, entertain her young children in a way that wasn't so fussy and messy and requires so much planning and work and toys and things. And she found that by taking them outside, they just thrived and they were happy and they were tired afterward. It helped with their vestibular system and their sense of adventure. And that— so it's this whole thing. So she has a podcast, 1,000 Hours Outside, and all of her guests are just phenomenal. And some of them I was delighted to find that I had heard on other podcasts., and she had them over. So I love when the worlds collide in such a way, but from physical development and how we move, the skeletal muscular system, and then just the grace and the wonderfulness of discomfort, and so, in, you know, and how it helps us to develop. So I knew that coming from a space where I was in an office all day to coming home and just kind of being inside, that the kids energy and rambunctious. I thought, you know, we need to get outside more. And whilst I don't think 1,000 hours makes sense for us right now, 1,000 hours in a year, more hours outside is definitely doable. And Charlotte Mason, in her earlier parts of her, uh, her volumes, talks about children should be outside for like 5 to 6 hours a day. And there's a wonderful book about, uh, and talking about there's no such thing as bad weather, just inappropriate clothing. You can find the right outfits and things to wear on the hot days and in the cold days, and so you can continue to be outside. So, so what we've done is definitely started to implement and allow ourselves more time outside, that vitamin D, that fresh air. And I think coming out of COVID too, that was super important for us. So we've done that and One of those things that we do is we have a local regional park. It's just beautiful. So we go there for one of our homeschool meetups. And, um, so even on the days that we're not there, I like to take the kids there to explore the area and just kind of be more familiar with it as like their park.

Two things. One, I'm pretty sure I have some of the homeschool moms convinced that you're a train killer.

I don't—

what? Because I told them about you. I didn't lie to him. You do do karate.

I do do karate. Karate, but I'm like a green belt.

Okay, go on. Almost purple. Yes, well, almost purple.

Almost only counts in hand grenades and horseshoes.

Yeah, because I think that's super cool. So I would let them know, you know, don't let her kind demeanor fool you. Jen is almost a purple belt in karate and she's sparring now. And they'd be like, what?

Oh my, tell them I was taking punches and kicks to the gut by other, other men in the class.

To the jejunum. No, no, nope.

There's pads. Go next. Yes.

And then the second thing was, it's funny because Jen is part of homeschool group, they meet at a park, and she kept on telling me that there's coyote sightings. So if anybody hasn't seen a coyote, the ones that are there—

I've seen it on Looney Tunes.

Yes, it's not like that.

No, it's not.

But have you seen— would you say they're like maybe 45 pounds? Yeah, about 40, 45 pounds, these coyotes. That are running around. So she keeps on telling me stories. So I went with her. I go a few times, been a couple times with her to the— with the kids.

Yeah, not my group, it's the kids group.

Yeah, the group, it's homeschooling group. So went to the park and we're driving and then she turns off at like Coyote Corner and I'm like, oh, you've been telling me this whole time about coyotes. I thought it was just kind of like, you know, random events. They're patrolling the whole park. They kept on seeing them. But your group is actually intentionally meeting in a place of this park called Coyote Corner. So you probably shouldn't be surprised— no— that there's coyotes patrolling the area at Coyote Corner.

It is a natural thing for coyotes to be in this area. It is a regional park, it's right up against the hill.

And this section of the park they choose to meet in intentionally.

We've been meeting in this area— they've been meeting in this area for years. I've been there. No, Coyote Corner is the— that's where we're from, area previous. It's the section right before ours. But also, we've been going for months, and for the first few months there were no coyotes. They only started coming in the last month or so.

But now they're coming in droves.

What do you define as droves? Two.

Two. There's people feeding them.

That seems really hyperbolic.

So anyway, the mother's bringing air horns.

What were you gonna say? So, um, so the coyotes might come and check it out. Some random man was feeding them. You've really digressed. Okay, so some guy was feeding them. We don't know his mental stability, whatever, why he was doing this, but he was trying to like befriend the coyotes. Yeah, and domesticate them or something. And so in the area next to where we meet, and since then, that's when they've been coming around a little bit more. Like to see a coyote every so often, or a bobcat, or mountain lion in the hills. Like, that's not uncommon. Hawks, all kinds of things. But the way that they have been coming around more lately is what has been concerning. So yes, one of the moms brought an air horn. We just have to reestablish dominance. They're coming, and all the kids have snacks for days, so of course they're like, when are you guys leaving? I want to get your snacks. Just like when the dogs like to pick up food from under the table from the kids eating.

Maybe that guy who was feeding the coyotes was sipping on a little too much of Aunt Rita's Darjeeling and he actually thought he was feeding geese. What happens if he thought he was feeding geese the whole time? There are geese.

Why do these ducks like me?

Anyway, but now Jen's asking me to purchase coyote spray for her, so I went on Amazon to look at coyote spray and I found coyote urine.

Oh no, that's gonna tell them to be there. No, I think cougar urine.

I think coyote urine. Don't quote me on this.

I don't want to listen to the podcast. I don't want this adventure, guys. I have to edit this.

But nope, the coyote doesn't— wouldn't coyote urine put somewhere, like, tell other coyotes, like, hey, this place has been marked, don't come here?

I don't know. Why don't you just go pee on it?

I don't know if that would help. I think the kids are already doing that.

Yeah, that's true. Next, goals. How do you determine the goals? How do you figure them out? There's so many different ways to do so. I'm just going to bypass that, what you were talking about. So there are this thing called SMART goals where they're achievable, they're measurable, they have a set timeline for them. And I forget what the first S means.

Don't look at me. That's your acronym.

It's not mine. And then there are the big bodacious goals.

Smart, secure.

No, I don't know.

I was going to say a bunch of S words. Nope.

What else about goals? Have you always set goals since you were young, by the way?

Yeah. Again, I forgot where I heard this, but it was like set 5 goals a year. So when I first heard that, I thought it was a good idea. The month just happened to be May, so I started in May.

Do you think it's important to limit and to have focus? Oh, for sure. Too many goals at once, you can become unwily and then you don't know what you're doing.

Yeah, I think 5 goals for the year and then attainable goals. So my goal of hitting, you know, New York Times best-selling TV show, best-selling movie is going to be a long-term goal, not in a year. But like in a year, how do you get there? So like, you know, you can break it down like a year, like, okay, I want to get an agent or I want to sign a manager.

Do you backtrack what you need to do to make that happen? Or is it as you encounter a situation, you determine, is this gonna help me move towards my goal?

I think you're giving me too much credit. I just go, okay. I'm not like trying to backtrack steps. I'm like, put down.

Well, I think that's also important. Some people operate that way. They may have a goal and say, I don't even know where to begin. How do I achieve this goal? And so something that feels big, I would say to see, you weren't going to choose the trifecta, the Michael, the Crichton trifecta day one as an author, right?

And what's really cool about the Crichton trifecta is there's not a whole lot of authors. Jen and I looked it up, and maybe you know more, so if you know more, please let us know. But we were looking at authors who have successfully, you know, had a career as an author but who have also transitioned into doing scripts, writing scripts for film projects. So not just authors who have had their work translated into film, but who— authors who are actually writing their own scripts to go to film.

There is a reason for that though.

Oh yes, I found out that reason.

Yes, it's not as though like, oh, no one's done it, like It's very difficult to do it.

So first, let's figure— let's tell them who we found, and then, then we'll tell them what.

So you tell them who we found.

I remember. Okay, good. So it was Michael Crichton, Neil Gaiman, Suzanne Collins, and then one of the writers from The Expanse. I forgot which one. Okay. But each one of those not only wrote their novels, but then they also had a hand in writing the scripts to a successful TV show or movie. So those are the 4 that we could find who went from being successful, like best-selling author, to successful either like number one movie or number one TV show.

Okay, why is it difficult?

Oh man, it was so hard. So I'm learning my own process. What I've come to realize too, as you set yourself up to tackle new projects, you have to figure out what your process is for you within that new project. So I've written novels, right? I understand my process there. I've written scripts. I understand what that process looks like for me there, but I had never until recently translated a novel to a script. So I was just doing some pretty motivating self-talk. Jonathan, you got this. Not a big deal. You can do this. Believe in who you are. I think I can. I think I can. I think I can. Nope. So I went from doing the novel into a script, and it was way more difficult than I thought, because usually when I'm writing a novel or a brand new script, I can just float. It's like all my imagination. I'm just seeing the scenes in my head. I'm making myself laugh. There's fight scenes, explosions, people are throwing up, other people are saying semi-inappropriate jokes. But then when I'm turning a book that already exists into a script, there are— I have to follow like a pattern, right? Like the story already exists. Now I'm just translating it into a different form. And for that was not easy. It was much more difficult than I thought. So I had to learn for the first time a new process on how I do that, how it works for me. So I got to translate a book that was 100,000 words into a script that was like 17,000 words. So as you can imagine, a lot gets cut out.

A lot of darlings were killed.

Yes, and I understand now why a production company or somebody who's funding a film would not want the author to also write the script, because I think as the author, there's certain things that we want to keep in the story, certain things that we really like or we enjoy, or we know that readers enjoy, so we want to keep in for the film. But then on the opposite side of that you have the producers and people at the top who are looking at the script just to make sure, you know, the script is sound by itself without the book and that everything makes sense. So they might tell the writer like, hey, this is good, but you need to cut out X, Y, and Z. And for me, it was just kind of like a mental hurdle that I needed to overcome myself, being like, hey, they're right, they want the best thing for the story in a script. So I needed to go ahead and realize it's not about what I want, it's about what's best for the script, and cut out a lot of different things that were in the book to turn it into a script. And I think we did that successfully. We've moved on now from getting approval for the script, but it was not easy. And I think now that I've done it, I think now I'll be way better doing it a second round, now knowing exactly how a book gets turned into a script.

So theoretically, you— well, not theory, actually, you had to find your process, right? You probably approached it in a couple of different ways till you found what worked in the beginning.

So it took me a lot longer.

So people who are starting out on a goal towards a new path They need to have grace with themselves. All of us need to have grace with ourselves to try out different methods as we work towards doing something new, to try to do something in a new way.

Oh, for sure. Like, you only fail if you give up, right? So as long as you keep on trying, if you try one way and it doesn't work out, then you have to try a second way. So if you try, like, to go around the obstacle, you might have to go under it or over it or through it, you have to find different ways to be able to accomplish what you set out to do. So like with myself, turning the book into a script, I had to find it, try a few different things before I finally found something that works. So my process was to, I had the book on audiobook, so I listened to the whole story again and then chapter by chapter I just made points. These are the points that happen in each chapter. And then once I had all the points, I realized what I could cut because it can't all make it into an hour and a half movie, right? 100,000 words. This isn't going to turn into 17,000 words and make everything in. So I realized what I had to cut and then I would have like, okay, chapter 1, this scene happens. And then I would just write the scene either from memory or like I understood like the key point that had happened. So I would just write the script almost like I was writing a new script. Like I wasn't cutting and pasting anything from the book. I was just writing a new script and that really helped 'cause there was like a little bit of freedom in there. If I understand like, hey, in this scene there's gonna be an action scene and then there's banter between our hard-nosed female and our young male who's coming up in the ranks. And that's all I would have. And then I would just go ahead and write that. So there was a little bit of freedom in there. I could come up with their lines.

So letting go of what you had before, what you knew had worked before, to try something different.

Right. And I would like to think— I don't know if this is true or not— but I would like to think that with every book that comes out or every project that I write, that I get a little bit better, even if it's like 0.006% better.

Well, if it's even 1% better, 1% on top of everything that you already have compounds. It compounds and it gets you like almost another 40% better in a year's time if you're just looking at if it's 1% better each day.

So this Jonathan who wrote the book X amount of years ago, hopefully Jonathan today that's writing the script for it is better. Yes.

Because I think you've written 10 books since. So actually, I know you've written more books since cents. So if you got 1% better each of those times, you've already improved over 20%. That's just some rough math. But amen. I feel like I can really relate to you on that. Two of the goals that I've had is to take our sales up another level from our backlist, and another one has been on the working out side. I want to become stronger. After I had Jackson, I was very thin. I lost a lot of muscle mass, but I also just lost general mass. I was very skinny. And I didn't like it. So building muscle was key for me. But after working out with the trainer for about a year and lifting, I realized I had to do things differently. So I tried a couple different plans and guidelines, and I just like knowing my body, my body type, what did I need to do. So I had to do things differently and sort of let go from what I've done in previous years and go ahead and push myself to the next level of discomfort with the heavier weights and the different sets and the different program and the eating and what I needed to fuel my body with to build that muscle mass. And I had to just have grace with myself. It's going to be a transition, but also not to say that I was dumb for what I did before, not working. Who I was, my body, and my goals were all different. So it was just time to embrace a new opportunity. Same thing with the backlist sales, you know, as you're going to be writing less, releasing less frequently, we want to have more depth. And so I want to bring balance to our initiatives. And so that was what I was doing before was okay, but I needed to go another level. So that means if I want to see different results, I have to do something differently. So trying a new process now and, and seeing that through, knowing that it's going to take time to set up and trusting the process of letting that come to fruition to see those, um, results. And I think whatever the new goals are career-wise, sales-wise, physically, marriage, relationships, motherhood, spiritually, whatever it is, we have to try things differently. Baking, I like burnt up so much butter in the bottom of our oven when I try to make those croissants or whatever. So I have to learn, okay, I'm try a different technique this next time and see, and see how it works. So, um, I think there's a lot of, a lot of grace, a lot of forgetting what you thought you knew and embracing and trusting, uh, a process and, and putting your goals— you write yours down, right?

Your 5?

Uh-huh. Yeah. And you have them in a place that you can refer to frequently. It's not like you have to like dig in a drawer to find them. It's that, correct? Through my phone. Oh, okay. Yeah, so same. Well, whatever it is, if your people are less digital, digitally inclined, and they've got a notebook—

I don't think you should say you people.

Did I say you people?

You're people.

No, I don't think I said people. If you are less inclined to be digital, you can go ahead and be— yeah, write it down in a notebook. So we should wrap this up because it's probably our longest episode yet.

Oh, okay. So thank you for listening. If you haven't already, you can follow us, uh, leave some comments. 100%, I will make sure to comment back. We appreciate you. As much as this is to give back, I'm also getting a lot out of it, um, too. So it's kind of like, uh, if you give, you get. I get to spend more time with Jennifer. Yeah, which is always a plus.

Plus our kids can watch this in the future.

Oh, I didn't even think about that.

Yeah, I got real—

future kids and maybe future grandkids. How about that? I'll raise— I'll raise you. Don't you even— get even more uncomfortable.

Folks, thanks for joining us. I'm gonna go cry.