House of Wolves Episode Ten - Creating and unleashing the beast within.

You should be a monster, an absolute monster, and then you should learn how to control it. There's an intensity to what we're trying to accomplish, and, um, you know, if you want to be truly great, you've got to bring it every day. Do you enjoy pain? Pain don't hurt. You blitz all night. Standing out is a long-term strategy, takes guts, and produces results. If you care enough about your work to be willing to be criticized for it, then you have done A good day's work. So what does it mean to you to be an absolute monster?

To be an absolute monster is to tap into the most savage parts of who we can be. So there are different parts of the brain. There's a lizard brain, the monkey brain, the dog brain that comprises what's the human brain, right? The most basic instinct, and then the whole community part, and then there's the part of us that wants companionship and all of that. And that's kind of what makes us human, because we have so many layers— will, consciousness— beyond basic instinct and desire and animalistic, if you will. So to me, it's being able to tap into those deeper instinctual levels at will. Someone who's a monster, an out-of-control monster, is someone that is doing these really bad things, is breaking down different parts and fabrics of society or organizations, family, communities for selfish ends and without being aware of what they're doing. So there's definitely some people, some situations that you would say that person was a monster. I think we can name a few, but we won't name names.

What do you mean by lizard brain and dog brain and monkey brain? I've heard lizard brain and monkey brain. Before. I don't think I've ever heard dog brain.

Dog brain's like the unconditional love that a dog has, that want for companionship, that being in a pack community, the nurturing instinct that they have with pets and the way they're able to bond with other animals. It's more of a community-oriented. So lizard brain is what they would refer to as your most basic instinct of survival. And survival is about reproduction. It's about eating. It's about staying warm. That kind of an idea.

That's lizard brain. And then monkey brain is what?

Um, it's the next level. Like, none of those brains have the sort of consciousness or will. They act on instinct towards survival. So they have a little bit more of a community because, like, the big monkey packs, organizations, there's a hierarchy to them.

There's more order than the lizard brain.

Yes.

So lizard brain is like the monsters or the savages.

Sort of, but a lizard brain isn't acting at will. A lizard brain is acting completely on instinct, like Wolverine. Uh, you're saying like a savage? He is a savage. Yes, he acts on instinct a lot. He acts on instinct and not forethought. That's part of like his— the charm of his character is that he does these things and, uh, he kind of goes into a blind rage. So that would be a blind savagery.

You know Hugh Jackman signed on for 2 more movies?

I did not.

I knew he was doing one more for sure. He's coming back for more, but he's actually coming back.

Wow, it's like 2 decades, 3 decades of Hugh Jackman as Wolverine.

I don't know if you all know this, but Jonathan loves Wolverine, which is interesting because I feel like early on younger Jonathan would have said Gambit was his favorite X-Men. But definitely I would say in my 20s that changed to Wolverine. Maybe like late 20s, mid to late 20s Wolverine. Up until then it was Gambit.

I've always loved Gambit and Rogue. Yeah, since I was yay high.

Magneto is my favorite villain too, of like all time, all DC or Marvel Universe.

Magneto is a good example of being a monster, an absolute monster. I do see, uh, it was on purpose. I, I— yeah, but he seems more methodical. He seems more methodical about his savagery. He was willing to make calls and do things others weren't to drive towards his means or his ends.

So maybe we should explain to everybody a little bit about who Magneto is in case nobody knows. So that would be great for you to do. In a nutshell, Magneto believes he is doing the right thing in standing up for a group of minorities, mutants, and he goes about it all wrong though. Instead of trying to bring peace He tries to fight the power and fight who he thinks, uh, basically the normal humans who are putting the mutants down. So he wants to rule and maybe even enslave the humans, definitely rule over the humans, as mutants he sees are like the next phase of evolution. Where Professor X and the X-Men are trying to get mutants and humans to live together peacefully and like help each other out.

This is in comic books in the Marvel X-Men universe.

Yeah, and in the movies too, right?

But that originated— it's comic book stories first.

It was comic books.

Yes, Stan Lee. Yes, he just had his birthday.

And do you know why mutants are invented— were invented for the comic books?

Fun little fact, right? What's your story?

So, uh, Stan Lee was creating all these different characters. Like, uh, Hulk had to be radioactive, um, gamma rays experiment gone wrong. Captain America was a super soldier, some more experiments. Gone right, I guess, in his case. And then there was Spider-Man, had to be bit by a radioactive spider to get his powers. And there's tons more, but they were running out of ways for people to have powers, like spider bites, gamma rays, super soldiers. So finally, I don't think you— I'm not sure if it was Stan Lee, but he was definitely part of the conversation. He was like, well, what if they were just mutants? Like, we didn't have to explain them getting powers in all these different crazy ways. We'd just be like, hey, these people are just mutants, they're just different.

Interesting.

That's how mutants were born.

Interesting. Maybe Jack Kirby.

Yeah, maybe. So Magneto being an absolute monster was he was super committed and threw all his focus and will towards one goal. And I think to be like that monsters that you and I are talking about are kind of like an absolute monster is kind of like a Mike Tyson who dedicated his life to boxing.

Right.

And when you saw him in the ring, you were like, wow, that guy's a monster. So by monster, we don't necessarily mean bad.

So yeah, I think that's a good differentiator. There are monsters, but to be a monster, you can— in the term we're referring it to, you can replace it with savage or beast mode.

Yes, like Marshawn Lynch, the former running back of the Seattle Seahawks, who went by the name Beast Mode. He's actually a super nice guy in real life.

Oh, you met him?

Um, from everything that I know about him, who knows? Yeah, there might be an opportunity coming up to meet Mr.

Lynch yet is how I would answer that.

Uh, but he seemed like when he was on the field, you would say he would be like— no, he— his nickname was Beast Mode, a monster, right? And like what he did, he was so good and so focused and so driven. How about that word? Driven to or towards his goal. That he would say he's like an absolute monster on the field. That's a good thing.

Yeah, I think that's the difference is What inspired us is to be an absolute monster and to have it under control is first being able to find, acknowledge, and harness that part of ourselves. And then the biggest thing would be to have it under control so we can turn it on and off as needed when appropriate. Marshawn Lynch wasn't a monster necessarily in the press room. He wasn't a monster necessarily amongst his teammates, but he became able to harness that and turn it on, on that field or in the uniform to be effective, an effective leader, an effective player, an effective lineman.

Marshawn Lynch was a running back.

Okay, sorry. But the same thing can be said about any of those guys when we see the players on the field who have to control that. And I think this year we're seeing more calls being made on unnecessary roughness, unsportsmanlike behavior, and things like that. It's because of safety reasons, but also understanding and teaching these young men and these athletes that as much as aggression as you have to have in all of that unfettered pushing through, breaking tackles, You know, you almost like are outside your body, but you still have to be in control.

Yeah. Well, I think there's a saying that everybody should seek to be a monster or a savage and then learn how to control it. Because if you aren't a monster, you're not use— you're not like, uh, useful or dangerous to anybody. I think a better way to say it might be you should seek to be dangerous and then learn how to control it. So you should seek to learn how to, you know, like defend yourself. How to take care of yourself and your family, and then control that side of you, that aggression, as opposed to having zero aggression, not being able to protect or control anything, because that has way less use than the person who can do all of that and then chooses to control that side of themselves.

That makes somebody completely harmless, right?

Like a harmless person.

It's a— they're harmless person to anybody.

That's better. Yeah, so a harmless person as opposed to like a savage.

Yeah, an in-control savage.

Yeah, because I guess a harmless person would be on one end of the bell curve, and then a complete savage would be on the other end of the bell curve. Yes. A complete savage can't control himself, and a harmless person can't help anybody.

Yes.

You need a complete savage that can control themselves.

Yes, absolutely. I think that's like Wolverine comes all the way around. Yes. Um, I think there are some other people like Tim Kennedy where he's teaching classes on different defensive and fighting styles for people in their homes. Men and women and, and children, like even his daughters, know how if they are alone in a situation or somewhat isolated, maybe on their way to the restroom or what have you, and someone tries to take them, he has given them the ability to— taught them to tap into that savagery as well as techniques to buy themselves some time or to evade being snatched up. And I think, you know, it doesn't have to be as aggressive as Wolverine, but it can be as useful as a 12-year-old girl protecting herself from getting abducted for human trafficking.

What about John Wick? He's another good example. He was like an absolute savage who chose to control himself and to leave that life. Until Thanos finger snapped his dog and then it was all over.

From there, it's really hard to have serious conversations with you. It's almost nearly impossible to have serious conversations with you.

But we should, uh, differentiate as well that even though when you think of a monster savage, we've been using physical examples like, um, Marshawn Lynch or—

oh, I have a good one.

Yeah, what is it?

Danny Garcia.

Yeah, so we, so we should say that even though being a savage correlates to physical strength and martial arts and take care of yourself and your loved ones, that you can be a savage in different areas. Like Danny Garcia. Yeah.

I mean, she broke the mold and said, this is not how I am going to pursue my success. She had been in accounting and had ruled the financial world or her financial space, but she could use her acumen and said, if I unleash this and I figure out how to tap into something bigger, then I can have an, I can have an impact, I can accomplish my goals, I can set an example. So she took that and stepped outside the box of what was typical or expected and basically said, I'm not going to conform and I'm not going to be necessarily apologetic about it. I'm not going to be the petite traditional view of a beautiful woman. I'm going to have strength and muscles, and I am going to not only do that, but I'm going to develop a clothing line to be professional and feminine, to be strong and feminine. I'm gonna not stay in my lane. I'm gonna go and be the CEO of the XFL. Um, I'm gonna bring the XFL to the United States, you know. I'm gonna make that a bigger, a bigger deal. I am going to not wait for the movies to come to me and the people what I represent and the brands that I represent, I'm going to go after and I'm going to create my own lanes. And so to me, she is an absolute monster, an absolute savage in her arena, right?

In her arena or her field. And I think the same thing could be said about Neil Gaiman, who seems to be like everywhere. Like, not only is that guy doing novels, but he's stretching and growing himself to do graphic novels. He's stretching and growing himself to do TV shows. And like, uh, for people who don't know, those are all very different forms of writing. So it's not like, oh, well, if he could write a novel, then it'd be easy for him to write a script. Or if he could write a script, oh, then it'd just be easy for him to write a graphic novel. Like, they're all different formats that you have to learn that all come with different rules. So to know that he's doing that has meant that he has had to start from the beginning multiple times in different avenues. So being able to stretch yourself and grow and not just do one thing well, but do multiple things well, I think kind of sets apart somebody who's driven and has that savage mentality.

Yeah, well, his, his way does well is storytelling, but then how he chooses to execute that into the different mediums, like you're saying, that's where his true savagery begins to shine, is he doesn't stay in one space, doesn't stick to one type of story or one tone. So Um, absolutely, I agree with you on that one.

I think it's like a mindset that we all share. Yeah, everybody who's pushing and driving forward consistently. I know a lot of people too who are just even like entrepreneurs or who, um, work on various businesses that I see them day in and day out not only maintaining but gaining ground. I would consider those people savages too, monsters. With how dedicated and driven they are.

When you think about the things they may have to have sacrificed or knocked down, obstacles they've had to crush through along that way.

I'm at the point now because we've done so many podcasts, I can't remember what I've said or what I haven't said. So forgive me if I keep on saying this a lot of times too. People write it off as luck. So I don't know if we've talked about that yet, and if we have, where people think like, oh, well, that person's just lucky. And somebody said— nobody said that to me recently. Or I should say somebody did say that to me recently, but before then it had been a long stretch.

Okay.

But maybe a couple of weeks ago, someone was like, oh, you're so lucky to be able to write full-time. And I felt like that part of Lord of the Rings where the king of the Rohirrim was like, where was Gondor when the Westfold fell? Where was Gondor when the enemy were at our gates? Where was Gondor? And then he cuts himself off. Yeah. And he says, no, we are very much alone. So then when people tell me I'm lucky— do you have the audacity to tell me that luck has had anything to do with our journey for almost 11 years now? I tell them, luck? Where was luck when I was grinding on holidays? Where was luck when I was saying no to events so I could work on weekends? Where was luck? And then I just cut myself off. I'm saying no, luck has had nothing to do with this.

There's been opportunity and preparation and favor.

Opportunity, preparation, favor. But I would say that none of those opportunities come without discipline and consistency first, because if discipline and consistency weren't there, the opportunities would have never had a chance to come our way, right?

You talked about opportunities by putting yourself in unexpected and uncomfortable situations, and also timing too.

Yes. So think of different people that we've met. If we had met them at a different time, the opportunities might not have been there. And also think too, when we have approached different people, maybe the timing for them wasn't right.

Right.

So now that we know what it's like to be on set, we understand, like, hey, if we're on set actively filming a movie or a TV show and somebody reaches out for a meeting, that's probably not the best time that we're going to be able to make something happen or partner with them when we're on set. Right. So the timing for that might be wrong. But if that person's consistent and they reach out again, maybe the following week or the following month, then maybe the timing would be better. But that has to start with consistency on their part, consistency, consistently reaching out or consistently showing up.

Yep, absolutely. I think it's a very intentional process. It's very intentional when to turn it on and turn it off. There's a time and there's a place. There's so much energy that can go behind each of those modes. You can't be full-time beast mode because it takes a certain amount of gas, and then that's when we can gas out, we can lose sight. How many times have we been watching football and we see a big guy take the ball and he beast modes down the line, and then he gets there and he's gassed out and he's like stumbling, bumbling, and fumbling towards the end zone? Um, because he hasn't prepared. That's not what he's trained for. That's not within his day-to-day wheelhouse, and he, he gassed out. So I think that could happen in any of these avenues as well. We'll, we'll see people take that intentional rest and recuperate time so they can re-engage into that. And the other thing is accidentally becoming a monster versus doing it with intention and in control.

How do you accidentally become a monster?

You don't realize the path you're treading. You don't have yourself surrounded, surrounded by people who are encouraging you in the right direction and kind of checking as your moral compass.

Oh, you don't have a good circle of friends, right?

You don't have a good circle of people, of influencers, of content, of mentors, or whatever it is. Because someone completely unchecked— like, it goes back to why we need those communities, why we work in sort of an orderly system. You have to understand what you're going up against. And if you just become a savage and become reckless and you don't even realize what you're doing, and you've— you know, it's a fine line between madness and like an honorable manifesto, I think. So I would say we've encountered a few people who perhaps we've specifically chosen to kind of steer clear of their space or their circles because we don't want to associate with the type of savagery they have going on.

Yeah, I don't even know if we should call it savagery, just like drama.

Well, because it's accidental for them. They don't really— they may not realize the, the turmoil, the pain, the kind of chaos they're creating around them. Where I think, um, that savagery isn't as— it's like unapologetic, but like not excusable either. You know what I mean? You're not hurting people, but you're paving your own path.

Yeah, just trying to circle back so I can understand what you're saying. You're talking about people who are not using their time wisely and becoming bad savages?

Yes. Yeah, becoming a bad savage.

Okay.

Yeah, like, I could think of some people were like, I don't care, I'm gonna do what I wanna do, snooky. She was kind of a bad savage. She did all the things, but she didn't care about who she hurt. In such a long time, I always just think of that meme of like, only God could judge me. And it's like, you should care about that.

It's been such a long time since I've heard that name. I've got like all kinds of different memories back.

I'm glad you remembered. It's a very random reference. I also heard that when I was listening to an interview with Hickson Gracie and reading his biography about how being able to go into those supposed dark places that may be countercultural— and I don't mean culture at large, but it could be the culture within like your immediate circle or space, whether it be how you were raised or what's common or typical in your arena, like being an author, being a homeschool mom, working in a specific office— is that you know, you have to be confident and willing to go to some of those dark places.

What do you mean by dark places?

Like Goggins, like being able to go like, this is a path no one has gone before. What are people going to be saying? What's going to happen if I mess up?

Doing something hard is a dark place?

Uh, it can be. Being willing to go against the expectations of my parents to forge my new path because this is the path that I need to take to go to this place. Like you said, being relentless. What happens if I say, no, I'm not going to join you this weekend for the family barbecue because I need to get this done, I have a deadline or whatever? And then they're like, oh, you never hang out, you don't show up, why are you so antisocial? Like those, that would be an example of how that could be. And be willing to say, like, I'm gonna go here, it's gonna be against the grain, people aren't gonna like it. How do you know that can be considered that place, especially for people who are pleasers?

Oh, maybe it's hard for me to relate then because I'm not a pleaser at all. Yeah, so when I think of dark places, I don't think of a dark place for me to go to is telling somebody like, hey, I can't make it to your barbecue.

Well, I was just thinking of something that could be common.

I don't know, but I mean, it could be a dark place to a pleaser, or like I said, going against your parents or saying like, hey, telling your parents. No, that doesn't seem like a dark place for me either.

Well, your parents are very kind and didn't have to, but there are many people—

but I understand what you're saying. Since everybody's different, there are those people who it's hard for them to say no. So then going to a dark place for them could be having to say no.

Yes.

Or going— like, my dark places would be very different than their dark places.

You have very dark places. Absolutely.

In my mind.

Well, good thing you have your writing to help you work that out.

Yeah, I feel like usually I don't really have to go to dark places. I have to more just kind of like hype myself up. Like if I'm feeling like I need a breakthrough, whether it's like hitting another writing sprint or tackling the next project, I just need to like psych myself up, maybe listen to some dubstep, drink lots of coffee, and like get myself psyched up and pumped up and ready to go. One thing that I learned about myself a few years ago is that especially when I'm doing something physical like a training, like I already have enough get up and go inside of me that I don't really need outside sources to help like pump me up or motivate me. Like there's already enough madness inside of me to do that by itself. So a lot of times maybe I don't have to go to such dark places. Like I just need to like internal psych myself up and get after it.

Yeah. Well, I think, uh, so I was reading about becoming a monster would be— we're always told to be virtuous, do no harm, and sheath your competitive instinct. So that means we have to not feel like we have to fit a certain mold of virtuosity, not being afraid of stepping on others, not squashing them intentionally, but not being afraid of it and also being willing to be competitive. And that means there are going to be winners and there are going to be losers. There may also be winners and other winners, right? It's not a zero-sum game in all instances. So going back to what you were saying is you don't have those fears. How do you control the beast, the savage, the monster, and keep it in check.

I feel like we— I need to, uh, point my savage towards productive things. So whether that means, uh, waking up at 5 AM, kind of like dulls my blade a little bit. Writing 4,000 words a day, that's my normal word count, dulls my blade a little bit. It's like giving that savage productive places to run. So waking up early, writing 4,000 words, working out 5 times a week— I work out 5 times a week— all of that helps keep my savage in check. And I can, like what you were saying before, how emotions make poor rulers but good servants. So I have that emotion, those emotions of that drive and get up and go and all that insanity and chaos that resides within me on a day-to-day basis, pointing all that towards productive things.

So comfort is a terrible master. Emotions are a terrible master. Beast mode savage within us is a terrible master. Yeah, all of these things make good servants.

Yes, like you have to master those things and then they can work for you.

Absolutely. So you're kind of at the head of all of that, directing them and leading them. So it's not in a passive space. You're very active and engaged.

Yeah, I think we just talked about this. I don't think we talked about on the podcast, but like when back's against the wall, whether it's a workout, whatever it might be. For me, it's usually when I'm working out, I'm exercising, uh, when I'm doing different things that are having to, um, require me to dig deeper to find another level. What do you visualize? And you said you don't visualize anything. I can't—

I don't think so. I was thinking about that when I was working out earlier this week. I just don't. I visualize it being executed, like it is done, it's already done. And if I know that it's already done and already know that I'm capable of doing it, the only thing left to do is to do it.

Or I'm on the other hand, I've always visualized one of those wolves from World of Warcraft, kind of like a massive wolf, like the size of a horse, but he has fangs like a saber-toothed tiger.

Interesting.

Um, that's what I imagine. And he's in a cage, he's always there, he's like roaring to get out. And when I need him, we open the cage. That's like the visualization that comes. And he's working for me, not against me, helping me to like push through whatever workout. I really don't have to use him when it comes to writing, but every once in a while I need him in the gym when I— like, if there's another set or something that I'm not sure I'm going to be able to do, I just give it to him. He takes care of business.

That's something that I'm learning to tap into in a more physical space when it comes to karate.

Oh yeah, should we talk and tell them about you kicking ribs?

Yes. So I'm in the sparring stage now. I have no problem, no fear taking a hit, totally comfortable with that for some reason, um, but it's following through when I need to hit others. And so my sensei wanted me to sidekick him, you know, it's all controlled, but that's like the thing is I couldn't follow through on a sidekick on him and a round kick on my sparring partner practice partner. And so some of the little things that I think he said had big impact was by not following through, it could do more damage to myself and to my partner, you know, in a different sparring situation. So to develop those habits now of a good follow-through on a kick and a round kick, and to be— how will my aim be target-specific? Is another one. When we were practicing blocking a kick and countering with like a side gut rib punch, and so being able to do it with such intention and ferocity. He told me, disrespect my leg, don't just tap it down or push it down, disrespect it. It is in your space. And I think that's the thing is that we're so conscientious of respecting others and being delicate and courteous and always thinking about 2 steps, 3 steps ahead of what they need, what do they prefer, what do they like, and making everybody comfortable that I think that has been drilled into me. I've drilled that into myself so much that I need to be able to unleash that at will.

And I'm the opposite where I'm always angry at any given point.

You're like Hulk.

Oh, I have to do different things to control that anger and use that anger in different ways. Or like, Jen, what did your sensei say, that you have a kind soul?

He said I had a kind soul. Like, we were making eye contact and my foot was up against his ribs and I could feel like his flesh, and as it rubbed against the bones of his ribs, and knowing I needed to like press into it, and like there's just something—

I can't say the word flesh, you're making fun of me for saying the word.

Depends on the context. Yeah, that depends on the context. And you said a worse word, starts with an M and ends with a—

I don't know what's happening. Okay, uh, so yeah, so it's funny, when Jen was telling me that story that she has a hard time, uh, kicking or hitting other people, that I'm— I was actually on the opposite end because I do boxing. Jen goes to karate and I box. So my coach was holding up a pad for me, uh, on his side. And then he was telling me, you know, we're practicing power. So I was hitting as hard as I could, and I noticed like when I was hitting as hard as I could, I would make him not stumble backward, but like he would absorb the punch and it would take him like a couple feet backward. He'd have to come reset. So every single time I hit the pad, I just thought, uh, I was trying to make him go further and further.

But the goal of that was to use it hard, right?

Yeah.

Okay.

To make sure I can break his base and he has to take a step, a few steps back before he comes back and holds the— but it's funny because I had like no— my initial instinct was like, I wonder how hard I can hit this and how far I can make him like, you know, stumble backwards or whatever it is. Where your initial inclination is you don't want to even hit somebody holding the pad.

Right.

That's interesting. Yeah. I wonder if that says something about us.

How are you doing with taking hits?

Good. I don't, uh, you told me I can't.

Don't, like, don't take him to the head.

Yeah, for everybody who may or may not know, or may know, I have sustained multiple concussions in my life from like motorcycle accidents, car accidents, boxing— not this round of boxing, but a previous time boxing— all kinds of jiu-jitsu, all kinds of different fun stuff. So when I started boxing this time Jen made me sign a blood oath that I would not—

a living trust oath—

that I would not spar, so I wouldn't take any more shots to my head. So I guess to your point, when we practice, we do practice blocks. So I am blocking, so he is hitting me, but I always have intentionally a fist up or an arm up to absorb the blow. We're doing different like weaves and different moves, but yeah, I don't really take like intentional blows. Like I'm always blocking the blows.

Okay, so being a monster, savage, animal, whatever it is, is about knowing that deep potential within you and deciding to lock it up and when to harness it for your benefit.

So maybe another way to say it too is how we read that article when— I'm just going to keep on going back to working out. Because that's a perfect example, but it could be anything. When your body starts experiencing discomfort, you're experiencing that discomfort at the 40% capacity of what you're able to actually do. So just an example, everybody knows what a squat is. So doing a squat. So you could do a series of squats. The very first time you start feeling discomfort, which would mean it starts getting hard or your muscles start burning, you're starting to sweat, that discomfort, you're at the 40% mark. And I feel like a lot of people will stop there when you still have— you've kept on pushing through it— 60% more to give. So I think those monsters and those savages are taking it past that 40% discomfort mark and going into that extra 60%. And even though we use working out as an example, you can do that anything, whether it's writing or whether it's running ads. Or whether it's creating art, sooner or later there's going to be some sort of discomfort. And where most people would stop, those savages continue on.

Absolutely. And I'm working on digging deep to pull that out. And you're working on making sure it stays— it's directed where it needs to be.

Right. So even like for you, like when you were talking about doing all that coding where you felt like you're in trance in the matrix, drinking your Red Bulls, So that might be uncomfortable for some people to get into it, but you were willing to push through and to finish it, to finish all the different coding stuff that you had to finish.

Yeah, that's another example. Well, looks like we've got some more savage things to do today.

So if we ever call anybody a savage, it's a good thing.

Oh yeah, absolutely. Well, aren't you trying to be it?

Yes, you're trying to be a full-time savage, trying to be a full-time savage and attack everything that I do with intentionality and intensity. Even hanging out with the kids, like hanging out with the kids in the afternoons. I'm on duty while Jen works. So yes, we definitely do have screen time because I think it's important that the kids learn to monitor and gauge their own screen time. So instead of me saying, nope, no screen time ever, I say, hey, let's do X, Y, and Z. Like, let's do some chores, let's go outside and play, let's go read books, and then let's have some screen time. So I can teach them kind of like, you know, you get done what you need to get done first, and then screen time is an extra thing that if we have time for, we can do. And then we put a limit on screen time. And they've learned already— I know that they've learned because they're okay with like turn it off and on just for a little bit— that there are certain things that need to be done, and then screen time is extra. And I know that they will get to the point where they will be able to monitor and gauge their own screen time. So they go, okay, I've only been on, watched a show for 30 minutes. I know I need to go do something else.

Yes.

But yeah, so when I'm hanging out with kids, I bring out that same drive or intensity, like going outside and playing. Like when they're watching screen time, I'm not gonna lie, I do get on my phone, check my messages and stuff like that. But when it's that time to do our reading or time to do our chores or time to go outside and play, like we attack it. We do not go gentle into anything that we do. Uh, right now outside we're building a big jungle gym. So I was telling our daughter like, hey, they're helping. Like, they were— I made them carry— all of us carried all the different pieces from the garage to the backyard to start assembling it. And I was telling her like, hey, this is not going to be a project that we finish like in 2 days. This is going to take a week, maybe even longer, like maybe even multiple weeks. But we will finish this because I'm working at their pace. I'm not like going off and doing it my own. Like they're act— the 2-year-old and the 6-year-old are actively helping. So it's going— sometimes that can be frustrating for me too because I feel like, oh man, it'd be so much easier if I just screwed in this bolt, and it'd be so much easier if I just worked on it. I could probably finish it maybe, maybe in a day, maybe, maybe 2 days if I just did it myself. But that's not the process. I'm trying to teach them to be savages too, and whatever they do, that they attack it. And that, uh, when they get frustrated, because that's what's happened the couple times because it's a big set. When they get frustrated, we take a break and we reassess, and they understand, like, hey, this isn't going to get finished today. This is going to be something that's going to require days of work.

And even when Joe gets frustrated on stuff, or you see that she's got this energy, sort of restlessness, we teach her to harness it. So telling her, calm down, don't have energy, which is just kind of asinine to ask a 6-year-old. It's Great. Do you have energy? What can we do with this energy? And not as a punishment, as you're being punished for having energy. It's what, what can we do that's productive? Let's get up and go outside and play. Let's go practice our karate. Let's go get strong with push-ups. Instead of saying, you know, go do push-ups, like, let's do push-ups and let's do jumping jacks. One of my favorite things to see is, especially like on rainy days or something, or if they're not quite well enough to, to go outside, um, Jonathan will do jumping jacks and push-ups and burpees and all of that right alongside her. And the great thing, and I know that it's got the right sort of tone to it, is that our 2-year-old will get down and try to do it all too because he sees it as a fun thing, not like a timeout or something. So I think at any level being able to identify those natural instincts within us and then learning how to— or like Jonathan's doing, is teaching our families and our others to harness it and use it.

Yeah, because she started doing push-ups, especially in karate, to have them do push-ups. So when she's running around the house, she'd be running around the house and then also like yelling or screaming and stuff like that. So like, hey, that's good, it looks like you have a lot of energy. Let's do something good with that energy so you don't get in trouble. Let's go ahead and go do our push-ups. Let's go do some jumping jacks. If it's not raining, we can go outside. Let's go outside and play. Let's go do something with all that energy. So instead of you getting in trouble for screaming and running inside the house with all that energy, let's do something productive. So then, like what Jen was saying, like, I want to make sure I lead by example. So I'll get down with her and do push-ups. We'll do jumping jacks together. And we're not talking about like 1 or 2. 100. We've done, uh, 100 jumping jacks, and then one time we did do 100 push-ups.

What?

Uh, usually I— we start with maybe like 20 push-ups, and then I ask her like, if you still have energy, that's good, it's okay, let's do more push-ups, let's do something constructive with all that energy that you're feeling, or practice your karate. So we'll do push-ups together, and she did 100 push-ups before.

I didn't know that. She's so strong. Yeah, proper push-ups.

Yeah, and not— of course not all at once. It was like 20 pushups and then she needs a break. And then we did like 10 pushups and then she would take a break. And then it was like 5 pushups and take a break. But we just kept on going. And again, that full-time savage comes out because you bring out the intensity. Like when we're doing this, it's not like, okay, well, here we go. We're going to do some pushups now. And I do the same thing when I work out. Sorry, not when I work out, when I write. When I'm writing, I'm not going to the keyboard Like, okay, well, I don't know what I'm gonna write. I'm not really sure. I don't want to be here. It's like, uh, you bring the intensity and you— I attack the keyboard with whatever's going on. Skrillex is like pumping, uh, some dark cello. I like cello music too. So just cello music. So just cello music is going and like we're getting into it. We're getting after it. Do not go gentle into that good night. Rage against the dying of the light by Dylan Thomas. All right, I have that tattooed on my body in case you're wondering.

Well, on that note, I know it's not a joke. Uh, well, on that note, I think we've given a lot of people to think about, and we'd love to hear kind of where you are on your spectrum of learning how to tap into your beast mode, or is it something you're still learning to control, and kind of where you are on that journey.

Yeah, and I think I would rather deal with people who are savages, even if they don't have it under control, as opposed to people who don't have it. Because I feel like if you have that intensity and that drive, you can teach people where to direct it, as opposed to if somebody doesn't have it at all. I think that would be much harder to create.

Excuse me. I think the other way around. Actually, I'm good with either. I think it can be taught because it's in everybody.

Are you okay?

My throat's tickling.

All right, on that note, we're gonna go take care of you.