In this seminar segment, Speaker A presents a framework for evaluating and managing people based on the outcomes they produce rather than their titles, tasks, or personal attributes. He introduces the Be‑Do‑Have model—derived from L. Ron Hubbard’s research—explaining that the only valuable element is the "have" (the result). The talk explores why ideas often stall, describing a hierarchy of resistance: internal self‑doubt, the physical effort required to act, and external opposition from others. Through vivid examples (a baker, a salesperson, a doctor, a boxer, a mechanic) he shows how each profession’s true value lies in the tangible result (sold bread, cash, healthy clients, reliable cars, etc.). He then critiques conventional hiring interviews that focus on past roles and behaviors, arguing they are time‑consuming, subjective, and miss the core metric of contribution. Instead, he advocates a rapid, data‑driven assessment that predicts a candidate’s ability to generate results, supplemented by personality testing as a secondary “software” layer. The overall message is that organizations should pay for and evaluate people based on the measurable results they deliver, using a systematic approach to filter out resistance and focus on productivity.
Chapters
And so if we look more at this thing of production, we're going to look at this actually in quite some detail for the rest of the seminar because this is the key factor. And so we look at it actually results. To get results, we go through a certain cycle. And that cycle starts off with— is the first thing is a person has to be. Something. You know, they need to be the electrician or they need to be the salesperson. Okay, and then, you know, then they actually have to do something. So if they're an electrician, what they have to do is they have to do the electrical work. That's very basic. And then what we then will get is some sort of result or a have. And we call this this Be-Do-Have. This very basic information, in fact all the information that we draw off for our research and evaluation and for knowing about people is actually based on the works of L. Ron Hubbard. You probably know this guy because he started the Church of Scientology and he did a lot of research into individuals and groups. We use that information as a basis of our technology. And he went on to say that this sequence often gets considerably confused. You know, this gets confused from as like young children. We ask children like, you know, what is it do you want to do in life or what is it you want to be in life? And so our focus gets moved to be and do. But in actual fact, the only thing that has value is have or the result. So in your organization, you can't pay for a person's position and you can't pay for what they do. You can only pay for the result they get. Would you agree? Yes. And so, you know, when you ask young children like, you know, what do you want to do in life or what do you want to be? They always quite often pick, you know, strong beingnesses like police, you know, because they have a uniform or a ballerina because they have a costume. And so this is where our attention starts to move More of have and it moves up the scale back to be. And so if we look at this in more detail, we could say that the idea is the be. We have action, which is the do, and then the result, which is the have. And every person has a lot of ideas. You know, we all have many times more ideas than we do actually get things into action. You watch the news, you read the, Read the newspaper and go, wow! This whole climate thing and this carbon tax. Wow! There's so I know so many ways we could solve this better. But of course, you know, you put the newspaper down and you go back off and do what you're doing. And you know, for some people, they're just full of ideas, and that's about it. You meet an old school friend at a reunion, and he tells you this idea. He's like, yeah, yeah, I've got this supplier in China. They're going to give me this product, and I can match it up. I've got this database here in Australia. These guys, they want it. And it's like we've got this whole internet system, and it's like automated, and da da da. And they And you go, wow, that's such a good idea. You're a little bit jealous. And then you see this guy 3 years later at the next reunion. You go, hey, I had that idea. He's like, which one was that? And of course we need to get an idea into action. And for some people they go into action and it's like, you know, they have the handbrake on and the foot flat on the accelerator. There's a lot of smoke, a lot of noise. You know, a lot of skidding around, but there's actually no— they're not achieving much. You know, husband and wife, they're working 2 jobs each and they're, you know, slogging it out. But you know, they're still renting their house. They can't afford to buy it. And so, you know, and in the workplace we can see a lot of busy people sometimes, but it's like, it's not always the person that's the busiest is actually the most effective. And what we know is that when we put something into action, we pump— we have this thing called resistance. You know, ideas don't generally have so much resistance. But now you go, okay, I'm going to put this into action. And the first resistance you bump into is, you know, your own. So maybe I'm not good enough to do this, or, you know, if it was such a good idea, everyone else would have done it. And, you know, maybe John, he won't agree with it. So, man, how Yeah, maybe I shouldn't do it. But okay, person pushes through that resistance and now they've actually got to move the body. And you know, minimally they've got to like pick up the phone or send an email or discuss something with someone, or they might have to go pick up a shovel and start digging, whatever the idea is. But that's the next level of resistance. And that can be so great sometimes, you know, that I could be just watching TV and you're really enjoying this show and the show ends and And I have the idea that, you know, I don't like this new show. I'm gonna change the channel. And then I look around, I see where the remote control is. And I go, hmm, maybe I'll just watch this show. And so we know the next level of resistance is like, you know, now you start to put some physical activity to get the idea into place. And then you've got now other people's Resistance. So you sit down and go, I've got this great idea. We're going to do this. Ah, you know that got tried ages ago. You're just wasting your time on that. No, no, no. I really think it'll work. No, that's crazy. And so now we have other resistance. We get other people on board. And so really, what we need to know when we're dealing with people is can they push through this resistance? And of course, if the answer or what manifests if they push through that resistance is we get. A result. And it's the result that we're looking for. Because we know that if the result is there, okay, then we can assume that the idea and the action, the be and the do, are okay. Does this make sense? And it's like we don't really need to get caught up in these 2 things, you know, until we know that there's some result. If we look at this a little bit further, let's say we have a baker. Okay, so what's a baker? He bakes bread, right? And so that's his do. And then what do we have? Sold bread. Sorry? He sells bread. Yeah, that's right. We have bread that can be sold. If the bread tastes good and people want to buy it and it can be made for a lot less than it costs, we actually have a result. We have something valuable. If we have a salesperson, same thing. He's there, he sells, and what result do we get? Cash money. Yeah, exactly. We get sales, whether it's a signed order or, you know, whatever his part of the result is. Sometimes he's got to collect the cash, sometimes it's just a contract. And everything exists in this state. If we look at it, we had the baker, then, you know, we have a doctor. What's a doctor do? Hey? Consults. Yeah. But what's he actually, you know, he does consult, but how would you describe that in more detail? He heals people. Yeah, a champion. And so what's the result for a doctor? Money. Sure, yeah. But what is the result that we can actually pay a doctor for or should pay a doctor for?
Healthy.
Yeah, exactly. Healthy clients. They're not even patients anymore. You know, wouldn't it be nice to get a doctor And you know, Medicare surveys you a month later. Should we pay the doctor? No, no, no, I still have the rash. Okay, we're not paying him. What about a boxer? What does a boxer do?
Fights.
Yeah, he trains and fights. And what's the result? Yeah, unconsciousness. But it's quite interesting, you know. Yeah, actually for quite some years I did like martial arts and then got into kickboxing as a young bloke. And then I got into the ring and the first fight I ever had, it's like, actually I loved the beingness, you know, you're in the ring and I love to do, I love to train and fight. But you know what I didn't like about it was the result. I couldn't hit people hard. And I'd always pull my punches and say, you know, I realize it's like, okay, I'll train and fight and I have a different product. Being in the ring for me wasn't the product I liked. And so that's one of the issues, you know. Someone might want to be a doctor, you know, because they think, ah, doctors are so important and everyone looks up to them. But this is the beingness. Then when they look at what they gotta do, oh really, I gotta put gloves on and put my hands there? Hah. And you know, so you can see that it's the result we're looking for. And if a person goes, you know, I really Like to help people and I really want to help them with their physical issues. Now they look at this and they go, and so I'm willing to do the do. And okay, so this is the beingness I need to take up. So I'll spend the time at university. What about a mechanic? He fixes cars and obviously what you want is a reliable car that makes it to the next service. And the problem is, is you know, with so many technicians, they don't realize that this is really the have. or the result they need to get. And so when you talk to a technician when something hasn't worked out, you go, listen, you know, that thing you fixed, it's broken again. I don't get it, I fixed it. I did this, I did that. Okay, that's cool, but it's not reliable. And so the more you can get tradesmen especially to focus in this area, because like you, you know, I've employed a lot of service guys and it's like really can be quite tough to get some of them to realize that it's like their job is actually to create reliability. Not just to go in there and make it work again. So if we look at the regular hiring interview, it goes into a lot of the beings. It's like, okay, so what job did you have before? And tell me, what did you do there? And, you know, after, you know, before that job, what were you doing in there? And, you know, what did you do there? And it goes back and forth. Like, tell me about this. And how would you handle this situation? And, you know, and it's like what we call the do-be-do interview. It's like, it's all about the do-be, the be-do. And these interviews can take quite a lot of time. And, you know, sometimes there's a panel of 4 people that do these interviews and they interview 4 candidates in a day. So, you know, the cost starts to get very expensive. And at the end of the day, they meet, the 4, the panel of 4 meet together and they go, now, so we've got to work out which person we're going to hire. And the discussion starts, well, you know, candidate number 1, he came 5 minutes late. We can't hire people that come late. No. And I was like, yeah, but you know, candidate 3, she was just so intelligent, enthusiastic. It's like, I really liked her. It's like, yeah, yeah, but you know, she was wearing one of those TAG Heuer watches. Remember? Remember that lady from 4 years ago wearing the TAG Heuer watch? She stole money off us. And this goes back and forth for some hours, and normally what comes out of it is like, I think we should interview Candidates 1 and 3 again. And so the next day or the next week they have another interview and, you know, but really it's a little bit of quite grey area. Whereas if you can just have some system that can look at this area first, it can take 5 or 10 minutes. We say 10 to 15, but you can get really proficient at this. It can take a few minutes just to know whether you should continue on and look at the next factor or not. And when you can start to actually value a person based on their contribution and how much value they can add to an organization, a lot of feeling goes out of it and a lot more real data goes into the whole side of it. And of course, feeling is the personality section. You don't wanna have feelings about a person's productivity. You wanna be able to know and look and see it. With— Personality? For sure. You know, we have testing systems that can allow you a lot of information about personality, but it's still— this is, you know, and as much as it's scientific, it's still— it's not the hard— what we'd say the hardware side of a person. It's the software side of a person.
