The Myth of Work-Life Balance in Real Estate (and What to Do Instead) with Jordan Quaresma | Ep 064

When you're an early stage team leader who's built your business on a very high level of customer care, you need to constantly figure out how to spread your time and attention appropriately across your clients, your agents, your systems and your processes and your life. But instead of seeking balance, Jordan Korezma has figured out integration. The leader of a three agent one staff approximately four year old team that did more than $50 million in volume last year, Jordan shares how he's brought harmony into his life and how building the team helped pay special attention for the story of turning a cold opportunity years ago not just into what at the time was his largest transaction, but also into several referrals and into a partner in a rental property business being the snowplow for your agents giving away a fifteen thousand dollar travel voucher hating video even though you're five years into doing it every single week. There's so much to learn and enjoy right now with Jordan Korezma on Real Estate Team os.

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Profitably with an operating system. Welcome to Team os, your guide to starting, growing and optimizing real estate team. Here's your host, Ethan Butte.

Jordan, thank you so much for being a subscriber to Real Estate Team os. Thank you for replying to one of my emails. So glad we connected to that. And now thank you for joining me for this episode of Real Estate Team os.

Great Ethan, thanks for having me on. I'm an avid listener like you mentioned and looking forward to, looking forward to the questions.

Is there anything that we have not discussed in these episodes that you wish was discussed more often?

So here's, here's the challenge that we run into some with some of these episodes. Obviously the content is fantastic. We have some of the biggest team leaders we get to listen to and get to get a peek inside their minds and how they operate their businesses and everything like that too. But sometimes here in Canada, in the small town in Canada, running a smaller team, it's hard to relate to some of these larger markets, larger teams, how they operate. Of course it's great to hear and it's great to strive for, but the smaller teams that are, you know, probably more hands on than a lot of the, maybe the other team leaders are just different challenges. So I think it's, it's finding the similarities. Even though a team might be 100 people, there is still similarities in a team of three or a team of five. So I mean I wish I had an exact answer for your question, but I, I don't think I do in terms of. There's an exact pinpoint, but just those similarities in the terms of the scale I think is the biggest thing.

Yeah, I appreciate that very much. And it's funny, when I started the show, you know, I was thinking about like, what is this going to be? Who is it for? What are we doing? What aren't we doing? I certainly had a very strong interest in diversity. And that of course takes all kinds of different forms including, you know, identity, theme, size of team, geography, etc. And so I appreciate you coming on and representing what I would generally call a smaller team. As you identified there now, small but mighty, you and two other agents along with a little, along with a small but mighty staff did over $50 million last year. So we'll get into, we'll get into all that, but you know where I'm going next. And that is a must have characteristic of a high performing team. As you hear that question on these episodes, you hear others answers. What comes to mind for you?

You know, I was thinking about this one for a while, Ethan, to figure out what, you know, what's a good answer to this question. I've heard some great ones. So I mean, I don't know how I'll compare to that. But I think the biggest thing is accountability. I think when I look at a high performing team, of course every team has values and a mission whether they state it or not, everyone has that. But a high performing team I think has accountability. Like if you look at a very high performing sports team, there's always a figure there that keeps everyone accountable, but they're, the fact that they're accountable to themselves rubs off in everyone else. You look at a Tom Brady, you plant, you hear all the stories about people that played with Tom Brady. You don't mess with Tom Brady in practice, he's going to throw you a pass. If you drop it, he's going to yell at you. Right? But he's also accountable to himself. He's the first guy there, last guy to leave. He's putting the time in to watch film. He's doing everything like that. So I think a high performing team has a lot of accountability, whether it's personal accountability and just team accountability. And that's like, that's the expectation in.

A much larger organization with a lot of new agents coming in. You know, it's, we have very clear specific standards. You do this, you do that, you do this so many times a day. You do that so many times a week. And if you don't, then we're going to maybe take you off leads or have a conversation or coach you up or whatever the case may be. I would assume at your size, that accountability is a little bit baked in to who you've started this team with. I mean, I'm. I don't know. And we'll get into, you know, the duration of your relationship with Phil and Lindsay, the two other agents on the team. Um, but what is accountability at the stage of your team right now?

Well, I think it's a lot, like, a lot more direct than it probably would be at a major team where they. There's different layers. And to the team leader, right, I'm directly accountable. I have to be accountable for my actions as a team leader. I have to practice what I preach. I have to kind of trailblaze in a way, be that snowplow that kind of pushes everything out of the way. But. But for the benefit of our team, right, I have to try new technologies that will hopefully be more efficient for our agents. I have to really push myself because I can't expect a team to push themselves if I'm not pushing myself. Now, with that said, everyone's. You're accountable to your goals, but everyone's goals are different. And that's something that's kind of evolved for me over time as a team leader. I think in my early days, I was. I thought everyone was just like me. Everybody just wants to make, as you know, as much money as possible, make our clients happy, push ourselves to the absolute limit. It's dinner time. I'm on my phone. I'm on vacation. I'm on my. I thought everyone wanted to be like me. Why wouldn't you want to be like me? And then life hit and you realize everyone's point of view is a little bit different. Their background's a little different, their family situation is different. They're just. Their overall goals are different. So it's my job to. Whatever they set out to do themselves, I gotta help them get there. Whatever that goal might be, it might be a more balanced life in this industry, which is tough, but it's doable. It could be. I want to push myself to the absolute maximum and finding what they're good at. Having them commit to something and keeping them to that commitment, which is ultimately the accountability aspect of it, and having them. You know, if you're saying you wanted to make X amount of dollars and help this many families, well, you should be doing at Least this. And if you're not doing this well, then you can't be surprised when you're not getting the results. Or maybe the results aren't here yet, but you should be doing those activities to kind of hopefully get you there.

So you sound like someone who holds yourself to a high standard. You sound like a hard worker. These are themes that I typically hear talking with people in your seat in these conversations a lot. Why don't you run us up through, like, when and why you got into the industry and when and why team became something that you started thinking about and then ultimately, of course, pursuing.

Yeah. So, I mean, early days of my career to get into real estate, I gave it absolutely no thought, and that's a terrible answer, but I was working in the sales industry in the field, my field, when I graduated school, and I met a realtor and a broker at a golf tournament as a part. I was actually working the golf tournament, and I met the broker and. And a team leader at the time. And they're like, hey, you should get into real estate. I said. And essentially in my mind, I said, okay. Gave it no thought. I was friends with the. With the team leader's brother. We both got into the. We started the course together, and that's it. That's how we got into real estate. I worked for that gentleman's team to start out under that broker. And that's how we. That's how I started in real estate. Gave it no thought. I just knew I was working a sales job with more high volume, working with more clients, less touches, less essentially commissions per. Right. So like, you're. You're almost like a machine. You're just pumping, pumping things out. And I really like dealing with the bigger clients that, you know, needed more attention, more care. You got to know them. I was working in sports, so I worked for a sports team, so I worked in ticketing and corporate sales. So if it was a corporate partner, I really like dealing with corporate partners and bringing the mascot up to the box so they could meet their son or daughter, can meet the mascot, you know, getting to know them and stuff like that. So when I started the real estate course, oh, wow. This is actually like right on my avenue. That passive recruiting attempt at that golf tournament by that broker and the team leader. I mean, it kind of worked. I was. I was into it. So that's how it kind of started. And then the early years, as you know, that kind of settled in. I was young, I was living at home, you know, not a lot of costs. So I could afford to just work. I didn't have. I didn't have kids at the time, didn't have a partner. All I did. All I did was work. So open houses every weekend, meeting with clients as much as possible. The early days, not much was happening. And I was starting to get a little discouraged not knowing what. What did I get myself into? You know, this is way more difficult than I thought it was or that I obviously did not think it was because I didn't think anything at the time. But then everything started to click and I think I started to realize that relationships go a long way and that. But at the same time, relationships take time. So you're. My only focus was to do the absolute maximum I could do for a client. If I got one client, I was gonna treat them like absolute gold. And at the time, I was just doing. That's what I thought we had to do. But then I thought. And then once deals closed, they were really happy with everything. Referrals started to happen and repeat business started to happen. I was like, oh, wow, okay, so one could turn into three or one could turn into five. Who knows what this can turn into?

How much time from, sure, I'll take the courses and join your team inside this brokerage to. Oh, my gosh, you know, this person just sent me a second referral. What period of time was that? Because, you know, the dynamic is very clear. Relationships are the most valuable thing we have, and they do take time. Like, what was that time window? Approximately.

Yeah. So, I mean, I think that adjustment period when I first started was about two years. I think that, you know, I was selling homes, working predominantly with buyers, so still pretty young. So a lot of people my age were starting to buy homes. First time buyers working, open houses, kind of meeting people here and there.

But was the team providing leads in addition to that, or was open houses your primary?

Yeah, the team was providing leads at the time and good guidance and everything too. So that kind of helped me along my way. And there was kind of like a shift happened. So to share a story here. So I was started on a team. I was with my friend who was the team leader's brother at the time. We were a team of, I believe, six at that time. So again, a smaller team. And there was a shift. So the team was going to another brokerage, but I stayed behind. So that changed everything. So I made the hard decision of actually staying at my existing brokerage under the broker that I had. We were kind of like in the middle of a project and like, I just, I couldn't go. I felt kind of bad for leaving. I wanted to stay behind. I, like, I meshed with all, everyone, but I meshed with him on a personal level as well. I just felt it was the right decision to stay. But at the same time, I went from team environment to just on my own. And I kind of had to figure.

It out solo instantly, like overnight.

Yeah, immediately solo. And I think where it all happened, where everyone from, okay, this is just helping people to helping people, that creates referrals and continual business. I actually had a client that, you know, an exit meeting with a team, you kind of divvy up the leads. This person here, you work with this person. This person not. So they're like, yeah, you can, you can work with this lead. He's never going to buy a house. So. Okay, that's quite the quite the handoff.

Challenge accepted.

Challenge accepted. And it turns out this, this gentleman, if I could share. Probably a little bit longer story than necessary, but we searched far and wide for a home. Him and his wife are both physicians, so they had a decent budget. Looking in our marketplace, where I had the privilege of looking at a bunch of like, beautiful homes. It was probably the nicest first time home purchase I think anyone would really make in the marketplace. So I was having fun with it. But at the same time, we're looking at a bunch of homes, they were still deciding where they wanted to be in the city, running through so many different decisions. They put an offer on a really nice waterfront home. They were going through their conditional, their conditional period, went through home inspection, everything. They want to do some drastic renovations to the house. It was restricted because it was on water and the floodplain and everything like that. Everything was fine. Two days before they're ready to remove their conditions, he calls me, he says, hey. He sounded very nervous on the phone. Yeah, we're like, we're all good to go. I think, you know, we like it. It's going to be good. It's going to be good. And I could tell he was like, this guy does not like in this house at all. So I said, you sure you want to make sure you want to buy it? You don't seem too excited. He's like, oh, you know, funny you mentioned that. No, I don't think it's the right one for us. I think I'm really worried about the renovations and how it's going to alter the house and, you know, it's not going to be what we want. I said, no problem, we will we'll just release for the transaction here. It's not going to work for you. Financing is tight as well because you're going to have to do these renovations too. And it's going to become a lot more complicated as well. So, yeah, let's walk away from this. He's like, what? And I'm like, yeah, yeah, no problem. We'll walk away from. I didn't know any better. I just was helping the guy out. He didn't seem very happy with. He didn't seem happy with his transaction. So we backed out of the deal. It would have been probably triple the amount of volume we would ever done in the before in the past for myself. And that's where the kind of the relationship started. He's like, he, he had, I had his trust, right? He, he trusted me, I trusted him. It was kind of mutual, but with me saying that one. He actually came to an open house two weeks later. He gifted me an Apple watch for not getting him through the deal. So I was like, okay, interesting. And we kept the hunt going. And there was a late night on a Friday and I was scrolling through Twitter like anyone would maybe on a late night on a Friday or Thursday, whatever. And house popped up, wasn't on the market, was in the neighborhood where he was looking. It was a tear down home, exactly what he would want. Not on the market or anything, just some agent just randomly put it on Twitter. It was just, hey, if anyone's looking for a waterfall home in this neighborhood, let me know. I messaged him right away. We got to see the house the next day. He bought it. He built a beautiful home. He destroyed what was there. Built a beautiful home to their. The dream home that, the home they always wanted. They were able to build it. And that man has referred me to everyone he's ever known. We're great friends. We have a business together where we buy rental properties together. But from that day, it meant if you advise and do the right thing and do whatever you can for your clients, they will take care of you. If you take care of them, they'll take care of you. It's not always direct that way, but if you take care of them, they'll take care of you. And you know, one client could turn to three clients, three clients can turn into nine clients, and so on and so forth. So that's how it kind of really happened. And then from there, I mean, we just kept doing what we can for our clients. And then we had to. Then we got overwhelmed and the team had to kind of happen.

First of all, a, that if I was a real estate professional, that is how I would operate. I think, you know, I've worked in a and had exposure to a variety of different industries. And this dynamic that you're describing. One, there are sales roles that are highly, highly transactional, high volume, and they're not like super satisfying, although they might be enriching depending on what you're selling and what your cut of it is. But this level of satisfaction and going deep is a thing. But then this idea of truly acting in someone's best interest, I think that's what, you know, all the best people do anyway. I mean, I just mean by like good, solid human beings. But when in your example, when it's so obvious that it's in their interest, but it's not in your interest from a rational perspective, like from an immediate rational perspective, that's where trust is like instantly layered. So I love that it's turned into a variety of referrals and a property business with him. I assume then that the dawn of the team was driven by a healthy database of people who were referring you initially started by probably some cold opportunities via the team, by the way, that the gentleman that's such a good part of your business today also started as a cold intro, essentially. So you turn that into repeat referral business, and at this point you have more repeat and referral business than you can handle while still delivering the level of care that you think is appropriate. Which I think is probably a good high standard. I'd probably be the same way too. So when you're like, okay, this is too much. What were the. What were the next, like two or three people that you brought around you?

Yeah. So we kind of hit that point where we're getting more repeat and referral business. We're getting lots of new business, whether it was just inquiries online. And we also dealt with builders as well. So we're dealing with a previous builder and then we're getting ready for another project, another builder. So that was always helpful for our business as well, generating leads for teammates. So in terms of like, where we needed to grow, I just, again, Ethan, you'll see a consistency here. I didn't give it any thought. I was just like, okay, I need someone to help me. I'm gonna get another agent. Okay. That's what I did. So not even really thinking about it. I just, I. I knew Phil. Phil was working for one of our builder clients. He was doing a great job for the builder client. I would just run into him Every now and then at their office. He was a licensed agent at our brokerage. Seemed like a really, like just a good, genuine guy. He kind of reminded me of me a little bit, so maybe I could relate. And then eventually we came across each other at an open house. We're both at an open house. And I said, like, are you looking to kind of pursue this real estate thing? Is this something you really want to get into or is it just more of a hobby? And he's like, yeah, I want to get into it. I'm like, okay, do you want to join what would be my team? He's like, yeah, sure. I said, okay, let's do it. And that's how the team was kind of started. Gave it no thought. So that was end of 2020, end of 2019, going into 2020. So his first few months on the team, everything's going fine. And then pandemic hit. And then during that, which was kind of, I mean, not a blessing, this guy. That's a bad way to put it. But it kind of slowed things down for us and it made me just focus in on the team. Right. I wasn't really doing a lot of buying and selling at the time because we're in that kind of weird window of not knowing what was going to happen if we were ever going to sell a house again or go into house again. So we did. I did a lot of training, one on one training with them just like this in a virtual environment. We're doing a lot of training one on one. I was kind of sharing how my philosophies were. I was writing down a lot of my, like, systems in terms of my recipe and how I did things, because again, I didn't give it a lot of thought. So I wasn't ready to have a team. I didn't have a CRM. I didn't have all the tools that you would expect. But we just kind of figured it out. I was lucky during that time to take a leap and hire a coach to kind of help me myself, but also help me growing the team. And I'm super appreciative that I made that decision because again, it was Covid bank accounts were only going down at that point because there's not a lot of house sales going on. So to commit to a coach that wasn't inexpensive was a move that I appreciate. I think it was a turning point for our team because it got me to focus more on, okay, getting back to the systems. You need this, you need that, you definitely get to hire an admin person because you didn't think this through, you're going to be doing all the admin work for your agent now. And I go, oh, yeah, no, you're right. I probably, I'm going to have to be right.

How did you source your coach? Like when you're like, I maybe should get some guidance from someone to make sure that I'm doing some of the right steps or whatever, like, do you just talk to a couple of people you knew? Did you already have someone in mind? Like, how did you select a coach at that stage? And, and when did you realize that coaching was going to be a good investment despite the fact that the financials in an immediate sense didn't say, oh, I'm ready to make a significant investment.

Yeah. So in terms of like finding the right coach, I mean, honestly I was, I was working a lot of model homes for a builder and doing a lot of open houses. So I was between people coming through and I was doing a lot of self education on like YouTube, watching different video series and everything. And I would come across, you know, the same kind of coaching, coaching company doing these videos and these series and an old playlist that I still go back to sometimes because some of it was timeless and knowing that I needed help, I always went to these videos before. So I was like, well, might as well, you know, reach out to these people as a coaching organization to see.

If you were essentially pre sold on who they were, their style, their philosophy, their. Yeah, great, love it that.

It just resonated with me. Resume, what they said. We still do a lot of the things that we've learned in those videos previously. So it's kind of a, when I look back at it, I've never really thought about that even a long time. But when I look back at it, that's essentially how, that's how it happened.

Yeah. So you get set onto the track of you need an admin, you need to build systems and processes. Where did you go for administrative support?

Well, I started to put the feelers out there that I needed help in the admin and marketing side. And so I had to kind of my, you know, my coach told me, hey, make your job description. Get all those tasks that you don't want to do and off your plate free and fill and put them in a job description. So I went on looking for an admin marketing person. Never hired anyone before. Never been in charge of someone like that before. No idea what to expect. I wasn't ready. I didn't have, you know, half the stuff that I should have had previous. But you know what, I just jumped in. So we hired someone on after an interview. It was actually like a family friend kind of connection that we kind of started with. And it helped us. I was probably wasn't the greatest leader because I wasn't sure what I was doing. But it definitely helped to realize, okay, this is what we need in place, this is how we do it. This is kind of what I think I need. But I had a hard time articulating that. So it was kind of getting that. Getting it out and kind of figuring it out and more so getting feedback from Phil and myself on a day to day basis. Okay, what, what do we need to get off our plate so that we can help our, help our clients and not be, you know, focused 100 on the clients. Because if we're going to service at the highest possible level, we can't be thinking about other things and do. Trying to do other things in between all that. So it was that. And also, okay, what can we do for marketing to help us grow and get that word out there of the services that we're providing to our clients? So that's essentially how it kind of went down. And it was, there was good, there was bad, that and also, okay, what can we do for marketing to help us, you know, grow and get that word out there of the services that we're providing to our clients? So that's essentially how it kind of went down. And it was, there was good, there was bad. The first administrator didn't work work out initially. We had someone else and then that one didn't work out. And then my wife stepped in to save the day. So my wife is the marketing admin for our team and it's an amazing dynamic. It's honestly a privilege that I'm able to do that with, you know, with my wife. But she knows how I am. So it knows how I operate and knows me personally, but is also very caring and supportive to the team and to, you know, what we've created for our clients.

What is your team today like? Agents, staff? Like, what is your team like right now as we record this?

So we're three agents, including myself and one administrator, which is my wife.

Okay, so we've covered the whole. Oh, wait, so when, when and why did the second agent join the team?

So second agent joined the team. Lindsey was in 2021 or 20, actually 2022. And we were just growing at a high pace. It was Covid market. We needed more hands on deck. I actually didn't know Lindsey that well. I just knew she had a family. It was a family dynamic. She had. She had a daughter. At the time, I was like, you know what? We need someone that's not like me. You know, we need someone that's. Has a different point of view, has gone through different challenges that she can relate to her clients, and, you know, a different. A different perspective across the board. And so that's how it kind of came about. I met Lindsey, and I was like, this is a perfect fit. And day we shared the value of, you know, really caring, and she's very much like that with her clients. That's. That's priority number one, of course, servicing at a high level. So it was like just a natural fit, and we progressed. But you can imagine when we mentioned earlier, in terms of challenges and goals and accountability, Lindsay's goals are much different than mine at that age, you know, with no kids or anything yet. I. I can't even relate to the challenges that Lindsay goes through on a daily basis in terms of balancing home life, work life, and everything in between. So now that I'm there with my daughter, I can go back to her and be like, listen, you know what? I didn't understand what the challenges you were, I was just looking at from my lens. And now that I've progressed myself through life, I can see it now, and I can even be a better leader for you now because I can see where those gaps are, where you can be more efficient, all those different things that I can help with, but also where you can help me see things that I didn't see before.

So you mentioned that you didn't really have any systems, you know, at a certain point. So describe a little bit how, you know, what systems did you actually then, you know, essentially create process documentation around? Did you put some tech in place? I mean, you mentioned you have a CRM. Like, how did that part of the business go? And how much of that was you? How much of that was your wife? Like, how did the kind of. What is the foundation of the team was essentially the team operating system. How did that kind of come together? And how much of that did you drive versus just support?

Yeah, I think the early days, it was just kind of getting everything down on paper, I mean, typed out, of course, in Google Drive, but, I mean, just getting everything out of my head or in the. Out of what we normally do with a client and just getting it out on paper to find out, you know, what do we even. What do we even do here? Like, obviously, we move around, we do things and we're busy. But what's actually going down? Okay, and what's what, how can we sort that. What can. What tools are out there to help us make that better and get more organized? Because now it's just not me. It's now everyone. So Nicole, my wife, has to see what's going on, that Phil has a listing coming on, or I have a listing coming on. So those, all those systems kind of have to come in place. And with something like Follow Up Boss, we were contactually before we came to Follow Up Boss, but we knew the importance of a CRM, right? We look at Follow Up Boss now as our. It's our epicenter of people. That's what we kind of call it. Because anything about our clients that we have in there, all previous transactions, anniversary dates, birthdays, everything is in related. They're related to our clients. And any kind of new leads and new people coming into our database, we're learning and populating that. And that's where we kind of go to. And then for processes, we use Trello. So a lot of our processing, we use Trello, whether it's trades and transactions. We kind of have a set list of checklists from there that deal with trades and checklists. Same thing with launching a listing. Everything runs through there. And all of our, like we call them, like I call them. I don't know if the team calls them this, but I call them like recipe cards in terms of how we do respective things. If you're meeting with a buyer for a buyer consultation, these are the questions you want to ask. These are the things you want to find out. How do you build a search for them? This is how it all kind of goes down. So went from Word documents to now these kind of cards that have all these things in place that are easily searchable, that we can train, but also they can reflect and go back on and find. And it's forever an endless improvement. Efficient, Making it more efficient.

Has it made you more efficient? I mean, the level of production that the three of you did as agents last year, of course, is impressive. How much did formalizing this stuff help you in the past year in terms of efficiency in production, just yourself.

Significantly, significantly. I feel like, I mean, just having those tools, just having those tools has made everything more efficient because everything is kind of standardized transactions. We kind of have a set list of checklists from there that deal with trades and checklists. Same thing with launching a listing. Everything runs through there. And all of our, like we call them Like I call them, I don't know if the team calls them this, but I call them like recipe cards in terms of how we do respective things. If you're meeting with a buyer for a buyer consultation, these are the questions you want to ask, these are the things you want to find out. How do you build a search for them? This is how it all kind of goes down. So went from so certain emails going out to clients that have just secured a home emails, certain emails with, with point main points of reference, the next steps, everything's laid out that we can go individually and tweak and everything like that per respective deals. But that framework's all there. So each client's getting a similar experience, but not the same because every home is different on the sale line, the same kind of thing. So having Word documents to now these kind of cards that have all these things in place that are easily searchable, that we can train, but also they can reflect and go back on and find and it's forever an endless improvement. Efficient, making it more efficient.

Has it made you more efficient? I mean the level of production that the three of you did as agents last year, of course, is those kind.

Of systems and standardized kind of templates on how to do things has helped me not have to give it a lot of thought being like, okay, I gotta summarize this. I gotta put this all in words. I could be like, no, I got this framework I can use and everything's put into place. And then same thing with like a tool like Follow boss.

Impressive. How much did formalizing this stuff help you in the past year in terms of efficiency in production, just yourself.

Significantly, significantly. I feel like, I mean just having outdoors information on the people that we can capitalize on. So when we're following up with a past client, we have all those details at the ready. And it's not just, you know, chicken scratch on an op ed.

Yeah, chicken or worse, scattered thoughts in your head, you know.

Yes.

At least chicken scratch on a notepad is one step toward that, toward a better system.

How?

To the degree that you're comfortable talking about it. How like what is the relationship with the other agents with regard to, you know, you're providing some of these benefits, you're probably, you probably help them build their own kind of like personal network by extending opportunities to them.

Just having those tools, just having those tools has made everything more efficient because everything is kind of standardized. So certain emails going out to clients that have just secured a home emails, certain emails with, with point main points of reference the next steps, everything's laid out that we can go individually and tweak and everything like that per respective deals. But that framework's all there. So each client's getting a similar experience, but not the same because every home is different on the sale line, the same kind of thing. So having those kind of systems and standardized kind of templates, like from a.

Financial perspective, how has that relationship worked?

Have how to do things has helped me not have to give it a lot of thought. Being like, okay, I gotta summarize this, I gotta put this all in words. So when I look at, on a day to day basis, we're kind of separated into two different categories, right. I have my respective business and I have the team leaders. I could be like, no, I got this framework I can use and everything's put into place. And then same thing with like a tool like Follow boss side where we're, you know, kind of coaching and training agents to be the maximum performance of themselves. And then we have the systems underlying that are meant to service everyone involved. Now if I look at just having those information on the people that we can capitalize on. So when we're following up with a past client, we have all those details at the ready. And it's not just, you know, chicken scratch on a notepad.

Yeah, chicken or worst scattered thoughts in your head, you know.

Yes, at least chicken scratch on a.

Notepad is one step towards that toward a better system. How to the degree that you're comfortable.

The actual team itself, it's not profitable. Our team in theory is not, is not a profitable team in the sense that if I was to get by a bus tomorrow as a team leader, the business would, would fail. Which is kind of a crazy thing to say. You would be like, well that's pretty wild. But I'm sure it's actually a lot of that for a lot of teams.

Talking about it how like what is the relationship with the other agents with regards to. To, you know, you're providing there. Absolutely.

But that's the biggest thing for me. It is being able to some of these benefits.

You're probably, you probably help them build their own kind of like personal network by extending opportunities to them. Like from a financial perspective, how has that relationship worked?

So when I look at, on a day to day basis, we're kind of separated into two different categories, right. I have my respective business and I have a team leader scale, essentially scale service for clients. And it also frees me up personally to work with the clients I want to work with. So I don't get burnt out. Honesty at times. It was very overwhelming before having the team where I felt I had to service everyone. I'm very much upside where we're, you know, kind of coaching and training agents to be the maximum performance of them, people pleaser by nature. So I just want to be able to help everyone, but I can't. And then we have the systems underlying that are meant to service everyone involved. Now if I look at the actual team itself, it's not profitable. Our team, in theory, is not. Is not a profitable team in the sense that if I was to get by a bus tomorrow as a team leader, the business would. And I had to realize that I can't. So I had to really focus on what I was good at, which is kind of a crazy thing to say. You would be like, well, that's pretty well. But I'm sure it's actually a lot of that for a lot of teams out there. Absolutely. But that's the biggest thing for me. It is being able to scale, essentially scale service for clients. And it also frees me up personally to work with the clients I want to work with. So I don't get burnt out. Honesty at times. It was very overwhelming before having the team where I felt I had to service everyone. I'm very much a people pleaser by nature, so I just want to be able to help everyone, but I can't. And I had to realize that I can't. So I had to really focus on what I was good at and dealing with the people that I want to deal with that I was good at and I liked, I enjoyed helping. Didn't feel like work to me. And that's how we've kind of set this up in a way. Even my own personal business, we hear it all the time. We got to touch base with past clients and. And you do all these kind of things with past clients and I can't just sit down and, you know, call past clients back to back to back. But I dealing with the people that I wanted to deal with that I was good at and I liked. I enjoyed helping, didn't integrate them well with my life. Right. So we would have. I have Charisma fc, which is our soccer team, adult soccer team, pickup team, which is comprised of a bunch of clients. We're all playing soccer all together, playing pickleball with clients, playing golf with clients. And those are my ways I stay connected, watch sports with a lot of clients, and those are the ways I kind of stay connected and integrate them. Not only into the city, if they're moving from a different city, but into my life. Because the, the lines have blurred between work and life. It's all just kind of one now. When someone says, are you working today? I'm like, honestly, yes. Like, are you on vacation? Are you working? Kind of. If I'm living, I'm kind of working. But if I'm working, I'm kind of just living too. That's how I've kind of integrated the two. And to me that's helped me personally be able to be the best version of myself from work wise, but able to balance everything out. Because I'm the same person with a client that I am at home, I'm the same person with a friend that I am with a client. It's all the same. You're getting the same person. There's no charade, which again is the way I think it should be. It's not for everyone, but that's been helpful for me in growing my personal business. But obviously formula and team, because if I go, the team goes, right?

Yeah.

Back to accountability.

Yeah. So you expressed a while back when you told the story of the team that you were with going to another brokerage, you stayed at the brokerage. What is that relationship with your brokerage now? Like, what do you rely on them for? I'm sure they're appreciative that you stayed and that you've grown both your personal business and the team business as well. But like, what is that relationship like? Like, what do you rely on them for? Anything you have to share on that would be useful, I think.

Yeah, that's a good question actually, because I think it's unique. So when we say we're a team of four, we're really kind of a team of maybe 10. Because we can really rely on our brokerage administrators, accounting department, front office support as one of ours. Right. In terms of like listing, launches, payroll and everything like that is all kind of coordinated through our brokerage, which we're thankful for. As much as they may be thankful that I stayed, I'm also thankful that I stayed and I'm able to grow within the system that's put out there. Because, you know, a lot of these positions I would have to fill myself, accounting department, front office support as one of ours. Right. In terms of like listing, launches, payroll and everything like that is all kind of coordinated through our brokerage, which we're thankful for. As much as they're maybe thankful that I stayed, I'm also thankful that I stayed and I'm able to grow within the system that's put out there because, you know, a lot of these positions I would have to fill myself, which as you've learned, I'm not great at hiring people. So that's where I'm, I'm grateful for, for sure.

Yeah. Good. It sounds like a really, really healthy relationship. What do you want for your team over the next like 24, 36 months? Is this going to be, you know, when you and I connect again in, you know, a year or two, is this going to be like a 12 person team or is this going to be.

Which as you've learned, I'm not great at hiring people. So that's where I'm, I'm grateful for, for sure.

Yeah. Good. It sounds like a really, really healthy relationship. What do you want for your team over the next like 24, 36 months? Is this going to be, you know, when you and I connect again in, you know, a year or two, is this going to be like a 12 person team or is this going to be, you know, a four, five, six person team just continuing to do the business the way that you want to do business and you know, have a healthy blend of a life that you love and a business that you love. Like, not, not that you can't do that while you're growing to, you know, tripling the agent count or whatever. But you know, what do you really, you know, a four, five, six person team just continuing to do the business the way that you want to do business and, you know, have a healthy blend of a life that you love and a business that you love. Like, not. Not that you can't do that while you're growing to, you know, tripling the agent count or whatever. But you know, what do you really want for this group over the next 24 to 36 months?

Yeah, I mean, in terms of what.

You want for this group over the next 24 to 36 months?

Yeah, I mean in terms of like growth plans or anything like that, I think if the right fit comes about, we're always opening open to adding more. But at the end of the day, it's not about really agent count. I'm not really worried about agent count. I've never been one to have to gloat, but I have a team of 10 or a team of 20 or a team of 200. Not that that's what anyone does, but I've never been one of the team count was important like growth plans or anything like that. I think if the right fit comes about, we're always opening. I just want productivity and I want like minded individuals. I want to work with people I like working with and open to adding more. But at the end of the day, it's not about really agent count. I'm not really worried about agent count. I've never been one to have to gloat that I have a team of 10 or a team of 20. So all those boxes checked and sure we'll grow, but at the same time it's like finding that right, the right growth in place and it really hinges on myself. Right. Like do I want to step away from production, do I want to stay in production, do I want to lower my volume down a little bit? And I just, I mean, it depends on, you know, what happens.

Really. Yeah. So you're just gonna ride it a little bit. I think there could be circumstances just the way you describe it, like when the right situation happens, you'll entertain the conversation and perhaps move forward if it makes sense. And I think you could find yourself in a place where you do need and want to taper down production a little bit. And then that also is kind of like this push and pull of I might need a couple more agents because you, you know, I still have all these opportunities and I can't, can't handle them all. So I think that I appreciate your allowing nature to take its course and to be open to opportunities, but to continue to do the most important things the right way and let that kind.

Of dictate our team of 200. Not that that's what anyone does, but I've never been one that team count was important. I just want productivity and I want like minded individuals. I want to work with people I like working with. So all those boxes check, then sure, we'll grow. But at the same time it's like finding that right, the right growth in place and it really hinges on my.

A little bit of what happens. So with that, like you talked about staying or leaving with regard to sales production, you talked a little bit about, you know, providing service to your clients at the level that you really want to. I love that you should, the way that you're integrating them into your life so that you could do some of that stuff while you're still doing some of the other things. You're going to want to play pickleball anyway. You might as well do it with friends and clients, right?

Like do I want to step away from production, Do I want to stay in production? Do I want to lower my volume down a little bit? And I just I mean, it depends on, you know, what happens. Really?

Yeah. So you're just going to ride it a little bit. I think there could be circumstances like in a normal like week or a month when you kind of like look at how a lot of that time is spent. How much time are you devoting to your agents and to hardening? I'll guess I'll split it in three. Most people like what I was going to do is say agents versus clients, but there's actually a third piece that's kind of a bridge in between it all, which is supporting your agents in a direct manner, stances, just the way you describe it. Like when the right situation happens, you'll entertain the conversation and perhaps move forward. If I'm answering their questions, you know, all the different things that you do with your agents, then there's like this kind of process piece or platform piece in the middle, the operating system, you know, improving processes and makes sense. And I think you could find yourself in a place where you do need and want to taper down, you know, coordinating some of that work with the brokerage. Brokerage. And then of course there's the time for your clients. How are you dividing that time, you know, this week or you know, how did you divide it last week on production? A little bit. And then that also is kind of like this push and pull of I might need a couple more agents because, you know, I still have all these opportunities and I can't, can't handle them versus maybe a couple of years ago.

Yeah, I wish there was probably a better answer to this question, Ethan. Honestly, it's a really good question. And, and I try to have kind of set days where I kind of focus on certain pieces of the business which of course you get pulled in multiple different directions. There's time sensitive matters, so it's hard to actually do this. But usually Monday mornings we do kind of our coaching calls with the, with the agents.

So I think that I appreciate your allowing nature to take its course and to be open to opportunities, but to continue to do the most important things the right way and let that kind of dictate a little bit of what happens. So with that, like you talked about staying or leaving with regard to sales, production, you talked a little bit about, you know, providing service to your clients at the level that you really.

So I'm kind of in a kind of coaching mode, see where things are at with the team. Wide challenges, struggles, wins, everything like that on an individual basis with each agent. And then on Wednesdays we do our team Meetings, just a collective unit. We all get to kind of chat about different transactions. For us, it's a way to relay any kind of tools coming down the pipeline based on, sometimes based on our conversation.

Want to. I love that you. The way that you're integrating them into your life so that you could do some of that stuff while you're still doing some of the other things. You're going to want to play pickleball anyway. You might as well do it with friends and clients. Like in a normal like week or a month when you kind of like.

Look at patients we had with agents or what's happening in the marketplace, everything like that. So those are kind of like the two set, like kind of team days. And in terms of optimizing the tools that we use and everything collectively as a team, that's really ongoing and kind of situational. Depending on, you know, what challenges we're kind of go through, different updates to systems and regulations. I'm sure everyone's aware of different things like that.

How a lot of that time is spent. How much time are you devoting to your agents and to hardening? I'll guess I'll split it in three. Most people like what I was going to do is say agents versus clients.

But that can alter how we do things, how we communicate with potential clients. So it's continuously improving that ongoing. It's hard to have a set day. I try to. Almost like every year I feel like I put my calendar. Okay. Tuesdays I'm going to be looking at overlooking marketing to see what.

There's actually a third piece that's kind of a bridge in between it all, which is supporting your agents in a direct manner.

What's going on the marketing side? How's our newsletter performing? Everything like that. And then I do that, but then it just falls off the wagon and.

I'm answering their questions. You know, all the different things that you do with your agents. Then there's like this kind of process piece or platform piece in the middle, the operating system, you know, improving processes and, you know, coordinating some of that work with the brokerage. And then of course, there's the time for your clients. How are you dividing that time, you know, this week or, you know, how did you divide it last week versus maybe a couple of years ago?

Yeah, I wish there was probably a better answer to this question, Ethan. Honestly, it's a really good question. And I try to have kind of set days where I kind of focus on certain pieces of the business, which of course you get pulled in Multiple different directions. There's time sensitive matters so it's hard to actually do this. But usually Monday mornings we do kind of our coaching calls with the, with the agents. So I'm kind of in a kind of coaching mode, see where things are at with the team. Wide challenges, struggles, wins, everything like that on an individual basis with each agent. And then on Wednesdays we do our team meetings, just a collective unit. We all get to kind of chat about different transactions. For us it's a way to relay any kind of tools coming down the pipeline based on, sometimes based on our conversations we had with agents or what's happening in the marketplace, everything like that. So those are kind of like the two set, like kind of team days. And in terms of optimizing the tools that we use and everything collectively as a team, that's really ongoing and kind of situational depending on, you know, what challenges we're kind of go through, different updates to systems and regulations. I'm sure everyone's aware of different things like that that can alter how we do things, how we communicate with potential clients. So it's continuously improving that ongoing. It's hard to have a set day. I try to. Almost like every year I feel like I put my calendar. Okay, Tuesdays I'm going to be looking at overlooking, overlooking marketing to see what's going on the marketing side. How's our newsletter performing? Everything like that and then I do that but then it just falls off the wagon. I'm just doing that on a Saturday and it gets out of hand. So as much as I try, yeah.

I put blocks in my calendar and some of them I honor and some of them get dishonored in one way or another. Sometimes it is me, sometimes it's circumstance. But yeah, it's difficult to do perfectly. You mentioned a lot earlier and then you just kind of mentioned again you mentioned earlier like, you know, one of the things was brainstorming on different marketing activities to generate business. You just mentioned a newsletter like what kind of marketing investments have you made over the past year or two, whether it's through time or money or both.

Yeah. So we've, we've definitely just the way Follow Up Boss integrates with a lot of our like new lead campaigns. So online leads and everything we've we've gotten into integrates really well with Follow Up Boss. We're able to do that collectively as a team. But I think across the board our main focus has always been past client referral business. So that's really scaling, being able to stay in touch with our clients on market information, you know, listings that we may have just to kind of, you know, share what we're kind of up to. Different changes to interest rates and you know, tips to do around the house, seasonal tips and everything around the house. So we try to stay up to date on that with our clients every month through our newsletter, which we also previously had a client of the month every month. So we do kind of a fun local integrated prize that we have every, every kind of month. This year we're actually giving away a $15,000 travel voucher to, to a client or actually a client that's referred us whether now or in the past 10 years to celebrate our 10 year anniversary. So that's kind of exciting thing to do this year. Looking back at how many, how many referrals we've gotten, how much we appreciate that from our clients has been pretty cool. So hopefully we get to send a family to Disneyland or a couple to a lifetime. So that'd be really neat. So different things like that that we can again, can kind of stay top of mind, have something to talk about and honestly just have fun with it with our client events and everything like that too. Just have, try to have fun integrated with our life.

Client events. Are you doing like, I don't know, parties, get togethers, pie giveaways, like, what is, what is a, what is an event? What qualifies as an event for you all?

So we do a client appreciation event every November. So we do family photos, food, drinks, a bunch of activities for the kids. And we do that every single year. And it's been an integral part of our kind of growth, but just kind of creating a sense of community. Clients that maybe have a young son or daughter meet another pair of clients that have a young son or daughter that maybe they've met somewhere before and they just, that's that common ground. So it's very neat to see, you know, two sets of clients that are from out of town are now friends and you're like, okay, this is pretty cool. Like we're kind of creating a little community here. We're the neutral source. People are asking us questions. It's just a great, it's a, it's a great little event to kind of get out there and get in front of people. And people love the family photos and everything. So it's kind of cool to see their families grow over the years. And you go into their home when they look to sell and you see a photo from the family event on the wall and it's it's pretty cool.

Yeah, that is cool. The monthly updates. I notice you're doing some of that in video. How long have you been doing that in video? And how much easier or more difficult was video than you expected out of the gate?

Oh, Ethan, I've been doing it for five years now. So I started around the same time. Actually, my coach is the one that got me to do it during COVID and I started it. Please don't ever go back in time and watch any of those videos. We're getting on to our five year anniversary, so maybe one of those is going to come out of the woodwork here. But it's not something I actually enjoy doing at all. I hate every moment doing, filming a video, but I enjoy the result, being able to share that information with our clients. You may have a piece of content that we can share and at the end of the day, it forces me to do something I don't want to do. So I think anytime you can force yourself to do something you don't want to do and do it, and it's every month, and you could easily create an excuse, you could easily not do it, but you do it. I think that helps everyone and people. I appreciate that in myself, but I think people, team members or people around me can be like, okay, he's doing it. I got to do something too.

Gosh, it's so interesting to hear you describe it as something you still like. Most people like warm up to it, like, oh, it's terrible at first, but then I warmed up to it. I think of it as a little bit of a microcosm of taking the processes out of your head as a solo agent and getting them down on paper and then turning them into shareable docs and then having other people benefit from them and then developing them and essentially building maybe some action plans and these kinds of things off of that. But it was all in your head at one point. When I think about the commitment of doing a monthly video like, these aren't 12 minute rambling videos where you're just talking top of mind about what's going on in the market. It forces you to think about, you know, what have I been saying to people? And you organize it, make it nice and compact, and then share it. I think to me, it's got a number of different benefits, some of them less tangible. And I think the skills that you develop doing it are transferable. Would you say that that's been your experience?

100%. 100%. And it's. It keeps me up to date on the market. All, all times. I have, I have my kind of processes leading up to create the script and get all the numbers kind of ready. And I'm able to recite the numbers like the back of my mind the rest of the month because I've, you know, had to take so many takes to do this video that isn't very long, but it takes a lot longer than it appears. But then day it makes me a better agent, better agent, a better team leader because I'm doing the work, I'm getting better. I've. I know more about the market and that helps us, everyone across the board.

Yeah, totally. Any advice for an agent who's thinking about joining a team?

Yeah. So joining the right team is important. I think joining a team can be a huge step for the right agent. It was super beneficial for me because I got to see a lot in those early years, see a lot of transactions, see how someone operates at a high level. So I think that's important. But you have to. What you run into a lot of people with teams, they don't want to do a team is that they don't want to share the brand, they don't want to share their commissions. That's the way they kind of look at it. But like anything, it's an investment. It's an investment that you're going to learn a lot faster, you're going to see a lot more and you're going to learn a lot more about yourself and what it takes to be where you think you want to be.

Yeah, that acceleration piece has been kind of a. I feel like just hearing you say it, it conjures like a few different conversations I've had just in the past months about when I started in the business. It took me six or seven years to get here. And now my agents, because of all the things that I've built into the organization, they're getting to where I was over the course of six years or seven years in two years or these kinds of things. I mean, like, just as you said, it took me two years to ballpark to recognize that some of my early efforts, even if they never resulted in a transaction action, are turning into opportunities now. You know, my reputation's there, I've got some momentum. I'm being referred. That can happen a lot faster in the environment too. I think acceleration is definitely a key theme. Any advice for someone who's thinking about starting a team?

Well, don't do it like I did. And I think that's another piece too. Right I get to make all the mistakes, and everyone gets to learn from it. So, like, that's. That's a big thing. Um, but finding out why you want to do it, like, why is more important. Are you trying to free up time? Are you trying to maximize dollars? Are you trying to just have the biggest team so you can stand in front of a big line of people and be really proud of all the people that work with you? You got to figure out why you're doing it. I think that's the biggest thing. Because if it's for the right reasons, it can be super rewarding. It's a lot of fun. But for the wrong person, it can just. It can be a lot. You're essentially. You have another role. You take on other roles. So if you thought being an agent was a lot, try being an agent and a team leader at the exact same time and see how different that can be.

Yeah. Any characteristics or aspects of a personality that you think helped you make that transition or to thrive in that kind of dual role, Any personality aspects or characteristics that you think particularly lend themselves well to also being a team leader.

Having kind of empathy and understanding for the people that you're serving, regardless. So I think you can take that from when you deal with clients, just understanding their perspective. It's no different than when you go to talk to an agent that you're kind of seeking to join your team. You got to look at from their perspective. Why would they ever join your team? Right. Are they going to save time? Are they going to learn a lot? Are they going to work with some of the best tools? Are they, you know, are they going to better themselves? I think that's. You have to put themselves. Yourself in their shoes to kind of understand, okay, what am I. What am I getting here? So I think that's an important piece.

Some really good advice there. Thank you so much for A, spending all this time with. With me and with all of us who are watching and listening, and B, thank you for watching and listening to some of these episodes yourself. So you already know what these three pairs of questions are. What is your very favorite team to root for besides your own team? Or what is the best team you've ever been a member of?

I'm a, we're two hours away from Toronto, so I'm a big Toronto Maple Leafs fan. It's been an unfortunate journey my entire life being a Maple Leafs fan. But in terms of accountability and teams, that's a team that doesn't have a lot and doesn't continue to have that. But in terms of a high performing team that I enjoy watching or one of my favorite teams, a big Formula one person. I love the Red Bull team, small and mighty, unrelated to racing, but has created a championship mentality, a championship team. And I think that's pretty cool.

Awesome. What is one of your most frivolous purchases or what is a cheapskate habit you hold on to even though you probably don't need to?

I mean, cheapskate habit. I just over research the simplest, smallest things ever and I just look for the best deal possible for like personal items like consumable products and stuff like that. I just, I'm very frugal when it comes to that in terms of like spending or anything like that. It's kind of more experience related, memorable, related consumables. I'm the most frugal, frugal person ever.

I think I've noticed the same thing in myself is like there's like an inverse relationship between the amount of spend on the product and how much time I spend researching it. Like I'll research a $20 purchase five times more than a 200 or a $2,000 purchase is so crazy. What does it look like for you? What are you doing, Jordan, when you're investing time in learning, growing and developing or besides watching YouTube videos? Or what does it look like for you when you're investing time in resting, relaxing and recharging?

So I think learning is kind of being consistent. So for me it's important to kind of stay fresh with reading material. I try to have the same time of day where I wake up first thing in the morning with my coffee. I'm always trying to read something, whether it's, you know, a business related book, a real estate related book, a mindset. I try to have something going into the brain first thing when I, when I get that coffee in. And the next step to that is working out and moving my body. I think that's been a big component for me to kind of do what I do at a high level and to help the learning. It almost like processes the learning when I go after kind of taking something in so that. And then also throughout the day I'm listening to a lot of podcasts like this one. To try to stay fresh, top of mind with everything, or fresh and stay top of everything that's happening in the industry and marketing and sales and mindset, you name it.

Awesome. Well, it's an absolute privilege to be part of your rotation of channels that you're tuned into to continue learning and growing. Really appreciate that. Appreciate you spending this time with us. If someone has gotten to this point in the conversation, they may want to learn more about you or about the Charisma group. Where would you send folks who have made it to this point in the conversation?

Yeah, best to follow us on Instagram charisma.group. you can also follow me directly. Jordan is my name and be happy to connect and we'll be learning together.

Cool. That stuff is all linked up down below. Jordan, I appreciate you. I'm already connected to you and I'm looking forward to staying connected over time. Continued success to you and thanks again.

Thank you Ethan. I really appreciate it. Thanks for checking out this episode of Team os. Get quick insights all the time by checking out real Estate Team OS on Instagram and on TikTok.