In this YouTube live‑show interview, dating coach Steven “Papa Choi” hosts his VIP client Brendan, a 28‑year‑old communication coach and influencer, to debrief a one‑week residential coaching program in London. Brendan flew from Montreal, lived with Steven and his partner Kati, and was challenged to cold‑approach at least 100 women sober on the streets over seven days. The conversation explores Brendan’s background—wealth‑focused career, limited dating experience, and deep‑seated limiting beliefs shaped by family and past relationship observations. It details the three core transformations he experienced: (1) overcoming the fear of approaching women, gradually desensitizing through repeated street approaches; (2) a mindset shift to view relationship outcomes as controllable, highlighted by a breakthrough interaction with a woman named Anna that proved he could create a date on demand; (3) adopting the “Papa K”/“Papa vibe” framework—an abundance, high‑status mindset already present in his business and health that he learned to apply to dating. Brendan also shares specific coaching tactics used by Steven, such as real‑time feedback on video tapes, role‑play, the creation of a custom “Zodiac Open” line, and rapid iteration of approaches. He reflects on day‑game versus night‑game, the value of sober street interactions, and why he recommends Steven’s coaching: money accelerates learning, and Steven’s expertise condenses 15 years of experience into days. The interview ends with Brendan affirming his commitment to continue working with Steven and a teaser for a future part‑2.
Chapters
Welcome, Brendan. How's the vibe?
Life is a gift, Steve. Ouch. How about you? Life is a gift.
I love that. I love that vibe. Look at you, just like, just risen me already. You know, it's like, I don't even know.
I'm learning from the best, man. What can I say?
All right, welcome to our cheeky vibe here with Brendan. So a little bit about me for those of you who don't know what I do for a living. I'm Steven. Aka Papa Choi. I help high performers like Brendan create their dream relationships through bespoke coaching. And this is Brendan, my VIP client and a good friend of mine. And we just finished our 1-week residential coaching program here in London where Brendan essentially flew out from Montreal for a week and we lived together, we trained together, and it was just like a nonstop A lot of action. And for context, Brendan is a 28-year-old communication coach. He's definitely a big-time influencer. When you go on his Instagram, he's got over 100,000 followers, um, over 40,000 subscribers on YouTube. He's a top voice on LinkedIn. Um, when it comes to personal branding, he's, he definitely knows what he's doing and he's been a big inspiration of mine. And more importantly, he's never dated anyone prior to us working together. So that's a bit of a teaser. And as part of our residential, what ended up happening was that I gave Brendan a bit of a cheeky challenge, which is approaching, cold approaching over at least 100 women on the streets of London, sober, Over the course of 7 days. And yeah, he had never approached anyone before. So yeah, we're just going to talk a little bit about that and what transpired as a result of our work together. So Brandon, welcome again. Can you start by introducing yourself and telling us a bit about your background?
Yeah, for sure, Steve. Always a pleasure to see you, man, and always happy to talk about my transformational coaching experience with you. So more to come. Honestly, this is just the beginning, but more to come. Yeah, so, so background on me. I mean, you know, the couple of points, you know, I think the main idea, to keep it simple for the purposes of this interview, you know, if I, if I were to separate life into 3 big buckets, right? Health, wealth, relationships. You know, I knew really young in life that wealth was going to be the first bucket I was going to be focused on because, you know, I didn't grow up with a lot of money. My parents were both factory workers. For me, the belief I had as a kid was that money was always hard to come by. So I worked really hard. I went to a great school, became an accountant, then got a job at IBM in consulting. And then I was able to start my own business around executive speech coaching. And I was able to build, you know, a good amount of wealth for myself. Not like a billionaire or anything, but like enough where it's like I can do something that I love and I can provide for my family. So that's the wealth bucket, right? So I put a lot of my focus on that wealth bucket ever since I was like 12 years old when I realized we didn't have a lot. The health bucket kind of solved itself on its own, you know, where, uh, when I was 13 years old, one of my cousins, his name is Naren, uh, and if you looked at him, Stephen, he's like this big Adonis. He's like this, he's got all the moves and stuff, and he wanted to do karate when he was a kid. So there was this little karate dojo that opened up near my house, and he said, you know, I want to do karate, but I don't want to do it alone. So they— my parents and his parents basically forced me to do it. Even if I didn't want to do it. And it ended up being a great 5-year experience. I did Kenpo for 5 years, which is a type of martial arts, and I kind of learned the discipline of how to stay in shape and all that jazz. And I learned from like one of the best kickboxers in the women's division who just happened to live next to my house, which is super weird. But you know, the reason I bring that up, Stephen, is in my life, the third bucket— you know, kind of like when you're in a basement and there's like this place, there's a bunch of dust everywhere and you don't clean it for many years. That was me in dating and in relationships, not friendships or like family, but just dating. I'd never really spent that much time on it. And I think there's a couple of reasons for that. The first one is that I was really just focused on solving wealth for my family because I just grew up with a lot of scarcity around money. And I'm still fixing that, but obviously my situation's gotten a lot better than when we first met. The second piece is, you know, at the end of my life, we were saying that on a live stream, you know, what am I pretending not to know? And I think for me it's that, yeah, I could be externally successful in life, but I really want to have a family and I really want to have kids. I think that's a beauty, a richness to life, having that woman that, uh, that is next to you, that partner, that thing that we see in the kind of the Disney movies. And then the third piece around dating, I'll throw it back to you, is like, I didn't really believe I could get that result. And I think the reason I didn't believe it, and that's changed tremendously since we've worked together, is that I would see a lot of relationships in my personal life, my parents' relationship, my cousin's parents' relationship, most people, the people I admire's relationship, and I would just see all these divorces, all of these broken relationships. I'd be like, I mean, these guys are more successful than me, they're smarter than me, they're making more money than me, they're who I want to be in life. If they can't figure out relationships, how am I supposed to figure it out? So I kind of gave up on it, to be honest. I was kind of like, you know, like, I mean, Stephen knows this about me, it's like I struggle getting a girlfriend. Like, I, you know, I could date girls, it's not like that, but it's more just like dating like the person that I would want to wake up to every morning. I just didn't think it was possible. So I kind of didn't really give it much of a second thought until I really met you.
Why did you not think it was possible? Because like when I look at you, right, like if I didn't know you, I'd be like, okay, this guy is a communication coach. He's really good with words, right? He's confident, he's charismatic, you know, like he's built his personal brand. He's connected to so many people. So what was really missing, would you say?
Yeah, I think the way that I would explain it, Stephen, is the way you do one thing is not necessarily the way you do another. So like, okay, this is the way it was in— it's in my head anyways, until you somehow magically broke that belief. I still don't even know how that happened, and we're going to talk about that. Whereas for me, if we go back to those 3 buckets, right, wealth and health are Even if a lot of people in the world struggle with that, and I totally acknowledge that, right? I was one of them. It's not like I'm any different. You are one of them too. But I think the, the main idea is like, for me, I always believed internally that I could achieve these results because at the end of the day, it's a system. So let's say we look at wealth. Okay, at the end of the day, what does wealth come down to? If you're an employee, it comes down to are you adding more value into the marketplace versus what the company is paying you. Hey, if you're closing half a million dollars of sales for the company, you ain't getting fired any day of the week, right? It's like, at the end of the day, if you're adding more value or you're so indispensable— wait, Seth Godin calls this the linchpin— if you're just so undeniably good, you're always staying up late, it's gonna be really hard for you to get fired. And same thing if you're a business owner. At the end of the day, business gets summarized into one line, which is: if you add value and people actually want what you have, they will pay you money for it. Very simple, right? Just do good on people and charge the right price, and you'll probably be successful. So it was a clear formula. It was still— it still felt really difficult, but I was like, at least I know it's possible. It's a simple formula. Follow the formula. I followed it. I became successful. Had a bunch of obstacles that we won't talk about today because that's the focus of today's conversation, but I made it. Health is the same thing. Look, if you walk more, you, you eat less unhealthy shit, and you work out, you'll probably be successful. That's been the case with me. You work out a lot. I I work out maybe 2 or 3 times a week, but my diet is really clean in general, at least when I'm living in Montreal. Maybe not when I'm hanging out with you, and I'm back on that diet. So like, you know, it's funny, like I'm weighing like 135 now. I lose pounds and stuff. But going to the core of the conversation, relationships, I just never felt that way, Stephen. And you asked me why. I think it's because, you know, I've seen a lot of stories and their limiting beliefs that you helped me unlearn, really. About people who put so much effort into the relationship, but at the end of the day, it's a tango. You know, the other person could just leave, right? Which is totally true, right? And, and, and that fear, that's a big piece that always bothered me. The second piece is, you're right, you know, I am a communication expert. I can talk confidently with women. 80% of my clients are women. But the missing piece is, A, they're middle-aged, and B, right, how do you talk with them in a way that's romantic? It's a completely different frame that I Honestly, a zero at. Like, how do you communicate with a girl in a way that leads to dates and leads to relationships? And I would say the third piece to that is I just genuinely didn't think it was possible for me. And just from a statistical perspective, like, which is a stupid way of looking at it because anyone, you could just be the exception, right? Where it's like, you know, like 50, you just look at the stats, right? You know, I'm a numbers guy, you know me, analytical. Like, what, what is, what is the divorce around couples? Maybe like 50% on average. But the other 50% who stay together, how many of them are actually happy, and then that number dwindles down really quickly. I don't know, I maybe I just had a really defeating attitude about it. Like, I, I think the main reason that comes from— for me anyways— is I felt I couldn't control the result. We talked about this idea of control in our week together. I felt like you controlled my health. It's like I go to the gym every day, I work out. I felt like I control my wealth, put in more time, get on more sales calls. I coach other people to do that, right? Whereas in relationships, it's like I can go on 300 dates, but does that necessarily mean I'll find the right person? If it does, does it necessarily mean they'll be with me? And if so, in what faith? And I just had a lot of defeating— I had a really defeating attitude around it. And I think that's really the crux of it. That makes sense.
I see. I see. So would you say, would it be fair to say that maybe you've actually experienced something pretty I wouldn't say traumatic, but like maybe an early experience that really shaped the way you think about dating? Maybe like, you know, you shot your shot at someone and then like they just rejected you? Like, was there any like story around that?
Yeah, thanks Steven for that. So it's a mix of two things. One, it's definitely my parents' relationship and the relationships that I've been experienced until I really met you and Kati and my business partners. I never really been given a great example of a good marriage. So, so we know this, uh, I'm gonna use a super random example. So like the fact that Barack Obama became the first Black US president is a really important thing, right? For reasons that people don't really understand, because it creates a reference experience. We talked about that this week. It creates a reference experience in your mind where like, okay, if that Black dude could be the president of the US, like, I think I can, I can— what's my excuse? And it kind of shifts, right? So it's the same thing. I never had any reference experiences of good relationships. I know it sounds totally crazy. But it's just the truth. Like, every year until literally 3 years ago, every relationship I saw, like, was broken to me. I was just like, oh, this— they're not really— or it's not what I wanted, right? That's one piece. The other piece is, to your point, yeah, I agree, I haven't asked out a lot of girls in my life, probably until, until last week. But, but, but let's focus on before. I mean, I think in my life— I think I told you this— I probably asked out maybe 10, 15 girls in my life. And, uh, I've never been successful once. That's also a piece to that where it's like I would ask out girls that I kind of liked or really liked, but some of them I just sort of like just to practice, and they all said no. My hit rate is actually 0%.
Got it.
It's 0%. But I would ask out one girl a year, right? So it's not like I asked out 15 girls in a row. It was, it was like maybe one girl a year. And I would self-sabotage girls that were interested in me. There's a couple we kind of gave as examples.. But I think the main idea is that definitely played a part too.
Got it. Got it. Amazing. Appreciate you opening up like that.
Hey, anything for you.
Yeah, thank you. Appreciate that.
It's the truth, right?
So, okay, so you've experienced some challenge around actually getting girls to say yes to your invitation to date or vibe or whatever. Um, and you must have, you must have actually tried to find some solutions around that, right? Right. Like maybe, you know, watching some YouTube videos, books, like what have you tried in terms of actually figuring this out?
Totally. And you know this well, since you know me, I haven't really put in that much effort because a lot of my focus is on business and health, which is funny now that I've been through your week. It's like, of course I'm not getting until this week, you know, of course I'm not getting really results in my relationships. I'm not trying. So It makes sense, right? But I think, I think the bottom line is where you don't put effort, you don't get results in. So the only thing I've really tried in my 20s was watching a lot of pickup artist videos. Even yesterday I was doing that just for fun. Yeah, I just think it's cool. I think it's interesting. I read The Game, right, by Neil Strauss, like I think every other guy does, and it really unblocked a lot of things for me, by the way. But I haven't really done that much, frankly. You know, my plan before I met you, which is interesting how karma works, my plan was just going to be grind run out the business for 2 more years, make a bunch of money, and just pray that I'll find the right person. That was literally my strategy. It's like, okay, I guess I'll go to India, I'll get an arranged marriage, I guess I'll talk to a few girls and kind of figure this out. And honestly, dude, I don't think the outcome would have been that great. I would have ended up with a girl, like a girl to reproduce with and have kids, but I don't think I would have woken up every day happy. So, so yeah, so that's why you, you, you realize, and that might have surprised you a little bit when you met me, it's like I knew a lot of the other pickup artists in the space, where it's just because I've just studied them. I've read some of their books, right, just out of curiosity, but I've never done anything more than that.
Got it. I see. So it sounds like you definitely have some baseline knowledge of some sort.
Of some sort. But honestly, after working with you for a week, and it's, it's funny, it's like we're on the record, but I also wanted to say, but we can keep it on the record too. It's just like, you know, now, now I'm just— now it's like cold pickup just keeps coming in my feed now, ever since. And I'm listening to the guy who's teaching it And I'm like, I'm better than this guy. How is that even possible? Like, because you're just so good at teaching it. But I think that's really the key is like working with you for a week. And I know we'll talk about this later in the conversation. It really shifted everything for me.
Really.
I know that sounds crazy, but it really just shifted everything for me because now I think about relationships from a controllable outcome perspective and that completely shifts things. The entire game for me.
I love that. I love that. Happy to unpack that. I can't wait. But actually, let's take a step back because like, okay, you, you started talking about how, okay, you were familiar with this pickup artist kind of like territory, and then you, you had read up on a couple of these books and, you know, you started watching YouTube videos and stuff. Okay, that's all good. And why did you decide to work with me, right?
Why did I decide to work with you, Stephen? I mean, there's a couple of reasons. A lot of it was mostly random in this case. You know, most people have a really good reason for, for working with the coach, and, and a lot of people who work with me as a coach have a really good reason for working with me. You are more of a unique case. How do I explain this in a way that makes sense for people? So there's a couple of things that are streaming through my mind, so I'll list them out. Number 1, uh, I've been thinking about relationships now for the past 18 months. It's always been on my mind, in the back of my mind. That I just chose to ignore because it's something my close friends, you being one of them, have told me in the background that I kind of told you guys about my 100K rule, which is like, you know, once my net worth gets to like $100,000, which is probably going to be the next few months now, now I'm going to spend more time on my dating. But to be honest, I didn't really mean it because remember, I didn't really believe it was possible. So now that I'm 28, I'm like, okay, well, I still have maybe like 7 to 10 more years to kind of figure this out realistically. Yeah, you could meet the love of your life when you're 40, but it just becomes harder, right? Things like that, like for kids, I mean, and all that jazz. Uh, but so I was just like, okay, like, I'll kind of take— so it's kind of the back of my mind, and it was kind of slowly getting bigger and taking a larger space in my mind. So that's one thing that was happening. The second thing that was happening is my business started taking off this year. I had a lot more cash on hand. I was getting a little bit— once again, not a billionaire, but getting more successful. And I was like, okay, now I can't really make an excuse about not having money anymore because now I've made it. I'm, I'm making money. I'm finding success in what I'm doing. And then the third thing, honestly, which is totally woo-woo, is divine timing. You know, we've been friends for 4 years. I actually was one of the 2 people who gave you the idea to even be a dating coach, and then you took off. And the last year you took off, you started signing a bunch of clients, and I was like, whoa, how much money is this guy making? Holy crap, what happened? Because I saw you in, in businesses in the past, and like, this one just immediately clicked.
Yeah.
And it wasn't even meant to, to be a coaching arrangement. Like, I think I reached out to you in August and I was like, hey, let's just catch up. And we hadn't caught up in a while. And then you were telling me how you were in London for the week. And then I was like, okay, that's cool. Like, that's awesome. I've been meaning to meet you for a long time. So I was like, okay, you do know I'll come out because it's your birthday that week, which I totally forgot about when I landed. And then I, uh, a week— I think it was 2 weeks before the trip, you text him and you're like, hey dude, I don't want anything from you, but I want you to take your dating seriously. Like, let's do some coaching together this week. And what I took as that, I took it as an invitation from the universe. Here's this guy who's approached 15,000 women, who's literally one of the world's leading— I think you're the best in the world right now, even if you might not know that. I think you are. And now that I've studied, now that I'm studying even more people this week, uh, like other guys, I'm just like, these guys are beginners. Even I'm better than them. Like, from one week with Stephen, I can't imagine how good you are. And here's one of my best friends giving me this invitation and saying, hey, you know, we are going to live together. We're going to have a good time. But like, this is your big thing, right? And I'm the number one in the world. Like, I should be helping you with this. That's what you basically said. And I had a decision to make. And that decision is, am I really serious about having kids and a family, meeting the love of my life or not? Because I've been pretending my whole life that I was when I wasn't. And this is the most important invitation that I know I've ever gotten in my life. And I said yes to being your VIP client. I said, you know what, I— so I got extra money, and you know this, I was like, I just printed extra money, and I said, hey, this is yours, I'm gonna be your VIP client, let's figure it out. And it was honestly one of the best decisions I've ever made in my life. And I'm not just saying that because you're my best friend. Wow.
Damn, some, some deep emotional connection right there.
DEC, you know, baby. I'm starting to make those cards right now. I'm gonna need a photo of all of those, but I'm gonna start printing them out soon. Let's go.
Oh, so amazing. Yeah, it was, um, yeah, it's been— it's definitely one for the books, you know. Like, I, I personally like really had, uh, just like so much fun vibing with you.
And I didn't have any fun, but it was amazing. I'm kidding. I'm joking. It was so much fun, dude.
Yeah. Now you can say it's amazing, right?
Yeah. Now I can. After a few days.
Got it. Amazing. Cool. Now let's actually dig into what actually transpired over the course of that week together. Yeah, hit me, hit me, bro. Your top, uh, breakthroughs, um, takeaways. And yeah, what, what happened?
Totally. And obviously we have a separate interview we did on the 3-hour, like, complete day-to-day breakthrough. So what I really want to focus on today is what are the 3 big transformations I got working with you. I think that's really the big thing. Let's start with number 1, the fear of approaching girls. So I'll tell you guys, when I was on day 1, I literally took— this is a real story— I flew on a red-eye from Montreal to London. I got there at 10 AM in the morning on a Friday. My client picked me up. I had a great lunch with her because I hadn't met her yet. And then I kind of just said, okay, cool, let's meet up for like 1 or 2 or whatever. And you and your girlfriend were— Kati— were having some brunch together. And in the back of my mind, I was like, okay, how crazy is Stephen really about this pickup thing? Because obviously we've known each other virtually, but I've never seen you coach before. I kind of just became your VIP IP client because I was like, I trust Steven. I'm just seeing it as a sign from the universe. Thank God I took that sign. I was just like, okay, let's just see what happens. So you gave me a hug. Kati was filming us kind of meeting each other the first time. And then like 5 minutes in, you're like, so are we going to approach today? And I was like, oh, shit, today? And I hadn't slept. Like, I probably slept like 2 hours. And I was like, all right, dude, I have no idea what this— so anyways, we spend the day, we eat up. And at this point, I didn't even want to eat. I already ate. And I was like, my stomach was already churning a little bit. And then at like 6 o'clock or something, I don't remember when, we kind of went out to King's Cross and we started walking together. And I was shivering. I'd never been more scared in my life. And I've done a lot of— you know, take it from somebody like me, guys, who are— and you are guys who are listening to this podcast— like, I've done a lot of shit in my life. It's not like I'm some loser that Stephen is coaching. I built a multi-six-figure speech coaching practice. I have 9 years experience in my industry. I have hundreds of thousands of followers in my industry. Like, I'm a top dog in my business. It's not like I'm some— and bro, I have never been more scared in my life. And especially at the beginning, it wasn't even— you were going so easy on me too, especially now that I've been through. I was like, okay, this guy was actually like not trying to push me at all. It's like, this is all Stephen did. And it's honestly the most important thing, which is the fear all of us as guys have and why we all need to be working with Stephen, honestly, is like, it's just the fear of approaching. That is 80% of the result. The fear of approaching girls is not as bad as you think. It's still a little bad, but it's not as bad as you think. So we were just walking at King's Cross. You were kind of helping me practice on your girlfriend, which I thought was both weird and interesting. I was like, okay, so I'm supposed to flirt with your girl? I was like, this is a little awkward. Okay, sure. And Katya's super sweet and we're obviously best buddies now. But that's one piece. But then the other piece is you start the coaching off really simple. We just walked. You were telling me stories about growing up in London to kind of calm me down. And after you just pointed out two girls, you just said, hey, you don't need to go on dates with them. You don't need to get to them. Just go there and say hi and leave. Hi, talk to them first. And I was shivering. That was actually the hardest approach out of the 100 because I did end up hitting 100, which is still crazy to me. Even if I cheated a little bit towards the end, but I still got to 100. And, and I went up to those two Chinese girls and I was like, this is literally what I said, I was like, uh, hi. And they were like, uh, hi. And I was like, uh, are you guys Chinese or Japanese? And they're like, Chinese. And they're like smoking a cigarette. And I was like, cool, have a great day. And they're like, you too. And I was hyperventilating, dude. So the most important result I got was getting over 80%. It's never going to be 100, but definitely 70 to 80% of my fear of approaching girls. Just that alone was worth the entire week. Do you want to comment on it, or do you want me to just keep rolling?
Let's keep rolling.
Okay, cool. And then after what happened, obviously you're gonna have a more— there's a 3-hour kind of detail, but basically what happened is I was scared on every approach, but for some reason I was getting a little less scared every single time. So then it became this person. I was like, I'm still hyperventilating. This person. But then after like the 6th or the 7th approach, I was still scared. They were still a little scared of me, but I was able to like talk to them for like 2 minutes this time. They weren't just leaving after 10 seconds. And then I like approach 9. I don't know what happened. I met this Russian girl. I stopped her. I twirled her and somehow magically we got her number and she was still engaging the whole week. And that was, that was my first peak. And I was like, holy shit. And there's a lesson there in transformation one, then we'll go to number two. The lesson there was, if you just approach, eventually you'll get a yes. Eventually. For some guys, it'll be 200 girls. For some guys, it'll be 50 girls. In my case, it ended up being 9 because I'm a communication coach, and I got that first taste of the result, and that was the most important result you got me. That's one. Number two, and this was the— this was a really important result too. So number two, uh, going to day two, I had a horrible day. So at this point, Stephen realized I was pretty confident. You realized that I was like, okay, like, he's actually a lot better than like 90% of my clients. He's actually approaching. Whereas the big challenge you've had coaching your VIP clients is that they're paying you a bunch of money, but they're just going, ah, Stephen, I don't want to approach. I don't— and I had some of that too. Let's not lie, especially on the last day, because I'm not here to paint an unrealistic picture. Even if I am one of your best students, and I plan to be your best one still, is yes, the last day I was lazy. Absolutely. Day 5, I screwed up because I was too complacent, but I needed that day to kind of reset and go like, yes, this is a big mistake, I can't do this anymore. So I still had some complaints. I still said no a lot to Steven towards the end, but definitely the first couple of days I was just approaching, and you've realized that.
You were just like, let's go.
I was just like, and the only reason is because I trusted you. I was like, okay, Steven knows what he's talking about. Let me just trust this guy. Give him, give him my life for a week. Then day 2 happened and you shredded me. Like I ended up approaching 40, 50 girls in a day. And, and some good things actually happened. I met a cool girl named Hazel and we kind of hit it off and she was super cool. And, and then I was a little bit bummed that she didn't message me back. And now I understand why that is and how to fix that. But at the time I was just like, Oh my God, that was a roller coaster ride. And by day 3, like, Stephen's girlfriend was looking at me and I was on the couch and I was like, oh my God, I just want to go home. This is really difficult. Which brings me to result number 2. Thank God I sticked. Thank God I sticked. Day 4, and I'll say this, I've said this a million times, even after a few days after reflecting, I'll say it again. Day 4 is still to this day the best fucking day of my life. Best fucking day of my life. So what happened, long story short, because I know this interview is supposed to be 45 minutes, but I know you would be like, we just vibed so much, it's gonna be a long one. I was feeling myself. Kati, Steven's girlfriend, styled me a day before. I looked fresh. I had my dark suit, my dark outfit on. I was feeling myself, and I was just— it's like when LeBron just hits three-pointers, because I had so much experience at this point. I was just like, you know what, I'm scared shitless. Let's try something. Boom, I meet this Tamil girl, sit next to her, get her number. Boom, her friend comes in. I stayed confident in the set. Then I met this other girl named Serena, interrupt her, kept her in the set for 10 minutes, even if honestly in retrospect that set was shit. But because I had so much conviction, like, I kept her in the set for 10 minutes and I could have gone on an insta date with her right away. I just kind of missed that part. And then you coached me, and then I met Anna. And Ana, dude, even after a couple of days, she changed my life. I was on approach number 63. At this point, you realize— that's why you're such a good coach. It's so beneficial doing cold pickup with the coach because when you're alone, it's just really shitty because you have nobody to talk to after you get rejected. Whereas I— whereas what I love is like, after I get rejected, I give— even whether it's a success or not, I give Steve— like, Steven— that like that fist bump. And I was like, okay, let's go back into it. And he's— and he just points He puts another girl right away when he realizes you're committed. He just goes, okay, cool, go there. And I'm like, oh shit. And then I'm running.
And then you don't even look at her, right?
Yeah.
You're just like, oh, you're super pretty.
And that's what happened with Anna. So this one, I approached 63 total. I probably approached 7 girls that day. So I hadn't done many approaches. It's just a lot of my approaches were quality. So I'm keeping them in the sets. That's how time was passing, which is a good thing, not a bad thing. Whereas on day 2, I just approached so many women because my sets were terrible. Where I was just getting crushed every single set except one that lasted 20 minutes with some weird Chinese girl. But anyways, so then we get to Anna and he points out this girl. He realized I was feeling myself and that I could just approach anyone at this point. So I ran up to her and by— I still am not doing it correctly. We're supposed to like stop. So I kind of just like get it right, then I just flip a 180. And I flipped, I looked at her and I was like, fuck. Oh shit. Hot. This is like the— literally one of the most prettiest girls. Like, because, because I like short girls, right? Like, for me, like, tall Victoria's Secret models, they're conventionally super attractive. I just don't like girls who are taller than me. So like, conventionally, like, girls like Margot Robbie or like Victoria's Secret models would be like 10s to most people. To me, they would be 9s because I just, I just wouldn't— they're still hot, like, but it's just like, you know, it's not my thing. So her, I looked at, I was Oh damn, that's like a 9.7. I was like, oh shit. But somehow, dude, you know, like you taught me this week, some girls just like you for no reason. So I got into the set, I asked her about some Zara things. She was like, the first thing she said, which I really liked, she said the price. She's like, oh, I only paid £60. I was like, I really like cheap girls. I just gotta think. Everything was working. She was learning French. I started speaking to her in French. I don't honestly didn't know what's happening. Even when I asked her about the zodiac sign, which is now is something like I really appreciate a lot more now that I've compared girls who didn't know versus the girls who knew. And she loved it so much that she asked me to guess, and then I got it right the first time, and she was just completely hypnotized. I got an instant date right away, and that instant date lasted 2-3 hours. Why was that the greatest result I've ever got in my life? I'll tell you why, man. Because when we were at Din Tai Fung and we're having dinner— shout out to Din Tai Fung, one of the Sponsors. I'm just kidding. You guys are not— don't go to Dentai Fund, guys. It's all about Upwork. Shout out to them. Real sponsor. Yeah, our real sponsor. And I was telling you guys over dinner, but what I hadn't said is the reason that was the most important transformation of my life is for a couple of reasons. Number one, and it was worth— forget the investment. I honestly should have paid you more money in retrospect. It's like, I basically just gave you everything that was in my pocket. I should have just went out and got more money for you. It's a couple reasons. Number one, you got me a result that I didn't think was possible in my life. So whether Anna was the right person for me or not is not the point, right? Because they're still qualifying for magic and all that stuff. But the fact that she checked all, all my instant boxes so quickly and that she was into me— so that's the key part that was missing before with the other women I had met in my life— it completely changed my frame. Because I couldn't deny anymore that the outcome was controllable. Because 4 days ago, I didn't know how to approach girls, and 4 days later, I just literally created that opportunity with your help, of course. But like, just creating that result completely shifted my mind from like, oh, there's no way a girl would— Anna would ever swipe right on me on an app or ever find me attractive. That belief changed from like, who gives a shit about an app?
Yep.
Who gives a shit about an app? I mean, obviously I'm gonna do that for fun, which is one of our next steps to get— just for fun. But really, the point is, like, I could go to Romania tomorrow and meet like 300 women exactly, and I could get rejected from 299 of them. It won't be the case because I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm pretty good now at this thing. But the fact that just one of them would be like the right person for me would close everything. And that comp— that's a complete 360 from not seeing the result as controllable to going like, I create this shit tomorrow. Tomorrow. And I'd even dare say with you next to me, obviously, because coaching is really— I want to have that coach next to me. But like, literally with Stephen next to me, in my sleep, like tomorrow. My— that is a crazy 360 result. And Anna, whether she ends up with me or not is not the point. She's always going to be a reminder for me. And that's what I was telling with my buddies. So I was kind of debriefing my buddies on this week, and they all couldn't believe the result. That I got. They were like, you approached 100 girls? I gave up 5. And I was like, what did you— and I didn't realize how crazy this result was until somebody told me. He said, you know, Brendan, like, this is a pretty big deal because now that this result is controllable and you know it's possible, you can create this result anytime that you want. And, and, and this is the thing I was telling Vlad that he was telling me as well. He was like, you know, dude, 20 years from now, when you're making millions of dollars a year, maybe like tens of millions of dollars a year, you won't care because you always knew that result was possible. But this Anna result, you'll never forget that woman for the rest of your life because she's a constant reference experience reminder that not only can I attract my dream girl, that that dream girl can be obsessed with me too. And that is something that money can't buy, honestly. And I'm super grateful.
Wow, amazing. Appreciate it, brother. So in summary, number one—
yeah, and so for— yes, in summary, number one, you know, part of the benefit of being one of your VIP clients, or really just a client in general of yours, is it's really about the fear of approaching girls. It's the fear of approaching girls, and you're still going to be scared even after 100 approaches. And now I need to do 1,000, right? But like, even after 100, you're still going to be a little scared. But it's not the same fear. It's not even close. Like, now when me and you do this again, and we're definitely doing this again, and we'll walk through the game plan, what that looks like, if you want, here, or we'll do it on a separate call off the record. But basically the idea is really simple. It's like, okay, yeah, approach 102, I'll still be a little scared because I haven't picked up in a while, whatever, but I'm, I'm nowhere going to be as scared as I was on the first approach. That, that guy, that Brendan, is gone. Like, going up to two girls and just going like, hey, what's your— dude, by approach in '98, I was yelling at girls on the street. I didn't even care. And I still kept them in the set. There's like, uh, what, which we won't spend— yeah, it was so funny. I was so fed up from pickup, guys, that like at 98— because I'm like Stephen's most successful student. No one's ever done 100 approaches in a week besides himself, besides him, right? So like on like Friday night, I was so exhausted, so I was making up some simpy shitty excuses as to why I didn't want to approach girls anymore. And then the last 2 girls, I literally told them, guys, I just need 2 more girls. I'm tired of talking to women this week. Like, I just need you two to reject me. And they both said no. I was like— and I got so mad at them. I was like, why aren't you rejecting? They're like, well, we need to know why.
For what?
Yeah. And then they both came closer. They're like, just tell me, like, what happened this week? And I was like, I was like, what's happening? So Steven was so good. I got so good at game to the point which even when I was telling girls to reject me, because I was doing it so much conviction and authority That's what you drilled into me, that girls just wanted to keep talking to me. And that was crazy. Which brings me to the final big breakthrough. I mean, there were so many, but I'm kind of give you my, my top 3. But we could— I mean, we already broke this down for 3 hours, but I'd say the, the big 3, the final one is that I know I can do this now. Now I have a solid game plan on how to approach this, like, strategically, where I'm almost like 100% sure almost 100% sure that I'm gonna land my dream girl once I've sorted out some things in my business. But I think the third takeaway is now I have a strategic, practical, tangible plan to my dating life that includes qualifying a bunch of girls and all this stuff, and that I'm now Papa K, baby. So let's go, Papa K!
Amazing. Let's go. Love it, love it. Appreciate that. Appreciate the breakdown. Let's talk about the Papa vibe. A little bit, right? The Papa frame. Tell me about that shift in mindset where before working with Papa Choi, right?
Pre-Papa K, the real Papa, Papa Choi.
And then now the transformation, what actually really shifted? Obviously you talked us through some of the stories, some of the foundational transforming reference experiences, Um, in addition to that, like, what were some of the things that made you realize that, wow, okay, I'm actually choosing to step into this Papa frame?
Yeah, man. And everyone's gonna explain the result differently, so I'll give you my version of this. I would say the big result that you really taught me this week is I'm already Papa K. I just— I'm not doing it in dating, right? And you know me really well, so the result that you got me was super fast and efficient where it's like I'm already Papa K in business. So when I was giving you some advice and I was practically yelling at you and going, hey, like, this is not how you do things. Now in your mind, you're like, okay, I understand why 80% of your clients are women. Like, they like being spanked by Papa K. Like, they, they pay a lot of money for that too. I just closed what, executive women this morning. I was just like, hey, like, you're just not approaching this interview process correctly. You need to do this, this, this stuff. We work together, I'll sort you out. She's like, absolutely. Like, with the smile on her face, absolutely, I'm so excited to work, I'll pay you by Friday, and that's it. So it's like, I'm already Papa K, bro, but it's just the difference is that the— and, and I learned myself in business, I went from scarcity to abundance. And I'm not fully abundant in business either, but I'm definitely more abundant in business than 90% of owners in the world. That's— there's no doubt. It's just like, because it's like, I know clients will come to me, I know I'm the best in the world at what I to do, right? I have great business, my business works. I don't need a client. If you don't want to work with me, you're not ready to work with me, hey, I'm not here to pressure you, right? I'm here to lead with love. So I'm already that way in business. But you real— you made me realize, Stephen, that's the big, big three, right? Is that, Brendan, you can be like that in dating tomorrow. You can be like that in dating tomorrow. And I didn't believe you. I was like, there's no way, dude, right? Because sometimes you just gotta— everyone learns the lesson differently. Right? Some guys, they have to approach thousands and thousands of girls to get there. Other people, they just get it right away. In my case, I needed to meet Anna to realize it, right? That's why I'm super grateful for her and you pushing me to approach that type of girl, right? Just thinking about it sounds crazy. It's like now I can sit down and go like, even, uh, the other girl too, where it's like just, just flipping the set on her from like me sending these texts to just being like, I don't give a shit. Got her to respond a lot more, right? But I think the main, the main idea was like, I am Papa K, right? And the faster I realized it in dating, it shifted. But to make it more practical for people, I would say the big, the big couple of things that shifted was really this idea of abundance. Because I got good at game— I'm not exceptional at it, I'm not exceptional, I'm not, I'm not perfect yet, I'm still going to need to work with Stephen until I'm married essentially— But the fact that I went from zero to like pretty much where I feel like there's other guys in the space I'm better than in 6 days really inspires me because it goes, shit, if I day game with Steven for a month, I'm gonna be absolutely deadly.
Oh, you're gonna be lethal, brother.
Like absolutely deathly, right? And but what's great is like, and that's what helped me, you being my coach, is you had that confidence in me long before you even saw my results. Even before I flew here, you were like, This guy, he's gonna do something. Of course he's got it, right? And that means a lot to me. And then I think the third piece, if I had to give one on, on being Papa K, what's practically shifted for me, I think what's happened is— okay, I'll tell you something. You know, before this year, the last time I really liked a girl a lot was 2019. You know, even in the last couple I've been thinking about, was there anyone else? Honestly, there hasn't it been. So the fact that I created those types, two girls in the last 30 days, changes my frame. And the first one I got when I was simpy, Brendan. So it wasn't even like Papa K vibe. Whereas now you would coach me completely different on that frame. I would have led completely differently. I would have built EC immediately. Like it's just totally different. But I think the key is like, okay, if I really dedicate a year of my life to this, it is impossible unless I give up. Which you will never make me do, you would never make me give up, is like, as long as I keep doing this for a year with an amazing coach, there's no way in hell I don't have one or two— forget one or two, I'll have like 20 or 30 opportunities, like high-quality opportunities. And I think that's the, the Papa energy. It's the abundance mindset, which is my last piece. How do you practice this? Which is probably separate podcast. I think working with you is a big piece to that, but I think the other piece is like find some Papa K, some Papa Choi energy in other areas of your life and remind yourself of those pieces. Because I have it in my health too, because I used to be a kickboxer, right, and do all this stuff. Bring that energy back into dating and I think it'll 10x your game. Totally.
Oh, I love that. I love that. Yeah, the Papa vibe is just like such a strong and foundational to your success as a man, actually. And this is actually the primary reason why I think you found success so early on, right? Because you know that you are like this in pretty much every aspect of your life outside of dating. But now you're like, okay, let me just find that. Just let me just access that Papa vibe in dating, in love. Why not? I'm like that already. So like, let's, let's, let's jump back into it. Appreciate that.
Yeah, like the fact that now I can approach girls on the street— I still need my coach, I still need you in my life— but the fact that I can just go, and that's where my eyes started changing now from like, oh, attractive girls don't like me, to like, now I'm like looking for them. It's like, well, where are they? Let's just go talk to them. We don't need an app. Nobody's approached— that's what's so amazing about day game is like, day game is my religion now. It's like there's like, there's like an empowering ourselves because most guys would never approach girls in the middle of the street, right? The middle of the day. But the fact that I have that power now is like insane. It's, it's a one of one. Like no one else is gonna do it. So, and you're not gonna do it anymore because you're in a committed relationship, which means I, I get everybody. That's great.
Exactly. It's, it's like finding a glitch in the Matrix, right? And then you're like, okay, like I found my thing and then like, let me actually like really, really poke at it. And the funny thing is, when I got into it, this was like, what, like more than 15 years, 16, 17 years ago when that's when I first started doing it, mainly because I really resonated with this idea of meeting someone cold, sober, right? During the day in the most spontaneous environment. And then just the idea of meeting that person, with like without anything shared, like without them knowing anything about you, no pre-context or anything. And then you just like create something new. Like to me, you found— it's, it's, um, I don't know, it was like such like a, such a magical vibe, right? To be able to create. And at the same time, just like this idea of, you know, me, me sort of like creating this attraction or actually finding attraction and then actually like like building on top of that. It's like, if you haven't experienced it, there's really nothing like it. And then now society is actually rapidly evolving in a way where everything is becoming heavily digitalized. So just like the idea of going to actually striking up a conversation with a woman that you're actually attracted to, right, instead of hiding behind the phone, like, it's just a crazy insane idea. But I'm so lucky that I've actually learned, you know, over the past 15 years, actually put everything into practice, actually approaching with 15,000— over more than 15,000 women across like 30+ countries. And now I have the, um, it's, it's a big pleasure of mine to be able to actually impart this vibe.
Totally. And let me build on that to pitch Daygame a little bit better, a little, a little differently. Yeah, dude, we're all grateful for it. Like me especially, because now I'm learning from your 15 years of experience, and in a week I'm already pretty good at this. And the other piece too that we haven't really talked about, I think the reason, because we did night game one of those times and I honestly didn't like it because some of them are drunk. Um, it's really hard to pull the instant date. It has to be drinks essentially because all the coffee shops are closed, right? And girls might not agree to night game, uh, or like an instant date, right? Because it's like weird, like they're with their friends and stuff, but then they'll forget you the next day. So there's actually, and it ruins your personal, like going back to Papa Choi, Papa K energies, like, like, are we really going to go out every single night. Like, we have a business to run. We're papas. We got other things to do. Whereas in day game, what's super interesting to me— and day game to me doesn't necessarily just mean talking to girls on the street. It's that you're at a conference, whatever. But especially the street game, it's like, you are— you're— the frame you're setting is automatically high status by default. And it's— there's no way of doing higher status. So if the girl is into you, she's already just like 'Whoa, you're like a magical leprechaun that came out of nowhere,' right? Like, literally. And I'm not even drawing, like, uh, I'm not even exaggerating this because that's happened. That happened to me twice that week, and it would have happened to me more that week if I wanted it to. I just got tired on the last day. But like, literally, it's like, there's one Chinese girl, like, I just went up to her and she literally said, like, 'I can't believe somebody's talking to me that I don't know right now.' She's like shocked. And she started playing with her hair like 20 seconds into talking.
She was hooked right away.
Hooked, right? She couldn't believe it. It was like complete— like this leprechaun came out of nowhere, is talking to me, is like making my day better. So automatically you are not being friend-zoned. The friend zone is gone. That frame is gone. Because the fact that you're sober— because remember, women are very intuitive, they're in tune with emotion— you're showing up confident, sober, and you're stopping them in the middle of the street and you're talking to them. You're already like on the pedestal. Even if they have a boyfriend, even if they have a boyfriend, that like— this is what's been interesting about Cold. We haven't really digged into this because I didn't, because I had so much going on in London. It's like even the girls who had a boyfriend stayed in the set. And what I mean from this is, I mean it from a respectful perspective, the women respected me so much that they were just like, you know what, they told me they have a boy, but they still kept talking. They're like, man, there's something about this guy that's really fascinating to me. And obviously I don't overstep that, so I talked to them for a few minutes and that was that was it. But it's just like the respect that women have for you is absolutely deadly. And I felt that, and I hope every guy feels that. But honestly, they won't unless they work with you.
True.
It's true. It's the truth. It's the truth, man. Like, in communication coaching, you could do the random word exercise without me unless you want to be world-class. You know, you, you can work with me, but if you just want to practice a little bit, but your game, dude, People really have to work with you. And take it from somebody who's super confident, I'm probably one of the most confident charismatic people in the world right now, and I say that proudly. I'm probably one of the most confident people you ever meet in your life, and I'm telling you, there's no way in hell I would have approached those girls without Steven next to me. And I also won't in the future unless Steven is next to me. So I'm gonna keep paying him a shit ton of money until I get the result that I want, and I'm glad to.
Let's go, let's go. Amazing. And speaking of coaching, I think you've already like covered it pretty extensively, but I mean, we actually did quite a lot of stuff together over the course of a week, right? We lived together. We obviously approached like all these girls. I gave you feedback, right? And then we did analysis, role play, everything. What parts, what part or parts of our sessions did you find most valuable?
Totally, man. And happy to do a part 2 on this because then we got to jump in 5, but I'll give you like the main, I'll give you the main takeaways. Takeaways. Well, first of all, for those of you listening, just because you want to join VIP doesn't mean you get to, right? So Stephen chooses who wants to be a part of his VIP experience, and he only picks the best clients who are actually taking action in his other programs. So that's something to keep in mind. Whereas for me, I'm glad you picked me for VIP for a couple of reasons. Number one, I get instant feedback right away. That's why my ramping was so fast. Like, literally, guys, what VIP is, is day 3, I'll meet a girl I'll, I'll— because I'm taking action, right? I'm approaching. If you're not even willing to approach, forget it. You don't even qualify for VIP. You got to be willing to change your life to do this. So I did it immediately. The night of, Stephen spent an hour going through the tape and explaining everything I did wrong. And the next day, I applied everything he taught me right away.
And that happened to be your best day.
And that was my best day. Yeah, that was literally what happened. Like, he's like, literally, we sit down, he gives me feedback on 'You know, this girl, this is what you could have done differently.' I'm listening to him and I was like, 'Okay.' And then I'm— because obviously me and Stephen are different people, so I take what he says and I shoot him an idea. And it's because of that feedback, in only 4 days of approaching, I came up with a new custom pickup open that has never been done in pickup, which I call the Zodiac Open, right? Where it's like I just go up to girls and I ask them what their zodiac sign is, and if they say, 'I don't know,' I already know I'm not interested. And that is a little Yeah, it's my qualifier immediately. Same thing on dates. You gave me the, the points. Like when you go on a date with a girl, hey, you like DMC, take out the cards, see if she wants to play. What is her emotional reaction to the game? Is it like, oh, you know, I don't really want to do this, or is it like, oh, like this is going to be fun? And that tells you immediately if this is a good use of your time. You can cut the date in 15 minutes now. That's Papa K energy now. It went from like, oh, maybe I should just talk to her for an hour, maybe I'll like her, because my first date was 90 minutes. Minutes, right, that you also helped me get my first ever real day. Whereas now I could have cut that down to 15 minutes because I could have just been like, yo, you, I have this game, you want to play? And if she's like, oh, like, not really, it's like, cool, enjoy your Poké. Give me like the bill and I'll just pay it and be like, you have a beautiful day, madam. And then I just leave. So yeah, man, you're a gift, man. You're a gift to the world. I really mean that. I'm really lucky to have worked with you, and I'm also lucky, whether you want me to or not, I'm going to continue working with you whether you want me or not until I get the results. I'm grateful.
Appreciate it, brother. Last question, uh, we're short on time. Um, you already said it, but yeah, um, why would you recommend my coaching to others?
And you know, it's the same reason why I recommend mine. If you want to work with a coach, there's a quote that Rory Vaden gave me, which is, money speeds up time. I want all of you to write this down. Money speeds up time. So whenever you're trying to solve a problem with your life, you can use that— you can use two ways to solve that problem. Either spend time to solve the problem or spend money to solve the problem, right? So if you're at your house and your wall breaks, some— something happens, there's an explosion in your wall, I don't know, maybe you're in a war or something, your wall explodes for no reason. Either you pay an expert, a contractor, to come and fix it and it's done. You pay a premium for it, but you're done in a few days. Or you sit there and you kind of watch a bunch of DIY construction videos, kind of figure out if you're a handyman, maybe you can do it in a month or something and buy the parts yourself. So my philosophy in life is really simple. I can make money, I can't make time. Whatever day we're supposed to die in the world is the day we're supposed to die in the world, whether that age is 75, 45, 25, 47. We're supposed to die. You can't buy time back. The only way you can buy time back is by buying other people's expertise. So because I worked with Stephen, he taught me 15 years of game in 6 days. But because I was a great student, I implemented maybe 80% of what he shared. Not 100. I mean, he's a master. There's still so much more, but at least 70%. I sped up time really quickly. I literally went from not knowing anything about game, not wanting to approach a single girl, even just to say hi to them on the street, to literally meeting one of my dream girls. Literally. And there's a little drama behind that, but if there wasn't, I would be already going on multiple dates with her right now as we're talking. That's crazy to me. In 4 days. And the only reason is because I made the decision to spend money to speed up time. So if you're tired, you've been single for a long time like I have, and you really want that dream relationship, even if you're broke, save up money. Give yourself a game plan. Work it out with Stephen, right? Get on a call with them and say, hey, look, I, I'm not— I might not be ready for VIP yet like Brendan, who's spending the big bucks to work with them, but hey, I wanted your group program. Can I do a payment plan? Like You put in the effort, show that effort to your coach and say like, I really want to work with you, how can we make this work? Do a payment plan, he's open to that. But the main idea here is if you spend money, you will speed up time with the right mentor. And I guarantee it, I'll say it's on the record, I bet my entire reputation on this, I think Stephen is the best in the world right now because he's authentic, he's super deadly, he has the best tricks and the best tactics and he knows exactly what to do in every situation. And a lot of my situations that week was super thorny, and he knew exactly how to navigate every single one of them. I'm grateful, Stephen, for you, that you're my coach, but more importantly, that you're my friend. And I can't wait to keep working together, man.
Brendan, wow, so touching. Appreciate the vibe, brother. Well, from one papa to another, um, you killed it honestly this week.
Week.
Um, can't wait to actually get to the next level with you to help you further along the journey of actually creating your dream relationship. So more to come. Well, Papa's gotta go, um, jump on another client call.
We'll do a part 2.
Let's do it. Peace out.
Just click it so that it loads. Yeah, because I need to stay
