#142: Surviving Separation: How to Find Balance When Your Partner Needs Space

Imagine hearing the words, I need space from the person that you love. Your heart sinks, your mind races, and suddenly you're adrift in a sea of uncertainty. If that hits close to home, you're in the right place. Welcome to Love Shack Live, the Go to podcast for those standing at the crossroads of relationship dilemmas, facing daily conflicts and a widening emotional gap, but still holding on to the hope that love lasts. I'm your host, Stacey Bartley, and I'm here with my co host and lover, Tom, and our daughter, Brooke. Why should you listen to us? Because we're. We've been the guiding light for countless souls, navigating the maze of love. We're back by popular demand after our viral episode number 140, the space between Us. Navigating your partner's need for separation. Your questions and stories have been flooding in, and we're hearing you and we're rallying to support you in the best way possible. So what's the big questions we're answering today? We're diving deep into how do you find emotional balance when your partner pulls away without dismantling yourself in the process? This is part three of a series, and you won't want to miss what comes next. So if you're struggling with the emotional whirlwind of a partner asking for space and are desperate for real, actionable advice, stick around. We've got your back.

Hey.

Thank you for coming. Welcome to the Love Shack.

So today I want to acknowledge you, our listener, for the overwhelming response that you have had to this conversation of space and separation from a partner. And I want to thank you personally for the engagement, the conversations, and for subscribing all the wonderful love that you have given us in this conversation. And like I said, we hear you and we are on our side doing everything that we can to support you in this space. And you're right. In the relationship journey, this space is absolutely the most painful. And it's painful because we hang out in a sea of uncertainty and we don't want to make a move. We want to do the right things in hopes of bringing us back, back together. We don't want to do the wrong thing to continue the divide that has now created the separation. It's a place of doubt. I said uncertainty three times, but I'm going to say it again because that is the biggest culprit. As our minds wrestle with answering the many questions that then our brains start to bring to our awareness. Why is usually the first word in any given question. And so, because in 140 we covered this need for space. Why space is asked for, and I'll just briefly say it here, separation takes place because one person in the co creation has lost their own self. We talk about this in 140. Along with the effects of external pressures for modern relationships that creates that need for being able to process down and connect with myself. Along with how to honor the need for space and some behavior recommendations that best promote forward progress. That's in episode number 140. I encourage you to check that out. In episode 141 we answered your heartfelt and brilliant questions such as how should we handle the dating conversation? And how much communication should we engage in? So today it's going to be a continuation of answering your valid and important questions. And I want you to understand that there is much to understand around this need for space. When it comes to our relationships, space can be requested for many reasons, but as I said, the biggest one is because one person in the relationship has lost a sense of self and they're needing to regather themselves before they can decide how and where we're going to go forward. This typically causes the other partner, who has no interest in space whatsoever, to start panicking as we had described in the intro. And this panic is really difficult. The person who's needing space grows weary and more frustrated as the panicked person can't stop texting, sending emails, wondering how to engage, begging and pleading for time and attention and a date. And this inevitably, when not handled correctly, ends up driving more of a wedge between the two of you, almost spiraling. The fighting, one needing space, one trying to get closer and figure out what we can do to save this thing. So we're going to answer these questions and continue to support you on this journey to navigating this in the very best way possible. My hope for you today is that with understanding from these questions that you have asked, that we'll find a place in your heart to create a moment of peace when we can start to understand the uncertainty that you're swimming in. Peace is usually the net result of that. So on that note, Brooke, tell us what your first question is.

The first question is kind of about ghosting. So when giving space starts feeling like abandonment. Where do you draw the line if.

Somebody is not engaging with you? Number one, it's very hurtful. The need for space is important and sometimes, let's be honest, when we take space, we're not necessarily honest about what we're going through. This is where we start to dive into the conversation that listen, if you're the person who needs space. Take it. It's okay to take it. It's okay to need it. And sometimes in that need for space, we're covering up the fact that there's a whole lot more going on there than we're disclosing. And it's kind of like this dance that we do as human beings. We're not necessarily to close a door, but we're not necessarily going to keep it open either. And so the person who's needing space can also get stuck in a space of conflict with inside of themselves trying to decide how they're going to govern this. And I just need to say this for the record, okay? I'm going to take a very strong position here. When you need space, take space. But don't ghost somebody because you're leaving somebody hanging in the tumbling waters of uncertainty. And it's okay to say, I don't know, it's okay to say, I'm not sure where we're going. It's okay to set guidelines and agreements in regards to how we're going to conduct space. But as I often say, space is just space. If we don't have the agreements of how we're going to rudder through this, you can put anything in it, but don't leave anybody hanging. That's just downright cruel. That's my position on that.

And I remember last, in episode 141, what I took out of that and what you had really shared, baby, was make sure, like you said, space just adds more space. But space with a plan is what we're after.

Yes, yes. Space with a plan to give us the answers that we need in order to uncover what's possible going forward. Think about this. You know, you're co creating and let's say you're co creating 1 year, 5 years, 10 years, 20 years, and then all of a sudden you ghost and you just go missing. And the other person is left to try their best to hold up the relationship as best they can while you've ghosted them. That's abandonment. Yes. That's trauma. Yes. That's painful. Yes. That's unnecessary. Because if we can learn how to use our voices and talk about things as far as like putting a plan together about how we're going to utilize this space, we can continuously increase our need for if we're finding that we need more space or that this isn't working, or you're not interested in continuing, it's so important to have those conversations because otherwise it turns into an exceptionally cruel Place where the person who's needing space knows what they're doing but nobody else does. So just imagine a parent who has a child out for the night. There's no communication. You have no idea where they are, if they're safe or if they're not. And just understand that when there is a void, we will insert a narrative. And it's usually going to be the worst possible thing that could be happening is happening now. And that's how I'm going to emotionally respond to it in the tumbling of no communication whatsoever. So it's important that there is a bit of communication in regards to what the heck are we doing? That's probably one of the biggest questions we get is what the heck are we doing here? Space is just space. Are we moving forward? Are we not? Are we learning? Are we getting help or support? You know, what are the contexts here? And it's like nobody wants to say anything about it because they're too afraid of getting themselves into to some kind of an agreement or a plan when that's exactly what you need. Because how are you going to chart the waters of uncertainty and the future if you don't have some kind of a plan that you can evaluate from with what's possible and what isn't? You really can't. You're just creating more space.

And I just want to say that some, a lot of people in the comments have said, well, if you feel like you're going to ever need space from your partner, then you should never get into a relationship. And to that I say, if only it could be so simple. If only life are so simple. But also none of us come into relationships with standardized training. None of us go to relationship communication 101 or attachment style education courses or anything like that in high school or college. Or we're all doing the best we can. And if we've developed these attachment styles from childhood, a lot of us have not ever dealt with our childhood trauma. So we're coming into the relationship with the attachment style that we developed as a kid. And sometimes in order to learn the skills and tools necessary to make a relationship great, you have to take space for that to happen. Sometimes that's just the reality of it. I don't think any two people ever get into a relationship saying, okay, two years down the road we're gonna need to take some space. That's not how it works. I don't think either side is saying space is great or it's so awesome that I need to take this space, space. The Avoidant isn't saying that either. They just simply don't know what else to do. But what we are saying is that for the relationship to recover from the space, there has to be growth, there has to be learning new skills, there has to be learning how relationships really work and there has to be a plan in place to come back together. I think for people who are just listening to little snippets of what we're saying, they're filling in the void of what they haven't heard and they're making up up these stories about what we're saying and they're most of the time wrong. Just exactly like you said, we're not saying that space is wonderful and you should forgive everyone for ever needing space and if they ghost you, it's fine because they need space. That's not what we're saying at all. It's a very clear thing that we're saying. It's very different from ghosting or taking 30 days and not talking to each other. We're not saying any of those things. And if you've listened to all three of the episodes, I'm sure you know that I'm glad you made that distinction because space with abandonment is cruel. It's the cruelest thing you could do to your partner by letting them reel and swim in the waters of uncertainty and just obsess and make up all these stories about why they're so awful and you needed space from them. That's a terrible thing to do to somebody. We're not suggesting that at all.

No.

And just for those of you that may think, well, gosh, I mean, that's. Is that almost like a oxymoron? Space with a plan? No, it's not. And don't get too triggered, I guess, would be a good on this plan. Realize this is a basic plan. This is a basic plan to how we're going to navigate what Brooke just said and realize it's very malleable and it's going to be dynamic and changing, but there needs to be some basic tenets of understanding and agreement between you and your partner, you and your husband, your wife, significant other. Otherwise, yeah, it's just going to give you more space. And there could be some other things at play here. But to be fair and to really look at it as objectively as possible, realize, let's just put some basic tenets together here as step out and let's.

So that we can maintain the safety for both people, maintain the emotional safety so that it's the point of the Plan is to eliminate as much as we can, the reeling that the anxious person is going to do and also eliminate the ghosting that the avoidant person wants to do. We're putting the plan in place to make those two things less possible, which is good for everybody.

Well, as I like to say to private couples who come into my office, look, exploring what's possible in the future is a journey. And to typically we've co created a lot of things like kids and mortgages and investments and a lot of other things that are now coming along for the ride. We also need to have a conversation about how we're going to rudder all of those things that are still in motion. Right. We just can't drop off the face of the earth and throw our arms in the air. I mean, we can, but I wouldn't recommend it. So a plan covers, okay, how are we going to maintain daily life while somebody does carve out the space for their time and space, realities of space or separation? And then we've got to be able to have some experiences that we can actually draw from to explore what is possible in the future. It's the only way to make those decisions. It has to be an experience. It has to be a journey. Otherwise we're just waiting around to call it quits or just waiting around to inevitably say, well, there's nothing left here. I guess we're going to be done. It's what I call a default option. So there's many things to learn and understand and explore in this journey. Between the two, you as you literally discover what's possible. And one of two things is going to happen in this journey, especially when you do have a plan and you have the mentorship and the support, you're either going to go, oh, wow, I see why this isn't going to work. I understand where you're coming from and I understand where I'm coming from. Or it's going to be, wow, we're making some progress. We're really going in a new direction. We're regrowing our relationship. This is so great. Let's go again. Let's take what we're doing and duplicate it again and again and again. And that's how we make the choice when we're stuck in this place of maybe, this land of maybe, or somebody's got one foot in, one foot out. And I also want you to hear that 99.9% of all relationships will at some point in the relationship, question the relationship overall. And we're all going to have a place where we probably need some space to kind of decipher, where am I at? Okay, now let's put a plan together, decide what we have to work with here. And those are important conversations as our relationships and our co creations transform year after year, decade after decade. Right? Because we don't stay the same people, we don't maintain our lifestyles, don't stay the same. There is nothing stagnant about human life and yet we have zero frameworks and tactics and skills in order to navigate through that. So I would encourage you to the very best of your ability to look at space as more of an opportunity to go. There's a lot of things that weren't working here for one or both of us. And if that's the case and we don't address it and we just keep doing what we've been doing, it's going to end anyway. So space, space is literally the red flag that goes up that says, okay, we've got some things to address here. We've got to evaluate what's working and what's not working. And we've got to decide how it is we're going to change our behavior, right? Change and understand our past so that we can go go forward in the future as better humans. And that's literally at the heart of what space is.

You and I, mom too talked about this last week when we were recording some videos. A lot of times in marriages and long term relationships, space is taken in the home. One partner just totally vacates the relationship. Meanwhile they're still sleeping in the same bed, they're still coming home every night, but they've cut themselves off emotionally from the relationship just because they don't know what else to do. And sometimes that can happen for years where you're like, wow, we don't even know each other anymore. So yeah, this space conversation is really hard. But I think some of the people who are resonating with these videos, if they were really true to themselves, would admit that them or their partner has been taking emotional space for years. That happened to me in my marriage. I was totally on another planet than my ex husband and we were not connected at all at the end of our relationship.

Well said. You can be taking space even if you don't declare it and even if you're in the same physical home or apartment or wherever you live.

And you might not even know it because you're just surviving. But if you really look at what space is, I think it's much more common than we would like to admit. And it's just because we don't know what else to do. You know, we're just trying to survive.

So don't, don't. Don't dismiss yourself if perhaps you're not literally, I mean literally in a different physical place, location. Because as we just shared, you can absolutely be experiencing all of the behaviors and emotional experience of space and still be in the same house. You know how many times people have shared with us? I've never felt so alone as I'm lying next to my significant other, other, like literally touching him or her. And I still have space, so can't. Don't know how better I could share it. So. Yeah, well said, Brooke. Important distinction. So it doesn't matter. We would invite you into these conversations and into our new love and limbo group wherever you are on the spectrum. This would be a classic case. If you get too hung up on the word, then you're sacrificing. What does that mean?

Circumstances.

The circumstance, the word for the experience. Don't do that.

Well, we tend to because there is no physical evidence that emotional space is growing between us. We feel it, it, but there's no physical evidence that it's actually happening. So we're going to cling to the physical evidence as though we're okay. It gives us the reassurance if we're still sleeping in the same bed and you're still coming home at night. That gives us the assurance even though we feel and sense something's not okay. I still have the physical evidence that you're here. We're still doing this. We're together. And it's very easy for us as human beings, especially when we're trying to avoid things that we absolutely don't want to look at, to live in states of illusion and pretend to get through the challenging times, to pretend like we're okay and that we feel a certain way and that this isn't happening. I don't want to look at it. I don't want to address it. And so to cope, we are very good and masterful at illusion and pretend. And we cling to the physical evidence as though this is a demonstration that we're okay. When indeed space starts out as emotional space. I start closing down. I stop sharing myself with you. I stop spending time with you. I stop sharing my thoughts, feelings and emotions with you as I once did. And then that can progressively grow over time. I don't just go from us being madly in love to saying, I'm going to move out. That's not how this works. It's a slow progression. I then start coming to bed after you and then I maybe move into the next bedroom. And maybe I say it's because I just got diagnosed with a cpap or you snore or I can't sleep next to you so I move into the next bedroom. And these things you'll see if you pay attention to them can be exceptionally progressive over time. And it's when I feel like I can no longer sustain this co creation with you because I've lost such a sense of myself that I'm going to say I need my own space. I need my own space so that I can be alone with my own thoughts and feelings. I also just want to point out that intrinsically that's what we do as human beings when we are struggling, period. Maybe it's not that I'm struggling with my relationship, but I'm struggling with a lot of emotion and conflict inside of myself. Just notice how we handle that. We tend to pull away. We pull back. I don't want to go to the party because I don't need any more input. I need to digest down what I'm currently feeling and I will as a human being. So we intrinsically pull away and need space to do that process. So typically when we go into I need to separate. It's because there is so much that I have probably lived with in pretend and illusion for long periods of time that now it's getting the best of me and I just, I can't think of anything else other than just resolving the internal conflict that I'm experiencing inside of myself. We're literally on survival mode.

And I to think to be totally fair and objective here. I think when any of us get to that place, it's a tremendous demonstration of courage because there is nothing easy to take that step when we've been experiencing what we just described. Maybe closer to home, literally, it's a lot easier to kind of keep things looking okay on the outside. But when we feel like Stacy shared that, that there's nothing left in us and we've got to take that step, literally that physical step, that takes a lot of courage. I'm not saying, please don't misunderstand what I'm saying, but to take that step after what Stacy and Brooke have just described, we don't just go there immediately. And many of us wrestle that for many different times and gestation periods. It's a very courageous move because we don't know what's going to happen, especially.

When we know it's Going to hurt our partner's feelings?

Absolutely, yes.

And rattle our children. Oh, my gosh, yes.

So some people would say, well, then just stay. If you don't want to hurt your partner and you don't want to rattle your kids, then just stay. But it's important to realize that the person is really struggling. So they wouldn't be asking for these things unless it was an emergency situation. And we don't tend to look at our emotions as the same way that we do, like a health emergency, but it is the same. We just don't see them.

Like Momchi always said, well, let's play it out. Let's say they do stay. Let's say through the enrollment process, right. We encourage them through a measure of things to get them to stay. I just am going to propose to you that you're going to have a shell of a person, right? That you are not going to have a fully present, right, thriving human being on your hands. Sure, they'll be in the house, and sure, they'll drive the kids to school and maybe even make some mills and take out the trash and contribute money into the household. But as far as, like, having a thriving human being, the house with you, you're going to have a shell of a person instead. And here's the most frustrating part. You're going to know it, right? That emotional connection that you're panicked, that you're not. That you might be losing, you're not going to have that. Because we show up as good as we feel as a human being. There's no if, ands, or buts around it. And so if I'm not okay inside of myself, I'm not going to show up very well. I'm not going to be able to be present truly with you, to create those wonderful moments of romance and connection that you're longing for. So if you're going to beg them to the lens of manipulation and obligation, then you've got to be prepared that there's this other aspect or chapter of relationships you're not going to have available to you. And is that really what you want? Is that really what you want?

It's going to be like living with a robot.

Yes. And there are many, many relationships, many, many relationships that are just like that. Right. That the measure of success is that we've lived in the same house for 60 years or 70 years, 40 years. And I'm asking you, is time the only measurement that we want to use for this? Are there other things that we might want to consider as well, like the health and well being of everybody in it. Right. That this is something that contributes well being and wholeness to everyone. And as I like to say, listen, if we are in a co creation with somebody and they are struggling, they're not the only ones that are going to struggle. This is a co creation. Right? And so if they have a problem, we have a problem problem. It's not their problem to solve, it's our problem to solve. And we've got to be able to tool up and skill up and get the mentorship that we need so that we can go and accomplish that in our co creation together. Otherwise it is going to divide us. Rather than be afraid of that. I hope that you're hearing that as the good news that it is. This is an opportunity for us to learn and grow and understand in hopes that we can create something better that helps us all thrive and become better human beings. That's the goal.

Yes, we're, we're advocating for saving the relationship, not for driving into the ground and grinding it into a pole till there's none left. We want this to be a wake up call for everybody that we want you to save it so you can stay together, not break up. I think some people are like, oh, you're advocating for space so that you can end all the marriages. No, we want the opposite. We're doing this because we want everybody to be able to learn the tools and skills that are necessary well and.

Navigate through this need for space by A understanding it and B being able to navigate through it in a good way. Typically what happens is when somebody gets hurt, we pretend like we don't care. So then everybody pushes everybody away. That just creates more of what you don't want. And so there's some human behavior, things that we just need to understand and get clear with. Things that you've probably never been taught, but in truth telling probably needed to have been taught at the very latest junior high. Right. So that these things don't tend to be these mysterious scary things. And somebody who says I'm just not going to get into a marriage or a commitment thinks that they've solved their problem. My friend, I have terrible news. The terrible news is you're saying that by not getting into a relationship you're going to absolve yourself of any emotional pain. And I'm here to tell you not being in a relationship or being able to commit and cross that line when you've met somebody you want to spend time with and co create with is just as painful as being in One and trying to navigate through the space that's needed. You keep yourself in a perpetual state of space thinking that's going to keep you safe. Now listen, we all have to choose our way through this, right? I'm not professing that everybody just run out and get into a relationship either. What I am proposing is that these things have a way of really showing up in different ways and in different rays of opportunity for us as a human being. And thinking that you're just not going to feel emotional pain as a result of human relationships is a lie in and of itself. Oh, the heck you won't. Right? I've met several people, I've worked with several people, I've been there myself who thought that just xing out a relationship and trying my best to not care anymore would be the saving grace that I've been looking for. And actually it didn't go so well. And it doesn't go so well because it's painful to not be in a relationship when you meet somebody you want to get all in with.

Weren't you through with relationship just a day or so before I reached out to you back in 2010?

Yeah.

Didn't last too long, did it?

It didn't.

I messed that plan up. I guess you can blame me. You can blame me. Listener.

Well, and the reason that was is because I had such a profound experience with you 37 years later that I think if it was just an ordinary person on the street, I could have probably maintained that Hail Mary, never going to do that, never going to marry another man position I was in. But because of this 37 year history with you in my own mind, I was like, stop me dead in my tracks. Maybe I need to reconsider what I'm doing here. Maybe this really isn' what I want. Maybe it is, okay? And I could create the safety to step in and try again. And I just bring that story up because sometimes that's what we're doing when we say we need space. Sometimes we need to muster up the courage to just, okay, let's go again. Let's try again and see what's possible here. It doesn't have to be this hard line in the sand that sometimes we think it needs to be that. If you're feeling like you want to do another round with someone to make sure that you're complete or to truly explore what, what's possible in our relationship as we grow and work and practice together, then another round is always a really good idea. If you're finding it really difficult to let go right after having space, then another round is a really great idea to get complete, to know. Because when we just cut it off without getting that completion, there's a tremendous amount of regret on the backside and a tremendous amount of uncertainty that creates additional emotional pain as a result of it. And that's just something to be mindful of. How many rounds should it take? As many rounds as you want to go. Because I'm going to tell you when you are complete. There's no question as to whether we're done right. But oft times I don't have that experience in a relationship because I'm simply waiting for it to get intolerable. And then I do. This must be it. This must be the moment I'm supposed to separate or get a divorce or be done without realizing. No, no, no. There's a lot of things that you can do before you just throw your hands in them in the air like a Hail Mary. There's a lot of things you don't understand and there's a lot of things to uncover and there's a lot of, of things that you could explore to see what might be possible, which is going to require another round with a plan, another round with support to navigate through and get the support you need to navigate and see what's possible. Those are big caveats. Are you going to do that probably on your own? No. Because you don't have the know how to do that. Not because you couldn't learn, because you've never been probably shown how, or that's never been modeled or demonstrated or taught or any of those things.

Number two is the three month mark. Is it healthy or alarming if your partner still wants space after three months?

I would say after three months you need to be in a place where you are, you're going to make a call and this just goes out of being respectful of the time that you've spent together, that in three months, if you don't know that you want to come back and work on the relationship, then my encouragement would be to end it, to proceed with divorce. Because here's the thing, there are plenty of opportunities for you to come back together at some point in time in the future. And just because you end it and move on so that you don't have somebody in waiting, that's a good thing. It kind of creates some lines so everybody can start living again. Because unfortunately, when we're in these patterns of limbo, we just hang out and hang out and hang out and it's not good for us, it's not good for our mental health. It's not good for everybody who's holding their breath waiting for a definitive answer. And so I would say if you're still in question after three months and you're not in a place where you, you want to put a plan together and explore what's possible in your relationship, it's better for you to end it, let everybody kind of self identify as a single person, an individual again. And then through that process, if and when you ever wanted to in the future, go again if you so chose to. But the, but it's the waiting that's the problem. It's the hanging out there for three months, which when you think about it, in this place is a really, really, really long time. It is not about the length of the marriage. It's about everybody in limbo for that of time. So when this starts to go on six months to a year, right, without going through realms of re engaging, seeing what's possible, working, retooling, going again, if we're just hanging out, waiting for some inevitable date or time in the future, then my position, my stance, based on what I know and see in my practice, is that it's better for us to end this so that we can both draw a line in the sand about self identifying. Let us grow, let us learn, let us do what we need to do individually between we've stalemated the indecision of it all, which is going to be the nemesis for everybody. It's going to continue to be that conflict with inside of you that's unresolved. And at this point in time, we're just trying to kick the can down the road so that we don't address it. We're not, we're going to kick it further down the road because this is uncomfortable. It hurts, right? It's disconnection is painful when you really understand that we literally have emotional ties that bind us. And so, so those need to atrophy if we're going to let go of each other for real. And that's painful. Just as anything that we experience in the world in which we live in is painful as it atrophies. And it's important that if we're just going to keep kicking the can down the road and the atrophy is happening anyway, then we have nothing to lose and everything to gain by just drawing a definitive line and saying, okay, look, if we're not back together in three months, okay, I got it, but I've got to move on. And that's what you'll typically find is the person who's been waiting finds that their mental and emotional, emotional and physical health has been suffering for three months, 90 days. And it's not healthy for them to continue to hang out and wait here. And so inevitably, if the person who's had space isn't wanting to draw that line in the sand, typically the person who has been waiting will, because it's so difficult on us to hang out in unknowing for extended periods of time with no end in sight, we'll just jump anyway.

Have we found a window doing this with people in this place? And we've worked with lots of people in this place. The more complexity, the more what I like to say, tentacles to the relationship. Like you said, children, business, all the things that, you know, we ask people, encourage them to put them, put those on the shelf. Does that add to the indecisiveness to make that 90 day call? What you just described, typically the pattern, meaning the more that that's there, the harder it is to draw that line that you just described.

So just remember there's a couple of distinctions here. We're talking about somebody who, who has asked for space, right? And in this space, they've typically left the home, okay? And they're doing life on their own. They're creating a life separate. And the longer that that goes on, the more that's going to happen. That's very different than somebody who's living outside of the home. But we have a plan that we're working and we're working to get back. I have several clients that I work with in this space. They're living apart, but they still come together regarding the kids. In fact, they even rotate being in the home so that they can support the kids and try and keep things as stable as possible for them, as well as they're still planning finances together, as well as they're still going to learn, practice, do sessions with me. We have a plan that we're following that's very different than just hanging out there in perpetuity. I just want to create that distinction there. We have one client who has moved back into the family home a couple of times and then moved out. But they continue to work and explore what's possible. And they've been out that for quite some time now, which there's no right or wrong to any of them of this. I'm just saying when I draw that hard line in the sand, I just want to be absolutely crystal clear here. If it's been Three months and nothing is happening. You're probably going to be better off to end it so that everybody can start living again instead of holding their breath, wondering what the future is going to bring. It allows everybody to move. That's very different than a couple who's working on the relationship, learning, growing, trying to support the family, those kind of kinds of things. What's our next question?

The next question is, how can you maintain your identity when you're focused on adapting to your partner's need for space?

That's exactly what needs to happen. And in that asking of that question, you also start to see how difficult it is. And this is because we lose a sense of ourselves in trying to think about all the potential ways that I could get this person to come back. Because the belief is that if I get them to come back, then I'm going to be okay without realizing. Actually, you're going to be okay when you realize that you feel really good about the person you're becoming, right. And you're showing up as that. And then they're going to want to reach back out for you when they see you doing those things. And here's the tricky part. At first, you're going to do it for them, and that's okay. But eventually, I want it to feel so good for you, you start to do it yourself. And so it's really important that you let go of trying to figure them out, because that's impossible. You can't figure them out. You don't even have access to the intel. But the one person that you can figure out is your yourself. The one person that you can get closer and more in tune with and in touch with is you. And so this is an important time for you to get back to doing all the things that you were probably doing before this relationship happened that you then started to, little by little, put on the shelf so that you could become the person that this person would love. There's typically a place where we try and morph out of love to become the person we think our person wants. However that becomes comes a very unclear picture. Because what I have found is we don't have those conversations with a high degree of clarity at all. There's a lot of assumptions based on unspoken things that tell me I need to become or do this and this and this and this. There's not a lot of specific clarity to them. And so even though you think you might have had those conversations over and over and over again, or you think you've got a pretty good pulse on It I promise when you start digging down and allowing everybody to share their individual perspectives, perspectives, you're going to find that there are many places where you were just simply off base. That's part of the understanding that needs to happen. So just all that to say, the one thing you can do is come back to yourself and establish and re establish a relationship with you and know that both of you are taking space now and both of you, if you're, if you're taking advantage of the timing, are doing just that. You're having to re identify and within yourself so that you can decide what's possible and what you have to contribute and give to each other to create the relationship. Overall, everybody's probably overextended and over given in ways you don't even realize.

Okay, so the next question is, the number one question we were asked is what is the amount of time I should give in space like 30 days? Tell me what is the answer? How much time should I give them?

I have good news and bad news. There is no amount of space space that we can quantify because each and every person as well as each and every couple are different and are going to have different needs based on the circumstances of where that person is internally. And there's a variety of needs that are going to need to be looked at and understood there. However, that being said, as I've said earlier here in our podcast, three months is a great benchmark and here's why. It's not that anything magical is going to happen in three months. It's not like all of a sudden, well, okay, we're going to give it three months and then something magical is going to happen. No, the reason why I three months is because that's a long time for us to just hang out and not have anything happen and still be questioning and spiraling in what does the future hold for me as a human being? And that is very, very difficult on us to just reel in the unknown is a very, very painful place for us to be. And so if I'm in that space, what you're going to find nine times out of ten is the person who's waiting is going to become weary of and quite, quite frankly not well in the waiting process. And so it would be better for them to let go for now so that they can begin to live again. Because there's this time where we all kind of just sit around and hold our breath right in this high sensitivity state which creates and produces a lot of anxiety trying to figure out what the future brings so is it space.

With a plan then? So maybe the initial piece of the plan that we're advocating here would be some, some type of a timeline. Would that be a good thing? Maybe just that one component to focus on?

Yes, absolutely. A plan can be. Tell me how much time you think and somebody's going to say, I don't know. Okay, well, if you had to guess, let's just break it down into doable chunks. Are we talking a couple of weeks? Are we talking a 30 days? Are we going to. When are we going to come back and reevaluate this? Okay. And again, based on where everybody is in the circumstances of the relationship, that is completely negotiable. But to not have that conversation is the cruel part, right? To just say, okay, in 30 days, let's come back around and please give me space for 30 days. And in 30 days I'm going to come back around and we're going to have a conversation about this. That would be a plan or while we're separated. Here's the things that I would like to ask you for. And there are critical things based on the circumstances of your relationship that we want to talk about. We want to talk about the kids, we want to talk about the finances, we want to talk about are we going to do days? We want to talk about how often should we connect and touch point for each other. Are we going to do, which I highly recommend you do, whether that's even separate initially, get some help and support, skill up, learn some tools, get some help because this needs to transform, this needs to grow and be understood in ways right now that you're probably not thinking. And that's why a plan is so important. We're big on plans over here. And I know it's a new conversation, right? We are trying to help you do a better job of getting through the need for separation and space. And our goal here and the reason why we do this conversation and we have our support group and we work with individuals here, is because we want this to go well for you. And what we also know is that hanging out in the unknown is not going to help anybody get through this in a better way. You deserve it. Your partner deserves it. Your kids deserve it. This has got to be something we get better at instead of just hanging out in the space in suffering that is no longer okay. There are better ways to do this, and that's what we're trying to tell you is that there are many things we can do right now while we're all in this place. Of space.

And I think it's probably pretty fair to say because yes, as a body work, in a family, we know it can go better. But I don't think there's too many examples of that. And that's why when everyone hears all this space, oh, oh, it's over. No, it's not. It's not. But probably fair to say if it's space with just more space and space in a limited time, then that's probably pretty fair to say. Yeah, it probably is over because not. There's not much opportunity for transformation. What you know, so we're all about no turning and be able to use this time as a catalyst for introspection, understanding.

Yes, transformation.

That's a very different conversation than the traditional one that most people revert to because quite frankly, that's the only one that they've ever heard of. Our no.

That's why so many people in our comments are saying no, this is too many mind games or this is exhausting or I hope by answering these questions we've dispelled those thoughts because we're trying to do the opposite of that which I think so now I think we have time for one more question. Another common question that was asked by the anxious people in the comments. How can we balance checking in in with our partner for reassurance and just having checkpoints without coming across as anxious or selfish?

That's a really great question. I think anything that we own, as far as an emotion goes, translate and cross pollinates a lot better. Where we tend to go is I say because you've left, I'm feeling this way. No, you're feeling this way. Just own it. And we can talk and share those things. But the minute it crosses a very delicate line into making the manipulation happen, happen right where I'm trying to blame or say this is happening because you did. That's true. But I'm still having my own set of emotions here. These are my emotions. This is how I'm interpreting this. And I know that's a difficult thing because the person leaving did bring up all of these emotions in you. But I. We can go the other way too, that when the two of you fell in love, you were having your own individual emotions then too about this person and what they meant to you and what you wanted to see happen in your relationship. Relationship. And that was just as much of a place of unknown as you are right now. So own your feelings, own what's going on inside of you and improve your ability to share those. When you do connect here's the thing, nobody wants to be accused or blamed or finger pointed, but I totally, as a human being can make space for your emotions if you'll just simply own them and share them with me. And that would be a great place to start.

And also I think they were referring to what you just answered, but also how often should they be checking in? They don't want to seem like very anxious even though it's what they're feeling. But can you help anxious and avoidant people? What language would be good to use to come up with a communication frequency, part of their plan during this time for space so that both sides could feel like they were being heard?

Yeah, I think it's important that that would be a conversation. I hesitate just throwing out a number. I can tell you things that are common. But for you and your situation and what, what everybody needs, there's going to be some very individual nuances there that we would want to have a conversation about. Very common numbers though is that we check in morning and night. You know, it's a very minimum. How are you doing? Share our day. Just to have a touchstone every day. That's, that's a very common one that comes up. And then some people want to do more than that. I, I know couples who still get together and go out with the kids and spend family time together once a week. It could be a variety of things, things based on what everybody is willing to do, how, what everybody is willing to contribute into this conversation.

So how about as far as that communication, do we want to try to keep it pretty agreed upon as to what we're going to like? I mean I think the more granular we try to get here, might we we trying to find like are we.

Talking about solving our relationship problems? Are we talking about the past? What are we talking about during these check in points?

I think initially out of the gate, I would encourage you to just talk about what's current, present day happening and maybe some of the details about maybe household needs or the children initially.

Especially if there are no children or they aren't married.

There's usually financial logistics that we need to talk about or plan and how are we going to divide up the finances and who's going to be paying for what. That's a, that's an important conversation to have when here's the thing, if you don't scale up, I'd love to just be able to say yes, let's start talking about the past. Just own your emotions and how that made you feel. But we don't have the skill to do that. You don't have the skill to do that right now. And so nine times out of 10, if you start talking about the past or talking about your emotions from a place of well, I'm feeling this because of what you did. It's going to derail the conversations and then you're not going to want to connect twice a day. You're going to say, you know what, I'm really good, I'll see you next week. Don't contact me throughout the weekend. I want to set you up for success. So if you just talk about out real time, where I'm at, what I'm feeling, what I'm struggling with, how my day went, some logistics of running our household or anything else that we might have in motion as part of our co creation is a great way to start. And then immediately, and I do mean immediately, start learning the skills that you need so that you can start doing a deeper dive into those conversations. The problem is you don't have any emotional safety or skill to do it. And so everybody's going to get defensive in about a half of an animal nanosecond. And then that just gets frustrating because it's just driving a deeper wedge in regards to the direction that we're trying to go.

Probably more confirmation that the space choice was the good one. Right. If we don't do something different. See, this is exactly why I needed to take space. Yeah, no, we don't want that.

That's the part of transformation I think that's really difficult to see in this space. We're so focused on somebody left. We're not focusing on things that we don't understand as a part of being in this relationship with each other.

So maybe said another way is what might be my part, as hard as that may be to self examine, where is my part that has played out in this to create this need for space? Right.

And that's a hard one. That's a really, really hard one for us to take on.

But another one is or is having the ability to imagine what you want the relationship to be, not what you want it not to be.

Exactly. Creating a vision should be part of a plan. Like in 30 days, when we look at this, where do we want to be and know that it's been a win and that we've made progress as humans, especially in the world of emotion, which is what a relationship is. There's not a journey that's more emotional than this. It's really difficult to see progress. So Unless we have something to track us. Right. It's really difficult to feel like we're making any progress at all. And so this plan becomes really, really important. We. Our plan that we use is called the Lease option Contract for Love. And we use use it for this space. We also use it for couples who are newly coming together. And it's a plan that we can track and evaluate over time that helps us see the progress, helps us chart the understanding, and it also supports us in practicing the skills that are necessary in order to transform and show up in a better way.

And it also is really good. Excuse me. I think this is really important. You don't try to take on the enormity of the entire situation all in one bite. And that is crucial. I know I've said that before, but this is, I think, think why this can be such an overwhelming place to be. Because you think, omg, where would I even begin? Or where do I even begin? And we understand that.

It also shows you there are actually pockets of good in your relationship because it tells you, no, we don't need to work on that part because we're good. So it reminds you that there is some stuff that's good in your relationship, even though you feel like everything is bad and your world is falling apart.

Yeah. That can be all consuming. And we do forget that there is good here. That's why you've been together for the emotion amount of time that you've been is there are good things that started this relationship off in the first place. Yeah. So that good is still here, it is still present, but it definitely gets lost in the emotional pain that we're not quite sure how to manage. And it literally is learning how to manage the emotional pain as well as skilling up that's going to help you get through this. And you're probably going to need a plan and some support to do that.

So where can we go if we're struggling with space or separation and we would like a little bit of mentorship?

Yeah. As we wrap up today's episode, I want to mention that we've launched our Tailor Made Love and Limbo separation support sessions. These are specialized sessions focused specifically on guiding you through the trials of separation. And if by chance right now you find yourself in the middle of a painful separation or feeling a silent drift in your relationship, remember you're not alone and we're right here to walk with you every step of the way. In these support sessions, we get up to close and personal guiding and walking by your side while you Work through complex emotions and tough decisions. It's about addressing your challenges with empathy and compassion. And you can jump in and join us in the Love and Limbo Separation support group today. You'll find all the information that you need to enroll in the show notes here and by visiting loveinlimbo.com step into the space of understanding today. We'd love to have you join us. And by chance, if this series has, has resonated with you and that you know of someone in your sphere of influence who may be going through these experiences again, one of the most painful places in our relationship journey, please don't hesitate to share this information with them. There's better ways that we can navigate through this need for separation and space in our human relationships. And it's high time that we help give people the support that they need to navigate through this very difficult place with the help and support that will actually, actually help and support them. Not theory, not conversation. Right? We're not talking about labels. We're not talking about attachment styles. We're giving you real skills for progression and a plan to help you get there.

I would just say being in this place myself, this is a very difficult place to share, even with sometimes the people very close to us. If you are aware of someone, I can just share with you with great love and respect. It's a very difficult place for any of us to be, be. And so this is what drives a lot of us as a family is there's so much pain out there and this place is filled with it. I've had calls with people just going through a day, a step at a time and having one heck of a rodeo. And so we're all about bringing us some, what we like to say, some new deposits into that very depleted emotional gas tank. It is bone dry. And so this can be really, really crucial and very helpful to someone. If you know in your space that you know, know is struggling, it really can be a tremendous gift.

Hey. And as you share it, you don't need to have them share what's going on and all the details of that. Even if you just sense that maybe they're struggling, you can just simply say, hey, I thought of you. This may not apply, but in case it does, I'm just going to send it along to you and then you decide for yourself.

Well, because I would bet that's really, for most of us, that's going to be. It's that into intuition, that hunch that something just seems to be a little bit off with our special people in our world. And we do know people that we know. Well, all. It's not my brother, you know, who's been on our show who's all about mental health most of the time. If we know people, it's not what's being said that we can take notice of that will give us the key rather than what is being said. Yeah, well said.

So let's have a little bit of follow the fun today, shall we? We're going to turn a corner as we always do. And today I just want to invite you to do something for yourself, something that brings pleasure and the much needed exhale. After all, if you're in this space, it's exactly what it is you need to do in order to weather some of the emotional challenges that are coming your way. And I just want you to think of doing something physical because something physical is the counter punch when we're feeling emotionally overwhelmed. So think about, like, pampering your physical body and. Or moving your physical body. These are things that will greatly help you balance the overwhelm that's actually, actually taking place within you. And just to get more granular in massages or baths or a walk, moving your physical body, dancing, playing a sport, laughing with friends, cooking, preparing a nice meal, these are things that move your physical body. And of course, the pampering of your body is obvious too, right? Nails and hair and baths and massages and sweet oils and all kinds of things that we can use to just simply bring the ease and the pleasure that we need. So just think of something physical, move it or pamper it, and you're going to have some relief, I promise. So in the close of our show, our song today is a song by Brandy Carlisle and Sam Smith, and they sing together a Party of One, the song where they say, I loved you the first time I saw you, and I love you still. I'm tired and I don't want to be writing anymore. I don't want to fight anymore. And I'm not taking your side anymore. I'm leaving, but I'm coming home because I'm yours. And this is a song that actually is a song of hope. Right? As we take space and we recognize and realize in the contrast of our experiences that I actually do miss some of those things about you. We didn't talk about this in the episode, but that's one of the things that space provides us. We can be so mired that nothing is working and nothing is good. And then I take some space and. And go, yeah, but I miss our conversations in the morning over a cup of coffee. You know, it's the little things. Oh, I miss the way we cuddle at night when we jump into bed. You know, I miss fill in the blank. And often those are the things that we need to and have the opportunities to see when we take space. So I love that part of the song where they said, but I'm coming home because I'm yours. You can listen to this week's song along with our entire relationship playlist by going to our website or a podcast page.

So why is this song so moving for you?

I'm trying to put it in words. It's moving for me because it's those beautiful little things that we can get so upset about and miss. And then we have the time and space, we realize, man, I kind of like you. I really do kind of miss you. And I wish more people could see the beauty in their relationships instead of all the pain. And I think we get stuck and hung up in the pain because we spend so much time focusing on it and we miss all the little things that are actually precious.

And would this be the reason why you're so consistent? And even as much as Brooke and I like to challenge you, do we still need to conclude follow the fun and the song that these are the parts that potentially can allow you to step into this place that maybe you are not able to because song is very powerful, right?

Absolutely.

Lyrics have the ability to speak about things. Songs are different. So it reminds you of things that you're really feeling because we all have had that experience or God, this song is nailing my feelings right now. When you're driving alone in a car. And I think that's. It's kind of a powerful way to end this three episode series because we've been talking a lot of negative, hard things that are hard for people to get their arm arms around. But for this last episode, three reminder that you can remember all the things you love about your partner even when times are hard. I would argue that that's probably the best time to do it.

And then at the very least, you know it's going to give us some empathy and some grace for this person that you've been in a relationship with and say you love. And I guess really at the heart of it is if we could have more grace for ourselves and each other. I think the relationship journey would go a lot smoother if we could remember the good in these things. And even though we do messed up things and say things that are hurtful and do things that cause emotions to flash. Typically, we're not doing them to intentionally hurt you. I'm doing them because I'm hurting myself. And it's just. Yeah, I love music for that reason. Like Brooke said, it does bring us and move us to parts in our hearts. And the ultimate is yes, for you to see those things in the moments of space that you. You miss. Right.

It's.

It literally is part of why the anxious person starts to reel because that's all they're thinking about, right? They pull out the books and the pictures and they remember all the good moments while the person who's needing space is trying to think of something else. And those are all tactics to to avoid what next absolutely needs to be addressed, which is what are we going to do here? I need to face myself so that we can make some progress and decide what we are in our co creation. So you can listen to this week's song along with our entire relationship playlist by going to our website website podcast page. You can also find it on Spotify at the Love Shack Live Playlist. Thank you so much again for all of your engagement, your questions, your listening, your shares. It's been an incredible thing to experience and I just really want to extend a heartfelt thank you to you for letting us have this conversation with you. And just know that we look so forward to having and continuing these conversations right here in the Love Shack. We hope that you'll join us again.

All right, it's time to leave the Love Shack, but before we part ways, we want you to know our door is always open and we'll leave the porch light on. Ready to welcome you back whenever you need a dose of relationship wisdom. For more resources and tools, visit us atlove shack live.com to dive deeper into the topics we've explored and find additional support for your relationship journey. Stay connected connected by subscribing to our podcast. Thank you for being part of our Love Shack Live community.