#211: Can You Save Your Relationship When Your Partner Wants Out?

Are you feeling stuck, that painful place where your relationship isn't over but it's not thriving either? Maybe your partner's asked for space, or worse, divorce papers have been filed. You're holding on, hoping, wondering, can this relationship be saved or am I fooling myself? If that's where you are right now, you're not alone. This space, what we call the Land of Maybe, is a roller coaster ride of hope, despair and confusion. And while it can feel like a living hell on Earth, it's also, believe it or not, a space space full of possibilities. Today's conversation offers fresh insights and actionable steps that meet you exactly where you are. Welcome to Love Shack Live, the podcast for anyone at a relationship crossroads. Whether you're navigating daily conflicts, emotional disconnection, or the fear that things might be coming to an end, we're here to help. I'm your host, Stacy Bartley, a relationship mentor and with over a decade of experience helping couples transform their love stories. Joining me are my co host and lover, Tom and our daughter Brooke. Together we bring you fresh perspectives and heartfelt support to this journey through the Land of maybe. We're bringing back an episode that struck a powerful chord with so many of our listeners, an essential conversation about navigating the uncertainty of space and separation in a relationship. Can a relationship survive after one partner has filed for divorce or asked for space? And even more importantly, how do you navigate the emotional chaos of this space without losing yourself in the process? If you're returning to this episode, it's because its lessons resonate deeply and for good reason. I want you to know that each time you listen, new layers of understanding emerge, helping you shift from fear and confusion to clarity and strength. If you're tuning into this episode for the first time, it's an essential guide for anyone grappling with the Land of maybe in their relationship. With whether you're living apart or simply feeling emotionally distant, you'll uncover the tools, strategies, and mindset shifts you need to navigate this challenging time. Today we'll reveal why the Land of maybe can feel so unbearable and how to find peace amidst the uncertainty. What needs to happen for a relationship to heal, even when one partner seems resolved to leave? And how letting go not of hope but of control can open the door to new possibilities, whether together or apart. You'll also hear real stories of couples who've faced these same struggles. Some reconciled, some parted ways, but all found much needed clarity and healing through their journeys. If you're facing space in your relationship, this conversation is more Urgent and relevant than ever. Space doesn't have to mean the end. It can be a powerful pause that allows for transformation, growth, and healing. But only if you approach it in the right way. Are you ready to stop clinging to what was and start imagining what could. To explore the hidden opportunities within the land of maybe and discover a path forward. Let's dive in. This is Love Shack Live, where we turn relationship trials into triumphs.

Hey, thank you for coming. Welcome to the Love Shack. We take your questions seriously, and we also are here for you, our listeners. So the listener question that came in on Instagram that inspired this podcast episode is, can you do an episode on avoiding divorce after one partner has already filed? I've been stuck in the land of maybe for a year, still hoping to reconcile and believe that our marriage can be salvaged. Even though we only had a few counseling sessions last year without much progress, my partner has signed the divorce decree and seems resolved to end our marriage. So let's begin our conversation by defining what being in the land of maybe is. Sure, we all know what it feels like, but what is it really? The land of maybe is a period of uncertainty after one partner has filed for a divorce or asked for space in the relationship, but before the relationship has conclusively ended. It can also be a space I feel within myself as I, on my own accord, long to feel included in the relationship and wonder if I should also exit the relationship. I'm kind of on the fence, so.

Meaning we could technically still be in the same house, not technically be separated and experiencing a sense of the land of maybe.

Absolutely. In fact, the person who's asked for space has probably already done this piece where I'm sorting through should I stay, Should I go? Should I stay, Should I go? And every day is kind of like a little mini calculator where you're trying to assess and take notes of and keep score for all the reasons why I should stay and all the reasons I should go. And every day it can be a changing experience. Oh, okay, I'm gonna stay. Yeah, it's gonna be fine. It's gonna be great. You know, after all, we had sex last night. Oh, God, no. If this conversation is gonna come up and this is where you're gonna go, and this is what you're gonna say, and this is where you're gonna take it, I'm out of here. And that conversation usually happens for a significant period of time before anybody steps in and says, hey, I need space. I can't do this anymore. I need a divorce. You know, that emotional traversing inside has taken place.

I think a lot of people in marriages especially go through periods of being really in love with your partner, and other times of being like, oh, you're kind of annoying me. It's just natural. We go through periods and cycles in our relationships every day. And I was gonna say, a lot of the land of maybe happens internally without ever sharing it. Your partner could have absolutely no clue that you're in the land of maybe. It doesn't have to be spoken out loud. A lot of times, the land of maybe is in. In secret, in private. We're going through these questions in our minds, and you have no idea. And that's not to freak you out. It's just to let you know that these episodes, maybe you think, oh, I don't need those. They apply to everybody. Because this space that we've talked so much about can be happening inside of your partner, and you don't know. But if you make some of the changes that we're talking about, you could intentionally create a safe place in your relationship that would allow those issues to come to the table rather than being kept inside forever, which is what happens.

For a lot of people.

That makes me think about. We've heard more than once. I've never felt so alone as I was laying next to my partner, My husband, my wife, my spouse never been so alone while I was next to that person.

Adding onto that, dad, I bet a lot of people, including that person's partner, probably thought, my marriage is fine. And their friends are like, oh, they have a wonderful marriage. They're always together, and they're so happy. Yet one of the partners is feeling more alone than they ever could. And it could be for so many reasons. It could be because you simply don't have the courage to voice your problems. It could have nothing to do with your partner. You know, there's a lot of situations that can create that feeling inside of you. But as a partner to someone, you do have the power to make your relationship more emotionally safe so that these things don't have to stay inside forever.

That it's the secrets that kill us.

And.

And the more I feel like my needs are not being met, and I may not even be disclosing what they are, the more I can come to the conclusion that they can't be met and won't be met, and I make up a whole narrative about what you're capable of and what you're not. And I still haven't spoken a word that this is all internally going on within me. And. And that's how this typically plays out, where somebody says, I'm shocked. I can't believe that this is happening. I had no idea it was coming out of left field. Yeah, I know, because it was never shared and it was never talked about. And that typically happens because my partner and I didn't necessarily share things or I was sharing, but I. My partner wasn't. And. And this is how we end up in these places of emotional space or land of maybe. I want you to know both whether it's happening internally or it's actually being spoken out loud, and we are in a place of divorce or place of separation for the moment, both create an emotional roller coaster that will include huge swings of hope. Days where you go, okay, okay, we're gonna work this out. They texted me, they said hello, we did a date. They said this thing. I think that means it's a good sign. And. And we get so sensitive and so attuned to everything that is done and said and spoken, as well as not said and done and spoken. And that's why there will also be not only swings of hope, but despair and confusion and a desperate longing for resolution. And this is why we call it hell on earth, because you are in huge swings of these emotions. And if I'm the person who's questioning the relationship, let's say I'm the person who's asked for divorce or space. I myself am experiencing this as well, and I'm trying to decide if I'm all in or I'm all out. Or I might do the logical thing, which is try and do both. Well, I'll participate here, but I won't get all in. And I'll make sure I have a door that gives me an out just in case things don't go my way. I can exit stage left. And. And that's a hell of a place to live in too, because you're not really ever in one place or the other. You've got yourself living in a place in a space internally of conflict, where every day I'm having to decide, am I safe? Am I not? Do I get in? Do I get out? And so you might see your partner doing this. You might see your partner being in. We have a lovely evening. We make love and we talk about a future, and then they freak out and they're out, and you don't hear from them for three days. It's because they're working out a lot of their own internal conflict and fear about where are they going to stand and where do they feel comfortable? And very often what's needed here in this place is some support, some skills, some, some, somebody, usually a third party to create a safe place to explore and lay the emotions and the thoughts and the fears on the table. So much so that we can sort through them and decide which ones do we need to address or learn how to take on and which ones do I just need to let go and move through? Recognizing and realizing this is a new day, this is a new moment where we can create anything that we want. And so the land of maybe is a hell of a place to live. It is one that creates a tremendous amount of breakdown. And when I say breakdown, I'm meaning emotional breakdown which will typically lead to physical breakdown if I hang out in that place and space long enough. And so it's a place that we wanna not have to hang out in any longer than we need to, but it's also a place that I don't want you to feel like you need to rush through as well. On an Instagram live today, we were talking about how it is that this place, this most difficult place in the relationship journey, it is this land of maybe. It is space of limbo and how easily we can be manipulated as human beings to reacting to the fear and the discomfort of it. And so there are a lot of relationship platforms out there who will leverage this to their advantage, who will install even more fear designed to get you to take action now, like, hurry, hurry, hurry. You don't want this to be you? Get in and do this program and save your relationship today. It's 100% guaranteed. Or you don't want this to be you. You better learn these skills and these tips and tricks right now. And I'm just bringing this up because it makes me crazy sometimes. You want to talk about a soapbox because the last thing you want to do in this place and time that is the most difficult part of the journey is to panic. Because panicking will cause you to make decisions and choices the likes of which we'll typically regret later. We'll say and do things in this place and space, in a place of panic that are not at all going to take us where it is we need to go. Okay, I'm reacting to the panic and the fear. Instead of slowing down, taking a breath and looking at many different angles and perspectives to collect the information and understanding that I need so I can make a choice regarding the future of my life.

I would say definitely the positive here. We've talked about this a lot in the past episodes. Your awareness is heightened now because of what Stacy and what you've all shared. Meaning you're going through a situation most likely and hopefully not often happens or maybe this is the first time it happens. So, meaning your awareness is very high and your motivation is very high because you are experiencing a lot of pain emotionally and mostly other places too physical. So that's a good thing. But then what do we do with this? Awareness is the key component where I hope and sense you'll see we take a different approach. So it is a gift. I'm not dismissing what you're going through, but to be fair, don't think you would be listening to us if you weren't going through this. So what can I do now with this? Rather than panic and freak out and be obsessed, what my partner is or is not doing, that's not going to get you to where you want to go.

Mm. What can I do with this time and place and space that will actually benefit me and my chances of reconciliation versus panic, Freak out and then have a tremendous amount of regret when it doesn't go the way I wanted it to go. I'm not putting my faith and my hope and things outside of myself. Skill up. Create learning and understanding and exploration. Yes. So that you can make a choice and a decision in your life that will serve you best. And there's only one person on the planet who can make that choice and that is you. And if you don't know how to choose in to things like that, then yes. Continue learning, continue the journey, continue the exploration. Because eventually you will understand and know that there are reasons why our relationships, which I see as co creations, is having the experience that it is. And the thing that can be so frustrating and challenging about this is there is no physical evidence that this is actually taking place. Remember, relationships are the most emotional journey we will take as human beings and emotions are invisible. There is no tangible or physical evidence of what is being experienced. Meanwhile, what's happening is the fear and the discomfort and the disappointment and the frustration is building, it's mounting and we just don't know how to manage and deal with it. And it will tip. It will get to a place where I become so conflicted or so overwhelmed with it that the only thing I know to do then is to say, I need a divorce. I can't do this anymore. And I want you to see that relationships don't end because they don't have tremendous possibility in the individuals that are co creating together the potential and the Possibility is real and it's there. And it's valuable. Being able to take advantage of that possibility and create it into something that we can live out is the question. And when we run out of emotional gas, we simply lose our ability to show up in the relationship. It does not mean that you're not loved or that this good that was created wasn't good. It doesn't mean that there isn't tremendous possibilities and capabilities in the relationship as a whole. It just means one of us, or maybe the two of us, when I start looking, do not have the bandwidth emotionally to. To show up in it, to keep working.

We've reached a capacity issue.

We've reached a capacity issue. And that's why relationships end.

Well, that's.

Don't.

I know I've said this up, but it's. Think about it. We usually hear some version of really those precise words, one or more. I just can't do this anymore.

When we feel like you just said mom to and Dad. I just can't do this anymore. Or I've reached this point where I've said this so many times and nothing's changing. When we've reached that point. I've said this before in an episode, there's really two options, or I guess there's three. We can say I need space. We can say I need a divorce, or we can say nothing and nothing changes. And many people take many of those options, but we can't be surprised when we get to this point. I would propose there's a fourth option, which is space of the plan, which is what we talk about here in this very long series that we've done on space and separation. Because there is another way, and that's the way that we are talking about in this episode, but it's a way that we've never heard of before. It's a new way of dealing with space and separation and divorce and preventing those things. So it's okay that you've never heard of it, but it takes skill. Just like Mom 2 said, skill up. Because it takes skill and it takes emotional regulation. It takes knowing about boundaries. It takes finding all the places that were causing you and your partner pain along your relationship and going to those places and figuring out what are the skills that we're missing so we don't run into those problems anymore. Because really, it's probably a skill in every single one of those places where you're feeling pain or coming to the same arguments or feeling frustrated. It's just a skill that you're missing.

And the skill is going to help you have the conversation, you know, you need to have anyway in a way that we can garner a new solution out of it. That's why the skill is helpful and beneficial. And that would be the opposite of what we typically do, which is we simply cannot buy into the illusion that this is all your partner's fault. And we cannot buy into the idea that this is all your fault. And we tend to go those one of two places. It's either all my partner's fault and if they would just start figuring it out and take care of their shit, or gosh, if I could just pull my shit together, then we would all be fine. This simply cannot be true. It is not based in principle at all. Because hold on, it's a co creation. And what we forget is that there is always a cause and an effect. Meaning the way I show up in the relationship is going to impact my partner's behavior. And the way my partner shows up is going to affect my behavior. And what happens is I bounce off you, you bounce off me, I bounce off of you, you bounce off of me. And we have what we call our relationship dance. And it won't ever be one person's fault. And let's just say we take the word fault and throw it in the garbage can and instead we're looking at what is I do and how I show up and how that impacts you, and then what you do and, and how that impacts me. We would be better served to look at it from that angle because there's always in a co creation, a cause and an effect.

So if you're in a situation where you love your partner with all your heart and you want this relationship to work and your partner is gung ho on filing the divorce and signing the papers, how do you attempt to both get back on the same page?

What's going to need to happen is I'm probably going to have to embrace that they don't want to work on this relationship anymore right now. And often what we start buying into in the illusions of our mind is that a space, a place of space and separation or divorce is the end without realizing. Actually it could be a brand new beginning, it could be the letting go of what didn't work. And it can be a new beginning in regards to something that can be. And the more we cling onto something that somebody doesn't want to co create with me, the more we think about it and I can't think of better words to use and this isn't going to be pretty. But the more we choke out what is possible in the relationship as a whole, energetically, emotionally, it's like the tighter I cling to it, the more I choke out any possibility of what can be. I can't even go there. I can't even think about that. I am just so desperate to cling to what used to be that I choke out any new possibility. And so the first thing I'm going to invite you to do, as crazy as it sounds, is take a big breath and recognize and realize that this isn't an end. In fact, it could be a brand new beginning. But the deeper and longer you cling to it, what is possible here will continue to elude you. It doesn't mean it's the end. And I can give you, in fact, I'll give you a few stories. I have clients that with me, that I've worked with past and present that have divorced and they've come back around to come back together. I've had other couples that have filed for divorce and they never finalized it and they continue to work on their relationship. I've had other couples who have gotten divorced and remarried not once, not twice, but three times. I've had other couples that have gone through a place of space and separation once, twice, and now they're doing great. So it's. We can't let these moments of space and divorce be defining moments. They can be new beginnings if we will just let go and see what else is possible here. Yeah, now that doesn't, that doesn't mean that you won't have the letting go part and that will both create and morph into new chapters of life. But I want you to see that the letting go part, regardless of how it goes, is a life giving new opportunity of life yet again. And if I don't allow myself to go there, that I'm literally choking off life for myself, that will be the net result of that where I'm not gonna allow myself to begin again. Instead, I'm gonna remain here stuck, believing that I can't move on and that I'll never love again. And I won't ever allow my love, myself to love again. And that is exactly what's going to emotionally kill you. So that is exactly what it is we wanna encourage you not to do and that there is new life if we let go. Is it hard to let go? Hell yes, it is. Is there grieving that takes place? 100%. As we grieve, though, I want you to know you are sowing the seeds of new life and new possibility. And not only are you going to have the grieving process take root that. That it's challenging, I want you to also know that you're going to be surprised by what's going to emerge on the other side. If we will take the journey now, that's easier said than done. And you're probably gonna need some help and some support with that regardless of how this goes. And the truth is, we don't know how it's going to go. So instead of figuring out the future, we need to live it. And the best way to do that is to focus on figuring out yourself. And then you become open to reacquainting with your partner. And both of you have traversed to a new place. So that we do have the potential of recreating or reconciling things in a new place and in a new way, because I understand things about myself and so do you. And we can come together. We can also see things that didn't work and things that we're going to be mindful and do differently going forward. That's all a journey. And that's a journey that cannot be predicted on the front side. It is a journey that must be lived. So those couples I was telling you about, the thing that they all have in common is not what happened in their relationships and how they navigated through it. What they have in common is that each person was willing to come back to the table to do another round, to look at themselves, to learn some skills, to practice some new behaviors, and out of that, they could create a different dynamic in their relationship.

I think, speaking for the anxious people who are probably listening saying, I can't let go because if I do, then my marriage is going to be over. And I just. I'm not willing to do that, which I totally understand.

And I.

And I get why you have a mental block there. Like, that doesn't seem like a real good solution. But I just want to remind you that the way that we act when we're feeling so desperate and we're choking the life out of our relationship, like mom too said, and we're just desperate for our partner to stop the divorce or shred the papers or whatever, we're not showing up in a good way, we're not being our best selves, we're coming from a place of desperation, and we're probably doing and saying things that we wouldn't normally do, and it's taking a lot of your mental capacity and energy to stay in that place. So that is why we're suggesting letting go so that you can be done with that. Because that is not a life giving place to come from. It's very taxing and it's emotionally draining and you're not doing justice for your relationship and winning it back by showing up as that person to your partner. It's probably just pushing them away even more even though you are so desperate for the opposite to happen. And I know I've done that so many times, so I'm very familiar with that behavior pattern. And I'm not coming from a place of judgment. I just that would have been helpful to if that would have been pointed out to me in a loving way. So I just want the listener to know that's why we're suggesting that you let go. Because you can then also let go of that vicious cycle that you're in.

I'm glad that you actually brought that up because we show up as good as we feel and sometimes we don't think about that. So if I'm reeling in anxiety or I'm in the alternate pattern, which is some form of coercion or manipulation or force, thinking I'm just going to force the issue. I'm just going to threaten you and leverage you and then you won't leave or you won't carry through on this. Both are coming from the same emotional place and space and both are going to have us showing up in a way that on the backside we're not going to feel good about. We show up as good as we feel. And so in the letting go part and focusing on the one thing that I can manage and control in a good way, because that's might win. This is why we're going to point you back to highlighting the importance of understanding yourself. And what are your takeaways and what is it you miss that highlight, what it is that works for you in relationships and what are the parts that frustrate you and what are the needs and desires in the relationship that are not working for you? And often what we find are clients that say, gosh, I've never thought of it that way. I didn't realize in my desperation. Whether we're forcing and coercing or getting anxious and begging and pleading and going along with whatever is presented, I'll be available all the time, I'll give you whatever you need, just come home. We don't realize that in those moments we're not showing up as the best version of ourselves. And when we really stop to look at it, we realize that there are a Lot of things that aren't working for me too. And I reject myself. I essentially navigate away from me and what I know to be true in an effort to try and get you to do something. And the focus is always over there, as opposed to now. Wait a minute, I count too. I'm not superior then, but I'm certainly not less than either. I deserve a table or a chair at the table of relationship. I deserve a voice and a place and a space to be and to feel supported and loved and heard and in a sense, that I matter and so does my partner. And that's the sweet place that we want to get better at. That is probably going to require some skill and the learning of some new principles, along with a healthy dose of practice to help us do that. And it's also going to require some clear, honest communication. After all, if we're not willing to step into clear, honest communication now, then when are we going to do it? And if it seems insurmountable or overwhelming now, it's not going to get easier with time. In fact, we become more afraid the less we do it. So if I haven't talked really to you and shared my thoughts and feelings in months or even years, the longer I hang out in this place, the more likely we won't allow ourselves to have those conversations. And this is another benefit of being in a place of intense pain, like Tom had said earlier, and emotional discomfort is all of a sudden I'm willing to push past that fear to have maybe the first honest, open conversation we've had in years. I mean, after all, in the place where our relationship hangs in the balance. If not now, when? You better get good at saying what you need to say. And that is usually what opens up the clarity to helping us understand where we can go from here. Without that, what you find is the solutions that we need to go in a different direction will continue to stay buried within us. That if we can't lay what I call our emotional cards on the table, then we're not going to be successful in finding the solutions we need to navigate to a different place in the future because they reside in us. They don't reside in me. They reside within you and your partner and the dynamics of that cause and effect in your relationship. So we've got to get to a place where we know and understand how to have open communication that is genuine for me, where I get to say and ask for what it is I need. And I actually have the emotional regulation to allow you to do that the same.

And Would you say in all the years we've been doing this, when people reach this place, that's probably mean to be really objective. That's gonna be difficult for you to facilitate that type of a conversation on your own?

Well, if you could have, you already would be yes, because it's painful to not do it. It's what intensifies and increases the emotional pain and discomfort and frustrations in our relationships. So we know that as the pain is mounting, which often, not often, which will lead to a need for space and separation and divorce, we know that what's being compromised is consistently the ability to talk and share regarding what works for me and what doesn't, and the safety of me being able to share those things without a reaction from my partner. So I might say, I can say it and I'm clear about it and I know what it is, but I don't share and say it because my partner reacts every time I do. And so then I stop, which then adds to the pain and the escalation of discomfort within myself.

So people like us can come in and usually create some permission and emotional safety that has not been there for probably quite a while. So you can start to have these conversations that you've not been able to have.

One of the first skills that we use in working with couples is letting them know it's okay to not talk about the things that they don't feel safe to to talk about. Why? Because if you don't feel safe to talk about em, you're probably not gonna show up all that great anyway. So please, let's just start with five pounders, the parts that we do feel safe talking about. And then we can save that for sessions or work with Stacy. It doesn't mean we're not gonna not address it, which is typically the default option. It means we are going to address it. We're just gonna set it up for a home run and a win instead of compromising yet again, the emotional safety. The other thought that usually leads to this breakdown is you find yourself thinking, but saying what I need to say is going to hurt someone's feeling. I don't want to be a jerk, and I don't want to rock the boat. They're not going to like it. And after all, we're having sex right now. So, you know, I'm just not going to bring it up. Well, if you don't bring it up, then what's going to happen is you're going to break down and your partner's gonna have no idea about It Brooke touched on this a little bit earlier on in our conversation today. Can you see, you are not avoiding any pain by how you are showing up or what you're not sharing, because you are going to create pain for yourself and you're gonna create frustration for your partner because they truly don't understand where you are, how you feel, what you need, where you're at and what you're experiencing. But the way you show up is going to tell them more of the story than your words are. Because if I believe I'm not safe here and I can't share these things with you, then when you bring up a topic I feel uncomfortable sharing with you, what am I going to do? I'm going to pull out. I'm going to shut down. I'm going to get evasive. I'm going to try and avoid the issue and make up false excuses as to why I don't want to talk about it or I can't right now. And my desire to be intimate with you is going to start to wane. So then I'm going to start making up excuses about that. And then I'm going to start wanting to hang out with my friends more than I hang out with you or work late or, sorry, I'm busy in the kids. And then slowly but surely we fall apart as I break down within myself and we're all pointing fingers at each other and you're going to tell me that's not painful. And I'm going to propose the idea that you are not avoiding pain at all, actually, you're contributing to it. So not saying what you need to say is how we write ourselves out of our relationships, I. E. Not getting our own needs met. And it also prevents us from finding true solutions to the pain that we are experiencing. And so we let the pain get to these excruciatingly high levels before we'll finally address anything. So tell me what's more kind? Doing what I just described or being honest and saying, hey, I just want to let you know before this becomes a thing in our relationship, I'm really struggling with this. Hey, you know what? I just need to ask for this because I'm noticing that I'm not okay, hey, I'm noticing that you're shutting down. Help me understand what's going on for you. Is there something I can do to support you better than what I'm doing now? And in these kinds of conversations, the pain doesn't have to get so high before we address it, number one. Number two, to not do so is actually cruel because we're setting it up for a lose, lose scenario with which it's going to break us down. You first and them second.

If you are having thoughts inside of your head that are like, hey, if my partner doesn't change this, or if we don't fix this one thing, I'm getting close to asking for a divorce. Don't you think that's important to say? Like, it is cruel when you think about it in that way? If you know there are some things that you could have asked for that could have helped repair and save your relationship, but you weren't willing to bring them to the table for whatever reason. Yeah, I understand. You're like, well, if I say this thing, it's gonna hurt the feelings. But isn't your relationship and the safety of it more important? Taking that risk, there's a big reward on the other side. And if you need some help and support in learning how to say those things in a way that's gonna lower the chances of it blowing up into a huge thing, then that's what we're here for. That's the work that we do. So book a session, join the roadmap. Join the Better Love club. Ask your questions. We are here to help you with that. If we have one legacy, it would be, say what you need to say, because if you don't, that's why these terrible things in relationships happen.

Just stacking on what you said, Brooke, is what Stacy, just earlier, you want to listen to that? Because this is what we get asked all the time. I mean, yes, there's more effective and less effective ways to say what we need to say without question. And I think why most of us feel like there's no way we could say that, because we're going to disappoint or hurt or whatever, because we don't have the skill set that Stacy does to be able to share what's truly going on in a way that works. It's usually from a place of accusation or blame or someone's got to be right and someone's got to be wrong. And I you correct. If I'm wrong with Stacy, she just went through a scenario there where it can be very hard to upset someone because it's truly done from a place of genuine and authentic and a place of curiosity. We are not natural how to do that. If I was to tell you how many times you say, stacy, I wish I had you or working Tom, I wish I had you all in my ear when I was going through this Difficult place and had to step into what we would say, a difficult conversation. Well, it's only because we've never had any experience doing it. And you can become much more comfortable and proficient and efficient at it, just like any other success you've had in your life through practice.

I have a quick example that I want to share of something that my fiance said to me that has stuck with me because he had the courage to say it. He said it like seven years ago, but it changed how I showed up. We were having a never ending fight, okay? He just couldn't get his point across because I was way too defensive. And then the thing we were fighting about, he said, you know what? This is the thing that if we do ever end our relationship, this is the thing that will end it. And I was like, oh, the thing we're fighting about? He said, no, your defensiveness and it at the time, it wasn't received well, okay? Because I didn't have all the skills that I have now. But I can tell you that stuck with me in a way nothing else ever has because he literally shared this defensiveness that you're exhibiting right now, which was very high. My defenses were off the charts. It was harming our connection. And so as a result of that, I listened and I was like, wow, I can't show up like that anymore. Not only because it's hurting us, but it's not how I want to be. I've been able over time to lower my defenses, but it's been hard. That is the power of sharing those things. It can alter the course of your relationship in a great way. Even if it was hard to get it out or to say it.

And usually the things that we need to hear and that we do need to look at are hard to say. It's going to be the hard things that we need to get better at talking about. And those are the things that never get laid on the table. And so our only other option option in this, the only other choice that we have is to live lives and pretend an illusion that everything is okay. And that's easy to do again because emotion is invisible and there's no physical evidence of what happened. But trust and know the discomfort and the emotional frustration and the emotional capacity to continue is on the line regardless of whether we see it or we don't. And that's why we want to ensure that we are talking about and sharing what works for me, what doesn't, and that I have the understanding and knowing to also check in with you about where you are and what's working and not working for you. And the skill and the courage part is that we actually have the conversations as we go. Because here's the other thing I need you to know. This is going to be a lifetime journey. This is going to be a lifetime skill. This is a long play. There is no quick fix it about it. Because as we maybe navigate through this challenging moment and find a moment of bliss and falling in love again, trust and know with the ebb and flow of life, there's just another place of transformation that will need to be navigated. Whether that's having children or a career change or an age change or retirement or challenges that our children are going through, our parents are going through. And you're not going to see these coming. Nonetheless, they're going to need to be met.

Should we add grandchildren too?

And then there's the grandchildren, right? I mean, it is a never ending sea of needing to transform ourselves and our relationship into a place and a space that can meet the challenges that life is going to inevitably bring our way. So there is no set it and forget it about this, but know that a relationship can always be on solid ground if we know and believe in ourselves and the confidence of us to have the conversations that are needing to be had. If there was ever a magic wand that I could pass to you, that would be it. And that is why we do what we do. So we cannot create the success we are looking for typically without help and support. Why? Because the principles and the skills and the understanding and the place of support and practice in navigating some of these things are just not known by you. Not because you're not capable or you're stupid or you don't know better. It's because they've never been taught to you. We don't study relationships like we study life. And we also don't realize we get better at them by doing them. And it's gonna be messy. We're gonna make mistakes and we're gonna fall down and we're gonna skin our knees. And that's okay. That's how we learn. Oh, wow. Wow. Okay. That doesn't work for me. Oh, this is important to me. I need to have this. And you start to understand that a great relationship is great because it works for the people in it. That's it. And now you have the skill that you need in order to create what it is you want to experience in your relationship and love life. Like that's key for the rest of your life. That's the Goal. I don't want to fix your relationship. I want you to fix your relationship, and I want you to know how to do that for the rest of your life. That's what we do here. Okay, so as we land this conversation, I hope that helps point you in the direction that can we reconcile? Even after divorce has been asked or filed, her papers are in motion? Of course you can. And sometimes, like I've said in the beginning, that's just a new beginning. And the more I cling to it, the more I'm probably not going to show up in a way where we can have the conversations, learn the things we need to do, and go in a different direction.

Well, I think, to be fair, I don't think any of us, you know, listening, or even us, we wouldn't want the same version of what it is that got us into that situation. So is it possible to create something, the same thing that you had? No, we wouldn't want that. But is it possible to create a 2.0 or whatever the number is hope? Absolutely. But again, everyone's going to have to step in and roll up their sleeves and skill up. Yes, it is. And we've been part of those transformations we have. Again, we're always about however this goes. Yeah. Whatever conclusions that the people that we're working with, clients and members of our communities arrive at, we're going to support that to go very well. And you're going to make the decision, not us, because that would never be our place to make a decision for you. It's going to. You're going to have what Stacy calls that internal clunk.

And we're going to show you how to get there. Right. So a couple of things to ponder as we wrap this up. Number one, I want you to realize you cannot force or coerce someone to be in a relationship with you. And the more you try, the more they're going to pull away or shut down. They have to willingly come to the table, they have to willingly choose in, or we've got nothing to co create with. I know that's some tough love right there, but it's important for you to see and understand that again, the couples who go several rounds who reconcile after divorce are couples who after divorce realize, wow, I really loved you and that was a really great relationship we had. And I'm recognizing and realizing there are some things I want to get better at and some things that I want to do different. Want to try again? Yeah, yeah, I do, actually. I choose in and everybody shows up at the table. Again. And then we, we improve from that place. Okay? If I have to force and coerce you or twist myself into a pretzel in order to get you to come home, it's probably not gonna go well because that's not sustainable. Remember, we show up as good as we feel. And so I can only pretend for so long before I start to compromise my physical, mental, emotional sense of well being. This is where we have physical problems and mental health problems. We can't just negate that away. Okay. We can approach a partner who seems resolved to end the marriage by doing our best to understand their perspective. Help me understand why you think this is over. Help me understand why it is you feel like this is gonna be the answer you need. Help me understand what you plan to do now. Help me understand what our future is gonna look like then as we co parent our children. Help me understand what you were thinking. Help me understand what didn't work. Help me just so I know in the future not that I'm trying to save our relationship, that I can just maybe improve my sense of understanding and knowing about love and life and relationships overall. Those are incredible conversations to have. If they're available to you. Each of you have the opportunity in this place and space to express your sincere intentions and what you would like to see happen going forward and what it is that didn't work for you in the relationship as a whole. That is life giving. Regardless of how this goes, it creates a sense of completion. It creates a sense of understanding. And what ails us and our biggest nemesis in this place in space, because nobody is talking and sharing these types of things is we get sucked into our own fears and doubts about ourselves and about life and about men, about women. And then we're going to show up as though those doubts and fears are true, which then starts to limit and shrink our life. As opposed to help us step into understanding and possibility to expand our lives. That's important for you to understand. We need to learn and understand ourselves better. Which will lead to a true demonstration of behavior changes that will be required on both sides to take us in a new direction. This will allow for changes in how you co create with one another. That's important. And I've got to just do my part. That's the only part and piece I can be responsible for because it's the only thing I have control over over. So I've got to do that work for myself. That's work only I can do. And then I've got to trust and know that my Partner will do their part as well. And out of that, we will be able to see quite clearly as to what it is that's possible and where we can go from there. Okay. There needs to be an evaluation and understanding of self before they can be success and growth and a reconciliation process. Otherwise, the reconciliation process will probably not happen. This will affect the different outcomes that we can create as a couple. I hope that makes sense. I've got to look at me and what works and what doesn't. And you've got to look at you and what works and what doesn't. And then as we share those things, it's going to create some clarity regarding. Okay, here's what's possible. Here's what we can do. How about if we do this? How about if we do this? All right, let's practice and see if. Let's practice and see how it goes. Oh, my gosh, it's working. I love it. Can we tweak it here? Can we adjust it there? Hell, yeah, we can. Okay, let's try that. And on and on and on it will go, hopefully for a lifetime. It's exploring this piece that leads to the reconciliation part. And if your partner is just not in a place to meet you there right now, then it's probably best that we do what we need to do to let go so that whatever potential life is there for you or for us in the future can actually be capitalized on. And it is an act of courage. But I want to leave this thought with you that I read and was so profound today. This morning I have this meditation book. It's actually a book of poetry by Mark Nepo. And I think what he had to say so highly fits what it is that currently is probably happening for you right now. He says, in the journey of love, there will be grief of what is lost, but also surprise for what is to be in the future. Much of our pain in living comes from wearing a dead and useless skin, refusing to put it to rest, or from bearing such things with the intent of hiding them rather than relinquishing them back to the earth. We live, embrace, and put to rest our most dearest things, including how we see ourselves so that we can resurrect our lives anew. And I think that is it. That is what's happening in this very difficult, transforming place of the human journey is I have to let go of what once was and garner new hope and possibility for what can be. And if I don't want to do so, then I take life away from Me, my partner, my family, the whole. And yes, it's always going to be better than you can imagine. And yes, there is going to have to be a place where we put to rest our dearest things, including me, the image that I am right now in hopes that I can become something anew. Because clinging to as. As Brooke described her story in defensiveness. Imagine her clinging to the defensiveness that she. She was unwilling to relinquish and lay to rest. It would not allow her to birth into something new that could be. And so it is for us all. I hope that gives you some comfort. I hope that that gives you a sense of peace, as crazy as that sounds. Amongst navigating the unknown. Find a place, dear listener, within yourself that you can feel good about who you are and who you are becoming. And please understand and know it will require us by principle to lay to rest many of the dearest things that have brought us to this moment, but yet will also give way to new potential and possibility in the future.

Yeah, and I would just remind the listener too that and we've seen this happen often and my Brooke touched on in the beginning is we know from our body of working one person Stacy calls the Braveheart, the person that raises his or her hand. Because very rarely do both people in a relationship, in a marriage, even when they know they need help, raise their hands at the same time. So it's usually one person that raises their hands. I like that Stacy calls him or her the Braveheart. By you committing to showing up to the best version of yourself as you navigate these new waters, it can absolutely change the trajectory of our relationship. Absolutely can. It will and it will. So I always say, like, look, if that was the least that came out of this very difficult situation you find yourself in, is that it was the catalyst to have you be committed to a new version of you and everything else above that was up all upside, as they say in the betting world. I would take those odds because there's no downside. There really isn't. So be committed to that and trust the process the best you can. And we're here to be of service. This is exactly what we do, you know, all the time.

Our follow the fun today is going to be a challenge. It should be not just follow the fun, but a challenge for you moment. Because what I'm going to ask you to do is something you don't want to do right now, but you need to do it anyway. This is a little bit of a tough love moment. I'm going to ask you to envision a future of new possibilities for you and ask you to reflect on what do I long for and what can I do right now to pursue it? I want you to understand that's a complete different mind shift, probably where you're coming from and why you're listening to this podcast episode. Help me come. Help me get him back. What can I say? What can I do? How do I convince them? How do I help them see the possibility in my relationship? You do this because it gives you a solid place to stand on where you can show up in a way that creates openness and expansion. Instead of limiting possibilities, you have a place that you can envision a future of new possibilities for yourself. It will also help you navigate some of the grief. Okay, maybe it's not going to happen with this person, but I'm going to ensure it's a part of my life because this is a part of my life that's valuable and important to me. Future of new possibilities with or without your partner. What do you long for and what can you do right now to pursue it? Our song today as we wrap up our episode is ironically, a song by Gone west called I'm Never Gonna get over your. Well, you might say, well, gosh, that's kind of a stab in the heart. Yeah. But here's the thing I want you to know. We really don't get over anybody because people who have impacted our lives and that we've loved deeply actually contribute to who we are now and who it is we have the potential to become in the future. And so essentially, we don't ever get over the people that we've loved deeply. Instead, I want to propose the idea to you that we integrate them into who I become. That they play a role that helps me see and understand parts and pieces within myself that worked and that didn't work and that. That is all very good news. We need to be more aware that our relationship, regardless of their duration, they become a part of who we are and not be simply lopped off and pretend like they didn't exist or that we didn't love them. That's. That's not what love does. Remember, love is always an expansive quality if we will allow it. If we don't allow it to be, it can become the number one destructive force in my life.

I was in a TikTok live yesterday and I saw a comment that said if love fails, it was never love in the first place. And I just want listener, if you believe stuff like that, I want you to know nothing could be less true because the reasons why relationships fail, which they don't fail. We don't believe in failed relationships because of what Stasey just said. The reason, the simple reason why a relationship doesn't work is because we're human. It has nothing to do with whether or not love was real. It was real. The feelings that you and your partner had were real. And you guys ending your relationship does not make any of the things that happened during your wonderful time together fake or wrong or that they didn't happen. That's simply not the case.

Relationships allow each one of us to improve our relationships with ourselves and with others. That's what's afoot is the becoming of you. And relationships just happen to be the greatest growth vehicle on the planet. So right when we fool around and fall in love, we put our personal growth on steroids and trust and know that all your fears and insecurities as well as your hopes and dreams are gonna come alive in that place and space. That's the point. So know that. Yeah, you're right. I'm never gonna get over you. But that doesn't mean I won't move on and love just as much as I loved you again. Because remember, love. It's an expansive quality. You can listen to this week's song along with our entire relationship playlist by going to our website podcast page or you can find it on our Spotify playlist Love Shack Live Playlist thank you.

So much for joining us in the love shack today for this very important conversation. And before you go, I want to share something exciting that we've been working on. It's our brand new self guided 30 day love and limbo Roadmap. For those of you navigating the land of maybe in your relationship, this is a flexible, self paced option designed to help you right now without having to wait for the Guided roadmap that is facilitated live. It is true, the Guided Roadmap is a truly immersive experience. Offering live group coaching calls a supportive community to connect with daily and even a partner to share and learn alongside you. It's an incredible transformative journey, but because it's only offered with once a quarter, we realized how many of you need something now, so that's why we've created the self guided version. It's a more independent experience designed to fit your schedule while still providing the same powerful daily meditations and actionable activities that guide you step by step through this challenging land of maybe you can engage at your own pace and still have access to all the tools, insights and reflections that will absolutely help you navigate this space with clarity and strength. Whether you're looking for deep connection and live interaction through the guided Roadmap or a more self directed and flexible option with the guided version, we have a pathway to meet you where you are and give you the help that you need when you need it most. For all the details about the self guided Roadmap, check out the show notes in your podcast app. You'll find everything you need there to decide which option feels right for you. And you can also visit my website by going to stacybartley.com thank you so much for being here with us today. It is truly our honor and our privilege to change the way we talk about the most difficult and challenging place on the relationship journey. Yes, it is a time of difficulty in grief, but remember, on the other side of grief, there's always a rebirth of opportunity. That rebirth, it's going to surprise you because things are going to get really good. Why? Because we're not going to stop until they are.

All right, it's time to leave the Love Shack. But before we part ways, we want you to know our D door is always open and we'll leave the porch light on, ready to welcome you back whenever you need a dose of relationship wisdom. For more resources and tools, visit us atlove shack live.com to dive deeper into the topics we've explored and find additional support for your relationship journey. Stay connected by subscribing to our podcast. Thank you for being part of our Love Shack Live community.

Sam.