#228: We’re Not Fighting, But We’re Not Okay: The Truth About Emotional Burnout In Relationships

More and more couples say they're not fighting, which for me is quite interesting. Having done this work for a decade plus, there is a change that's happening. And that change is we don't want to fight anymore. We're just tired. We're tired of walking on eggshells. We're tired of holding it all together. We're tired of being the one who always tries. And so the fighting doesn't happen. We just go quiet in silence because we feel so exhausted. Studies show that emotional exhaustion is one of the leading causes of relationship breakdown. And the hardest part, most people don't even realize it's happening until they feel completely disconnected. If you're in that space where love feels more like a burden than a comfort, then I want you to know this episode is for you. There's a reason why we're tired now and we're no longer fighting. It's not necessarily a sign that things are improving. It's actually a sign that we've all become exhausted in trying so hard. Welcome to Love Shack Live, the podcast for people at a relationship crossroads. Whether you're trying to save your marriage, navigating separation, or longing to reconnect to a special someone, we're here to help you rebuild something real and lasting. I'm Stacy Bartley, a relationship mentor who spent more than a decade helping people learn the skills love actually requires. And I'm joined by my co host and lover, Tom, and our daughter Brooke. In today's episode, we're unpacking Emotional exhaustion. How does it creep in? Why is it so hard to talk about? And how do you protect your energy, your emotional energy without abandoning yourself or your relationship? We'll share the signs, the science, and the simple boundary setting skills that could shift everything for you. So let's get into it.

Hi.

Thank you for coming. Welcome to the Love Shack.

And let's begin by talking about what emotional exhaustion is. I bet by just using the words or giving you words to use for the experience you've probably been having. Having is in and of itself like, oh, that makes so much sense. That is exactly how I feel. I just didn't know what it was.

Should we take a collective sigh right now?

Yeah.

With our listener?

Yes.

Ready? One, two, three.

Ah.

Yes. That's it. Like, I don't have any more fight in me. So we become more and more and more avoidant, less and less and less engaged. I just don't have it in me anymore. As we feel our emotional capacity. Gas tanks go. What we try and do is just like put a little post it note over the meter so that we don't look at it anymore. But it doesn't give us more fuel or more energy. It just disassociates us into never never land and we just cross our fingers and hope that we're gonna hang on. So how does it show up? Well, we have several ways that we can exhaust ourselves as human beings and our relationships. One of them is the over functioner. The person who's constantly solving, constantly doing, never resting, feeling the sole responsibility of trying to save their relationship, save their family, you know, take on all of the, the, you know, sheer day in, day out, working my tail off, trying to keep this thing together place. And then, you know, counter to that is the under functioner, the emotionally checked out, going numb person who just decides to not even deal with it at all. I'm going to go get lost in the kids or I'm going to join the bowling league or I'm going to go hang out with the gals or the guys, we're going to do a little shopping. We are snapping at small things and we're avoiding the big ones because here's the truth. We're too tired to talk about it, we're too tired to bring it up, we're too tired to figure it out. Now some of this has to do with the culture and the society that we are currently living in. We are so strung out by everything that's coming at us and the requirements of adulting these days that having anything left over in the tank is not happening. And so it's our relationships that take the brunt of all of that. And because relationships are the most emotional experience that we ever have in our lives, it's a nuanced experience. It's not something that starts to accumulate in the corner like a pile of dishes that need to be done or trash that's stacking up that I can no longer put in the garbage can. To be honest, I wish it was because I feel like we would give it more time and attention than we do by avoiding it or trying to over function and problem solve something that we really don't understand. In the nuance of it all. It's like we're trying to manage this thing that's unseen, that's invisible, but we're starting to understand and learn. It has incredibly high impact and consequences on our sense of well being and on the things that we hold very, very dear. And then what do we do? We can't even look at it to problem solve it we don't even know how to use the words to address it. And so we just hang on doing the very best that we can until we run out of emotional gas. We don't fight anymore. We just don't talk about it, we don't address it, we ignore it. We do a whole bunch of other things to check boxes to help us feel successful and like we're doing everything we know how to do as a responsible, loving, thoughtful, kind human being. And it's exhausting us. I find this interesting too. A survey that was conducted by Marriage365early in 2024 had 10,000 responses. Found that emotional laziness was the number one turnoff and a major reason why spouses reported feeling less attracted to their partners. That was above and beyond money or letting our bodies go. It was the emotional laziness that it just came across as though nobody really gave a damn until everybody kind of burned out, which just iterates what I just said. We don't understand what's going on and we don't know how to problem solve it. And we certainly have run ourselves out of that emotional energy.

I think we are really good at knowing that our families and our spouses are supposed to be there for us no matter what. So we are okay with going silent and flatlining and kind of fading out because we can count that they're not going to leave us. What we're not really good at doing is doing the things that build that connection up. We're really good at wearing it down and counting on it no matter what. But then when that period of time is over, when the rough spot is over, we don't do anything to reinforce it or to make it more resilient or make it better. We just count on it to still stay there.

No. So absolutely spot on. And this takes me back to like the invisible part that we can't see, right? It's like in our relationship life and I mean no disrespect here whatsoever because the reality is we've never really studied or understand relationships and the nuanced dynamics. That is very real but nonetheless invisible. It is an intangible experience that we each have both individually and collectively in our relationships. And like a child that doesn't understand the world we can live in. Magical thinking. We can think. It's no big deal. We can think. It's not going to affect anybody. I'll get to it later. There's plenty of time. And just like you said, Brooke, they're going to be with me forever. I mean, remember the day they profess.

That until death do us part.

Yes, until death do us part. And we all know how that goes. Or even though I feel like I'm being ignored or dismissed, or even though we haven't even had a conversation in six weeks. Really, it's been high by. Did you take care of this? Great. Okay. Love you. Kiss you. Okay. See you tonight. It's not understanding that there is no way relationships can continue to thrive regardless of how much I love you. Unless we do some very basic things and honor some very important principles. You're not going to have it. And it's slipping through our fingers like sand. But we don't understand why. And so it's very easy in our magical thinking to make it up. It's just going to be okay. It's not going to be any big deal. There'll be plenty of time. They're not going anywhere. And yet, somewhere inside of our hearts, we know that this isn't okay. Like intuitive intelligence. Yeah. But like a child has to learn. It's awesome to have big dreams. To be an astronaut and a firefighter and a doctor all in one lifetime. You grow into adulthood and realize, oh, see, that's probably not going to happen. I've just smashed three lifetimes into one. And so it is with our relationships. We can go, oh my gosh, no matter what I do, they're going to love me. They're always there for me. It doesn't matter if we haven't spent any time, we'll fix it. We'll catch up maybe after the kids are raised or these problems are solved and we'll finally go back to the things that make our relationship healthy and thrive. And it's that magical thinking that ends up running us out of emotional gas as we withhold truths as we don't know how to talk about the fear, as our personal respect erodes and our self esteem and our confidence within our ourselves. And the resentment builds on the corner that we can't see. And all the things that I make up about you that just simply aren't true. But I don't know better because we're not talking. And so I just go ahead and make it all up in my head and then live congruent to that. And it's amazing how quickly we can start coming up with some very malicious stories when we're disappointed and we're hurting. You can go from being my lover today and a terrible monster tomorrow.

Well, and don't forget that everyone around us is going to absolutely Confirm what we're saying and then make, you know, whether we're going to be right and whoever's in partnership. But yeah, it's just when he or she gets their stuff together, you're going to be fine.

Yep.

You know, good old confirmation bias right there.

Well, and on top of that, there can be literally 50 million ways to look at your situation, you know what I mean? Like your specific circumstances can be interpreted through so many different personal movies. Every single person you speak to is going to have a different thing to point out or a different take away from what you're saying. So it's impossible to have consistency, you know what I mean? That's why it comes back to being so important to be grounded in yourself, so you don't have to go through all of that. But that's another topic for another day.

Yeah, totally agree. It's like, interesting when you really think about it. If we really understood what's going on here. You really think that somebody who doesn't live in your life day in, day out, every moment of the day knows more than you do about your relationship and your life and then you're asking them to solve your problem when they're exhausted, probably in their life too, and are just going to give you a really quick answer? Yeah, yeah, just do this, you'll be fine. You know why they say that? Because they don't want to be bothered with it and they don't have the bandwidth.

Well, and also, are they experts at human connection or like relational principles or are they just going off their own shitty set of skills, to be frank?

So I'm not negating the importance of being able to share ideas, but it's amazing to me how we are now rehearsed and looking outside of ourselves for the answers that impact our lives, the likes of which there's only going to be a few people who live with the impact of that for the rest of your life and that's going to be you and your partner and your family. And so we have to understand that unless we can learn some of these principles and skills and really do a deep dive and sitting with the things that we need to understand and know about relationships, we're going to continue to live in magical thinking.

Can I just add one caveat to that? I just want to make our listeners aware that if the person that you're getting advice from, if their number one solution that they continue offering you is to punish your partner for whatever behavior that they're doing, don't follow that, that is never the Way to get a better relationship by punishing the pain out of your partner. It doesn't work. It's a bad idea. It just takes you further away from where you want to be.

May I stack on that also? Don't punish yourself.

Exactly. Yes.

Because neither one is going to take you where you want to go. But we do both. And that's where our exhaustion happens. Our exhaustion happens because we are blowing our emotional fuel on either, you know, beating myself up for not knowing better or sticking around or not figuring this out or still struggling with these same things, or I take it out on my partner, which is the opposite side of that, thinking that that's going to take us to the promised land. And we might swing and vacillate between those two experiences without realizing neither one are taking us anywhere. In fact, they're taking us to the same place. They're taking us to what I call the city of the every time, with uncanny precision, 100% of the time.

Well, it's the exact opposite of what we often say. And just think about how important this is right now. We show up as good as we feel. So if we're trying to kick the crap out of ourselves and or our partner or both, how are we going to ever expect to follow that principle? And that principle is time tested for as many over, you know, thousands of people that we have helped. And think about it. Do you feel better when you're feeling good in your own life? You have a little bit more skip in your step. Come on, that's irrefutable. If you have a good employer that you enjoy going to because he or she treats you well in the culture, is a place you look forward to going, probably going to be a better working environment.

Yes. It's like pulling up and putting gas in the tank so that I've got just a little more to do what I need to do. And now you can start to understand why. We have a whole host of coping skills. There is something about that, that coping skill that refuels me enough to just get through the next day, at least a hit. It's survival mode.

Exactly.

And if I don't believe in my psyche that I can get from day one to the next hour to day two, well, then I'm going to do anything I need to do in order to help me get there. Right. And we have a whole host of things that we won't dive into today to help us do that. But the exhaustion happens because I'm literally in emotional survival mode and my nervous system is Spent. I can't problem solve, I can't focus, I can't think, I can't. And so I've got to find something to just help me get from point A to point B right now, because I've pushed it to the place where there's nothing left in the tank. It's like having to pull over to the side of the road and hitch a ride from somebody or right. Have to walk to the gas station in order to find. I'm gonna do it. I'm gonna figure this out. And that's what emotional survival mode looks like. I will do lots of different things, healthy and not healthy, in order to just get myself to the next day so that I can try figure it out and cope and deal and live through. Because after all, if go down, there's nothing left of me. Well, that's kind of a game over, isn't it? So that survival mode will kick in and we'll do whatever we've got to do to get through the next hour or the next day or make it to the end of the week. Right. And that ironically exhausts us even more. And so this is a very challenging place right now in our lives, not only in our love lives and in our relationships, but in the society and culture with which we live within the world structure that we live.

Well, because no one wants to admit that they're feeling that way. And then once they do admit they're feeling that way, what do they do? There's no solutions available, you know, and.

I think we don't realize that when we don't speak, it actually creates more of what it is we don't want. Because now we're all operating in our own places and spaces within ourselves. So it's really easy for me to start making up and conjuring up things that just simply aren't true. I can get freaked out and it's amazing what we can make up. Is now true that the minute I buy into that, I'm going to act as though that truly is true. And that's going to dictate a lot of my choices and thoughts and decisions about how I behave going forward. Unspoken things don't fix our relationships. When I say we're not fighting, that's not necessarily a good thing. We think it's something that we could celebrate, but it's really not. I would prefer you fight and get the information out. Not in a destructive way of abuse, verbally or physically, but in a place where the words are getting said about what works and what work Also, you know, if there's no conversation, we can't have additional understanding in our life. And this is always going to lead to some rupture of ourselves and our relationships. There's not going to be any safety to share what we need to say. There's not going to be any support. I'm going to feel very isolated, very alone. And the more I spiral in my own self doubt and in that mire, the more I'm probably likely to take it out on myself or take it out on the people that I am around. Because those are my two options as a human being. I'm able to understand it, put it into words, talk about what's not working and just as important, talk about what would work and what I can do and what I'm willing to try. But we don't do that. We just sit around and talk about what doesn't work. We just hash that and hash that, hash that. And the more I do it, the more I feel shitty and the more my partner feels shitty and the more I realize we're not going anywhere but just stuck in this dysfunction and hurt and disappointment and frustration and resentment. And so we're stuck there principally not because somebody's doing it wrong. You're stuck there because you don't understand the skills and the principles that you need in order to move through it. You know, it's like knowing that when the gas gauge gets to E, oh, I know what to do, we pull into the gas station, we put some gas in it and if we do it before we get there, even better. And now we have confidence that we can make the 5,000 mile trip. I know how to govern and rudder my life using principles that are tried and true in skills.

I want to share with everybody something that mom too, Stacy was talking about on our Better Love Club call this Monday. She was explaining that, you know, our thoughts and our feelings lead to our behavior and then that comes out through our voice. It's a cycle of how we express ourselves and how most people don't realize, number one, that they have some sort of control of that cycle and how it sort of dictates how you feel in your life. You know, if that cycle is really shitty, then you're probably feeling really shitty and showing up really shitty. If you have a better understanding of it and realize that you can change your thoughts, that then change your feelings and then change what comes out of your mouth that can improve the quality of your life. But so often we feel like we're not in control of anything. In our life, you know, like when we're in a down cycle, we just feel like God, the universe is kicking our ass and it feels awful. But we don't realize that we have some control. We can change that pattern of behavior. What a gift it is to have some of your agency back. But everything you just explained, 99% of the population isn't aware of it. So when they're in these downward spirals in their relationships, they have no idea of the power that they really have to make it better. And I just think what a shame that is, you know, like, we all feel like we're victims of what's happening to us, which we are in some way, but we have power to change things. Just really struck me when you were talking about it on Monday. I wish so many more people realized that the structure, structure of our universe would change if people realized how powerful they are to change that dynamic and how powerful it is to change it in your relationship, in your homes, with your kids. Like, you have so much demonstration that you can do that you're not realizing.

I think the tragedy for me and the part that I see all the time is without understanding how this works, we make up some terrible things about ourselves and some terrible things about the people that we love. Yeah. And then if you. When you understand the cycle, that just leads to more of the internal suffering that we create for ourselves and the people that we love. Because it works, whether you understand it or you don't. Yeah.

It's happening either way.

Yes. Happening either way. So it's going to take you for a human ride, regardless of whether we understand it or we don't. Just like oxygen, just like gravity, just like, like some of these electricity.

Yeah, you turn that light switch on. But. And I would say, you know, the first point is understanding for sure. And then the second point is to be able to deploy it and implement it, especially when we're emotionally upset. That's really the super bowl, you know. But to be fair, a lot of our upset comes when we're emotionally triggered. And I hate to be the bearer of bad news, listener, but we're going to be emotionally triggered for as long as we're breathing. So let's. Rather than be surprised by it, let's just build for it, knowing it's happening and it's going to happen. I mean, to me, that's a much more realistic approach. It's, oh, we're never going to have this problem again. Oh, yes, you are. You'll have a new version of it because that's how things are designed. It's designed to press upon us. I mean, we would never have advances physically if we didn't press upon weight, our body weight, other weights, things that cause resistance. That's a good principle. It's a universal principle. Any different if it's not?

And the point of life isn't to control other people, to change other people's behaviors. The point of it is to understand your behavior so that then you can react in the way that you want to react. It's much easier if you're just like, oh, I'm in control of these triggers. I don't have to go and fix everybody, you know?

Well, and I feel inspired to kind of like address this too. We. We walk around feeling like failures, you know, with really something that we don't study, we don't learn, we don't practice, we don't understand. It's not your fault. We just never were taught about it. And so when we don't understand, we go, well, I guess I was a failure, or I guess I'm not meant to be in love, or I guess I suck at this, or my picker's broken, or all the silly little things that we say. And I just want you to know there's no such thing as failing in a relationship. Like, it doesn't exist. It doesn't go the way you want we had. It is just, in my humble opinion, the expression that I don't really understand what I'm doing and I don't understand how to do it. I don't know. And so I keep trying these things. And when I do, as a human being, I'm probably swinging from one extreme to the other. I'm either all in or I'm all out. You hear it all the time. Oh, I want love so much. It's going to be so great when I find my special person. And then it's like, oh, hell no, I'm not going to fall in love again. Those are two extremes in the relationship journey that tell me the frustration is neither one is going to fix your dilemma because each their pros and cons. The problem is you don't understand how to navigate it. It would be like, I'm going to buy a car and I don't realize I got to put gas in it. And then when it fails and clunks out on the side of the road, I'll never own a car again. I'll only walk.

Well, yeah, like, if you really think about it, being married or being in a relationship or living with your partner. It's the hardest thing that we're ever asked to do. As humans, we've prepared zero for it. Like, we. There's no universal teachings that we all learn, just like adding numbers or subtracting. Like, we all learn that, but we don't learn the skills that you need to be in cohabitation with another human. But then they just say, go do it. And you're just supposed to. And it's supposed to go well. And then for women especially, we get made fun of if we have a lot of partners, you know, But. But that's how you learn. You learn by having relationships. So I would venture to say the people who have more partners have learned more lessons. Like, they've tried to figure it out more times. And the people who, I guess stayed with their first partner, they got lucky or they figured out how to make it work. Like, it has nothing to do with being a genius at love. It has everything to do with being willing to try. Like, you have to be with someone and be in a relationship to gain the skills that. That you need to make love work. You don't just have them, you have to create them. You have to learn them.

Definitely a participatory process.

We have it so wrong that some people are good at love and some people aren't. No, you just haven't learned the skills.

Yeah, I guess it just isn't meant for me.

Like, how many people have that belief in them right now?

It is a challenging thing. I've got to understand my own landscape and how that works. And then we step in and think that somebody's going to correct this or right the ship for me. We do take a magical carpet ride on the front side, right. Where all my hopes and dreams come alive again. And I feel that surge of all the potential rushing back inside of me, only to find myself in the same challenging places where also what's going to follow is all of my fear and insecurity is going to show up. And the more I care, the worse it is. So then we go, oh, just don't care. You know, if you don't want to lose power and control in your relationship, you make sure you're the one that doesn't care. And you're like, okay, well, I love the logical thought, but okay, if we go down that pathway, guess what's going to happen? You don't care about your partner. They're not going to stick around. You might have power, but you're going to have power on your own all by yourself.

Well, you know, and also, I was just as you were saying that, Brooke, I mean, here's the thing. Let's say, you know, you come together with your special someone. Think about that. You know, in the beginning. So there, yeah, there's probably a lot of intention or whatever, but here's the thing. How much of that have you continued? Because life is not stagnant. My gosh, it changes so fast and fluent and dynamic. So that same investment that you put in the beginning, I think as Tony Robbins says, if we did what we did in the beginning, there would be no end. That's probably pretty fair. So, no, I'm good now. I found my special someone. We're going to knock it out of the park. Well, maybe. But do you understand what's coming at you for the next 10, 15, 20, 30, whatever amount of years or months you have? Even Stacy and I, in the 15 years we've been together, the amount of stuff that's come at us, Number one, just as well. I didn't know number one. Number two, I mean, we have the blessing to do this as a body of work, but you couldn't have even.

Dreamt up some of the things that have happened, like with the best writer from Hollywood, they wouldn't have been able to nail it, like in everybody's life.

There's a powerful motivation because we've chosen this as our work. But to me, that's like a really good challenge because, you know, hopefully if you ever met me on the street or wherever, you realize that we are, the three of us, who we are. But it's because it's the most important thing in our life. Now, you may not want that, but to whatever degree, you just have to understand, especially now, none of us living, except for the very, very oldest, have ever lived through a time like this. The amount of change in every place in our life, and you don't think that's going to stress, number one, the relationship with yourself and then number two, with your special someone. It's going to require more skill than ever right now.

Well, I want to speak a little bit to that logic idea, you know, because it so relates to how it is we run out of emotional gas. That wonderful idea that if you just did what you did in the beginning, there wouldn't be an end. And I love that saying, by the way. But we never talk about why we don't.

Yes, good point.

What the heck happens? We all understand and wrap our head around. We put so much effort and intention when we're first coming together. But what we often don't realize and understand is how much of it really isn't true for me. I am playing a role that I think you want from me and you want me. And we're both really kind of selling each other a sales job. We're putting so much thought and effort into becoming or essentially showcasing who I want you to believe that I am. And I think the reason why it turns into such a struggle after the magic wears off is there's so much shit that then has to get sorted out because I went along with things I pretended like I was okay with things I didn't disclose, things I didn't know, things to disclose about myself. And so there's this moment when all the fear comes up and the gig is up and it's not disingenuous. I mean, we really believe that we've got to put our best foot forward and put on our best clothes and our best behavior. Behavior. And use the proper words. Well, do you realize if I set it up like that, in order for that to be the life that we live, I've got to be able to sustain that for the long haul. And we can't. We run out of emotional gas. Number two, we don't have any skills to navigate what's coming at us when the starts to hit the fan.

Well, and also it takes up all your time. Like you have no time for anything else except your relationship.

So it's when all the fear and insecurity comes up and we've moved in and I realize you like the toilet paper off the back of the roll, and I can't stand that. And the way you load the dishwasher drives me crazy. And you start scratching your crotch and doing a big fart. And I'm thinking, oh, my God, who is this person? This is real life. I don't have the skills and the ability and the understanding to even regulate myself. So you know what I'm going to reach for as a human being? I'm going to start trying to control you. I'm going to start telling you what you can and can't do and what you can say and not say. You know, because I'm right. I'm the one that has the proper etiquette on toilet paper and. And when should fart and how it should sound and, you know, all the things. And. And so then we fight and we get into these cycles of fighting because the reality is I'm trying to control and manage you because I don't know how to control and manage myself. I don't understand myself enough to do it. And you're doing the same thing, which I say this often, but my favorite, favorite, favorite quote that makes so much sense. More so than if you, if you did what you did in the beginning, there wouldn't be an end. Yeah, that would be true. But here's the problem. We can't sustain that because we really don't understand ourselves long enough to do it and we don't have any damn skills to help us navigate when the does come up. So Share the quote we're strangers to ourselves. Most of us are strangers to ourselves, asking others who are strangers to themselves to love us. And we expect this to go well in a space and a place where the stuff that we're dealing with is emotional. It is invisible. So there is no physical evidence that we can point to that this is not working for me, not working for you. And heaven forbid, we can't see the great impact that's happening in our relationships as we do the shit that we're doing. And so then we step into our magical thinking and make it up that it's just no big deal or you should just get over it, you should just be able to let it go. And little by little we run out of gas and we destroy the very thing that we were excited about in the beginning. So there are some important things here that I hope you're taking from the conversation. Running out of emotional gas doesn't mean you failed, doesn't mean you're malicious or awful or broken or your partner too. It means we don't know what to do instead of what's not working. We don't understand how to navigate ourselves through those very common and challenging places and spaces that exist in all relationships across and around the planet. So I would ask for you to take another big sigh and big deep breath. Like there's answers, there's skills, there's principles that would make it so much easier for you to drive that car 5,000 miles instead of pulling over, getting pissed off about it, and deciding you're gonna walk instead. You won't make it. You just won't make it. Just think about how it's gone in your life and how these things have played out and what it is you wish you could know that you simply just don't. That you know somewhere inside of you would make all the difference. Like think about not just what's working, but what would help it work going forward. What is that? Emotional exhaustion is probably what you're experiencing as a part of many other Things as well. Just contemplate some of the things that we've said, like let them stew and sit within you. Nobody is wrong. In fact, I would propose to you just the opposite. Everybody, including you and the person that you love, is doing the very best that they know how right now. They just don't know what to do instead of what they're doing to get from point A to point B. And when we don't know that, we just cross our fingers and hope, bear down, give a hell and hope that this is going to go well. That's what we all do when we don't know what else to do, right? It's going to pass. It's going to be okay. Yes, that may be true, but boy, could you double down and really educate yourself and practice and implement some things that would really make a lot of difference. Essentially pull up to the gas pump and understand how to unscrew the gas lid and put the hose in there and pull the handle. That sure be helpful, wouldn't it?

I just think it goes back to what I said at the beginning of the show. We're so good at depending on our relationships to be there for us no matter what, but we are so bad at pulling up to the gas tank and giving ourselves some more fuel, giving our partners more fuel. How great would it be if our relationship was like a string and you could see when it was about to break because it's become so thin?

Oh, yes. Or. Or I've even thought about the idea where we have a light on our forehead and when I am a hot show, it goes off, letting everybody know, like, give her some time and space, like, or, okay, this is having great impact. Maybe it has different colors that start to flash when I'm feeling unsupported or unloved, or what I've just done has really hurt my partner and it flashes green or something like that so that we, we didn't make it up so much. And, and we had some concrete evidence, tangible evidence, that of what was happening here. It gets so egregious because it's invisible. Not because we're disingenuous, though we. We really do want our relationships to go well. I would say that's the one place in our lives where that's really where our hearts go when we want it to go really, really well. While I'm trying to manage me and understand you, and I don't understand me, so how the hell do I have the bandwidth to understand you? I don't. You know, there's just so many components that start to stack against us simply because we haven't really studied it as much as learning how to bake a good old fashioned casserole or something.

Well, and I really do, I know this is redundant, but I really think too we don't give a lot of consideration to how much change is going to happen when we step into this. And so it's probably, you know, what got you there is not going to, you know, get you to the next level. That that's a very common business framework and understanding. So again, why would it be any different? And I wouldn't even say it's arguable. Let's just be honest. Stepping in and bringing our life together with another human is going to be the most challenging undertaking any of us will step into. Maybe be careful what you ask for.

I just still think it's so interesting. I don't know, I guess I just realized this. But we are asked to do this like it's in all of our plans from being a little child to get married and have children and have a.

House and live and how does everybody live? How does this go?

Happily ever after?

Everybody I've ever asked that question to on all my calls from around the world can always answer that. And I always say, like Fred and how are we supposed to go? They live how? Oh, Tom. Happily ever after after.

But how many hours have you spent studying how to do it? Most people would say zero.

Yeah, maybe I did a little something when we got married 23 years ago. Yeah, there you go.

I mean, I mean it's just mind blowing. I don't. It's a scam. We've all been sold a lie. It's just. It's really frustrating that we all are expected to do this one thing, yet none of us have ever learned how to do it. That doesn't make any sense.

And sadly we. Something's wrong with us like Stacy said.

Or our partner and we think we are failures and we're just bad.

No, you need some more damn skills like it.

It's so mind blowing to me because most people don't even know how to regulate their emotions.

They don't even know how to understand their emotions.

What that means.

Their emotions.

Yes.

What are we even talking about?

And that is essential if you want to have a shred of a good relationship.

Yes, yes. So as I we wrap up this episode, I want you to consider a few things. Emotional exhaustion isn't failure. It's a signal that I need to refuel. How do we refuel? Let's just take a few minutes here before we close out the show to help you understand, as human beings, some common ways that we refuel. We've talked about some common things that, you know, basically run us out of gas. So let's talk about how to refuel. Pull up to that gas pump. Essentially, these are places and spaces where play for the. For no reason whatsoever, just the enjoyment, the opportunity to engage in it heals us.

I think so many adults don't know what you're saying when you say play. They think kids play. So how do adults play?

Oh, well, they would say we go out and get drunk and shoot some pool. But play could be going for a walk. You know, we can go from the most responsible as an adult to the silliest. Let's just kind of do it on a sliding scale. Being out in nature would be play. Taking your bicycle out would be play. Getting on a paddle board or going for a hike would be play. Playing in the grass, Rolling around on the grass would be the silly part. On the other extreme, right, getting dirty, having a mud fight, gardening.

You, like, put your hands in the dirt.

Put your.

Dancing the dirt.

Dancing, singing, music, listening to music, something funny is a great form of play. Hanging upside down and having a conversation with somebody is. Is silly, and it makes you laugh and it makes you let go of all of this pressure. It gives us something. And you know what's interesting is we don't need a lot of these. We get a lot of mileage out of a little bit of fuel. Like, we can go a really long time on a little teeny, tiny bit of fuel, but we can't go forever on no fuel. If you were to take literally, like 30 minutes a week and just play just for the sheer pleasure of doing whatever that is, maybe it's sitting down and drawing a picture or allowing yourself to sing or dance, as Brookie suggested. You know, any little thing that you want to do just for pleasure, it's amazing how much mileage you're going to get out of that.

I just want to remind you that the. The worse we're doing in our relationships, the less likely we are to play. For some reason, we have made it up that if we are struggling our relationship, we are not allowed to do anything fun fun or laugh or have any joy in our life until it's all figured out. And I hope you have seen throughout this episode that that couldn't be further from the truth. In order to figure it all out, you have to have the fun and the Joy in the play because it's going to help you get to the finish line. Otherwise you're not going to survive.

If you hear in your relationship conversations, you say it yourself or your partner is saying it to you. Can we just go have some fun and stop trying to solve the problems in our relationship? That is a high sign that somewhere in the intelligence that you're saying, we're not going to make it if we don't go and have some fun. That doesn't mean I don't want to solve the problems in our relationship. It just means we need to put them on the shelf for a minute, go refuel, and then we'll have what we need to come back and figure them out. Those are the words that are commonly put to, I'm running out of emotional gas. And if we don't go find a place to play and be silly and laugh and remember that I really do enjoy you in some other places and spaces, we're not gonna make it. I don't say it like that, but that's what I'm trying to say in my lack of expression and understanding about what's really going on.

And you might be saying, because when we bring this up, and we do all the time, people say, oh, Tom, Stacy, and Brooke, you don't understand where I'm at. Yes, we do. That's why we're so impassioned and why it may seem so counterintuitive for you to not shut us off and turn off the podcast right now. Because with great love and respect, this is precisely what you need. Because it's the fastest way for that dopamine hit in a way that's going to give you that pop and probably your special someone as well. And it is. Yes, it's very counterintuitive. We got to get this figured out before we put. Have some play. I mean, Stacy's been working on this for 15 years and she's right. Like, no, honey, that's. We can't do that right now. Well, why not? I mean, could we have some champagne at 11 o' clock in the morning?

But how often do we bang heads a little bit and both of us stop and look at each other and go, we need to go have some fun. Yeah, we got to run away.

Yeah. So the more agitated we get, we need to.

We got to go play.

And it's amazing how quickly you can reset. It's been proven scientifically. This is not what we say. All the data suggests that it's very counterintuitive. We're in the throes of upstream upset, but it really is the sign, like, oh, man, we got to break this cycle, and that's the fastest way to do it. That's why Stacy, Brooke and I, we've talked about this. Why does she have follow the fun in every single episode? Brooke and I, mom, babe, we don't need. Yes, we do need it. We're going to continue it.

We, me and dad have been the fun police. But I can finally say we've been converted, because I bet you a million bucks mom, too, did not expect me to say what I just said in this podcast I episode.

That's true. That's so true. You were the one that kind of brought the play up. So yay. It's hard because we're hurting and we think, oh, I can't switch gears right now. I can't go there right now. Yes, you can, and you need to. It is the difference between being able to make the long journey and not, I need fuel. I need to be able to just go and remember and take the pressure off for a minute and stop trying to solve the problems that we're kind of at loggerheads about. Let's go remember some other things about my relationship because. Because otherwise, we're stuck in this all or nothing kind of place. It's either all bad or it's all good. No, that's not true. I want you to see and understand that we need to explore the spectrum of our relationships, not just these things that are hard and not just these things that are supposed to be good all the time. It's going to be an ebb and flow of both. And so when we're at odds, we need to remember why we got ourselves into this place in the first place. We need to refuel ourselves, refuel our relationships, and thereby share some things that remind us, you know, as human beings, we can be very forgetful. That's where we can start getting into that catastrophic feeling of, oh, it's never going to be okay. We're never going to be able to sort this out. It's never going to work. Maybe we just need to step out of that conversation for a minute. Let's go play. And then we'll come back to this. We do this in lots of ways when we work. You know, we'll say, oh, I can't focus anymore. I'm starting to wane. And we'll get up, go for a walk, get a glass of water, you know, maybe take a lap around the block, and we come back and we feel a little bit better because we've just refueled for the task at hand. Same, same. It's the same emotionally. I feel so hurt or disappointed or distraught and I'm stuck in my worry cycle and so I won't allow myself to refuel so I can come back to it. It's a really important principle I invite you to embrace. Let's talk here for a minute. If you're in a place of saving your marriage, I can guarantee you the best thing that you could do is give yourself some time to refuel and play and take the pressure off yourself and your partner and remind yourself that everybody is doing the very best that they know how. That would be your very best next step. And space and separation, right? If we give ourselves the time to understand some of these skills and principles, one person has the ability to change the entire dynamic that's happening in your relationship. And after all, like I said, if I don't understand and know me, what am I bringing to the relationship to co create with anyone way? You know, very often we take this space and then I long for you, I miss you. And then we get back together, we just find ourselves in the same very difficult, painful, distraught place. Because what's not changed is the understanding, the skills and the adherence to some of the basic principles that we need to understand about relationships. So in this place of space and separation, please, please, please give yourself time to explore those things so that you have what you need to step back in and truly go in a different direction. And dating. Well, here's the deal. If you do what you do in the beginning, there'd never be an end. But do you know what to do in the beginning so there won't be an end? Because I'm going to guarantee you, if you're just trying to put on a good show with a slick profile and slick marketing campaigns, it's not going to be sustainable. You know, even though it's an invisible experience, the truth as you feel and know it is all going to come out soon. So let's just begin with that in mind. Let's just get as much as we can comfortable in our own skin so that we can bring, yes, those wonderful parts, the messy parts and the, and the fabulous, brilliant, amazing parts of you to the table so that we can co create better from the get go. Appreciating that there will be a lot of change. Understanding your yourself and some key principles and skills of human behavior is absolutely what you need in order to create better behavior. Not more battles. We're stuck in battles and suffering because we just don't know what else to do. I hope that you'll give yourself and each other a hall pass if this is resonating with you at all. In any small measure, I'm going to encourage you to initially get the Space and Separation Communication playbook or join the love and limbo 30 day roadmap. But I also want you to know that there is a place called the Better Love Club. It's your training ground for connection, courage and co creation. And there is a path there for space and separation, saving your marriage and coming soon singles and dating. And because we value our podcast listeners, you can also receive 15% off your first month by using code LOVESTACK15. Okay, let's talk about that. Follow Fun we were talking about earlier. I love this one because, you know, I love animals and I love being out in nature. And I thought how can we take some difficult moments and turn them into something that would kind of be, you know, spring, you know, or outside more hopefully you nailed it when you said love to get your hands on the dirt and get all messy. So I thought what if we were to take our, our notice our, our feelings like that we're noticing that we're coming up for us and we were to journal it like a wildlife explorer. You know, like I would make an entry in my journal and I'd say mood spotted Giltas maximus. What is my behavior? Pacing and over apologizing and over analyzing. What is my habitat? My GD inbox sending me over the edge. My recommended action, a nap and maybe saying no. So what would you say is an emotion that you're experiencing today that you could kind of turn into like journaling about a little wildlife and like, you know, what is the habitat? What is the behavior? What do you think that they need to do instead? Doodles are important. Always do little circles and doodles. It's amazing how that simple little action can also connect you with what you're feeling and experiencing. Guiltus Maximus. I love it. So come up with a silly name, some behavior that's silly. You know, just, just have some fun with it. I promise you, every time I do this, I feel a little better. You know, with some circles and some doodles and helps me get over myself a little bit. So give it a try and let me know what you think too. The song that we have selected for today's episode. I don't get the impression that you like it so much.

I just heard a little piece of it. You know, Stacy, I Never know what the songs are.

So, yeah, it's by the ghost towns.

I have no idea who those are.

But yeah, it's country with a little.

Bit of like R B other twist to it.

It's kind of a little blend.

But the lyrics spoke to you.

They really did. Especially for this particular episode because he has a song that's titled before you leave and. And he says, maybe it's my fault, maybe it's yours But I bet we can agree Love is just not enough so let's set it free Love is a great place to begin but it often can't take us to the promised land. As much as we like to believe that idea, that's a little bit of magical thinking.

All it takes is love. Then we're gonna. I mean, but yeah, no, it's. I mean, that's a good start.

Yep, it really is a good start. We wanna start there, but then we need to add some things to it. So you can check that song out on our Spotify playlist at love Shack live playlist, or you can go to and you can listen to this week's song along with our entire relationship playlist. All right, thank you so much for being here with us. We so look forward to connecting with our listeners each and every week. And if today has resonated with you, we ask that you share it as we would love to help and support more people who are in this place and space of making up some tragic things within themselves just because we like.

To give credit where creditors do. That quote that Stacy shared and loves to share is from the wonderful Leah Biscalio, who's. Who's passed on now, but a man who truly was ahead of his time and we're a huge fan of his body of work. He was a professor at usc, just an incredible man.

So ease up, give yourself a hall pass. Realize everybody's doing the very best that they know how. These things that you're facing, these challenges and feelings that you're having, there's solutions for those. So take a deep breath and step in slowly but surely into the exploration and I guarantee you're going to figure it out.

And if you need some help, that's okay. It's not a sign of weakness as we'd be. You know, this is why we're here. You know, step in. I'm sure we can assist you in some way, shape or form right where you're at.

Goodbye for now. Thanks for being with us. Bye. Bye. All right, it's time to leave the love Shack.

But before we part ways, we want.

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