138. Positive Parenting Tools With Ralphie Jacobs

Hello, sweet friends. I'm so excited for this episode. Welcome back to the momset podcast. I'm your host, Tessa Romero, and today we actually have Ralphie Jacobs from Simply On Purpose. If you guys don't follow her on Instagram. I actually started following her when I had my first son, so almost seven years ago, and I've been learning something from her since then. And, Ralphie, I know you're listening to this too. I didn't even know that this, like, parenting style was a thing. I just knew that I wanted to do different than the way that I was raised. And I was kind of just trying to figure out what that looked like and how I would do it. And thank goodness I started with one tiny baby for me to be able to figure it out. And now four kids in, I still learned so much from Ralphie, so having her on the show is absolutely just such a joy, and I'm excited for us to dive into these questions together, too. So if you are new to Ralphie from Simply On Purpose, share. She has an incredible community of over 670,000 families that she's helped online and through her online audio courses. So you can actually get an audio course from her and listen to it while you're doing the dishes or on a walk with your kids. And that's the most genius thing ever. Um, if you're struggling with positive parenting, that course is definitely a go to. So Ralphie Jacobs is living in Austin, Texas, with her husband and her four daughters. Her oldest is 21 and her youngest is 11. So she's definitely has tons of wisdom to be sharing with us today.

She's.

She graduated in early childhood education from Utah State University and worked as a preschool teacher and creator of children's organizations and curriculum, which is so cool, especially as I homeschool my boys. I like, appreciate that even more. As an early childhood expert, Ralphie quickly learned the best way to impact a child's life for good is to teach parents. So she founded Simply On Purpose, and that's where she's built that large community and shares her writing and her resources with us there. Her audio course, like I mentioned, has changed thousands of homes, and she travels across the country speaking at live workshops on positive parenting, which I had the joy of sitting in on her keynote just a few weeks ago at the Women's Wellness Conference, and it was so good, and it got me even more excited to have you on the show. So welcome, Ralphie. We are so excited to have you here.

Oh, my goodness. This is such an honor. I Didn't know that you followed me for that long. That's so special, Tessa.

I didn't know that. This is so much fun.

You watch my kids grow. That's so great.

Yeah, it's been. It's been so fun. The. More, like, I'll have another baby. And I just. I look at the way you're doing things and the joy and just the like. You can just see the connection that your girls have with each other. You have four girls, I have four boys. And I just really appreciate being able to learn from you as you're a season ahead of me.

And.

And it helps me have, like, courage in the hard moments because I'm like, okay, if Ralphie can do this with four girls, I could certainly do it with four boys. So I've been following you for a very long time.

So fun. Yep. And we need each other. Right. We need each other. Linking arms along the chain of life to help each other out, to give each other wisdom and advice. I certainly seek that from people that are ahead of me. And so I'm so grateful to be on this path with so many awesome mamas.

Yeah. I mean, everyone. Everyone has something to share and contribute, and it's so fun to learn from one another. So if you'll give us a little bit of a background story to you, like, we've got the education part. We know you're qualified, and I full heartedly trust you. I just want to hear more about what was, like, an aha moment for you, or were you just always this way? Did you grow up this way and you're like, this is what I'm going to do?

What?

Or did you kind of have to learn and figure it out as you went to.

Yeah, I kind of grew up in a unique situation. I have six brothers and two sisters, and I'm the oldest girl, and my mother has a Ph.D. in child psychology. And my father was diagnosed with Ms. When I was 5, and he was in a wheelchair by the time I was 10. So I just grew up with a lot of respect for human struggle and also a great love for children that struggle, too. And so growing up and having those experiences really led me to just want to learn more and more about how children develop, how I can help, how to be the best teacher for them. And while I was raising my children, I was like, the best mom for the toddler, the best mom for the baby. And then as soon as my oldest got into that pre tween, I was like, oh, my goodness. There's this gap between where I want to be performing and where I actually am performing as a parent. And I was just so frustrated with myself because I knew there was a better way I had to discover what that was. And so I dug back into educating myself, learning more, and getting better at connecting the dots for myself. And I learned that there's just such a great need for parenting truth out there, that it's not just the scholars, the people with the big lingo, that should be able to have the answers for how to parent well, but it should be for the everyday parent that we should all be able to parent our children in a loving way that we desire to. And so I started learning more, and then I started simply on purpose, where I just took the audience along with me in that journey of learning. And as I connected dots, I would share them with parents and, and. And practice them with my children. And it just became such a special thing to. To. To bring the audience along with me. And just as you teach, you get better and better at it. And that's kind of been my story. I stumbled and tripped and fell into simply on purpose. And I'm so grateful that I have because it's been such a blessing in my life and such a blessing for our family. And it's just given me a lot of wonderful experiences to be with families and to see the tears in their eyes when they express how much they love their kids and how much they desire to do the best for them and to change patterns and to have find new hope in their lives. And it's been such an honor to be able to be a little bit of that and to be a small part of their family with them.

Oh, that rings so true. So true. Because there are definitely times that in parenting, we feel defeated or we feel overwhelmed by our circumstances and overstimulated in our environment. We're trying so hard to figure things out, especially when we know we want to do things different. And when I like, help women with mindset, so often moms are focused on what they don't want to do to the extent that it's all they're doing because it's their only focus. They're like, I just don't want to yell. I don't want to yell. I don't want to yell. And our mind doesn't interpret that as the direction of what to do. Instead, it just looks at it as well, this is the command to yell instead of what we're going to do instead. And I just love that overlap that you shared there.

I.

When you, when you Just said that you, you know, you took your audience along for the journey of figuring these things out yourself, and when you made a connection, you would share it. What I found is when I make connections and with perspective, like that's where I like to make connections, is really perspective. And then I love to learn parenting tools from women like you and apply them. And I find that I really do need the right perspective in order to apply the tools, especially successfully. And for me, absolutely, with toddlers, like, my voice hit too. I'm like, okay, I need a lot of good perspective here. So what about with you? When you make a connection, you have this aha moment and you go to share it online. Do you ever find it like you receive some pushback? Or maybe you're, you're parenting differently than some of your friends, you have a lot of siblings, so differently than your siblings. Is there ever a time in your life that you are doing it different than the status quo and you're met with this opposition that starts to talk you out of it? I think a lot of moms face that. Like, they're like, this feels right and we're just so easily talked out of it because it goes against the grain against that status quo. What do you think about that?

Right. I also, I think that there's this really important piece too that we forget that sometimes our behavior that's poor, like as parents is really self reinforcing. That if I yell at my child to knock it off, it scares them into knocking it off. We think, oh, that works, that makes sense. And so it's a reinforcing feedback pretty quickly. But what we lose sight of is those long term negative effects of not, like you were saying, replacing that behavior with something that's positive and helping them to see through your model what's the correct behavior. Even when I'm upset, I don't yell or I don't scream. I don't get really angry at people that are more vulnerable than me. I can mock model that positive correct form. But yes, absolutely, I do get pushback. And I'm sure you do too.

Yes.

And I'm kind of at a place in my life now. I'm 45. I'm kind of in that place where I'm like, if I'm doing something that's different than the norm, I might be on the right track. I might be doing something that's right. Especially if I feel like it's the most loving and long term correct way to do things, where I'm focusing on the relationship and the child's long term well being more than their temporary goodwill for me, more than me feeling like I nip that behavior in the bud. And I'm the authority here. It's more how can I help them to grow into resilient, kind adults. And so yes, there's pushback. There's pushback with, I talk about like, I don't know, cell phones or being careful with sleepovers. We don't do sleepovers in our house. Or even when I talk about ignoring and letting go of things that are inconsequential because that's going to zap all of your time and your energy and move your energy and focus towards building on good behavior and giving your children lots and lots of reasons to behave well. So their brains are starting to connect good behavior with good feelings and all of that. That's a hard thing for parents to hear because we just come from, we're just one generation from people saying, well, that's permissive. That looks like, that looks like, what's the right word? Allowing them to do those things or encouraging those things. If you don't pay attention to their squabbling or their eye rolling or them slamming their door or them back talking or whatever it is, all of those are like inconsequential, like squabbles. It's just behavioral junk that kids go through when they're developing and when they're growing. And so yeah, I do absolutely get pushback. But again, it's kind of, it's remembering that parenting is not a social matter. It's not social, it's. It's spiritual, it's personal, it's emotional, but it's not social. And if we allow society to dictate how we parent, it's going to become coercive really quickly. Really quickly. Because society is saying we want expediency, we want that overgrowth. We want things to happen fast and we care about growth. Second. Oh yeah. P.S. yeah, they should probably be able to grow and to learn, but no, fast now. And the childhood is no longer about a slow development of self. It's about performance and want children to be seen as little mini versions of adults and for them to actually behave better than adults can. So it's just it. I just have to remind myself even when there is social pressure, like, no, it's, it's not societal. It's within the walls of my own home. It's what I feel right about doing. And I'm the one that loves them the most. And who else is going to love them unconditionally and be willing to do the things that are hard because nothing that I'm doing is easy. You know, saying no to cell phones, saying no to sleepovers, saying being calm when I'm the one. It would be a lot easier to get angry. Holding boundaries, want to be a lot easier to let go because they're yelling and screaming. None of that's easy. It's. You have to have to hold on to yourself and hold on to what you value because nobody else is going to hold on to your values for you.

That is, I feel like we could end the episode right here and everyone would have gotten like tremendous value. Be like, that was the best. I just took all of that in and honestly, just that part of you saying, parenting is not social, it's not for society. It's personal and it's spiritual. It's within the walls of my home. That just blew my mind. Like, I think I'm very active on social media and while I do have boundaries in place for like my, my screen time and phone use, I do read comments and I'm just like constantly consuming things even when I try to just be creating. And I think about that just in our, in our social norms today. Social media is a very relevant factor in our lives. And the more overwhelmed or overstimulated or you know, tapped out a mom is feeling, the more likely she is to just get on her phone and scroll and it starts to create a connection between our parenting and society when we're using our phone to interject those moments that we're feeling something very intense. And I've just never, I've never considered that before how it's not just about numbing an emotion when you reach for your phone and you're scrolling. It's not about avoiding the difficult parenting moment or behavior that you're seeing from your kids. It's actually creating a bridge from your parenting to social media that we don't even recognize that we're creating that. Ralphie, you just blew my mind. That's what you just did. That was so good. Talk more about this inconsequential behavior. I, I needed to hear that too. Especially when it comes to, I mean, I've got my four young boys, so yeah, my six year old does slam his door and my five year old will throw something down or like there's eye rolling. And my 2 year old is so advanced and he picks up on language very quickly. So. Well, if I were to tell someone like, yeah, my two year old says you're mean, I hate you. Get away from me. Everyone's like a two year. They're not even talking yet. I'm like, well, my two year old has two older brothers that have friends come over and they just, they say something. And with my older two, it feels like we can correct it very quickly. And then my 2 year old, it'll be like a 5 month thing where he just says it. And I've noticed though, if I pay attention to it, if I make it this thing, he says it more and he says it more aggressively and it escalates from there. So talk more about this inconsequential behavior. And what do you advise moms to do in those moments where they want to just draw the line and say, you can't talk to me like that, or don't slam your door.

Oh my goodness. Well, Dr. Glenn Latham coined the phrase junk behavior. So he puts all of inconsequential behavior into junk behavior. And it's kind of a reassuring, kind of. It lets you let it go when I label it that way, because it's like the junk drawer, you know, like, it's just the junk drawer. We just put it and we just kind of forget about it. We shut the door. It just, it doesn't deserve time and attention. There's research that says that over 90% of the misbehavior in a home is junk. It's just behavior that's part of development, part of growing. But it's inconsequential in that it doesn't do damage, any lasting damage, and it doesn't destroy anything. It doesn't do damage to self, to things, to other people. It's just like growing up and figuring out where you begin and other people end and pushing your boundaries and testing your limits and seeing what you can and cannot do and creating your reality. And so what positive parenting teaches is that the best way to use your time and your energy instead of focusing on what children are not supposed to be doing and pointing a finger at that, is that you move behavior along as quickly as you can and you replace that with good things. You point out what they're doing well, even if it's the tiniest thing, like, thank you for going upstairs all by yourself. You know, meanwhile, they're like, you're the worst mother ever. I'm moving, I'm leaving. This tells, I can't stand this. And they're stomping up. They're like, thank you so much for going upstairs. And that's like, when I say that I know how Crazy. That sounds to be like, wow, I can't believe that parents would do that. But the reality is, is that you don't want to energize the negative. We don't want to energize the negative. We want to energize what's positive and we want to use our power. Because parents are so powerful in creating behavior. We're so powerful, we're so good at it. For better or for worse. Is that if we point fingers at what they're doing well, the research says is that 80% of misbehavior just disappears. When parents are good at looking for what their children are doing well, giving positive reinforcement for what they're doing well, that 80% of the junk behavior just disappears. Children produce a lot of it. They're is research that says it's in that. Let me think about this. That little girls will do something to annoy their parents every minute and a half and little boys will do something to annoy their parents every minute. So there's a lot of junk behavior. But the reality is, is that as parents, and this is kind, I feel like it's been a little bit of my crusade. It's just to build a tolerance for it. Build a tolerance for it, be more okay with it and realize, yeah, tantrums are a part of being too. That's actually a healthy and natural and good part of being a two year old is that they express and they expel, they get overwhelmed, they flip their lid, their, you know, their prefrontal cortex isn't working anymore and they're, they just need to melt down for a little while and then they'll come back and on the other end of that, then we can talk and we can reconnect. But we don't need to be have such a hatred for all of the junk behavior. We just need to realize that it's there. And then also when we see it to think, how can I help? How can I as a parent be a better teacher? How can I be a better model? How can I be better at looking for what they're doing well, because those are the three things that create good behavior. Is that we are a good model, that we are up a good teacher, that we teach in an engaging way that helps our child to learn. So I recommend role plays, role plays, role plays. I could say to him, blue in the face. They're such a powerful way to teach children how to perform behavior correctly. And then also that we just, that we look for what they're doing well and we let them know that we love it and that we see them and that they don't need to fight for a place in her home that will create that space for them because we can see them, we appreciate them, and we love them for who they are.

That is so beautifully said. I, I really appreciate that you recognize tantrums and pushback are all healthy developmental steps of a toddler. And yeah, the way you captured that with, they're really good at expressing and expelling. So when they, they just get it all out and think about us as adults, how much better off we would be if we would just let ourselves get it all out sometimes instead of trying to push it all down. And most of the moms I work with are so good at suppressing things. They're so good at avoiding emotions. And I really believe that that's one of the biggest struggles that they face in parenting, is that they're trying to parent people that are good at expressing and expelling things while they are very poor at it. And that's just generational.

Right.

Like you were taught to, to suppress it, you were taught to avoid it, and now you have fresh new life that's doing what it's supposed to be doing. And we're trying to make it look like us and, and be like us without doing some reflection to say, wait a second, how much of me do I really want them to take on? Do I want them to take on these parts of me or these other strengths that I really have? So, Ralphie, how do you think when a mom struggles with, like, negative self talk and when she does something wrong, she berates herself and belittles herself and puts herself down? How do you think that impacts her parenting when her kids have a shortcoming or are having a hard time?

Yeah, I don't think I've ever heard a parent say, you know, to me, I'm such a lousy parent, but I keep getting better because I keep telling myself that I'm doing so poorly. No, I, I, I've never heard a parent say that ever. I just want to give parents so much hope out there. Children's brains are so plastic. Even teenagers, adolescents, their brains are extremely plastic. And they will. We can mold them and create new experiences for them and that it's a beautiful thing for children to see their parents work on themselves and to try to be better, especially for them. What a, what a wonderful, loving message to send to your child is that you're willing to be brave and you're willing to have courage and to close that feedback loop really quickly and say, how, how can I do things better? How can I learn? I, I did this one thing really well and I did it for about 10 seconds and then I, you know, my patience was gone and disappeared. But I did that really well for about 10 seconds. And I also think that sometimes as parents, unfortunately, we allow our child's behavior to dictate how well we are parenting. And I, I want parents to remember that too, that there is a, a discon. There's a difference between our child's behavior and our behavior. And that good parenting is not having a child that behaves well all the time. Because there's a lot of children that live in tons of fear and that's why they're behaving well, that's why they're being really obedient, is because they're fearful of what will happen, because they don't. So a well behaved child does not mean that there's a parent on the other side that's loving and kind and is doing all the technical, correct things. But a good parent is somebody who is responding well to the behavior and, and, and a pair. And a good parent is a parent that repairs. There's, there's studies that show that strong families, after following them for a long time, two wonderful things. One is that they only have to get it right 40% of the time for their children to turn out fine. That's incredible. There's a lot of grace in parenting. And number two is that strong, the strongest families are the families that are just really good at repairing the families that are really good at coming in and saying, I'm sorry, I messed up or that wasn't what I meant to say. Let me try again. And what a beautiful model to your children to show them that, yeah, life is full of failure, life is full of struggles, and that we can turn those failures into successes by coming and just trying to make things better. I actually, I have this, this is random, but I have a, a subscription called Teach me How and it teaches children social and emotional skills and it comes to your inbox every month. But the one that's cool, we'll get that linked. Yeah, yeah, it's beautiful. It's colorful and interactive and fun and it follows a lot of research about. It's actually written for children to teach. So it's a. Written in a really simple language. So children learn the best when they teach themselves. So that's another parenting tip is don't tell your child stuff. Ask them questions. But anyway, the one that we have coming out is just about when we make mistakes and how we can make things better. And that's a skill that as parents, we are learning too, right? Is how can I take ownership? How does my behavior impact other people? And how can I take ownership and responsibility for it? And how are the all the many millions of ways that I can make things better? I can make things better. I don't have to just be sad about the mistake that I made, that there is beautiful possibility in the tomorrow and that I can continue to make those incremental steps to make things better. And the lasting change is slow change. It just takes a long time. And sometimes people feel like there's been no progress. But I would, I would suggest that if you feel that way, take some data. Like write down how long your child yelled or how often you, how many times you yelled that day. And then, you know, the next week, take some data. Oh, I only yield two times. I think that is that we assume the only way for there to be success is for us to produce zero junk. And every single person on this earth produces junk. We all do. I produce junk, you produce junk, we all produce junk. But the fact is, is that we're just continually trying to get better. And that's the whole point. Right? The whole point of life is just to learn and to grow.

That's so good. So what about with parents that think they kind of miss their window? Like, I have four young kids and you're in a season where Your oldest is 21 and your youngest is 11. What if there's, what do you say to the mom that has a, I don't know, seven year old and she heard all the research that, oh, you just have to get the first seven years right. Oh, I know. Mindset is instilled by seven years old. Like, there's all this, there's research supporting how instrumental those early years are. And what do you. How do you encourage the mom that is out of those earlier years and she really wants to make a change, but she's battling this narrative in her mind that says it's too late.

Yeah. Yeah. Well, I get that a lot. I know you do too. And the thing that I always answer back is, it's never too late for positive change. Ever, ever, ever, ever, ever. If your parents made positive change, wouldn't you love it? Because is there something that your mom does or your dad does and you're like, why do they do that? I would love it if they didn't do that anymore. And then all of A sudden tomorrow, they come up and they're like, hey, honey, I noticed I. I had this feeling that there's something that this thing that I'm doing and it might be hurtful to our relationship. So I'm not going to do that anymore. And I want to apologize to you.

Oh, I love it.

We would all be so happy. And so, and I'm, you know, middle aged. There's never a time where it's too late. Wouldn't that be sad if that were the truth? Yes, those early years are important, but so are adolescents. There is new research that says that the adolescent brain goes through remodeling, an entire remodeling reconstruction that, oh, cool. Neurons that are not being used, neural pathways that are not being used, are lopped off. Your brain kind of takes a use it or lose it mentality where it's like, if I'm not using this neural pathway, I'm just going to lop it off so that I can create faster neural pathways, super speed highways rather than bumpy roads. And so that means that an adolescent's brain is more moldable at any other time in their life. So, no, it's never too late. Look at all these beautiful ways that the body is helping us again and again to try, to try again, to try again, to try again. And I don't think that there really is an ever, ever too late. It gets harder. It does get harder, but it doesn't mean that it's impossible. I think that it's something that we need to continue to grasp onto and to be willing to keep trying. Because the reality is, is that we don't want the other answer. The other answer is the worst answer, that, yeah, it is too late. That there always needs to be hope. There always needs to be something where we can keep moving forward and that our children will learn that we are a safe place if we change the way that we behave. They'll learn that home is a place they want to come to and that it beckons them home. And so. No, I don't believe that. I know you don't believe that either. There's. There's no such thing as a too late. And positive change doesn't always look positive right away. I think that people, positive change, it's just gonna be great. No, like if you, all of a sudden, you step back. Okay, I'm not gonna, I'm not gonna engage in this argument anymore. I'm not gonna argue with you anymore. My loving child. They're gonna fight harder, right? They'll start Yelling harder. They're gonna be waiting. They've learned, they've been conditioned to fight harder, to yell louder, and to push. It's called an extinction burst. When you're trying to get behavior to be extinct, it will push harder before it dips down into a new baseline, a new, lower level of negative behavior. And so just remember that, that sometimes when you learn new positive skills and you try to be more calm, you're holding boundaries, but you're doing it in a safe way. It might get harder for a little while, especially on their end, but just keep holding your boundaries and remember that even though maybe they were losing it all day long, if we can go to bed and feel like we behaved well, then we won. That's. That's the key, is just to remember how we're responding to behavior.

Yeah, I completely agree. And now we all need to remember junk. Junk behavior. And the extinction. What'd you call it? The extinction.

Extinction burst.

Burst. Extinction burst.

Okay.

We need to remember extinction first and junk behavior. Yeah, we really need to get down. That's. That's so, so true. And, like, even for my recent Mother's Day podcast, and I talk about this all the time, that what really helps me in parenting and my mental health and my mentality about it and my behavior of what I'm choosing to do is to keep that focus on how I'm responding. And instead of like, oh, well, I just have to react to that. I have to react to that. And what I think is so interesting is even when we tell ourselves, I don't want to yell. I don't want to yell. I don't want to yell, we put so much focus on what we don't want that we never actually define what we do want. And until we define what we do want, the mind has no idea how to do it. It's like, well, give me a picture, please. I would love to help you get that. You're just so focused on, well, I don't want to yell. And that's the vision. The. And the vision doesn't come through. Telling ourselves what we're not going to do. Our mind basically just cuts out the knot. And then it says, I do want to yell.

And we just.

Then we get the urge back again. So I think just marrying, like, the positive mindset with the positive parenting and keeping that powerful step of repair in there, just to let go of this idea of perfection, which I always think is. I'd love to hear your take on perfectionism and parenting. I always just think it's so interesting that we've ever tried to be perfect parents when we don't want to raise perfect children. Like, we don't want to put that pressure on our kids. And yet we want it to be a standard that we hold ourselves to. And I always look at it as, like, when I make a mistake as a parent or I slip out of alignment is what I call it when I do that. I tell myself it's a good thing I'm not trying to raise perfect kids because I look at it as like, I basically just accomplished the goal then, showing my kids diversity. There's more than one way that things can be done. One way feels really good and one way feels really bad. And this is what I do when I make a mistake, and this is what I do when I do something really well. And if I. If I only show up perfectly. That doesn't teach my kids. That doesn't teach them really anything. I think. What do you think about that? Perfectionism and parenting and motherhood. Yeah.

Yeah. One of my favorite things that my mom has told me is being imperfect is part of being a perfect mom. That that perfection is. Is being imperfect. Because the only way to teach a child well is to show them, is to show them what happens when I make a mistake. What happens when I get angry and I like, oh, I said that in a really angry voice. I'm sorry, let me try again. Or I forget something. I do that all the time. This is totally in my genetics is to just kind of be. I'm not very good about details. I'm like, ah, I forgot my keys, you know? And then I, like, run inside and my kids are like, mom, but again, then I come outside like, I'm such a. But it's showing them to, like, not take yourself too seriously, not take life too seriously, to have joy and to be silly. And all of those imperfections about us, the things we, you know, we get older, we get more tired, we're going to continually have more and more imperfect bodies. And it's just, that's life. But how beautiful, how beautiful and how perfect is that imperfect life? And it's. So what's so interesting to me too, is that what you were saying about wanting perfect children too is it's. I call it self projection, is that we project onto our children what we desire ourselves to be. And so if they're not doing certain things well, that's a reflection on our goodness. Like, oh, it's obvious that I'm not good at those things because my child's not good at it. So I'm going to push them harder to do those things that I'm not good at. And, and all of the things that you're training and helping mothers to do. I'm helping parents to teach their children how to do. You see, we're still learning all these same skills. Kids will. I'll ask parents, why do you yell at your children? And they'll say, I'm overwhelmed. I, they won't listen to me any other way. I, I feel overstimulated. Those are all the same reasons that children yell. Mm. Right. And so we're still, we're like in lockstep with our kids. We're growing up with them. And what you said about when they are telling themselves, just don't yell, don't yell, don't yell. But they're like, okay, what do I do instead? That's what parents will do to children is they'll say, don't hit your brother. Don't pull the dog's tail, don't throw the rocks. And so. But they're not replacing that behavior with anything that's positive. They're not using instructive language. To use instructive language means I'm going to instruct and give. Replace that behavior with something that's positive. Positive. If you don't replace it with something that's positive, you just are creating a void. And what's filled into that void is almost always something that's negative. Again, because it's the positive. Things are skills. And if you're not building skills, then we're just going to continually put it in something that's part of the primitive brain. And the primitive brain says, go and look for the things that are going wrong and let them know that you see those things that are going wrong, fix the things that are going wrong. And so kids do that too. They try to self preserve, self protect. But replacing those things is a parent's work. It's a parent's work to do it within themselves. It's a parent's work to do that within their children. So all of that looks like mess, right? A lot of mess. And it's going to be a messy system. It's going to be a messy progress. But again, I don't. That's life's terms. That's life's terms when we chose to have children. That those are the terms is that we were going to grow up together and that parenting requires of us to mature in ways that we wouldn't otherwise. And so just embrace that again. Build a tolerance for and accept it and be grateful for it and. And allow your children to be your teachers. I just. They teach us in such beautiful ways.

It's very true. They. They. I look at my kids and I just want to be more like them every single day. And when you're talking about behaviors that parents might struggle with and realizing, like, start with. You start with focusing on. Use the example specifically of, you know, oh, I said that with, like a really angry voice. Like, I'm sorry that I said it that way. Oh, if there's one thing I need to work on as a wife and as a mother and as a human being, it is my tone. And that's something I'm hyper aware of. And it's like my. My initial thought and feeling get. The power of my tone is what I'm noticing. So I've had to teach myself to quietly correct my own thoughts, change my emotional state, and then communicate. Because if I just go right into communicating, especially about what you're calling the inconsequential behavior, which now I know I don't even have to communicate about, thank goodness. When I go right into communicating about that, it's like my tone just, I'll say the right things, and I say them in a. In a harsh way or a really stern way, and it's so unnecessary. And I love what you said about giving, you know, ins, like instruction, using your language to give that instruction and being mindful, though, not to do it towards inconsequential behavior, because I think I'm really good at giving that instruction language, and I do it for inconsequential behavior. So if I just. If we all just focus it over, like, let that be. Let it be the junk drawer, the junk behavior. So they roll their eyes, so they stomp their feet a little bit, like, goodness, aren't they good at expelling this?

Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Right.

Building the perspective, layering it into those moments where they're expressing themselves. Layering those visuals with perspective does help to control that emotional state and being. I love. I just love what you just taught me of, hey, that's inconsequential behavior. And you can use your really good instruction language over here for when they do need something. How you're saying, okay, a dog is getting hurt, or someone would get hurt by those rocks that you're throwing. Like, that must be the consequential behavior then, right?

Oh, yeah, yeah. If. I mean, the beautiful thing. The beautiful thing that parents have the ability to do is to predict their child's behavior because they have so much past behavior to as data. Right. And so sometimes, unfortunately, parents, we just are tired or we're busy, we're distracted, we're thinking about our own agenda that we're. We don't take a minute to set expectations and, and help your child to think through what would be the correct thing to do here. If you're like, I have a good prediction that they're going to probably throw those rocks because I've seen them do it several times before. I'm going to keep them in the car here for maybe 30 seconds and say, hey, sweetie, you see outside? Look how fun it is to be outside. And people are going down the swing and it looks so fun. And there's, there's a. There's lots of fun things to do at the playground. You. But, oh, see the rocks? What should we do with the rocks? We've talked about this before. What should we. How. What should we do with the rocks? So you're instructing them to do the positive form. You're talking about the positive form and you're helping them in. I'm asking questions so my child can say, I keep them on the ground. That's right, we keep them on the ground. And then what I can do as a parent, as well as attach a positive consequence to. I can say, yeah, and all the kiddos that can keep them down on the ground, we can stay for a whole 20 minutes until we need to go home for dinner. Okay, you got that? We give each other a five.

We've got this.

We can do it. I know you can do it. It's going to be such a fun day. And then we go outside and we play. And the research says that if we just set those clear expectations and we talk to our child and especially attach a simple positive consequence. If you want to, you don't have to, but that really helps with momentum as well. If we do that, then 90 out of 100 times a child performs better just because we talk, talk them through it and we help them to see where the behavior is supposed to go.

Which is such a blessing that truly teaching ourselves to focus on the positive. And we're talking about positive behavior, positive consequences, positive language, not just think positive. Bright sides and silver lining. I think when people hear positive, they just think it's avoidance, like you're being naive. And what I've truly found through my own life is no, when I'm positive, I'm a better human. I'm better in every single area. And I still have Boundaries with myself and others. I just feel positive about those boundaries. I don't feel that they're there because of anger or hurt. I feel that they're there to protect myself and respect others and they help everybody coexist much better. And positive consequences, like, yes, my kids still face consequences. I appreciate every God given natural consequence that they face. And you know, when it's time for them to face a consequence. And like when my, when my kids hit. I don't know if this is how you think of it. I actually learned positive consequences from you, like that idea. I was like, oh, no. Natural consequences.

It's.

A few years ago, I, I heard you talk about natural consequences. I was like, what? There's a natural. It blew my mind. It blew my mind. And taking natural consequences and allowing them to live in my home and in my parenting has taken such a weight off of me because when my kids hit each other, I don't see myself as someone that needs to come in and punish somebody because I'm like, well, you're already hurt because you got punched. And then you're hurt too because he threw a car at you and you punched him. Looks like all the natural consequences already took place. Let's get back to regulating and teaching and shifting our attention. So I look at it as. When I'm focused on natural consequences and positive consequences and my expect my positive expectations, my positive boundaries, my positive language. I. I just show up in a way that I feel lighter. Like, I feel like the hard stuff, the. I wouldn't even necessarily. The hard stuff, just the, the ugly stuff like the yelling and the spanking. It's. It just feels like it's not my job to do it. And yeah, those things already taking place. So I'm like, clearly those are somebody else's job to do.

But I mean. And that's the secret. That's the secret because you hit it on the head, is that first of all, number one is our work as parents is not to change behavior, is to change hearts. I think far too often we just look at the behavior first. Right. But the behavior is a symptom. It's a message that's sending. It's being sent to us that something needs to change within the home some way somehow. Something that the child's dysregulated or, or that we're being a poor model or that the environment around them is not helping them to be calm or they're just going through a developmental phase. But the work of parents is to change hearts, which then change behavior. If that makes sense. Yeah. It's to create connection and love and to help build a loving reality for them with boundaries that helps them to learn to love, to behave. Well, I think we want children to do it, but that's a false goal. The goal is that they choose it.

Oh, that's so good.

That's. So they choose it on their own because we can't control them. We can only control ourselves and we can control the environment. But if we learn to do what's within our power in a, in a, in a positive way, they'll learn to choose it. And so that's why it's so important to learn how to use positive parenting correctly. And also what you were saying is that it just makes life better. Who wants to walk around looking for things that are going wrong all the time? Who wants to walk around pointing about your weakness and your weakness and P ops? I hate that weakness of yours. Nobody. What? Number one, it doesn't make anybody feel better, but it makes us go to bed feeling like life is terrible, that there's scarcity, that there's not eating enough, that I'm not enough. I'm not like, everybody's broken, everybody's doing terrible stuff. But if I learn to look for what's good, which is an actual behavior change, I can choose to change my body in a way that purposefully looks for what is going right, that the good keeps getting better. It keeps getting better. That's not just me, like laissez faire saying, you know, kumbaya. It's gonna get. No, there is actual research that says it will get better, that 80% of the misbehavior disappears and that there's momentum. The kids just keep getting better and your life keeps getting better. And what we do is that when we look for what's going right, we actually trick our brains into thinking. And even if we project like parents have a ability to create light in the future. So even if I say to my child, you are such a loving sister, I love that about you. You're such a loving sister. But I'm like, like in reality, maybe, you know, most, you know, most of the time that she's working on it, and I'm. I'm calling in that in her, right? I'm choosing to see what's best in her. That because I say that out loud to her, my mind is being tricked, that she is a loving sister. And because I say that about her, I'm going to behave toward her and parent her differently. Now I'm going To walk a path of gratitude for who she is rather than just believing that she's a. A lying, mean toad. Right. And nobody wants to. Wants to live their life that way or to. Or to just believe that their children are that way. It. Our brains are so powerful, they create our reality. And that's why, that's why positive parenting is powerful, is it's not only brain science and behavioral science. It just feels good. It feels good. Yes.

Yes, it feels good. It feels right. That when you, when you look at it from the perspective of what we're saying to our kids, I call it speaking life over our kids. Yes. Like with your, with the ur statements that you use with them, you're so right that when I tell my son, you are so helpful, it does program my mind to look for all the ways that he's helpful. And it also turns that you are statement. Once he receives it, it turns it into an I am statement in his mind. Just the same way when. When people say things to us like, oh, you are. You're saving me right now. Like, oh man, you're really saving me. Our mind inter interprets that to, I am saving them. I'm helping them. Wow, I'm really showing up. It turns into our self talk. And what I love about what you just said of, you know, our job as parents is not to change behavior. It's to change hearts. And when I think about that, I also love the perspective of I'm the heart of my home. And the heart is a very important organ in the body. It pumps the blood to everywhere it needs to go. And when I think about one of my kids having a hard time, like they're struggling with something, I think about it the same way, as if I had a cut on my arm, my heart wouldn't just stop pumping blood to that injury. It actually works harder to get more blood to the injury so that it can clot and heal properly and that we don't die and need to sever off the arm kind of thing. So when I, when I think about it, like, okay, I am the heart of the home, and my job is to change their heart too, not their behavior. That's. That's the default. And I also got me thinking about how many moms are feeling so anxious in motherhood simply because they're focusing so much on, like, trying to choose for their kids rather than how you said, empowering their kids to make the choice. Like, it's not about do this, it's about choose this and how much more relaxed we would Feel as mothers, if we knew and we trusted, oh, my child's gonna choose that. Like if they're playing with friends, if they're at a friend's house for an hour for a playdate, I trust them to choose this behavior because it, I never did that like for them or forced them. That is so powerful to just. If you really sit with it, if the listeners sit with this, if you want to feel less anxious and less like you need your mother in law to do things just the way that you do them or whoever. While yes, there's a lot of power and consistency for kids, there's also a lot of power and diversity. And as long as we get to their heart and we help them make those choices, then they can still be around people that do things different and not feel that same stress of control that we have more have the acceptance of like, oh, well, this is the choice I'm going to make because it feels right. So I just, I love, I feel like you just put like 10 things together that I loved so much. We're the heart of the home. We're choosing behavior, not getting them to do something, to choose it. I, I love that so much.

Yeah. And that's how it works long term. Right. It's the brain science about it. Here's the brain. So it's like I'm like a brain science geek. But the. When neurons will wire together multiple times or they'll fire together. Excuse me, they'll wire together eventually if they're firing multiple times. And so if I go up to my child and they're not very good at cleaning their room and I'm constantly yelling at them about their room. This is a disgusting, filthy health hazard. I can't believe you're such a pig. Those neurons are going to keep firing and pretty soon she's going to have an emotion connected to a behavior. She's not going to like cleaning her room. I'm not helping her to learn to like that. But if I can come up to her room and I find something, you know, like, oh, you took really good care of those new shoes that you bought. You're putting them to put. That's so dependable and very responsible of you. Thank you for doing that for me. I really appreciate that. Taking good care of those shoes. I give her a high five and I walk out.

That's awesome.

That's gonna help that those neurons to fire and wire together for her to learn. Like, yes, like you said, I am dependable, I am responsible. And if we continue to do that then pretty soon it helps all of their behaviors. Behaviors are linked. You can't isolate a behavior. I can't say to her, you are so dependable and you're taking care of your shoes. And that only affects that one behavior of her taking care of her shoes. Behaviors are links. They're links in a chain. They're all connected. So if I say that one thing about her shoes, it's going to affect all of the other behaviors in her life. They all generalize and so it just helps, it moves all behavior forward. I'm creating momentum for all good behavior just by saying one positive thing about one behavior.

I. Oh man, that is so good. So let's talk about like with your 21 year old, for example, in her character and what you just notice about her personality and the way that she's going through life now. Do you have any like points in time where, where you can connect? Like I saw that in her, that quality in her earlier. Like early on I saw her be dependable or responsible or charismatic with others or outgoing. Like when did you notice some of the behaviors that are just so true to your 21 year old earlier on in her life?

That's a really good question, man. I have to think about it. Aaron is, she's vibrant and has a lot of joy and is very childlike in the joy that she has. She loves, she still loves to play with her 11 year old sister that she, she's just graduated from college and wants to be a play therapist and makes perfect sense to me because I'm like, yes, of course, would love that job.

But.

I, I remember just saying that to her all the time, even when she was little, just saying, you're such a joy, you're such a joy. You're so fun to be around. I love your laughter. I love that you think that life is so fun. And she does still do that. Like she laughs and she has so much fun and I'm great that she's embodied, I'm grateful that she's embodied that, that she has become that person for herself.

It really is building a life around it. I mean she's choosing to play therapy.

An entire life around it. Yeah. Which is really pretty remarkable. But that's, you know, we, we can't decide what our children choose to do. Again, that's not our role. Our role is not to have children that never make mistakes or that always do the things that we want them to do or choose the path that we hope for them or anything like that. Our role is just to Be a safe place for them when they come home. Our role is to just be like someone who they can rely on, that's consistent and will call out the best in them. That will continue to do that and that will. That they believe in and that they trust because of all of the experiences that they've had in their lives. And so what I like to tell parents is just to remember that what's most important is relationship first and then behavior second. So focus on your relationship first. Like, don't go in and just be angry about what's going on. Just get down and be curious. Give them a hug. Say it looks like you're struggling or whatever, or, hey, can you tell me what's going on? What. Why did you take the balloon away? Can you help me understand what were your thoughts there? So now I'm caring about her. I'm worried about her thought process. I'm trying to seek what's going on rather than just getting angry about the behavior. So keep the behavior protected. That's the most safeguarded piece of your life. It's invaluable and it's been beautiful to see a couple of children launch and to still call us, like, almost every day, Bless their hearts and want to talk to us. But I'm like, this is what I wanted. Right When I'm on the phone and I've been on the phone for like two hours.

This is what I wanted.

I wanted this. And I'm so happy about it. It's worth it. It's worth our time. It's worth all of our effort. It's worth all of the energy. It's worth all the courage, everything. Families is the most important, number one life endeavor is to raise a family.

Yeah. And raising a family, if we lean more into what feels right rather than going through what we should or shouldn't do right now, like asking ourselves what really feels right. When I prioritize our relationship and then I focus on the behavior. Yep. That can make such a big difference. I have one more burning question for you that I, I think would just wrap up things so well and hit some of our. Some of our mom friends, parenting friends that have a little bit of reservation and making these changes because they tell themselves, well, my spouse isn't on board and he, he doesn't think the same way that I do about this. So how am I supposed to make any real progress or any real change if he's not on board? What, what's your advice there for someone that wants to make these changes and just feels like it's going to get shut down if their spouse. Or it's going to be useless if their spouse isn't entirely on board and doing all the same things too.

Well, oh, man. I have a few things. I think that, number one is just to remember that a pattern is changed when just one person changes. So can't. Things can't stay the same. It's impossible for things to stay the same if one person changes and. And continues along a path. Sometimes we'll be discouraged and we'll just go back to what our spouse is doing because we feel like there's no real progress. But if you stay on that path and you continue on that path, then the pattern has to be changed and it has to be broken. The other piece is that because moms and dads, you know, in the typical male, female relationship, they are so different and they're naturally so different that we think the mom way to raise children is the gold standard. Like the nurturing and the. Like the cuddling and the. All of that is the gold standard. But the reality is, is that children need both. They need, like you said multiple times, diversity in their lives. And they both need a parent that is nurturing, and they also need a parent that's focusing on maturance. They need both of those. They need a parent that's like, oh, it's okay. They're. They're wrestling, they're punching each other. Yeah, yeah, man, get in there. Get in there. No, you gotta. You gotta do it like this. You know, all of those things they need. They need dads that throw them up way too high in the air, and it makes the mom panic. And they also need somebody that holds them when they cry and is. Is willing to get down at their level and keep their arms open. They need all of those things in their lives to help them to balance out their needs. Children's behaviors are complex and their needs are complex. So just remember that there's some things also. When my children were really little, I was like, oh, I'm the best mom ever. I'm so amazing. As they've grown up, I see my husband's strengths come to light more and more. He's so good with teenagers. He's so good with them. He'll sit with my daughters forever and just talk about things like whatever their hair and their new hair products that they're going to get. And. And I'm amazed at his patience for just having conversations that feel like they're going nowhere. But remember that you have strengths and weaknesses and you need to balance each other out and to not worry too much about changing their behavior. Focus on changing yours. And then you can ask them, hey, I'm going to try this new thing. I don't know, honestly, if it's going to work or not. So I'm to going crazy. Parenting expert said that it was going to, but I'm going to take some data. Will you help me take the data? Husband, will you help me take the data? And if he's taking the data and he's like, yeah, I can see that now. Their tantrums were shorter. Instead of an hour, it's 20 minutes. It's getting better. Things are getting better. Help me to see that it's working, and I'm going to give it a try. And then I'll come back to you in a few days and we can talk about it and see if. Whether you think it's working or not. So kind of help them be a part of the outside study instead of, I'm forcing you and I. You have to change your behavior. And it's hard. Parenting is hard because you have to check your ego at the door. And so for some people, that's really difficult. Right? It's to check their ego at the door and be like, yeah, I. I really don't know anything. I know nothing now, and I'm going to learn and grow up with my kids. It's difficult for some people to be willing to do that. But again, if one person changes, the pattern changes. So don't be so worried. Be willing to just be the person that they're inspired by.

Yes. Yeah. And it's fascinating for the amount of moms that I've. I've worked with throughout the years, and this, this has been like an ongoing thing that comes up. And it's fascinating, though, that when we do take the leap of faith and we just choose to focus on us, like, sure, he's going to yell or he's going to spank. He's going to do the thing that he said he's going to do. And I can't control him. I can model something different. I can choose the way that I'm going to show up. And it is fascinating how quickly and frequently other people change their behavior very positively when our behavior change is positive and we're in control of ourselves. It's not this, like, reactive fight of, well, now I can't do the thing I want to do. Because you didn't do the thing you were supposed to do, like, right, well, no, you did the thing that you wanted to do, and I'm going to do the thing that I want to do. And both can coexist. It's just like you said, creating an environment in which one phases out very quickly because it just doesn't belong. It doesn't make sense to be there. And we don't have to tell. I believe that we don't have to tell our spouse when their behavior doesn't belong. Like, I. I've noticed that more often than not, they're perfectly capable of recognizing when they've. When they just overdid it. Like, that was. That was a lot. That was pretty intense for, like, this little thing. And especially if I handle it almost completely opposite of what he did. It's like a night and day for him where he's like, I didn't even consider that to be an option, which truly we didn't think this was an option before we learned it. And it's the same thing for them. And I love going back to the mentality of everyone's doing the best they can to their mental and physical capacity. So if my husband yells or if I yell, both of us did the best we could. And pointing it out and poking and prodding around in the negativity of things and what we don't want to be happening doesn't actually make it better. It doesn't lighten it up. We just feel a little bit more comfortable in that victim mentality of, see, it's you. You're the problem. It's not me.

Which is so much easier to do. Right. Exactly. To see the problems on the outside of this.

And then though we're. We're not only feeling like we're struggling in parenting. Well, now we're struggling in marriage, too. And I've found that when I just respect my husband and I show up in just a supportive way where it's like, I. I know the daddy wants to be. I know it. And I know that all four of our boys have a blessed gift of finding boundaries. I mean, they seriously find them wiggle under them. They are good at it. And. And I know how challenging it can be. And I have found nothing that works better to help my husband, I stay on the same team. Than for me to just be kind to him, like, especially in his hard moments, especially. And. And on his side, especially when my boys are like, well, mom, dad did this. I'm like, dad's doing the best he can. Dad's doing best can just like you, just like me. And I tried to protect that. That how you said, like, that relationship over defending behavior or one single person, like, we're just gonna protect this whole stinking relationship.

Yes.

That's so powerful, Ralphie.

It's.

And it's true. Like taking it back to focusing on you and what you're choosing to do, even when or if your spouse does something different. And yeah, I do. I love that you're saying, I think my husband's going to send you a thank you note. Honestly, I think he's going to listen to this and be like, where is Ralphie's address? I'm going to send her a thank you note. Thank you for telling my wife that I get to be a dad and I get to do things. There's value in the way I do things. And just like you said, I've learned so much when I just go hands off and let my husband do things his way. I have learned so many amazing ways to connect with my kids and reinforcements, behavior. I mean, he's so creative. He's so playful.

He.

He makes bedtime so fun for them. I was like, this is the way bedtime has to go. And then it was taking so long. And then he steps in. He's like, okay, I'm gonna tell you a story. Like, they're doing shadow puppets with the phone. I'm like, what? I never thought of these things. And he. He's the reason why so much of our home flows smoothly because he brings in play. He brings in so much of that. That. And I wouldn't have known that if I kept. Kept. Because it was there. Kept the expectation of do it my way. This is the way we have to do it. And I think just how you said, naturally, sometimes we think we're the gold standard and maybe we're not for everything.

And that just that one little thought, too, of looking for the good in your husband too. And even those little things that you're like, okay, he did that one thing that I love that I. I really appreciate that he did that. That he. When he was talking to him, he got down at the level. Maybe he still wasn't using instructive language, but he was down at the level. Or maybe he did choose to use instructive language one time. Or maybe he was playful at bedtime and just love to see how he connects with them. And. And you can even attach that to a value. Like, I love how you're protecting your relationship with them. And then it's so important to you to have a positive relationship with them. And it helps him to see. Yes. That Yes, I do care about that. That is something that I value. Because who wouldn't want to live in an environment where people are just seeing what's best in you and again, they are seeing what's best in you. Then you keep getting better, you keep getting at it. Like I said before, behaviors are all linked together. They're going to move forward in positive directions together. You can't isolate behavior. It's all going to move together in the same positive direction. So, yeah, look for the good in him too.

So good. So good. All right, Ralphie, we're gonna, we're gonna wrap things up. This is gonna go down as one of my all time favorite episodes that we have on the show. So there's that.

So nice. Thank you.

I'm gonna make sure that your newsletter is linked so they can get onto the. You described it as how to. Like your how to subscription or. What was that again?

Oh, teach me how.

Teach me how. Teach me how. Yeah. Okay, so I'll have that linked below and your audio course. I just want everyone to be able to get connected with you. Do you have any final words of inspiration or drops of hope to share with our listeners before we sign off?

Maybe just to be willing to take the time to learn and it's okay to learn what you don't know yet and to forgive your past self for things that they didn't know and just keep moving forward. Be willing to invest in the relationship with your kids and all the beautiful ways like with your, your wonderful consulting and coaching that you provide. And there's so many beautiful accounts out there now, thank heavens. When I started Simply Purpose, I was like, I have to keep talking because.

I'm the only one.

But now there's like so many of us out there and it's so, so beautiful. I'm so grateful. Yes, there's wonderful ways to consume positive content that will help you just seek out the things that feel right, that feel good in your heart, that feel like, yes, that's the kind of parent that I want to be. And just be mindful of your power to be able to. To set your children up for success, to help them to be successful. That's what we want, right, is we want them to just be successful. So try to think proactively and intentionally. How can I help my child at the playground? How can I help my child to get to school on time? How can I help them at dinner, at the dinner table? How can I put something at the table that I know they will like? So be thinking that through to just help them to be successful in their lives, because when they do, they just feel better about who they are. So that's it.

So good. So good. And we all individually know our kids best. So, like, everything that Ralphie shared here and everything that I share with perspective, the mom listening to this, you know your kids best. Like, there's no one that could come into your home and show up for your kids better than you do, because you're the one that knows their preferences, what they will and will not eat, what they will and will not wear, what they enjoy listening to, or, you know, the time of day that they want a certain thing. I. I appreciate that so much. In my home is, like, if anyone else were to walk through the front door and even just try to put the laundry away, it would take them three times longer than it takes me. I can, right? I can.

I can do a whole load of.

Laundry with all of our clothes in it. And I don't even have to look at the tags. I just know that's Drew's, that's Jake's, that's Liam's, that's Luke's, that's Marks, that's mine. And it's just like. Like, I flow. And I feel so fulfilled when I do it, because I know I'm the only one my husband still has to look at the tag. So truly, I'm the only one that can do that, that can do that. It's a strength. So I hope every mom listening celebrates her wins a little bit more, celebrates the wins of her kids and her spouse, and feels just a fresh wave of hope after this episode. So thank you for joining us, Ralphie. It was such a wonderful blessing to have you here, and I'm excited to continue learning with you as well as everybody else. We'll see you later.

Thank you. Thanks so much. Bye.