How I Cut My Lead Cost In Half In 24 Hours

All right, what's going on, ladies and gentlemen? In this video, I'm going to be talking to you guys about how I cut my lead costs from $90 per lead to $40 a lead in just 24 hours, and how you can implement these same tactics to decrease your lead costs and increase your profit margins. So, um, I'll give you guys a little bit of a background in terms of what happened here. Uh, so basically we shifted our model over from a retainer model where you basically charge monthly to a pay-per-X model. So basically we charge people per appointment that they get, right? Um, per show and appointment for more context. So essentially we're having to spend money on our client's behalf and our profit margin is the difference between what they pay us and what we're able to get the appointment for. So as we've sold more appointments, we're on pace to do $600K this month. We have to also scale up spend so that we can actually deliver the product that we're selling. So essentially what happened is we were in the process of scaling this up. I had a media buyer who was running everything on the back end, and our costs went from about $40 per lead to $90 a lead in a matter of about 7 days. Right. And so there's 3 things that I did to fix it, to get it from $90 back down to $40. And I think today it's at like $35. So we're in an even better position than when we started and we're on pace to scale that up and have very high profit margins as we continue to grow the business. So let me walk you guys through the 3 things that I did to cut our lead costs in half in 24 hours and how you can implement these as well into your own business. So the first thing is creative output. The second thing is the campaign structure that we use. And then the third thing is cost caps. So this is basically a strategy you can use on Facebook that I'll walk you guys through in a moment. Cool. So first and foremost, the creative output. So most of you guys are probably familiar with Andromeda. It's the new update that Facebook dropped in like July of 2025. And basically now at this point on Facebook, it's all about variety and unique creatives. So basically like completely new concepts of ads that look different and are unique from the ones that you have currently. That is the key to success on Facebook. And then just having a very, very high volume of output of ads. So before, what we were doing is we were probably producing like maybe 10 to 20 creatives a week. Now we're upping our creative volume to like 50 to 60 plus. Right. And the way we're able to do that is by using AI, which I'll talk about more later on and then even more in depth in another video. So basically the way that Facebook's new algorithm works is they're able to scan and index every ad that you upload to their platform for, you know, the text that's on it, um, who's in the ad, all these different things, all these different factors. And then they use that in combination with their algorithm to target and attract the right person. So basically at this point, creative is the targeting. You're not actually going in and like messing around with, um, audience targeting and interest targeting and all that stuff that you used to do. Like you're not targeting someone based off of their zip code really, or their, you know, interest in dogs. It's more so just like making the ads really, really good and making the ads very clear about who they speak to. Right. Um, hold on. Anything you want to add or any questions you think people may be having as I'm kind of going through this?

Uh, no, I do want to clarify though that, that $600K is, uh, we're pacing that on the, on the front end for, for my people watching. We're going to be, I think we're going to be able to, to actually blow that out of the water, uh, just because we haven't even hit our renewal swing just yet. So as the chief of revenue, I do wanna just throw that one in there, a little street cred for myself undoubtedly. But I would say like the biggest thing, one of the questions that I'm thinking through if I'm a young lad thinking of how I can scale my agency is gonna be like, you know, okay, cool, that's awesome. But like how do I actually do this creative stuff? And maybe that is that other video you were talking about, but that's the first question that pops into my mind.

Yeah, for sure. Well, that's actually exactly what I'm about to talk about, so great question. Um, so basically there's, there's 3 different pieces of— 3 different types of creatives that you can make, right? Um, or ways to come up with ads: ideation, imitation, and iteration. All right, so basically I'll explain what each of those means. So ideation is basically you're coming up with a brand new idea based off of different, uh, inspiration that you have, right? So some examples of inspiration, actually, let me just— so this is something that I basically was building out. I know you guys can't see this, but This is essentially drawing and mapping out our entire creative system, right? So inspiration could be looking at other people's ads that are successful, right? It could be listening to your sales calls and coming up with winning ads based off of what people are saying on the calls. It could also be, you know, current events, right? Things that are going on in the market, in the news. And just the overall ethos of society. Ideation is basically you're coming up with a brand new idea. It comes out of your brain from inspiration, right? So what we do is we take a bunch of transcripts of our calls, we upload them, and we use AI to find new ideas and new angles that we can go after, right? The next thing is imitation. So you can look at other industries that are doing really well and copy and replicate their patterns that are making those work. Right? So for example, let's say you're doing lead generation for solar. You could look at insurance to come up with ideas, or maybe, maybe you're doing lead generation for lawyers. Well, you could look at roofers to come up with ideas, right? You're basically just getting ideas from other industries and then applying it to your own. Really good one to look at is always e-commerce because with e-commerce, their margins are so terrible. That they have to be really, really good at advertising. Right. And then the last thing is iteration. So this is just basically making new versions of your winning ads. So what we do is we basically take all of our ads that we've seen are successful. And I'm actually— I'm building out a whole AI software that can analyze which ads are working on our account and then make new ads based off of that. And then essentially, like, it's just an entire feedback loop where it creates the new ads, we send them to an editor, the editor produces them, we launch them on Facebook, it stores all of the data in terms of what was good. It has access to all the scripts, all of the videos and everything. So it can see like, what are the patterns between what's working and what's not? And I can, I can make a whole separate video like breaking you guys, breaking down what that is and showing you guys how I built that. So the other thing too that we started doing is leveraging AI-generated UGC. So this is, this is some, some pretty saucy shit where essentially what you used to have to do in the past is you'd have to go and write a bunch of scripts, send them off to UGC. You're probably paying anywhere from $75 on the low end to $300 on the high end for a video. Then you got to take those videos, send them back to your video editors. Who are then going to edit them, put them all together, and then you launch them, right? So it's like a 2-week lag time to get ads actually made. So what we can do now is I can just take all these ideas, all these concepts, create the scripts, send them over to my editor slash AI video generator. So he actually does both and he'll create all of the ads, edit them up, clip them, and then I launch them. And that's done within like 2 or 3 days. Right? So you shorten the time cycle from 2 weeks to like 2 or 3 days to get an ad made. Uh, Julian, any— anything you want to add there?

No, I think Kobe said it all in the background there.

Um, yeah, could you hear that?

Oh yeah, yeah, I heard. I saw him like chewing on your plane or something there a second ago too. I think it might— maybe it— maybe it'll increase the viewership, uh, the retention, but No, I mean, I think the, the AI-generated content, like the, the AI, AIG UGC, if you will, um, that's going to be the future of, of creative for sure. I mean, especially because like, you know, when you pay UGC, it's like hopefully, hopefully they come back and deliver it the right way. And, you know, hopefully you don't have to go back and forth with them. And then like, you know, with that, I mean, it's going to be so much easier to edit your videos so much quicker as well. Like That's going to be a super, super huge play in the future, dude.

100%. And honestly, like, you can make it where it's better than a UGC creator would be. And right now, our best performing videos are all, um, AI videos. They're not even UGC videos. So there's no reason to have to pay an actor when you can just generate it. So Cool. Next thing that we did, this is something I see a lot of people making mistakes with, is we simplified our campaign structure. So the media buyer that I had running my stuff before, he had like all these different complicated campaigns set up and different ad sets targeting different audiences. It was like 5 ads per ad set, just all this stuff, right? Now, post Andromeda, with all of the AI in Facebook's algorithm, they can figure out exactly who needs to be targeted, right? Your job when you're generating leads, running ads, whatever, is to just create as much high-quality content as you can, give it to them, and say, just do your thing, right? So what I did instead is I basically just launched one broad targeting campaign. So no interest, no nothing, no age, literally nationwide. One broad targeting campaign. I uploaded like 30 different ads into it, so 15 images and 15 videos into the campaign, and then just said, cool, go and run. And I let Facebook do its thing. Um, and that's less work on my end, and it also gets a better quality lead. And if something doesn't work well, Facebook literally just won't spend on it. That's the entire thing, right? So this alone probably accounted for like 30% of the results that we got. Let's see what this is, right? So there we go. Um, now the next thing that I want to talk about is something called cost caps. So basically, this is something I hadn't really heard of. I've like, I'd heard of it before, but I had never used it until very recently. Uh, this is a fucking game changer. I don't think I'll ever run an ad without this, uh, moving forward. So essentially what this is, is you tell Facebook what you want to pay per result, and if they can't get that, like, get the result within that price point, they literally just won't spend your money, right? So I put it into Facebook, I'm like, cool, I want to pay $150 per appointment. Right? Because with all of our other costs and everything else, acquiring customers on the front end, paying our team, accounting for no-shows, all that stuff, I figured out that that's, that's kind of the sweet spot for what we want to pay per appointment. So Facebook cannot find me an appointment within that cost, it just won't spend the money, right? So what you typically would do is as you scale up, Facebook will just spend your money regardless, right? So we went from like Spending $1,500 a day to like $3,000 a day. And instead of getting us more leads, we just doubled our cost per lead. Now, if I say, hey, this is the max that I'm willing to pay, it won't spend more. It'll just cap out the budget. And so you, you lose, you save all that money that you would have spent just wasting on Facebook. So essentially you put the cost cap in and then if you scale up and Facebook does not continue to spend your budget, You just have to make more ads and improve your conversion mechanism, right? So improving your funnel, improving your offer, improving all of these other things. But this alone, now our cost, uh, cost per lead is like $40 and our cost per call is like under $100, all from just doing these things. So that's pretty much it in terms of how we cut our lead costs in half. Those 3 things: more creative, simplifying your campaign structure, and then adding in the cost caps. So I want to open it up to Q&A. I'm happy to show you guys different things within Reason and kind of explain more in depth in terms of like some of the things that we talked about, depending on what you guys have questions about. Julian, you got anything to add, buddy?

Uh, no, I think while we're on that topic, it's, it's worth noting that it's not like, uh, it's not just a matter of like media buying or creative when you're setting up constraints in a business. Like your system will grow, um, or your business will grow to the constraints, right? And so if you can actually self-impose constraints, a lot of the times you can actually force growth even further with inside the existing system. Like Tim is doing, for an example, like he could spend 10 times more. Or like, I think you said you doubled the ad budget and then your lead cost just doubled. Like it basically, you were basically just setting money on fire. So like you took the budget, doubled it and it's like, okay, cool.

I was funding Meta's acquisitions of other businesses.

Exactly. Yeah. You were, you were paying Zuck's salary. Right. But it's like, if we can set a set of cap on that, then like you're forced to be better at your job in a way because you have to give it enough game to play with to be able to hit your constraint, right? And so this is, this is something that's like whether you're using capital allocation within the business, whether you're looking at sales reps, like I have my own budget cap for sales reps. So I do, like for me, I'm willing to invest $15 grand into a sales rep. And if they don't provide at least, you know, 1.5x return within the first few weeks, and that's like really, that's like not good. That's really bad. Uh, but it's, it's enough for me to know like, okay, cool. I've seen that historically people over 1.5 actually eventually get to double plus. But again, the, the idea here is not just, it's not like, don't just think through this of like, hey, I just need to do this one budget cap on this one thing in the business. It's like, no, no, no. How can I apply this first principle of creating a constraint within the business to force more profitable growth? And that's something that we learned over the last year that really helped us in terms of profitability.

Yeah, 100%. Um, okay, let's see, we've got a couple questions here. So first one is, do you believe in having the first 5 clients to be free to learn from experience or charge them? So if you're selling leads or appointments, you definitely cannot have it be free or you'll just set money on fire. If you're selling a service, that's a little different, right? So what we did is we basically over the last like 6 months or so, we transitioned our agency from selling a service to now the only thing that we sell is a product, right? So we went from a service to a product. The service used to be running people's ads. The product is now appointments, right? So if you're selling a product, you can't give it away for free. If you're selling a service, you can give away your time for free. Um, so I'm not against this. It just depends on your comfort level, I would say. Uh, I mean, realistically, if you can't close and you can't sell, doing it for free is probably the best move. To get a case study and get experience. But, you know, I don't think if we started a product from scratch, we wouldn't make it free. But we also have years and years of sales experience, both of us. And I'm confident enough in my ability that I can deliver it. Right. But if you're brand new, then you could certainly sell it for free. You know, get a track record, get some experience, learn what you're doing. Um, but I will say the nice thing is if you sell it, then you at least have some capital to kind of like experiment with. And worst case scenario, if you don't get the result, you can just give them their money back, right? And usually when they pay you, they'll take it more seriously. So that's what I would say. Julian, do you have anything to add to that?

Just the caveat that like you can't give them a refund if you spend all the money and you don't have anything to refund them. So just make sure you have a capital reserve there to refund them if you shit the bed.

Yeah, well, if you're brand new, you shouldn't sell leads or sell appointments. You shouldn't like sell it as a product. You should sell a service, in my opinion.

Oh yeah, I would never, I would never like, I would never start this business that we have right now from scratch as like a beginner. I don't think that the business we have is a beginner business. The retainer plus ad spend model that we used to have, total beginner business. Phenomenal. Way, way better for learning. But like right now, if you don't have experience in like, like what Tim's area of expertise is, for example, of like, you know, doing creatives, managing budget allocation for ads and you know, how to, you know, financially model the business's profitability based off of what your cost per live call is, et cetera, et cetera. Like if you don't know how to do all that stuff, first of all, you're going to get toasted. And dude, even if you have like an, I would say like an intermediate skill level, like if we tried to do this, I would say probably a year and a half ago where we were probably, I would say we were probably intermediate at business like a year and a half ago. We probably would have gotten smoked and, you know, it would have been like a learning curve and we probably could have turned it around fairly quickly. But like even still, and that's fairly recent as a year and a half ago, like I would not recommend starting off trying to do that because it's very easy to go upside down quickly, especially like if your costs are out of control and you're not a savage, like creative guy or media buyer. Like if you're paying, you know, $200 a lead and you're selling them for $50, it's like, dude, you don't have to do that trade very long before you're going to be out of business. You know, so I think Retainer Plus is best way to start. And like, you can sell that service for free if you need to, to your first 5, depending on, um, you know what it is. I always like to throw in some element of performance if you're going to sell it for free, because like, it's just like if somebody came to me and said, hey, Julian, like, I'll, I'll do sales for free. Be like, well, you probably just suck. You know, I'd rather somebody come in and be like, hey, I'll work for free for the first $100K in cash that I collect. But once I collect $100K in cash, I want 15% instead of 10% to make up for the first $100K that I didn't get paid on. And it's like, okay, well now this person's like, they're asking for more than I would otherwise pay because they're willing to put their nuts on the table if they don't perform. And so it's like, okay, cool. Like now I wouldn't take that trade obviously for myself, cause I know my numbers and that doesn't make sense for me personally. But the point being is the same is that like, if you give them free or, or like a higher level of performance, if you know that you can do it. Then that's worth it. Or if you're just like in the training grounds, it's your first client, you don't know shit about shit. Like, yeah, I mean, doing it for free and like getting the testimonials is always a play. That's how we started basically.

So yeah, I agree. How would you approach learning Facebook ads marketing with limited budget? Work for somebody else. I mean, you really have 3 options. You can, you can work for someone else. You can pay to learn from someone else, so like buying a course or buying a mentorship or whatever. And then the last thing you could do is sell services and learn on somebody else's dime, you know, so sell a few clients and then kind of figure it out as you go. Luckily, there's a lot of content out there where you can definitely learn how to run Facebook ads. It's not rocket science. But it does take skill and there is a little bit of a learning curve. The good thing now is it's more just about— the main thing that you have to learn is like, how do you make good ads and how do you manage your money? But those are really your 3 options. So really just pick whichever one appeals to you most. Do you want to buy a course and just shortcut it and learn the lessons? Do you want to go and work for somebody and learn Facebook ads from them? Um, or Do you want to sell some clients and kind of learn through doing it? And granted, you could do any combination of those three. You can even do all three at the same time. They're not mutually exclusive. But the biggest thing is like, you want a combination of hands-on experience with knowledge, right? When you combine the two, it becomes applied knowledge, which is ultimately how you develop a skill.

Yeah, I would say it also depends on your risk tolerance and how, like, how, how okay you are financially. Like, if you're poor and you're like, you're hurting, just get the job, dude. Like, set the ego aside, get the job, learn from somebody who knows what the hell they're doing, and keep it moving. I, I learned how to sell initially in, like, getting sales jobs. You know, I didn't start off like with my own offer and all this other stuff. I went to proven products with proven companies and proven processes. And then I was able to play within that, like that little playground. If I fell down and caught a boo-boo, it was on somebody else's dime. I didn't lose anything. Uh, they did, you know, and obviously I had to hit KPIs and all that stuff. And eventually I ended up being the top rep at like pretty much everywhere I went. But the point being is, um, I had to, I had to learn those skills initially on someone else's dime. And like, I have to say, that's one of the most underrated things of all time. Like, everybody hates on the internet about like having a job, but like, if you have a job that doesn't teach you skills, that doesn't invest in you, and they don't like want you to grow, and it's just like the super corporate, like, sluggish situation where they're just like, yeah, you're gonna die here and live here, work here for 40 years and get a 0.03% raise every year. And like, we're not going to teach you anything, just like don't talk to us. Like, you know, clock in, clock out. Like, that sucks emotionally. But if you can go to a company like, you know, not to plug our company, but like Advanced Agent Marketing, uh, our marketer just made— the guy that works with us has been working here, he's got experience, he's learning new things from our mentors and working with Tim. And dude, he's making serious money um, with his skill sets that are going to stick with him forever. So he's literally just getting paid to get better at running ads, which is—

they got paid $24,000 last month. It's not bad.

Yeah, it's max level badass. Like, if you can make— if you can get paid to, to learn and get better, crazy.

Yeah, 100%. 100%. All right, let's see what we got here. I have $1,500 Canadian. You're gonna have to convert that into USD for me, brother. I know about ads, GoHighLevel, and basic service delivery stuff. Which niche should I target and what should my offer be? Because I have zero proof and no testimonials. Um, so I'm going to answer this question. I'm kind of going to answer this question, but I'm also going to make you— I'm going to give you some homework, right? So what would I look for in a niche? I would look for They sell something that's high ticket, so $5,000 or more. They don't go out of business often, right? So you want to look for established businesses that stay in business for a long time. If you can find people in your niche that have been in business for like 20, 30, 50 years, gold mine, right? Third thing you want to look for is a business that already spends a lot of money on marketing, right? Like, I'm not going to go to Um, massage therapists who don't— like, them spending a couple grand a month on marketing is a lot, right? Or I'm not going to go to, you know, like a, like a local handyman who like does, you know, repairs toilets for $20 an hour, right? Like, that would just be terrible. So you want to go to people that are already spending a lot of money on marketing. Um, a good way to to find those industries are just like, look who is putting up billboards in your city. Look who is running ads already on Facebook. Look who, um, is running ads on TV, right? Like those things. So the combination of those things. And then the other thing you want to look for is a, is an industry that's not super technologically advanced. If they're a little bit further behind, that's, that's good because that means that anything that you do for them is going to be like rocket science, right? If I go to an e-commerce business and I'm like, oh, I'm going to help you generate more customers, they're going to be like, yeah, you and everybody else with a pulse, right? Because that industry is locked in and they're good and solid at running ads and getting customers and building automations because they have to be. So you want to go to an industry that doesn't really have those same skill sets, right? That's what I would do. I have a whole video on my channel talking about what's the best, what's the best niche, but those would be the biggest things. Now in terms of your offer, what I would do is I would do a retainer model with a performance guarantee, right? So basically they're going to pay you a certain amount per month, depends on the industry, anywhere from $1,500 $3,000 a month. Usually I would structure that for a 3-month term, so it's going to be anywhere from $4,500 to $9,000. And basically what you're going to do is you need to figure out what are other people in your niche offering, and then you need to basically make a guarantee that, that you will get them the outcome that they want, or you'll continue working with them for free. You don't want to do a money-back guarantee because because you'll end up getting screwed because you don't know what you're doing. So that's what you need to do. Run that up, get some proof, get some testimonials, and then you can leverage that to basically grow and become better. And then eventually you can get from selling a retainer, which is a service, to selling a product, which is leads, appointments, shows, clients, whatever. Anything to add to that?

Nah, see if we got anything out. Nah, I don't think so. But oh yeah, oh, actually the $1,500 Canadian was the only other— that was the only thing I did want to touch on. Uh, you need more capital, bro. I mean, not to get started, but like to keep it going, you definitely need to get like— I don't know if you have a job or I don't know if you have a business or if you have like a client base or whatever, but if you have $1,500 to spend, like I would figure out like first, how can I turn that $1,500 into more? If that's like, you know, what I did when we were starting, uh, initially was like we would work on our business Monday to Friday, like literally like 16 hours a day. Um, we would take like a 15-minute break to smoke a Black Mild and talk about how we were gonna, how we were gonna take things to the next level and, you know, take over the world. And then on the weekend, days were dark, dude. Dude, it was so dark. We were so— our business was so broke back then. But, um, we were, we were trying something new every week and listening to Alex Hormozi's $100 Million Offers on repeat. And I would literally work like 38 to 41 hours a weekend waiting tables, opening, working straight through the day and then closing. Um, and then doing that same thing. I did that for months and Tim was like raising my puppy. So it was like a madhouse, but it's like, that was the dedication that I was willing to put in to get extra capital to have to invest. So like, if you're like, oh, I don't want to do that. It's like, dude, just do it for a few months. Just do it for a few months. Bail yourself out. You'll, you'll make it faster if you can endure more pain now.

Trust me.

But let's see. You're spending $1,500 a month for B2B ads for your agency. How many ad creatives should be in that ad set?

I think this sounds like another, another question like the one before. You just need more money, bro. Yeah, like I wouldn't even like your first, the first like 5 words of your question, I would just not do. Like you're, you're not going to get anywhere with $1,500 a month, dude. That's like $50 a day. You need more cash. Like you don't even have enough money to really test much there. Um, the minimum I would start with is like $100 a day, ideally like $200 to $500 per day. Yeah.

And the reason why we say that is because like you basically, what you're saying guys, when you're doing this, like we're not just, we're not just dogging on you guys in the comments. Like we've all, we've all been there, but what, what needs to happen here is like you guys actually have to like have money to test because you're going to make mistakes. You're basically confining yourself by having to bat 100 with $1,500 a month. So it's like, yeah, you essentially have to like hit the bullseye every single time. And if you're less skilled, you're, you're essentially like you have a pistol with no sight and you're trying to take a 100, 150 yard shot and hit the bullseye every single time with that budget. And like, nobody's going to hit that shot. Tim's not going to hit that shot. The top marketers and Tai Lopez isn't going to hit that shot with a $50 a day budget. Like there's going to be waste. There's going to be mistakes. And yeah, like if you use the, I think it was like, what was it? Iterate, ideation, iteration. There was another issue.

Imitation.

Imitation. Yeah. If you're going through like the 3 I's and then you like set budget caps on yourself, like you're going to be able to definitely get more juice for squeeze. Like you'll get closer to the bullseye. But you're just putting— you're pigeonholing yourself into such a difficult position when you're trying to play with such limited capital like that. And this is like, you know, if you guys need to, um, if you guys need to get things— I saw another question come in, I got distracted, sorry. Um, if you guys are trying to get things rolling, like, you're gonna have to either sell like we talked about earlier to get money in to play with and learn, or you're gonna have to get a job or work for someone or do something so you have more money to spend. Or if you already have income coming in and you're just being cheap and you're like, this is all I'm going to spend, the answer is just to spend more in that scenario so that you can learn faster and then ultimately grow quicker. And like, you are going to lose money. You will, you're, you are going to lose money. You're going to pay to learn those lessons and it's going to suck temporarily, but it is a price worth paying as long as you are in this game for the long run. But if you're trying to get rich quick, uh, sorry, we can't help you. Let's see, we got another one, another one that just came in. Let's see, when you scaled your agency, how much of that was profit? Um, we don't actually have exact numbers in terms of profit here just because we actually walked away from that opportunity. I don't know if Tim's closer with him than I am. Maybe you have additional context, but I don't know what that I don't really know much about that situation.

Yeah. Um, I don't know the exact number, but I think it was like 30 to 50% margins. Yeah. But we were like way higher on ad spend. His problem is he couldn't, he wasn't able to like actually fulfill the service that well. So he's, he's going back to the retainer model because it was a brand new industry. Um, so again, if I were to go back, What I would do differently is I would do a retainer model first, learn the skill of lead generation in the space that you're in, and then do selling pay per X.

Honestly, so yeah, if I could go back and redo that, I would just hire someone who knew what the hell they were doing. Like, if I was him, we'll call him Batman. If I was Batman, What I would do is I would hire someone who would actually run what he was fulfilling. And honestly, he didn't even need either of us. Like he could have just done that and hired like somebody to do some creative stuff and like, like the AI UGC thing. And I think that probably would have been like best case scenario and then just raise your prices. And I think he would have honestly been fine. Um, because like the one thing that needed to be solved for that model was the one thing that like none of us knew how to do. That I have the most experience in, but it was also like, I've never done that either. So, you know, so it's like, I don't know, I think that that would have been the only thing that I would have changed there. But I think that was actually a pretty flawless business idea and model.

Um, let's see.

Should I try to get more money first or cold call? I don't know why I thought that said cold plunge when I first— I was like, dude, what's this guy saying? Uh, or cold call to get initial clients as I am jobless and homeless.

So this is all I'm supposed to be in, bro. I don't know if you meant homeless. Either way, we're praying for you, but homeless is also tough too.

Yeah, I did. Yeah, I, I don't know if you're like memeing in the comments right here with the homeless thing or if it was just a typo. Um, but if you're, if you're— let's assume that you're jobless and homeless. Um, go get a job. That's— I'm just gonna— that's, that's all. Start there. Get a job, get a home, fix that first, and go from there.

Now, if you're hoeless, get a hoe.

If you're hoeless, um, that's a different problem. Go to the gym and get your diet right, take a shower, and just like, you know, become a more well-educated man so that you can represent yourself properly in the marketplace. So we got another one. Fare at $100 a day.

Start tanning your balls too.

That'll help. Never done that, can't speak to it, but it sounds, sounds like it might work. Uh, $100 a day with a tight offer, how many leads appointments would that be then assuming a static photo ad, potentially a good video ad, good offer, no proof? I don't know if you mean tight offer as in like tight as in good, because then you also repeated yourself, which I'm not sure. You said good offer later, so I'm not sure if you're saying tight offer isn't like a good thing or tight offer as in like it's tight for you to get results with it.

Um, dude, the thing is, there's no way for us to predict how many leads and appointments you're gonna get. It all depends on how good your ads are. Like, the problem is, like, and this goes for anyone that's just so tight on cash that you're like worried about this, if you can't just lose $3,000, like, you need more money. Yeah. Like the fact that you're even asking us how many leads and appointments you would get, it does. It just depends, dude. Depends how good your ads are. Depends how good your offer are. Depends what your industry is. Like there's no way for me and William to predict that here. It would just, we would just literally just be pulling out a random number.

Um, yeah.

So like, dude, you gotta just get more cash. Like have $10,000 set aside, gunpowder that you can go burn. Um, or just go work for someone and learn.

Yeah, that's what I would— and these aren't bad questions. Like, I know Tim and I can be a little direct sometimes, but like, these aren't bad questions, but you're just looking for surefire bets, and that's just not business. Like, if we— when we talk to our, our mentors early on, you know, a lot of the people that we were working with were less established and younger in the game, and so they would just tell us whatever they thought was right. And then the further up we go, the more they speak in principle and idea and general direction, unless they speak in like certain direction and certain outcomes. Because like, I could come in and tell you, oh dude, with $100 a day, you're gonna get this and this and that. And then it's like, if it doesn't happen, well shit, is it my fault or your fault? Who knows, right? But there's no business— there's no business oracle, there's no mentor, there's no coach or course or any one thing What you're paying for is experience and judgment when you're going through and learning from other people. And that's what you're paying for when you run ads and they suck. And that's what you're paying for if you have a job with your time. And so like the biggest thing that I can give you that'll help you more than us giving you the exact answer to that, even if we knew it, would just be like, there's no magic potion, there's no silver bullet. You just have to get better. And invest in your skills and take the time to realize you're gonna suck a lot for a long time, and eventually you'll get better. And the, the delta on the skills that you build and how that correlates with your income is explosive when you find that intersection of skill and experience. But right now you need experience so that you can get skills. That intersection up here where income is, is like a J-curve where it just blows up. And I'm saying this as someone who like, I didn't have $3,000 to set on fire when I started a business and it was like hella stressful and I had no idea what I was doing, but I was also working 40-hour weekends to make sure that I could keep the dream alive. And it was exhausting.

The thing is we set the $3,000 on fire anyway, you know, like whether we had it or didn't, which I'm not telling you like you guys to do that, but I'm just saying like, You got to be willing to lose it.

To answer Paul's question, I think so, but that's not the answer for everyone. That was just—

that's what I mean. That, and then paid people for coaching to just learn how to fulfill for that industry. But his situation, which he's doing now, particular— he's doing it now. So we'll see, maybe, uh, maybe he'll be at a million a month in the next year. I think he— I think he's gonna hit something big. Yeah, he's in a really good industry, so he definitely will.

It's not a one-size-fits-all though. That, that's the thing. That's, that's what I was kind of trying to tell Kelvin a second ago, Paul, is it's not a one-size-fits-all of like, oh yeah, you should just hire someone to fulfill your service every single time. Like, that, that's not always the right answer. For me, if I started a business by myself, it would be because I'm not a fulfillment guy. I'm a sales guy. So like, I can go sell something and then hire someone to fulfill it. Because that's just not my specialty. So like for me to, it would be less valuable for me to try and learn how to fulfill something and build systems than it would be for me to just go off and sell it. But for a lot of people in the internet space, it's actually, it's actually backwards. They don't have the sales skills. So it's like oftentimes it is worth it for you to do that early on. Um, when we were early on, me and Tim, I sold everything. Um, he fulfilled everything and that was, and he marketed everything. And then a lot of the times I did the customer service facing stuff and then it kind of evolved and You know, we still actually kind of stay pretty much in that lane for the most part. He markets and fulfills, I sell and deal with everybody. That's pretty much like how we've always run it. Kelvin says makes sense.

Cool.

I think we got time for one more.

I mean, dude, I mean, you don't have to go necessarily get a job, but like you're not going to be able to— you're not going to be able to like see success on ads if you're super on a very, very tight budget. That would be the best way I could put it. Um, with OpenClaw and AI autonomous agents now, what do you think the best case scenario your margins would be at scale? Um, I mean, dude, there's, there's businesses out there that run 80% margins now. So it definitely opens up, it definitely opens up the potential for very high margin businesses, for businesses that would typically be lower margin because of the labor costs, right? So we're eliminating a lot of the roles at our company because of AI. I'm not really— I haven't used OpenClaw a ton. The people that I've seen that have used it, it ends up just really taking a ton of time away from dollar-producing activities. I haven't really seen it produce a massive ROI. I did buy 2 Mac Minis and I had a friend set them up, so I'll keep you guys posted if that ends up becoming like a major, um, driver for us. But I mean, dude, without OpenClaw, if you just use AI to automate a lot of your workload and build automations with N8N and other things, um, I mean, I don't see any reason you couldn't run like a 70-80% margin business. The math that I've done with a few moves that we're in the process of making, I mean, I think we'll be there too.

I know here's, and here's something too, cause I've like, there's this, there's this myth online that was shattered for me by a lot of business gurus of like, your margins will compress as you scale. And there's definitely some, some truth to that if you don't regulate your spending. But like, for example, there's companies out there like Visa, for example, if you guys have ever heard of them and MasterCard and those guys have like 50% margins. And that's not speculation, that was like in a court case disclosed. So when you're thinking about like how you can— and that was like before, that was before AI was going like super hard. So like just think about what is possible.

50 to 55%, that's insane.

I think look at their revenue.

Gross margin is 97%.

Look at their, look at their revenue though. That's what's more impressive. They're not doing $50K a month. You know what I mean? It's not like they're doing a 97% gross margin on $50K a month.

Like, what is their top line? $5.1 billion in profit on $8.8 billion in revenue.

What are we talking about? Yeah. You know what I mean? You know, so it's like when you think about that, it's like, and they're going to be ahead of their curve. You know, if you're making, if you're making $5 billion a year in profit, like you're going to be able to reinvest to to, you know, forward-thinking technological advances before they even come out, you know? So they're probably a little bit ahead of the game in that sense. But it's like, with what's coming available to the public, you can definitely run higher margins and build a bigger business than ever before in history. Like, we have the literal best thing ever. This is like when the gun— this is like when guns were invented for warfare, you know what I mean? It's like revolutionary, the freaking opportunity that we have in front of us.

This is like when fire was invented for, for humanity.

Yeah, literally. So, um, let's go through one more and then we can, we can wrap it here unless you guys don't have any. I don't want to hold you guys hostage and spit unbelievable amounts of game on a live on a, on a Saturday if you guys don't want it. Let's see, do we have anything?

Going once.

Anything to throw out there, Tim? Any, any kind words of genius before we wrap up?

I don't know about that. Um, I don't know about kind or genius, but I will say, like, man, I'll tell you this, guys. If you just stay in the game long enough, your skills will build up to a level and your judgment will build up to a level where it's just inevitable that you'll make money. You know, but like you just gotta like, you just gotta take imperfect action. Um, we're going to start making a lot more like advanced higher level content on this channel, probably talking to people that are already doing, you know, $50K to $100K a month with their agency, but want to make more and increase their margins. Um, and really just kind of talk about what we just, the transition and shift that we just made. But I'm telling you guys like stay in the game, pick one niche that's good. Like really think through the niche that you pick, make a good decision, go all in, and then just become a student of the game within that industry. Never stop. Like for us, it's been insurance. I know basically about everyone that there is to know within my side of the insurance industry. I'm pretty well connected in that space. Um, and I continue to get even more well connected, but like You know, if I got into legal or something like doing lead generation for lawyers, or I got into lead generation for roofers or home service, I would just become as much of an expert on that industry as possible and just stay in the game and master my craft. And I'm telling you, if you're in the game for 5 years and you're continuing to focus on your skills, Even if your agency is only doing, you know, $10,000 to $50,000 a month, eventually your skill sets are going to get so good that you will just be able to find a massive opportunity. And if you pair that with execution and you go hard, you'll make more money than you know what to do with. It's just, it's, it's just a fact of life. Um, and that's kind of what we're seeing playing out for us right now. It's like we've just stayed consistent. With the same thing for long enough. And eventually we've started to find a combination that works. And now it's just about scale, scale, scale. Um, I mean, by the summertime, I think we'll be doing a million a month. And I'll share with you guys exactly what we do to get there, uh, and how you guys can kind of replicate it in your own business.

I'm putting it out there. I think we'll do it sooner. I'm just, I'm throwing it out there.

By the latest summer, but Ideally, yeah, probably.

I think we'll have it done. I'm like, I'm like talking to the team, like, how can we do it next month for our, for our first million dollar month? I think, I think it's, I think it's possible and probable, but not guaranteed. And that's all that I need anyway. I don't need a guarantee. Um, so cool. Last question and then we'll wrap here. Thoughts on cold calling? Um, I mean, if like cold calling is a really low, uh, cost way to acquire acquire clients. It's just time intensive. So like, is it the best way to get clients? I wouldn't say so, but if you have a background in cold calling and you know how to do sales really well, uh, it can definitely be super profitable for you and you can acquire clients that way. Like, people do it all the time. So I mean, it's not a bad acquisition model. It's just, is it the best? And a lot of that comes down to like how much you have to invest in ads. I would personally rather just do ads, direct response, and do like a setting for—

you just got to do something. So yeah, cold calling if you're poor, great. If you have money for ads, I would rather just do ads. Bingo. That's how I would say it. But hell yeah. All right. Peace, y'all. We'll see you guys next week. Go crush it. Make some money. And if you guys are not already in the school group, jump in there. I need to get back to some of you guys' questions. But we are active in there posting content and, uh, sharing game. See you guys soon.

Peace. Later, skaters.

See ya.