Renat Gabitov: How To Create The Life You Desire? | The Authors Unite Show #979

All right everyone, welcome back to another episode. This is my brother. I'm gonna let him introduce himself.

So tell us, in the house, the lifestyle engineer, the traveler, Been to 70 countries. I live around the world. I work on a workflow automation tool in software. An entrepreneur, ran an agency before. But on this phenomenal podcast episode, Authors Unite, uh, yeah, I just wanted to catch up with a good buddy of mine. It's been a while, man.

Yeah, dude, I'm excited. And, um, for people that don't know, like, what I've been starting to do, um, and you're actually— it's, it's really only you and one other person so far that I've been doing this with— is like like every couple months, like have you on for a longer period of time and just like talk about stuff because it's you. I don't know if you know my other, um, his name is Jay Duran. I don't know if you've ever heard, um, an episode with him, but like both of you, I just feel like you guys do so much stuff that like every couple months there's just so much like downloadable information. It's, it's like you're a new person every 3 months. So I, I don't know, I just feel like it's cool. And, um, so you'll be hearing from Renette, uh, again.

Yeah, being on this podcast makes me want to live a more epic life so I have more stories to share. Just some highlights, you know, I was just riding huskies like 2 weeks ago, you know. Yeah, I was, I just tried to do crazy, crazy stuff every time, man, so that life feels very intense. Like, you know, sometimes I work like every day, everything is the same. I go kind of like to the office and I do a lot of really cool intellectual creative work and I love it. Like I lose myself in the flow, but for me, I need to do some external things like motorcycling through, I know Turkey, that's something I did recently. Or like doing huskies or just, you know, I know going to a Philharmonica, just whatever it is, you know, it just like makes me feel like, okay, life is so intense and full of things to do.

And you bring, you bring people together. I know, you know, obviously before the, everything hit, we were discussing like a potential entrepreneur house and stuff. So, how many times have you been to Bali or for like the how long?

I spent 7 months living in Bali.

7 months. Yeah. Well, what are your thoughts on that? What was that like? Good times?

Yeah. Well, here's the deal. First of all, Bali is a place I did not want to go to. So, I spent— Really? A month in Thailand, then I lived in Malaysia, I spent months in Hong Kong, so I lived kind of all over Asia a little bit, and it wasn't quite my thing, you know, I do not like people running around too much, like too much the way they do in Asia, like things are, you know, dirty, and then it wasn't quite my vibe. I like Barcelona, yeah, I like kind of like classier, you know, more organized things, where I do not feel like I'm super stressed out. So I was really resistant to go to Bali. I'm just like, you know what, fuck it, I don't wanna go. And then too many friends, too many friends, they told me, hey, Renato, Bali's the place, Bali's the place. So I thought, okay, I'm gonna go there for maybe a couple weeks. If I do not like it, I'm out. That was my kind of introduction experience. Honestly, the first like 2 or 3 days, I was blown away. The rice fields, amazing food, completely different culture from like the Asian countries that, that I've been to. Uh, yeah, I loved it. Beautiful people, amazing, um, amazing nomad ecosystem with fast internet, with villas. You feel like you, you live like, like a god in a way because you have everything available to you and you do not need to, uh, be balling like you would if you were to live in New York City in order to afford I know like 3 mates in case that's something you're into. So yeah, Bali is awesome.

That's awesome. It seems to me to live like a god, all you need is my doctor and then you need Bali. My doctor in Bali and you're set.

I wonder how many of your listeners know about your doctor because this is something I keep bringing up to all of my friends. I say, I got this friend Tyler And this guy, he, he does something super unique. You want to, you want to tell us what you do?

Oh yeah, sure. I mean, basically, I, um, well, how it all started is I was having severe stomach pain and then I found out it was like gluten related. I go to this doctor after going to the hospital 5 times and he takes my blood and then he finds out what I'm allergic to and a bunch of other things that I was low on. And Then he basically every 2 months I get my blood drawn and then he basically just like fine-tunes me almost like a car. I feel like it would be to make my blood levels be at the optimal. And this is everything. This is like testosterone, vitamins. It's all natural stuff, but it's pretty much, I guess, everything from a blood panel that you would have. So like 2 IVs a week. And I feel incredible, honestly. So that's really what it is.

Can you remind me how much you drop on that doctor a year?

Oh yeah, um, so it's, it's $5,000 every 2 months. So what is that? Um, $25,000? $30,000? Yeah, like $30,000.

Yeah, yeah, exactly. No, no, and at the end of the day, for a peak performer to pay, to pay somebody $30,000, which sounds ludicrous, it sounds crazy, but at the end of the day, if it adds a little bit of an edge— and then you've been saying that, you know, It's been like a game changer. Such an amazing investment.

It's pretty, I mean, anybody, a little testosterone goes a long way, let's say that. That's awesome.

So it's super interesting just on that point really quick. I know a lot of people that are data fetishists. They try to collect all of the data. They wear 10 different wearable devices. They try to watch everything, take pictures of their food, do extensive journaling on everything they think and everything else. And at the end of the day, I'm not sure how, how, how it's with you, but I realized— and I was like one of those people, I was just tracking everything, uh, trying to evaluate, measure everything, try to like programmatically make decisions— and I realized it's such a waste of effort and time and energy because, uh, because with certain things like the stuff that you do, I feel like if you just say, okay, let a professional do his thing, let them fine-tune me, and I'll just be responsible for my very narrow area that I want to be an expert at. And that's going to be podcasting, that's going to be making authors become bestselling authors. And that allows you to develop that expertise because you have a lot less cognitive load. You do not have to worry about, like all of the bullshit because you have the magical doctor, but it's not only just the magical doctor, it's delegating that decision to an expert, to a professional to be able to do that for you.

[Speaker] Yeah, okay, I love that you said that because I think that especially health, right? Like, I mean, and this could be with a lot of things like building systems in a business, which I know you're amazing at, like things like anything, but health particularly, especially 'cause I know, all the things he thinks about, like, it would take you a lifetime to get the knowledge, honestly, that like this guy— because we're talking, there's like health, it's a never-ending thing, right? Like there's always new stuff coming out. There's peptides, there's, there's all this new stuff coming out now for our, for our health. And he is just like so on the cutting edge of it all that like, you know, if I were to try to prescribe myself, right? Yes. Could I probably save some money? Whatever he's charging me, right? But like the time it would take me would be outrageous. Like I'd probably have to, I'd have to shut everything down, you know. There's no way, it's so complex, dude, you know.

Totally, yeah. So yeah, it's the energy management as well. I'll share this, this quick experience with you as well because there's the other side of like health in particular. So a buddy of mine, Steven Posner, he went to a doctor and he had like super high what was it called? Cholesterol. And the person said, yeah, yeah. The person, the doctor said, oh, you gotta like, you gotta take these pills, you know? And they do like all of those things. And like, you are this age, you're like 50, like forget about it. And like, this is like, this is the only thing you can do. And then the guy is like, what if I change my diet? Like, is it going to help? He's like, no dude, it's not going to, you know, help you enough. Like with this thing, with your results, it's not going to work. So the guy says, okay, I'm going to take whatever pills, but let me just do my diet for 4 months. So the guy does the diet, completely crashes his blood test results, and he is like, fires the doctor, and he's like, okay, that's, you know, that's not somebody I have to listen to. And for me, I had a similar experience. Like I went to one doctor, he's like, yeah, everything is, you know, everything is cool with you. And then I went to another one and then it was a completely different result. So in this world where, we have not very little information, but we need to navigate in too much information. That's where the complexity becomes evident, right?

100%. And I would always say too, on the health side, the natural ways, like, look at them, because the doctor, probably the doctor that that guy had, is the type of doctor that like you go in and you're like, hey, I have anxiety or depression, and they just prescribe you like a medication. When in reality, I mean, I I can just tell you this from personal experience, like if you're a guy and like your testosterone is low, you will not be as happy as if it were to be high. So, and that's a natural producing hormone in your body. So there's a way, there's ways to have, you know, with a doctor produce that more in a safe way. I'm not saying like go crazy, but like in a safe way. And also just like your blood panel with vitamins and stuff, you know, like if you get IV and doesn't have to be IVs, but I have 2 IVs per week and they have all my essential vitamins, vitamin B, like all that stuff. It's just like, look at that first. And that's a hell— rather than numb the pain, that actually fixes it, you know. And it's like these chemicals and, you know, it's way out of my league to try to describe it. But it's— I just feel like a lot of times doctors, like you're saying, they're just like, no, like the diet won't work, this won't work, just take this pill and it'll numb your brain so you won't be depressed anymore. And it's like, well, what happens when I stop taking the pill, you know? Like, uh, so—

and that's actually like a perfect segue into just a mindset about just living and making decisions about your lifestyle, about life. So I have this book I'm working on, it's called Lifestyle Engineering. And this is not like a perfect way to plug in my book or philosophy even, but like the idea of— the idea of doing things the conventional way. We go to the doctor and they tell us that thing that they read in the book that everybody practices It's kind of like plug-and-play solution. And I feel like, I feel like a lot of us in life, we try to, we try to go through that narrative that the society has created. Okay, go to college, get a job, learn from some dude, and then maybe you'll start your own business. Maybe you will do whatever else. And the truth is, like, every single person who has done transformational things for the world, they never ever ever followed the conventional path. They always did something differently. They always thought for themselves. And I think the key is to really unconstrain yourself, unchain yourself from the way the society works, that kind of mechanism and that old school way of just doing things because this is how the world does things, and start Start breaking patterns. Man, I gotta tell you this, all right? So I've been trying to break my own patterns and start thinking in new innovative ways. And that means that, okay, I need to stay away from comfort and I need to train my brain that, dude, you can do things in completely new ways. And it changes not just one instance, and I'll be very specific, it doesn't change just one instance of how I think, it changes the way I think in general, globally. So one thing I did recently, It was about 3 weeks ago. So I went to do an obstacle race. It was an obstacle race. It's here. I'm right now in Eastern Europe. It's cold. It's freezing, snow outside. And then I thought, you know what? I'm going to do this race in my shorts, just in my shorts. And it's an obstacle race where you need to, like, carry bags of sand that are like 30 kilos. You need to, so what I did, I needed to, crawl under the barbed wire through the snow. Again, I'm just in my shorts, you know, falling, you know, I have like my, my legs are covered with blood. And this was like one of those things where like, and nobody was doing it. I thought, I thought, okay, first of all, if everybody was, was doing it in shorts as well, would that make a difference? Like in terms of like, I'll probably do it the same way as somebody else. but I just wanted to do, first of all, I wanted to do something challenging physically, but also I wanted to try something unconventional. And when the other people were standing there, there are obstacles and sometimes people pile up waiting to go through one obstacle that is really difficult. There were people just like, "Fuck, man, it's so cold," and whatever. And I'm standing there in my shorts, not feeling cold, you know, and I'm just like, I'm just kind of in my own zone and I'm feeling like, yo, this is an expectation in a way like, oh, it's supposed to be cold. And then if I believe in that, in the fact that it's cold, it's going to be cold and I'm going to be freezing or whatever. And then a lot of the things are just not true. Like the things that my mom tells me or my grandma tells me, it's like, not. I do not tell them what the type of crazy shit I do because they would get a heart attack or something. Maybe sometimes I tell them after the fact.

Don't send them this podcast.

Yeah, but yeah, that's the basic idea. It's just like a small example of doing something, something challenging, something unique. And then if you start doing those like little actions in a way that nobody thinks about, for example, all right, another example, you ready?

Yeah, yeah.

So today is the 8th of March, and obviously you invited me for that occasion. So for those who do not know what 8th of March is, it's the International Women's Day. Did you know that?

All right, I did.

I actually—

you know, that is why I invited you for today.

Yeah, I'm a special guest. I'm a special guest. That's awesome. Oh yeah, so for example, like, and here what people do— and I was born in Russia— and what people do in like the post-Soviet countries they give flowers, they give the same type of flowers, and they just give it to all women, and they say, okay, you know, happy Women's Day, whatever. And for me, I was just like thinking, okay, like first of all, if I go the conventional way, that's going to be lame, and I'm not going to like, this is not going to be me. It's not going to be coming from me. It's going to be coming from, okay, people expect me to do something, so I have to do something. So I thought, okay, what can I do? And so I printed out like a massive, massive poster with the picture of my girlfriend. And I put a sign, we have this insider joke of saying sayings, like the old Russian sayings that do not make any sense, and then plugging it in random scenarios and random situations where they do not make any sense. So I have that picture, I have that saying, and I'm just going to send her a poster. And I actually want to put a billboard right in front of her where her mother works with her daughter like stretched out. I'm working on getting that done.

That's awesome.

Hopefully that happens before this podcast comes out so I can do a little surprise.

Dude, that is so cool. Like those are the things too. It's weird. It's like what you just said there where when something is like every year or every quarter, every month, like it becomes a normalized thing. It can be like you don't go all out for it, right? Because it's just like, it's what you should do. So instead, you'll be like, okay, for the women in my life, I don't know, I'll get them all some chocolate. And like, you know, it's National Women's Day, March 8th again. And yes, but like when you go outside the box, like what you're saying, like that just makes it so much more profound. Like, dude, if you do that, that's sick.

I'll tell you this, I'll tell you this, like right now, and that's the interesting thing, like before I would notice things that are different. Right now I notice things that they're the same, right? If I have to do something like everybody else, then that lights a bulb. It's like, why the fuck am I doing it, right? So kind of like trains your mind to notice patterns that you involve yourself into all the time. And you try to unconstrain yourself from, from kind of like those, uh, yeah, those things that just exist in our lives.

Just, um, because I'm curious, because I just thought of it now, in that race it seems like it was kind of like an Ironman. What, like, were you— how did you perform in comparison to others? Do you think the shorts, like, were good or bad for you, or like just overall didn't really affect you?

Yeah, so, uh, so it's an obstacle race. Ironman is, um, it's a triathlon, uh, So the key is my goal wasn't really to be the first or to be kind of like in the top. I performed really well. I was in the top whatever, I'm not sure, or whatever it is. But for me, I think here's also an interesting thing. I think a lot of us also subscribe to the arbitrary goals. It's like, okay, if you race, you need to be the top 3, you need to get a medal. right? If you, if you, I know it's like if you do a contest, you need to be, you know, whatever, whatever it is. So in my case, I just, I, I, I just wanted to, uh, to have fun. And, uh, and my, my thought was I want to experience something I haven't experienced before. I want to experience challenge. And when it was challenging, I was like, this is perfect. This is exactly what I was looking for. And I didn't, I didn't care about finishing it fast. Or going at it. It's like, it's this flow state where I didn't sign up for the finish line. I just signed up for, for like carrying that fucking bag that's heavy and suffering through it. This is actually exactly what I paid for. Yeah. And that was perfect. That was perfect. That's, you know, that's that enjoying the moment.

It seems like, like your mindset, at least currently, is kind of like that Mark Twain quote where it's, um, um, like if you notice the masses going in one direction, it's time to pause and reflect. And then maybe go the other, you know what I mean? So it's like, okay, I'm going to this event and everyone's going to be all bundled up, and he's like, so I'm going to just throw on shorts and like see what happens, you know?

Yeah, no, absolutely, man. This is, this is exactly it. And sometimes the majority is correct, is right, and many times it is, other times it's not. I, I think the key is to think for yourself. And I'll tell you an interesting thing. So I know a lot of people who who try to go on, what's the new app that's popular? Like Clubhouse. They try to go there. Yeah, yeah. They go there and they try to say, okay, that's going to be an outlet for me to gain an audience. You know, they try to get that edge. And a lot of them like try to follow that kind of conventional thing, but still that follows that conventional path. They just see what the trendsetters are, and then they try to go after it. For me, I'll tell you this, During that race that I did in my shorts in the snow, I got so much publicity, dude. I got so much publicity. I'm not sure if it ended up being like being at many places, but every single person, people were filming me. There were people with cameras around me and people were screaming, "Okay, let's go." It's like that guy, the people knew me by name. I got this I no longer have Instagram, but people were like, you know, tagging this guy. And then after, when I finished the race, different people from completely different kind of circles and communities that I have, they started messaging me. It's like, Renat, what the hell is that? Like, why am I seeing you at this guy's Instagram story or something like that? So it's just like a small example of like doing things unconventionally and like it gets noticed because it's unique, it's different. And I think that differentiation goes a long way.

Oh yeah, no, I agree. So, let's, because for people that don't know, actually let me remember because I know I've been on your podcast. This is your first time on this show in this long form at least, isn't it?

We did a short episode in 2018 when I talked about marketing.

Yeah, a little one. I remember. Yeah, yeah. So, this is just what, so, Let's, um, let's go back to young, um, Renat, because I, uh, just so people can get to know you because you're going to be coming on, uh, more, more often than not. So like when you were young, like where did you grow up? Like tell us kind of the, the childhood story a little bit so people have a background.

Totally. Um, and I definitely want to, uh, dive, dive into what's, what's happening in your life and the epic stuff you're doing. But here are some Cliff Notes. Was born in Russia in a family of pretty nomadic people or slow-matic people. So my parents, they were born into relatively poor families. The Soviet Union families are pretty much all poor families, so it's not very unique. I guess middle-class families for back then. And they were born into smaller towns. And then if you're not familiar with the Soviet Union times, you could not leave the country. You could not travel anywhere. The information you have access to is whatever on TV, and it's all filtered. There's very little information, very little access to the outside world. So the Soviet Union collapses, and my parents realize that, "Oh, you can go and visit many places." And that was that first thing that really hooked them. They were curious. To see what's out there, the cultures, how people live. And they first went to, I know, Poland, then they went, uh, farther, and then they went to Asia, and they took me as a kid and my sister to all of the different places. So as a kid, I was exposed to lots of cultures, to lots of different ways of doing the same thing. When I was around 10 or 11 years old, I went to Kenya. So, that was one of the most memorable trips. Have you been to Africa?

I've been to Africa, not Kenya though. I went to Marrakech, Atlas Mountains, like North Africa.

All right.

It was definitely a culture shock. I'll say that. Like, it was different. You ride the camels? Oh yeah, dude. You know, I did. Yeah, this was with like a college kind of trip. So, we did like a couple nights in Sahara Desert, bonfires, rode the camels, did that whole thing. It was beautiful. It was really cool. And really, for me, what it kind of did at that point in my life, I think I was 20 when I was, or maybe 19, 18, somewhere in there. And like, it just made me realize that I was happy in those moments and I didn't, in those moments, like, money, I don't know, out in the Sahara Desert, money doesn't really mean anything, you know, like, like, what does that mean? Like, because you're, there's nobody, you can't use that money for really anything. It's either you already have it there or you don't. And if you don't, you should, you know, find somebody who does real quick because, so either way, it was just like, it was like very present, at peace, and it just, um, kind of like a reflector on like my own little town an hour north of Philadelphia is not the only way the world operates. And that was like the polar, it kind of just was, it was big. It was kind of maybe, I guess, how it was for you in Kenya.

So, did it shape you in any way? Did you start kind of like noticing new things?

I, yes. So, this is a bigger conversation actually because it's like, I think that most people really don't ever leave, like, and I can speak to kind of in my hometown, like, A lot of the people in my hometown, they go to a similar college. It's like Temple University or Penn State, and that's still in Pennsylvania. And then, they'll get a job and then, they'll move back to the small town and they don't really ever experience these other ways. And that to me, it kind of all compounded. So, I traveled, then I come back and I read The 4-Hour Workweek, and then, I drop out of school. And then now I'm like on this completely different path. And I think the traveling really helped me open my mind. Maybe it actually was the catalyst to even being open to reading The 4-Hour Workweek. You know what I mean? It's like I slowly was like breaking open and considering other possibilities besides stay in my small town, go to college, get a job, get a mortgage on a house, raise a family, and then, you know, just live in small town Pennsylvania. Like, that's what people where I'm from, that's what they do.

That's right. And I think the statistic is that, uh, that majority of Americans, they live within the 40-mile range from— Oh, really? Yeah, yeah.

That's the statistic.

Their families.

What's the percentage? I didn't know that.

Uh, I, I think it's the average distance from the hometown.

Okay. Got it.

It's definitely under 100 miles. It's very little. And I've reflected a lot on why that is the case. And I've come up with just two things. One is the way we think, kind of like the ways of thinking in general. Like one thing is that we may read something, but we'd not really prescribe it to ourselves. Like, okay, like, but yeah, that person can do it, but not me. That sentence or idea has absolutely no basis. It's like, you're no different than anybody from that perspective. It's like, what is the limitation? Once you uncover the limitation, there's probably none, and then you're not different. So then in reality, It's more of one thing, and that one thing is fear. It's fear of the unknown. It's fear of change, which is fear of the unknown as well. I know, I think that's that fear. And fear is also a habit. It's something that when we fear, what do we do? When I fear, I eat. When I fear, I do not approach that woman. If I fear, I do not talk to my boss about the raise. I do not apply for that I'd not try myself in arts. I'd not do whatever. You just fill in the blank, right? So, and noticing that the source of inaction is the key. And for me, I have this word tattooed on my hand, and that's another one. Yes, here we go. It's a different one. I have two tattoos to reveal you, two different stories. So the word I have on my hand, It says courage. So there's a difference between a brave man and a courageous man. Do you happen to know the difference?

No, no, tell us. No.

So a brave man is the person who does not feel fear and who acts. He's like a fearless person who acts in front of an obstacle. But the courageous man is the person who acts in spite of the fear, meaning that we all experience fear, and I experience it, and I experience it quite a lot. But for me, I want to live a courageous life where I notice whenever I feel fear, I go and I confront it, I show up, and I do not shy away from it. And that's, that's the pattern that a lot of us have as humans. I have, everybody has it. But once we train our brain to see something that we're afraid of, to see that woman and say, fuck, I'm afraid, and just go after it and just go say hi and get embarrassed. And then your body and your brain starts realizing, oh, that's not that bad. That's not that dangerous. Nobody's going to stab me to death. Nobody's going to do anything, right?

No. Yeah, no. So let me ask you this. How do you— how did— if you were to provide that like a, um, maybe a step-by-step, like how would you help somebody with that? And then as an additional kind of part to that question is like, I, I agree with you, as I feel like it is kind of a habit, right? So it's like getting out of that habit of, you know, whenever something is, is, is like too overwhelming for you, whether it's unknown, whether it's the fear of failure, whatever the fear is, most people, like you're saying, they do kind of retreat. Like, they step back and then they just don't do anything about it. Whereas, like, the opposite is kind of like what you're saying, where, you know, like, I've told you this, I think, in other times that we've talked. Like, I've reached out to pretty much anybody you can think of for, like, a podcast. Like, Tony Robbins, like, people that on their Instagram DMs, like, I don't care who you are, like, I'll just be like, I think you're interesting. I want to have you on the show. And, you know, sometimes they respond, sometimes they don't. But I guess, how did you start to notice that about yourself prior? And then, what did you do to kind of slowly fix it? Or was it very abrupt and you were just like, screw it, I'm not living in fear anymore. I'm just doing it. You know what I mean?

Yeah. Yeah. It's a phenomenal question. For me, the way it happened, and I've been telling you that for me, I think the key is to be authentic, to be yourself, to do what's right for you, and just to forget about like the gurus telling you to do whatever. For me, it's been honestly just doing it. I don't think there should be an answer. I'll tell you this, I've read hundreds of books on personal development. There's not much new stuff that I do not already know that I haven't read in a certain format. And I think the key is the latter that you said, just to fucking make a decision, go at it, turn off your brain, not turn it on, not start overanalyzing, not start reflecting, do strategies, reading the best way to reach out to some person on Instagram, not overthinking, just to fucking do it without thinking. The more you think, the less likely it is to happen. All right? And yeah, that's my case. If anybody's listening to this podcast right now, and they're thinking, okay, like, oh, Renat is going to tell me something interesting, or they're going to tell me like to read the book, or, you know, to do whatever. No. It's like, yeah, just like fuck off and just go do something right now. No, seriously, go do something. No, this is a very big point, because a lot of people right now, their information is available, A lot of people, they get into this personal development cult, but it's complete bullshit because they're delegating their decisions onto somebody else. It's the guru that has to tell them how to live life. It's somebody else that has to tell them the perfect advice. It's like, yo, just do your own life. Take your own decisions. Just make your own mistakes. And I think Yeah, just, just fucking do it.

Yeah, I agree. No, no, you're so right. And that's— I'm glad I asked the question because I, I ultimately agree with you. And the thing to realize too is like afterward, it feels so much better after you do it, whether— and well, I'll just use like a girl as an example because it's just an easy kind of yes or no example of like, if imagine you pass that girl and, and you find her very attractive or something draws you to her and you don't say anything and you just keep walking, that at least from my experience, that kind of sticks. That'll like stick with me for like a day or two. Like I'll actually be like thinking about it and it like, it like stays. Whereas if I go up to her and she denies me, at least it's like the loop is over. Like I know it's like, I know, you know, I could, I guess, you know, if I see her again in a week, I could be like, yo, what about now or something? But like, but like You know, it doesn't mean you give up necessarily right away, but it's like you— at least the loop is closed. And I feel like that, like the habit thing, if you— if that happens to you all day, like imagine there's like 50 things that you want to do in a day and all of them you don't do because of fear. Like imagine that energetic, like, like buildup in your body. I would imagine it becomes like heavy, you know, like life probably would become heavy.

And the hard thing becomes the easy thing, right? Because following the path of least resistance, not talking to the girl right now, guess what? Your brain is going to go after you and is going to be kicking you and saying, Tyler, you should have talked to that girl, right? And it's a lot easier to take, you know, to rip the Band-Aid, to talk to the girl.

Yeah, it is, dude. Especially in South Beach too. I mean, Come on, man. There's plenty out here. So, if one says no, just, you know, talk to another one. That's the way it works. So, next thing, let's talk a little bit about the, so, we covered kind of your upbringing. Well, wait, actually, Kenya, tell us a little bit more about that though. Like, what was so, what about Kenya was so profound for you?

I think because I, as a child, I was exposed to a lot of countries. I was going to every country I remember, we were traveling with my parents in Scotland, somewhere super beautiful, or New Zealand, and everything was kind of the same. And I was in the backseat, like driving in that car, I'm just like, fuck, man, another road trip. And I wasn't like really realizing how cool it was that I was to do that. But in Kenya, it was different. So in Kenya, it was in a way, I wouldn't say, a culture shock because I was no longer shocked by this unique environment. But what I like seeing is I like seeing how people live in those huts made out of poop, you know, just living a completely different life. So Maasai, in order for them, in order for a boy to become a man, that person is given a spear and they, they have to come back with the tooth of a lion. That's— so think about like, uh, the, uh, the graduation in the Western world of like a man, oh, of a boy to kind of to, to manhood. Like they go join a fraternity and get fucked up.

Yeah, I was like, I don't even know what it is. There's not even like a real, like, a thing. I don't, you know, like there's—

But there is no such an experience, right? I've been reflecting on that. And I think that's actually unfortunate. That is unfortunate that we'd not get to really transition from that state of, hey, my dad or my community takes care of me, to the, hey, I'm going to be responsible for my own life. For my own decisions, for, I know, my significant other, for my children, for whoever it is. It— we no longer have rituals around it, right? We need to figure it out ourselves. And especially, I think it's painful among men because they, they're never taught how to, how to be men. So that's, that's definitely one of the areas that needs to be advanced.

I agree. And I wonder Well, I don't want— I think it's probably one of the reasons like Jordan Peterson, we've talked about him before, has like broken through. So because that's kind of what he talks about, like responsibility in a sense. And I agree with you, like it would be really good if there was an actual like act or something that like graduated you from like, you know, I need people to to be responsible for me, to now I am now going to be an active, responsible individual in society. Because the way it currently is, at least in the Western world, it kind of actually feels gray and it kind of feels like overly extended. Because if you follow the actual path, what it is, is, you know, you go to high school, you graduate, you go to college. And now in college, it's normally more than 4 years. So it's like 5 years to like 8 or something. And then, when you get out of college, you work for somebody but you're in a lower position, right? So, you're still like not really, like you're an intern. And it's almost like, in reality, if I were to put a number on it, I feel like 30 is like when people actually in the U.S. really become like an adult because they've gone through the whole ringer. I don't know. It just feels extended even though that technically at 18, you're an adult.

But yeah, whatever the definition of an adult is, and I feel like many people never become responsible entirely for their own lives. Like, if they follow the same narrative of the— this what society ascribed to them, I'm not sure if that counts as being an independent thinker. Like, I— to me, an adult is somebody who, who plans strategically for himself for the people he cares about or she cares about and goes after those goals, those desires, like proactively as a free thinker.

Yeah.

So, and I'm not sure if majority of the world are adults, although they do adult things.

I like that. You're right. So that's kind of even more so to the point of it's like, it shouldn't even be an age thing. It's like until you come back with that tooth, like you're not it, you know?

Exactly. So the point is, uh, the point is that, um, the, the narrative I've heard in 2020, uh, like social justice, you know, so we're going to filter what, what, what you can say, what you cannot say, what you can do, what it's not acceptable to do. It's like, like so many limitations, and it all goes towards the very soft side, making everybody feel comfortable and honestly like shying away from that hardship, from the challenge, from the fears. And the intentions might be good, but at the end of the day, for me, when I do difficult things, when I do an obstacle race, I'm going to— I just signed up today for a marathon in 2 weeks. Oh nice. Yeah, I like doing stupid shit like this. It's like 2 weeks. I think it's going to be difficult enough. Yeah. So, so yeah, like for me, I see my life easy, easy where, okay, you know, I have, I have the money to do whatever, you know, I can do whatever, whatever I want. I don't have to work if I don't want to. I can go surfing, I can fly to this country, I can talk to this person, I can, you know, I can hang out with, with this woman, whatever it is. And I've tried, I've tried doing those things like perpetually for a few months. And life then, and life when I go and do difficult stuff is way more fulfilling and I feel way happier. And I think there's this misconception that like hard things, we should make our lives comfortable or we should make our lives easier. I think it's actually the opposite. It is about what challenges you choose. Of course, you do not want to do stupid, have stupid problems like, you know, financial problems or like mortgage problems, whatever problems that are not pleasant to have. But what if we could like choose the hardships that we want to exist in and embrace them and say, hey, yeah, that's what I signed up for.

Dude, and the thing to think about with that is, and I know we're in some of the same circles, like, and down here in Miami, like I know some people, you know, with the type of money that it's just like, You know, you don't even have to think anymore. It's ridiculous. And like, but the thing is, they're still doing the stuff that we're doing, you know? Like, that's what I've come to realize is like, people, you know, you hit this level of success like you're talking about, and it's different for everybody, but like, a freedom. And then what, for me, it's very similar to what you're saying. Like, it's come back to the point where I can do whatever I want, like, whenever I want. And honestly, what I enjoy most is having like these deep conversations And I actually enjoy working because there's obstacles to get through with it. And it's almost like, I don't know, like, like you're saying, the difficult things are fun. So, it's not like, it's not like you make it and then everything is easy like that. And I feel like people have that misconception or perception of like, okay, I need to make all this money and then I'm just gonna lay back and life will be easy.

It's like, dude, never happens.

Yeah, like, try laying back for a week and like enjoying the easy life. Like, honestly, you will, I feel like this is what happens to me. My brain will start to just create issues.

Like, yeah, that's exactly it. Yeah, our brain is the, the problem creation machine. It's like, do you, do you want to be kind of on the passive side of like just problems happen to you, or do you want to create your problems?

Yeah, dude. Yeah, that's really sick because when you said the 2-week thing, this— I feel like we're kind of on to something here with like You know, it's almost like holding yourself accountable. So, it's like, if you want to have good habits and a good daily routine, like, abruptly just sign up for a freaking marathon in like 2 weeks is pretty wild. I'll say like 30 days for the normal person, but like 30 days, you know, but like, if you actually take your life half seriously, then if you sign up for a marathon, like, I'm sure these next 2 weeks, like, you're training somewhat or like, like, trying to stay healthy because you don't want to like walk into that like—

No, no, I'm approaching it very professionally. I'm, I'm training like I'm going to be training every day. Um, so this is, this is the thing where, uh, where there is an expectation. It's like, okay, if I do a marathon and the average person, if you actually look at, uh, guides on how to train for a marathon, um, it's usually going to be like 3 months minimum, 3 months minimum, minimum, minimum, and then it's like 6 months or something. Like this, and then like, uh, the, the whole experience becomes, becomes too extensive. You make an event out of it, you tell all your friends. It's like, okay, I'm running a marathon, it's in 6 months, I'm going to get ready for it. Uh, but to be, to be very frank, uh, that, that's just a low bar. It's just whatever, okay, the average person does it in 6 months, they do whatever. Uh, the truth is a lot of people, they, they actually would ask me, okay, how are you? Okay, you're doing, uh, you're doing a marathon in 2 weeks? Like, how are you going to do it? You're crazy. It's like, okay, why is it crazy? It's like, well, it's usually much longer that, you know, that takes to prepare. It's like, why? What? But why is it crazy? Like, why isn't the same thing? Uh, and then you want— when you actually look into whatever challenge you have in front of you, marathon takes 6 hours to, to complete. This is like the cutoff point, right? So, uh, if you, if you run with like an okay speed, there's some marathons that are like 8 hours, that take 8 hours to complete. Like, you can You can like half run it and like half walk it, a marathon. You can do it. It's like you can, you can totally do it. If you want to complete the marathon, you don't need to like tell your friends, tell everybody, you know, make an event, a big deal out of it. And if you, if you run 10 kilometers, if you can go right now, run 10 kilometers, you can do a marathon. It's just like if we, if we stop, uh, ascribing this kind of like difficulty level, you know, to things, and importance level to things as well. I, I also think that a lot of like, a lot of, a lot of A lot of goals that we have, we think they're too important. And if they're too important, they need to take too much effort. And if they take too much effort, then they're kind of too difficult, we'd not have time and attention for them, which is not true. If you think your goals are easy, and if you think about, okay, what's the easiest way to do it? How can I half do it so that I still complete the challenge? It becomes so, so, so much simpler. Just to look at any problem.

Yeah. It's interesting because it's almost like if you can remove all titles from everything, then you can actually be the true creator of your own life. Because even me, like, that's kind of what I just did there. I'll call myself out on it. It's like, because when I think of a marathon, even though, as you know, like, I run every morning, but it's like 5 to 6 miles, like, It's not a marathon. So, I've just always thought, because isn't a marathon 26 miles or something? I think it's 26.

Yeah, exactly. Yeah.

So, like—

42 kilometers.

Yeah. I mean, and you have all day to do it. It's only 20 more miles than what I do. Not only, it's still, you know, it's more. But when you're— what you're saying there is like, at the end of the day, you could walk, you could half run, like, you know, if you just want to finish it, you could do it in like 6 to 8 hours. Right, but the word marathon is like, there's an association with it of like, this must be difficult. Like, this is really hard. Only wild, crazy running people.

Exactly.

Do marathons.

And that's the reaction you get when you tell other people. It's the status of an event. That's the medal. That's the everything that comes with, you know, that big thing that a lot of people want. Like, if you If you really stop ascribing like those, you know, all of those traits, all of those, what is it called, adjectives to whatever activity, it's just an activity, just go fucking do it. And which brings me to my next tattoo, the actual, so we're talking about me revealing a tattoo on this podcast.

Yeah, I'll reveal mine after this.

All right, okay, big deal. Let's do you first.

No, no, I actually— it's on my butt, so I actually can't.

For reals?

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I didn't— I have a tattoo that I got actually in Poland. I got in Poland, um, and it's a tattoo of a smiley face and it says "Create happiness, love life" on my right butt cheek. But yeah, I don't want YouTube to take this down, so I can't.

No, I know, it's great. Create happiness.

Yeah, but it's there. And I was 20. I had a few Polish beers. I'm not gonna lie. I knew I wanted to get it. It does. I will say though, just so people don't think it was just like the alcohol, like I knew I wanted it before I drank, but I drank the beers to allow myself to just go get it, you know? So that's really what it was. It's like, I was like, I know I'm doing this, but if I have these— and Polish beers, I don't know if you know, like they're oddly strong. I think they were like 11%, so it was like kind of drinking like 9 beers. Yeah, yeah, I stumbled in there and, um, very hot Russian lady, and, um, she put a needle in my, uh, in my butchie. It's great.

Oh, okay, okay, okay. I was getting a little confused. I was like, were you drinking the beers with the Russian lady?

No, no, dude.

Yeah, that was the tattoo master.

Yeah, yeah, she was, she was great. I still have like, I can see it, but I don't remember the spoken words that occurred, but yeah, it's a good memory.

It was all love language, yeah? Lots of courage, right? Yeah, pretty cool, man. Like, for me, this tattoo, first of all, I didn't think I would be the person who would get tattoos. I thought, okay, it's, you know, me tattoo? It was just like not a thing. I thought I was Like in Russia, just culturally, you know, people with tattoos, they usually come from kind of less successful families. They usually have, actually, so back in the Soviet Union, that's probably where it comes from. People who had tattoos, they're the ones who went to jail. And probably culturally, because like you do not have, tattoo salons in the Soviet Union. So you couldn't get tattoos all that easily, right? So that's probably where it culturally came from, and probably that's where it rubbed off of me as well. So I had to like sit with the idea of the tattoo, but what my tattoo says, it says choice. And this word really, really, really resonated with me when I was doing a marathon 4 months ago in in Istanbul. So I signed up for a marathon. It was 3 weeks before, 3 weeks before it would start. Yeah, there's the theme, you know. So like this one in 2 weeks, it's like already, already I want to like wake up and say, okay, you know what, fuck it, let's go.

Signed up today.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Or just, just go, just go for distance. But for me, Uh, for me, what was— I actually like trained a little bit for, for that other marathon. And, um, I told a bunch of, a bunch of my friends in a similar way. And I started, started the race. I was running late. I was a little stressed out. I start running. It's a little heavy, but I know sometimes I can kind of like, um, get into, into it. 5 kilometers in, I'm feeling exhausted. Like I do not feel I can keep going. I have stomachache and For those who ran and who's run with a stomachache, it's not pleasant at all. Yeah. It sucks. So I have like the cramps, like my legs do not move. I feel tired. Like I literally cannot move. And here's the best part. People pass, people pass, one after another, after another. And that inner voice with that every person that passes, It's like, not, what are you doing? It's like, come on. You, you said you would do it right now. You're, uh, you are 5 kilometers in, you know, you, you're nowhere close. It's not going to happen. It's like, um, and then, and then that turns on that, like all of the things start bubbling up that identity. Of like, you said you're this, and then in reality you're that, right? So, uh, so actually the reason I signed up for this marathon is to make it difficult. Like, I want to feel certain, certain pain that makes me more at ease, uh, through, through life. And then I ran before, like I ran the week before, actually in 2 weeks in training. I was doing a 35-kilometer run to prepare for the marathon, which is 42, and then I thought, you know what, I'm feeling amazing, I'm gonna run the whole thing. So I ran the whole thing in training, and then I didn't realize that when the actual marathon came in, I probably depleted a lot of my reserves. So I was beaten up, I was beaten up, and then that voice started saying, oh, well, you kind of ran the distance, you kind of accomplished it. And it's like, and then the other voice is like, told me, told me, not really, this is just a lame excuse. And you signed up for a marathon, not for the distance, so you have to complete it. So, so what I did, I kid you not, I wanted to, I wanted to go to a corner, give up and cry like a little girl and feel pity for myself. I kid you not, real, real thought. A real thought, I was like, I was really beating myself up. And then at one moment, and that comes full circle coming back to the tattoo, I thought, you know what, okay, I'm going to run for 2 more kilometers and I'm going to stop thinking, you know, this stuff. I download David Goggins, Can't Hurt Me. You read the book, right?

Oh yeah.

I downloaded this book by a Navy SEAL who does this crazy, crazy 200-milers through the Death Valley Desert, you know, does crazy shit. And I started listening kind of like to his story, distracting myself. And then it was still difficult and I thought, okay, if I was to do it, if I was to give up, I want to give up at my limit. So I'm just going to, run until 10K. So 10K passed, and I ran until 21K, and then I was slowly starting getting in motion, uh, and I thought— I literally thought I would give up like 5, 6 kilometers in. So, so at around, at around like 25 kilometers, like, I realized that if I keep telling myself that disempowering narrative about like how I feel and how what I feel should dictate what I'm going to do. Like the story I tell myself based on kind of like the facts, like such as pain, you know, yes, I feel pain right now. Yes, you know, it's not pleasant. Yes, like a lot of those things, but that narrative changes everything. And if I tell myself that empowering story and then the story I told myself like maybe, maybe actually around, around like 10, 15 kilometers in, or oh no, it was, yeah, it was around 20 kilometers. That was less than half of the race. I told myself that I will not be that little girl who is going to cry around, you know, about the pain, about the things I cannot do, that's going to give up, that's going to, that's going to complain, that's going to see the world from the scarcity perspective. And I told myself there that I'd rather die. I literally like that moment, I was like, I'd rather die than not complete this fucking marathon. I'm fucking doing it. I swear I was like motivated as hell. It was painful. And that was exactly what I signed up for. I signed up for that specific moment. And when I did the marathon distance and training, I was like, oh, that was easy. I could do 50. You know, and I got what I wanted to, to get. So then my heart rate at some point, um, I think— so I have, I have this Apple Watch that has a heart rate monitor. It went to 198 BPM. Uh, dude, that, that, that's very high. That's— this is like unhealthy high. Yeah, I was, uh, Yeah, my vision was getting dark, you know, closer kind of like to the end, you know, where I thought, okay, I'll pass out. But dude, that moment, that moment, I'm just like, I'm fucking running this thing because if I keep running away from like from all of the obstacles, all the little things that life throws at me, you know, I'm just going to be a miserable little girl who's going to cry about the circumstances. So, um, and I, I finished the race and the last kilometer I saw a guy who was speeding up and we raced. We, the last kilometer, we raced as fast as we could through the finish line. And I felt like I could actually do another 10K on top of that.

Oh yeah.

That's great. So that was my experience, and that word choice to me stands for the decision for like the narrative that we create around the world around us, and it is literally a decision. They're just facts, there's reality, and the way we interpret the world, the story that we tell ourselves, that, that changes everything.

Yeah, dude, I love that. Courage and choice. And I, um, I think that's another thing, like fear with a habit of like just, just finishing things. Like, I feel like a lot of people, they, they don't finish things. And, and maybe I feel that way because I'm in the book world. And so when you said that, it like correlated with me there, as I was like, what I tell people all the time when they ask me about books is I'm writing a book, I'm like, first off, just finish the rough draft. Like, stop trying to perfect it. Stop trying to like make everything so perfect. Just get the rough draft done and then work from there. And it's kind of like the same thing with running a marathon where it's like, dude, maybe you're going to have a stomachache. David Goggins literally was having like, if you remember that part in the book, I think he was having like kidney failure. And I'm not saying you should run with kidney failure. Like, that's insane. But like, he literally, if I remember correctly, at the end of the book, one of his like races that he did. He was having legitimate kidney failure and he still finished it, I think. And then they took him like, and then he like fell over. They took him to the hospital and then they thought he might die or something. And then somehow they fixed them all up. But the point is you didn't go in to like win the race, but rather winning to you was finishing, completing the actual the actual activity and not quitting even just because your stomach hurts.

Exactly. And I had my motivation as well behind like why I wanted to join something. Like, for me, literally the reason I wanted to do a marathon is because I wanted to do something difficult, and I got it. And when, and when I was experiencing it, experiencing the hardship, you know, I wanted to, I wanted to think, okay, it sucks, and maybe I shouldn't do it. But at the end of the day, like, you, you kind of realize, okay, I actually signed up for that precise reason. If it was easy, nobody would be running marathons, right? So when you get your motivation clear behind, uh, behind whatever action, uh, that, that we're taking, that, that just makes it very different.

100%. So I wanna, I wanna go back to— and it's just because I'm curious, just as a friend, so I want to ask this first, and then we can talk maybe some marketing, some business stuff too. But for, because I did not know you had a sister, so my question to you is like, who's your sister? What does she do? Is she similar to you? And then, also like, just a family in general question, like, are you still close with your family? Like, what's that whole situation like?

Totally, man. I appreciate you asking those like personal questions and seeing, you know, like where, which path my sister has taken and my family. So I believe that I'm pretty, pretty different from the rest of my family in the way that, um, in the way that I try to— I try to do things that are unconventional, that might seem a little crazy on the surface. And I think, I think actually my family members are Similar in that regard. I just not only think in those ways, I'm more like act in those ways as well. And my parents, like my dad is such a hustler. He thinks about creative ways to do everything, every single thing. For example, I'll teach you, I'll tell you how I used what he kind of like the software that he installed in me. So about 2 weeks ago, about 2 weeks ago, I was to go with my girlfriend to an arts museum. So there is, we show up there and there's a massive line stretching around the block, like super long. So I come to the front and I asked the guys, okay, hey guys, like, where are you standing? You know, what are you waiting for? And they're just like, okay, we're going up to the museum, blah, blah, blah. And I said, how long have you been waiting in line for? And they're like, like an hour and a half or whatever. And it's like, definitely not doing it, definitely not doing it with my girlfriend. Um, so I try— I said, hey guys, like, can we, can we like, uh, come, come with you or whatever? That, that didn't work. And then I was like standing there and I— and then I see, um, I see this, this like little, little sign says, uh, it says like whatever café, and it's a rooftop café at the top of that building. So I just called them up. I'm just like, yo, do you guys have, uh, do you guys, uh, are you open? Uh, they're like, yeah, how do I get in? It's like, oh, you just kind of go, go right there through the same door. You say to you're going to the cafe. So I was like, okay. So I just go to the front of the line. Uh, there was a massive line again, stretching an hour and a half. And it's just like, I just go up and boom, that was, that was my way. Took 3 minutes. 3 minutes, 3 minutes. And there's always, there's always more than one way to do anything.

Yeah, I agree. I love that, dude. That's sick.

So that's something I learned from like from my dad and from my sister. They're like such hustlers.

Yeah, that's so— okay, so you still have a good relationship with mom and dad, right?

So you still talk to them? Yeah, I have. We still chat, they still chat. They're in Russia at the moment. They travel around the world. Usually they spend usually half the year in Dominican Republic, another 3 months in Slovenia or in Croatia.

They love the spices. Now, when you said nomads, are they retired or do they still work?

I wouldn't say they're nomads. They're more like They have a base that is in Moscow. They have their real estate in Moscow as well. And they just go different places for like 3, 5 months, especially when it's cold. Not these days, but due to the pandemic. But yeah, that's usually something that they do. And my parents have also a pretty interesting story, just in general, like the way they've been building their lifestyle based on what they know. Just, you know, being curious, going different places.

Dude, that's all. I feel like being curious is one of the best assets to like just have because that's like, that's really kind of the main reason I do the podcast. Like, I enjoy it but I think I enjoy it so much because I'm so curious just about other people's lives just like, and not in like a nosy way or anything but in a way of like, I'm literally curious, you know what I mean? Like, I'm just like, how did your parents— like, your parents seem to be able to, you know, obviously besides the pandemic, they have freedom, it seems like, to travel whenever and however they want. So that's like interesting to me. I'm like, that's pretty sick.

Curiosity as a trait is something that we are born with and something that we lose, right? So children They're curious about the dirt. They're curious about the bubbles. You know, they're curious about snow, snowflakes, everything. They just run around. Everything is new. Everything is unique. You know, they ask stupid questions. They do not always have that, like, sense of, like, identity or, like, judging themselves or thinking about, okay, how does the snowflake relate to me? No, it's just the snowflake, right? It's just something. Something there that exists. And then through that cultural conditioning, I feel like we'll lose that curiosity. We no longer run around and ask stupid questions. You know, like the common thing that we can think about is at the meeting, like nobody asked a stupid question, right? Like in the board meetings everywhere else, you know, it's like, this is the most important question. Like the stupid question, like those things, like pursuing our curiosity, like trying out different things, asking like why, why, like why is everything the way it is, right?

Yeah, I love that. Yeah, it's interesting. I feel like you're so right and it's when you— I've always kind of naturally been that way, like not afraid to ask the questions. But also at the same time, like a little bit more nervous of being on a stage by myself and speaking, right? But like, if I'm asking the question or if it's right off the cuff and it's like in the moment, that has never been like nerve-wracking, which is hence, again, here maybe why the podcast is what I like to do.

Yeah, you're so good at it and I really appreciate that you're really leaning into into the thing that you're passionate about, the exploring your curiosity. And so, how do you find, how did you find what you love yourself?

Dude, yeah. So, this is, okay, so I'll explain. So, basically, I started out in college and you might know some of this already, some of these parts, but in college, my major was accounting. And I chose that major just because I had read in an article that it was the highest paid salary out of school. And my dad was an accountant, so kind of all just like, you know, I didn't know what I wanted at that time. So, I was like, all right, this makes sense. He did it, he's done well, he's my dad, we're pretty similar. And I was like, and it's the highest paying thing, so, okay, why not? And then, literally, the first accounting class, I am just like, I can't do it. Like, without, you know, my friends helping me, you know, there's no way. I'm I'm getting by. So either way, not only do I hate it, I'm not good at it. And then that was kind of like a reflection so that I noticed that. Then I travel the world, read The 4-Hour Workweek, and then I start my entrepreneurship journey. And what I'm noticing is like, I go to all these conferences and I'm like, okay, one thing I'm noticing at these events is that I am definitely better than most. And I want to say better, but more so enjoying— maybe it's both— than most at like connecting with all these people. And then I sat back and I would wonder, all these events I'm going to, I'm like, why is that? And then I started to really think about— I'm like, I think it's because I actually like it. Like, I literally like going— like, I actually like that weird kind of feeling when you're at an event and there's like 3 people talking and the circle's kind of closed. And I kind of like stepping in there, you know, and being like, hey, like, and not in like a, in a way of like interrupting, but more in a way of like, I see you three talking, I'm curious to learn about you. And, you know, obviously I speak differently, like I go and say, hey, I'm Tyler, nice to meet you all, or whatever. But I noticed that I liked it and I would leave those conferences with like literally everybody's contact, like, and I made a relationship with all of them. So then I'm like, all right, how? I'm still broke though, right? So I'm like, I'm still broke. So I'm like, okay, how do I actually make money kind of at like making friends? Like that's what I'm good at, but I don't know how to like make money. So I gotta eat. So then I'm like, then I write a book and then it turns out—

Wait, wait, did you move into some friend's place? An entrepreneur house?

Yeah, yeah. I'm skipping some like some details But yes, I was there during— that was actually right after the conferences though. So, it was like right after the conferences, then I write a book about conferences.

I just think it's a very important detail that you didn't mention because I feel like that circle of people who think differently, who'd not think like Germans but who think like entrepreneurs.

Oh dude, and writing a book, that accountability was insane. Like, I don't think I'd be where I'm at without it. You're 100% right because writing a book, now I can say it so easily, like, oh, just, you know, write the first draft, just get it done, because I've, you know, been through it so many times. But at the time, it was the hardest thing I had ever did. And without that support group literally living with me, and the way that we had it structured, now that you brought it up, is like, we had, and The 4-Hour Workweek talks about this, like, stakes. So what I mean is, like, not only did we say what we would do every week, But if we didn't do what we said we would, we would have a weekly meeting on Sundays in the house. Then we would kind of be like, like, I'm blanking on the word, like bad things would happen. Like you'd have to do the dishes, you know, or something like that. Like, or you'd have to pay the other person $100. Like if I said I would write 5 chapters this week and I didn't, I owed him $100. And at the time, $100 was a shit ton of money to me at that time. So like, I was like, I am not giving this guy $100. Like, that's my fucking dinner for the week. Like, I need that. So, I wrote those chapters, you know, and but either way, it just, that's where it's kind of like you keep moving forward and then you kind of fall into it because now that I look back on how far I've come up to this point, doing what I do, the podcast is very obvious to me because it's, you know, it's just, it's, you know, it's people. The book thing is not as obvious but it does make sense to me now because every— like, a lot of people want to write books. So it's almost like I'm the person, and, you know, there's other publishers and stuff that do similar stuff to what I do, but I'm in a position where a lot of people come to me because they want to write a book. And it's just— it's still very people-oriented, you know. It's not like— I'm not like an editor or something. Like, my task is more so overlooking the company and communicating with the authors. So every part of my life now is just basically me communicating with people, and that's what I like to do.

So yeah, yeah, and it's amazing that you, you've uncovered that kind of so, so naturally, so organically. And I'm sure that there were a lot of moments, a lot of small decisions you needed to take, but it seems, it seems like everything fell into place, right? You went to this conference, you dropped out of school, and then you, you started, you know, speaking or, uh, or writing a book, and then things started unraveling, which is probably not, not exactly, not exactly how it happened.

No, but kind of, I mean, it's just kind of like things, and that's the point of going back to what we're talking about though, of completing things, right? So like, when I wrote the book, I didn't write the book to help other people with books, you know, like I had no idea that's what was going to happen. I wrote the book, well, really two reasons. One, I thought that at conferences, like, I really knew what I was doing, and I felt like really nobody else did. So I was like, I'm gonna write this book and help people so that they go to events and they actually walk away from them feeling like they've like had a good experience. Because I felt like a lot of people at conferences were like going and they would leave and they would blame the coordinator for it. But I'm like, dude, you didn't talk to anybody. Like, I saw you, like, you just sat there. Yeah. So, it's like, how, like, why did you even pay? Go on Google for information. Like, I don't go to events for information. Information personally. Like I go for the people. So I don't know.

Wasn't another reason that a speaker who has a book?

That was the other, right? So it was that and then the other reason was because I wanted to be a public speaker. And my mentor, well, multiple mentors said the root word of authority is author, right? So I was like, okay, I'll be a public speaker. But then when I wrote the book, I did get some gigs and that was working. But then people just started flooding, asking me how I did what I did. And I was like, oh well, not only is this producing more income, it's actually more aligned with my lifestyle, I felt. And now I guess, thank God in a sense, because if I was just a public speaker right now, it's a little more difficult now.

So I don't know. But yeah, it'll be a little bit more difficult to afford that $30K doctor. Yeah, they give you— they get you juiced up.

I'm gonna have to move these lips more. That's awesome, man. Um, so, okay, wait, I don't— I don't know if we got to— what does your sister do though? What does she do?

Oh, yeah, so my sister right now, she is— she's a couple years older and she is still figuring things out, uh, in, in her life and She's figuring out kind of like what she's curious about, what she's interested in. She draws, she tried like all of the weirdest professions. She was a florist and then she took in pets from different shelters. So she's like doing a lot of different things. She doesn't like the conventional like office jobs. So she's on her journey kind of like figuring things out.

Dude, that's awesome, man. So, kind of more like an artist brain in a sense, like an art, that's what it seems like. Yeah. Like an art, yeah. Dude, oh man, that's so cool. I, um, yeah, I feel like art, I feel like artists, they have like the, like a moment, right? So, it's like, they'll try to figure it out and then, they have this like, just breakthrough, just trajectory moment or something. So, I don't know, either way, probably having you as a brother is perfect because you're more like business-minded. So, You can kind of help her with that.

That's right.

But so, now that we're kind of getting towards the end, what are you— let's get to the present. So, we kind of— this is awesome, dude. This is the kind of like a documentary almost for— so, like, what are you working on now? Like, what's going on like now in your life from like a marketing business standpoint?

Yes, a little bit of background about like my professional life because I think it's important kind of how I got here. And the kind of the journey, not just where I'm at. So I also dropped out of college, mainly because 2014 happened in Crimea, the currency collapsed, I could no longer pay for the university. And I was not going to college, like officially, but I was living on campus in LA, and I was thinking, okay, like, what do I want? I love entrepreneurship. So I started going to like the innovation center, like the little startup incubators, and started like working on startups. Didn't know anything, uh, that, you know, anything I was doing, honestly, like all college kids, it was, it was a lot of, a lot of just trying to figure things out, being unproductive, you know, talking to a lot, but it was still good. Yeah, it was still good. So, uh, I met this, I met this, uh, this guy. He, he is a very successful venture capitalist Tim Draper, billionaire. And, you know, I was at a conference as well with young entrepreneurs, young entrepreneurs, everybody was so fired up working on their businesses. And I felt like a little bit like, hey, I do not belong here. Like all of the people here are like so successful. There are, you know, billionaires and crazy people walking around just like this. And I can go talk to them, very small. So I talked to Tim, and I pitched him a shitty idea. I'll pitch you the idea. It was, uh, it was a shower head. It was a shower head, uh, that, that knows the perfect temperature for you to take shower, you know, and that always outputs that temperature, you know, so you, so you don't have to wait.

That's awesome.

And I just, I, I did such a shitty job pitching it.

Yeah.

So, uh, and then, and then Tim is, but I was like super enthusiastic and everything. He's like, not, You have to go through my incubation center, incubation program in the Silicon Valley. So I was like, okay, yeah, of course. I was like, yeah, I was not like taking it very seriously. And then I applied, then I got into the Silicon Valley, into that incubation program. And then I was selected out of like a small group of people and we're doing a TV show. And what that TV show did, brought crazy founders of unicorn companies, like founders of Airbnb, founders of Lyft. There was Lyndon Rive, who is the founder of SolarCity, cousin of Elon Musk. SolarCity was acquired by Tesla, and now they do solar panels, right?

For Tesla.

Anyways, so a lot of those insane, insane people were there right in front of me. There were a cohort of 22 people, or something like that. And I got to interact with many of them. I was like 19 years old or something like that. I was in the Silicon Valley and that really shaped me into like thinking differently and then seeing this very successful entrepreneurs, so, okay, I can actually do that myself. I ended up on Necker Island, just also like reaching out to people and I ended up kitesurfing on Necker Island. Thanks to Richard Branson, crazy story met, and another crazy community of older entrepreneurs and a lot more successful as well. And then I realized, damn, like, does these people that surround me, you know, they can do those things and I'm not different than they are. You know, I was like a young kid, like 20 years old, doing all of those things. So it really allowed me to see that, hey, anything is possible. Long story short, Long story short, essentially I joined a little agency, more like co-starter, didn't know what I was doing. I needed some sort of a project to be occupied with. It was the time of equity crowdfunding, the JOBS Act passed, and people could invest into startups as little as $100. So we built an agency, didn't do really, all that incredibly well. I didn't have many skills, to be very honest, like most people out of college. And yeah, so we were talking about kind of my professional life. I did an agency and then I transitioned to a different type of agency from equity crowdfunding to like personal branding, building kind of like really nicely designed websites for thought leaders, for companies. That was, that was my business. And then I started working on an education company in Latin America. It did super well. And then I realized that if I keep being in the state when things are good, I'll miss out from the things that are great. So I literally gave away all the equity, you know, cut, burned the ships. And I was like, okay, I need to jump into something else. And right now I am working on another project that really stretches my capabilities. And this project, it's still in the stealth mode, but it's a workflow automation tool. What this means, it essentially allows you to do things, to automate what you usually do with opening up new tabs, clicking around a bunch of places, It allows you to control all of your web apps. So think Asana, Trello, I know you use Basecamp, Google Drive. So you can control all of those apps and the information that exists there just by typing things with natural language or by clicking on certain playbooks and that allows you to perform more complex action in just one click.

Uh, very cool.

Yeah. So yeah. And the mission, the mission is to allow people to, to do more of what they love, you know, to save their time, to automate their kind of like day-to-day small things that they hate doing.

Dude, that's free. How, what's the timeline on that? I'm interested.

It works. I'll give you a demo.

Give me a demo, dude.

That's sick.

Oh my gosh, man. Like, um, yeah, cause you know, I mean, I'm, uh, I mean, I've gotten better since me and you have met, but let's just say, if you looked at my desktop, you'd be sad still. You'd probably be sad. Still?

I do remember Tyler was sharing his screen. I was like, okay, man, the first thing before we jump into operations, the first thing we gotta do, created a little folder and just like dropped all of it.

Oh yeah.

Yeah, yeah, a million tabs.

Basecamp helps me a lot, but I can only imagine, you know, I use other apps, so just like probably everybody does. So having that all in one kind of database, that would be very helpful. That sounds awesome. Um, so I guess last thing, I kind of want to leave it to you, like if there's anything else you want to share, please do. And then, um, uh, where people can find you. I know you're not on Instagram anymore, so kind of how are you, how are you staying in contact? With people because Instagram is the only way.

Totally. Do not follow me, do not look me up, I'm not on social media. That's awesome. Actually, for reals, for reals, because in this podcast I kind of like shared majority of the things I wanted to share with you. Yeah. The one thing I want to tell you, just like stop fucking overthinking things. Go do shit, you know, don't make a big deal out of it. Live life on your own terms. Do stuff that's challenging, do stuff that you want to do. You know, do not listen to what other people think. Sounds a lot easier to say than to do it. But in reality, if you just like turn off that inner critic and just start doing shit, like things, magical things will start happening. So that's my message. So, uh, and that's a better one that I would be able to record on my Instagram story. Oh, have you seen this?

That's your phone now?

Uh, kind of. Not really, but I didn't— so, uh, what I'm holding, I'm holding next to my hand there, if in case you guys are listening, uh, on, on audio, uh, I'm holding a Nokia from 1996. This phone appeared in movie Matrix.

Oh, okay.

Yeah, yeah. So this is pretty much the Rolex of phones. It's like ultra light. It's the banana phone. And yeah, it has like mono, what is called monophone, or it has only like one type of sound it makes or something.

Yeah, yeah.

For the melody. So I did an experiment. I love experiments. That's what my book is about. So I did an experiment where I lived without my phone for a week. And then after that, I just wanted to see how I feel, if I think differently, if I get less distracted, which was the case. And then as a symbol, I bought myself this old phone from 1996. So recently when my phone died, when my phone died, the battery wasn't working, I picked this phone up and I was literally going around town with this phone attracts so much attention, picks up the girls so easily. Well, not something I'm doing, but it does it automatically. Just like, no, people, people, you just like put it on the table and people are like, what's that? Yeah, so it's like a really cool unique thing.

Yeah, no, that's awesome. That is so cool. So, but you still, so you still have your phone though, but just sometimes you'll, you'll switch over? Yeah, that's more, that's more just like a signal for you. Like a, um, uh, how do you say, like a, what's that called?

It's more of a little reminder.

Yeah, reminder. That's what I'm trying to say.

Yeah, a little reminder. I gave it to a buddy of mine, uh, so a friend of mine, he came to me, he's like, Renat, like, uh, I work 7 days a week, I'm like so distracted, I'm not being productive, like I'm being occupied all the time, you know, working on my startup, uh, it's like, how do I, how do I escape? I do not know how to escape. I literally give him this phone, for a few days. He comes back, he's like, okay, it helped.

That's it. Yeah, dude, that's— dude, I know, that's the thing is like people, we all overthink things and it's like, um, it's— it always, to me, it seems to always go back. 4-Hour Workweek just covers so much stuff and that's one of the things that he talks about in the book. He's running that, um, uh, uh, fitness thing or like medicine, uh, a thing, supplement, like nootropics company.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

And he real— he's like, he decides to travel and he just— I think he like decides not to answer email or text for like months just to see like how bad things get, you know. Or he— and then he comes back and he's like, wasn't really that bad, you know. Like, he's like, I lost, you know, lost some business, but like at the end of the day it was fine.

Yeah, yeah. It's, it's doing those experiments. It's fear setting. Like, what's the worst thing that can happen? In case there's still like thoughts, fear that comes in.

Yeah.

Yeah. So like making uncertainty a little bit less so, because when you know the worst thing that can happen, it's no longer as scary, right?

Exactly. Exactly. Well, thank you, brother. I appreciate you coming on the show.

I appreciate being here, man. Fun times.