092: Becoming a Social Entrepreneur with Miki Agrawal

Hi, I'm Natalie Jill, fat loss expert turned high performance coach. When odds are stacked against us, how do we shift and create everything from nothing? How do we level up when we aren't feeling it yet or we've had a big setback? On this podcast I'll be talking to some of the most inspiring and courageous men and women on this planet who at their worst learned how to achieve success greater than they ever dreamed possible. Leveling up and creating everything from nothing. I interviewed Mickey Agarwal on the perfect day. At the perfect moment, I was battling my own self imposed stop conversation in my mind about maybe needing to give up something I had been working on and believed in. But interviewing her and the conversation I have with her shifted me right out of it. And I know it's going to do the same for you today if you're in that place. Mickey is a true social entrepreneur in every sense of the phrase. Now she was raised by parents who never complained and who always found solutions to any and every problem. And she learned early on that there is always, always a solution. Now Mickey shares so many incredible stories and journeys of her pursuit to never give up. How she was the founder of the acclaimed farm to table alternative pizza concept called Wild. They now have three locations in New York City, one in Guatemala, one more on the way and she is also Ladies listen to this. She co founded thanks. If you don't know what that is, that is a high tech period proof. Yes I said period proof underwear brand and led the company as CEO to evaluation of get this $150 million and to Fast Company's most innovative companies of 2017. All while helping tens of millions of women. Period. Better as she says. She most recently founded a new innovative company called Tushy. Wait till you hear about this. Oh my gosh. Her energy, her creativity, her pursuit of never giving up. Wait till you meet her today and learn exactly how Mickey has over and over again created everything from nothing. Today on leveling Up I've got Mickey Agrawal and I don't even know where to start with her. I'm so excited. I have so many questions to ask her today. She's just serial entrepreneur. This one's near and dear to my heart. She was the first to create a gluten free farm to table pizza in New York City. I don't know if you know this Mickey, but I'm a celiac so I'm dying to hear about that.

Thank you for creating that.

She created the Think period proof underwear. I didn't even know what that was. But wait till you hear about this, ladies. Oh my gosh. She created a bladder leakage product. She is now working on a product called Tushy, which gets rid of the gross toilet paper problem. She's a best selling author of two books. Her list goes on and on and on. She's a true serial entrepreneur. But she created every single one of these concepts from nothing. Nothing was handed to her. I am dying to get into this with her today on how she came up with the ideas, how she even did this, how she made things go from nothing to everything. Mickey, thank you so much for being here today.

So happy to be here.

Oh my gosh, where do we even start? Because most people say they're a serial entrepreneur and like really they just do a lot of different things, but nothing really takes off and it's a success. But you've created these massive things that are success. Like where? Take us back. Like, how did this even start? Were you born with a million ideas? Did you have the resources to create?

Who were you? No, I mean, my father came to this country, to Canada with $5 in his pocket, okay. And then my mother came here from Japan having speaking very little English. And my parents met in 1974 and against all odds, disrupted societal preconceptions of interracially and fell in love, married each other and within one year, you know, of really kind of, well, of getting married. So that happens. They got together in 1974. But then a few years, a couple years later, they had my older sister and then they had my twin sister and I. So, okay, three of us were born within one year. And then we moved to Montreal, Canada. And I think, you know, growing up I just saw my parents who had, you know, just. We were very middle class, you know, once on a modest engineer salary. My mom was a stay at home mom and raised us, you know, without really any help. And you know, whenever they would see stuff in community, in the community or in the city or in the town that was missing or lacking of, they wouldn't complain about it, they would just solve it. And I just watched them. Like, for example, growing up, there was no gifted children summer camp, okay? Summer camp for like people, you know, sports summer camps and regular summer camps, but there was no summer camp for gifted children. And so my mom without, like, again, with broken English, without any resources, any money, any connections, anything, figured it out and created Montreal's first gifted children summer camp. And it ran for 15 plus years with hundreds of children and just figured it out, you know, and then growing up. Yeah, yeah. And then when we were, like, in elementary school, my parents were like, oh, electronics are gonna be the future. This is in, like, the early 1990s. There was no cell phones, no computers. There was still no personal computers. Of course, nothing. And the first Commodore 64 started coming up, and then Apple just, like, slowly, slowly. And they were like, this is gonna be the future. So they were like, children need to know about this. They created the first electronics children's kit that taught kids how to make electronics, like breadboards and burglar alarms and lights that flash and stick and. And then they just sold these all over Canada, and they just kind of, like, made these things all our lives, and we just watched them never complain, never give up. And we just were like, all right. I guess when we see a problem in society or in the community, we're just gonna go fix it.

I love that your parents, what a gift they gave you. Like, that's so incredible. And I don't know that I've ever heard somebody that direct with what their parents did for them. So when you would have a complaint. Cause everyone has a complaint. How did your mom handle that? Like, when you would be Clint, which you just automatically go to, how are we going to solve that? How did she coach you through that?

Yeah, I mean, I think we. I mean, honestly, I don't recall having any time to complain growing up, because we were like. They put us in every. We went to language Monday through Friday with French school, Saturday we had Japanese school, and Sunday we had Hindi school. So we went to school. Our parents tricked us into going to school seven. And then we had, like, soccer and music classes, and we had all these, like, all the things. And so we just didn't have any. Literally any time.

So you just had to learn to figure it out.

We had to learn to figure it out. We just kept going and just kept moving. Yeah.

Yeah. So how did you know as a little girl? Like, did you know you were just gonna figure things out and create things or what? What did you think you were gonna be when you grew up, when you were that little girl?

I. I did not know I was gonna be an entrepreneur. I mean, I didn't even know it was a possibility. I didn't even know. Like, it wasn't. There was no Facebook. There was no entrepreneurial anything. It wasn't in the zeitgeist at all, culturally. So, no, I only really figured out that entrepreneurship was a possibility. When I was, like, 22 years old in New York City, I went to My first party. And I was in my first party where I was invited into the VIP section of an Armani party when Armani was like. And I was standing at the VIP section, and standing in front of me was this guy named Graham Hill who had started a company called Tree Hugger and another company. And we just sat there in line talking. We ended up spending the whole evening just chatting and talking. And I was like, wait, you started a company? Wait, how did you do it? Wait, wait, you can do that? And then I just was. So it was just mind blowing. And then he next day invited me to this brunch with a bunch of his entrepreneurial friends. And then I met with them, and I just sat. And I was 22. They were all in their mid-30s, and they just took me under their wing. And I just, like, I just. That's how I learned about entrepreneurship. Wow.

Because I know what you're talking about too. Like, I grew up in D.C. so, like, that whole east coast vibe, it's not a very entrepreneur area. Like, you just think you go to college, you go to, you know, you get a job. Like, that's what we're taught. It's very different than, like, I live in California now, where it's this. Everyone's an entrepreneur, right?

Exactly. But back then, nobody. I mean, it was like investment banking, management consulting, law, going to law school, becoming a lawyer, becoming a doctor. It was like real vacations that you would. And professions that you would get into. Entrepreneurship was certainly not one of those options. And so when my. When I sort of discovered that entrepreneurship was a thing, I just started thinking more about it and just saying, oh, what would be something that I would want to start? I never came up with an idea or even thought about, wait, how would I even raise the money? I had student loan debt. I didn't have it. I just didn't have any savings. Like, I was just still. It was just not even option until, you know, I went. I see my first job out of college was at an investment banking. So after Cornell, I got a job directly across 2 World Trade Center. And my job started on September 1, 2001. Yeah. And so my subway stop every morning was 2 World Trade Center. I would basically get tea with my girlfriend who worked in the hundredth floor. And then I would walk across the street to my job. And I did two months training still there. So I was there for like two and a half months. I officially started the first week of September and 911 happened, and 700 people, my girlfriend's office died. On that day, she worked on the hundredth floor. She went down to get coffee. I thought she was dead for a month. I didn't know. Wow. What? Two people in my office died. And it was the first and only day in my life that I slept through my alarm clock.

Oh, my gosh.

First and only day. To this day, I'm the lightest sleeper and I would. I just. If any like tink sound, I would wake up.

What a bizarre coincidence. Yeah.

And so to me, what I learned, you know, when I found out what happened and I came to. I just. What came to me was that, oh, my God, the mystery of life is that you never know when it's gonna end. Yeah. The time was absolutely now to make every moment count. And you know, right now a meteor could hit the planet and we can all be incinerated and die. You know, like, we just never know what freak my accident or some crazy like 911 would happen. And in that moment, I just saw my life flash before my eyes. And I feel like so many of us have had an aha moment where we had a family member pass away or we've been like, near death experience, or we've had some kind of a thing that just shakes us awake to our mortality. And that was my moment. I was 22 years old. And, you know, I've had like little like bike accident kind of things. But this was really, like, I really could have been there and I. And I was just really shaken up from it.

Yeah, I can imagine.

Yeah. And that's when I was like, all right, like, I have to make every moment count. And so I wrote down three things I wanted to do with my life.

Okay.

And the first was to play soccer professionally. Okay, why not? The second was to make a movie.

That would be on my list too. I'm just so random.

So random. Okay. And then the second was, yeah, play soccer professionally and then make movies. And then the third, Start a business.

Start a business. Okay. But you didn't know what you just said. Start a business. Okay.

Start a business. Like, whatever. And I played soccer all four years of college in Cornell. D1. I played my whole life. I was obsessed with it. I, you know, played the highest level. And I found out that the New York Magic was holding tryouts in Brooklyn. And while I was working my investment banking job, I snuck out of my investment banking job, tried out against all top D1 athletes from around the country. You know, they would cut teams, cut people, every single tryout. And I kept going through, like, all the way to the very end, two and a half months into the tryouts, the coach puts the, you know, the list of all the starting lineup on the. On the, on the bulletin board. And there I was on that starting lineup, and I was like, oh, my God, I just made the starting lineup of the New York Magic soccer team. I'm going to quit my job. This is epic. But then I was like, you know what? Wait, let me just play my first game, see how it goes, and then quit my job, because who knows what's going to happen? So I played my first game, and then within the first eight minutes of my professional career, juke a few. Couple of players in, I crossed the ball. The striker puts in the back of the net. And then, like, while I. As soon as I crossed the ball, a defender came in, took out my leg, and I heard the telltale snap. And then.

Oh, my gosh.

Yeah. And tore my acl and I was out and I was done. And then I had to stay in the investment banking job to get the best health insurance, the best doctor, the best surgery, the best physical therapy. And then I was like, fuck it. I got back. I came back as hard as I could and then tried out again the following season, made the team again, made the starting lineup again, and then tore my acl, my other ACL in the semifinal games.

Oh, my gosh. That's a sign. Yeah.

I was like, universe, oh, why does it hear you? Yeah, I got it. Thank you. But, ugh. And so I looked at the second thing on my list, which is to make movies, and I was like, okay, second thing is to make movies. And I dusted off my film resume. I spent my two summers in LA while I was in college working for the guys that produced Dumb and Dumber and Kingpin and all these, like, smart movies, and basically got a job as an associate producer at a production company, you know, like, for commercials and music videos in New York City. Very quickly I'm like, you know what? I'm not a nine to fiver. I can't do this anymore. So then I decided to go freelance. And while I was freelancing, I started, like, as a production assistant on sets of commercials and music videos, picking up trash, like, on the streets of sets, like, driving directors around, getting producers coffee. Like, my Asian parents were freaking out. They were like, oh, my God, you know, but you were doing whatever it took. Yeah. And so very quickly worked my way up to producing commercials and music videos. And then while I was on set, I'm sure when you're on, you've been on sets of things on set. There was these craft service tables where they have these snacks and all this food.

Totally.

And it's always usually garbage.

Yes, it is.

It is always eggs in the blanket. It was like hot dog. It was like cheese fries and pizza and like, you know, M&Ms.

And it's not ever what the talent eats.

It's all pretzels, Just the crap. And I was an immigrant's daughter, and I had a student loan debt, and I was now working on, you know, picking up trash, making very little. And I would just eat that all day long as my meals because I was like, I love free with my favorite price at the time. And I was just like, eating it. I would just come home with awful stuff.

You froze there. Hang on.

Because I just never thought about it. And finally I was like, oh, my God, I had a worst stomachache. I came home one day, I was like, enough's enough. And I just researched it and I was like, oh, my God. Like, oh, my gosh. Like the pesticides, the hormones, the antibiotics, the bleach, the chemicals, the preservatives that was in food was just making so many people intolerant to food, allergic to food, having issues just like you with celiac disease, you know, just like people who are just intolerant to all this processed crap. And I was like, oh, my God. And I started thinking about my favorite comfort foods, like pizza. And I had to give it up too, because every time I ate it, I would feel bloated and gassy and stomach pains, and I just couldn't eat pizza anymore. And I just. And I just started looking it up and I was like, oh, my God. The pizza category is a thumbnail $32 billion category. Americans eat 100 acres of pizza every single day.

Yes, they do.

And I was just like, oh, my God. People love pizza. And yet nobody was making pizza for people who had intolerances, who had, like, issues and food issues. 2005, like 2005, gluten free was not even a conversation. Organic farm to table.

Totally.

None of those things were being had. So I was like, oh, my God, I'm going to open New York City's first alternative pizza concept that had gluten free flours, hormone free cheeses, local seasonal topics, organic vegetables when possible. Like, I'm going to support local farms, create local jobs, like, do a whole local movement. And everyone laughed at me. And everyone said, no one's going to buy ew gluten free.

Because no one even knew what gluten was I used to carry a cart around, like what? Like to give chefs at restaurants, like, to make sure it wasn't in anything.

Yeah, people probably didn't know he got sick, I'm sure. So it was just a thing. And then all of a sudden, like I said, I was like, okay, I have this idea. Okay, now I have to like do it. And. And I was like, I didn't have obviously the capital to make it. I didn't have any, you know, I didn't have any of the resources. And so I had just had to like gather all of my friends. So luckily I was dating an architect at the time. You know, I had a friend who was interior designer, I had a friend who was a chef who I played soccer with. I had like, you know, in my investment banking days, I'd like amass a Rolodex, a few people with money. But I didn't know even how to raise money or even have a conversation. So guys, can you be quiet really quickly? Yeah. I just didn't have any of the knowledge of how to have the conversations. And so I just first started like, you know, trying to like have one on one meetings with potential investors to talk about my idea. I would put my investment banking suits on and I would put my pearls and I would just be like a fish out of water again. Just like I saw investment banking and I would just try and raise the money and be like, I have this idea and this is what I want to do. And I raised a big fat donut. I raised euro dollars, like nothing for six months. I just tried raising money, going out, meeting everyone I could, everyone who I thought had extra pocket change raised zero.

What made you not give up in that moment? Like, I'm curious about that because a lot of people would take that first no or maybe the fifth no as a sign. Like, okay, I need to give up. Just like when you had the ACL tear, you know, the second one, you're like, I'm done. What made you keep going?

Wow, that's a great, that's a great. I mean the ACL tears. I mean, two reconstructive surgeries, it was just like, oh, too painful. Yeah, I mean, I just believe that. I mean, like, more and more people were showing intolerances in food. There was no alternative to America's favorite pastime. I missed pizza. And I believe that the, you know, like the necessity is a mother of invention. Right? So like, I had the problem first and I would crave pizza sometimes I would just be like, you know, What? I need pizza so much that I would just lock. I would go by myself on a Friday night, eat it, and just be at my home, like, like, crying sick. And I was just like, I knew I wanted this product you had.

Your why was so much bigger than your why not. And that's what I want people to hear. Because it didn't matter. What? It didn't matter about people not believing you, and it didn't matter about the nose. You were so clear on your vision that it didn't matter.

Right? That was it. And I just felt that's exactly it. I was just like, I know that if this food was out there, people would want it. Like, okay, I know that there's a market for it. Like, even if it was a small. So we. Celiac community, or like the dairy free community or the organic community, even if they were tiny in 2005, there was a market for it. And so, Mickey, did you ever get.

That glimpse of, like, when someone said, no or this is dumb, or whatever they said? Do you ever have a moment of, should I not be doing this? Did that ever even cross your mind?

Of course. I mean, I would be crying, like, I don't understand what I'm doing. Like, what is wrong? What am I doing? And I would just like, yeah, I would just get so upset and would be lucky. I have a twin sister. And I think when you have a twin sister who's like, you're a best friend and champion, you know, like, you believe in me. And I remember, like, it was like, I raised $0. And finally my sister and I were at a restaurant with this guy who wanted to invest in the business. It was like, 4 o' clock in the morning, right? She was like, we were at this restaurant, and my sister had her head on the table. She was sleeping. And I was sitting there talking to this guy who had, like. Who literally, like, wrote a $25,000 check for my investor. And I would. And she was there with me. And I. And. And finally I was just like, you know What? Like, it's 4 o' clock in the morning. If you're not gonna invest, just don't. Like, I just can't. I'm too tired. Like, you surrendered. I surrender, I just said. And then just. She and I just were walking away. And then he, like, was like, wait, like, dramatically, like a movie. And he was like, all right, here, just go do it. And I was like, it was such a New York moment. 4:00 the morning, Soho. My sister and I were just like, Arm in arm. I was like kind of tearing up. So I kind of was like, oh, okay, wow. All right. Well, yeah, great. And it was just a New York moment.

What an awesome lesson in that. Just listening to you though, because you had to get so past like the no. And the rejection, like, and people give up before that point, you know, like if you had not done that one more, like just the one more.

Right.

Like you were so close to not being there and not going one more at 4 in the morning. And like you did it and look at what happened.

It was such a. It's so. Cause it's the first time I'm actually reliving this moment. But it was such a. Now that I'm talking with you about it, it was such a critical moment about that realization said that like, wow, like I could have been like, fuck it.

Yeah, I'm done, I'm over done.

I'm. And I kind of at that moment was. But then, but he saw, like I stood there, I sat there till 4 o' clock in the morning, just like, like just being like, this is a big idea. I know it. You know?

Yeah. And what I like too is you weren't begging him. You were just pleading your case of your vision. You were just stuck. Like, this is my vision. This is what's happening.

That's it.

Like you weren't like, help me, help me. It was just like, this is my vision and you weren't giving that up.

That's it. I mean, and looking back, you know, it's just like, it's like you have to start with a big vision and share. Like, I think that this is a movement, you know, and it's like whether or not it actually happens, you have to believe in the big vision.

Yeah.

And really understand what that is. You know, it took years for me to even get to the second restaurant and like, and get out of the. Just like barely breaking even and really, just kind of like really now is when we're taking off. This is like 15 years later. You know, you think about Lacroix, you know, Lacroix, the drink that now everyone has. It's a 30 year old company.

That's incredible. Incredible. Yeah. They're not overnight successes.

It's like a 30 year old company and like, like my restaurant, Wild, I feel like, is now just starting to take off, you know, 15 years later. And I think that, you know, it's just like it's. It has to be the right timing, the right management team, the right, the right, the right recipe, you know. And, like, we've been. We've been sort of, like, figuring out the system for so long that I think now we're finally figuring out, like, we finally have our franchise package together. We find it was like 15 years. I mean, like, and usually most of my companies, like, I'm like, you know, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom. But certain categories, like the restaurants be. Sometimes. Like, sometimes it hits, like, right away, and sometimes it just takes a long time. Like, you just, you know, it's like, but it ain't over till the fat lady sings. Like, that is for damn sure.

So. So how do you go from. I love. So many lessons in that. That I just wrote down, like, so many lessons in that. How do you then, like, it's like this. It finally is happening. I got it. I got. I surrendered. It's happening. Like, I'm now gonna put a plan in place. How do you then now go, like, a whole different direction? Like, that's happening. But now you're like, I'm gonna create another. Solve another problem and start all over again.

So, I mean, I ran the restaurants really, you know, for seven years.

Okay.

You know, you. I ran them, and I. And I did a pretty crappy job because I didn't have any experience. Like, because you're the idea person.

You're the visionary.

Exactly.

You're not the integrator or the, like, doer.

Yes. And what I realized, and so this is another huge lesson, was that I ran them myself. Like, it was like I was going in the middle. I was in molasses uphill. Like, I get it. Barely like, breathing.

Yeah.

I finally find a partner who doesn't steal from me.

Yeah.

Like, take advantage of me. Because every other manager was like, this girl's clearly a rookie.

Yeah.

It would just fleece me dry. And I, at this point, can't even blame them.

But another lesson, Mickey. Like, look at that. Because you could have also said, I don't trust anybody. I'm done. Everyone's a scam artist. And you kept the course.

Yeah. I mean, yeah. Well, interestingly enough. So I finally, after seven years of being, like, screwed over by so many times, but learning and learning and learning and learning, I finally found a partner who's now my current partner, Waleed. And my first question to Waleed, kind of exasperated, was, do you believe in karma? Do you believe in karma? And his answer was, mickey, every time I have a bad thought, a bicycle run over my foot.

I love it.

And I was like, are you the genie from Aladdin?

Yeah.

That was my next Question. I was like, oh, my God, Like, I love you. And so immediately I was like, okay, we're partners and 50 partners and not even shitting you. Within one week, him taking over what I've spent seven years doing. Within one week of a restaurant operator taking over, our numbers doubled.

Incredible.

Within one month of him taking over, our numbers tripled. And I was, like, so angry with myself. But then also so, like, it was such a firework lit moment where I'm like, oh, my God, this is what you just said. Like, I need to focus on what I do best. The vision, the idea, the marketing, the, like, the creative, the thing. And have someone who loves operations, who gets it, who loves, like, the whole, like, the operations of it does, is that that's their zone of genius. And we can come together and be amazing partners. And that is what was like, you know, a huge, painful realization.

So brilliant. But what I also love about that is, once again, you didn't give up because you could have. It wasn't working. People are stealing from you. Many entrepreneurs listening can relate to this. I can for sure. Where you start losing trust in people. You start. Was this a mistake? Maybe I wasn't meant to do this. But you kept pushing. You just kept going and until you were going to find an answer.

I think I. Yeah, I mean, I think you have to have a really, really healthy level of naivete and just be like, oh, okay, cool. Okay. No, I believe you. I'm, like, pretty naive in a lot of ways. I mean, like. But like, But I'm just. I. Yeah, I think you have to have a healthy level naivete and just like, keep yourself in that space because it's.

Yeah, but it's hard. It's so hard because if people prove you wrong, it's like you start finding evidence that people are wrong.

Yeah. I think I'll also like growing up with. With a twin sister where you have to fight, and then like, five seconds later, you're like, you want to get lunch? You know, and you're just like, constantly getting. Or playing soccer, getting punched in the face. And then you have to get back up to the next play. You have to just, like, be so ready for the next play. Even if you lose and you screw up and you lose and you lose the ball or you. Your sister, like, beats you down, whatever. Like, you have to get back up so quickly. I think I just developed a really quick muscle memory to just like, you know those punching. Yeah. Keep like.

And I think your parents really helped shape you in that because you watch Them not complain. And they never gave up. They just found a solution. Let's find a solution.

That's it.

That's so incredible. So you find this, this partner, which is incredible. And everyone needs one of him in their business. I like question, do you believe in karma? That's a great question. I'm gonna start using that. Tell me about your next big part.

The transition.

Yeah, transition. And like, because this is, this is so cool. And I love. You're constantly like looking at a problem and then not just solving it for yourself, but solving it for everybody. So tell me about that. Tell me about these, all this stuff.

Yeah, so. So, so when I put, when Waleed, you know, really took over the restaurants, it really freed up a lot of my energy to focus on this next idea, which is thinks. And the idea behind it was also born out of a necessity. You know, I would be riding my bicycle from one restaurant to another, you know, and I would just literally have my period. Like it was like my first time ever. You know, I would just leak through everything. All my clothes, all my stuff was just like.

And it gets worse after, it gets worse after having a baby, right?

And you're just like, oh my God. And just like leaking through everything. And I would be the one having to interrupt my day, run home and change, be the one in the bathroom, like public bathroom, scrubbing the blood and like under the blow dryer, trying to. And it was just a mess and I was just like, ugh, this is like so ridiculous. And at my family barbecue in 2005, the same year I started my restaurants, my twin sister and I were at our family barbecue and we were defending our three legged race championship title at our family Barbecue. We were 10 year reigning champions of the three legged race. And we basically were, as we were sprinting like in the finish in the three legged race championship final, my sister started her period in the middle of the race. And as we're sprinting through the finish line, still tied to each other in the three legged race, she started her period and we had to sprint through the finish line, opposite of stairs still together, into the bathroom so she can change out her bathing suit bottoms and wash out the blood from her bathing suit bottoms. And as she was washing out the blood from bathing suit bottoms and I just watched her doing that, the idea hit, oh my God, wouldn't it be amazing to create a pair of underwear that never leaked, that never stained and that supported women every day of the month. Rhonda and I got so excited. We were like, oh my God, what an idea. We kind of burst through the bathroom door and we talked to our older sister. We're like, oh, my God, Yuri. My older sister, she said she's a head and neck surgeon. My older sister, she restores hearing for a living. And we were like, oh, my God, Yuri, think about it. Every one of your underwear in your underwear drawer has stains in them. Like, they all have period stains in them. Why is that? Why do all of your underwear have period stains in them? And she was like, well, because in the middle of an operation, like a 13, 14 hour operation, you can't be like, face, like, stay open while your fucking whole face is out. Totally. Oh, my gosh, change my tampon. Like, you can't do that. Or like, so she bleeds.

That's crazy. I never even thought about that.

And then, like, you think about, like, you know me in a soccer game. You can't be like, yo, ref, can you pause the game? I would have changed my tempo back. Like, you can't. The number of times I've bled through my short, you know, or like when you're performing or when you're stuck in traffic, or you're, you know, at like on an elevator, or you're in an airplane, or you're like, making out with a guy, or you're like, yeah, these situations, watching a movie, you can't stop. And you know, like, you can't.

Guys have no idea. The guys have no idea how big of a problem this is.

It is. And so it's like, we need a solution that really solves this problem. So we got so excited, we brought in the third co founder, Antonia, and the three of us spent the next four, almost four years developing a pair of underwear feels like a regular pair of underwear, like a sexy pair of underwear. Built in technology in the gusset part, that's leak proof, that's absorbent, that's antimicrobial, that's moisture wicking, that's odor proof. That really just absorbs up to two tampons worth of blood. It's leak proof. And then you just wash them out and you hang them up to dry and you're fine. So they're like a great backup to your tampon or pad. Or you can use them as a replacement. Your medium and light days. If you're a really, really heavy bleeder like me, I need a tampon with my underwear as backup. But then on my medium and light days, I wear the underwear bites up. Because, you know, when you're on your period, you put in a Tampon inside your vagina and it's dry. You kind of have to shove it up in there. That actually, that's what causes the micro abrasions inside your vaginal walls, which are the more.

Yeah.

And if you use, like, the organic ones.

If you use the organic ones, it's even. Which are better for you. They'll shred if you're too dry, so.

That's right. So they're just. It's just, like, terrible. Yeah. So there was an. It was such a huge. I mean, huge, raging success. I mean, 2005, we, you know, had this just hockey stick growth, and it really came from another setback. So, you know, we were. We were growing and growing kind of steadily small, still in the red, still not making really any money. We, by the way, couldn't raise any money for things, so we had to go do a Kickstarter campaign. I spent almost a year trying to raise money for things, and all investors were like, la, la, la. Should I be hearing about a period? Ha ha ha. Because it's all. And so it was so hard. And so we did a Kickstarter campaign and, like, you know, finally eked enough money to make our first production run and then launched the company and just, you know, raised a little bit of money from friends and family and just started eking by. And really, the hockey stick. Growth time came when the New York City public transit system, like, we want to advertise our ads, our period underwear subways in the subways of New York City. And the New York City subways banned us from putting our campaign subway because they said it would be offensive to riders. You can't say period. Oh, my gosh. And we're like, oh, my gosh. What?

Yeah.

Progressive city in New York City. You can't say the word period. Oh, no, you didn't.

Yeah.

You know, got our punching bag faces ready, and we said to them, like, all right, well, if you do not put our ads on the subway, we are going to press. Yeah. And they were like, you know, I was definitely like, you know, I was definitely like, you know, hoping that they would say yes because I didn't have any press contacts.

Yeah.

And they called my bluff. And they're like, go to press. Like, oh, fuck. And I was like, all right, well, I'm gonna call the two very, like, light contacts I have, and I sent them an email with subject heading scandal with New York City public transit system, period. And. And they both wrote back, and they're like, we want to write the story. And I was like, oh, my God, really? Okay, okay. You both get the exclusive.

Yeah.

Like, that's not how exclusives work. It was like a whole fight. I was so embarrassed. And finally one of them took the story. It was mike.com.

Okay.

Story went viral internationally.

Incredible. Yeah.

And so again, like, you talk about setbacks and how we could have been like, all right, well, they rejected our ads. That's it, we're done. Like, we can't do it. Or it's like, let's find a different way. Let's turn lemons into lemonade and figure out a way to make it actually work for us. And it was such a huge.

So like almost a twist on guerilla.

Marketing, but, like, and it was like, it got us more press and more than having spent all this money on actually advertising itself. So it was such a huge, huge thing that happened. And that's what really put us on the map. We went from 0 to 50 million in revenue, like, so quickly. Well over $100 million. It was a huge, huge, exciting, exciting time.

I can't even imagine. That's incredible. What an incredible accomplishment with that.

Yeah, yeah, it was amazing. And then. And then, yeah. So really built the company and then stepped down in 2017 as the CEO and, you know, professional CEO was put in place, really, from Harvard Business School, you know, who really understands sort of scaling those sort of mid sized companies up. And then I sort of took. I started working on my newest company, which is Tushy. And Tushy was born out of necessity as well, which, you know, when you think about it, like right now we're talking on the, you know, on zoom call with wi fi and these noise canceling headphones in this technologically advanced society that we live in. And yet the minute we step into our bathrooms, poof. We're back in the 1800s, like, literally, like, poof, back into the 1800s. And like, toilet paper was brought to America in the late 1800s and 1890s and popularized by Scott's brothers and Charmin and all these types of people who, I mean, these types of, like, people who had money and that can actually spend on creating something that people did every day. And the Scott brothers were like, what do people do every day? Of course, poop. What can we market to these people? You know, to the American consumer that people can buy over and over and over again. And so they, since they had the most money, the most budget, they popularized this toilet paper idea, which now has been a generationally ingrained thing that we use. And when you really Think about it. Like, imagine if you jumped into your shower, right? You worked out, you just had the biggest sweat of your life. You're about to get your periods, you're kind of hormonally smelly. Like, you're kind of, you know, like. And imagine not turning the water on and just using dry paper to wipe your body down. People would be like, yeah, what are you doing? Crazy. You know? Or imagine if you were, like, at your kitchen sink and you just cut up a raw chicken, you know, raw chicken that had salmonella all over it. And rather than using any water at all, you take dry toilet paper and you just smear the toilet paper around on the plate and you put the plate.

Totally, yeah, gets a good point.

Would be like, what are you doing? Think about what's down there. Like the E. Coli and the infection and bacteria our fecal matter has. And we go to the bathroom, we take dry paper, the dirtiest part of our body, we smear it around, and then we sit on fecal matter all day long, which then spreads. That creeps up to our vaginal walls, which then causes urinary tract infection. All these issues down there, bacterial vaginosis. And then, of course, people who use wet wipes, just stripping away the natural oils from behind, causing anal fissures, anal itching. So you're just like. And then, of course, toilet paper, when you're using on your butt, exacerbates and you're rubbing so much to try and, like, get it all out, which helps promote hemorrhoids. It's a really, like, art.

What's crazy that no one's brought this up or thought about it before? I'm hearing this from you, right?

And it's just like when you. Because again, it's so deeply ingrained in society, you kind of go to the bathroom, use toilet paper. You kind of.

You don't think about it. That's all that people know.

That's it. But when you actually think about it, like, wow, 30 million cases of combined chronic UTIs. Hemorrhoids, anal fissures, anal itching, all these things. Because you're taking dry paper and just smearing poop around and sitting on that all day long on your computer, on your phones, you're sitting on it, which is, like. It's crazy. And when you think about, you know, what's the universal solvent water? You think about in Asia, bidets are ubiquitous. And you think about Europe, bidets are everywhere. South America and Middle east, bidets are everywhere. So what we've created is what we've invented is simply a modern bidet that looks like this beautiful iPhone next to your toilet. It easily attaches to your existing toilet, so clips onto your toilet in 10 minutes and turns any toilet into a bidet in 10 minutes. And there's no plumbing or electrical required. It only costs $69. It's not like those super expensive Japanese toilets which cost thousands of dollars plus plumbing, plus electrical, or those weird French bidet things next to a toilet where you have to like, shimmy over with your poopy butt to, like, wash your butt. Like, I don't even know what people do.

You know what's coming up for me? This is so funny. And because so many people think of bodet, like, because especially Americans, they're trained so backwards with toilet paper, they look at bidets and they think it's like dirty toilet water coming up. But what they're not understanding, if it's not one and two, like, what's the alternative? What you just explained is so much grosser than water. Like, that's. That's crazy.

It's crazy. And by the way, it's not dirty toilet water. It's the same water you brush your teeth with.

Yeah.

So they're pulling the water from the wall. So, yeah, our product, it comes with a little splitter in the hose. Everything's in the box for the $69. And it comes with a splitter in the hose which splits off from the wall the same water that goes into your tap that you brush your teeth with, that goes into, you know, into your bathroom. So it's not the toilet bowl water, the toilet tank water, it's the water from your wall. Same water you brush your teeth with. And then also people's big misconception. It's like, oh, my God, like, won't poop just fly and spray everywhere? And the answer is no. It's like a precise shower for your butt where the water precisely is pulled into the toilet bowl. And it's like, it's so. It's like you can sip champagne.

Oh, my gosh, Mickey, you're so funny.

You know, it's like the most clean, pristine, high end experience for $69. I mean, it's like we're all ordering this now.

Like, we're all ordering that. We're all ordering the things we're all order.

And by the way, by the way, super, super important, do not go to tushy.com. it's like the most graphic anal porn site. Go. Oh, my gosh, go to hellotushy.com.

Can you spell that?

Hello? Yeah. H E L L O T U s h y dot com. HelloTushy dot com.

Okay, so no, we're not going to porn sites.

No porn site. Yep. Hello? Tushy.

That's hysterical.

Check it out. I love it.

Oh, my God, you're just incredible. I love your energy. I. The things that I'm picking up from you. So, I mean, if nobody's told you this or if you don't know this about yourself, they're so evident to me. Like one that you don't take no for an answer. You're so committed to your vision and problem solving that that tops all of your why not? So, like, no one can talk you out of anything because you are so completely committed to it. And I hope people really hear that, because it's not. You are so not a victim like so many people would. You could have taken any one of those stories and become a victim around them and given up every single one of them. And because you were so true to your vision, it didn't matter. There was no victim mentality. You were just gonna find a solution and you weren't waiting on somebody else. And I think that's just such a powerful lesson. And going back to the soccer story, because what I heard is you stopped because of the acl. It was also not in your vision anymore. So your why not became bigger than your why. And that's the difference right there. So, like, if you really wanted to be a soccer player, if that was someone, I'm sure you would have found a way.

Absolutely. Absolutely. And I think that I always knew that it's just like, that there's a bigger world changing sort of plan ahead. And I think soccer was a good lesson and stepping stone. And it was the right. Like, it helped me sort of push through all these challenges. I was going to come. Come forward in my life. I think it really served its role and served its purpose in such a powerful way. But I love what you said about the victim mentality. I talk about that in my book Disruptor all the time, about the idea of, like, you know, like, complaining is for procrastinators. And I know that people like, we can. We can easily play the victim about anything in our life, just like you said. And. And it's like, it's. It's. It's like. And again, we, like, there are shitty things that happen to everybody.

Yes.

We have all experienced shitty things that feel, like, so out of control and out of alignment within who we are with what you know, it's like, it's real. Like, being a victim. Yeah. Can be real for people, but it's really like. It's really like that happened, and then the rest is now a story that we're just repeating and repeating and repeating in ourselves. And it just becomes. It becomes a crutch. And it does. This victim mentality just does not help us live our best lives. And I think that the more we catch ourselves in that victim mentality and being like, oh, my God, I'm complaining again. I'm complaining again. It's like I'm just delaying the possibility of magic that's ahead. I'm just delaying. I'm just delaying the future. I'm delaying, like, all the joy that's ahead by just replaying this over and over and over again. I talk about that in my book as a chirping in your brain. Like, we're just chirping and chirping and chirping and chirping about all the things like the judgments and the perception, the what ifs and the. I can't believe that this happened. And I. All the things that just. Just keep. And it just. It's kind of like, you know, when you. When you see a tree with like so many birds in it, it's just like one loud, incessant chirp and you don't even know where it's coming from. Yeah, that's like all the thoughts in our.

Yeah, they're like 60,000 thoughts a day that we have, Right.

And it just gets. It consumes us. And so when it does, we just have no space for anything else. And I talk about all the time in my book, like, how to become a warrior, gatekeeper of your mind. Like, how to really catch all of this. Just be like, okay, no, I am in control of everything in my brain. I'm in control of what I allow to be true, factual or not, or a judgment or not. I'm gonna just catch them. Be like, nope, not today. Not today. That's judgy Judy. That's mean, Margie. Trying to come to my gate in my brain, not letting that happen today. And when you do that, you're like, oh, my God. I now have the space to keep dreaming, to keep believing in all the things I want to do, to keep doing. Like, okay, so now that I don't have any of these fucking annoying thoughts in my head, I'm now going to be proactive. I'm going to call this person to go and shadow him for the day because they built a company And I want to know how they did it. And you just have like all the space to create again. And I think that's so important.

Mickey, I have one final question and I'm absolutely adding your book to my Amazon cart. It's coming in. I need to know more. I ask everybody that I interview this question. I'm going to ask you this and I'm going to ask more about where people can find you and all the things. If somebody is listening right now and they're in their own personal rock bottom, so maybe they have their ACL injury or their relationship has fallen apart or financially, they're in that spot where you were eating craft services because that's all you could afford. Whatever their own personal rock bottom is and they're in that spot of I give up. I don't know what to do. If you were to give them three things right now that they can do to start shifting and start thinking the way that you do, what would you tell them?

I think it's really about putting one foot in front of the other and it's actually nothing beyond that. I think we, we have really a lot of analysis paralysis. And actually when we start taking action of any kindly just saying, like, I'm going to call two people today or I'm going to go and meet this one person today. I'm going to do this action today by just. By just actually making a to do thing. Even if it's one or two things, you'll start being like, oh wow, I just made progress or oh wow, like I just fed off that person's energy. Oh wow. Like I'm no longer in this thought loop in my head. Like I'm actually now in a forward motion.

So any action, I love that.

Any action at all. I think also it's really, really important to take stock of who are your five friends in your life and I. The five most closest people in your life. You know, it could be a family member, a friend, a colleague, you know, and just assess what are they saying to you in your ear. And it's like you are the average of the five closest friends you keep. Right. So we are the average. The five closest friends we keep. And. And by friends, it's like again, a family member could be like, stay in your safe job. You need to quit. Like, what are you doing? Why are you.

Your spouse. Yeah.

Or your spouse. Spouse or someone who's trying to hold you back and they're doing it because they think it's the right thing for you.

Yeah.

Out of love. And they're doing it out of compassion for you, what they believe is right for you. And so it's not like they're. They're. They're. They're bad people. They're just not acting in alignment with what you are aligned with. And so I would. I would really try. And I know sometimes when we're at a rock bottom, we want to grasp and reach out to everybody that we can think of to commiserate and to commiserate and be. And they'll be like, well, I think you should. And I think you should. And don't you.

Or they tell you it sucks. Like, you're right. That sucks.

Yeah.

And it just.

It just becomes again, like. It's like. I don't know, because now everyone's telling you different things and you just, again, are paralyzed. So I would. I would actually suggest. This sounds like, so crazy and so, like, duh, obvious, but honestly, like, doing a 15 minutes a day of just not of, like, closing your eyes and a bit of a meditation experience. And I do, like, you know, I know that's like, oh, meditate, blah, blah, blah. Like, everyone's like, yeah, meditate. It actually does help you resolve so many things.

Yes.

Quiet time. And actually, like, I come up with my best ideas when I meditate. Like, my best things. I do. I literally. I'm not saying that because I'm just like, oh, people close their eyes and they're like, I actually. I do. I do Transcendental Meditation. And Dr. Bob Roth is my teacher. He taught Oprah. He taught, you know, Seinfeld. He taught Ray Dalio. He taught, you know, all the. Gwyneth Paltrow. He taught so many of sort of the movers and shakers in our culture how to meditate. And they all swear by it, including me, because it's not like, don't think every time you're an active thought. You're like, fuck, you know, I can't meditate. I'm. It's what transcendental meditation is. It's actually. It's really cool. It's actually effortless. It's actually. It's actually a vacation from the vacation of your active thoughts. And so you're just basically like, you know, thoughts come and go, but instead of thoughts coming, like in the top of an ocean where it's just like, oh, my God, I. Thoughts are. It's just like, so crazy up here. It's just taking those thoughts down below in the ocean where it's quiet. Bottom of the ocean when it's quiet. The same thoughts still appear the same, you know, so you're not letting go of those thoughts.

So there's not the hurricane, like, all spinning around.

It's just not, like, at the top of the surface where there's waves and crashing, and you're just like, ah, yeah.

That'S where I live a lot. So I understand the hurricane.

Right. It's just, like, bringing it all down. And then when you. You do that, it kind of just like. And then you have a mantra, which. Which isn't like, mantra, mantra, mantra, mantra. Thinking of thought. Like, oh, like, I'm thinking about. It's kind of like, you know, when you walk to the subway or you walk to your car and you kind of know where your car is. Like, you know where the garage is? You know where you're.

Well, depends. I never remember mine is. But.

Okay, well, okay, so pretend like a weather problem, right? But you have your favorite juice spot, right? You know where it is. Your favorite spot. You know where it is.

Yes, I do know that.

And you're not, like, thinking, like, walking, like, I'm walking to my juice spot, you know, it's kind of like your body just.

Yes, yes. Right.

Subconsciously. And it's. That's your mantra. Your mantra kind of, like, is your guide. That kind of, like your compass that kind of helps bring you back. You're not like, I'm walking. You're not, like, thinking your mantra, like, so you're just like. It's just a guide. It's a light, effortless guide. And it just sort of, like, brings you back. And when I. And, like, for someone who's as high octane as me or as you people who are just like, constantly moving really fast.

Totally.

That time is so important for me to just, like, have that space and that beat to just, like, all right, like, I get to breathe again. I get to think again when you.

Get in the, like, hurricane. Because I'm sure it still happens.

Like, oh, yeah.

When you get in that. Is that the time you go and do it? Or do you have, like, a set time that you do it?

No, no. When you get in the hurricane space, you're like, all right, I need. I need that.

The last thing you feel like doing when you're in the hurricane. But that's when you need it.

But. But then you. But then you actually, like when it actually is when you need it. And then you're like, I'm just gonna. I'm gonna take five or I'm gonna take 10, or, I'm gonna take 15, I mean, 15, I would say, is the minimum. Like, 20 is ideal.

Okay.

But 50, you know, 20 is really ideal. But 15, I would say, is a minimum to really get you from, like, the heart palpitati, like, yeah. Vibes to, like, really breathing and, like, really just, like. You know, I also. I also have. And this is another thing I would do for these people. When I was going through, like, the really most challenging times in my life, I put reminders in my phone. Like, take three long, deep breaths every hour. Every hour, I had a reminder pop. And I still do to this day. These reminders pop up. Take three long, deep breaths. I have another reminder which is the right way, not right away, you know, and that's another reminder that pops up twice a day. Because I'm usually like, I just want to move things fast, and I just want to do, do, do it. Just, like, resolve. And she's like, oh. You know, And I get. Sometimes I'm writing that down. Yeah. It's like. And so my girlfriend told me. She was like, let's just. Why don't you do things? Why don't we talk about doing things the right way and not right away?

So. Good. That's my new screensaver right now.

Yeah, exactly. And that's been. That's been one of my mantras, like, over and over again. The right way, not right away. And I just have these little reminders. And another one is when I'm upset. When you're upset, did you drop down? Because when you're upset, like, in your operation root chakra, I'm like. And then you. And then. I can't believe it. But when you drop down to your root chakra, that's actually your true soul. That's your true self. And when we're, like, going through, like, internal struggle and all this shit, and we want to, like, be at our throat chakra, did I drop down? And the way I drop down is I put my feet on the ground, and I just. I just, like, plant my feet on the ground and just be like, all right. Like, I'm. I'm like, back to my root chakra, and I kind of sit up tall, and I just, like, again, just, like, plant down. And I'm like, okay, I'm operating from a place that I don't want to. I sound like a crazy person right now. I'm not being myself. I'm being, like, not. I'm being, like, irrational or I'm being unkind because I'm just emotional. So when you kind of, like, root your Feet to the ground, actually doing a physical action. I talk about my book Disruptor, all about pattern interrupt. Like when you're like in these like high, like moments you have, it's like, it's like a baby crying. Whenever your baby cries, like, you have to change the position. You have to like go outside or you have to take the baby and like, look. Oh, look at that. You know, kind of like pattern interrupt. Their like escalation. Because shit escalates quickly, right?

Yes.

So when we escalate quickly in our minds, we pattern interrupt really fast. But it's as simple as like walking outside and walking back in and taking a second. So just all these little things, I have these reminders in my phone. So I would suggest those. Those things to do too. Just put so good reminders in your phone.

Oh my gosh. So much good information today. Okay. Where do people find you? I know, I just looked literally as I'm talking to you, I know you can get your book on Amazon. I'm assuming anywhere books are sold. Is Amazon the best place or where do they go for your book? Does it wrap to work?

Yep, Amazon. So you can go. My first book is called do cool shit with the subtitle. Quit your day job, start your own business and live happily ever after.

Love it.

And that's really about how to really come up with your business idea. How to raise money for the first time, how to get pressed for the first time. Everything I did to go from step zero to step one in business, in life. So that's like, dude, that's it. And then disrupt her. It's basically, it's a manifesto for the modern woman. And it's looking at 13 major areas in our lives where we just need disruption. Like our career, money, the concept of needing more stuff like perfectionism, like, you know, even feminism, patriarchy, and all the shit we can't talk about. Yeah, it's just like just facing all these uncomfortable subjects and being able to find alignment and power within all the major areas in our lives. So that's sort of, it's just disrupting everything.

The tissue paper thing.

Hellotushy.com hellotushy.com and then definitely check out my Instagram page in Agrawal. I would love that as I'm sort.

Of like building it up.

And then, and then I just launched a monthly. So just a once a month blog called Mickey's Monthly Musings.

Okay.

And then you can just literally, if you go to mickeyagrawal.com, there's a subscribe button in the top bar. You can just subscribe there.

Got it. Oh my gosh. So awesome following you on Instagram right now everyone. If you liked this episode please comment, rate, review, screenshot it and show share it. Especially on Instagram. Tag Mickey, tag me so we can see that you you liked it and share your thoughts with us. And thank you Mickey. I'm so excited. I thank you for doing this today.

Thank you so much for having me. It's been so fun.

Thanks for leveling up with us today. Please share this episode if you found it helpful so others can join in. And don't forget to hit that subscribe so you don't miss out on future future shows. And if you would leave me a five star review. I appreciate those so much. I read all of them and it's how I know that I'm giving you information that you find valuable and come interact with me over on Instagram at Natalie Jill Fit I read all the direct messages and comments over there. Make it a great day. Creating everything from nothing.

Sam.