Cancer to Clean Living: How Food, Stress, Toxins, and GLP 1s Can Change Everything with Jen Delvaux

So what do you do if you've been listening to the benefits of hormone replacement, you've been listening to the benefits of higher protein, but you've had a scary diagnosis, you have had breast cancer, and maybe it's not active now, but you went through it and you were thrown into early menopause, and you've got all the symptoms going on that we hear about with midlife women, but it can be scary. And you see contradicting research and contradicting opinions about, can you still do hrt, should you do hrt? And then also adding in the idea of high protein, especially animal protein. We hear so many contradicting opinions around that, like, oh, you enter into midlife, you should be upping your animal protein. But what about cancer? What if you've had the scary diagnosis and you're navigating that? And are there other ways to stay lean, to stay strong, to preserve bone, to preserve all these things that we hear about declining when we don't do HRT or don't eat animal protein? What can we do there and do GLPs? We GLP1s have a place to support this. I cannot wait for this conversation today. I have my friend Jen on now. Jen is the host of Not Today Cancer, which is a fascinating podcast to listen to. Now, Jen did not choose to be a cancer expert or even a midlife expert when it comes to hormones and GLPs, but she was thrown into early menopause and a very scary diagnosis. And she's navigated all this. She's researched to the degree, and she's very aware of all the topics that I've discussed on this show. So I wanted to get a real life life. How did you navigate this? What did you learn? Why did you make these choices? So thank you so much for being here today, Jen.

I am so excited to be here and to talk through all of this.

Yes. Okay. So I don't even know where to start, but I'm going to start at the diagnosis because I would have considered you and me very similar. Like. Like how we worked out our mindset, our nutrition are, like, doing all the healthy things, and then, bam, you got a scary diagnosis. What happened? How did that happen?

It was shocking. Like, I was not expecting it. I thought, there's no way. I just. A quick background cancer journey actually began in 2009 when my husband was diagnosed with brain cancer. So we've navigated his brain cancer over the years. He's had three brain surgeries, two rounds of chemo, and radiation. He's Doing really well, but dealing with long term side effects because he's this miracle. Like literally he's a miracle. And so now he's dealing with these side effects that people don't even live long enough to experience.

Wow.

So his last brain surgery was in 2019. Went through the second round of radiation, which radiation to the brain definitely causes some issues. Then 20, 21, I go in for a routine mammogram and get called back. And I remember when she called me, she was like, do you wanna know which breast? And I was like, sure. And in my head I was like, she's gonna say my left. I know she's gonna say my left. And she said, it's your left. Even though I never felt anything. That was so weird to me.

So no lumps, no things that you would find on your. And then what did she see on the mammogram, specifically?

So I got called back for the second and they, you know, they bring you through. You do the repeat mammogram and if they see something there, then they bring you to the ultrasound. And if they see something there, then they call in the doctor. So when they called in the doctor, I knew I was in trouble. I knew I was in trouble. So, yeah, it was invasive ductal carcinoma, stage one, grade two breast cancer, ERP positive, HER2 negative. And it literally rocked my world. Like, I have never been so scared in my life because I think I'm the provider for the family. I take care of everyone, I take care of my husband. And I'm like, wait a minute, what's going to happen if something happens to me? And when you get a diagnosis, anybody that knows, when you hear cancer, you literally think your life is over.

Oh, yeah. And plus, you had kind of had this identity, a different identity than your husband. So he was the cancer person. You're like, wait a minute, where is this coming from? Now, before I go further on this, I want to just kind of ask your opinion on mammograms because that's another controversial topic where people say, no, mammograms can detect things that aren't really, you know, scary. Like they just scare you. But it's not. Mammograms can cause it. And people have been recommending, you know, breast MRI or ultrasound or what is your opinion and experience there?

Yeah, I know there's a lot of controversy out there about mammograms and radiation and you shouldn't do it. And I'm, for me personally, I have done a lot of research on this too. And I found my breast cancer due to a mammogram. Because of a mammogram. And if I had not gotten it, they, had they not caught it, I would be in serious trouble because it was a grade two. So it was a little bit more of an aggress. Had some aggressive characteristics to it. So I don't know where I would have been had I not. So I am under the impression that mammograms are the best way to right now to check for breast cancer. Even if you have dense breasts, you might want to add on an ultrasound with it. But the radiation is. From what I'm understanding, what I've looked at is the same as taking a flight across country. Okay, so we're all going to travel, right? Like, yeah, it's once a year getting this mammogram. Yes, there is. And I know that there's some studies out there that do show it can cause breast cancer, but there's so many more that it catches early.

Okay, makes sense.

Yeah.

Yeah. I had a. Do Dr. Jen Simmons on a while back and I'll.

And I'll.

I'll mention that in here. And she had this, you know, and I don't. Again, I don't know. I interview and get different opinions and different takes. And I encourage everyone to do their own research here. She had this whole take that sometimes it. It picks things up that would just resolve on their own or go away. So I don't know. I don't know. And I feel like this is a conversation everyone needs to just on their own go with how they feel it best serves them. I don't believe there's like a one cookie cutter cutter way. That's my.

I agree 1000%. You whatever. I've always said this and whatever you do, you have to believe to the core that you're making the right decision on that. You can't waiver on whatever you're doing. Because I believe. Our belief is so powerful.

So what did you choose to do? To address it and treat it and has it come back? What did you do?

No, thank God. I knock on wood. I went through. I had a lumpectomy and then I had radiation and there was. Chemo was on the table. But my. Just because of the aggressive characteristics. And there's an oncotype score and my oncotype score was in that gray area. Probably should do chemo. So for a while I thought I was going to do it or for a couple weeks. And then my doctor felt comfortable if we shut down my Ovaries. So throwing me into menopause overnight with Zoladex injections and then putting me on an aromatase inhibitor, which is a hormone blocking med for those that are in menopause. So there's tamoxifen, but that's for people that have not gone through menopause yet. And then aromatase inhibitors are for those that have gone through menopause. But I was forced into it overnight dealing with the lovely side effects.

So this is really, gosh, I feel for you and I understand it a lot more now being on the other side of menopause, like having not having a period. Most of us in menopause or perimenopause, we have this luxury. I mean, you don't. We can describe it as luxury, but it's just like gradual decline and change. Right. So you have the changes, but it's still. It doesn't just yank it all out of you. You went from like, I've got all the hormones to like, not only do I not have them, I'm going to stop anything from working here. So my gosh, mentally and physically, what did that do? Like this quick overnight, pull the band.

Aid off into menopause. It was the hot flashes and the night sweats were like unbelievable. I'd never experienced anything like it. Like. But honestly, I'm. What am I. I'm close to four years out. It'll be four years February 21st or 22nd. But I, I don't deal with anything anymore. I don't deal with any menopausal issues. I feel like diet played a big role in it. Exercise, hydrating, like there's things that you can do. And of course, you know, when you are first ERP or positive breast cancer, all of the do scare you to death to never ever take a hormone. So you just. So what? I'm a researcher. So I just started researching what can I do. And I looked at different foods that can help minimize menopausal symptoms. And I, and I looked at the exercise that I could do and you know, like getting your sleep, there's so many things that you can do to actually help with those levels. And I think also some women experience worse menopausal symptoms than others. And maybe I'm just more fortunate that mine weren't as bad.

What did you. Because you, I know you're up to speed on research around HRT and you're very aware that some doctors are not educated when it comes to that and they just assume. So where was your take on that? Did you Try challenge it at all. Were you clear you didn't want to do it? Like, how was your journey there? Because there's a lot of women with estrogen positive cancers that have chosen to still do it. And you could find doctors supporting that that could actually be preventative. So where did you research and how did you like, end up coming to your decision that you're not going to do it?

Well, the first couple years I was sc Every doctor will scare you about it. And then obviously all this emerging research about HRT and I kept thinking about, okay, this is the sad part about breast cancer. Most women don't die from breast cancer. They die from the aftermath of, you know, not having estrogen in our body and maybe the treatment, that's what typically they die from, from cardiovascular disease and fractures and bone health, like Alzheimer's. Like, all these things can happen when we don't have estrogen in our bodies. So I was very scared of this and I didn't know what to do. And I researched it and researched it and I was like thinking, I'm going to start taking this. And I decided to do some testing first. I worked with a naturopath and we ran test and by the way, vaginal estrogen, I take vaginal estrogen is totally safe. This has helped so much with because when you obviously don't have estrogen, it affects your bladder, it affects vaginal dryness, it affects everything. And that doesn't just like get to a point and then it just, it stays there. It gets worse and worse and worse where you have atrophy. So that is something we can all use vaginal.

It doesn't get systemic. Right.

It just seems correct so that I take and I can't imagine my life without it. And then. But regular hrt, I did testing and I really recommend everyone take the Dutch complete test. In fact, I think it's like when women or girls, like when you're 18, when you're 18, this should be required and probably one day it will because you literally learn how your body works. And I learned that my estrogen metabolizes down the wrong pathway. So when we actually looked at my printout of the test, I was like, oh, no wonder I had a diagnosis.

Wow. Okay. So this is interesting too, because another. I mean, gosh, I sometimes I feel for my listeners because I bring so many great experts on and then. But we get conflicting information and it's confusing. And I always say we got to be our own health detective and learn all the sides. And then you kind of intuitively have to do what feels right to you. Depending on who I interview. Doctors absolutely love the Dutch test and switch. Swear by what you just said. And some say it's pointless. There's no research. It gets very confusing for people. Yeah, I just, I haven't heard. Yeah, I just interviewed Kelly Caspersan. She's amazing. And she didn't say it's bad, but she just says it's kind of a waste of money. Like you don't need it. It doesn't, it doesn't help. Which is interesting because I always use Dutch test too. I'm curious how it metabolizes. So it is confusing for people to know, like, do I do this? Do I not do it? And that test is not covered by insurance. So it is an out of pocket, pretty pricey, crazy test.

Yeah. I actually understand, I think what Kelly's saying and I love Kelly Casterson. She's amazing. I mean all these doctors that have come out, she's incredible. But I think what she's saying is because yes, the majority of women probably should be on hrt. The fear of breast cancer that we've, you know, from our doctors. And after getting it, you have so much fear. And I think for me, what it did is it gave me like a peace of mind that, okay, I'm not going to do this now and it's still not forever. And in fact, I also have testosterone sitting here that I haven't taken yet. And I don't know why, but I still have it. Yeah. But just because I've seen some studies that that testosterone could potentially turn into. Yes. And so there's just, you know, I think anybody who's gone through breast cancer understands.

Yeah, it makes sense.

You know, it's just this tricky situation. And for me, it just made that if I learned in that Dutch test that my estrogen was metabolizing properly, I would totally be taking HRT right now.

Totally. That makes sense. And you know, I've definitely thought about that with mine because my Dutch test shows like what yours does it. Mine does not metabolize. Right. So for me and who has not had breast cancer, knock on wood. But I choose to do estrogen replace as a patch. But the low, a very low dose. I don't go to the higher I do enough to bring me up to just the levels that gets me out of symptoms. That's my personal choice. Because of a similar reason that you said there just as the.

And I think, and honestly, I think microdosing that. So I was on testosterone and progesterone prior to my diagnosis, too. So I think that's why in my mind, I have a little bit of fear attached to it. And I know I had the pellet testosterone, which is too much. And so, you know, I always go back to that. And I think whenever it's a medication, it should be low and slow. And it still frustrates me so much. Medications aren't individualized that there are some, like, speaking of hormone blocking meds, there's tamoxifen and there's aromatase inhibitors, and it's one dose for everyone. How could that. How could that be? I'm, you know, 115 pounds. How could I be the same as a woman who's £300 or two? And so that's why I truly believe that because after two years, and not that this happens to anybody, everyone. So if you're on an AI, this does not mean this is going to happen. I was thrown into osteoporosis. This.

Wow.

After two years of being on it, like, they said they've never seen anything so rapid in their life. And then they wanted me to go on another drug. And I'm like, nope, I'm hopping off this hamster wheel.

Yeah.

And I'm doing this on my own. And, and, and after a year of being off of it, I was able to. And again, I'm not a doctor. I'm not a doctor. I'm just sharing my experience. But then I was able to stop that decline and reverse it a baby amount. I'm still working up, but yeah.

So now you did not have a mastectomy or did you? You just. You did the lumpectomy and you did. You did not do ch chemo. Did you do radiation? Did you do anything else?

Radiation.

Okay, got it.

Yeah.

Okay. Totally get your stance on HRT for you and what you personally chose. And what did you decide? Let's jump into, like, kind of the higher protein. Now, you used to eat very similar to what we hear is ideal women. You ate higher animal protein, lower carb, healthy fats. Like, you were not, definitely not a vegan. What made you switch to being vegan? How hard was that? What did you notice? Help us with that?

So when you have that cancer diagnosis, you feel like you've lost all control. And I said that in my head. I was like, the only thing I can control right now is what I put into my body. That's where I can control the most. And I thought back to what was I eating prior to my diagnosis. And, you know, I wasn't eating that, it really wasn't healthy because I was living on protein bar protein shakes.

I was so not natural protein.

You were eating. No, no, no. I did do animal protein, but again I wasn't. It was like turkey burgers and you know what I mean? It wasn't.

You weren't having steak and fish and.

I'm not having grass. No, it was not. It was literally to fit in the skinny jeans and just to get enough protein and no, no fruit because God forbid fruit has sugar. Like it was ridiculous.

So you were not eating actually an unprocessed diet. You were eating a processed diet but getting the right macros. That's how I describe it.

Exactly. So I decided to go. I followed a couple people that had gone through cancer and how they had gone whole food plant based. And so I am not. There are so many unhealthy vegan out there.

Yes.

I do not get packaged vegan food. I make everything myself. I do a lot of organic non GMO soy. Yes, it is safe. There's a lot of people who fear soy. There's no need to fear soy.

Which is probably also helping with some of your estrogen deficient symptoms.

It does. And it helps totally with menopausal symptoms. The phytoestrogens actually can combat the bad estrogen in our body. And there's studies to show like women in Asia, before the western diet was introduced, breast cancer didn't exist and menopause didn't exist in Asia.

Okay.

Because they consume a lot of soy. So that's my legumes. I eat a ton of beans. I eat a lot of bowls. I make a lot of bowls. I still don't do like a lot of bread or carbs like that. It's whole grain. It's. If I do. So I eat a diversity of food. Tons of fruit, tons of vegetables. I do make sure I'm getting enough protein, but it's through nuts and legumes and soy and tempeh and you know.

So in fairness for people listening, we don't know know for sure I'm. And correct me if I'm wrong, we don't know for sure if it was the switching to the unprocessed natural food or if it was being strict on no animal protein. They both probably contributed. But someone could argue and say, well, if you had done all the unprocessed but added in lean grass fed meat, you might have had those that same shift. Maybe. We don't know.

Totally. And I'm not against that either. And I mean I, for some reason, for me, I'm just not a big meat eater to begin with.

Exactly. Yes.

And so it wasn't that difficult for me. And I do have wild caught fish or seafood when I'm traveling. When I can get it, I live in. I don't, I don't trust seafood here. So.

A little bit pescatarian maybe.

A little bit pescatarian, yeah. Okay.

So that, so if I'm hearing correct, it's the unprocessed part that really made the difference. Giving up the. And then also she did cut out animal protein. But one could argue that possibly if you're eating the clean. Because I believe this link with animal protein and cancer, it's. They're not talking about the, the organic grass fed stuff. They're talking about the highly processed junk. So. Yes, that's what I believe. Like. Yeah, you have like caged, you know, chickens with lots of antibiotics and hormones. There's an argument for that. But when you're at eating the free range, I could see the difference there. Now there is a whole other part about burnt meat and stuff like that with a glycation. Like that's a whole nother carcinogen right there. So it's also, it's looking at how our meat is, I would imagine.

Yeah. And not only that, it's even how we cook our all, all foods. You don't want to burn foods. Like I've learned even like roasting vegetables. I used to roast everything at 400. I never go above 350 now.

Because the glycation. Because of that. Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's. And it's challenging. I know. I love grilled meat and it's like. But you, it's almost impossible to not have that crispy part on top. So it's like, it's challenging. Like I feel like you almost have to boil it or broil it. Like you can't. You have to be so careful or braise it. You know, it's just, it's hard to get it in that perfect, perfect. That perfect place. But great insight there.

I thought about like back. Because it's a known carcinogen that.

Yeah.

That burnt part out of. And I used. That used to be my favorite part of the chicken.

Yeah, of course. Yeah, we all love that part.

Right?

It's. That's the challenge there for sure.

Yeah.

I mean I just started eating steak again and I know we do it on our, on our grill and it's like, I'm like, I don't, you know, you had to avoid that crisp, just low and slow.

It's. You can grill. You can grill. And I. I had a. Somebody on my podcast and he's great. And he was. It's low and slow. He still likes to use his grill. It's just. Yeah, it takes a little bit longer.

Yeah, that's true. Okay, let's talk about what you figured out with GLP is because this is a kind of a fascinating twist that I had not heard about for this.

So my biggest is the lack of estrogen in my body and what it does to our brain health, what it does to our cardiovascular health, and what it does to our bones and more. I mean, so much more. And I've been scared for a while, like, unsure of what to do. And I remember listening to actually an episode that Chalene had done with Dr. Tina and it was on GLP1s. And I was like, wait a minute, is this something that I could take? And I started doing a deep dive research on it. But it took me a while because I was, you know, there's so much, like, praise out there and like, shame of women who did take it. And, you know, so I was kind of confused. And then I started working with a naturopath and doing that testing and. And then I said, what. What are your thoughts on me doing a GLP1? Because it was in my ear 24 7. I was listening to podcasts on it, and I learned, you know, how protective it is in cardiovascular and can. I mean, it's mind blowing and for our brain health. And it's insane. And so I just dove into it and inflammation, like, inflammation, inflammation infl. Like so many things. Bone health, like, are you kidding me? I went into osteoporosis. Like, what it can do and what the emerging research is showing is truly unbelievable.

But there's a one. The. One of the big interesting problems is, like what you said earlier. For most people, it comes in those pens or at a prefix dosing, and it's not a one size fits all. And it's almost. It's too much for many people.

Totally. And I. There's no way I could have done even the smallest dose. So I worked with her and I was like, let me try it out. And so we are doing. I'm doing semaclotide and we are doing a third of the starting dose.

Yeah.

And. And let me tell you, the other thing is I thought, oh, is it going to be super expensive? I thought to get your hands on this, it was going to be really expensive. But when you're Working with a compounding pharmacy. It's not actually not.

Yeah.

I think mine is a hundred and like eighty dollars for like three months supply. That's crazy.

No, that's amazing. And what did you feel doing it? Like what?

Yeah, what did you know?

And what changes did you see?

The first thing I noticed in that first week was all of a sudden I had a clear head. I feel like I always have kind of had ADD or adhd. Like my brain is always going a million miles an hour. And I also feel in my house there's a little bit of stress when you've got. You've got you yourself as cancer and then your husband has brain cancer and you're trying to like, you know, keep everything together. And I just feel like all of that weight, it's been lift it. Like I'm just happier. It's weird. Darren will say it too. I definitely noticed the food noise went away because I'm a snacker and I, you know. Oh, and. And even like going into menopause. Not that I gained a ton of weight. Yeah, but you just felt like thicker and I could feel that. So I felt like that was going away. The. I could feel like the inflammation going away. Even though it's weird, you can't feel it, but I just felt less inflamed. But I think this thing I noticed was mentally happier clear head. I think that's the biggest thing for me. No food noise.

I know I talk about GLPs a lot on my show lately because I'm so irked about the judgment around them, because it's kind of like you wouldn't judge somebody for taking insulin, for being type 1 diabetic, and our body already makes JLPs and some people are very deficient. Whether you're looking at it for obesity, which I do believe it's a disease. When you look at obesity, it's not just work out harder and eat better. When you look at it for that, it's groundbreaking. But even more so at lower doses, the research really seems supports this break on inflammation, on getting your A1C down. All the metabolic markers that are creating disease and issues. These low, slow doses are really, really groundbreaking. So, you know when people are saying, oh, this is so dangerous. This is like, I feel like they have not looked at any of the research, like, really, truly the results. Because I think it's people feeling threatened about their jobs and that's why they're saying that, honestly.

Yeah, I think it's weird. It could. Because honestly, there is, of course there's you know, a risk to, I guess, everything, anything. But the people who are having, you know, issues with it, first of all, they're not on a low dose. They're not micro dosing. They're also not changing their diet. They're also not exercising. They're on too high of a dose. They're not working with a doctor. I mean, there's some people, sadly, that are like just getting this off the Internet, like. Yeah, that is insane.

Scary. Yeah.

Yeah. You definitely have to be working with the doctor if you're going to be doing this and making sure that you're. This isn't just a quick fix to lose some pounds. This is hopefully going to change your life and, and getting you to get, get better eating habits because you aren't. A lot of us, I think, do have that food noise where we're constantly thinking about food because this is what the world did to us with ultra processed food that's like poisoned and it makes us all addictive to it. So I mean, it's crazy what that does, but it's, it'll help you get on this good path. But then you have to do the things to help with this as well, like lifting and, you know, eating healthy and looking at what you're eating, protein and fiber and healthy fats in each meal, like, like, you know, that's why it's important to work with somebody through it.

No, I agree. Now, so you don't have any menopausal symptoms right now because of how you've changed things, which is amazing. Did you notice a correlation with when you finally dialed these things in? The symptoms went away or how. What was your, like kind of your progress through that?

I think it was about a year after I went and forced into menopause that I really, I wasn't dealing with the hot flashes and then when I did the vaginal estrogen, I wasn't dealing with those issues. But this, the GLP one, what's the this. This has just changed how I feel mentally and then, and, and getting rid of the food noise. So it's like almost like that final piece. But I also think it gives me peace for the future because I've always had so much fear around not having estrogen in my body and what that could do for longevity. You know, reasons like I, like I, that's always been my biggest worry is like a cardiovascular event or something. And knowing that I have this in me that can be cardio protective is, is, is truly, you know, unbelievable and just feels good. In fact, we're thinking about doing this for Darren.

Wow.

We're talking to his doctors because there's so much neuroprotective and neuroplasticity reduces inflammation in the brain and he deals with long term side effects and memory issues. And you know, there's new research showing this can help with Alzheimer's and Parkinson's and so many things. Yeah. I feel like a miracle drug.

Totally now, right?

Done.

Yeah, done. Right, done right. When you do too much for the wrong reasons and you just like. Where I think it goes wrong is too high of a dose dose and people start having all those side effects. They are doing it and they're just not eating, which you just don't eat and you rapidly lose weight. That's not going to be healthy. You'll lose right muscle, then you lose bone. There's like a whole. But if you do it and do the right habits, I think it can be life changing for people.

Yeah. And I definitely noticed that my first week on it, I was like, kind of felt it a little bit more where I was like I had to make myself. I wanted to make sure I was getting the right protein and, you know, healthy fats. Like I wanted to. I. Because I, I don't want to lose muscle. No, of course that's when people are losing muscle, is when they're not eating enough protein and they're.

Yeah, yeah. What about. I want to talk about something a little bit different here. I want to add on to this. I want to talk about toxins because you're one of the first people I noticed starting to clean up all of that. What's your journey been with that and what have you learned?

Yeah, it's definitely an evolving journey. So it's so. Because a lot of people when they start this, they get so overwhelmed and they're like, oh my gosh, what's the point? Or people think, you know, I've been doing this forever and I'm fine. But it's that whole rain barrel effect that you don't understand when your body is going to reach that point where it's overflowing and that's when disease comes, happens in the body. So I think like the most important things to look at is number one, your environment, the air quality. Like where you spend the most time, which I'm at home is how is your air quality so important? Is the air we breathe opening up your window for 20 minutes a day, even in the winter, just getting in that fresh air, getting outside. So I think number one, you know, even Getting a filter, maybe with a HEPA filter. Second thing is water is the hydration, the water you're drinking. It's really sad, but there's a lot of garbage in, in just regular water. So you've got to make sure you've got a good filtration system. With that I think you start getting rid of candles. Candles, sadly candles.

Yep.

Are real bad. Anything scented. There is a study out there. New this was out maybe this summer it came out, but was a 28 day study where they actually took tissue from the breast. And for when you remove parabens and phthalates for 28 days it turns the breast cancer genes off. Wow, 28 days. So that's why people have to understand you can make changes pretty quickly. And so that's just making sure like you're really looking at your products that you're using, what you're putting on your skin. The skin is the largest organ of our body and what we put on our skin matters. So I cleaned up my skincare, my makeup, like everything, deodorant, everything you can imagine I've cleaned up. And it's, you know, taken some time getting rid of non toxic cookware that has eos, the forever chemicals. It's basically the worst thing in the world. Just go buy some all clad or the one cast iron is good too.

We use cast iron and then the all the pure. Like just the pure metal.

Stainless steel. Yeah. And you could get it like people are like, it's so expensive. All Clad is. Yes. But you can get it at homegoods or wherever you can get a cheap.

You know, it's more expensive of being sick and getting on.

Exactly.

That's the, that's the. When people say that, I'm like, I think the biggest problem with the All Clad is you have to use a lot of fat to cook. That's the bigger issue because otherwise everything sticks.

Yeah.

So that's. I feel like that would be the, the more pain. But we. You got to find workarounds on that to make it right. Which makes sense. So. But I'm sure like what are your toxins? You kind of choose because we pick and choose our battles. Right.

Like do you totally.

Or some things you still do or what?

How did you. Yes. And I will get some, some harsh criticism from this and I'm like, you know what, listen, I. You have to live your life. You have to do what makes you happy and you don't have to follow me if you want to know. I still get my nails done and I Get my hair colored. I'm not going to go gray. And so, yes, I still do those things. I wear lashes, like, what makes me feel good. Yes, those things are toxic. But you also have to live your life. And I preach this all the time to women in my cancer community and women that I talk to. We can't be in a cancer bubble. I was in it for a little bit where we're so scared to live totally. That we don't do anything. I remember I was being visiting, actually, Shleen. She's like, dude, you gotta get out of this bubble. Because I was afraid. Afraid of everything. And we can get to that point, and it's. Yeah, that's not healthy. None of us know what's gonna happen. None of us.

No. I certainly didn't have a cancer diagnosis, but when I was living in the black mold and then learned I had an implant rupture, and I did my toxin testing and I saw how many I had in me, I went into a bubble as well and, like, started just eliminating everything. There's a pendulum. So I understand what you mean about kind of coming back halfway through. And what I decided, and I think it sounds like you're doing this too, is lessen as much as you can. You pick your poisons. Like, okay, what are the things? And we. It sounds like we have similar things. Like, I'm like, I'm still coloring my hair, and I'm going to get my nails. I had nothing on my nails for a year, and I have nails again. I'm like, I can't. For me, it's my thing.

Yes.

So. And people really mean. Because I had removed the implants, they thought I was somehow all natural. Granola girl. I'm like, I never said that. I never said that. But what I think is really critical is to get your body an optimal state where it knows how to eliminate toxins. Like, so, yes, you get more efficient at that. Because I do think when we're unhealthy, we are not eliminating those toxins the way that we should be. And what are your takes on alcohol?

Okay, so this is a good one. This was tough for me, too. I mean, this was the hardest thing for me to overcome. And not that I was ever an alcoholic, but that's. Alcohol's how I was. Like, that's what we did. We'd go out to dinner, we'd have wine, we'd entertain. We'd family get togethers. There'd always be wine. Like, it was just part of our lives. And Darren and I like, Four times a week, we're drinking. And after my diagnosis, before my research, I remember actually calling my oncologist. Just. I'm so embarrassed this still to this day. Yeah, I remember calling her because she wanted me to take these Zoladex injections. And I'm like, listen, I can't drink alcohol when I'm doing these Zoladex injections. Not even realizing that high. There's like a connection with breast cancer. So slowly I took that off my plate for the most part. For the most part. And I mean, like, I drink, like occasionally if I'm on vacation, if I'm celebrating something, if I want to. But to be honest with you, I don't even really care for it anymore. I might even just order to have it there. But that's the other thing with the GLP1. This is weird. So I would be at a restaurant with friends or whatever and want one, but I just didn't. And I was fine, but I wanted it. I was with a group of people and we were out to dinner, and I was like, I don't even want it. And that's a lot that shows with.

GLP is it helps knock addiction and helps not cravings. Not just food addiction or cravings. It's like anything that we feel this because with low GLP in your brain, you do have a dysregulated craving because sense so four things. So that makes sense that that would help knock that out.

I know. And so I don't. It's just not really part of me anymore. And, you know, you just have to create a new normal and a new fun and do something different. Darren and I will make little mocktails all the time. Like, I have fun with that, and so it still feels like I'm having fun. And I. And I don't need the alcohol.

So now, knowing what you know now, what would you have done differently? Do you think you could have avoided the cancer, do you think? And I know I don't ask this to shame people that have cancer. That's not why I'm asking. I guess I'm ask for the woman that doesn't have it yet. They don't have a diagnosis of this. What do you want them to know? Like, what can they do? What should they be looking at and doing?

Well, I'll tell you what. This is absolutely one of my favorite questions ever. And I think people do sometimes feel like you're blaming me or shaming me. It's the most powerful question you can ask yourself because it gets you to understand what you could do differently. And it empowers you for the future of the changes you can make. So. Oh, gosh, yes. There's so many things I wish I was doing. I definitely wish I wasn't drinking alcohol as much. I do feel like that. I feel like stress was a huge contributing factor. I'm type A personality. I never slowed down. I never dealt with the stress of Darren's diagnosis. I never cried. I was just like, I got this. Like, we got this. Let's keep going. You know, I just never.

You describe, like all of our friends right now. Like, that's how. Right, right. Just tough it through. Just go.

Yeah. And I never understood, like, the power of slowing down and doing meditation, breath work. Like, that has been instilled into me since my diagnosis. And the other thing is, like, I never stopped to look around. Like, we. That's one of the beautiful things that come from a diagnosis is you actually look at the world differently. You look at the sky and the clouds and the sun and the snow, Everything looks different after a diagnosis and you appreciate it so much more so that just slowing down. Minimizing ultra processed food. My goodness gracious. You know, like, I think about all the foods I was eating just the garbage to. To look skinny, although I was so unhealthy. But I think stress is probably a really big one that we don't even understand. You may not even realize, but with our phones, with social media, we're constantly like bombarded with ding, ding, you know, text message. I've got to do. Yeah. And so you have to take time to decompress.

Wow. Okay, that's. That's. What, what about your thoughts on, I think UX planted like me, correct?

Yes.

What are your thoughts looking back on breasts, implants?

You know, I don't know. I never thought that I got my diagnosis from my implants. I don't. And the reason why I had my implants out is. And it's weird, like, I didn't care once I had my diagnosis. I'm like, take my implants, do a mastectomy, Whatever you need to do. And she said, no, we can just wanted it out.

You just wanted it out.

She was like, no, we could just do a lumpectomy, but when you do radiation on a breast that has an implant, that's not good. So that breast was just super enlarged. And they're like, we're gonna have to replace that implant. And I was like, no, let's just take them both out. I mean, here's the bottom line. It's a foreign object. Bodies. And our bodies, the cells in our bodies are going to try to heal that instead of healing something else.

That's how I feel. And you just explained it in a different way than I would explain it.

But it's.

So when people ask me about implants and, or they get defensive of theirs and I had them for 33 years, so believe me. And I had five sets. So I was the defender of implants, like thinking. But what I realize now is every time we're adding a foreign thing or a toxin to our environment, or whether it's alcohol or whether, whether that's the scented candles or it's the foreign implant in us, you are overloading your body's clean out system with more things to deal with. So then when you do get exposed to other things, like there's just no room to keep dealing with it. So I feel that we overload. So it's not a judgment thing on like, oh, you shouldn't have. But you just have to take that into consideration. And when I look at my inflammation levels in my blood work and then just even visibly on my body after removing them, it's like night and day, day. And I also had high elevated liver numbers for quite some time. And I know that had something to do with it.

I did too. I had a, my, my levels were so bad. Even when my, my naturopath who I'm working with, she had looked at my levels about six months prior, I was still on the aromatase inhibitor. And I mean I was a mess. And now I'm like, my levels are, she's like, you're in that small percentage of being metabolically healthy.

I'm like, so good, so good. I love all of you. This, what do you want somebody to know that is newly diagnosed and they're scared and they, maybe they found this interview because of that. Where do you, where do you want them to start? What do they need to know?

They need to just go slow. Just go slow. Don't react out of fear. You know, I think we, most of us, most of us that get a diagnosis, we have time, we have time to make an informed decision to get the right doctors to really have a truly understanding of what you're going through. I even think, you know, we don't get second and third opinions. And I can guarantee you if your doctor got a diagnosis, sometimes we feel bad, like, oh, I don't want to offend the doctor. If your doctor got a diagnosis, they would also get second and third opinions because, you know, Then if you've got two or three doctors recommending the same, you know, plan, then you can feel competent in it. And so I think that, I think slowing down, I think, you know, I, I mean, this is why I created. I actually created a blueprint. It was actually Natalie, like after I had the conversation with you last time, you're like, so what do you have to plug people into? I'm like, well, nothing yet. I created the. Yeah, I created the blueprint. And it's from results to rising and everything in between. And I talk a lot about the fear because there's so much fear. So you need to have something that can be calming. And for me too, that was that meditation. I remember not being. I was just frozen. I didn't even know it was after Covid and I didn't know how I was going to be able to drive myself to one of the appointments. And I thought, like, what am I going to do? How am I going to have it? I grabbed my phone and I just searched meditations in the apps and I found one through unplug and it was a meditation called your superpower calm. And that meditation stuck with me for all I mean to still. To this day, I still do. In fact, I record meditations now. It was the one piece of it that literally saved me.

Wow, I love that you're talking about this. I've had different guests on that have navigated cancer and different opinions, but I think that is has been a strong thread with the idea of grounding yourself more, being more present. In fact, I recently interviewed Maria King. I don't know if you heard that interview I'm mind but I loved it. Okay. Yeah, so she said very much that like to her, she felt kind of like this wake up call and this like she's talked to her tumor. Like she's literally like, what do I need to learn from this? And her big, big awakening is about being more spiritual and being more grounded. And she's navigated a stage four colon cancer. So it's. It was aggressive. But how she has really made peace with that and found comfort and healing in. In what you're talking about is really wild. Where I think the type A tendency is just to go get it out right now and strict food. And what's my answer? Like it's this, this extreme, right. And there's this really beautiful place that some of you have shared that has, has saved you. I have some other friends right now. I have a one friend in particular really navigating cancer and he's not seeing that part yet. And the stuff keeps getting worse and worse and everyone's on their own journey. Right. So it's not for me to say, oh, go do this, but to me, just linking together, listening to you, listening to Maria, I feel that that could be a missing list link.

Totally. We have to have ways to bring ourselves into a parasympathetic state. We have to. And even if it's for, you know, a box breathing. Even. Even. It's for like, you know, 16 seconds. Yeah, just box breathing throughout the day.

What advice do you have for someone that is that type A, that can't get into that, like that really struggles. Do you have like a quick, like, try this first. Like what. How do you, what do you guide them with that?

Definitely guided meditation. Because that's me. That's me. Like, I was the same. I was like, let's get rid of this. What do we have to do? Research. Research. And I couldn't. And so I literally grabbed my phone and I had tried meditating in the past. You know, they say it's good for you. I'm like, I can't sit here. I don't have time for this. It's literally just finding an app that's a guided meditation. And even if you only do it for two minutes, good. Maybe the next day it'll be three minutes. Maybe you're going to realize it's just the breath work. It's literally going within to calm yourself before appointments. You know, I couldn't have gotten through it without it. And I'm not that type. I am not this type.

Have you done anything with 528 Hz music? Have you ever.

Oh, yeah.

Okay. Because to me, that's been pretty life changing. Because I can. I might not be able to like go into meditation music on and close my eyes or go for a walk with it or even while I'm driving. And it instantly like aligns frequency to feel different.

Oh, sound bath. There's nothing like it. A sound bath. Yes. And I tell people that too. Instead of type A personalities, we always have to have something in our ears. We want to be listening to something, educating ourselves, learning something. And I tell people, turn that off and listen to that. Like 5 to HC or literally don't have anything on.

That's hard. It's got your noise, your brain noise.

I know, but when you're walking around, it's so good for us. Just for a couple minutes.

Yeah, that's good. A little couple rapid fire, like unconventional. Just so curious now. What do you think of taking, like, CBD oil, which to me, like, if. And maybe I'm. And I'm totally willing to be challenged here. So, like, yesterday, recording this now, but yesterday I treated myself to a day at the spa. Like, I wanted a facial and a massage, and it happened to be in the middle of the day. And my type A brain does not shut off in the the day, middle of. Of the day. So for me, I'm like, I will not enjoy. I'll get annoyed by the facial massage unless I drop into that. So for me, I take CBD oil. A lot of it. A lot. And it instantly calls me. Do you have any thoughts on that? Is that dangerous? Is that good?

Like, where do you find that? In my opinion, I haven't done a ton of research on it, but I take it every day.

Oh, you do? Okay, good. So.

Oh, yeah.

I like how it shuts that off without giving you the high. Like, you don't get the. I just shuts off that noise and I can relax.

I realized through testing that I run high. My cortisol always. I'm like, just, like always high. And she's like, we got to bring you down a little bit. So I take something for the adrenals, but also I take happy, or what is it called? Some CBD where it's like a happy gummy. That's what it is. So I take that every morning.

Oh, wow. Okay. So I take mine when I'm, like, winding down or when I want to. Like when I'm, like, deliberately wanting to shut it down. And I.

To me, I.

It's like a dream. Like, I freaking love it. It's like, it's the best thing ever. Okay, what about rapid fire stuff? So I don't know, you're going to, like, think of things like earbuds and then all the WI fi stuff. Like, where do you fall on that?

I know that's a tough one. I don't wear them all the time. I really do.

Mine away.

Yeah, I have some issues with that and what's coming out. I beg my kids. I'm like, please don't have it in all the time. So, no, I worry about that. I worry about our phones. But if you just have your phone in airplane mode by your bed, it's okay. In my opinion, I don't have the watch. I remember actually having the watch, and it affected me. Like, I didn't like it on my wrist. I did get the.

You mean the. I like the. The eye. Whatever it's called. Called that apple Watch.

Apple watch. Yep.

Okay.

And I felt weird. I almost felt like an energy sensation. And my. The ring. I had the. Not the ring con, the other one. Or the ring con. I had the ring con. Or again.

Okay.

I. I always felt like when I was sleeping.

Yeah, I sleep like that with the light. I might wonder about that too. Yes.

Yeah. So I was worried. I was like, oh, my God, Like, I don't think this is good to have this by my head. So I just stopped wearing that, too.

Okay. You know, there's a setting on those, at least if you have aura. Because I wear an aura. Right now there's a setting on your phone to shut up off the ring at night. So then it doesn't transmit anything. So there's that. What about. Okay, this is my other big one that I've, like, played with. I'm curious, your opinions and because you mentioned high cortisol, what's your thoughts on natural sunlight and blue light blocking at night? And do you wear the glasses? Where have you landed there?

Oh, gosh, yes. Natural sunlight as much as you can. It's freezing here. I live in Michigan, but I really try to get outside. I'm always the one to take Phoebe out in the morning just because I know that that's so important. I also think even this is another whole thing. But e. Seeing during the daylight, I think is always really important. But no, I don't have blue light blocking glasses yet, but I really try to keep it dim at night.

Okay. I'm going to introduce you to somebody that put on your podcast about blue light because.

Yes, please.

Fascinating.

Yeah, I want to learn more about that.

There's a lot there that. Gosh. That I've uncovered recently. Just about the importance of. Of having your cortisol naturally raised in the morning with sunlight and then the decline at night and how blue light and all the overhead bright white lights. And even as I'm recording right now, my white LED staring right at me.

Me.

So just the ability to be able to counteract that at night. I see a lot about that and reduction in disease and stuff. So that's. That's a whole wild topic. I was curious what you. What you thought there.

I need to learn more about that.

Yeah. Oh, my gosh, Jen, this was awesome. Thanks for doing this. Where do people go? They're all going to want to learn more from you. So tell us about your podcast on social. Your community. Like, where do they go deeper?

Yes. So I am on Instagram a lot. That is where I spend most of my time. Jen Delvo J E N D E L V A WX Our podcast is Not Today Cancer and my website is jellbo.com yes.

Okay. All things. I love all this. I love that you do all the natural things. I love that you do opposite things than what I teach, especially when it comes to, like, nutrition and hormones. But you, again, walk through something I did not. So I love this information you're sharing. Thank you so, so much.

Thank you for having me.