Exploring Natural Medicine with Dr. Steinke & Dr. Sweetan

Hi, I'm Natalie Jill, fat loss expert turned lifestyle and high performance coach. Welcome to Listen up the podcast. On this podcast, I do what I do best. Taking complicated information that is relevant to us now and breaking it down simply with actionable steps you can implement to level up your life. I also regularly interview some of the most inspiring and courageous men and women on the planet who at their worst, learned how to achieve success greater than anything they ever, ever dreamed possible. Creating everything from nothing. If you are new here, I encourage you to go back and listen from episode one, when this podcast was previously called Leveling up for the Full Transformative Experience. Today on Listen Up, I've got my new friends. They are naturopathic medical doctors, Dr. Sweetien and Dr. Steinke. Now how I met them is really interesting and I love that they are in a practice right down the road from me. When I had broken my foot and went to the urgent care, Dr. Sweetan was there and what I loved about her was she wasn't just making it about my foot, she was asking me so many questions just about my health, my history, all the things. And I thought, who are you and why are you asking me all these questions? This is amazing. I wasn't used to an MD taking this full lifestyle, holistic approach around things. So when she did that, I instantly liked her. We exchanged numbers, we stayed in touch, we became friends. They're now the doctors that I go to and they are my go to for a lot of my questions, a lot of the advanced questions that come in through my community. And because we talk so much about hormones on our own, I thought, let me bring them on, Let me open up the conversation here for all of you. So today's episode is all about hormones. So thank you so much for being here, both of you.

Thank you for having us. We are excited to be here and be part of your community.

Thank you so much.

So for those of us listening, there's a lot listening that don't know what a naturopathic medical doctor is. Can you just kind of give us a rundown on what that is, how that's different than other. Other fields, how it's different than a regular medical doctor, how it's different than a functional medical doctor?

Sure. I mean, both of us can answer this question. Tara, Dr. Steinke wants to chime in. That would be great too. So we attend four year in residence medical schools, just like MDs, just like DOs. We do have to have undergraduate degrees. Tara has one in chemical engineering of all things. And then mine is in Psychology, more of a. Like neuropsychopharmacology, biopsych emphasis. The first two years are very similar. So you focus on biochemistry, anatomy, physiology. Where the shift comes is year three and four because our emphasis is different. We believe in natural medicine. We believe our body has an innate ability to heal itself. We believe that we don't need to go high force, we don't need to go high intensity at first we look for root cause and then most of the time that fixes the problem. But if it's not able to fix the problem, we can do high intensity intervention.

I love that. Now what's the difference? I know. Tara, you had mentioned earlier there's a distinction between functional medicine doctors or naturally path. Path that are not MDs. Can you speak a little bit into that? Yeah.

So a lot of medical doctors, MDs will pursue a functional medicine certification through what's called the I, the International Functional Medicine, the ifm.

I think it's something like that.

We don't have it because we're naturopathic doctors. But. But yeah. So an MD can go down the route of getting certified as a functional doctor. And so they, they really, in honesty, sort of hijacked what we've always done in. And it's great because patients are getting access to the type of care that we provide, which is to look at things from a functional perspective, from the perspective of how is our physiology working and how can we find the root cause of any disruption or imbalance in that physiology. That's what we've always done as naturopathic doctors, as Dr. Sweetan mentioned, looking for the root cause in the physiology and really going down that route rather than looking at things that just mask symptoms. So pharmaceuticals that just treat a certain symptom, or skin things, topical things that treat a certain symptom. We want to look at root cause also. Naturopathic medicine as well as functional medicine looks at things from a whole person perspective. So what are all of the contributing factors that are leading to the disease or the dysfunctional presentation?

And that's what I've loved about the two of you, is that you look at all things and you, you're not attached to one way. You can do homeopathic, you can do natural, you can do, you can do prescriptions. You look at all of it and you figure out what's best for the patient. How did you both get. And I know you have different stories, but I'm curious how you both got into this field. I want to touch on that. And then how you came together and why you decided to join forces.

Want to start?

Yeah. So for me, it was really a culmination of many, many years of getting to the point where I actually discovered naturopathic medicine. I was into, I went vegan, vegetarian, and I was doing things with my own health and well being. And I really wanted to do something in the area of health and wellness, but I didn't know what that looked like. And coming from a scientific background, having an engineering degree, I really wanted it to be science based and sort of at the highest level you could go like, I didn't want to be a functional nutritionist, I didn't want to be a health coach. I really wanted to be, take it to the next level. And I didn't even know what naturopathic medicine was and I stumbled upon it and it just like, I think my head popped off my body when I heard what it was. I actually met two young women who were just starting at naturopathic medical school and they told me, these are the principles, this is what it's about. And I was like, oh my gosh. So it was a culmination of my own health journey as well as seeing friends and family, loved ones really struggle with the mainstream medical paradigm and not getting proper care. So it was kind of from two angles, my own health and then also seeing, really, I hate to say it, but a lot of the dysfunction that exists within that career.

What about you and then me? So I had always wanted to be a doctor since I was a little kid. I got caught playing doctor when I was like five and I was naked and my mother was like, what are you doing? I want to be a doctor. So I entered health care in 1992 in the U.S. navy. I was a corpsman, an EMT. I entered women's health at the same time. I then challenged the California Nursing Board and became a vocational nurse. I did that for many, many years, putting myself through undergrad with the goal of becoming a doctor. What I didn't know is that naturopathic medicine exists and it has existed for a long time because I was stuck in this conventional paradigm. What I quickly learned is that I was pushing pills all the time and I had very little time to connect with humanity. And it broke my heart, to be honest with you. I just thought, there's got to be a better way. Then I had my own health crisis, which you know about because I had discussed it with you in the past. And of course, if I knew then what I know now, I would not have got radioactive iodine. I would have not killed my thyroid. But here I am and doing the best I can with what I have after the fact, with the knowledge that I have. So I was actually studying to apply to an MD program. I always wanted to be like, the best of the best. I'm going to go to Harvard, I'm going to go to Stanford. Then I found out that they opened a naturopathic medical school in San Diego and I could stay with my family. I didn't have to sell my house. I went to an orientation and like Dr. Steinke, I was like, oh my gosh, this is amazing. I can do all the beautiful things that I want to do for people and be a doctor. So I cried all the way home after that orientation. Like, I found my tribe, I found my people, and I never looked back. I applied and here I am.

Now, what I love about both of you is to just a side note, I consider you my friends now. Like when you, when anyone I've sent to you, they walk in and they're like, I feel like I'm talking to my girlfriends. Which is so amazing because I think too, there's a disconnect so many times with traditional doctors where we can feel they're taught we're being talked to, we're being talked at, we're being talked over. And I have not had that experience with your type of practice, which is another amazing, amazing reason I'm all about what you do.

Well, I would add to that, Natalie, our approach is to meet the patient where they're at and work with them. It's not our decision on what you do with your health and well being. It's your decision. We're just there to guide you and give you the information. Based on our education and our experience.

We're conduits. We're partners.

You make a personal responsibility too, which I love.

Yes.

Yeah. Ok, so let's get into this topic of hormones. Because if I were to just take all my programs and say, what is the number one question like over and over and over and over again, it's something about hormones. And I know it's because I deal primarily with women in their 40s, 50s and beyond, even though we're not excluding men from this conversation, especially if you've got a wife or a girlfriend, they're going to go through this. And now me being almost 50, I'm experiencing shifts and things. So I have so many questions there. So I'm just going to start firing them out. And I don't even know where this conversation is going. To go. But I have so many questions when it comes to hormones. Like, first and foremost, what is it about hormones and females? Like, why does this start to shift as we age? Is there a timeframe that you really notice this big change with females?

Well, let's start with the timeframe because like all things naturopathic and our perspective is that you're a unique individual. So there is no particular timeframe. I cannot say to you, hey, Natalie, all of your gals, all of your group is going to start at 30 or 40 or 50. So we take a look at history. What's your family history like, what's your diet like, what's your lifestyle like? And that plays a huge role in what you'll experience with hormonal decline as.

Well as your medical history too. You know, do you have a history of fibroids? Do you have a history of pelvic inflammatory disease? Do you, Were you a smoker? Things like that all play into the timing of when the ovaries decide to start to not function anymore.

I love this answer right now because I feel that in marketing world, I see a lot of people talking at a one size fits all with hormones like your estrogen changes. And I wonder if you see that too in the marketing side. And what do you say to that? Because I'm assuming patients come into you with these preconceived things like, oh, I must be low on estrogen, or I must be this.

Yeah, I mean, absolutely, we see that. We hear that if you've ever watched regular television, we are just completely and totally in inundated with pharmaceutical ads with people selling, selling, selling. I think that it's taking advantage of humanity. It's taking advantage of the fact that there's so many people suffering and that they feel like they don't feel good, they don't look good and they want an answer and they want a quick fix. But the truth is there's not a quick fix. And every human, every woman is different.

Okay, so that being said, I want to kind of go through them and then I also want to talk, to ask. I have a lot of questions about bioidentical and treat and things like that. So can we talk about sort of like the main hormone shifts? And I know everyone's different, I hear that. But like there's certain ones that come up all the time. Like I'll hear about estrogen dominance, for instance, or I'm low on estrogen. Can we sort of go through some of the things that you've seen and if there's a way to do it. Like, some of the things you might feel like. For me, I know I was low on testosterone. That was one in my test. I also know I was low on progesterone as I got older. So can we talk about sort of like, the general ideas behind some of these hormones? And again, everyone listening, they're not giving medical advice to you. This is just general questions that I'm asking. You would want to obviously go in and get your own tests and figure out where you are. But I'm asking. I want to ask some general questions around those.

Sure. So I think that the reason Dr. Steinke and I work well together is because we often fill in the gaps.

Yeah.

I'm super excited. Like, big energy. And she's more stable, so it works for us. So I think that as I'm talking or she's talking, if you don't mind, we'll sort of.

Yeah, that's great.

One of us has something additional.

Totally great.

So estrogen.

Yeah, let's start with that, because estrogen is a big one. Estrogen dominance versus low in estrogen.

Right. And so let's just address the issue of estrogen dominance, because I think sometimes people think that estrogen dominance means you have so much estrogen. And while that could be true, it could also be that you don't have enough progesterone. So they balance each other. I don't know, because I'm not usually in the room with Dr. Steinke when she's with her patients, and she's not usually with me. So we might explain this differently. But I like to start with the brain because that's where the signaling and feedback loop goes. Is that a good place for you to start, too?

Yeah.

Okay, so you have your hypothalamus, which is in your brain. Then you have your pituitary, also in your brain, you get signals, hormonal signals, from the hypothalamus to the pituitary and then from the pituitary to your major hormone organs, including your ovaries. It affects things like testosterone, progesterone, estrogen, but it also affects things like thyroid, adrenal, your pancreas, insulin. It's not as simple as it's only your estrogen or it's only your progesterone or your testosterone because they're all working in conjunction with one another. But specifically with regard to estrogen, you have something known as fsh. Follicle stimulating hormone. It comes from your pituitary, and it tells your ovaries, hey, I Want you to start preparing, one, for eventually ovulation, and two, making the uterus real juicy and ripe so that you can potentially get pregnant. And that's estrogen. But there's actually three different types of estrogen. And I can let Dr. Steinke speak to those different types and why it's important to understand all three and how they relate to each other.

Yeah. So, I mean, most of the time, when any MD is talking about estrogen, he or she is usually referring to what's called estriol, or, sorry, estradiol, which is E2.estradiol. Estradiol is the most prominent form of estrogen in our reproductive years. It's known as the workhorse estrogen. It binds very tightly to the estrogen receptors. As we age, we start to lose estradiol. We lose estradiol. And our main form of estrogen is then estrone. Estrone is produced by its E1. It is produced by your adrenal glands primarily, or your estrogen then becomes aromatized in the peripheral tissues. That's how we get our estrogen post menopause. During our reproductive years, our estradiol is being produced by your ovaries. Once the ovaries decide to discontinue function, then our primary form of estrogen is estrone. Estriol is converted from E2 or estradiol. That's another form that's considered the protective form of estrogen. Those are your three different forms. It's important to know estradiol, your E2, is the workhorse. That is what really is in decline during your perimenopausal years. What happens when our ovaries start to peter out? A lot of women experience surges, these highs and then these super lows, because it's almost like the ovary is squeezing out that last little bit.

When you mean. When you say highs and lows, you mean, like, during ovulation, like, feeling an extreme there or what do you mean by that?

All over the place, actually. One month you could have extreme surges. Then two months down the road, you can have, like, no estrogen. So what that would look like clinically or in your cycle is one month you might have a really heavy period, and then a month or two later, you might have, like, a really light period. And you might get hot flashes, night sweats, you know, some of that brain fog, because the loss of estrogen causes those perimenopausal or menopausal symptoms.

So is that what causes those hot flashes specifically, or. There are a lot of things that cause Hot flashes.

It's lack of estrogen is what it's causing.

Wow.

And there is definitely a relationship with cortisol and stress. And that's why when we started this conversation, you may like to say, oh, it's just as easy as your hormones, but there's really nothing easy about hormones. And that's why it's imperative that whoever you work with truly understands the biochemistry of these pathways, because they're complex. And not that we're geniuses, we're not. We're just committed to women's health and to understanding those pathways in order to maximize wellness.

I want to just because I don't mind sharing about my own personal stuff, just to kind of give examples of things. So just like, I get hot flashes a lot. That's a common thing, typically at one part of my cycle. And I. It's funny because I posted a reel about hot flashes and I had like, hundreds of women like, oh, that's me, that's me, that's me. Are you in my bed? Right. But this is what's interesting about what you just said. A traditional doctor would have said to me, it's lack of estrogen. That's what's happening. Right. But in my case, I actually was estrogen dominant for the reason you said so for me, it was needing more progesterone. It was needing other things. So it's interesting that why I like you two and what you do, because you really do. Look at that whole picture versus, like, some traditional doctors would have just said, oh, go on birth control pill, or like, they just give you this quick answer, which is not always the answer. It's not always the best answer.

Yeah. And it's. I can speak for myself. It's my opinion that someone in their mid-40s to late-40s who's Perry should not be on birth control. That's not healthy.

And I chose not to.

I mean, it's not just her opinion, personal opinion, it's her professional opinion. It's my professional opinion. We could have a whole other podcast on birth control pills, and you know how it depletes nutrients, but it is this relationship. It's this dance. It's this constant harmonizing between all of your other hormones. When Dr. Steinke was talking about these ups and downs, at the same time as that's occurring, your progesterone is starting to taper off too, and it's not mirroring the estrogen. And so that is why sometimes those symptoms can seem worse.

Okay, so the two things I hear with estrogen And I know I'm generalizing here. Either her estrogen dominance or lack of estrogen, are there, like, specific symptoms typically that you'll like? When somebody says, I'm having all these symptoms, you know, oh, we must test for this.

So, yes, yes and no, because they sort of seem like they. And Dr. Steinke can speak to her experience to not oppose each other, but they work in tandem. They work together. And so if you're having those ups and downs, it's not always perfectly clear, which is why we like to do diagnostics when it's possible. Specifically. Specifically serum testing, urine testing, and also saliva when it's appropriate. So, for example, if somebody comes in and tells me I'm really swollen, my breasts are swollen, I'm retaining fluid, I think estrogen, I think too much estrogen.

Okay?

So estrogen is the building hormone. So estrogen tells the lining of the uterus to build. So that's why if you. You're estrogen dominant or you have a lot of estrogen, you will have those heavy periods because then you have to shed that lining. So. But it doesn't also build the lining of the uterus. It tells you to hold on to a lot of other things. So that's why you'll feel swollen, you'll feel bloated, you'll feel, you know, all those kind of PMS symptoms that come with estrogen.

Okay.

And then let me just add on to that. So then when you have that picture, but you also don't have enough progesterone to what we call oppose that, then you can get mood swings. You can feel cranky. And, you know, you can. People be like, oh, my gosh. You know, Dr. Sweetan, for, you know, the majority of time is, like, really even tempered. But lately, in the last five years, she's really like, say something. She goes off, well, hello, ladies. You know that. Is that progesterone estrogen imbalance.

Okay. And I'm gonna. I'm gonna give you kind of like the. Where I'm going with a lot of these questions, so you can help with how I'm answering. I want to ask about the other hormones, but what I'm gonna also want to ask in here is about what happens when you have a hysterectomy. Like, does. How it forces you into menopause right away. What happens there? And then I also have so many questions about bioidentical. And, like, is that safe? Is that not safe? Like, what. What do we need to know about that? So I'm not throwing all Those at you at once. But I wanted to tell you where I. Where I want to go with some of these questions. So let's talk about the next hormone that comes up a lot, and that's testosterone. Because I think a lot of females think of that as a male hormone, but I know it's a very important hormone for females as well. Can we talk a little bit about testosterone?

Yeah, let's talk about it. We're like, yes, let's do it. Do you want to speak to that first, Dr. Stink?

Well, testosterone can also decline in women as you age. So we think of testosterone. Most times it's the male hormone, Right. So men have a lot of it. We have a little bit, and we need a little bit. It is our sort of drive, and it's responsible for retaining muscle mass, energy. It's very connected to energy. And really like that I want to get up and go kind of feeling. So a lot of women that come in, they're like, you know, my motivation is down. I don't want to do things. I'm not even motivated to do fun things. I'm losing muscle.

I don't want to have sex.

Yep, sex drive. Huge. Huge. That's when we sort of suspect a potential loss of testosterone. And you have to think about, you know, when we do testing, we look at a lot of the different areas of the hormone category. Cascade and hormones all come from cholesterol. So if you don't have good cholesterol, I mean, we think of cholesterol, oh, my gosh, it's bad, but it's not bad. We need adequate cholesterol to turn into all of our sex hormones. So cholesterol turns into pregnenolone. That's one thing we can test for is what's our overall conversion of cholesterol, driving into the hormone cascade, and then everything else kind of comes from there. Our DHEA is another test we look at. In the serum. DHEA is converted to testosterone. So that's one thing we look at. If you're low in dhea, then we think, you know, gosh, we don't have enough of the precursor to really drive testosterone. So rather than going to directly supplementing testosterone, we can supplement DHEA or even pregnenolone. So just understanding the pathways, there's different areas that you can target as far as treatment goes.

And one more thing to that. So oftentimes we think about, okay, I don't have enough testosterone. So then people will supplement with the testosterone. And then they're like, but I don't Feel better, then they start having symptoms that are often associated with too much estrogen. And that's because as part of that cascade, Dr. Steinke used the word earlier called aromatase, it converts into estrogen. So it's this, like I said before, it's like this dance of trying to figure out where you intervene with the mindset that we're not trying to get crazy here. We're trying to help people feel better and restore their hormonal balance.

So let's talk about that, too, because I know a lot of people do jump to bioidentical hormones, and I know you even will prescribe them for patients when you think they're necessary. And then there's this whole. There was a whole setback years ago with those hormones about estrogen causing cancer. Is that all? Has that been corrected? Is this still a concern when you're taking bioidentical? What do people need to be worried about or know about when it comes to making choices around bioidentical hormones?

Yeah. So way back in, gosh, when was, I think the early 2000s, there was a study called the Women's Health Initiative, and it really looked at the safety of hormone replacement therapy, not bioidentical. So a lot of doctors really flipped out after the results were published. Really worried about the safety of doing hormone replacement therapy. That was the dominant knowledge for many years. And that's why hormone replacement therapy got a bad rap. More recently, when they dug into the data more closely, they started to see that it depended on the combination of hormones they were using and synthetic versus bioidentical. When you're using a synthetic hormone, a synthetic estrogen, and estrogen that's from. And don't jump off your seat, but they use estrogen from horse urine, they extract it from horse urine. So it's not identical to what we produce in our bodies. Yes. Giving a woman estrogen that is unopposed, not balancing it with progesterone. Natural bioidentical progesterone can be dangerous, especially when you're doing a synthetic form that binds very, very tightly. And the concern is, obviously everybody thinks of breast cancer. When they dug into the data further, they saw that it was usually either estrogen unopposed with unopposed progesterone, or they were using also a synthetic progesterone, progestin. We use bioidentical hormones that are exactly the same as what we're producing in our body, and we look to replace what's called physiological levels. So levels that are what would normally exist for a healthy reproductive aged woman is what we're going for and enough to get you feeling better.

And I do take, I'm being transparent with my audience here. I do take bioidentical hormones. I have not estrogen. I was one of those lucky ones that was, was dominant with estrogen, but are not lucky. But that's what I found. But like, I'm going into your office later this week, I am committed to lab tests recently, regularly, every three months to make sure because I think things do shift and change and we have to stay on top of that. I don't want to take things if I don't need them.

Yeah, and you make a really good point and I'm glad you brought it up because I feel like people think it's one and done. Like, oh, I'm going to go see the doctor, I'm going to take this and then I'm good. But it is so important that you do do these check ins, you do repeat the labs. You sit down with your patients. And in a time of COVID that hasn't been where you can sit down in person, but whether it's telephonically or it's in a medium like this, sit down, talk, check in, how are you feeling? How is it different than it was before? And then just commit to making the changes, acknowledging that you might have to adjust these doses or try something different.

One of the things that comes up with my in my fat loss programs, and I've really worked with women to understand this, and I'm curious your opinion. Even if you don't agree with me, feel like, feel free to jump in. Sometimes I think women, especially when they have a lot of weight to lose, they'll come to me, they've got 50 plus pounds to lose and they'll say, I think there's something wrong with my hormones. What I typically encourage them to do is, yes, you can check those, but let's first clean up your diet, let's get your body moving. Let's do those things first so then we get an accurate assessment. Because I feel, and again, correct me if I'm off or wrong, that sometimes going right down the hormone route first and we haven't changed those things or looked at those things, is not giving us accurate readings. Is that accurate? Am I off on that?

No, I don't think you're off at all. You sound very naturopathic, you know, like, remove the obstacles to health. It's one of our first therapeutic orders. At the same time, and I don't want to speak for Dr. Steinke, but I know that I like to come at things maybe like multimodality or multifaceted. So, for example, and in full disclosure, I am part of your total body thrive program and I am completely and totally thriving and losing weight in inches and doing all these great things because I tell people what to do and then don't often do it myself. So I am all about eating healthy and doing the right thing at the same time. Your liver can become overtaxed. Now, I know some people and maybe you too, and that's okay because, you know, we don't always have to agree on everything. We can share and educate each other. But if your liver is not functioning and detoxing properly, then giving hormones or supplementing or botanicals is not going to have an optimal effect.

It might have a negative effect, as.

A matter of fact, yes, because you can get build up and you can back up these systems that we talk about in this feedback loop to your brain and you can find that you start to have sort of, you know, like glucose dysregulation, insulin issues, thyroid issues.

And also you could be converting those, the detoxing the estrogen that you're giving yourself through pathways that are not good, pathways that can lead to things like DNA damage. So definitely want to make sure your liver is healthy and you're converting and detoxing things properly.

So a simple detox, not something you would hear about. That is extreme. Oh, I can't eat regular food or I have to only have shakes every day or I have to drink juice. And I'm not saying those things are bad. I'm not poo pooing them. But I think that that is definitely a challenge for most people when they hear detox, they think that one, it's going to be miserable and two, it's not manageable. And then they don't truly understand why they're doing it. It might just be cool to be doing it at the moment, but I feel like it's important to do that with the proper eating and then go into introducing supplements and or the bioidenticals.

Okay. Oh, go ahead.

Sort of, it's such a buzzword out there. I, I think of a detox more of restoring liver function.

Yeah, I like that. Okay, I've got some big words.

These are.

Well, they're not big words to you, but they're big words to everybody else. Insulin, adrenals and thyroid. Okay, let's talk about those things because those are another. Those are other three things that come up a lot around the hormone conversation. We can start with any of them.

Okay, so thyroid. Thyroid is a biggie. So, okay, insulin, adrenal. But your adrenals are responsible for producing a lot of different hormones and then thyroid.

And I bring that up, by the way, because. And I'm just thinking of the things that people come to me with. They'll say, I think I have adrenal fatigue. They don't know. They say, I think I have adrenal fatigue, or I think there's something wrong with my thyroid, or I think I'm insulin sensitive. And that's why I want to address those things.

Right. I was just going to say adrenal fatigue is not a medical term. There's really no adrenal fatigue. There's adrenal insufficiency. So the adrenal glands might not be producing optimal levels of hormones. So I don't like the term adrenal fatigue because it's like, oh, the adrenals are, like, done. They're out.

You're tired.

But no, with a little love, you can restore function.

Okay, Is there a test for that? Like, could people go get a test to see if they actually have poor adrenal. They have adrenal deficiency, like you said.

Yeah. You'll look at things in the blood, things like DHEA is produced in the adrenals. Cortisol. So you'll check those levels in the serum to get a good idea of.

I left that word out, too. Cortisol. We want to talk about that. Okay, so adrenal. So adrenal fatigue is not really a thing. It's adrenal deficiency, and you can get checked for that. And then there's ways to treat that if you are.

Yeah. Adrenal insufficiency is insufficiency.

Right. And it also has to do with things like water retention. It just. It's multifaceted. But, yes, there are diagnostics, along with a really good history to help us detect if that's occurring. And then, like Dr. Steinke said, we can certainly help give them some love so that they can get back to where they need to be.

Great. Okay, thyroid. Let's talk about that.

Let's talk about it. So again, this is all this cascade, this feedback loop going from your brain to your thyroid. You actually have. There's four different kinds. There's T1, T2, T3, T4. You commonly hear about T3 and T4. T3 and T4 are just T1 and T2 added together. Like, you have 1 and 2 becomes 3, and 2 and 2 becomes 4. You need it for everything in your body, including adequate female hormone balancing.

And I think women that come in, they're like, oh, I can't lose weight, and, you know, I'm tired. They connect that to thyroid immediately. I mean, it could be other things.

Too, but it also could be their diet, because I know something. I know, like, with thrive, we clean up the diet, and a lot of those symptoms, like, all of a sudden go away.

They could be having what's called reactive hypoglycemia because of their diet. So. Yes, absolutely. Which has to do with cortisol and insulin, but specifically with thyroid. Thyroid receptors exist everywhere in your body, and thyroid hormone really drives your metabolism, like your baseline.

Yeah.

So even when you're cold, Natalie, and you start to shiver, that's actually an increase in your thyroid hormone that causes that. So it drives your metabolism, it gives you energy. So loss of thyroid function, you're going to feel fatigued, you're going to feel tired. You're also going to gain weight because you're not, you know, your metabolism is.

Suffering from that, and your periods. And your periods are going to be affected. So you might think, oh, I'm estrogen deficient, I'm estrogen dominant, when in fact, you have thyroid dysfunction. And you might be hyperthyroid producing too much thyroid hormone or hypothyroid, not producing enough thyroid hormone.

And there's all kinds of causes for both of those as well.

Okay. Cortisol and insulin, because those play a role together. I want to talk about those. Those. The other things.

Yeah. So cortisol, that's, you know, produced in your adrenals, and it works like a friend holding hands, skipping down the sidewalk with all your other hormones.

Do you all feel like you're in a quiz right now, by the way, with all my questions?

No.

No.

All right. I know I'm throwing a lot out at you.

Okay.

We're really excited and passionate that we get to share this with so many people who are listening to your podcast, because we want people to feel better and we want knowledge. Okay.

So it's producing your adrenals, the cortisol.

Yes. And so it goes sort of back to this old story about, like, being chased by a bear. And so you have to have a mechanism for your body to be like, oh, my gosh, we're in trouble. We got to get out of here. Or we got to turn around, raise them up, and fight. But. And that's good. We want our body to do that. We need our body to do that. It is A survival skill and coping mechanism. What we don't need it to do is to continue to do that all.

The time, which is what modern society does. Yes, Our nervous systems are not built or designed and have not evolved yet to deal with modern life. This, like always, their constant level of background stress and that tends to produce adrenal insufficiency.

I would imagine our phones are a huge culprit for that because all the beeps and the notifications and the this and that and the shit shifting your attention.

And we live in a culture where it's really popular to have this attitude that you have to pull yourself up by the bootstraps and to a certain degree you do. But it's like there's this badge of honor of how much you can take. Oh yeah, I only slept two hours last night. Or I don't need to do that. You know, I'm strong, I'm tough. Fabulous. Great, that's wonderful. But at the same time, if you never give yourself a chance to rest, then you're always turned on, then you're always inflamed. And that's another big buzzword is inflammation, because that drives disease, which we like to break up and say dis ease. And so yes, by optimizing adrenal function, we can help with those cortisol levels, which then help with thyroid function, which then help with your female and male considered, quote unquote male hormone testosterone as well as insulin regulation.

So can you speak into insulin then? Because I think there's a lot and I'm not talking about the diabetic insulin. So type 1 diabetes, very different, type 2, very different, but more just insulin. And what happens? And because I think a lot of people think that they're insulin sensitive or they're. What is that? And is it as common as people think it is?

It's very common.

It is very common.

Okay, here's where it goes back to diet. We talk with our, we address first the determinants of health with our patients, which is diet, lifestyle stress management, are you getting good sleep, are you drinking enough? So in that comes into play stress management and diet. So when we are eating, when we're not eating a lot of fiber, well balanced meals, when we're eating high glycemic index foods. So what happens is when you eat that three rolls with your dinner or whatever it might be, that causes a spike in your blood sugar. So your body has to respond to that. Your body goes, oh my gosh, we've got to get this blood sugar out of the serum out of our blood. And so that's when your insulin spikes. You get this insulin spike and it spikes too high, and then the sugar gets pulled into the cell, which is not good. And then you have what's called reactive hypoglycemia. And that's after you have that bowl of ice cream. You feel great for like 45 minutes to an hour. And then you're like, oh, my gosh, I need to go to sleep. That's reactive hypoglycemia. So that's happening to a lot of people multiple times a day. And if you do that too much, it moves into a metabolic issue that can become type 2 diabetes. But it first presents as this, like, afternoon. I feel tired and sleepy after a heavy meal, you just want to lay down, you get brain fog, all those good things. So, yes, it happens a lot.

And to that I just want to add real quick. So then there seems to be this connection with glucose, with sugar and energy. And then people falsely assume that they need to continue to take in more sugar to have more energy, when in actuality they're completely zapping themselves.

Yeah. They're in this vicious cycle of the.

Up and down, up and down. So we're looking at diet. It's really imperative to, you know, and just help people like you do, Natalie, create a different mindset and educate about healthy changes that can be made and are manageable long term to maintain a healthy blood sugar level.

Gosh. I could talk to you both all day. You answered most of my questions here. But I want. I want people listening to kind of have some takeaways, like if I'm hearing correctly and interject if I'm not. I feel that everyone, especially women in their 40s, 50s, and beyond, we should be getting regular laptops to actually know what's going on, not playing the guesswork on Google. Is that. Would you go along with that?

And I would add to that, I would say we're big proponents of having people come in when they're young and healthy.

Yes.

So don't wait until you're 50 and feeling like crap. Come in when you're 35, 40. You know, I want. The best case scenario is I want to know what your ideal blood levels and diagnostics look like when you're young and healthy. Because everyone's so different. What's normal for you might not be normal for someone else. And I don't like otherwise. We have. What we have to go off of is normal blood ranges that we get with or functional blood ranges which are tighter. We look at what do we want to see, ideally in the general population. But when you look at your blood work, when you get that back and your MD goes, oh, you're within normal range.

Normal range.

Normal range. What people don't get is normal range. Normal range includes on most tests two standard deviations outside the mean, which includes 90% of the population. And anybody can look around and see that 90% of the population is not good, they're not healthy. I don't want to compare your numbers to an unhealthy normal that's out there.

And I add that exact experience happened to me because I do take supplements and bioidentical. But my, my ob GYN had said, you're normal, like everything was normal. But going to naturopathic MDs, like, I know that that's not the case and I feel so different making those tweaks. So I highly encourage. I know, I tell all my clients, I tell my friends, go get actual lab work. Get, go find a naturopathic md. Go do this work. I have been telling people in California, the doctors I'm interviewing right now, they're located in California. So if you are in California, you actually can work with them direct. I'm going to link up their information below. If you're not in California, you can come visit and work with them and then they could do, I believe, telemedicine. But if that's not an option for you, you'd want to find somebody local in your area that's doing that. Anything else you want people to know while you've got their attention right now?

Oh my gosh. There's so many things. You'll have to have us back if you will. I guess the big takeaway is, yes, we, we need to look at the diagnostics, the labs. It's better to do it when you're younger than older, also including things like a DEXA scan. I know we didn't talk about bone health, but hormones are an important factor in bone health. The standard regulation or recommendation is get that when you're 65 years old. We do not wait till 65 years old to do those tests because let's get ahead of it. Focus on diet and lifestyle. Sleep. Sleep is imperative for restoring cell health. The Sleep foundation says that 47 or up to 47% of women experience sleep disorders who are perimenopausal and up to 60% of menopausal women.

Wow.

So getting good night's sleep, eating healthy, loving yourself, loving yourself, having healthy conversations, own dialogue in your brain, that you're worthy and powerful and that you can achieve all things that you put your mind and heart to. But that doesn't negate getting the diagnostics because that's important.

Yeah.

And I would add to that for women specifically that are starting to go through perimenopause, you don't have to suffer. You really don't have to suffer. And getting a hold of what's going on with your hormones and your thyroid and all of that, the earlier you do it, the better. So if you're starting to feel those symptoms like seek the care of a naturopathic doctor because if you can get a hold of those things early and manage your transition into post menopause and manage your estrogen levels, you can actually put yourself on a better trajectory from a bone health standpoint as well as a cardiovascular and a anesthetics, fine lines and wrinkles.

Let's be honest here.

We don't want to get rid of them. Yeah.

Brain health. So your hormones feed into so many other things than just like dealing with, you know, these annoying symptoms. They really put you on a better path for overall health as you age.

I love this was so helpful. I probably will want to have you back if you're open to it and I am going to link up all of your information. If you're to inclined California, I highly recommend you reach out to them. You might run into me there and some of my friends. I've sent everybody there and thank you both for being here today. Thank you so much.

Thank you. Thank you for having us. We appreciate it.

Lovely.

Thank you for taking the time out of your day to listen in as my guest today. If you found this episode valuable, please share it with friends and on social media. I don't advertise this show so I rely on rely on word of mouth and reviews to get it out in the world. The biggest thank you that you can give me is leaving me a review and a nice one. I hope, by the way, this is how others find these episodes. If you do leave me a review, be sure to Message me@supportnataliejillfitness.com with a screenshot of your review because I would love to send you a free digital download of my DSR journal as a thank you. And please don't forget to connect with me on social media at Natalie Jill Fit on Instagram and Facebook.