Intermittent Fasting, Carb Cycling and Macros to Support Midlife Body Changes with Le Bergin

Today on Midlife Conversations, I've got Leigh Bergen here and I can't wait to dive into this topic to hear because we're talking about something that comes up in midlife, especially if you've been following me for a long time. We're talking today fat loss, weight loss, muscle building in our midlife. But we're going to be talking about some very specific techniques today, things that you've not heard me speak on before. We're going to go really deep into things like intermittent fasting, into carb cycling, into macros and, and to a different type of training. So I'm so excited to have Leigh here today. Thanks for being here.

I am thrilled to be here. Thank you so much, Natalie, for having me on.

So for starters, if you're not watching her on YouTube, if you're listening to her on the audio, you don't see her buff and toned arms. She's 49 and she is like, looks so good. She's super tone, super defined. She does not have the jiggle in her arms that most women us have in midlife that's missing from her. And it's not missing just because of genetics. She's got some hard work and some really great information, information to share and I want to just sort of start. She is the lead pro trainer at my friend Amanda's company, Faster Way. And I was laughingly. I don't know if Amanda told you this. Recently I saw an ad that. Did she tell you this?

No.

Okay, so I'm scrolling Instagram and I see this ad from Amanda and it's this like really old looking woman. I mean she's like really not our age. Like she's really like, looks like it could be my grandma. Like my grandma. And it said, it said something about welcome to our over 50 community. And I was like, huh? I screenshot it and I sent it to her and I said, I don't know who is 50 year old you think this is, but this is not me or my friends. So. So Amanda, she sent it to others on your team and they, they wrote back, this is not Lee or Natalie. So I just, I didn't know she shared that with you. But I said, I said we get to redefine what you think 50 is and what it looks like and what it has to be. So I wanted to start with that.

I am laughing because again, I don't, I don't 50. It always seems so old. It always seemed golden, girly. It always seemed that way. And I think that our generation, yours and Mine kind of broke up into a couple of different forks in the road.

Yeah.

And you know, those who were stuck in one way and then those who wanted to continue to educate and those who are not kind of scared to go to the next place. What is the next place? Place. Who is the woman waiting for you around the corner? We haven't met her yet. And I think a lot of people are fearful because it is comfortable to be uncomfortable. It's a little bit sometimes more comfortable to be there than it is to go around the corner and meet a new revised you. Because she gonna be like, right, Totally.

Well, I told Amanda and her 35 year old self that that is not. If she wants to look like that 50, she can.

But I'm glad you got that off the Internet.

Changed your whole ad. I was like, that is not representing.

She doesn't call me Ma.

No. Okay, so, but, but seriously though, talk to us about your journey. Like, were you always super fit? Like, what. Tell us about your journey and how, like how you even got into what you do.

I was a zoo. I mean, I got glasses when I was 18 months old. I was legally blind. My legs were pigeon toed. They had to. I had to wear a cast on my legs after they broke them so that I could walk.

Right.

I mean, I was a mess. I had a very volatile upbringing and then went to high school and said, let me try out for the dance team. And everybody just laughed and so did the judges. I was like, well, okay, didn't make that. So I wasn't always athletic. My arms and legs were too long for my body. I just, I just didn't fit in. But what I could do, I started to dance. I was like, I can dance. So I danced through college. I ended up making that something that I could do because. And again, I worked at it really hard. But then after that I, I got, I was really fascinated. Remember the women on ESPN who wore the slouchy socks? And yeah, I was just mesmerized by them, but it didn't seem like it was anything attainable. I always thought they were real, you know, tiny. Like, I was like, they're so short. You know, they. They're on steroids. Like, these are the things in my mind. Sure. So I just. So I started to run because I thought I equated being toned with running and cardio and fat loss. I didn't understand. So I ran. I ran marathons. I was a triathlete. I was super. I was about 20 pounds lighter than I am right now. So I didn't quite, you know, that scale thing is stressful for people. So I ran Ram Ram ran. Had two kids in two years. Had a whole different life. I was a high school teacher and when I would lift weights, my body responded quickly and I was always curious. I would just sit there waiting for my Oxygen magazine. Waiting for the magazine with you on the coverage. Like I would just go and I would just pore over it. Just in my mind, my kid's dad at the time, you know, I hate to say ex husband, we're friends, was always like don't put on any muscle, okay. As soon as we split up, I said okay, I'm not going to run anymore. It was like a forest gump. I was like. Then one day I just like I'm done. Let me pick up a heavy bar. And I had. My kids were 4 and 5. I didn't have a job. I was a stay at home mom. So I went, I went to. I got certified by Billy Blanks. I trained with him for four years and started teaching Taibo at a church. I mean literally, because I was like that's kind of dancy. You know he didn't want us choreographing anything. So. Okay.

So.

So then my body started to change because I stopped running so much and I was like, well this looks great. Then I became obsessed with Nicolette Sheridan Desperate Housewives. I was like, just like her. And I was so far away from it and I don't know why, I mean I literally, I had her picture up on my fridge. I was like, whatever she's doing, but I didn't know what she was doing. So I said, let me become a personal trainer. Big hurricane in the town that I who care all this stuff. So a new guy owned that bought the gym. He said be a personal trainer. You can have some job flexibility. And I said, let me be my first client. Okay, let me see what this has looked like. I knew about, I knew about food enough about food, but I didn't know how much I had to eat to look like Nicolette Sheridan. I took my mind off of what I wanted to look like when I picked up a 45 pound bar just for a deadlift. I mean literally, it's like picking up a bag of dog food. And I said, you know what, I'm going to just train like I would somebody else. Let me see what happens. And I took my mind off of the results. And in a year my body was just completely different. I said I want to do is just.

This is really Important. I want to, like, back up a.

Minute on that, because there's so much.

A different type of mindset training. So I always talk about mindset, like, making a decision, getting into your vision. But what you're saying is it's almost like you were psyching yourself out and almost like being. Like you're almost witnessing yourself working out versus being in it. And is that. Am I hearing this correct?

You're 100% right. Because I think I was also very wounded, sad, scared, frustrated, and nervous to be a single mom with these two kids. And I was insecure, obviously. And I didn't know what. I didn't. I didn't know what that. I just knew I wanted to be strong somewhere, so I wanted to be a good trainer. So. And I wanted to be strong. And I let those pictures and those images in the magazines go, because at this point in my mind, I was like, that's never going to. I don't even know what that means. I just like looking at the bodies, right? And I just committed to the process of pick up the bar, add 10% more every time you come up to it. Eat for it. The more you lift. The more you're hungry, the more you lift, the stronger. And I committed to the process of just making the bar grow. And in a year, I looked in the mirror and was like, well, that's interesting. Even though I had all the education for it, I did have my personal training. I did have clients. But I was like. And it wasn't that hard because I wasn't scared of food. Right? I think a lot of people are scared of food. But I was done running, and the more. The stronger I got, the more hungry I became.

And you were really. You were more focused on, like, the sport of it and being strong versus, like, I'm gonna get skinnier.

Oh, yeah. Not the performance. Right. And I was shocked. I was like, what in the wide world of whose body is this is going on? And then. Then everything just changed, and my whole perspective changed. And then I ended up marrying the gym owner. I had clients. I mean, I've had some of. This is. This is almost. This is a long time ago. I've had clients for almost 15 years at this point who just kept looking worse and worse and worse, and they weren't doing anything that I was saying. And I kept saying, why are you not doing what I'm saying? Well, you're telling me to eat carbs. You're telling me.

Oh, because they were, like, super focused on. I should not. They're still on the skinny mindset, like what we thought skinny would be.

Yeah, fully. And they were looking older. They were looking like the woman in the.

Wow.

Right. So I'm sitting here looking younger, continuing to lift, but getting to a point after about five years, like I don't think I want to lift any heavier now. It's the maintenance game. Right now we're fighting gravity and time and inflammation and other other cool factors that come along with aging. But that all of that journey to get to where I was. It's just like you said, I was just a pioneer. Lewis and Clark. What's in this uncharted territory? I was curious again as a, as a teacher. I want to know how and why. Let me try it on myself. Because if I can't do it, there's no way I'm talking about it.

Yeah, totally.

Yeah. Wow.

That's why I love that journey. Okay, so. So clearly you're into lifting, but let's talk about this food component with lifting. So, so what? And if I have a bunch of different listeners here, but if you are a listener that came in to me through my fat loss programs, the distinction of what we're going to be talking about right now is a lot of what I taught is general fat loss, like how to get healthy as we age, like how to, to navigate the hormone changes, all that, how to do general fat loss. What we're going about now is really some fine tuning things, which is next level, which I think is amazing. And I think if you've done my programs before and had results and are ready for next level, this is stuff I really want you to listen to because this is a way to get to next level that we have not really dove into before. So let's start with. I want to, I want to talk, let's talk about, let's start with the macros first. Can we start with that? Because this is, this is really important. And then I want to lean into carb cycling from that.

Absolutely. And I think that there's a vocabulary list that I think is missing from this next level. Right. I think body composition is something that a lot of people don't talk about. It seems like it's in, you know, the bodybuilding world or somewhere else. Body composition is what's under your skin. Right. So what we tried to do our generation was just make our skin sex smaller. We just kept wanting to get smaller and smaller and smaller, but getting smaller didn't. It didn't. It started to get saggy as we're aging. So What I wanted to look at was what's under my skin, that body composition. So the next level is creating new stuff under your skin. So fat loss and muscle gain can happen simultaneously. Most people came also to me for fat loss. So the same work that I did As a person, £20 less is the same work. I would tell somebody who needs to lose 20 pounds. So if I had to gain 20, they had to lose 20. It's the same effort. And when it comes down to is, are you strategically lifting for a reason? Not just because the class told me to. Right. The class told me to. With these little pink dumbbells. I'm doing what the class said. I'm gonna do that for five years. You're not challenging.

There's no progression there. There's no intensity.

Exactly.

Yeah.

And so the food component is the missing link. Because we were so scared of food, we kept lifting these weights and we're like, nothing's happened. It's like, I say this, it might be a little bit obscene, but it's like picking a scab. Like, you're just never going to go anywhere.

Sure.

Just going to continue. So it's that kind of thing that allowed me to say, okay, I want to build what. What genetics is going to make my body, whatever it is. But there's a reason. There's a time frame and there's a next step. Always. The next level is always going to be there. There's. I don't know anybody who can raise their hand and say they're done. Because as soon as every Monday, every day, I wake up and like, it's. It's still new. So I think that's a conversation. Is body comp position the next level? You're never going to reach that next level. And it's a great exploration. If we can embrace the exploration, not the struggle. That's another. That's a. That's a trigger word for me. Right? Yeah, the struggle. Tell me when you're not struggling. Right. Embrace the exploration. Understand what you can do. And in faster way. Our friend. Our mutual friend really focuses on that. So if the mindset is open, what can I do? Then the results come off the table. Because now it's about performance and what does it take?

Makes sense. Makes total sense. And it's interesting because in my fat loss program, even though I've taught workouts over the years.

Yeah.

We fully focus initially on mindset, getting into that right state, and then obviously, nutrition, because I do believe you're going to have that initial change with fat loss but what you're talking about here, fully changing your body composition, we've got to include these aspects. This is critical or we're not going to get there.

It's like trying to build something without the stuff. Yes, the stuff is what we need. Right?

Okay, so let's talk about macros because to me, because, because what my people have learned is protein, carbs and fats.

But let's get more.

I want to get more specific on there. Like, when you're talking about macros, how are you explaining it?

Yeah, so when I'm talking about macros, one of the. A great way to describe this is that your macros are. Think about it like your money, right? You've got some money for shopping, that's for fun, some money for your bills and some money that you save. You have the same amount of money, right? You can spend all your money shopping, but you're not saving and you're not paying your bills. Or you can save it all, but you're not having. Again, there's a balance and you get to budget them. So macros are the same way. Fat has a specific reason, carbs have a specific reason, protein has a specific reason. But they're all within your umbrella. And if we understand what our umbrella looks like, what our budget looks like, and how it's going to vary from time to time, person to person, and really, really, again, be curious, how much protein do I need? How many carbs make me feel better? Why is fat important for my cellular rejuvenation, for my body to heal as I train, as I sleep, as all of these things? Once we understand those components and how critical they are, then we're able to enjoy them a little bit more and not feel like everything we do is so punitive.

Okay. So good. Okay. Yeah. Because I cannot stand when new diet programs or nutrition programs take away whole food groups. Like, it drives me crazy.

It's food.

Yeah, it drives me crazy. I'm not, I'm not on the. Not a fan of carnivore or keto or any of that because I think it's. I mean, I get, I get short term for some things. There's definitely some room there. But we have to have carbs. And fat is still fat. So too much fat is going to be a crazy overload of calories.

Holy. It's going to blow you out of your budget. I mean, and again, you know, I'm just going back to all of these fads. You know, CrossFit had a great. Let's do Paleo Great. Paleo is whole food, but it's not unlimited whole food. And people are rolling around with their Brazil nuts all day long. Macadamia. I'm like, nothing's happening for you.

It's so interesting because, I mean, we're the same age that we. I mean, I remember like the whole fat free era where I would like go to the movies and get a thing of gummy bears and I'd be like, oh, they're fat free. You know. So we went through that whole like, oh, you can eat all the fat free, the snack wells. And then we were gaining weight and our insulin was out of whack and we didn't know why. And that's why. But I'm watching it go this other way now with this high fat. Like, just because something's labeled keto doesn't make it a free food. No. And it's just. And I feel like that's part of the problem right now, especially in midlife. There's a lot of women in midlife trying to follow these high fat keto type diets and they're wondering why they're having issues. Well, you're having a ton of calories that you're not burning a ton of.

Them and they're not getting stored in the right place. You know, these, the fat, proteins and carbs all have such a specific job and it's the cascade of hormonal trickle down that that gets us stuck in these places. We're like, forget it, I'm just too old, I can't do anything now. And it's, we can reverse some of these things, we can reverse some of the side effects of inadequate nutrition. But I was exact same with you. I mean, I was like, thank goodness I got my fat free fig Newtons and I'm eating the whole with my Diet Coke and it's going down. And again, we were younger than we were, more resilient then. But that stuff starts to catch up. Literally, if I didn't get a divorce at 35 or whatever, I mean, that was my prime time for muscle building, right? That was just a prime time. Had I not done all of that, I'd probably still be running, you know, running away, running, doing all of these things, thinking I was creating a body. But you're not, you're just melting your body.

Okay, so when you talk macros now, and I'm going to get into carb cycling in a minute here, but when you talk macros now, do you believe it's like very individual for people? Do you have A place that you start people like, how do you, how do you sort of guide somebody through?

Great question again, food is fear for a lot of people. We always want to meet people where they're at. Where are you? What are you doing right now? You know, in hindsight, if, when I was training people, I would have worked with them for a year on their mindset prior to even walking to the gym with them. I mean, there's so much to unpack, so many times. But if every single person is at a different place, so you can have a former athlete, you can have someone who's never lifted you wherever they are. We're going to start everyone at a general baseline for their, for their height, weight, activity level. We're going to start everyone here. We're going to find out in six weeks what this prescription does in six weeks. We'll say, now you know how to use these macros, how to consume them, what the right ratio is for you. And then we move on to, okay, if you're feeling this way sometimes, let's make an adjustment. Let's make an adjustment. Protein is the priority all the time. Usually there's two kinds of people, the overeaters and the undereaters. So if we put everyone on a baseline, the undereaters are going to learn how to eat and the overeaters are going to learn how to bring it down. And that's where we end after six weeks. And then it becomes way more personal after that.

So good. So good.

Yeah, it's awesome.

Okay, let's talk about carb cycling. This is a big one and I want to share that. I've actually never carb cycled. I've never not. I mean, maybe I have by accident. I've never.

I was gonna say you didn't do it on the never.

I've never, I've never also I'm, I'm somebody who eats carbs. I mean most of my carbs are fruits and vegetables. I will have like some sweet potatoes and yams and I even as of late added back in some high fiber. Um, I was, I had not had grains for a long time, but I'm having some high fiber oatmeal and brown rice. I'm experimenting with that again. But I want to talk because there's a lot of science behind carb cycling and I've never actually played with it. So I'm really curious to talk to you about this and, and like, who is it for everyone is it for some people, like, talk to me about that. All things carb cycling.

So the amount of food that we eat, whether we are on a diet, let's just use the word, okay. Whether we are on a calorie restrictive space or whether we're in a surplus, that's carb cycling. Even if you're eating the same ratio, if you're increasing your carbs on specific days and dropping them down, then you're still carb cycling. Right? So just by the amount of food, that's number one way to carb cycle, a second way to carb cycle, and you can carb cycle in 1 million ways. We found an effective and efficient way is, is dropping the carbohydrates down out of your day and then replacing that with fat. So whether it's one day a week, two days a week, three days a week, every other day, a lot of different ways to do it. But dropping those carbs down, allow your body, when paired with the proper exercise, to deplete those extra carbs that are stored in your muscles and your liver to really deplete so that you can go into the next storage space, which is fat. Tap into that. Then when we move into a different day of exercise in which we lift heavy weights, those carbs are critical. So we really pair our workouts with our carb cycling. So we learn how to take those carbs down, replace those calories, because it's still the amount of food that you need with fat. And then the other days, we drop the fat and then lift the carbs.

Okay, can you. Do you have. Can you talk a little science behind that? Because I know there's some people listening that want to, like, go, but I don't understand. But why.

So let's.

I want to get in a little bit.

All right, so when you're eating, when you're consuming the carbohydrates, the carbohydrates are going again, like I said, in these storage place spaces. And the carbs are the most readily available fuel source. So having those carbs just like you too. I'm a 250 carbon day person. A day person. Okay. I'm the same way. So when you're consuming those carbs, they're used for that energy. So they're used to help your body work, and they're also used to help your body recover. All right? But sometimes they. Blood sugar plays a part, and bodies aren't able to metabolize that or their workload doesn't match. Many people who come to us have tried keto before. They've been on a low carb. But they're not really in ketosis, they've dropped their carbs down, they're consuming a lot of fat, they're overweight. So really bringing carbs in is hard for them. So when we bring in just a couple of days, hey, let's just bump up those carbs just a little bit. They find, holy smokes, my energy is through the roof, I'm sleeping better. Their cortisol drops. All of the, again, the cascade of events that happens to their hormones once these carbs brought in is what the magic is. So when, in order to, to make that body composition great. Okay. In order to increase your lean tissue and decrease that, that fat, that body fat, we have to still have the same amount of calories throughout the week. So by replacing those carbs with fat and pairing it with some high intensity interval training, we're able to deplete, build that muscle, take the carbs out of the system where they don't need to be, and then your body just gobbles them up there. It's like PR and ready to be able to use those carbs for fuel on the days in which we lived heavier.

So good. So if, okay. So with all that being said, if somebody is not active, if they're not working out, this would not be something you'd recommend. I mean you do recommend everyone works out, but if they're not doing that, that wouldn't necessarily make sense.

Absolutely. I'm going to say that it does make sense because again, they're tapping into different fuel sources. When people are just running high, people who over consume carbs or processed foods are just running high on this, this blood sugar problem. So in order to drop that blood sugar down, we intermittent fasting helps and reducing carbs help, but that carb reduction is not sustainable. But it is something that your body can adapt to. If you do it a couple of days a week, you're going to find some people find that they really love those low carb days. Some people have a little bit more of a challenge with low carb days. But again, after six weeks we say, okay, on a low carb day, does low carb day look like 50 grams of carbs to you? Is it maybe 75 grams of carbs? What is your low carb day? So my low carb day is 125 grams of carbohydrates, which is not low for most people. Exactly right. So my carb cycle is based on my activity level, but again that same amount of calories I need for my fuel. So if someone is sedentary, but their blood sugar is high. Dropping those carbs down in a sustainable way by carb cycling periodically through the week allows them to really reap the benefits of stabilizing that blood sugar and allowing them to bring those. I mean, carbs are found in vegetables. People are scared of bananas. They are freaked out. Yeah. So, yeah. So it. But it's just a gentle undulation and. But everybody who comes in, who goes through this feels all right. I feel better on this day. I feel better on this day. And I'm able to heal myself because a lot of people are just dying. Really? Yeah. I mean, they're literally just doing that.

Okay, so before I move on to. I'm going to ask you a question about protein. But with the carbs, where are you getting most of your carbs from? Are they mostly coming from fruits and vegetables? Are you adding sweet potatoes? Like, where is the majority coming from? From.

You know, I laugh about this because, again, I've tried everything. So my husband is a competitive bodybuilder. I have seen all of the things, very unhealthy things. I'm not, but I've seen all kinds of things. So thinking about, you know, where the carbs come from. And I always wanted to try the experiment, so I said, let me see if I can just try only fruit. I believe that I'm German and Dutch. There's no mangoes in Holland. Okay. So the food that I was eating when I did that, all fruit. I didn't feel the way I wanted to. So I found that, you know, my primal life, I think, is more potatoes and rice. So I do love potatoes, rice, rice cakes. You know, oats are great. Ish. But I'm like you. Sometimes they're my friend and sometimes they're not. But those are mostly the sources. And. And the carbs that I like that, that work best for my body from fruit are vegetables. But I do really well with squashes. And some of those starchy vegetables are great. But again, taking the process, this food out of the equation also takes out the grayness. Well, can I know the answer if it doesn't come from the ground or have a mother?

Yeah, that's a good point.

You know, what's your question right now? And there are times faster way does not. And I wasn't going to go into a program that was going to say, you can't do, not only take away a macro, but don't take away a food group. And don't take away, you know, a glass of wine or, you know, A donut. These are the things that people want. And so we found a way to incorporate that as well.

But yeah, okay, talk about protein for a minute. Are you eating your body weight and protein less more or you don't know?

More, more. So I. Yeah, yeah. So I remember tracking macros when OJ Simpson was driving down the highway. Like that's how long I've been doing this. Right. I just remember with my pencil like doing the math all the time. So I've been doing this forever. When my fitness pal came out, I put my weight in, it was 140 pounds, whatever. And I said I wanted to weigh 120 because I guess in eighth grade I looked good. I have no idea. I'm 165 pounds right now. Like I don't know what 120 looks like. But my protein goals at that point I just found the, the default ratio that my fitness pal gave us which was 50% or. Excuse me. Yeah, 20% protein, 30% carbohydrates and then the rest or fat and the rest were carbohydrates. So that was my initial breakdown. It started me out at about 110 grams of protein and the stronger I got now, I mean how many years? So I get up to 200 grams sometimes.

How do you get all that in? Are you eat like are you eating, supplementing a protein powder or what are you doing?

I, I do, I, I try, I do. I, I can get it through a lot of food. I mean I, I can, I can eat girl. So I have eggs and I have chicken and I have turkey. I try to vary my protein as much as possible. I find that fish is much easier for me to digest and ground ground meat is easier for me to digest. It's like been pre chewed. Yeah, but versus a steak. But I do. So I have salmon, I have white fish, I have chicken, I have ground turkey, I have, I have grass fed beef, I have eggs. Yeah. And then protein powder.

My, my issue, I, I try to get pretty close to my body weight and protein a day but I find I, some, a lot of times will have to supplement protein powder. And I think part of that is like in the, for instance in the, in the more my first meal if I want eggs, like I cannot eat five or six eggs. Like it's a it one or two and that's not enough protein. So I find there's a lot of times I end up having to supplement the powder.

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. I mean I've had protein powders forever and I'VE gone through different times where I think I had too much whey at one point so I took a break and then it can come back. But protein powder, I mean I probably have a shake, at least a shake a day or I put it in my coffee. I mean I can so convenient get.

20 with 30 grams of protein.

Exactly. You can make a pancake with it. You can do a lot with it. But it definitely, definitely helps for sure.

Yeah. Because I, to me, I mean I don't, I rather have unprocessed food but I know if I can have two scoops of protein and get an additional almost 60 grams of protein, like to me it's a no brainer. Especially if it's just like pure whey.

Or it's just protein. Yeah. And it's hot. You know here in Florida it's hot. I'm from Texas. It's hot. So a cold shake is great. And then you know, maybe if it's warmer you can put, you can make a hot cocoa with it. We have an awesome protein at faster way that is hydro beef and so it's got all the branch chain amino acids but it is, is dairy free because a lot of people don't beef.

You said. I didn't.

It's hydro beef.

Interesting.

Hydro beef. Yeah. So it's curated from. From interesting animal. Yeah.

Okay.

It's fantastic. And so it's a fairly new construct and we created our entire line this year.

Got it.

And it's fantastic. Okay, that helps.

Okay, so facts, how many are you doing? I'm pretty much like an. I use my hand a lot so I'll use like basically my. I kind of. I like. My palm is my protein and my thumb is my fat. Are you sort of the same or do you.

Absolutely. And again, since I've been doing this for so long, I definitely want to take a shortcut. And everyone's hand is proportioned to their body. Right. So my thumb is different than your. Than your thumb. So that is the greatest way to do that. And if you can spread your fat out throughout the day, that's ideal. But I do find that my body is more sensitive to fat. Fat. So a lower.

Mine too.

Yeah.

And it took me a while to figure this out, but I expect. I don't know if it's an age thing too, but I, I've started to go way lower on my fat than I was a few years ago and.

I feel like it just, you know, you said that earlier. You said people were so excited about bringing fat in so they just over consumed. Yeah, it's a dosage, you know, it's a sprinkle.

I would do like handfuls and nuts. And I'm wondering why I'm getting all the sweet, like, well, hello, nine calories per gram. Yeah, there's.

It's an issue.

So I stopped, I stopped that.

Yeah, I know. It doesn't take long to figure that out.

No, nuts are not a free food. Okay, so let's talk about intermittent fasting now.

So.

So from my perspective, what I've always taught, and I'm so interested in your feelings on this and how you'll correct me or change me or challenge me or what's new. So for me, when I look at traditional intermittent fasting, I think it's eat all your food in four to six hours and then don't eat the rest of the time. And I have found that's very hard for people to make that a lifestyle. So what I have taught in my books and in my programs is what I call modified fasting. And I teach that, number one, you give your time more space between meals. So it's not that eat every two hours like we used to teach. And it's also about giving yourself a longer gap at night. So starting with 12 hours, like if your last meal is six, you don't need to six again. I find that's a great way to ease in, which gives your body a break from secreting insulin. And when you're. Because you, if you're secreting insulin, you're not burning fat. So I find that's like a gentle way to ease in.

Yep.

But I'm curious, how much more of a benefit do you see, like really going strict to the four to six hours? Is that what you teach? Like, yeah.

Yep. So no, these are good. I love what you're saying because I'm the same way as you. I don't think that people understand how much that nighttime feeding can interrupt their sleep and their people were so programmed to wake up and have breakfast. And breaking your fast, fast after you have that digestive rest makes sense. 12 hours is a great starting point because of the amount of food that I have to eat to maintain. All that was the big realization this year too. I went, wait a minute, I got to keep, keep doing this now. So in order to maintain that, I've got to eat all that food in. So 12 to 14 hours of a fast for me works very well. We recommend, because of the success that we've seen, a 16 hour fasting window and an 8 hour feeding window. So a lot of times people will say they skip breakfast. I, I, it's not, you don't skip it, you just move it. Skipping implies that you're, you're eliminating something. It's really a schedule. It's not about taking that meal away. When you do have about eight hours to consume your food, three square meals are great. You know, snacks. Amanda, she always says this is great. Snacks are for babies. You know, I think we can get hung up in the snacks, but if we sit down, enjoy our food, because it is a gift, right? The food is wonderful. There's bountiful, you know, meals that we can just enjoy and if we can sit down and enjoy the food, wonderful. Some people say, I can't wait till noon. I'm a teacher, I'm this, all these, and we said, let's talk about how you can, or what if you did eat first thing and then you close that window at 4 or 6 in the evening, you can close that window down. But again, it's going to vary from person to person. But 12 hours is the perfect starting point. 16, 8 seems to be a sweet spot for me.

I think I'm probably actually not intentionally. 16, 8, I don't, I don't think I, I, it wasn't a planned thing, but I think that's just naturally what I've been doing and it makes sense. But I like that you just shared that because I think it's, it is intimidating for people to think they have to do it in four hours or six hours. I mean, eight sounds more doable. And then even starting with the 12.

To me, and just like you said though, that mindset thing is such a, I, I didn't want to fast at all. I thought, great, now I'm gonna lose everything. I'm not, I'm not doing it. I'm not, just not. So my husband, he's a guinea pig too. So he, he eats in a four hour window and what he puts down is just, he doesn't talk for four hours either, but it's going down. So I just watched him and I'm like, how are you not losing strength? You're not losing size, you're not losing anything. So I was intrigued by him when I found the faster way and I said, okay, let me just try it by the book. It's uncomfortable for a second because your body has to adapt. Everything's uncomfortable until it becomes comfortable. So we're finding out what that is. And if you eat enough the day before, then it becomes just a Habit. If you need to fast a little bit longer because you're traveling, you know that everything you work for isn't going to go away. And your body is grateful for the chance to put everything where it belongs. And it's not just filled up constantly with more stuff to put away.

Yeah. Plus I think a lot of the snacking too, it comes out of boredom and habit versus actual hunger. I really believe that.

I agree with you. You.

So I think just even being aware of that, noticing that, but for me, a big connection about like not that every time you're eating or screening insulin, when you're screening insulin, you're not burning fat, just that information alone is enough to sort of change things.

Yeah. It just makes you think, okay, like is, is this necessary? Right? Am I eating for food? Am I eating for fun? Am I eating for function? Am I eating for what am I doing right? And if you and my kids too, I've got a 19 year old daughter, an 18 year old boy. They're completely different. It's a bunch of different meals at the table. Are you having dinner together because you like each other or because you're forcing everyone to eat the same thing at this point? Like, let's let go of some of those traditions that make us feel so resentful because everybody has to eat the same thing. No, let's just enjoy the time together, you know?

Yeah, that's. I love that. Okay. You know, it's funny because I watch, because my daughter's 15 and I watch her eating like she naturally doesn't want to eat three meals a day. Like she wants to eat one or two. Like that's. And like old school thinking was like, no, she can't do that. But knowing what I know now, now like if that's when she feels hungry and wants to eat, it's fine, that's perfect, let her.

And there's, there's an intuition that comes from exploring what you learn and from exploring that body and intuitive eating is not, it's, it's, it's not, it's not a thing. Because my intuition a lot of times really just wants pizza and beer. Let's be clear. But, but that intuition, like I think.

Back to high school, I didn't want to eat breakfast, but we were like taught. Like I was always taught, like you have breaks. Most important meal of the day. But no, I, I wasn't hungry in the morning.

Yeah, totally. And you're probably still digesting and you're still getting your body ready. I mean, it's just but again, we're so people. The older people get, the more dogmatic they become. And they say, this is the only way. This is the only way. This is no, there is no one only way. We're going to teach you how to do it all and you're going to pack away what works best for you and then you're going to continue because three months later, your body's going to adapt again. And what does that look like? And how does your movement match that? And now that you've got all this energy, you weren't working out for six weeks. Weeks, you've got all this new energy because you're being fed now. You might want to exercise a little bit more, move your body a little bit more, feel that your joints are lubricated because you have enough fat in there not to overdo it. I mean, all of these are, these are quality of life things. I mean, it's 4:30 in the afternoon. I'm about to jump out my skin all the time.

Yeah. You know what else I'm just thinking as we're talking here? I mean, obviously we're not huge fans of calorie counting, but, but calories do still matter. And if you think about it, you know, it's 3,500 calories to lose one pound of fat just by giving up that first meal of the day or that late me, you're going to just lose weight from that if you think about it.

Sure, sure. And again for the overeaters. Exactly. The overeaters are really, really happy psychologically to say, okay, this is my window. Like again, there's nothing great ding when the bell rings. I'm done for. The under eaters, they really struggle because they say I can go for two days without eating. I mean, I've been there before, you know, I'm not, I'm not hungry. I can go. So I don't have that problem. So, you know, the idea is how much can you eat without gaining fat and how strong can you get? Because then we got to pull those numbers down. Right. You're not, I'm not going to be deadlifting 500 pounds. I'm not going to eat forever. Then we pull it back. How little can you eat and still stay strong? And then it becomes like this. And the leaner you become, the more fine tuning you can do with those numbers and a little bit more freedom you have with it as well.

So good. Okay, what do you think of like, all the plans out there that talk about like actual fasting, like skipping a whole day or skipping two days. Are you a fan? Are you not a fan now?

I am really.

Okay, tell me.

Yes. So. Well, so we are periodically we enjoy a 24 hour fast together. So what happens is we stop and that is, I mean I heard, I just heard all the breaks in this town just hit. Everyone just hit the breaks just. Now 24 hour fast is when you stop up. You start your timer at the end of your meal in one night and then the following day, 24 hours later you eat again. So most of the time you spent sleeping, you stay busy. You're not going to train or work out on that day, but it is just this hyper effort to bring your body into digestive rest so that your body is able to really I'm, I'm smarter, I'm sharper when I am in that 24 hour fast. Fast. But again it's the dosage doing that over and over again in such a small amount of time. If you're 24 hour fasting for three or five days a week, you know, or at a time then you're going to the opposite direction. So on a 24 hour fast. And I'm just going to be honest, I've only done the 24 like two or three times. I'm great with like I made it to 20. I feel good, you know, but I'm not, you know, super hungry. I've made the mistake of going to get something that is a little bit more highly palatable, that doesn't feel great the next day. But really breaking that fast with a whole food meal. I picture my body as this dried up sponge and I'm like all my body wants right now are these micronutrients. I've been drinking water all day and I can just feel it almost taking all those vitamins, minerals and putting them exactly where they need to be. I wake up the next day fresh, ready to go. But again it's strategic, it's timely, it's when does it work. But we practice, practice one time together in that six weeks and say let's see what we can do again after we've gone through all that we know and, and that the only thing that we have to tell people don't fast too much but 24 hour fast once a month every now and then. I think it's great. It's great.

Which is also a lot of undoing because I think we were, we taught, we learned so many years ago about like you're going to ruin your metabolism but that your metabolism ruining is over time of like consistent calorie deprivation versus like these strategic fastings.

100 and it's not. The metabolism works. The only time it doesn't work is if you're. You moved on to the next. You know, when you're, when you pass, your metabolism is just adjusting to your behavior. So we can increase every people's metabolism by bringing in the right food at the right time at the right speed. This is not again, a lifestyle and change and mindset and change is practice with a group of people who are in this in the same place. Everyone's looking to feel better. Everyone's at this age. I feel like, I feel like aesthetics is a secondary thought. I think we're like, oh no, I don't want to get cancer. I don't want to get all that my other friends are having. I want to feel good. I want to be able to get up and down and I want to do all these things. I think that that's an impetus. But then once they start to eat enough and they're like, again, same thing. Like, what's happening to my body, it looks different. The motivation changes, but we have to do it together. I always feel like we are just like I said earlier, I was a pioneer by myself. I felt like, but if we can do this together, we can change a generation. And that whole entire mindset of everything is going to happen in one day. Nope. You're not going to get exactly where you want to be in one day and you're not going to lose everything you've done in one day. You're going to learn how to use a strategy that works best for you at that time for your longevity.

So good. Oh my gosh, I love this. Okay, so I'm gonna, first of all, I'm gonna ask in a second Lee where they can find you. But I want to what I want to. I'm doing a really fun partnership happening with Faster way because I just been so fired up learning about their whole process and how they work together. And I just think it's such the perfect place for especially those of you that have been through my fat loss programs and my workout programs. Like this is the perfect next place for you because it's just next level with they're going to take you through. It's like everything you learn from me is still there. Plus you get this whole additional learning on the carb cycling and the intermittent fasting that you can try on. And like these really, they are so set up for you to win with daily workouts. It's crazy. And an individual coach. I mean, this is like, next level. This is like everything. If I had all kinds of energy and creativity, I would have built.

Exactly. And that's what Amanda did. And I'll be honest, you know, like I said, seeing everything and being so curious and always being a student, you know, I was looking at all these programs and I said, okay, well, let's see. Let's see what this little young youngster.

No, I love what she. I've been friends with Amanda, and I just love what she's built and created. And it's. I think it's the perf place for the perfect place.

It literally is the perfect place for everyone who's tried everything. And coming from you having the education right now, it's the next level. Because like I said at the beginning, there's always a next level, no matter what. And how do you get there? What does that look like? And how is it going to be safe and effective for you?

So they have chat, they have groups starting at all times. But when. At the time of this episode. Leasing right now, if you're hearing this around the time of the actual release date. If not, there's other dates you can join. Fine. But I want you to, like, really take seriously looking at this January start date, because not only am I doing a lot of stuff with them, but I've created some additional really cool bonuses for people coming in through me. Like some additional workouts that only you're gonna get from me. They're kind of like my last, final, best of best workouts. I promise. I told Amanda, I said, I will create them for you and for my people coming over there. So. So you every year. I know Amanda's like once a month, but seriously, they. I've got some really great bonuses for you. So I'm going to put a link in the show notes here. I'm going to put a link. So make sure you have that. Make sure you come in through that so you have access to the special bonuses. Plus, those of you that come through me are going to have a dedicated coach close to your age, which is one of the things I really wanted. I was like, I want. I want other midlife coaches that are living it and rocking the world to be the ones coaching my people. So I'm going to put all that down below Lee. Where else can find you? Because they might want. They might want to be curious. I'm sure they're curious. Yeah.

So you can go to Instagram at. Lee Bergen. It's. Lee is short for Leave on. So it's only two letters, L, E, B, E, R, G, I, N on Instagram. And every single day I go into my stories and I have no makeup on. And it is everything that I thought about when I was training at 5am so that is where I'm talking. The most amazing.

Well, thank you so much, Lee. This was super. That was fascinating. And I can't wait to see all of I hope, hope many of you are going to go check this out at that link, because I can't wait to see you in there and hear about your results and what's happening over there in the community. You're going to. You're in good hands over there.

We are pumped. We're ready for everybody. We're here for you.