Real Life Confidence Success Story: Matt’s Transformation

Coming to you from the center for Social Confidence in Portland, Oregon, welcome to Shrink for the Shy Guy Helping men everywhere go from social anxiety to social domination. With your host, Dr. Aziz.

Welcome to today's episode of the show. And today is going to be an inspiring episode, an inspirational episode, perhaps they all are. But this one especially because in today's episode I'm actually interviewing someone who's an expert, but not because they studied stuff in a book or because they have mastered stuff for decades or something, but because they're a real person, just like you, who was really stuck in shyness, I mean really limited, who step by step figured out how to break free. And I love this. This is another interview where I do a success story with a former client who really just took charge of his life. And I find him incredibly inspiring. And not only that, but he is very articulate in how he can describe kind of how he was thinking, where he was at in his life and then where he is now. And not only that, but the steps that he took, the stepping stones, the path. And so if you listen to this interview that I do with him, his name is Matt. And. And you really apply what you learn, you can follow in his footsteps. Just like thousands of other people that I've had the privilege of interacting with either directly or in groups or through one of my products or programs or through this show or YouTube channel, whatever it is. I've gotten so much feedback from the world out there and people who are saying, hey, I'm applying this stuff and this works. And so if you're coming to this episode and you're kind of like, yeah, but my situation's different or I'm worse or I'm not as good looking and you're in that place, of all the reasons why maybe it won't work out for you. I'm so glad you're listening to this today because you're going to leave here with a newfound sense of energy and inspiration and hope, knowing that you can shift your life. Whether you want to get out of a place of a lot of shyness and a lot of stuckness to average functioning, being able to have conversations with people, or you're kind of already there, but. But you're limited at work and you want to break through that ceiling and just have more interactions, better interactions, rise to levels of management or leadership or increase your sales or you're in your own business and you want to be able to reach out there and network with people in your industry. You know, wherever you're going, wherever Your goal is it's the same process, and you're going to learn about the magical steps of that process from Matt. So without further ado, let's jump into our interview with him.

Expert interview.

My guest interview today is actually with a fellow named Matt, and Matt is a former client of mine, someone I worked with, actually, and got a chance to see him kind of firsthand go through some really powerful transformations and really started to see Matt apply things in his life and get some key distinctions that I think, from my perspective, have really expanded his life. And we'll get a chance to hear from him what he experienced and what he learned. But this kind of falls into my success series stories. People who really, you know, through working on themselves, are able to achieve a much higher level of confidence. So thank you so much for joining us for the show, Matt.

Oh, yeah, yeah. Thank you, Aziz, for letting me be on.

You are most welcome, man. And let's just start with. So guys can kind of get a sense of maybe where you were. So before you reached out to me, before we ever talked, can you give a little snippet of maybe what your life was like, maybe some of the challenges you were facing just so we know where you were starting from?

Yeah, yeah, totally. So basically throughout. Well, I'll go back to high school, basically. Once I entered high school, middle school was pretty good for me. I was confident in who I was. I didn't really have a hard, you know, time connecting with my classmates or making friends. And then I got to high school, and that kind of all changed in the ninth grade, and I kind of. I don't know, I guess I started kind of seeing kind of almost like creating clicks in my mind, you know, groups within the student body. Like, these are the cool kids. These are the nerds. These are like the weird, you know, kind of like the stereotypical, you know, something you might see in movies or tv.

Sure.

And I identified myself as, you know, one of the nerds, one of the. I don't know, I thought of myself as, like, you know, kind of like a loser socially and just like a very bad thing. And the friends I carried over from middle school, a lot of them went to the same high school, and they were also kind of the same, I guess, in the same group that I considered myself. But since I associated it with, like, negative worth, like social worth, you know, and I wanted to be seen as, like, disconnected from them and more like towards, like, the popular, like, cooler crowd, I basically disengaged from my friends and kind of ended up with no friends throughout high school in order to avoid looking like something I didn't want to be in the eyes of people I, you know, I didn't even know. And then it carried over into college. I was living away from home. I went to Linfield in McMinnville and really kind of the same pattern. I didn't really try to connect with anybody unless they gave me like an overt invitation that like I'd be welcomed to hang out with them or welcomed to talk with them. And I found that rarely happened. So most of the times I was really just alone. Didn't really know a lot of people. There wasn't really a part of any groups, much like in high school. And really my self esteem just you know, naturally kind of just went down and continued to go down until I realized, you know, this just. I wasn't happy at all and I needed to, you know, start looking into making some changes.

Yeah, I love it. You said some really interesting stuff in there. One of them was kind of wanting to look better in the eyes of people that I didn't even know. And I think I, and so many people can relate to, to that, you know, we're always just trying to look better so they, whoever the they is, might look more favorably upon us. But also, you said I wouldn't go interact with people until I got a very clear invitation, maybe almost an over invitation, like, yes, come talk to me. And as a result, it sounds like, you know, that didn't happen very often. And so you didn't have a lot of interactions.

Yeah, I mean, I was waiting for somebody to basically like, invite me to thing, like invite me to talk with them or to sit next to them or. Yeah, like you said. And basically I just kept on waiting and it rarely happened. And so. Yeah.

Yeah. And then on top of that, this perception of yourself, this kind of identity of, oh, I'm. I'm not one of the cool people, I'm not desirable, I'm kind of a loser.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like I had, I think I kind of had this idea in my head that if I wasn't, you know, this unpopular loser guy, I'd be getting these invitations, you know, constantly from strangers. Like, I, they just like be like, oh, you're so cool. I have to hang out. And so it's like, since I didn't get that, I'm like, oh, that must, you know, mean something bad about me. Like, you know, it was basically just validating that, you know, false mindset I had about, you know, how social Interactions basically work. Like.

Yeah, yeah, that's a, that's a really interesting point. We, we have this idea like, I'm a loser. And then the evidence that we take in from the world around us kind of seems to verify that and, and further that belief. So, yeah, this is, I think you really eloquently described. That's definitely the situation I was in for many years. And I know people listening might really identify with some of that perception of themselves and some of those hesitations about reaching out to people. So what would you say shifted as we started to work together? What are some of the things that you learned about reaching out to people? Maybe about yourself and, you know, whatever comes to your mind first. We can kind of peel back and see what's there. But what are some of the major things that you learned? We're going to pause here and take a quick break and then jump back into our interview with Matt.

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Well, I think, you know, at first I learned a lot just by, you know, really basically saying hi to people I didn't know, really connecting to them in a kind of just, you know, casual, fundamental, basic, whatever you want to call it, level where it's like I'm passing them on the street, I try to greet them, and a lot of people greeted me back. And I was kind of surprised by that. I thought most people wouldn't want to be bothered by me and that, you know, I should just, you know, like me reaching out to them was like a nuisance or an inconvenience or something like that. And I found that I got more positive reactions than I expected. And over time, the non reactions really bothered me less and less. I really didn't get any negative reactions, maybe one or two there. But most of the times it was either, you know, people would be like, hey, how you doing? Back to me, or smile at me, or they just like completely ignored me and be in their own kind of zone. But I didn't get the reactions, you know, I was expecting, like, kind of like the you Know those glances that say, like, you know, like, don't bother me, or, why are you talking to me? Or, you know, that kind of thing?

Oh, yeah, you're. You're a terrible human, and I'm repulsed by you. How dare you.

Yeah.

Interact with me.

And so. And I found that, like, most. It's a little hard to describe clearly, but for a long time, like, in high school and college, I had this idea that, like, certain people were, like, better than I was for some reason. Maybe it was the way they looked. Maybe it was because they had lots of friends. Like, if they were really attractive or tall or in really good shape or something, I'd be like, who am I to try to associate myself with them? They were on a level above me. And when I was greeting all sorts of people, I said hi to those people as well. And they were, you know, warm and pleasant to me back. And I'm like, you know, it kind of just disproved that idea that, you know, they were much different than I was, you know?

Yeah, and that's actually a really good point because I think just, you know, people.

Yeah, yeah, absolutely.

And so many people, I think, have that idea, like, oh, that person is. Is superior to me. And one of the things they point at is, well, they do seem more confident or they do seem more popular. And how did you get around that? How did you. So at first, it sounds like first you started to just interact with them like they were other humans and not distance yourself. But how did you start to shift that perception of yourself, do you think, as somehow less than they were?

Mm. I think at some level, I always kind of believed I was, you know, I had the same level of worth as they did. But, you know, there's. There was always that voice that was, like, really powerful. It was like there were two voices in my head. One was like, I'm a pretty cool person. You know, I can hang out with them. But then I was quickly overpowered by, like, no, you aren't. Like, don't say hi to them. Like, they'll just reject you, or you'll say something stupid, and you'll get embarrassed, and it'll be uncomfortable. But as I interacted with more people, I just started getting kind of showing myself a little more of that side of myself that I thought was cool and was funny or smart or interesting or whatever. And I started getting, you know, incremental, like, positive responses, like, this person would laugh at my joke, or this person would smile at me when I looked at them, or I could strike Up a conversation with this person just as I could with anybody else. And I just kind of used my kind of what I already had there that I was like too afraid to really show people because I just had, you know, low self esteem at that point. And it just started to gradually kind of shift that perception that, you know, the things that I had to say or thought about or just those aspects of my personality were, I mean, just as appealing as what they had going for them. I'm not sure if that really answers the question or makes much sense, but hopefully kind of you get what I'm saying.

I think I do. I mean, one of the things that I hear there is that you changed the way you saw yourself and stopped believing that other people would see you so negatively, that other people would be so dismissive, that. All these negative predictions about how social interactions were going to go and the thing that I hear coming loud and clear across from what you're saying that dissolved that for you. It really helped in that process was doing it because multiple times in there you said. And then. So when I did go talk to them or when I did put myself out there, here's what really happened. And I think that so many of us can stay stuck because we're not putting ourselves out there. We're not taking those little risks each day.

Yeah, I would definitely agree with that. And I think what was so powerful about me taking action and what really helped me was that it proved that other voice in my head, like you said, like what it was predicting actually didn't work out. Like it wasn't true. Like it was just like, you know, a narrative I was telling myself to keep me kind of in the same spot and keep me what I was used to, which was being unhappy. But that was what I knew, that was what was comfortable, you know. And so, so yeah, it was just like by taking the action I was saying, like, is what this, this kind of voice that tells me, you know, not to take risks because, you know, you'll get embarrassed or it'll be really bad if you get embarrassed, like you'll feel really bad about it.

And.

Most of the times I found either that didn't happen or when I did get embarrassed, it didn't last very long. It passed quickly and I moved on to the next person. Like it really helped me just, I would say now I can really just. Something I couldn't do a few years ago is just let things go much more and not dwell on like a slip up I made when I was talking to somebody. Or, like, analyzing everything I do so much or like, watching myself.

Yeah, sure. And I think I remember a really powerful moment for me in hearing from you and your story was this kind of turning point where. And I'm hoping you'll share a little bit about that, where there was this, I think, a family friend, a relative family friend that you kind of grew up with, and you always had sort of compared yourself to him, and, oh, he's real social. He's really good at talking. And there was this moment I remember you were telling me about when you were at some family gathering and something had shifted in the way that you saw him and the way that you saw yourself. And can you share a little bit about that experience?

Yeah, yeah, definitely.

We're going to pause here and take one more break and then get back into the conclusion of our interview with Matt.

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So, yeah, this guy is my cousin. And I remember. I think there's probably when I entered, like, high school age as a kid, I remember I was pretty close to him, me and my brother, you know, played video games with him, and I played basketball. And I really just saw us all as, like, equals. Like, I wasn't afraid to, like, say or express, like, what I considered, like, my dorkiness, like, around him. And. But then when I got, you know, into my teens, like, I think I really just kind of, like, closed up a bit around him and saw him as, like. Just like, wow, he's like, he's much better looking than I am. He's much. He has much better, like, physique. Like, he's better. He. He has a girlfriend. I don't. At dinner parties, he's making everybody laugh. I'm not talking to anybody. He's not talking to me, which, I mean, he's the cool guy. He's not talking to me. That's just what, you know, I'm used to. Like, it just proves that, you know, there's something wrong with me. But then, yeah, at this, you know, after a couple years of work, I. We had this family reunion in the Summer. And I saw him again for the first time in several months, and he was the same old Michael. He was just as, you know, kind of. He could take over a room with his personality. He could, you know, tell stories and have the whole, you know, dinner table listening to him. He could be the center of attention. And in the past, that would definitely make me feel, like, just, like, small or insignificant or invisible. Like, I didn't. Like, I just didn't really have, like, a place in the conversation or, like, just like, there wasn't, like, room for me to also be kind of, like, silly or, you know, that kind of thing. And so at this family reunion, I was just so. And he was the one to tell me what a difference he noticed that I was just so much more comfortable around everybody I was talking with, you know, aunts and uncles who normally I would dread talking to a few years ago just because I'm like, It just make me uncomfortable. Like, I feel like I didn't have anything to talk with them about or, like, it just, like, pester me with questions and I'd be, like, interviewed. But, like, I don't know, I just felt like, you know, I'm an adult now, just like they are. I'm on their level. Like, I can ask them questions. Like, I can direct the discussions just like Michael does. And I was just much more. I just felt much greater sense of freedom to just be however I wanted. If I didn't want to, you know, be the center of attention in a group or whatever, I would no longer, like, feel bad about that or take it as well. That's because, like, you don't have the personality. Or that's because, you know, you're too afraid to do it or, you know, or whatever other story I might be telling myself at the time. I could just be free to, like, sit back and enjoy what was going on. And then when I had something to say, I, you know, I just blurted out. Then Michael would say something, and then I'd, like, riff off of. Off of what he said. You know, it was just totally different than really how I had been in probably, like, 15 years since I had known him. And, yeah, I really just attribute it to just taking small actions consistently. Consistency, I think, was definitely one of the keys. And just, yeah, every action, every time I reached out to somebody was just like another example of, you know, my old way of thinking not being an accurate reflection of, really, reality. And it was just like. It's just really kind of a big relief to feel like I could really just Be myself and not have to try to, you know, hold something back or be kind of a certain person that people expected I would be since they hadn't seen me in so long or. I don't know, it was just. It was really refreshing and really positive for me.

Yeah, absolutely. And I think a sign of a lot of confidence to show up to a situation and trust that we can be ourselves and make jokes that we want to make and not overthink what we're going to say. And I think that really is a sign of that. Of that growth.

Yeah. And I would say it's. I mean, of course, that was like my family and extended family, but that's definitely extended to, like, my. My co workers, like people who aren't, like, related to me. And I don't know, as. I mean, you could say, well, yeah, you can be confident around people who, you know, love you because they're your family, you know, but like, basically strangers and my co workers I've had since I've been working and since that experience in the summer, I've, you know, found myself with. Able to approach it with pretty much the same mentality. Like in the break room, people I, you know, get along with at work, if, like three or four are up there, I can feel, like, free to just kind of, like, crack jokes and use, like, my kind of sense of humor. And sometimes they laugh, sometimes they kind of just like rushing me off and like, talk about a different subject. And I just kind of roll with it and, you know, try to just try take more of a leadership role in the engagement, you know, instead of, like, Ellenfield, like, waiting for, like, people to try to, you know, kind of get me included in what was going on. Just trying almost to force my way in there in, you know, in a sense. So I feel like just increased confidence really helped me with that as well. So it extended far beyond just the family reunion.

Sure. And, yeah, when we are willing to initiate, to dive in, to insert ourselves into situations, conversations, we have a lot more interactions, we have a lot more opportunities. And yeah, that big welcome mat of people saying, hey, let's stop what we're talking about and invite this person in. It's pretty rare for that happen.

Like, for example, I think what I would always wait for is somebody to say, matt, what do you think about this in the conversation, what they were talking about?

Everyone, everyone.

Shh, shh.

Matt has the floor. Go ahead, Matt.

Yeah, exactly. And now I just kind of add that spontaneously without, you know, without somebody trying to kind of, you Know, usher me into the conversation.

Awesome. Yeah. Just giving yourself that permission, not needing to hear it from someone else.

Yeah.

You know, one thing, I mean, I think you shared so much in there about how to develop that confidence and I'm wondering if you have some words for. Let's say there's someone who's listening who you, you know, maybe is where you were towards the beginning of your journey where you had a lot of that negative predictions, kind of being down on yourself, you know, and they're listening and they're thinking, oh man, I want to be able to do that, but I don't know if I can. It's going to be real uncomfortable. Is it really going to work anyway? Like, what would you say to someone who's in that, you know, wanting to grow but also a little wary or skeptical?

Yeah, I would say, I mean, to definitely start with kind of low risk interactions like just saying hi to someone on the street that you don't know. I mean, you never know what could happen. Most likely they'll say hi back and you know, that's that. But you could make their day or it could lead to another conversation or even if nothing else comes from it, at least you get the practice of, you know, that interaction and you really don't have much to lose just by starting. And once you start, it's easier to keep going. It's really just the act of starting that seems the most daunting. And it's like me, I. You can really go at your own pace. I went at probably a slower pace than, well, probably an average pace. You know, I probably could have tried to, you know, experiment with more interactions sooner than, than I did. But even, even going slowly, just starting with, with a few people a day or trying to talk to one new person, really just making small talk, like saying like, find it like realizing yourself in a situation where you have that opportunity and not shying away from it. Like at the grocery store or I mean, just like talking to the cashier. Like they're used to it and you know, it's like a no pressure environment, but it's still really, it can still like really benefit you. And I found that a lot of people actually kind of like talking to, you know, they like when people seem interested in them and even just try to get to know them a little bit. And so yeah, I would say at first it's, you know, you're going to have a few moments where it's like, it seems like it doesn't, it's not working. Like you're not getting the results you want. And I feel like that's also another key, is kind of not expecting things to happen, like a certain way right away. Like, my experience has been everything has kind of built, built on. On itself. Like, it's been a process. It's been, you know, a fairly long process. But it's not something that I feel like if I tried to rush it, I feel like it would have led to a little more like discouragement or frustration, but just giving yourself permission to be like, you know, not beating yourself up for not, I don't know, for not really being super successful at your first tries.

Yeah, I mean, I think I remember we had some conversations because I know you're really into basketball and we kind of likened it to practicing a certain kind of shot, like a three pointer. And, you know, consistency is huge. And if you said, okay, I'm going to practice like crazy for the next three days and then therefore, I'm going to become amazing at three pointers, that kind of sets us up for that discouragement or that frustration because it's. Yeah, you have to learn it over time. But if you said, you know what? I'm going to get out there, I'm going to shoot whatever, 15, 20 shots every day or three times a week, I'm going to go out and shoot 30. That. That is how you really start to build up that momentum.

Yeah.

Cumulative effect.

Yeah. And I would say the kind of. The word I would focus on that you use is momentum. I would say that's definitely like, once you get started, it's easier to continue. Once you stop and like, you know, take a break for a while, it's harder to pick back up where you left off. But I mean, also there isn't really like an end point where you feel like, okay, I'm, I'm there, I'm done. You know, my, my work is finished. I feel like I'm still working on everything I've learned and I can still improve and get better. And that's kind of the fun part of it is just kind of a challenge and figuring out, you know, how can I get, how can I even further increase, you know, my, my happiness in myself and what I can do and get closer to, you know, just keep on setting goals. But yeah, just the consistency and building that momentum. I would say starting out is definitely key. I remember, I think one time we went to a. I think it was a Whole Foods downtown, and I was just starting out and we were doing an exercise where I would ask, like, Five people for the time I would ask them what time it was. And at the time I thought it was, you know, really difficult. And you were, you know, telling me that, you know, that first person is. If I can get past asking the first person, I'll just. You just keep on going. And so I'm like, okay. And so I did ask the first person and then we were walking around and you kept on asking. You kept on picking out people for me to ask. Like the next person I pass and then the next person I pass and I just started doing it reactively and I wasn't even afraid or thinking about it after that first, you know, person. So it's really just. Yeah, I feel like it is. Just forcing yourself to really put in an effort and not just kind of hoping and waiting like I used to.

Yeah, that's a big one. The hoping and the waiting. And I love what you described. I remember that. That was fun when we did that. And there's something about inertia, you know, when an object at rest wants to stay at rest and. And when. Whatever it is, the first anything that first high, the first asking someone question. If your work involves talking to people or making sales, it's the first call that you make. It's always the first one. Because that's when all the negative stories can build and build and build and build and create this invisible force field that's trying to keep us from taking any action. Stay in the comfort zone. But then when you do it, once you've pierced through and there's this really cool moment where you pierce through and there's all this gravity that's trying to pull you back. But if you just do it again and then again and then again kind of quickly after a few, it's like your rocket has kind of broken through the atmosphere and the gravitational pull is not so strong. And then, yeah, then it's cool. Then it's like, well, what else? What's next? And I love that I've seen you still working on it, still growing, and myself included. I'm always looking at what is my edge, what scares me. Because what scares us is also where we feel the most alive, the most excited. That's where we can grow in our career chosen field of study or our businesses or relationship finding someone or making your relationship more awesome. Wherever you're at, it's always like that edge that we're most alive in. So I absolutely agree with you that it's a continual process and I really appreciate what you shared today, Matt. I think it's really going to help people listening to hear someone kind of go from exactly where. If you're listening to this right now and you think, wow, I sounds like I'm kind of where Matt was, then take note of what he says, maybe even go back and listen to this again and take notes, write things down and success leaves clues. And if you follow in the footsteps that he's talked about here, you can get results similar. You can get a lot more confident around people. I've seen it happen again and again and it's always great to hear it directly from the source. So thank you so much for joining us today for the show, Matt. I really appreciate it.

Yeah, no problem. Can I say one sure.

Final thought? Of course. Bring it on.

Adding final thoughts. But kind of if I could leave, you know, your listeners with one kind of message that I think I still use and has been. One of the biggest helps to me is that it's not really about you so much. At least when you're starting out, like when you, when you're trying to engage with people and if they don't go, well, if those engagements don't go the way you hoped or you feel like you're bad at it, like maybe you like, come across as like, maybe nervous and that gets like a certain reaction from people. It's like, that's okay. You're, you're, you're just, you're, you're making an effort to, for personal growth, which is an extremely positive thing that not everybody, like, consciously does. And so you should like one pat yourself on the back for that. But also like, people who don't know you, if they react a certain way, it's almost always saying something about something internal they have going on. And it's not like a comment on your like, individual worth as a human being. Like, I thought it was in for me in high school or in college, like, if you're working on this, you will get a lot of like, instances where it's like, oh, that didn't go the way I'd hoped, or that didn't go as well as I think it should, or I didn't do as well as I think think I should at this point there. It's like, and it's, it's easy to just really take things personally and identify with them. And that's what I did. And I don't do it anymore. And I'm in just a much better place by saying like, okay, that guy seems grumpy. It's not because I tried to talk to him. It's because, you know he has something going on or that person doesn't want to talk to me. It's not because they don't want to talk to me. It's because they're in a rush and they don't have time or something. It's in any other setting, they'd be happy to sit down and talk with me. It's not anything against me. It's not personal. And so.

Yes, absolutely. I'm glad you inserted that. We didn't conclude because that is a huge, liberating insight to really see and attribute what's happening not to some fundamental flaw in me and this invisible badness that I'm carrying. It's. Something's going on. Mostly people are just stressed about something in their life or they're uncomfortable, they're irritated, or they're worried. And so when we don't get the reaction we want, we really want to start to see more and more what this is not about me and what's going on with them. And you know, that is true. When you go do something like a small experiment where you do kind of the same thing again and again and you get a wide range of reactions and you're not doing anything different.

Yeah, I don't know. I guess I used to be maybe a little like egocentric. I don't know what you'd call it, in a way was like, I'm affecting everybody. Like I. I'm responsible for how everyone feels. Like if they're not happy, it's because of something I did or because of something I said, you know, like when that's not always true. And so it's. I don't know, it's really important to, as best as you can, try to remember that when you're trying to, you know, make a change and work on yourself.

Absolutely. I think that can really help us let go of some of that self criticism, being overly responsible. So thank you so much for sharing that. I think that's yet another gem from Matt. Write that one down, too. Awesome. Thank you again so much for joining us, Matt. I really appreciate it.

Oh, yeah, yeah, no problem. No problem at all.

That brings us to the end of the interview and the end of the episode. But before we go, we have to end with what we always end with, which is your action step.

Time for action.

Today's action step is to test something out. Remember how in Matt's interview he kept on talking about how I had this idea in my head that this is going to happen and then When I tested it out, when I went and did it, here's what actually happened. And it often was different. Our predictions are often wrong, overly negative, overly fearful. And the only way to prove them wrong, to show to ourselves that we are capable, we are likable, that people do want to talk to us, is by testing something out. So you got to get out there today, or if you're listening to this late at night, then tomorrow find something and test it out. Notice one of those little predictions, maybe a small one that says, oh, they're not going to like that. Oh, don't make that joke. Oh, don't go talk to those people and do it. Just get out there and do it. Test it out and see what really happens. And again along the way, have a lot of compassion for yourself. Be patient with yourself. It's a process, and it's not about each individual interaction. It's about you stepping out there and working on yourself and being committed to do it again and again and again and again. And that is how you break free. That's how you create extraordinary levels of confidence. So thanks so much for joining us today. I've had a great blast talking with Matt and hope you learned as much as I did from him as he has. I mean, he's got a tremendous amount to share. So thank you again to Matt. Thank you for listening and I look forward to speaking with you again in the future. Until we do, may you have the courage to be who you are and to know on a deep level that you're awesome.

Thanks for listening to Shrink for the shy guy with Dr. Aziz. If you know anyone who can benefit from what you've just heard, please let them know and send them a link to shrinkfortheshyguy.com for free blogs, ebooks and training videos related to overcoming shyness and increasing confidence, go to socialconfidencecenter.com.

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