Squircle: Where Science and Nature Come TogetherEpisode 095 with Francis Cholle of Squircle Academy

Greetings, everyone, and welcome to another serving of business soup. Talk radio.

If it's in business, it's business soup. I'm your host, John Dibavoise. Today, the recipe involves Francis Choell from the Human Company talking about his best selling book, Squircle, where it uses deep human learning and cognitive science to help you and your organization solve complex problems and thrive in disruption. Well, if this isn't the year to learn to thrive in disruption, because that's all. All it's been is disruption. He's an international speaker, best selling author, and he is joining us as a radical thinker, global thought leader, and he's going to serve up his revolutionary way of thinking that is especially relevant today in this climate of chaos. Get in line because Squirkle is on the menu. And this is business soup, where business comes for business.

Francis, welcome to this serving of business soup.

Hello, John. Thank you. Very happy to be with you.

It is our pleasure. Business soup is all about the small business owner. You are talking about the unconventional science based model of Squircle. What is the Squircle and how does that apply?

All right, I'll be happy to do this. That's what I spend my days on. So Squircle is simply square and circle coming together. We all have a square side, which is the ability to reason, the logical mind. And we have the circle side, which is the ability to feel, to respond to sensations and emotions, inspirations and intuition. We live in a society where the square is predominant and tends to squash this other part of ourselves as inferior, not intelligent, misleading, and not something that we should trust.

Wait, wait, back up. We're not supposed to trust our circle?

Yes, at school, you know, everywhere, you know, people will tell you, hey, come on, put your emotions aside, mind over matter, and so on and so forth, you know, so it's like, hey, come on, this is what makes us human. You know, that's what actually AI specialists have a hard time to duplicate. It's not about denying our logical mind. Obviously not. It's not about trusting blindly your emotions, sensations and intuitions. But it's about realizing that both have their place. One has been developed through our culture, the logical mind with its great language called science. And we're all grateful for science, obviously. And the other one is what we're born with, A natural capacity to adapt, create and be resilient. So you don't want to take the power over the other one, but you need to realize that we live in a society where the circle is squashed by the square. Whereas a good synergy between the two will make you successful today. And every entrepreneur understands that. But the model is there to make it very obvious, very clear, and in moment of confusion, remember that you have this natural ability to move through those complex problems that life throws at us.

In your book, you talk about these two. And if I am to step away and put the rational side, the square on the left, and the circle, which is where I've lived, the passion of going, you know, I'm the first one to say, I can do that, you know, jump in or strap myself on, let's go for the ride. That's not the logical thing to do. That's the emotional thing to do. So I'm looking at the square and the circle, and I'm supposed to bring them together in some way in which they balance out. How do you separate those two? And then what's the step to blend them together so I don't kill myself?

It's not about bringing them into balance. It's to allowing a natural synergy between the two. The synergy is when the forces in presence, the factors that come together, create more than the sum of each. It's a good, healthy marriage. It's a good partnership. When two people come together and create more than they would do individually because there's a chemistry. There's something that happens. And I always say, the sun and the tree produce oxygen. Nobody's trying. But you remove the tree, that doesn't work. You remove the sun, that doesn't work. And the two together create something that allows life. So we are humans, we are synergistic, you know, within ourselves and with others. And when we're able to understand that there are those two forces in us, those two approaches in us, and that we live in a culture, unfortunately, when one is devalued, when actually it's as essential as the other one. And if you're able to allow those two to come together. So I'm going to give you an example. We respond to gut feelings in emergencies, and they save our lives.

Right. Well, that fear of loss is the greatest motivator.

Yeah. I wrote in a previous book, the Intuitive Compass. You know, in Iraq or in Lebanon, a soldier walking up the street and picks up a cue. He cannot explain it, but he knows he has to get out of the road, and he jumps out based on that cue that he cannot explain, but he is forcing him to take action. And then two minutes later, boom, there's a bomb. And he would have died if he had not thrown himself off the road. So that's gut feeling. And then there is intuition. And intuition to me is like, it's like a search engine. Imagine Google. That goes beyond words. The image here is that we have a search engine that can take us beyond what we can understand. So the logical mind will stop and say doesn't make sense. But then that search engine will keep going.

That's right.

Whether they're right or wrong, whether they make sense or doesn't make sense comes back. And then that's your responsibility to process it and put it in perspective with your experience, with your mentor's words, with what you read and you evaluate. You know you have the responsibility of making a choice, but know that if you are able to pay attention, to pause, to give it a bit of time, that nonsense making cue may make a huge difference. And in business, Steve Jobs built Apple like this. He thought that computers were more than efficiency machine. And he created the biggest capitalization based on an intuition and inspiration. He says that everywhere you have to pay attention to intuition. It's not going to deliver truth, it's going to deliver something different.

What's the difference between intuition and a dream? Let me refine that. You know, I'm a business owner and I have this vision. I have a dream that I want to get to a certain level. What's the difference between that intuition and the dream? And obviously the dream is something that isn't in existence. So how do I get there? And is my intuition going to be the tool that gets me there?

That's a great question, John. So the dream is the aspiration, that's the vision. I know in me that's what's going to really meet the consumer's appetite or whatever that is. Okay, I know there's an opportunity there and I want to be part of that adventure to create that opportunity and to turn it into a business. Okay, so great, that's an assumption. And then there's no one to tell you whether the assumption is right or wrong. That's entrepreneurship. Okay, but then comes in intuition, your best friend, because it will give you cues and subtle information that will bring nuances to how you get there to even the vision itself. And it's going to you enter in a dialogue within yourself that will allow you to make experimentations just like a scientist. And you'll validate along the way, step by step, whether you need to adjust, whether you need to give up, whether you need to keep going. And that inner dialogue is made possible when you develop that quote call, attitude, ponder, feel and trust. There is more to it than what you can rationalize and understand. And sometimes when put into words.

Squircle is now a best seller on multiple platforms, including Amazon and Wall Street Journal. When I pick up that book, when someone orders it on Amazon says, you know what, I was listening to this on Business Soup and you know, Francis has got a point and I buy that book. What is it that I'm looking to accomplish by getting your book and reading it? What path is it going to take me down to solve a problem?

Well, first thing you can do, go to squirrelacademy.com and at the top right, you'll see an orange tab. Test your thinking now. So just go there, test your thinking now, and you'll get a free report, 20 pages and something customized to your way of thinking. Whether you're square leaning person or circle leaning person. What SquirrelQL will deliver to you is the ability to make the most of what you have and make the best of what the people who are around you. And you told me, John, that you were talented at getting other people to do what you wanted to see happen. So SQL will allow you to really create those great synergies either within you or outside of you. And there are lots of tips from Managing time from Squircle. You those synergy within you, SQL collaboration with other types, dialogue, communication, very concrete tools that will allow two things that you stay on track with. Your budget, your timelines, your product launch. And at the same time have this creative ability to get off the beaten track and leapfrog competition because you'll come back with ideas coming from nowhere that nobody had thought about. And you know, entrepreneurship is all about this making the extraordinary ordinary. And that's the journey of the entrepreneur.

At your website, the human company. That's where I can test myself.

Go, go to Squircle Academy.

Oh, Squircle.

Okay.

I've advised big CEOs of big global organizations and I wrote Squirkle Academy to make that knowledge, which I've seen work over and over again. That's why I can speak from authority about it, from experience, that it works. And I create Squirrelquil Academy so that to pay forward, you know, to the world what I've seen work in those global organizations can work in everybody's lives, whether you're an entrepreneur, whether you're a student, whether you're a professional. So on squirrelcallacademy.com you have this free assessment. Test your thinking now. And that will give you a real insight into what you can get out of squirrelcall. Book which as I said, explains very well the simple model, how you can tell it to your employees, how you can build teams around this, more synergy between square and circle within your teams diversity. And how it can help you innovate and actually get to your full potential.

You're saying that Squircle is a new way to think for the new world?

Yeah.

What does that mean?

It means that we live in a world that's fast changing, deeply transforming.

True.

And the hopeful message of squirrel is that we have all in us to succeed in that new world. Let me explain. We are natural adapters, we are natural creators, we are natural disruptors. And I'll give you a very simple example. Imagine a bird and a nest. The bird at any given moment can leave the nest and go into the wilderness, feed itself, adapt, right? Create new ways to feed itself and then can come back to its nest. The structure to rest, to repose, to reproduce, etc. So you have the nest, which is the square, and you have the bird, the white bird. That's a circle, you know, pure adaptation, pure flow in the moment. Now you replace the nest and you create a cage and you put lots of food in the cage and water and you put the bird in there and you close the door. So now, great, the bird is fed. The bird doesn't have to protect itself from all the predators and dangers. It's a great habitat. But the bird is no longer a bird. The bird becomes an object of decoration. And in being imprisoned, not being able to leave its nest because it's a cage, and going into the wilderness and adapting and creating and surviving, it's losing all its natural abilities to create, adapt and be resilient. So what Sqworld does is it makes sure that all the tools that you have will never squash your natural abilities to create, to adapt and to be resilient. We are of nature, nature lives in us. And we are as such natural adapters, creators and resilient. And that's important to understand that all the tools we have should never take us over to the point that it limits and restrains those natural abilities. So what Squirtle does for this new world that's so different than what we used to know even five years from now, and which will keep changing more and more, is awakening in you what's already there so that you can adapt and create regardless of the level of disruption. And that just requires a change of mindset and a change of attitude. And that's what the book is about.

Men and women can look at something and approach it or interpret it differently. There's the old women's intuition. And they might say, you know, that's not such a good idea. And the guys go, let's go. How does the one book address those two different mindsets when people are looking at the same object or the same activity in two different concepts? And how do you bring them together?

Square quote is all about doing more action, innovation, success in a way that allows pauses, inner calm, and reflections. Yeah, I remember a client telling me. I remember Andrea in our executive room. And I could tell, looking at Andrea's face and body language, when I had to stay still and not say anything because I knew what she was about to say was important. Just pause and listen. So that's what Squirrel Cool is about. I've listened to women for three years, two years, sorry. And then worked for one year with a group of women here in Los Angeles. Because I know, and it's been researched, that women have great contributions to make, but very little opportunities to do it in those regular organizations as we know them. Women for decades, from puberty to menopause, have a relationship to their body that men don't have. Once a month, they are called to nature, and that requires collaboration, humility. They fluctuate emotionally and physically with whatever is going on in their body. And their productivity, efficiency, and way of relating to others during the day are affected by this natural phenomenon within themselves that happens once a month. So that enables them to develop a sensitivity and a humility to the environment that men don't have an opportunity to develop unless they listen to women and learn from them. And so one is definitely circle. What happens in our body is of the body. It's circle. And the attitude that you develop towards what's going on in your body is the circle attitude, meaning your ability to reason. Something that's beyond what we can understand or predict fully has to surrender. So that's where the square is no longer dominant and functions with the circle to create a deeper intelligence, a broader intelligence, a finer intelligence that's actually making you fit exactly for the world we're entering now.

So by listening to women who have this different natural connection, I could learn from them. My wife keeps telling me that all the time.

Absolutely. No, but that's true, John, and she's right. And, you know, to learn from someone doesn't mean that you learn blindly. Whatever knowledge you acquire from someone brings even more responsibility. The more knowledge you have, the more responsibility comes with it. So it's not like you learn and you follow blindly. You Learn, you ponder, you reflect, you contrast with your experience. You contrast with your better knowing, inner knowing. You contrast with other sources of knowledge. And that's how we enrich each other. And that's a true synergy. That's a true synergy. And what women say you can learn from us is because men and the system that we function in and the way we organize work has given too little space for women to be heard. But there's absolutely an opportunity, very topical, for our time, to learn precious insights from women, certain ways of being that leads to new ways of doing that are absolutely fit for the time.

And as I've been telling everybody and what I did in my companies is that I surround myself with those people who are the best in what it is they do, whether it's a man or a woman. It's surround yourself with people who are smarter than you in particular subjects that give you the information, the tips, tools and techniques, as I call it, so that you can make an intelligent decision and move your business forward.

Agreed.

One of the hardest things is to listen to them, because sometimes what they're telling me isn't in line with what it is. Is my vision where I want to take that company, and they're not telling me what I want to hear, but I need to listen to them because they know better than I what those steps are involved to get to that vision.

So, John, you've experienced it, you know, as an entrepreneur, you know, we come from that, as you said, vision, dream, inspiration, things that aren't necessarily rational. And it's important as well to be able to be open to the contribution of others. And it's not an opposition, it's a merging. It's a coming together. And there's an enrichment in it. If you're able to be open to diversity, to different point of views, that's when there's a true enrichment and you change. I'm sure, John, that you've done things in the past, 20 years ago that you know better about now, that you will not repeat, even if you're tempted to repeat and just do it the way you want. But now you know better. You've learned, you know, you're not going to. So you're more open, you're more malleable, you're more. You're more collaborative, I'm sure, with people different than you are. And that's what Squircle does.

So by reading this book and then perhaps taking it further into the program that you teach through the other company, the intuitive compass, you've Taught a lot of people how to do this. This sounds like something that would be very informative and educational as going to a seminar or in a workshop type environment, surrounding yourself with people that are seeking the same thing. I see that as a huge benefit, not just from sitting in front of myself, talking to myself or reading the book, but being able to experience that from others in your workshops.

So that's what we do. Actually, Friday I got a workshop with eight coaches, people who are in the process of becoming consultant of the Squirrel Call methodology so they can bring it to companies and to their teams. And eventually we will also put out an assessment that will be much deeper and broader than the square call test that you have online for free right now, so that you can learn with others what is really your potential. And we specifically look at one thing. How do you make decisions in a complex world? So we left the golf course where you can linearly move from hole number one to hole number two to hole number three. So it's a linear trajectory where you can have strategies, things are clear and delineated. And we left that course, we left the golf course and now we're in the jungle. So when you are making linear decisions on the golf course now you have to make what I call holistic decisions. The way you make decisions, when you drive, you take the whole around you as a whole and you adapt. So on decision making, we're putting out an assessment and from that assessment we'll develop webinars to bring people to come and learn together from one another. So that's in the plan for today. You can go to the website squarecodecademy.com take the test you're thinking now, and you'll stay in touch with us and we'll feed you with insights and opportunities to come and learn with us and potentially help your business.

Which one came first? Did you write the book first or did you do the seminars, the training?

So what came first was an assignment from the CEO of l', Oreal, you know, the number one beauty company in the world that is huge, humongous company. And the CEO at the time asked me to reflect on the management of creative people. And that's when the whole philosophy got developed. Because the managers rationalize the environment to make budget happen, projects happen in timelines and so on and so forth. And the creative in the chaos of life don't rationalize anything. They just engage from their gut and navigate chaos with their guts. And that's how they encounter new ideas. So we had to reconcile the two. And that's how I created the whole thing. I created and Squircle was born out of the success we've had in global organizations to bring it to everybody and the largest population possible. So to answer your question, it was first the consulting assignments that led me to develop seminars for l' Oreal globally on how to manage creative teams. And then the books that I've written, the Intuitive Compass for the C suite and Squircle for Everybody.

So you started off with an idea.

Yeah.

So you had the square and you had the circle.

Yep.

And the idea was the vision to you are asked in the square to come up with the circle with l' Oreal and come up with a way in which to teach upper management how to accomplish bigger and better goals.

Correct.

And then you go, well, I can put this into a book. Well, now you're turning this into another business. And I'm looking at your website and by testing my thinking, you're now creating a link between you and me that you can stay in contact with me and you can expand your business. I. You can't get me to come to one of your seminars or anyone if they don't know you exist. So this is part of your distribution tool. And I find this very interesting and I love the business model.

Thank you. And the distribution tool will be also the assessment. You know, so we'll post online, hey look, you know, you have a business, you want more innovation, but what kind of innovator are you? And then we'll give you a profile. You can call us and we'll explain more and we'll tell you, hey look, you can take an even bigger test assessment that will give you even more information. You can bring it to your team, you can bring to your partner and we can have conversation with you. And then once you have the assessment, then you have three levels. You can do self paced elearning courses. You take them, you do it on your own. You can attend webinars with other participants, you can bring webinars to your organizations. Or you can have us as consultants and coaches for one on one work or teamwork.

Say that I'm an employee at a company, I'm a middle management or perhaps and listening to business. And they're listening to this show between John and Francis. And we're talking about the human company as well as Squircle. It gets my attention. If I was part of the corporate to bring a training program into the company.

Yep.

You would be in a position to come to the company and say, all right everybody, I'm Going to make you more productive through this course that we can teach you, which include an autographed copy of your book, Squircle, Correct?

Absolutely. So a few things to say to this effect so we can help you on straightforward matters such as how to save an hour and 20 minutes a day on better email management, how to become more productive with ease. Okay, okay. How do you assemble teams that are going to be more productive because you'll understand their profiles? How can you innovate and manage innovation in a very powerful, straightforward manner that addresses all the pitfalls that keeps people from being innovative and organizations to succeed with innovation? So you see, it moves from very, very tactical to operational, but on bigger themes. And we can do all of this remotely. Remotely, yeah, absolutely. Everything we do and is very experiential and very immersive can be done through zoom. And I've trained a number of consultants who are certified in this. And soon you have an assessment that will give you a wealth of information and a wealth of resources that you can pull from to improve your business.

Well, and I can see from your business model there that you've now taken the concept, which is one, and by training others in the. In the Squircle and in the human company and such, you're now compounding the reach. Being able to go out if it's 10 times or five times, you're able to compound that message to more and more people as opposed to the one on one.

Correct. This is exactly my point. You know, I believe in Squircle in helping us being more innovative and more in tune with nature and reaching our full potential at whatever age. And it's a simple model that everybody can get. It can get. It's a visual model. The name speaks what it is, and everybody can get it quite rapidly. And then it's a journey to develop, as I call it, the squirrel called mindset and the attitude. But that's what we do.

Whether we're in the current pandemic or forces on the outside that are pushing against the business that my audience may be involved with, you can address those issues and how they can approach them, regardless of what the forces are. From global environments to economic recessions, the ups and downs, whatever is is pushing against the business that you're involved with. You can come in and bring some semblance or balance in the circle in the square.

Absolutely. And it comes from motivational speaking. You know, I was just called by a hospital in Colorado to give them a motivational presentation and all the way to working one on one with the CEO or working with teams to improve productivity or saving them times and teaching them how to manage time in a way that respects all different styles style of learning and thinking and working.

Francis, I can't thank you enough. This has been fascinating to understand not only your business model but how you can help others, my audience in overcoming objections, solving problems and it's just not reading a book. It is learning how to use a mindset and taking the circle and the square and combining it together and navigating it through the squircle. Love it.

Well said John. You're hired.

Done deal. Thank you Francis. I want to thank you for enlightening us. Look forward to having you come back and share your message again here on Business Soup.

I hope so. Thank you John.

This has been another serving of Business.

Soup where business comes for business. I'm John Debaboys inviting you to visit.

The website for more servings of what.

Is best in business.

Sam.