Tiny Challenge Masterclass 06 03 25

Richmond, uh, is become a friend and really something he discovered is a business model that is accessible for anyone in any season, in any niche, in any industry. And, um, it's crazy how just him expose, and this is the power of exposure. Right? The power of exposure is you hear something you've never heard before and now you are accountable for what it is, you know? And it's really cool to see that when you discover something so accessible that you can implement right away without so much explanation, it shows how powerful that thing actually is. And so, uh, without further ado, I want to welcome 8-figure entrepreneur, uh, killer when it comes to helping people make money online. You guys are really going to get the keys to make at least an extra or your next $100K. This year. And so I want to welcome to the stage my man Richmond Denn. Let's go.

What's up? What's up everyone? Hey, just woke up.

He just woke up. So like, let's just give him some grace. Uh, yeah. Author of Tiny Challenge book, bro. I'm excited. Thanks for doing this. Pumped to have you here.

Thanks for having me, man. I'm, I'm really excited. I, I love your opening video. That is 100% my vibe. Alesso EDM, love the clip. Oh my gosh, this is like, this is what we do in our community as well, and we play the same similar music and all that kind of stuff. So it's gonna be a lot of fun, and thanks for having me. Really great, Stan. Honored to be here, and I know your, um, your community loves you, like, and, and I mean that sincerely, which is a great representation of your own leadership. So well done to you, man.

Appreciate you, bro. It's all yours, bro. Take the stage.

All right, all right, all right. Very good. Okay, so it is— it's not too early right now, it's 8 AM. Thanks for moving the call because when Omar asked me, it's like, God, dude, that's like, that's like 2 AM for me, you know. I guess I could do it, but then I won't be as sharp for your, for your students. So thank you for coming up with the second call here. And how many of you have watched the, um, the podcast I did with Omar, where Omar interviewed me on Tiny Challenge. So pretty sure you guys all know what a Tiny Challenge is. Who, who does not know what a Tiny Challenge is, actually? Because this— and Omar's right when he says that all of you can make and will make at least an extra $100,000 in the next 12 months from this framework. I even believe that many of you could even make your next 6 figures. And it's a big bold statement. I know everyone's kind of saying this, but next 6 figures a lot sooner than that. Because there's a few models that I'd love to share with you and just help you out today and just more Q&A style. So anyone— okay, great episode, says Sophie. Anyone not know what a tiny challenge is like, or not clear on it? Just want to make sure that you guys are all—

yeah, there's probably a couple people because literally we added about 15 to 20 people this last week to the Inner Circle. So they might be new to the concept. So act, we all need, we all need to act like we've never heard about it before. So like, bro, yeah.

Okay, good, good, good, good. Okay, cool. So in order to just be in context about marketing, in order to market yourself, you can't just open up a website, have a book a free discovery call and suddenly launch the site and tomorrow you got 20 calls booked in. You're not going to be able to put your $2,000 or $3,000 or $5,000 program on a funnel and then launch the funnel and suddenly tomorrow night you got $10,000 in your bank account like that. That doesn't happen. You have to actively market yourself. And so then the question asks like, what is the best way to actively market yourself and what are the options? You can do a podcast, you can grow a YouTube channel, you can do a webinar, you can do a small event, you can do a VSL, you can do group challenges. There's a lot of vehicles to actually market yourself and build know, like, and trust. You can do like a paid challenge like what Omar does as well. And they all work. Like everything that I just mentioned, except for a podcast, it's probably the only thing I don't do or don't have, um, works. And we've made a lot of money from each of those vehicles. But the problem is, if you're relatively new and you're just starting out, those vehicles can be quite hard to master because they require a lot of skill set just to make it work. And they can be highly profitable, but for example, running a webinar or running a group challenge, you need to understand how to speak one-to-many. You need to understand the tech. You need to understand how to fill up a room, how to facilitate a room with— when nobody knows who you are, you need to understand on how to build relevance frames, storytelling, all those kind of things, which is good to learn. But what if you want to make money now? And what if you don't have a big list and you want to have a big following? And so what a tiny challenge is, it's like a traditional group challenge, which you've all done, with Omar. That's why you're here because you're in his 5-day paid challenge. And so it's like that, except it's delivered one-on-one. Hence the word tiny challenge, it's you and another person, just one-on-one, one-on-one with you and another person. And I know it sounds a bit weird when I presented this to Russell first, he's like, that does, this sounds so weird. How do you, how does that work? I can't see this working. And then And when I explained a bit more to him about the benefits of doing it, number one, you don't need to learn speaking, you don't need to learn the tech, you don't have a big audience. When you're filling up or when you're launching, you don't need to launch it because why would you need to have a launch date when it's only one person? It's extremely flexible. You can do it anytime, anywhere, anyplace. If you were to put up a post on socials right now saying, hey, I'm doing a free or paid one-on-one challenge with me for 5 calls, 5 days consecutively, Who'd like more details? And you get 5 people put their hand up and you DM them. You literally could get your first tiny challenge started after this call. Like literally they say, oh, when should we do our first call? You're like, we can do it in an hour. We can do it in 2 hours. Does that work for you? And when you jump on that first call, you block off the other 4 calls and then suddenly you got all 5 calls booked in back to back, one after the other over a series of 5 days. And that's a tiny challenge and it converts like crazy. Like the conversion rates we've seen of our students doing this has been their first 10, up to 9. Like easily we're getting people converting their first 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, even up to 9 clients in their first 10 tiny challenges. And they never needed to learn speaking or tech or create any— like, should I create a funnel? Like what for? To get one registration? No, you just DM them when you get interest, you know what I mean? Should I create an email series? What for? You got one person. Should I build a big following? No, what for? Do I have to do a tech course? No, what for? You got one person. And so the conversion rates are so high because the reciprocity is so high and it allows you to tailor your offer to them, especially if you're not clear in your offer. You're like, okay, you listen to everything they're saying and you can tailor your offer exactly to what they need. And so I just want you to imagine, imagine you were to get your first 10 one-on-one tiny challenges and you could complete it in the next couple of weeks pretty easily. I mean, depending on your time schedule and your responsibilities, it's quite easy to do 10 a month. That's about 2 to 3 a week. It's very achievable. Some people can do 20 a week. Some people are so busy they can only do about 5 or 6 a month, which is not that hard. And let's just say you did 10 a month and you converted 5 or 6 into a paying client and you got a $3K offer. You literally do the maths. A $3K offer and you sign up your first 5 or 6 clients, that's your first $15,000. $20,000 with no list, with no launch, with not worrying about the tech or the speaking or anything like that, and you're off to the races. Who can see the power in this, by the way? Like, you can see the power. Like, that's, that's, yeah. Thank you, Omar. And so, um, I will actually, I'm gonna, I gotta, I'm gonna give this to your, your audience, Omar. So I'll drop it in the chat. There's no, there's no opt-in. I'm not grabbing your emails or phone number, nothing like that. This is a direct Dropbox link, like a direct Dropbox link. So you don't need to put in email, nothing like that. There's no opt-in. It's literally you just directly download it. There's no pixel. There's nothing like that. It's my book in electronic form just so you guys can have it. And go deeper into what we talk about today. Or if you watch this episode where I'm on it, you can go deep on it. It's got the whole framework on how to run it, all that kind of stuff. So all you guys can have that. I mean, the book's free anyway, so you got to pay $10 for shipping, but that allows you to have it straight away. And so that's kind of the principle. So first things first, any kind of misconceptions about what it is, because in order for you to run this, I Number one, well, you don't have to run it. You'd be like, you know what, what you're doing right now is working. I always say, you know, don't fix what's broken. If it's already working, double down on it. Like, that's kind of— if it's what you're doing is already working, great. Don't remove that. This is not to replace what you're doing. It's if it's already working, keep on doing it. It's more so if you're overwhelmed with everything else, this is a great starting point. Or if you want to add on an additional kind of way to do things, this is a great way to do it. So I'll give you another example. Let's just say you were actually talking to Justin. What are you guys doing now as a vehicle to get clients? Is that— are you guys mainly— I don't know, Omar, is there a preferred way they're getting clients right now?

I mean, preferred way is like posting consistently on platforms like YouTube, Instagram, um, and then, and then like using lead magnets or different, different ways to just pull them off the platform. That's usually kind of the thing. Yeah. And we have people in real estate, we have coach consultants, we have agency owners. Yeah. A couple people like Monique's doing a tiny challenge now. And I think something that's cool is like you say one-on-one and, but it, it's also like great for us 4, right? Like I guess that would be my thing would be like you could do 4 different one-on-one challenges or you can do one challenge with 4 people and it, it's powerful. But I love the idea of like, you just, you said it, you were like, if you feel overwhelmed, this is a great solution. And like, I feel overwhelmed with opportunity. So like my thing is like, like I really, I, I feel like doing a, even a separate offer for specific real estate YouTube. It's just something I've just been like, it just keeps coming back to me and I keep trying to resist it 'cause I'm like, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. But really I'm like, I literally can just test it, put it out there. Say if you're in real estate, don't do anything. Like just gimme your email or, you know, and then here's the Zoom link, put on your calendar, here we go. And then at the end of that, do something. I just love, I love all that. So, but I'm sure a lot of people want to break the idea, break it, you know, as, like, yeah, what was it? Like Aria said, how often would you recommend running these? You know, but anyway, yeah, I mean, I'm just—

Yeah, great, great, great question.

I'm going to shut up now. That's what I'm going to do.

So it sounds like the main method is like post content and then you might get them on a phone call and then you just sell them straight into your—

Yeah, discovery call. Some people are doing a challenge. Some people are doing web classes. Yeah, some people got brick and mortar, you know, like, so.

Yeah, cool, cool, cool. And this is where I think the model can really boost your business is if you are doing kind of discovery call, you're going to find that, you know, some calls are like 2-call closers. And then you're probably going to have to do, say, you probably need to jump on 5 to 10 phone calls before you close one person maybe. And if you think about, and a lot of them are 2-call closers, that could be 2 tiny challenges that you're running. And then the conversion is half. And then so it's the same outcome, but you can get to convert a lot higher and it removes imposter, it removes all the stress and everything, so you can get started straight away. So, okay, so Amber says discovery call, uh, how this working there? Yes. Okay, great, great. So Caroline, you're like, um, face-to-face hairstylist salon kind of thing. Okay, situation. This is, this is Awesome. This is awesome. We got PTs doing it for sure. And they do it face to face as well. So for yourself, I mean, um, then they need like, but the first thing when you're running a tiny change, number one, start out with what are you going to offer? Like, what is your core offer? What's your core offer? And so Caroline, what's, what is your core offer actually? I'm just curious. Like, do you offer like a 12-month coaching or subscription or something like that? Um, where are you? I'm just trying to find you on the screen here.

Feel free to unmute Caroline too, to go back and forth, unless, unless you're like on the chair right now.

I don't know. Hi. Hi. I am here, but I had to step out. Um, I don't have an offer right now. I am, I've owned my salon for only 3 years. And so I'm just looking for ways to grow. So I saw Umar's challenge. And so I figured. And he's actually hitting the areas that I need to work on. And so that's why I'm here is to kind of figure out clarity of like, how would this work for hair salon?

And right now, what's your, um, or what are you thinking as a means to acquire a new customer? Are you thinking of ads or anything else?

Well, I was going to do, I will be running ads so I can push the salon out to where I'm at. I live in the Bay Area, so it's a big, huge area. So I'm more in the Contra Costa. I was thinking more of like trying to attract people in my area first and then push the name of the salon out. I'm very niche specific. I focus on natural, special curly hair. That's what I specialize in. And so I work with specifically people that has textured hair.

And I—

when they said challenges, I was kind of like, how would I apply that to the salon and like my clients? So if that makes sense, it's just trying to figure out—

I, I feel like that's— this is a bigger— this is just like a new opportunity to just serve people online with the information, like how to maintain— do maintenance products, just like getting ready, like easy ways for that type of, that's how I see it. And then the local people will come through your doors. But when I think about it, it's like, do you have curly hair? That pain, pain, pain, pain, pain. And it's like, oh, let's hop on. I wanna work with you and make sure you feel beautiful every single day of the week. So you don't have to come to the salon. Like, and then now you're either going to get people that are currently sitting in your chair or you might get people that just are a fan of whatever you've been— you will have been posting consistently or have you been posting consistently.

Right. And it's growing really, really fast. I live in Brentwood. I'm more in the Contra Costa area. And so there was a need in the area and I live here, so I opened up the salon. Salon, and within like a year I already grew like 200 clients, which is crazy. And so a lot of people are asking for tutorials, and so, you know, being behind the chair is hard. And so I was thinking of doing like a course type of tutorial, like how to style your hair, like products that are great for your hair, because curly hair is a whole different beast to deal with. So I just don't know how to go about getting it out there, if that makes sense. You know, I'm not great with like marketing. A lot of my clientele are like referral type, and, um, I'm Polynesian, so a lot of my clientele are Polynesian, so they all like attract— and I do a lot of, um, football players' hair And so, um, they see me from there, you know, but I just, I don't know. It's just finding that clarity and figuring out the steps to get things out there so I can put a tutorial course together to—

Yeah, I feel like I have the question for Rich. Rich, the question—

Thank you.

Yeah, Richmond, the question is, like, could you— and it sounds so simple when you say it, but I want you to maybe say it in a different way. But like, how do you get your tiny challenge out there?

Mm-hmm.

Yeah. This is interesting, right?

And it kind of, it kind of speaks to even Sherman's question where it's like, can I do a free web class then offer a tiny challenge to those interested? So like, I, I, I think, yeah, like I guess the question is how do I get it out there and then how do I get people in it?

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

So Caroline, you're right now, um, your store is reliant on foot traffic that gets new customers in. If that's kind of the only marketing method right now, they walk past the shop or drive past and they're like, oh, that looks cool. And then you got referrals?

No, actually I'm in a suite. And so a lot of my clientele comes from what they see on Instagram and like, I am literally booked like 2, 3 months out. And so, you know, so it's, it's a need, but it's just like, I'm one person. So, okay.

And do you have a course at the moment or is it kind of in beta version?

Yeah, the, oh, the course. No, I don't. Okay, cool.

What are you thinking of charging?

Oh, my haircuts are $350 and that comes—

Oh, you're just on mute.

Oh, sorry. I don't have a course.

Okay. Okay. And if you were to do like a course or sell a course or something like that, what would that kind of look like from a price point and delivery? Like an online course.

I guess that's why I'm here.

Yeah.

To figure that out.

Yeah.

So, well, I actually have asked my clients and be like, okay, if I were to put something together, because I was also thinking of the platform, uh, Skool, of doing like a paid membership type of thing where I can upload everything, but I also like YouTube, right? So it's just kind of like trying to figure out which platform would be best. Um, yeah. And so I was thinking of like the membership, like maybe, I don't know, $97 a month or something. And they have access to all the videos that I would be uploading. Um, of like how to style your hair, the products, the right products, uh, different textures, uh, understanding the science of their curls. So many people have questions, don't know how to style their hair. They have children that have curly hair. It's a whole thing. It's just putting it together.

Yeah, got it. Got it. Cool. All right. Well, there's two types of tiny challenges you can run. And so tiny challenges, well, what most people perceive it as is it's a way to acquire a new customer. So cold lead, they don't know who you are. How do I trust you? You bring them through a one-on-one, 5 days with you, 30-minute calls each over 5 consecutive days. And the trust is built, it's so high, reciprocity is so high, you get to learn all about them and you turn around and offer to them at the end and you sell your $3,000, $4,000, $5,000 program. And so that's kind of turning a cold lead into now a paying customer. Tiny challenges can also be used, and this is what I'm thinking for yourself, Carolyn, for the start anyway, just to get some social proof and also you get clarity on your offer is it can also be used. To ascend clients, existing clients. So you can use it to acquire a brand new client or you can use it to ascend existing clients. So she's already got tons of existing clients who pay $350 for whether they love her. She's booked out a couple of months in advance. And I would, as a starting point for you, Caroline, I would just, you've got an abundance of clients there. There's probably a lot for you to choose from, but I can, I would imagine you can think of your top 10, your top 10 favorites. Um, we all have favorites, right? And even if everyone has a favorite, and, uh, and I would just, I would just literally text them, DM, however you communicate with them, or whether when they're in the chair next, just say, hey, look, I'm thinking about doing this thing. It's a one-on-one challenge with me. It can be online or it can be face-to-face, but online's the most economic for you. Um, and In the next, over the next 5 calls, 5 days, I'm going to help you insert just one of their pain points that they have when it comes to maintenance.

The other thing I was— sorry, I don't want to interrupt you. The other thing I was thinking is more focusing on hairstylist, working with hairstylist because there's not a lot of us natural curly hairstylist in the area.

Very different niche, right?

So I was thinking of focusing on that. So many people have DM'd me and have asked like how I got started in the—

yeah, this is great.

And so I'm already giving information out for free, so I'm like, why?

So here's what I'll do also as well. Here's the best thing about a tiny challenge. Like, just in case you're in Caroline's case and you're like, wow, I'm thinking about working with hairstylists, and now she's venturing to kind of I don't know if it's business coaching or helping other hairstylists do what she does, or she can help her current clients. It's two very different avatars there, and you might be in that crossroads too. So you might be in real estate, you might be— I might, I might help— I might actually help sales agents, or might help actually the agency owners, or— and so they're two different avatars. Um, and so if you're in a situation where you've got two or three options where you could do this, do this This is, in my opinion, why tiny challenges are so powerful, because you could literally do a tiny challenge on, on a hairstylist. You could do a tiny challenge on your current clients and then maybe do a couple of them. And after 2 or 3, you're going to realize, actually, I want to go down this path. So it's a really safe way to get clarity on your niche and what you're actually going to offer if you're in that crossroads right now. And so Rather than doing this big launch and then having this— make this big branding and make this new decision, you don't have to do it. You can just do a one-on-one 5-day challenge. And then, Caroline, I'd do both. I'd find a hairstylist, do a tiny challenge on them, and then do one on one of your current clients. And, uh, and you'll know immediately on whether that's going to be the path that you should take. You, you also know that you can't take— you can't do both. You can't go all in on both. Um, but you can start on both, do a tiny challenge, and then get clarity on that's the path I want to go. Uh, helping other hairstylists will definitely be way more scalable and lucrative for you, right?

Awesome, thank you.

Cool, that's awesome.

Which is what I love about it is, again, it's like, because like I would even say, and, and Caroline, you're in the tone, you don't have to unmute or anything, I'm just like, I get a sense in the tone is the overthinking is simply from the place of feeling like it has to be a certain whatever. But I think the freeing concept of putting a tiny challenge out there where you allot yourself, I only wanna say 5 days, when you allot yourself the 5 hours to get somebody or 3 hours, but whatever, you know, you could do a 3-day or a 5-day. It's just, yeah, like when, when you could actually say, when Richman can actually say, do both. See which one you enjoy helping the person. Sometimes money isn't the motivator for some people because if you help somebody grow their business and charge higher prices for this service or technique that you offer, and then you coach them through that, obviously you're adding money to their top line. But then on the same side, you're helping somebody's life, like busy moms, busy professionals, Um, so I think, I think this is good, but the, the big idea is the whole point of a tiny challenge is to kill overthinking. It's like, is the tiny challenge is the new, like, school. The tiny challenge is the new ClickFunnels. The tiny challenge is the new whatever, like that. Instead of going and setting up a website or doing the thing, you, you literally just put it out to your people with the most low-hanging fruit. So when, when Richmond says like, how many of you guys have clients you've already served that haven't heard from you and you've helped them in life in some way, shape, or form, and you just lob it out there, hey, I'm thinking about you. I'm doing this special thing where I'm working with people intimately. I've never done this before. And so I wanted to give you the first opportunity if, if this is something you're interested in, like, text message, like fill up the calendar and here we go. You know, I love this. I did write this down. I, and I'd love to either process this with you or get your insight on it for, for professions in real estate, whether you help people buy homes or you help people sell homes. But we, we also have loan officers where you help people get pre-approved to buy a home. Yeah. How, how would you frame this? Because it like, obviously it seems like it, this is really good for, or easiest to contextualize this for coaches and consultants. But when we think about like service providers, like real estate specifically, have you worked with somebody in real estate who's leveraged this?

Yeah. Ricky, Ricky Carruth. I mean, obviously he's doing a bit more the coaching side, but he's moving. Ricky Cruz is a cool guy. We both know who he is. He's made like a quarter of a million dollars running like 3 tiny challenges, something like that. But obviously got a big following and stuff like that. And he did a paid version. So in your case, was this a question from Chris? Is that you yourself? Might get you unmuted. Or was that someone else?

Yeah, Chris, do you have one when it comes to real estate or is it different?

I do have a question regarding real estate.

Yeah, go for it.

Hey, by the way, thanks for the book, Rich— Richmond. I'm only in like chapter 2. I have some ways to go, but I look forward to it.

Oh, great. I'm glad you got it. Thank you.

I read it all. I read it all in one flight.

Wow.

Nice.

Yeah.

So my question, Richmond, is this: I feel like I'm coming full circle and being a coach, meaning that when I launched my podcast 40-some-odd episodes ago, I was thinking, okay, I'm going to create a message that appears— that appeals to entrepreneurs, not a specific industry, but entrepreneurs, because I love entrepreneurship and what it could do, especially for families. And yet, especially last week, I've been thinking about this, like my expertise. The reason people hire me is because I'm an expert in real estate. And so here's, here's my question is that would you recommend as far as framing coaching and real estate, how do I frame that? So it's concise and clear because I think the lane that's wise for me to run in, if I look at everybody that's hired me professionally, it's, it's been because of real estate in one way or another. So I'm thinking, okay, why would I reinvent the wheel? Why don't I just stay in the area that I've been at for almost 2 decades now.

Yeah, that's— it's a smart move. If you're still enjoying it and it's your passion, then I would say keep on doing what's already working and stay in that lane. So unless you are not passionate anymore, then you want to consider doing something else.

I'm passionate about people development, not so much selling houses. I like what selling houses does for people because it's providing service and value on so many levels. But I love the people development, the goal setting, The gaining vision or clarity on vision, those aspects of business.

Right, right. So coaching people through their goals, like kind of like a life coach, but for agents really launching.

My expertise is helping people launch their real estate business.

Right, right. This is, this is you 100%. You could do a tiny challenge. It's like launch a 5-day one-on-one challenge with you. Launch a real estate business. That's the outcome. In the next 5 days, and then, then you present an offer at the end for them to work with you for 12 months to actually get it profitable.

My first challenge I did— go ahead, Richmond.

No, you got— you got—

last month I had my first webinar and I called it 5 Mistakes Entrepreneurs Make When Growing Their Business.

Is that—

would you recommend that I be more specific and include verbiage around real estate to appeal to my target audience?

Yeah. Yes.

Yes.

Yes. Yes. Yes. It'll speak so much louder. And then you gotta decide, are you speaking to an audience where they're already established and they're struggling or they actually just want to get started and launch, like they've decided, I wanna change careers. I wanna launch this right now. So that's a very different message altogether as well. Okay. Yeah. And so go, go down, niche down. I mean, you will never, you will never go wrong when you're niching down. And speak to real estate agents that way. The other— how many people were on the webinar, by the way? This is like— this is a great point I want to bring up to how many people on that webinar.

So it was 22 on the one that they didn't pay with their finances, they paid with their attention. And then the paid one, there was a total of 5 people in that, 3 VIPs at $199 for a 3-hour we met via Zoom, a virtual workshop, and 3 VIPs and then 1 general admission. And from that, I sold 1 coaching package for $15,000 to a gentleman that was in that.

Nice.

To work with him over the next 12 months.

Right. And there was only how many people in that VIP?

Oh, there was 5 total in that.

5 total, and you pitched it 15K and one person bought?

Correct.

Got it. And it was a 3-hour kind of session?

It was, it was 4 hours with that extra bonus hour VIP because it was his Q&A, and then 3 hours for the general admission.

Nice, nice, nice. Cool. So I mean, that, that sounds like it worked really, really well for you, so I'd continue doing that. I mean, that's, that's a good result. It's a great result. You sold VIP tickets, $15K program. Now this is a great opportunity for, like, I mean, if there was a term called never lose a lead again, or there's a book called Never Lose a Lead Again, then, then a tiny challenge will allow you to do that. So let's just say you were running a webinar or someone here, you're running a group challenge and you had, and it was relatively small and you had 30 people registered and only 20 people showed up, which is awesome. And that means 10 people didn't show up. Now the number one reason why people don't show up to your thing, whether it's paid or not, is because the time just did not work for them. That's the predominant reason. It's just inconvenient time. The only reason why people turn up late because the start time didn't work, or they leave early because the finish time didn't work and they had to go to another commitment. And so what we do for our clients who, um, transition from one-on-one tiny challenge to now a group challenge or group model or webinar is let's just say they had 30 people registered and 20 couldn't— and 20 attended but 10 couldn't attend. You reach out to the other 10 and offer them a one-on-one tiny challenge And that way you always get them in your calendar because now the time always works because a one-on-one tiny challenge has supreme flexibility on when you want to do it. And that means you get a 100% show rate. And the conversions of the 10 that didn't show up will be so much higher because they're done through a tiny challenge. And so you think about never lose a lead again, it is legit how you could never lose a lead Again, so you got so many leads you could do a tiny challenge on now who couldn't show up. I'm just wondering how come you didn't show up? That would tell you some version of the time didn't work. It's always the time did not work. And then you could sell, like you'll convert better. You converted 1 in 5 in a group setting into your $15K, which tells me you'll convert 3 in 5 in a tiny challenge.

Thank you.

You will make, if you reached out to 5 people that didn't turn up to your webinar and you did 5 tiny challenges, you're going to convert 3 out of those 5 as a minimum. That would be my guess because you did— you converted 1 out of 5 in a group setting. Uh, that's $45K for you, man. And then you can just test out a few things. You can test out the messaging of— we should do the launch messaging, should I test out this different messaging here, should I test that? And you could test out 3 different things that you're thinking of and make $45K It's like you're making money while you're getting clarity on what you're doing. You know what I mean? It's good.

Yeah.

Thank you.

You're welcome, man.

I'm excited for Sophie to ask her question. Sophie.

Hi. So I have been, I'm in, I'm a loan officer. I own my own mortgage company and I'm 25 years seasoned. So I'm, I'm in my 2.0 era, right? Omar. So anyways, so I've started doing the webinars and I'm too teachy even though we're trying to dumb it down. And it's just— I've had 68.

I think I have like—

I think after this last one, I have over 70 people that I've been running paid ads to get them to do that. And I probably had about, I think, true people, like 20 that have showed up, but I haven't been able to convert to get them. My whole webinar is to get them on a one-on-one, so we follow up, we have the funnels. I mean, I have everything all built. So my question is, on the one-on-ones, how do you— like, how would I, um, promote? I guess you gave me good ideas for how to do my follow-up sequence for all those that did not attend or didn't do the replays, to try to do that. But for the one-on-one tiny challenge? Is it just to do what I normally do when I call people and I meet with them when they're referred to me? Because I've always been referral-based business, but it's all changing. So I'm just, it's, that's what I'm trying to figure out. How, what would be my one-on-one mini challenge?

Yeah. Yeah. You, I would do since like, I mean, you got a strong business. You've been in industry. It sounds like you've got a bit of a name for yourself as well and reputation. So you could do a 3-day one-on-one tiny challenge and that would be the minimum. Tiny challenge doesn't have to be 5 days. We've got some people doing 3 days, 4 days, 5 days, even some doing 7 days, which I think personally, I think it's a bit too long, but 5 days is fine. You could do a 3-day tiny challenge and I want you to think of it this way. It's like a, it really is just a 3-day sales call. I mean, you're not, you're going to definitely add value, but the benefit The benefit of doing a 3-day one-on-one tiny challenge where the calls are 30 minutes each over 3 days, that's 1.5 hours rather than doing one straight out 90-minute session is that you give them progress because there's homework designed after every call with accountability. And so in a 3-day tiny challenge after call number 1, give them some homework, they do it, they send it into you, you review, do core number 2, there's homework, you review. And so they get huge amounts of progress for the same time as doing one 90-minute session. And so people buy when they feel progress and they feel like they're moving towards something. Okay.

I mean, so I think about something that comes to mind because like the goal I imagine is for people to discover that they actually are in a place to buy a home. Maybe they didn't think so. And you came up and showed this the possibility of what could happen and how buying a home could change your life. But the reason people don't buy homes is because they disqualify themselves. That's literally— and then what do loan officers do? They qualify you. I mean, I see it from like a financial standing type thing, like where do you stand? Or it's almost like by the end of this, because that's where I see that value as like Now you have the plan in place to buy a home when you're ready. And I understand that everyone's— because even when you reveal their financial situation, it's like they might literally not be ready. But something— what would guarantee them working with you, the chances are, is giving them the plan that they would hopefully— and then you check in on them and stuff. I feel like—

so you just gave me the aha moment because it's like what you're saying, I'm just teaching, but I'm not giving them any tools, right? So the first day of the mini challenge is to fill out your budget, what your budget what your take-home pay, what all of that— just do a pre-qualify sheet and explaining it, correct? Like, okay, this is what you're going to look for.

The—

because I have the 3 C's of what it is. You have to have capacity, which is income. You have to have credit, and you have to have, um, credit, cash, and, um, employment, cash, and credit, you know. So those are the 3 C's. So what you're break down those 3 C's into a mini challenge and cover each one each day and give them a tool to know how to— because that's a total different way of thinking than even how I've been doing my challenge.

Yeah, it's sneaky. I was going to call it sneaky sales. Like, you're— and I think day 1 is just like, why don't you guys own a house right now? And you let them unload. And what they're going to do is they're going to literally tell you all these limiting beliefs, these things that people taught them growing up. They feel like they're going to move, you know, they don't know when they're going to move, that buying a house, they say this to social media that and like, so you're just getting that out their system. But then, you know, yeah. And then you, then you walk them through. And then the crazy thing, if you really want to get super sneaky, is having different solutions based on where they're at. So here's what's crazy. If you might, you might do a tiny challenge with either one person or you might do a tiny challenge with 5 people. Let's just say you're going to do one with 5 people. And the first day they tell you everyone's just going through and you're— and then you just bring this encouragement. Like, I promise you guys, the next 2 days you're going to be so confident in your ability to buy a house and create the generational wealth journey for your family and your legacy. How does that sound? Crazy. Okay, so tonight, whatever. Then you have— you give them homework, then like, yeah, the next 2 days. But what I mean by being super sneaky is like, it's like you should have somebody that can help them fix their credit. And like that's a referral.

Yeah.

And when, and then now when the credit gets fixed and they're ready, guess who they're gonna go to? I think it's your situation in all honesty, and I know you know this, but it's sowing seed. That's all. That's like, that's what the point of it is. And there will be the chance where people will be accelerated into the possibility like, oh my goodness, I had no idea we could buy a home. I literally felt that when we, when we first bought a home, our first home, which changed our lives forever. It was like, yeah, we made combined $60K, me and my wife. And it's like, and that's pretax. And then it's like, there's no way we can own a home. And then we go through the process and we ended up being able to do it. It's like, and by going through the process, I didn't know I needed to be like, see a loan officer. I went to a real estate agent first. So I think that's the way. It's just like, yeah, it's just do, helping people financially position themself. And I think there are creative ways that you can help them be so clear and literally change their life because like now they have a budget because you brought it to their attention.

And one more question is that, so then when you're doing the tiny challenges, is it just based off of my organic audience or do I just throw some money behind it for a paid ad so that I can get like, be very—

I, I wouldn't throw any money behind it. And even if you did, you'd throw $30 to get one registration. I mean, it's, it's so economical. That way because you— so I would start organically. And here's the thing, because as Omar was explaining that to you, you know, people spend time with people like them. And so if they're thinking they can't get a home, they've probably got friends that think exactly the same thing. And that's the only reason why they think it, because they're around people who say, no, actually you can. There's actually a way. So at the end of your tiny challenge, you always— or at the start, you just pre-frame them. Hey, we're going to cover these ABC. And if you loved it, would it be okay if at the end you can think of at least one person, maybe two people that are in a similar situation to you that would get value from this experience. If only you got value. So number one, you're basically pre-framing a referral. And then, and if then you love this so much, would it be okay if I present to you what the next step might look like if you don't want the journey to end? That kind of framing there. So now you're seeding the offer. So then when you get to the end on day 3, 4, or 5, you say, hey, look, just before we finish up, like, do you, can you think of anyone that you know that might be stuck like you who thought they couldn't get a loan or thought this or this, this, uh, would really appreciate referral and get them to do it on the spot. And then they, they'll always have a friend that has the same situation and that's how you grow your next one and your next one and your next one and your next one. So you, I mean, it'll be, to date we don't have anyone running ads to Tiny Challenge because they've never needed to. You know what I mean?

That's kind of cool.

Yeah.

I, I will, I just wanna highlight, like you guys have the link to the book. 1-4-3, I love you. Uh, that's the number of I love you anyway.

Uh, is that really?

Yeah. Cuz like, yeah, cuz I is one word, love is 4, and then you is 3. So like 1-4-3. So when it's like 1:43 PM or 1:43 in the morning, Just take a screenshot of your phone and send it to your wife and just say, I love you. Uh, no, but any— okay. No, this is, uh, page 143 where literally it just like breaks down. So it's toward the back of the book, but literally how, uh, Richman kind of delivers the actual experience itself, which is super helpful. I just wanna throw that out there, but good stuff. I love that, dude. Um, the seeding. The referral, and that literally could fill up a consistent calendar for you to do a tiny challenge is awesome. Monique, who's currently doing her first tiny challenge this week, she came on the call this week here, or to this morning, she came on the call this morning and was like, Omar, I like, they're all struggling with so much. It's like I'm overwhelmed and kind of, wait, wait, wait, what was the word you used? You said you were, uh, I feel defeated. Defeated. And I'm like, don't be defeated. It just proves that you actually have so much to offer. But anyway, yeah.

And thank you for taking this. Hi, Richmond, nice to meet you. I actually have two copies of your book.

Um, oh, thank you.

Yeah, so, um, I actually have my second day starting in 15 minutes, so I'm going to make this quick. All right, so I teach, uh, I teach home, home bakers or small businesses how to take photos of their products using their smartphone. Because hiring a photographer, professional photographer, can be expensive in the beginning. Okay, I always say get the professional photos, but in the beginning, starting out, use a smartphone. Okay, anyway, so I, I, I, I, I'm really blinding. Besides using your book for, for help, I'm really walking through this blindsided. So I, I have a, I have a course. I use Kajabi and I have about 700 students currently. Okay, so with those 700 students, I reached out to a handful of them. I said, hey, I have this idea I'm trying to try, you know, it's called Tiny Challenge. And I actually— I didn't name it Tiny Challenge. I actually named it the 5-Day Product Photo Transformation Challenge. Okay, so I said, okay, so this is, this is for me to, you know, fine-tune the process before I offer it to the masses. So with— I was able to choose 10 people. And I was trying to do— let me back up and say I also work full time. So, so with that, I had a few people that were like, okay, yes, cool, here's my schedule for one-on-one. And then I had a few people that I actually had 6 people that chose the same time frame. I'm like, okay, well, how am I supposed to do this for one-on-one? I don't want to like prolong it month after month. I say, okay, well, for these 4 people, let's do one-on-one. But for the 6 people, let's do a group. You guys are cool with group? They're like, yeah, we're cool with group. Okay, cool. So I meet with that group tonight in about, what, 10 minutes or 11 minutes now. So, but my thing is, yesterday I felt so overwhelmed because I thought I started off with the 5 Fs and I have my fingerprint. Okay, so I have my fingerprint and I have this method I call LIGHT. And the LIGHT, each of those acronyms, each of the letters stands for what they should be doing in sequential order in order to set up for their photos and take a beautiful image. Okay, so, but talking about their failures and frustrations, oh, they gave me an earful. And I was like, okay, so, but, but everything that they told me, I was, I was okay in my mind. I already processed, okay, this is what you're doing wrong, this is what you need to do. Like, I already had the answers in my head, but I felt so overwhelmed. I'm like, okay, but I can't teach them all of this in these 5 days. Like, what am I supposed to do? So I guess my question is, what am I supposed to do? What am I supposed to do with this? Like, I don't even know what my offer is going to be on day 5 because we're going to end it with editing on Lightroom Mobile. I have a 5-step process that I've done. I always do for my editing, make it quick and simple but beautiful. So we're going to end on the 5th day with editing. So every day we're building up the same product. They're coming with the product, they have homework, they've already submitted their pictures for their homework. And today we're gonna talk about composition and angles, different angles for your product. And so I'm like, okay, but after day 5, how can I continue this relationship? But they are current, they are already current students.

Yeah. Yeah. Yep. Yeah. Well, first of all, you can, you don't wanna solve everything anyway. Like, I mean, you can do, You can do anything, but you can't do everything. And so don't, don't pressure yourself to actually solve all their problems because you're going to overwhelm them because then it's too much for them. People don't underestimate the value of a reminder over learning something new. People need more reminding than learning something new. And quite often in the Tiny Challenge, it's like just a reinforcement of what's already working. And that's why I kind of open up like, what you're doing is already working. Double down on that, keep on doing that. You don't need to do a tiny challenge. It just can supplement what you're already doing. So, so don't pressure yourself for that. Now, if you get to the end, there's two types of offers. And I talked about one in the book, but I didn't really talk about the other one. But the first one is more of the same. So people value more of the same. So when you're offering more of the same, think about what that might look like to them. People right now in the world of AI, people are looking for community. For accountability and for an experience. So if you can think about what can you offer at the end of the 5 days that would give them community, accountability, because they get accountability during Tiny Challenge and they love that, and some sort of an experience. And that, that could be in-person, could be virtual. And so when you think about framing an offer like that, you're going to be ahead of the curve. Now, if you're really stuck, they love you. Here's what I would ask them. What do you think about charging, by the way, $2,000, $3,000, $5,000? What's the price point of the next step?

I don't know. And to be honest with you, I did a— I paid the extra money to have that one-on-one talk with Myron Golden. And when I told him my initial price, he shook his head and he was like, oh no.

Oh no. I know what Myron's gonna say.

So that part, I don't know because I got these current students at a lowball price.

Yeah.

So I'm like, I, I now, now they're in that, well, I think they're in that mindset that whatever I offer next is also going to be a lowball, but it's not. But if you're not my customer, if you're not for me, you're just not for me.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's, yeah, it's how you frame it. Well, what, what, what did Myron say and what are you thinking? Did Myron say $100K or $25K or something?

Well, he, so I Okay, so first, for my current, for my current course, he said raise it to $497 and then raise it to $997.

Okay.

Yeah.

Okay.

So I was like, okay, cool. And then he was like, well, for this tiny challenge, here we are. And I don't know. I don't know what.

Good.

I don't know what I would charge. But I can say this as I am, as I did my sessions yesterday, in my head I'm thinking this is a lot of work. That I'm doing. This is a lot of work, so I definitely need to charge for the time. And then the expertise— I'm like, I'm not charging something— I'm not teaching you something that I ChatGPT'd or whatever. I, I'm, I'm literally— sorry for my, my setup, but I, I have all gear. Like, I'm showing you the different lighting setup, the different props. I got the whole nine. So it's not like I'm YouTube and then I'm going to teach it. No, I, I do this. So it's like, I can show you better than I can tell you type of teaching.

Yeah, yeah, totally, totally.

All right, well, okay, just for the sake of time, because I want to honor your time, bro, and I know we still got questions, and next few questions, please, just for the sake of time, rapid fire. The question is, how do you help people through pricing and security?

Good. You just ask them. You just say, number one, well, first of all, what do you secretly want to charge, Anthony, if it's $1,000? I would say no. Well, I'm surprised Marian didn't say $25,000 or $100,000. But let's just say I was thinking, okay, $5,000. I was just at the end of the tiny challenge saying, hey, look, if I was to offer you a $5,000 thing for you, for us to work together for the next 12 months, what would that look like for you? What would need to be in it for you to say, oh my gosh, that's a no-brainer. I'm in. I want to work with Monique for the next 12 months for $5,000 if she did this for me. Get that data. And then once you get the data, if it's like, I can do that, yeah, I'm doing— oh, let's go. And you literally just offer it to them if you can do it or if you're willing to do it.

Okay, thank you so much.

Yeah, you got so much reciprocity, so you can do that.

You could do that.

Thank you.

And I, and I think I want people to know that that's why you guys need to take action, is because it gives you the insight So like, let's, I, I'm, I don't wanna, I'm not gonna bear, bear bad news. Uh, but if nobody does it at 5K, they, you did do the work to get the offer. So like that alone is so valuable, right? And, and now you, when, and you guys don't realize when you guys have an offer, it's like the craziest thing like that wor— that, that works or that like resonates, right? Um, with people. It's, It's magical, but awesome. Crush it today. You got this. Shimon, what's up?

Yes, hi, hi, hi, Richmond. I too got a copy of your book. I've just started going through it. I've been doing web classes and then trying to do Office, and that hasn't been going too well. So my question is related to if I switch from doing the web classes to the tiny challenges, Um, does the challenge have to be free or, um, is it best to start off with a low price? How, what, what?

That's great. That's great. Now, um, no, it doesn't have to be free. The majority of our students do a free one and then they offer like a $3,000 program as an average at the end. That's like 99.9% of students do a free. Free is just easier to market. Now I get that some people think if I do it free, what if I get a time waster, which is actually not the case. It's a very high-level commitment for someone to say, okay, I'm going to book in 5 calls with you one-on-one. They're not there to waste your time if that's the case. They are there because they want change. Or alternatively, if you are entertaining a paid version to a cold audience, to a cold audience, they don't really know, like, and trust you just yet. I would do $100 fully refundable deposit that they get back at the end of the 5 days. And that will allow you to sell that easy as well. Now, if you're doing it to a warm audience, you can, you can charge $100, $200, $500. Like, you know, warm audience is very different. You know, you can charge, like, it's very easy to sell that to a warm audience, but to a cold audience, I do it free or a fully refundable $100 deposit and that's it. It'll be the least amount of friction you're gonna get to get your first 10 Tiny Challenge registrations.

Okay. Thank you. Appreciate it.

You're welcome.

Okay.

Let's go to Piers. Piers.

Hello, Richmond.

Hey, how you guys doing? Is it Amber and David? Amber and David. How you doing, Dave? Doing good.

Good.

Thank you.

So what would— do you have any ideas? This is brand new for me. So the whole challenge thing. Also, this is my first call today. I'm new to the Inner Circle. So all of this is very new. So do you have any ideas for a tiny challenge for someone that's like in the church consulting mentoring world? So all I really have that I offer at this time is in-person workshops, webinars that are usually booked through churches or one-on-one mentoring with worship staff, people on staff as worship pastors and worship leaders. So I don't have any digital products yet. So what I just need, maybe, do you have an idea? I have an audience, I guess, kind of. I'm very active on Instagram with teaching and giving tips and advice. And I do have people seek me out for coaching from word of mouth and from Instagram. So What is— do you have any ideas on a tiny challenge that I might could start with?

Yeah. And so people seek out coaching for just general stuff, nothing related to faith-based, or is it just more like life coaching kind of advice?

It is specific coaching to their role as a musician, a worship leader in church. So that's like a whole nother world. And on social media, we have our whole like huge community.

It's global.

And there's a lot of pain points and I hit all those pain points and talk about those pain points and, and have systems and processes and things to help them in their role musically, administratively, and things like that.

Yeah. Okay. So I would write down a list of who you secretly want to serve. The who is the first step to get clear on. But the good thing is in a tiny challenge, if you've got 2 or 3 options that you're wondering like, oh, I could serve that who or that who or that who and just write them all down, whatever, 2 or 3 of them. And I would think of a person that you'd love to do a one-on-one 5-day challenge on and just reach out to them and make the offer to them. And then just do that. And then, because right now you just need to do as many tiny challenges as possible to get clear on who you want to actually serve. And then we can figure out what the offer is gonna be like, but just figure out your who first.

Yeah, I actually think, because I've, I've been in the church space and I've been helping too, and I realize a few barriers when it comes to buying power, when you, the people you're helping necessarily aren't financial decision makers.

Right.

Uh, sometimes they're volunteers. I, I do like the idea of targeting, I wanna work directly with your team. Like, um, like the tiny challenge could be for one church, but the entire team has access to this experience. And, you know, and I think, I think the idea is where if you do it the right way, whichever the right would be for you, in my opinion, it's like, let's keep this good. Then, then the offer literally really is more of the same because what are the pain points? Like you have, you know, depending on the size of the church that, you know, you want to help or whatever, you got a person maybe on salary part-time, or maybe they're full volunteer, but they have full-time job. Like there are all these things that you could speak into. Um, uh, I think, I think the biggest thing is to know that because I'm getting so much insight helping, I'm doing a 12-week church marketing thing with 20 churches. It's been so enlightening because I didn't, there are things that I didn't even realize I was going to help them with, like reigniting a passion for their role. That wasn't like one of my, things. My thing was like, I'm gonna help you guys crush it on social media and market your church. And they were like, bro, I've never loved my job as much as I do now. I'm like, that's invaluable. Like, you know, um, I, but I, but all that I say all that to say it took, it took to get them in the context of helping them to, for them to find that breakthrough. But yeah, I, I feel like it's like, hey, I'm look, I'm looking for, uh, and then the more specific, the more prolific it's like, I'm looking for churches with, this many people attend, maybe one person that's running the worship team, and I wanna coach not only the leader but also the entire worship team. And whether that's paid or not paid, whatever you wanna do with that, I think it's regardless because they're gonna see what life is like with you and then it's gonna be like, okay, sayonara. And then as far as like, you know, tiers, like there's this whole thing, I'll do it on the brand call when we do it within the next month. It's like the value ladder. Like you should have stuff for volunteers, like people who just wanna get better at serving and leading worship that it's not their calling in life, but they like, how many churches, how many people in church have that role filled by just a regular mom, stay-at-home mom or a full-time dad? Or whatever, entrepreneur, but like it'd be good that they're getting fed in that way. 'Cause sometimes even the leader sometimes aren't always that skilled. Maybe they're great at leading, but they're not good technically. And so like all these things, but that's where I think like a Stan store might make sense. I think at the end of the day though, you can, you can crush, like, I don't know what it looks like now, but I mean, whether pricing and stuff, and we can get into it in another time.

Yeah.

But I, I really do think there, there's a, there's a sweet spot of a type of church that could really cook. And it just— yeah. And I know it's not— it's funny because it's like you want to impact as many people and as many churches as you possibly can, but you guys got to pay bills and you also want to build something too. So it's like, you know, but that's just as what churches are different sizes. There was one church that literally paid me $90,000 to be technically a In a, what do you call that? Like a part-time, like, uh, uh, what do you— it's, it's, yeah, I mean, to consult, but they call it kind of like a, um, it's like a, an executive that really isn't on staff.

Oh yeah.

What is that called?

In-residence kind of thing?

Fractional. Thank you, Brandon. Oh, like a, like a fractional worship director.

Yeah.

That, that, you know, that, that kind of idea.

But anyway, I actually got approached to be a fractional worship leader that was, they were like, you can do your own thing and your own business, but we'll just have you on retainer kind of thing. And I was like, and I know there's churches out there like that, but it is deciding whether I'm going to really target individuals for one-on-one mentorship or churches. So I know we can unpack that in Inner Circle, but yeah, thank you, Richmond and Omar. Appreciate it.

Definitely. You're welcome. I know we got a few more questions left. I got another appointment now. My assistant booked me another appointment. I'm more than happy to come back on another call for you, bro. Like, legit.

Yeah, dude. Let's clap it up in the chat, bro. Thank you so much for your time, bro. Well, yes. You said it. I didn't say it. You said it.

So, yeah.

Yeah, we'll do something, a part 2. That would be really sweet.

Yeah, dude. And I want to give a shout out to you again. Like, I travel so much to the States and your hospitality— hospitality when I'm there— hospitality when I'm there is like second to none. And I remember when we played golf together, it's like, dude, I hope this is not like a surprise for you. Like, how else are other people treating you when you come here? So dude, I just want to just really thank you for how much you look after me when I'm moving to the States, dude. So appreciate you so much.

Yeah, man. I appreciate you. Thank you for giving your time. Super valuable. We honor you and we'll be consuming it all. The book, I mean, it's a new way of life now.

Yeah, it is. It is.

Yeah.

Cool. All right. Thank you, everyone.

Hey, appreciate you. You guys could stay on for a sec. Mm-hmm. Yeah, I mean, if I don't mind answering some of the questions that some you guys had. Kirk, do you want to ask the question anyway? Yeah. Yeah. What's up?

So I was just looking at it from the perspective of which one should come first.

So you do the, you know, web class or webinar or do the tiny challenge first. I mean, could you lead into a tiny challenge from a webinar from, from a, you know, group session? Great question.

And in that case, would it make sense to charge for the tiny challenge? Or is it, you know, is it just when you do tiny challenges first, you don't charge? Yep.

Let me try to, let me try to unpack that because, because like if you have, if anyone here, by the way, when you guys aren't offering it necessarily a tiny challenge, that's just the package your offer is in, right? It's like, hey, I do one-on-one. I know in the back of my mind it's a tiny challenge, but to them it's working with me one-on-one. That's, that's the mentality, right? That I just want you guys to know. So, so if you wanted to go directly to a tiny challenge, the thing is, is like you guys still have to make sure you're building brand, creating demand and desire to even want to work with you. You know, there's still steps that you can't skip. You, you need to be known for the problem you want to help people solve. So that's, there's that part. But if in my, in, from my point of view, you 100% could just go straight to a one-on-one offer. Like literally, like from, and when I think about it, literally like the visual when I say that is like you go on stories one day when the stories clear out and you say, hey, I'm looking to work with 2 people one-on-one. Who are looking for, or who are here and are looking to here. And I will work with you one-on-one to help you get to where you need to be. Just DM me the word, you know, coach, and then, and then just work that through and then set it all up. Now, the reason why the web class to sell a tiny challenge, my biggest thing is it gives you the permission to do a small challenge. Like, like the thing I got from Richman's bright idea with this tiny challenge thing is like so many people get discouraged when they got 7 people on their challenge, but like something that Richman's doing is creating a different way of thinking about it. It's like, no, you actually have like 7 people who are super bought in Like I, I mean the challenge I did last couple weeks ago you guys were on was like we sold 320 tickets and we had 270 people on and then by the end of the thing it was like 250. It's like, or 150. Like it really just dwindles down. Like I'm, I'm seeing like if I literally put it out there on my stories like to, to now and I was like, hey, I'm, if you make $500,000 or more in your business and you want to build your personal brand, and you would like to work with me one-on-one, I've never done this before, DM me the word coach. Like that, just, just because I put it out there, the 500, like, and somebody is waiting for Omar El Takrori to say, if you make a million dollars in your business right now and you're looking to like blow up your personal brand, the thing is, is like, I can, I can do that. But it, it's the specificity of, of that verbiage that allows somebody to raise their hand. Yeah, because like when I think about testing offers, which by the way, you guys think you're struggling with offers, bro? Like the amount of offer ideas that I get in my mind is just like, it's insane. But obviously I have to demonstrate a level of discipline and just work what's working. But I always, I constantly all the time, like, dang, what if I just, yeah, what if I just help? I'm working. Hey, if you make, $200,000 in your business and you're looking to launch a podcast that's going to increase lead generation and revenue, I want to help you launch your podcast. Work with me one-on-one. DM me the word coach. Like, like, I mean, I don't have to build a whole challenge around this idea. I can literally just give this person the game for 5 days and say, hey, if you want to work together, honestly, I can do that and be like, join my inner circle. They probably would, you know, that's like, um, so Yeah, that's— yeah, yeah. So if you do the web class to sell a ticket or sell your tiny challenge, I think all it really does is make you feel better about doing a challenge with 5 people if that's what it ended up being. You know, like that's what I do. It just, you know, you guys should be encouraged with the small numbers. You should, because it's like, you'll never get this much buy-in, you know, as you grow. The buy-in gets, it gets harder to retain the larger that you're reaching people. The more, the more Ninja, the more automations you need, the more like, you know, insight and all that stuff. But like, if you're really, you could be, you could be a premium, you know, you could, you can offer a premium thing in your industry with the problem you solve. You could just be the premium version. And work with so many people a year and be freaking, you know, pumped. Like, let's go, you know?

Yeah.

So I mean, neither is wrong. I just feel like you can do one-on-one straight off of social, straight off of email, straight off a text message. And or if you do the web class that sells into an event, like an intimate thing, or The web class that sells into working with you one-on-one for 5 days. Yeah, both. I think they're all good. Okay.

Thank you so much.

Appreciate that. Yep.

And shout out to Kenyatta. I appreciate you, sis.

Let's go. KK, what's up?

Hey, what's up? So I had some, like, I ran 2 mini challenges off of LinkedIn and these are organically grown. So I had 2 cohorts, you know, initially I advertised as like working moms and strategies, your moms on maternity leaves trying to figure out how to get back. So with that group, they weren't receptive to like a paying offer, but then my second cohort, I had 7 people. And it was working moms, but they were more interested about like health and hormonal balance. And I sold 2 at $47. I just threw it out there like, so does this mean— should I run 2 more cohorts to try to see and kind of switch? Because I have expertise in both, right? I have a passion in both hormonal health, talking about like new mothers and, you know, all their wacky hormones and how to approach it. And also like strategy and logistics, right, of helping with the craziness of transitioning back to work. But, you know, based on my two cohorts, there's a co— there's a better cohort that is more willing to pay, so it's more profitable. So I guess I'm at a fork in the road, right?

Like, yeah, no, it's really good. Um, I mean, my thing is just, it sounds like you can serve both. You just have to find a way to say it.

Yeah.

When, and it's almost more in my, from my point of view, it's almost more mom, like the like 10x motherhood or like, I don't use 10x 'cause like Grant Cardone, who knows what, you know what I mean? But that idea of like become the super mom you've always dreamed of is kind of the big idea. But then it's like, yeah, you can have those people self-identify the season they're in to take this journey. So when I say that, I mean, it is cool that you say, hey, if you're transitioning from— it is a very specific season and problem you're serving, which I think is cool. It just takes a supernatural amount of intentionality to create an offer in a way that actually gets you paid. And, and the reality is, is it might not be coaching. Like sometimes like a coaching offer isn't the thing. Sometimes it's, it's more like resource. Like you resource a mom with stuff and then you make money on the backend from like affiliate. So that's, that's how I see when, when, when, when you serve a group of people, that typically don't take the offer, they're usually not looking for coaching per se. Now, I think there's 22 people joined from the last challenge. There was 310 people that bought a ticket. Like, you know, the reality is that there's always going to just be the crumb that are going to raise their hand and want to work with you. But I think the offer can encapsulate a lot of that stuff. Stuff of, you know, working together. So did you say you, the second time you did it, you got 2 people to do the challenge, or you got 2 people from the challenge to work with you?

The 2 challenged for more time with me for another, to, to join a, like, a longer— I just threw it out there like, hey, we can do a 3-day dive where we can, you know, again, take an audit of your symptoms and what you want to address. And this was like based on I somehow we touched on hormonal balance and everybody went crazy.

So that's good insight. But yeah, and you charge it and it was, it was $47 to do that.

Yeah, because that's another mini, right? So I'm doing a succession of like mini challenges.

Yeah. No, no, no. Like I I told you that I paid, me and Amanda paid a girl to read our blood information. We paid her $500 to read it to us.

Yeah, but that's not including my interpretation.

Yeah, sure. But all I'm saying is when you're dealing with product, like either productivity, health and wellness, there is a, like, I mean, my thing that my question to you is, where, what happens if women don't handle the thing you help them with? What, what like really happens? Like if you, if you really were to go down that path?

Like how do you mean? Like if I give them the protocol and they don't, they don't do it?

Well, like what, what, okay. By the end of the challenge that you do, challenge.

Yeah.

What, what, what are they, what are you hoping that they leave with?

So this small one without going in depth is just for them to have the language to go talk to their doctor. Actor for this small challenge. So later on, I have my idea to take them from A to Z to exactly know what to do, right? So right now, for my smaller challenge, since I was so focused on moms transitioning, you know, like strategy transitioning from motherhood of staying at home and then going back to work, when this opportunity came on my second mini challenge, so literally it was like 3 days and I just threw it together like, hey, let's go down this path and figure out like what your symptoms are and let's figure out the language to communicate like identify what is going on, right? So I guess it wasn't well thought out until— I know where you're going. Yeah.

It doesn't need to be well thought out. I just want you to be like, you're smart, you have education, you have experience. The offer doesn't have to be something like where you don't have to— even if the offer is helping them have a better relationship with their doctors or finding the right doctors, Like, it's not like you should get the short end of the stick in that equation.

I think my brain wasn't going like, I actually charge people more when they come to me for like the business side of it. But I guess to me, the Tiny Challenge, I'm like, I should just keep it either free or as a, you know, like, which I don't mind. I mean, I, yeah, I think, right.

I think the Tiny Challenge being free is totally fine. Like, it's, you know, totally, it's a, it's a lead generation. Warm it, like it will warm up somebody. Somebody will see you on LinkedIn, take your challenge and be like, this my girl, right? Like that's lit. Like that's the idea and the hope of what, what the challenge would do.

Now, so on my next cohort, would you say, because like on my standard rate, if a business were to come to me, it's $200 like for the reporting. Yeah. An hour minimum. But you know, since I'm moving towards like a non-professional, this is, I think this is where my disconnected because, sure, I don't mind charging business like $200 an hour, right? Like 3-hour minimum. But when it comes to like people in real life where they don't have a business, they don't have a budget for it, I think it's hard for me to move, right? Like to charge them that much initially.

Yeah, I mean, I mean, I think people, people are different levels. You know, the pain, the pain is increased, you know, like if you, um, the, like depending on what they have to lose, what they have, you know what.

Yeah. So eventually if I, if somebody works with me at like a, uh, like a 6-week program, it's going to be at least like $1,200, $1,250. Right, right now. Right, right. But right now it's like, it's a mini challenge. And so my brain is like focused on, you know, just the research.

Yeah. But the mini challenge is just to to get people to, you're not, not get people to take the next step, but to create the feeling in people if it's the right move for them to take the next step with you. Right. Which would be a, a $1,500, 6-week program. That's, I mean, that's all it is, you know?

Okay.

So that would be my next like try.

Yeah.

And I loved it. I hope you guys caught certain things that like Richman was saying. I know he's saying it and kind of like you maybe you don't know what he's saying, But when he said, hey, if, if I were to work with you 6 weeks for $1,500, what would you like to be included in that so that you would feel best about making that decision?

Yeah. So I'm bummed out that I didn't even pose that question. Like I'm kicking myself in the rear.

That's fine. And here's the crazy thing is if you have their information, you can literally call them still. Like if, if they, if they, yeah, if they went through a process with you, You can reach back and say, hey, I wanted to ask you something. Let me know when you have 5 minutes. Okay. And then leave an open loop like that. And then they're going to be like, yeah, what's up?

Okay.

And you know, that's it. And then just preferably if you can get on the phone, even better. But yeah, if it's through email, cool. But yeah, love it. Way to do it though.

You, I love that. This is all from LinkedIn.

You're doing internet stuff. Look at you.

It's all from LinkedIn.

So Yeah, I love it.

Yeah. Thanks.

Yeah.

Alex asked, is the tiny challenge like a lead magnet? My thing is lead magnets are simply anything that you give in exchange for information, for the most part free. So like, that's what I, that's what a lead magnet is. So technically I guess it can be, I, I think, I think one way, one way you can leverage Marketing a tiny challenge, AKA marketing the fact that you're working with people one-on-one, is that like, hey, you do that thing where you put it out there. If, if they, if they raise their hand and say, I'm interested, be like, yeah, what's your email? I'll give you more information on what it looks like. Now the information you give them for their email for the tiny challenge, in it of itself is a lead magnet, if that makes sense. Not the tiny challenge itself, me giving you the information. 'Cause you, you, you said you were interested in learning more about it, working with me one-on-one, therefore me grabbing your information. Boom. And now, now, now what's a lead? A lead is just somebody that's in your world CRM, or you know, that, that, that you consistently send out valuable emails to. But yeah, I, I think in that sense, yeah, it totally can be. Web classes are lead magnets. Checklists are lead magnets. Mini courses are lead magnets. Anything that you can do to trade their information for, uh, their, your, your information for their information. Uh, Aria, what's up?

Hey Omar, how are you?

Good, good. That's good.

So I actually had a couple things come up when I was listening to some of the other people ask their questions. So first off, I'm having trouble figuring out exactly what to do for my offer and who to offer it to. So my expertise lie in, like I was saying before, automations and setting up like the email funnels, um, how people get tagged and so on and so forth. However, to automate so you're not in there in the back this all the time. But I also, back around 2018, 2019, I did start my own, um, recruiting firm. So I am very well versed in how to find people to hire and how to go about setting up all of the hiring paperwork and the whole process from offering to the actual hire and how to get them acclimated to working within your company within the first 30 days. So I'm just having trouble figuring which one to run with as far as what I offer personally for my business.

Yep. Uh, I, yeah, I, I'm getting a sense from like just a, a lot of, a lot of the group just having either pricing, you know, things and then also like offer uncertainty.

Mm-hmm.

Um, I think I, I, I do wanna like. Um, downplay what an offer is, is like an offer is simply an opportunity in exchange, an opportunity for a product or a transformation or a, a promised outcome. Like that's like literally all it is now. Like all offers are great if you just like keep working the offer. And my thing is I needed the automation thing. Like Art learned it, but I'm just gonna let you straight up, I'm like, no shade, here we go. When it's all said and done, I paid a company to do my backend automations in the last year. I've paid them how much? So 40 times 3 times over $150,000. That's not counting like the monthly fee that I paid them just to be on. They, they only need, they only need 2 Omars a year to have a quarter million dollar business. Like, so, so when you're, when you're considering the who, I mean, I want people, you know, also another thing to remove yourself from is just the need to help everybody, like help everybody with content online, help everybody with content online, just boom, boom, boom, just give it all. But like the reason why our business is so successful is because I'm leaving so much money on the table. Like that's why it's successful. So, but a lot of the times we don't want to leave money on the table going into something. The reality is, is like if you're doing something significant, you're leaving so much on the table. The amount of opportunity I leave on the table, it's insane. But I'm at peace and I'm content. And it's because I'm okay with helping less people deeper. Mm-hmm. Legit. And then I have convictions around, That actually being a higher form of service as opposed to selling 15,000 people on a course that I know people won't go through and like still put money behind it to sell it and sell, sell, sell. 'Cause I know people will buy the idea. I mean, but then, but then 0.0000001% of people actually get breakthrough from the information inside of that course. And it might've been accidental. I don't know. So, so I say that it's like, I, I preferably me, and I know there, there are people that some of you guys should do the volume play. Like you should probably have a $37 a month community and have 1,000 people in that community. Like some of you guys could and should do that. That to me, that just sounds like work I don't want to do. And I, even though I know I can do that, so like I mean, and just, and I don't know, get the insight from someone like me who has seen it all and done it all. That, you know, creating something that you don't want to sustain at a certain point, it's like goodnight. And I mean, I love this. Like I love this so much. I did, I put 2 calls on the calendar today. That's how much I love this, you know? But when I hear what you offer, that like the automation thing is great. But I mean, just throw a me in the chat if somebody can at a snap of the fingers build your automation sequence and sell tickets to whatever you're doing or get people to show up on web classes and all that stuff. Like that is actually a need that a lot of people have even in here, right? So yeah.

So I guess my next question after that is just would I present this to business owners already that are struggling with having that piece or people that are starting out?

Well, the reality is the, yes. So it's like, it's like, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. Uh, and it's, it's also knowing that sometimes they don't even know what's possible. So right now what they're doing is they have a million tabs open and they, they're going from thing to thing and maybe they thought to it to themself or maybe they didn't, but they were like, What if this all could be done with one thing, right? So like that's the, that's the like the, the kicker. I mean the reality is sometimes people don't even know that they like, they started out with opening up a Gmail and then they, they used Google Forms and then they, then they got a, a, a Calendly account and then they got a Zoom account and then they got, and then it's like boom. And then it's just like, my goodness, what, what did I just do? So, So it's both, it's both exposing to people and you could do this in content, like minimizing the thing or, and it really, that's stunting growth. It's like focus is the number one key to growth. And if you're spread thin across all these different tools and automate and like maybe they haven't even heard the word automation and like that, that's a word that you need to bring to people's attention.

Yeah.

Like I, I love that Rory Vaidt, it's literally ingrained in my mind that when Rory Vaidt said automation is the seventh wonder of the world, he made that up. I don't know, it stuck with me and I actually believe it. It's like, it's like, or eighth wonder, I don't know whichever one it is. Like automation, a.k.a. you set something up once and then it does it for you afterwards. Right? So like, yeah, it's, it honestly, You know, I know some people even join this program. Some people buy a ticket to my challenge just to see if I'm legit, not to take the challenge. They buy a ticket to the challenge to see if I send emails, if I send text messages, if we send Zoom links and reminders. That's sometimes that's all a person even needs to be like, oh, like, Omar's not just the guy, like he's doing the thing. So, you know, so you solve so many problems, but yes, you should, you know, target either new business owners, new online, like coaches. But honestly, I feel like when you understand automation and Zapier and stuff, which I don't, you can literally help anything, anyone, any industry. But if you want to charge your worth, you could, I would attract business owners because it's now, and now you can get them on a month, there's a setup fee, then there's like monthly recurring. I literally, and monthly recurring until they want to turn it off, which means forever unless their business, I mean like until their business fails. But I had a friend, who worked with me at Think Media, he understood Zapier and monday.com. We would do so many little nuanced tasks when we, when it came to going on Monday, communicating with brands and all that stuff. He, he created so much automation. It was like insane. And he didn't get paid extra to do so. That was just his, you know, well, his doing.

Yeah.

And then, and then he, you know, he, he, he put in his resignation, stopped working at Think Media, started doing like really cool work with like agencies and did stuff with The Rock and all that stuff. Anyway, besides the point, he told me, I think it was Anthony O'Neal wanted to like— Anthony O'Neal is kind of just like a financial guy online, has content out there, he does really well. I think he paid $250,000 to set up the automations in his business, and then and then a monthly fee to be on call to fix or whatever. Like I, I did one client and it was like, tell me your processes and then I'm just gonna streamline it. You know, that's invaluable. That's invaluable to a business. And, and you could do it as small as helping people with automations for a specific thing. But like, I mean, or solving the big problem of communication automation. We're talking Slack ping, we're talking you get a text message.

Yeah.

I mean, if, if you tapped into automation, it's like, I feel like you could speak a different language that I don't know how to speak, but.

Yeah, there's a whole long thing. You could just go down that rabbit hole forever and there's always gonna be something new that pops up. So that's something I've been passionate about helping people with.

You're passionate about it.

Yes.

I'm throwing my marker across the room. Like, you're passionate about something that I don't understand. That's the— that is the remedy for getting paid. One of the worst feelings I get is when I pay somebody who doesn't want to do what I pay them to do.

Yeah.

So I guess my other question beyond that, and I promise this is the last one, how could I put content out there to maybe not overshare, but also just let people know that I know what I'm talking about when it comes to automations? Because that's where I'm having a little bit of trouble as well. Like, yeah, I want to overshare and I work with very sensitive information from my clients to begin with and I don't want to accidentally share too much.

Yeah. No, okay, so like when it comes to like oversharing that envy and that concept, I think Sophie, she just jetted, you know, she was like, you know, she's overteaching, which, and I know she said it just because maybe a lack of terminology that, you know, she had to say, she was just like, I just dumb it down. I needed to dumb it down. It's like, no, overteaching and teaching to kill beliefs is actually, it's not dumbing down. I'm not dumbing down the information. And even in the context of like, I don't know what to share or like how much, I don't put a filter on myself in any capacity. So the, the key would just be to create content and just get better at communicating things in a, in a potentially fresh way. That's all it is. So I, I think a lot of words of like, imagine, imagine if, Well, or what if, well, you actually can, like that, that's what I think about when it comes like for you or even like automation ideas, like the, sometimes people don't even know what can be automated. So that's why I wouldn't hold back. Don't feel like overteach or whatever. Like just communicate to business owners So think about those things and then over time it'll get dialed. Like, dude, something Gary Vee said, it was so good, but he only knew to say it because he's so in what he does. He said, we are leaving social media and we're going into interest media. I'm like, dang, that's actually a fire observation. There's a group of people that don't know what the frick that means. To me, I know what that means. So like, even though that was like a very profound thought that I heard today and I remember it, there's still people that would be like, what? So what, social media? Whatever happened to AI? I'm still trying to, what happened? I just still have a green bubble when I text people. Like, so don't think, Don't think that you're gonna like lose people with your explanation of things or like, have you heard of Zapier? And maybe you heard of Zapier, but maybe you don't know what Zapier does. I'm gonna tell you the 3 best things that Zapier does for entrepreneurs. The, you know, do you use project management software in your business? Maybe monday.com, Slack, Asana. You know, most people didn't, don't know. Most business owners don't know Or, you know, whatever. Hey, what if I told you that you could cut your employee, employees' effectiveness, you could double your employees' effectiveness and productivity all while giving them 20 more hours a week to do their job? I mean, like, these are just all ways. I'm just, you, you can just creatively package the concept of automation. Okay, perfect.

Well, thank you very much for answering my question.

Yeah. And then the, um, yeah, your Instagram bio should be like, I help businesses scale. I help businesses scale without any new hires. Dang.

See, I'm gonna use that and update that right now.

Yeah. And then it's just like automation expert, you know, get your life back and make more money. Like these are all cool things and that are very true as far as what you can deliver and offer. Mm-hmm. Good stuff. All right, y'all have a great week. Yes, I know there's a lot of people, this is you guys' first day, you know, Excited for the year we got together that me and the team are dialing in next week. We got the content workshop next week, which we're pumped about. The first one in this new space. I'm so excited for you guys to see it. And yeah, if you guys have any questions, throw it in the school. If you need anything, reach out to Soph and you guys have a blessed week. See your faces on YouTube, social media, or interest media and