Cancer, Identity Collapse & the Shift From Survival to Self-Expression with Cassie Miller

Hello, my love, and welcome to Seen, the podcast that helps you to stop hiding, claim your worth, and build the most vibrant version of your life possible. Thank you so much for being here.

And when he said, Cassie, you've— it's— you've gotten your endocrine cancer and it's spread everywhere, I feel like everything just stopped. Like, the world around me stopped, and I just thought to myself, fuck, like, this is really bad. It was like I went from Cassie to Cassie who has cancer within 3 seconds.

You mentioned that, like, you don't even look at it as a disease the more you look at it as like more of an initiation.

I wrote down incurable cancer and I just put one line on the end and all of a sudden it read, I'm curable. And it felt like the clouds parted. The data, the statistics have never been run on me. So why should someone else's story be mine? My story isn't about illness. I speak about having cancer, but it doesn't define me. I think the word purpose is so tricky because I still don't know what my purpose is. What I am practicing now is like self-love, self-awareness. I am trying to understand what lights me up. What drains my energy? I am following what makes me feel alive. At the beginning, I needed doctors to tell me I'm going to be okay. It was control, control, control because I felt so out of control.

We think controlling gives us safety, but it doesn't.

But if you flip that into curiosity, that is when like your whole world expands. That's when you start to follow the things that feel alive.

A lot of people think we need to have all the answers first and then we have permission to like share.

No, and no one really cares about the destination. Let's be honest, like It's about the journey. People want to know the messiness, the magic. Life is messy and people connect with the messiness because none of us have it figured out. I'm not trying to get millions of followers. I'm just trusting that there might be one little one-liner that resonates with someone.

Being seen, it's not just surface level.

What is seen is someone's essence and their energy. Being seen is being seen in yourself.

You can't fake that.

We only have one wild, precious, and fragile life. None of us are guaranteed tomorrow. When I take my final breath, I want peace to fill my heart knowing that I lived a life where I left nothing on the table.

Hello, my love, and welcome to Seen. And I'm so excited to be joined today by Cass Miller. So Cass has an incredible story that I can't wait to share with you. And just over 2 years ago today, Cassie's world was turned upside down when she was diagnosed with metastatic neuroendocrine cancer. As a young mom who had 3 beautiful kids, your life literally was turned upside down and things have completely shifted to where they are today. So What was going through your head at that time, Cassie? Thank you so much for joining and sharing your story. And I just would love to know, like, at that moment when you got that news and your world was turned upside down, take us back to that moment.

Yeah, gosh. Thank you, Katie. Thank you for that beautiful introduction. It was actually funnily enough that weekend when you were supposed to— you were coming up to do like a deep dive when you were in the agency in Sydney. And yeah, so it was— this series of events had led me to the doctor and I wasn't expecting it. I was sitting in the chair and when he said, "Kassie, you've gotten your endocrine cancer and it's spread everywhere," I feel like everything just stopped, like the world around me stopped. Everything kind of went into slow motion. I feel like shock when it's felt in that level of intensity is something very profound. And I remember just kind of looking over at Aaron, my husband, and he's, you know, he's my rock and the calm one in our relationship. And he just had his head in his hands and he was crying. And I just thought to myself, fuck, like, sorry for the French, but this is really bad. And, you know, I kind of walked out of that room into a world that like looked exactly the same, but it felt totally unrecognizable. It was like everything in that moment had changed. And I was numb. Like I just, I felt nothing. It wasn't until we kind of got into the car and I called my mom and told her the news that this tsunami of emotions came flooding in. It was like the paralyzing fear and the gut-wrenching grief and the overwhelming vulnerability. It was just all-consuming. And I just felt like everything that I knew to be true about the world and my place in it was just shattered into a million pieces. It was kind of like I had lived my life thinking a certain thing about the world and who I am. And all of a sudden I had no idea who I was. It was like I went from, Cassie to Cassie who has cancer, like within 3 seconds. And everything was dark. I remember it being really, really dark. I remember feeling like I'd just been given a death sentence. I think when you hear the word cancer, I think we are conditioned to believe that that's the end. And you know, I was 36, I had 3 young kids, and I just, I didn't see it coming. It was something that I'd never envisaged for my life. It's— when I think about it, when I step into that time, it honestly brings back like a visceral reaction. I do feel like my hands are sweaty now, and it's something that I wouldn't wish upon my worst enemy to have to move through that.

Yeah. And I mean, you've come so far, and it's just been incredible to watch your journey and see you use this experience as like a catalyst to step into your purpose and your mission. What you are passionate about doing in this world. And like, fast forward to today, you know, you're sharing all of these incredible resources with people. You're teaching people how to live their life with purpose and their life with passion because of the experience that you've went through. But obviously you can't know that this was all coming at the time. And I love, you know, some of the things that you say about the experience. Like, I know one point you mentioned that like, you don't even look at it as a disease anymore. You look at it as like more of an initiation. And so obviously that would've taken time to kind of get to that point. So talk to me a little bit about how you've moved from that like dark night of the soul to starting to see it as something that was maybe given to you or something that you had to work through, or how, how did you start to see it?

Mm-hmm. It's a big question. And I think it starts with the fact that it took me a really long time to, see any glimmers of light. I think I was in a very dark, deep, dark hole for a while. And it took a lot to process and understand. I think with my personality and my spirit, I very early on without knowing just started following things that felt alive. They make no logical sense, but they made sense in my intuition or somewhere deep in my bones. And it would— I'm a very, I don't like being put in a box. My kind of Human Design profile— What is that, by the way? I'm a Manifestor 3/5, and I don't like to be labeled. I don't like being put in a box. And if someone gives me a rule, I kind of go against it. But I think the pivotal, really big changing moment for me was a few weeks— It was probably about 3 weeks after my diagnosis. I was sitting with the specialist oncologist in Brisbane, and we were talking about neuroendocrine cancer, and they were kind of giving me the lay of the land the land. And they said to me, look, neuroendocrine cancer, once it has spread, is said to be incurable. So, uh, you know, basically I'm in palliative care, and the goal of my treatment is just to manage my symptoms and to make decisions that give me as long of a life as possible. And that felt really pessimistic, heavy. I kind of just felt like I'd been put in a box, like, here's your fate, this is it. That's it. And it just didn't sit with me. And the few weeks after that, I was agitated. I felt like everything was heavy. I felt like a dark cloud was over me, if I'm honest. It just felt like I couldn't sit well with it. It felt dark. And I started scrapbooking. One day, I was writing in my scrapbook. I wrote down incurable cancer. I just felt like I needed to get my thoughts out of my head and just onto some paper and try and make some sense out of it. for some, there was like a cosmic intervention. I honestly, I don't know what happened, but I picked up the pen and I was looking at having this big pity party for myself. And I picked up the pen and I just put one line on the N and all of a sudden it read, "I'm curable." And it felt like, honestly, it felt like the clouds parted and this light came shining down on me. It was like this, ah, you know, like come to Jesus moment. And everything changed. Like nothing had changed externally, but everything internally changed. And in that moment I was like, No, like, I— this is, this is a big— the odds are stacked against me. But the research that's been done prior, the data, the statistics that the doctors have, have never been run on me. Like, they have not taken into consideration my body, my mind, my spirit. And so why should someone else's story be mine? Like, I— they haven't come across Cassie yet. And so it was in that moment that my mission to kind of prove I'm curable began, and that really lit fire under my belly. It was almost like from that moment I decided, look, I'm gonna try anything and everything to see my children grow as old as I possibly humanly can. And I started to say things that made no logical sense, but I would say yes and I would follow them. And that led me down a path of healing with medicine and magic. And the magic is the mind, body, spirit. It's the things that make no logical sense, but that is where the magic lives. And the medicine kind of, you know, I feel like the medicine has mended me and the doctors and the research and the treatments that I've been in have helped save me. And then also the magic have helped morph me. And I think that it was my rebellious, to answer your question, I think that it was like my rebellious innate nature, the refusal to be put into a box, to be realizing that like no one else is coming and that I'm the hero of myself. Story that I'm the only person who can do this. And just this like insane hunger to live a life that meant more. And I think I know now the fragility of life and how it can be. I think when you face your mortality, everything changes and there's an urgency to it. And so I don't think that there's a clear pathway or a framework, but I think now that I look back, there were these series of moments that came to me, whether they were the universe brought them to me or whether I I seeked them out. Where I was, the times when I was curious, I had these calls to courage moments and Cassie before cancer probably would have said no. And Cassie now with cancer says, "Hell yes." The way I loved, lived, moved through the world changed. And there was no designated path. I just kind of followed where it took me. And it's been like a natural evolution. And now I still have cancer. I'm not without cancer. I have a long way to go. But I have never felt more alive in my life.

Yeah, that's incredible. And I love what you said because it sounds like you just really tapped into this like fighting spirit, you know, which I think can be such a beautiful thing to find because a lot of people, I think, don't feel connected to their purpose, you know. And I feel like what you've been through has brought you closer to that and lit that fire in you, which is such a gift in so many ways to to be able to feel so connected. And I know you've been through so much adversity and you're still going through that. And I think sometimes people need to really look at what do they hate or what are they like standing against? Not just like, what's your purpose? Like, what do you like? It's like, what fucking drives you crazy?

I think the word purpose is so tricky because I still don't know what my purpose is. If I'm to say what I think my purpose maybe is now, it's like just becoming aligned with who I truly deeply am, my soul. And I don't know what the meaning meaning of life is. I don't know. You know, there are so many unanswered questions. I'm not saying that I, I know all this. I don't. But I think purpose, it feels external. And really what I am practicing now is like self-love, self-awareness. Like, I am trying to understand what lights me up, what drains my energy. I am following what makes me feel alive. And there are times when I've had to upregulate. There's times when I've had to downregulate and find stillness and sacred solidarity. And there's times where it's like, no, you gotta do this. But I think when it all comes down to one thing, it comes down to love. And there's this beautiful story, Mai, that I'd love to share with this because it really changed the trajectory of how I moved through the world after my diagnosis. And I was sitting with my brother. So my brother is like this, he's a breathwork facilitator. He is just a very wise, beautiful human. I almost feel like he was put in my family for a very specific reason. But some of my most profound healing experiences over the last couple of years have been with my brother. So it's not lost on me how blessed I am. But it was early on in my diagnosis, we were sitting at a coffee shop and I'll never forget, I was giving him my war speech. I'm like, #FuckCancer, I'm gonna go for this, I'm gonna fight. And I was angry. And these are feelings that I needed to process and move through. And he let me kind of word vomit, everything. And even my body, it was tense, it was angry. And my brother was like, "Kass, do you mind if I just challenge you for a second?" And I was like, "What the fuck? What can you possibly challenge me on? Bro, I'm going to war here. You with me? Ride with me or not? This is the heaviest thing ever. What can you possibly challenge me on right now?" And he's like, "Just please give me a second." I'm like, "Okay." And he said, "All right, imagine your body is like an ecosystem. It's like a village. And there are some people in your village that are breaking the rules. They're playing up, they're being destructive, they are ruining the environment for other people. As the leader of the village, do you wanna go in and kill them, destruct them, like harm them, remove them, and fight? Or do you wanna show them what it means to be in your body? Do you wanna role model the love and the compassion and the self-trust? Do you wanna role model the behaviors that these villagers need to do if they wanna stick around stay in your body? Like, do you want to heal through fighting or do you want to heal through loving? And I was like, oh my God, like, I'm not a fighter. Like, fighting does not feel sustainable. It not only does it just fuel cortisol in our body, and which is an inflammatory thing, which is something that I need to 100% get rid of, that we should all be trying to reduce in our bodies. But love is like the highest frequency. Like, love is something I can really get around. Love is something that— there's a reason why it's the power of love. Most all of my healing experiences, the people I've met, the experiences experiences I've gone through have all been fueled by love. My reason, my purpose now is fueled by love. And so I feel like when we speak to people about purpose, it really just comes down to love.

Well, that's beautiful because I think purpose doesn't always have to be a final destination, but it's more, for me, purpose is like a feeling. I just know when I'm not in my purpose and it feels awful because I feel disconnected and not passionate. Purpose to me is like a feeling of like, like you're saying, like lit up, like just like I can do anything and I'm following the breadcrumbs and everything feels exciting and, you know, curious. There's a lot of curiosity there.

So it's so interesting because like someone even said to me the other day when I was on retreat in Bali that almost when we, our soul, when our soul has reached its full purpose, when it's come here to do what it needs to do, we die. And so purpose is like, if you reach your purpose, maybe that's it for you on this planet. We are evolving always and it's more It's more like it's about coming into alignment with our mind, body, and spirit, and with our soul. And when we are in alignment, we don't need to manifest because we— that is, we are living our manifestation. And I am experiencing that in real time. I mean, there is magic in motion here. But I think what it comes down to is that I think so often we try to control. Like all of us, we try to control our environment. We try to control our mind because the brain hates uncertainty. The brain is always scanning for threat. And so, and it also loves the story. So it's a melting pot concoction for all the heavy, nasty things. And our survival mechanism is to try control. And I tried to do that at the beginning. I was trying to find external validation. I was trying to seek assurance that I'm going to be okay. I needed doctors to tell me. It was control, control, control, because I felt so out of control. But actually, if you flip that into curiosity, that is when like your whole world expands up. I feel like that's when you start to follow the things that feel alive. You start to be more courageous, because if you're acting with curiosity and love, you can't go wrong. And when you're acting with curiosity, I feel like that's when you come into more alignment. That's when you feel more expanded. That's when you feel like you're in flow. When you're trying to force your way through life, when you're trying to force this purpose, when you're trying to force— it doesn't happen naturally, and life feels like it's stuck, it's exhausting, it's blocking. But when you are in flow, that means you're living in alignment, you're living in your truth, you're living courageous, you're living curious. Like, all expansive energies is I feel like what has kind of taken me from trying to find assurance that I'm gonna be okay to having acceptance of my situation. And that doesn't mean hanging up the boots and being like, "Oh, well, that's it for me." Acceptance for me feels like creating this sacred space around me where I have more spaciousness to be curious and blossom, and to navigate my way through the mud.

Yeah, I love that you're speaking my language. I've had to really unlearn that control so much. Like, I've been humbled again and again and again the last couple of years, 'cause I just cling to this control. And the ironic thing about it is that we think controlling gives us safety, but it doesn't.

No.

We can control whatever we want, and that doesn't mean we get the outcome that we're desiring. So it's just, it's a complete fool's errand.

Someone said to me the other day, like, you've only ever got like this frequency thing of like, like 2 seconds in front of you is what we can kind of control. And so we're moving through our days like every 2 seconds trying to control what does my hair look like? What is this alert? Like we're trying to control it. It's like, just let it be. I have this actually, this beautiful story that's just dropped in and I feel called to share it when I literally just said, let it be. Because I think that that's what it is. When I speak about following what feels alive and not knowing and releasing control, but I, I did a breathwork with my brother in Bali. And in that breathwork and meditation, I had this really profound visualization of me as an 80-year-old. And it was so vivid. Like she was beautiful. I say she was wrinkly AF, but she was so wise and grounded and knowing and assured. And I came out of the breathwork and meditation bawling because I felt like at that moment that they were like dangling candy in front of a baby. It was like, "Haha, this is This is what you're never gonna get. I just could not believe that that person could be me. And these series of serendipitous events happened and I'll walk you through them really quickly. So one day I was in a crystal store. I'm holding my crystal, I always do, but I was actually looking for this crystal. I was just really agitated. It was early in my diagnosis and I needed something to calm me and just hold my energy. —this beautiful lady came up to me in the crystal shop and she gave me a crystal, this crystal to hold, and she just did this like little thing around me whispering some like chants and stuff. And I was like, "Oh my God, do you do that outside of here? I don't even know what that was, but could you do that to me more?" And she was like, "Of course." Now she's like my spiritual healer. I see her once a month. She has been so pivotal in my healing journey. So I went to see her a couple of weeks later and we did a session. And afterwards she came up, she goes, "Oh my gosh, Cass, Mother Mary was coming so strongly through in—" you're in our session. And I'm not religious, so I was like, oh, well, cheers, Mother Mary, like bring Jesus along, you know, whoever you've got. Like I need as many people as I can on my healing journey. So then fast forward a few, that was a lovely sentiment. Fast forward a few months later, and I was at my kinesiologist and she was tapping away, doing her thing. And we said, let's do some future self work. So I was like, I'd like to talk to that 80-year-old me. Me who I saw in Bali. So she's doing her thing and the layers and pulling out the books and gave me a book to open. I opened it on a page that said, "Let it be." And she goes, "Oh, that's your 80-year-old self is saying, 'Let it be.'" And I was like, "It's a beautiful sentiment." She goes, "It reminds me of the Beatles song, 'Let it be, let it be.'" Terrible singer. But I was like, "Well, that's a beautiful sentiment. Cassie, let it be. Surrender. My 80-year-old self is just saying, "just don't force, flow." So it was a beautiful sentiment. So I called Mum after to tell her about my experience like I always do. And I said, "So my 8-year-old self said, 'Just let it be.'" And Mum goes, "Oh my gosh, Cass, every time over the last year when I have been really scared about your situation, when I've been down in the dumps and I'm trying to lift myself up, I've been listening to 'Let It Be' by The Beatles." And I was like, "No way, that's what she sung?" And then she said, "And I love that it's about," about Mother Mary. And I was like, oh my God, what the hell? And all these pieces of the puzzles came together. I mean, it took me the curiosity to, you know, I did the breathwork and meditation, see myself in the 80-year-old, but to believe it was her, I had to— I went the spiritual healer, you know, kinesiologist, my mom, all these random serendipitous events led me to now believe that I am that 80-year-old girl. And so I deeply believe that now, but there was no roadmap to believe that. It didn't make logical sense. Sense. It still doesn't make logical sense. Other people are like, well, how can you prove it? I'm like, I don't need to prove it. In my bones, I believe this. But it took curiosity, it took courage, and it took just following what was alive to have those moments and an awareness to bring all those pieces of the puzzle together and go, this is my truth.

Definitely. And trusting that that was sent for you, because we can often look at those things and be like, oh, whatever, that— like, be skeptical and just be like, that doesn't mean anything. But a big journey I've had, even personally, is just stop apologizing for that. Stop being like, oh, I know this sounds silly, but, or, you know, this sounds a bit woo, and just being like, no, I know that I heard that for a reason. And if it resonates, it resonates. You don't need any further proof. Stop trying to explain it, stop trying to justify it or prove it, and just take, like, does that resonate? Is that something that you can hold on to? And I think that's beautiful.

And I think, you know, our souls come here on this journey, and every single one of us are here for a very specific divine expansive reason. And we don't know what that is, we never will, but our journey to come into alignment with that— but if we try to plan and force and control our way through life, we're never going to live in alignment. If we surrender and start to notice the serendipitous moments, start to realize that we are about a part of something much bigger than just this physical experience, then we begin to kind of flow with life more, and we become more courageous in how we live. We become less apologetic in who we are because we know that we are here to shine light in whatever way we are meant to. And we know that internally, we just have to remove all the noise and really come into ourself to find that.

I love that because it's like you don't have to have a reason. It's like if it feels alive and you just share it, and as you just said, you don't even know exactly what your purpose is, but you're still feeling called to share things. I think a lot of people with this control, we think we need to have all the answers first. And then we have permission to like share. Otherwise it's like, well, what's that like for? Why are we doing that? And it's like, you don't have to like trust that if something is coming through and you feel like speaking on a topic or you feel like acting on something, that you don't need all the answers in advance.

No. And no one really cares about the destination. Let's be honest. Like it's about the journey. People wanna know the messiness, the magic. They wanna feel the vulnerability. I mean, vulnerability, like Brené Brown says, is the birthplace of connection with ourself. And with others. And so not trying to have the answers, sharing as we, you know, believing in where we're headed without even knowing. That is the beauty of life.

I love that so much. And I just listened to a podcast actually recently with Charlotte Tilbury, and she's actually very spiritual, and she was talking about how authenticity is like a frequency 40 times even stronger than love. So I think a lot of people, they worry about being authentic because if they're, for example, like, you know, they've got a business or whatever, it's like, is that professional? Is that aligned to my offer? Like, you know, all these things. But it's like, like, what has been your experience on authenticity? Like, how do you view the things that you feel like, okay, that's kind of sacred for me to keep as like personal, I wanna keep that to myself versus I think this could help someone or I just am feeling called to share. How have you navigated that side?

I think I am, I don't even know why I'm sharing, to be honest. And I feel like it's just like, it's just, it's happened. and I think the advice that I would have is that people— life is messy, and people connect with the messiness of it. I think someone said to me once at one of my events, "It's so refreshing to hear someone speak who hasn't got it figured out," because none of us have it figured out. And so, to hear from someone who's in the eye of the storm, who is connecting two things— I mean, my story isn't about illness. I very rarely talk about side effects, symptoms. I don't even really acknowledge kind of having— I speak about having cancer, but it doesn't define me. I speak about the things that make me feel alive, the spirituality. I speak about my fears. I speak about the uncertainties I have and how I'm navigating it, the modalities that I'm experiencing, the things that are just like the messiness and the magic of life. And I think that's that's what people are craving. The authenticity is literally just like, I believe that whoever needs my light will see it. I'm not trying to get millions of followers. I'm not trying to take over the world. I'm just trusting that there might be one little one-liner that resonates with someone, or there might be something I say or something that I do or something that I share that people— gives them permission and lets them see their truth. Both. So it's not for me about trying to get this loud message out. I'm just sharing as I go along. And there is no— I think in the businesses I've done before, there's like plans and there's projected forecasts. I have none of that. I am literally going off intuitive pull. I say yes to things now. Like for me, yes means your energy soars. But I'm also a fuck no. If I know that it doesn't serve my myself or my energy, or if it's a drainer, I don't want any part of it. But I do know that I say yes now to things that I definitely wouldn't have said yes to before, because I know that if I feel like there is something alive there, I need to follow it, because there will be something. Amazing.

So even with like content and like programs that you do and things like that, you just wait for them to drop in and then you work on them? You don't plan anything out?

No. And I mean, there has to— I mean, I also am like in marketing prior and all that stuff, so there's an element of, you know, creative processes And you do need to have an element of planning, but in terms of the vision of it, it is a deep felt sense and an energetic pull that I'm following. And I'm, you know, I was gonna do an event in February. I'm like, that doesn't serve what I need to do right now. I need to focus on this new program. Like I'm shifting and moving things. I feel like I am just, I'm flowing with whatever is being called because I do think now I truly believe in, signs, symbols. I feel like the universe has got my back and will kind of show me the way forward within myself as well, intuitively, my life force energy, all that kind of stuff. And it sounds woo-woo, but it's really not.

And have you always been this in touch with your intuition? No.

I mean, no. And you know what the crazy thing is? It's actually, um, I think now I am. It's, it's very layered, but it's— the intuition has come through stronger, I feel. Because I trust myself wholeheartedly. How did that happen? I think when I realized that no one else is coming, that I'm the only person who can walk this journey, and when, you know, I'm the only one who can go on the PET scans, I'm the only one who gets the blood tests, I'm the only one who can— I can have people circle me and scaffold me, but when it really comes down to it, I'm the only one who has to show up. And so there's— I've had to learn how to self— how to trust myself. But that's not something you can just read and flick a switch. It's like, okay, I trust myself now. No, it's saying yes to these little things. It's like putting a marble in the jar every single time. So when that real big call to courage moment comes, I have enough evidence in my heart and soul that I can do it. So I'm having to learn to trust myself, but I'm also having to— in terms of my body, I've had to— I've stopped drinking alcohol, coffee, things that used to numb me, or I stopped it for my anxiety when I was first diagnosed and for health reasons as well. But I feel like now I have a lot clearer vessel. And so, my mind is a lot more connected to my gut. And I feel like I have this— my energy field is a lot more purer than what it used to be. And so I think that it's not necessarily that I'm like, "Oh, I'm an intuitive being." I've had to work hard to get to this place. And I've had to, you know, this is something that's learned and earned. It's not something that you can just like read a book and be like, "Okay, this is life experiences. These are moments that you put it in like your own bank." blank. And it's— I've had to be curious. I've had to read lots of books. I've had to navigate my way. But I think that's what I'm trying to do now. Like with my new program, Rise and Shine, I'm done all this exploring and uncovering and discovery. And I've had these big moments, these little moments, these aha moments, these following the glimmers. I've really leaned into spirituality a lot. And that has become a huge part of my life now because I understand the neuroscience of it. Which is so not woo-woo. It is mind-blowing how people think spirituality is woo-woo. I used to think it was woo-woo. And now, like with all the research of say like Dr. Lisa Miller, who I'm obsessed with, it is so, it is part of our like biology. We have, everyone is born with an innate capacity for spirituality. It is a part of our brain that we, children are the most spiritual beings, but then society, —conditions them to not. So things like prayer, meditation, breathwork, random acts of kindness, volunteering, service, being in nature, all these things is what lights up that part of our brain. And then obviously the world we live in, we're on our phones, we're always distracted, we're not in tune, so we're never using that part of the brain. And Lisa Miller is saying that if we live with an awakened brain, not only is there like we have this feeling of— for me, it's felt like I'm divinely supported and protected and guided, And it makes me feel like I'm part of something much greater than just this physical self. And for me, that has been the assurance that I need that I'm going to be okay. It has helped me understand what I believe to be true about death, which was my biggest fear. It has helped me, you know, I feel like this is happening for me, not to me, because of this understanding of the universe energy and my deep connection with it. but there's also this research around it that's like people who have an awakened brain are less likely to have substance abuse, suffer depression, mental health, where people with an awakened brain are more resilient. They have a deeper sense of belonging. And so, there's a lot of stuff saying there is a direct correlation between increase in mental health crisis across the world and also a decrease in spirituality. So, it is so profound. But these things, what I'm doing, this Rise and Shine program, I feel like is trying to help people that have any challenging chapters or their breakdowns whether they're big or small, and use them as a breakthrough in their life by all the things that I have kind of— the big overarching chapters, I've kind of like wanna cut through the noise and give people the catalyst for them to go on their own expansive awakening, beautiful journey so that we can now look at challenges as initiations, not as, "Oh, poor me. The world's out to get me." It's like, "No, this is calling me into my next step." step of evolutionary growth.

Um, so yeah, yeah, that's amazing. And I love what you said about that because obviously there's so many things that people can try and they have to go on their own journey, of course. But I think as well there can be things that like have more impact than others and that you do— for example, like you mentioned, even just your body being clearer now because you're taking better care of your physical health. And it's like that alone probably eliminates like 10 different things that could come up, like anxiety, stress, this, that, the other. So it's like, I feel like it is actually very worthwhile for people to look at, like, what's the one thing that if I was to get on top of this one thing, it would like have a knock-on on these all, all these other things, instead of trying to be like treating anxiety with pills and doing this with that. And do you know what I mean? So I think that's really interesting as a concept to me, to like look at what are the things that we can really have massive impact with. And they're probably not going to be related.

So it's like something that you like do to make a decision around a boundary of what you eat. Are you eating the processed sugar, or are you going to sleep before it with the screen, whatever it might be, that will then impact your clarity the next day, your, your drive, your motivation, your like your energy levels. Like they're not necessarily correlated.

Yeah. So you could be looking over here externally at a problem and actually it's like way back internally, you know, that could be helped with more sleep or like whatever. So I mean, you've tried so many different modalities and different things. I'd love to— I mean, you've essentially made yourself a guinea pig in a way of all these different like modalities, foods, protocols. With just on the topic of like food and energy and health, what have been the biggest shifts that have given you more vitality and made you feel more energetic?

I think now I am like consuming things that nourish me. Like I think I, if I, if it, if I, you know, I have cancer, I can't— processed sugar is really bad for cancer. The caffeine, all these things that heighten my anxiety or cortisol, anything like that, I don't consume anymore. And since that, I think that taking care of my body from what I consume has been a big one. But also then, I'm loving— I sat in a frequency room the other day, in a quantum healing room, and that even was amazing. Hyperbaric chambers, ozone therapies. I'm trying to rid heavy metals and detox pesticides and all that kind of stuff. I think that I'm trying to create a clean space in my body so that that the tumors that I have aren't given the environment to thrive. Like, I'm essentially starting to starve the cancer through creating an environment that it can't survive in. And I'm doing that— is mind, body, and spirit though. Like, I feel like often we're like, oh, wellness is just looking what you consume in your body. It's, it's only one-third of the puzzle. Like, if we can be eating the healthiest but we are so anxious and we are trying to control and stuff because we're not doing the mind work, and we might be feeling so strong in our sense of conviction, but we are totally missing the magic around us because we are not attuned to our spirituality or giving that a lens, then it's all out of whack. So for me, I think I have literally decided that— again, I'm a yes girl and I say yes to absolutely everything. And it would be really, I think, I think it, it goes through those three lenses.

Yeah, I love that. And so what does your day-to-day look like now as opposed to what it did before, before you had this journey and lived in this new way?

Well, I think, you know, it changes. Like, I think my days— three young children, like, you guys, you know, our days are never the same.

And that, and that's even a good point to bring up because sometimes we have this intention of like, I'm gonna be so calm today and I'm gonna be this and that and like let all these good things come through, but then you're like dealing with absolute chaos Totally, 100%.

I think what I am in a season of now is devotion. And so I have really kind of dedicated myself in this little season I'm in. I don't know if it's gonna be a month, 2 months, 3 months, but I am at the moment getting up at 4:44 every morning and I'm giving myself— I go down to the beach, I do a meditation, I then go do an exercise session, or I will walk the beach, or just— I just need a little bit of time to myself. That's been very sacred and beautiful for me. Especially when the sun is so beautiful at that time of morning. And then I obviously, when I do that, I feel like I'm more present with my children. I'm still, I work, but I'm always, I work, I'm with the kids, I'm trying to incorporate more play. We do a morning prayer ritual with my children now. I think I'm trying to create more rituals for myself, for my family. And I remember always saying to my mom, 'cause we have a really beautiful family unit, unit. And I remember saying to her like, "How did you create such a beautiful family unit?" And she said rituals. And I remember it didn't really land with me that much, but now I understand. It's like creating the morning prayer rituals. We do gratitude at night around the dinner, whether we're out or whatever, it's chaos. Everyone says what 3 things that they're grateful for. I have more rituals around myself right now and being boundaried. I mean, I have 3 young children. Before, I thought I was so busy being everything for everyone but myself. And now I'm like, I can't operate through life and be the best mom if I also don't give that to myself. It doesn't mean that I'm like every morning, you know, I don't, it ebbs and flows and I give myself permission and grace through all of that. But I do think that a priority is my health and my healing. And it should be for everyone. We are all essentially healing from something like mind, body, spirit. And so it is, is, you know, it's heal is part of health. It's, you know, it's part of the word. I think that we need to put our own masks on before we can attend to other people. But how that looks every day changes. Some days I'm really regimented on my health regime. Other days I just lie down and read a book because that's amazing for my mind. Other days I'll do a breathwork and meditation, or I'll go for a walk in nature with the kids. I'll try and incorporate them both, kill two birds with one stone. You know, like I'm flowing with it. I'm not someone who's like, like, "Must do this, then that," 'cause that's control. So there is a fundamental understanding or a belief around how I wanna move and operate in the world. It's becoming less and less structured, but it feels good. There are times when my body— The last few days I've been really tired, and so I've canceled some of my exercise classes. I didn't get up at 4:44. I honor my body. I listen to it. It tells— Before when I was diagnosed with cancer, I feel like first it whispered to me. Me. Then it kind of started yelling at me. Then it screamed bloody murder until I actually listened and I was forced to. And what was going on? But I do feel like now in hindsight, I look back and I was like, well, there probably were some little red flags that I didn't listen to. Like what? Just like stress, overworking? Yeah, like I had some bowel changes. I was very tired, but I had 3 young children. I just finished breastfeeding. I thought it was hormone changes. I was puffy. I was in like— I just felt like I was foggy in the head. I mean, neuroendocrine cancer has very subtle symptoms and that's one of the problems why it can take so long to get diagnosed. But I think now I'm way more attuned and I actually listen to my body. So if I'm tired, I rest. When I'm like need to upregulate, I was coming here in the car and I was like listening to like epic music. I was like having a little dance party. So you need to upregulate, you know, I just go with it now. What my body tells me it needs, I listen. But it's taken hard work to create an energy field where I feel like I can do that. That. Yeah.

And I mean, there's so much noise around us saying like, you have to stick to your routine and this and that, and like habits— you stick to your habits. And so we think like, oh my God, I'm just like giving myself excuses if I don't like do what I said I would do. And yes, it's important to like keep those little micro promises to ourselves, but also if like you're getting up at 4:45 to make yourself feel better for the day and actually what you need is rest, then just stay in fucking bed. Yeah, totally. Like, that's going to make yourself feel better. Permission.

Because I think it's very quick to go into this like shame spiral. And you know, we, we are our own biggest critics, and that's our mind, our ego. It's like our, um, the conditioning, the, the societal expectations on us. Like, it's a lot. So how do you operate in this world but also stay true to your essence, your energy, your vibration? Um, and both can absolutely coexist, and it is such a beautiful journey to be on. Because you know what I realize now? Like, we only we only have one shot at this life experience. We only have one wild, precious, and fragile life, and it can be taken at any moment. None of us are guaranteed tomorrow. So I feel like a lot at the beginning, I was kind of like, "Oh, well." I was jealous of other people that they got to kind of work through the world. I'd look at them in shopping centers and I'd be like, "Oh, look, they're blissfully— They get the best life and I'm here on my death sentence." But then I realized one day, I'm like, no, actually nobody is guaranteed tomorrow. We all dance with our mortality every single day. And maybe the gift is that I'm hyper-aware of mine. I look back now, you know, mom said to me early on in my diagnosis about a year in, she was like, if you could go back to that day when you were diagnosed and they said to you, it's just an infection, Bob's your uncle, you can go back, would you? And my answer is no. Like I would not want to live the life that I was living before compared to the life I am now, because I know that nobody is guaranteed tomorrow. Guaranteed tomorrow. We all live a fragile life. And so I'm no different to you even though I have cancer, but I am now living life through a lens that is so much more beautiful than it was before. And I think beauty has this real tension to it. I feel like you can only really understand beauty if you understand the tension and the fragility of it. It's like a sunrise. Sunrises are so beautiful because they're fleeting and they'll never be the same again. It's the same with our Like you can only understand the beauty once you really, once it lands that like literally your last breath could be this afternoon. And I think when you fully deeply let that land, then the way that you move through the world changes because you only get one shot at it. And so my goal, I think, and we spoke about purpose earlier, but it's like what I'm doing now is that when I take my final breath, whenever that may be, I want nothing but peace to fill my heart knowing that I lived a life where I left nothing on the table. And I feel like if you would ask me that a year ago, I would say I'm not. Like if I were to die now, I wouldn't. If I were to die now, I think I'm getting pretty close to living a life that I would feel peaceful with that because I'm feeling living aligned and true. And I get to raise my children through this lens now. I see, it's so beautiful.

Like what are the things that you think you're trying to instill more in them now or some of the, traditions that have really brought that together, because I love that you do some of that stuff with your kids. And I think it's so beautiful to, um, to actually give them that insight as well. And even something you said at the Dare to Live event, you know, talking about— I remember you shared a story, it was just like a little thing about how, I don't know, maybe one of your kids fell and scratched their knee or something, and you, you know, you just said to them, it's okay, because like your body knows how to heal itself. And that's something I've adopted since. Whenever like one of my kids get an ouchie, as we call I'm like, that's okay, just take a couple of days. Your body is amazing and it heals itself. And that's just like, just a beautiful reframe.

Um, yeah, gosh, it's been, it's, it's been such a privilege to be able to grow, raise my children through the lens that we have been over the last couple years. And I think we haven't shied away from— they've come to a lot of my doctor's appointments, or we don't actually— I was talking about this the other day, we don't even talk, we don't tell them that it's cancer, but for them that would mean nothing to them. Yeah. And so already I'm trying to we're trying to shield them from something that actually we could normalize this. So I haven't had like a proper deep conversation about the darkness of it and the mortality of it. But I bring them into blood tests and they come, "Mummy has to go exercise because Mummy's honoring her body. Why isn't Mummy doing this? Mummy's honoring her body." Or, "Mummy has to go and expand her mind or her heart." Like I normalize that kind of stuff. Stuff. But we do start from gratitude through to bravery, the way that I speak to them. We bring them on the journey with us in a sense that these little reframes, "Your body will heal itself," through to 3 grateful practices. I talk to them about the universe, and every time there's an angel number, we make a wish. I speak to them about manifesting and visualizing, even when my daughter is doing like her cartwheels. She now like takes a deep breath, breathes, does it. We do our morning prayer rituals, which is just more around we acknowledge spirit, ourself, and I love it. The other night, my daughter said to me, we were going around saying our gratefuls, and she was like, "I'm so grateful for my heart." And I was like, just to be able to instill these kind of qualities in these children to allow them to thrive. I've even been doing their Human Design profiles. I did their numerology mapping. I've done their astro cartography mapping. Like I want to allow my children to— I wanna nurture their spirit and I want them to grow up living in alignment. And so I'm taking these little micro things from mine and bring it into their life through the lens of mind, body, and spirit. I mean, we, the mindset, I'm also, we talk about, is that an everyday food or is that a sometimes food? Trying to get them to make decisions honor their body without taking the fun out of it. They're obviously children, so I give them autonomy and choice, but I also get them to follow their heart, be courageous in little moments. My daughter and my son have had some troubles in the last few weeks of school with drop-offs, and so we went and bought a crystal, and then we all put our hands around the crystal and charged it together and poured all our energy in it with my husband and my two other kids, charged it in. And then they took that to school with them and held them. And so there's little— there's things like that. When I go to Bali, I bring back statues of Hindu gods and like we talk about different experiences. You know, I just share the magic with them. We go on wonder walks together. I think that I want to— yeah, I want to raise them to be spiritually connected. I want to be in tune with their body and to have an expansive, curious, open mind. Yeah, that's so beautiful.

And I love what you just said just, you know, have shared just over the course of the conversation, it's all really just about that devotion, but it's like also through parenting and through, I just feel like, you know, obviously this podcast is about being seen, but what people sometimes don't realize is that it's not just surface level that, you know, being seen and talking about your brand or whatever, it's like all these little micro moments throughout your day and throughout your life that make you feel like you've got this beautiful life and then you're sharing that with others.

And I think it's what is seen as the aura of someone and their vitality and their essence and their energy. And that's what people feel. And we're humans, we crave feeling, especially in a world where everything's so automated and digital and surface level. And it's just like, it doesn't, you know, robots. It's like we crave connection, connection to self, connection to others. And so I think that being seen is being seen in yourself.

Seeing for who you are. Seeing for who you are. You can't fake that.

No, and owning it, but being willing to expand that and to get really curious around it. I feel like a lot of the time prior, I was probably putting myself in places with people who might drain my energy or businesses that weren't lighting up my soul. And now I wanna put myself in places where I'm feeling expanded with, you know, expander people where, I have new ideas, new ancient wisdom brought to me where it's a felt thing. Like I want to— and I think that's what people are drawn to is just this like magnetism because of the authenticity, of the truth, but of the courage to do things differently, to not be like, do things how society expects it to be done. And I think that that is, is what allows people to truly be seen within themselves and others.

Yeah, I couldn't agree more. And yeah, I just think it's that, like, as you said, it's that magnetism, it can't be faked and people feel it. And it's about working on those other areas of your life that allows that to then come to the forefront rather than trying to like put a bandaid on like, oh, it's like my content strategy that's not working. It's like work on you, on yourself, you know? So how have you navigated being more visible? Because, you know, it's really in the last probably year, I would say, that you've really started to share more this journey and, and create programs around it and, you know, actually share yourself and your message and your mission with the world. So how have you navigated that? That— has that been scary at all?

So, um, it's— I think it's interesting because I, I'm a, I'm a an open book and I want to share all aspects of my journey, the dark, the beauty, the magic, all the things. But I think I've realized in the last little while that some things are sacred. I had a spiritual healing session the other day and the one I spoke about in the crystal store. And I walked in, I was like, "Do you mind if I record this in the back, like just a time-lapse of it to share?" And she was like, "No, this is sacred between you, me, and the divine." And I was like, "Oh my God." I was like, thank you for saying that to me, because I think sometimes you feel like everything is on the table, but it doesn't need to be that way. Yeah, I think some things are sacred. Um, and also, you know, when it comes to kids and some of the things we do, like, I think that there is a beautiful— and it goes with anything in life— sometimes we feel like we need to share everything, otherwise we're not being authentic. It's like, no, well, this is actually very sacred to me, and I don't need to share that. Um, but it has felt— I want I think that I want to be of service to this world. And so, I feel like my light is— by sharing it, whoever needs that little bit of light will find it. At the beginning, it was very much about I need more followers, I need to put ad spends into this, I need to have this like smoky mirror thing. And I've actually surrendered to that entirely. Now it is— I actually don't even care about followers followers. I don't even have many. I'm like, it's just, I think about it like, you know, someone said the other day, like, you think about the amount of followers you have if you were sitting in a room with them all. And I was like, that is so many people to have in a room. Like, that's enough for me. I'm like, that is incredible. But I think I just, I just want to share whoever is meant and trust that whoever is meant to receive or will you'll be put in front of it. And I think that I used to have plans and strategies. I don't. I'm just like winging it. I'm like just sharing what drops in for me when it does. But being intentional about it as well and pushing the boundaries a little bit. Like I think I'm more and more going into the realm of spirituality and woo-woo things, which I don't believe are woo-woo at all. And I wanna bring people on that journey with me because it's so expansive and enlightening. Yeah, and they can take it or leave it.

Like, it's your account.

Totally. It's your account.

You can post whatever you like. Totally. Why are we scared to post things when it's like, it's ours? People can just hit unfollow or just whatever, move on.

And I think I also used to at the beginning, like, look at people who were, um, not in a similar— because I guess what I'm doing is super unique because it's just my journey— but look at other influencers or keynote speakers and be like, oh my gosh, I can never be like that. Like, what's the point? And now I've actually just like— I'm looking at people. I'm— now my feed is fueled by things that energize me. So it's like health things or like magic and beautiful quotes. Like it's not about the people in my realm. It's about the things that inspire me. And so I think that now my like feed is, I'm like, I'm excited to get on Instagram, see what's happening. It's not like a scary thing. And I think also the programs I'm creating, the events I'm curating and delivering and facilitating, it's all about, about just authenticity and storytelling. And I am always blown away by what comes through for people. Like, I think I'll have an idea of what might resonate or land for people, and it blows my mind where their aha moments come in. And I'm like, you were meant to be there, or you were meant to have that program because you were destined, or the universe wanted you to receive whatever download that was. And they're always so different. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

I love that so much. And yeah, I think it's such a great lens to have on it. And I think also coming into the new year, I think it's a great time for anyone listening now to do something like that, to look at your feed and look at what could you— are you just following competitors? Totally. Can you just make it more fun and inspiring to go onto your feed and not like, you know, and really audit, you know, what we're looking at?

Yeah, invite in expanders, but expanders not necessarily in an external way, but in an internal way. Like, what are you interested in cooking? Get some more cooking things in there, like whatever. What inspires you is like what fuels you. And, but I think it is very, very easy to fall into the trap of comparison mindset and trying to control the narrative. And, um, I'm not good enough, it's already been done, who needs mine? Like, it's just, yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly.

I love that so much. It's been such an amazing conversation. I've got like 3 quite long-winded questions to wrap up instead of rapid fire. Beautiful, let's do it. So the first one is, what would you suggest to anyone that wants wants to connect more deeply with their purpose? And in saying that, it doesn't have to be that destination, but just to like light that fire within.

I would say read The Awakened Brain by Dr. Lisa Miller. Um, yeah, or if there's a link I can send you to a podcast she did. Yeah, I'll put it— I'll send it to you. Listen to the— this podcast. Amazing. I'm definitely going to do that as well.

Okay, what can people do just on a day-to-day basis? What have you found the best thing for your mental health just to make you feel amazing?

I have created a little like meditation ritual for myself. I think I always used to think of meditation is like a time waster. I don't have time. But it is so— since I've started meditating, it's like the world around you transforms and changes. I think this sacred space just to go inward, it's when the insights come in, the downloads come in, and I'm like, I also know what I need to remove from my day and all that kind of stuff. I think that it gives me a little bit of a passageway to tap into my intuition. Life is so busy. Like, if we don't have 5 minutes to do a meditation on our own, then there's something wrong with how you're navigating your day. I have 3 kids. I've worked 2 jobs. Like, I've got— I'm healing. I'm all the things, and I can still find that time. It's a devotion practice though, but I think that there's something with devotion that, you know, if you devote yourself to something, then it changes around you. So I'm devoting myself to meditation at the moment, and I'm finding that I am more present. I'm— my days are flowing more fluidly, and it actually feels good to take like like a bit of ownership of that.

Yeah, I love that. Do you have a particular practice that you follow?

I have created my own practice. Um, I think that that's something that's meaningful to me. Um, but I— there's so many different meditations out there to find something that lands for you. Yeah. Um, but I have kind of created my own.

Yeah, that's beautiful. And lastly, what can people do to have more visibility with their mission?

Just be authentic and see where that lands. Like listen to your intuition. I think that there are so many ways, there is so much space in this world for magic and light and love. And so to find a way that feels true and authentic for them for what visibility looks like, it could be on socials, it could be just in their family, in their community, it could be through events. Like it could be through writing a book. Like who knows what visibility looks like? It could just be visibility within yourself and your heart. But to be curious, to let go of the control, and to probably sign up to my Rise and Shine program if I'm honest. I'm like thinking about it. I'm like, I think that the world needs that kind of cut through the noise and have these little initiations that make you realize what's really important to you and how you wanna move through the world.

Yeah, amazing. And where can people connect with you and find out more about this program?

So Instagram is my modality. Of choice. That's where I share everything. So that @iamkasmiller is my Instagram. And Rise and Shine is currently in the works. So that'll be launching on the 22nd of the 2nd. Of course, there's an angel number, 222. But Rise and Shine is essentially just a— it's a program to turn any breakdown into a breakthrough. And it takes them through the 9 steps. So it's like R is reckoning. It's an acronym. Reckoning, the invitation, self-trust, embodiment, spirituality. It takes them through all the things. And it's a curation of stories. There's a workbook, so there's personal reflection. It's a self-paced online program. So I am pouring my heart and soul into that right now, and everything is channeling. All the paths lead to this moment. So I feel like that will be launched on the 22nd of Feb. And yeah, I'm excited for that.

Amazing. Well, I'm sure you'll be posting about it on your socials. So I'll put all that in the show notes, and people can connect with you there. Thank you so much for opening your heart and just sharing your story so beautifully and vulnerably with us today. I'm sure there's so many golden nuggets. I, I know I've definitely had some, and you're doing so much amazing work and inspiring so many people. So thank you. Thank you.

Thank you, Katie. Thank you so much for having me. Of course.