A Conversation with Emily Sandberg | S03E10

Hey, I have a quick announcement before we get started. So many of my clients start how to CEO because they have issues on the team and they can't figure out, okay, is this a me thing or a them thing? Am I the problem or are they the problem? In order to address that, I'm doing a five day course live called the Team Audit. It's hosted in a couple of weeks in May. You need to register, go to chrisplacky.com audit and we're going to get to the bottom of it. Every day. I'm going to teach you exactly what you need to do to determine are they the problem or am I the problem? And then what do I do about it once I know the answer. Chrisplacky.com audit sign up now. It's going to be amazing. It'll be fun. And mostly it'll answer that very pressing question that I know you have. Now back to our regular programming. Welcome to season three of the Leadership Is Feminine podcast. I'm Chris Plackey and I'm so happy that you're here. In this season, we're doing something different. One of the things that I believe to be true is that there is so much unsourced, beautiful wisdom in the everyday person. I really like to talk about what I call obscure wisdom. That means these are things that people know that unless we meet them at a cocktail party or at a barbecue or sitting next to them, you know, on a train, we don't hear about it. And these aren't celebrities. These aren't people who've written, you know, best selling books yet. These aren't people that are on the circuit that everybody else is learning from. These are everyday women who are CEOs, building, dealing with, working through all the pieces and parts of running a company. And I want to bring my beautiful clients and their wisdom to your ears because I know that you'll find it to be validating and insightful and hopefully also some fun. So without further ado, let's get started with this week's amazing personal client and guest on Leadership Is Feminine. Welcome, welcome. Thank you so much for joining this episode of Leadership Is Feminine. I'm Chris Plecki and I'm so excited because today Emily Sandberg is here and Emily is my CFO as well as a few others. But we don't like to talk about them because she just is mine. But I'm just so excited to talk to Emily because not only is she my cfo, she also has been a client through the how to CEO program, and she's building her own gorgeous business alongside everybody else. So welcome, Emily.

Thank you, Chris. I'm thrilled to be here.

So tell everybody who you are, what you do, and what kind of magic your business does in the world.

Oh, our magic is money. And helping entrepreneurs with money, especially women, I just hate to see money cause people to stumble. And it's such a big stumbling block, or it can be. And so my mission is really to take that away, to not allow money to be the reason that you have problems in your business. Like, we can figure that out. This is numbers on paper. Well, that's what we think, but really, it's what happens up here in our heads. Right, right.

Exactly. Yeah.

So if we can, we can unravel that stuff that's happening in your head around money. Your business can be so much fun. There's so much more magic there when we don't have that creating problems.

Right, exactly. And who specifically do you work with? Because I know people will be curious, like, yes, everybody hears about, ooh, a cfo. I want one.

We work with online business owners who are coaches, course creators, people who really sell their expertise and they work online.

And why have you chosen that group of women mostly to work with?

They're my people. It's who I am. It's who they are. So it's easier for me to understand. Maybe not easier to understand, but it was just the most natural progression for me. I used to work with more people, but when you niche down, you're able to help people more, to get more. You're more experienced in who they are and what they need. So it just was a way for me to magnify my own expertise by helping a smaller group.

Yeah, it's such a harder way for people to learn how to think. Right. That serving a smaller niche actually helps you expand your ability to help and also actually expand the success of your business, Right?

Absolutely. The efficiency of your business, too. You become more efficient, which then allows for the growth, because you're not. Your experience or your service doesn't have to be as broad.

Right. So you don't have to put your hand in so many different pots. Right.

Yeah.

Zero in. So you've been a guest expert several times actually in the how to CEO program, which has been delightful to have you in there. And I'm kind of curious, just as we talk about your expertise, what would you say, what you would answer now might be different than what you would have said a year or two ago, but what are you seeing as what are the Big obstacles or challenges that entrepreneurs are facing right now when it comes to money.

Right now, when it comes to money, there's uncertainty. We've been dealing with that for a couple years now. After Covid hit, it felt like all of a sudden there was a lot more uncertainty in the world as far as what could happen, problems I could face, issues that I could need to find solutions for. We've been dealing with that uncertainty. And the idea that this is right along with the uncertainty that I see this trajectory of my life. And before, it felt like the trajectory was pretty set and I had control over that. And then people discovered, oh, we have Covid, and we have an insurrection at the Capitol, and we have lockdown, and we have mask mandates, and we have protests, and we have all of this happening that was like, I don't have control over this, and it can affect my life, affects my business in ways that I don't necessarily feel prepared for. And so that created a lot of uncertainty and a lot of scarcity around that. People wanting to hold onto their money a little bit tighter.

Yeah. And it's interesting because maybe you can echo this or add more perspective, but certainly over the last couple of years, when Covid first hit. Right. We talked about sort of that March 13, when it was like, whoa, everything screeched to a halt, and everybody was just terrified that they were going to stop making money. And certainly the majority of my clients have made more money than they ever made before, including me. Right. And so that's so interesting that despite all of what you've just said, there's so many people making more money, and yet there's this really, really powerful or pronounced belief that there's less opportunity, that things are. You have to be in scarcity. Right. So how have you worked with women through that? I'm just kind of curious. As you've been working with different kinds of, obviously all online businesses, but different areas of focus, what have you seen in the women that have struggled is sort of that common or core belief that they have that is preventing them from, in many ways, almost taking advantage of a time where there's a tremendous amount of opportunity?

Yeah. It was watching them give up control. They never had control in the first place, but they thought they did. And so when they thought it was taken away from me, and then. Then that became a really scary thing, and so they felt they retracted. Watching them retract, rather than going, oh, the safety was never in the money. Which you. If you've listened to me, you hear me say that a Lot safety isn't in the money, but in who they are and how they react to the circumstance. What I do with my clients is helping them learn to rely on themselves, their talents, their skills, what they had going for them anyway. And then that helps them make more money. Not ever the money that creates the safety. It's your own ability to react, to respond, to plan, to have vision. All of those things are what makes your business.

And to trust yourself, right?

Absolutely.

Even in the absence of a lot of evidence. You and I have had this conversation about my business.

Where I've had to do the most growth is believing that I can make something happen that I've never made happen before. Right. And then also knowing like, even if whatever it is I'm doing right now stops working, I know how to translate what's in my brain into revenue.

Yes.

And even if it takes another year to get that to go, I do believe that's true. And so that belief though is sometimes the hardest part to find. Because when the bank account gets low, when people don't buy, you know, whatever it is that you do, it can be very convincing that you shouldn't, that you're not going to be successful, that you're in the wrong thing, that nobody wants you. Like you can just really, really fall into that trap.

Well, yeah, if you're consistently looking for things that are going to go wrong or how they're going to go wrong, or I'm on the lookout for that, we have that natural confirmation bias, but then we find the evidence. Yeah. And so when you contract, when you, you lose that belief in yourself and you start to contract, then you find all the evidence that it was scary and dangerous out there and that contracting was the right thing.

Yeah. It's always so interesting to me. Right. Like I remember years ago, I don't know if I ever told you this, I was doing a thought model in a leadership workshop and it was a bunch of bankers.

And I put.

In the circumstance line, I said, I give you a million dollars today.

I told them, I said if I give you all a million dollars, we're going to put a million dollars in the ceiling. What are the thoughts that you have about that? And I went around the room and people were like, that's cool. Woo hoo. I could pay for my kids school. They had all these thoughts. But there was this one guy who was my favorite and he just said, it's not enough.

I was like, that's so interesting. Right. So whatever that dollar is, right. I could have put $100, $500, $500,000, $500 million. And everybody would had a different thought about it, but we just think that money is what makes us think or makes us feel. And it isn't. It's the way that we think about money. So anyway, I just, I. My work with you has been so powerful. And what I would say for people listening who don't have someone who they partner with, if you're running a company, there's. There's really like, we all need a bookkeeper, right. We need people who categorize and manage and document how the business's money is spent. But then we need someone also who helps us think forward and strategize and forecast and budget and plan and ideate. And so working with you has been so good because it keeps me very connected to my money, to the money of the business. And I have to face things about money that I may not want to, but I do it every Monday at 9:00 in the morning. And so therefore it's done and over with. Right. I always like to joke, right. If my dashboard, because Emily uses this, uses a system that's like a dashboard. If my dashboard's green, it's much better meeting than the red, but it's red, so.

But I love how you said it keeps you connected, though, because that's what we see people do when they think the numbers are wrong or when they think the numbers aren't going to tell them what they want to hear, they disconnect. That's when they stop looking.

And a lot of times I'll find people are wrong. They show up to meetings with me and they're like, wow, that was a terrible month. I'm like, really?

Yeah.

Looks pretty good to me.

Yeah.

And we dig into it and they've been having these terrible feelings about this month.

And the money's not reflecting that. That's not the reality.

I have learned. Yeah. Money denial does not help you make more. No, no, it doesn't. It also doesn't help you be rich.

No, no.

Even though it's like, well, it's okay. There's probably some in there, right? I'll just spend it. I'll be fine. So I love that. Okay, so let's talk about money and leadership, because you and I have had this conversation. I used to talk about this a lot. I feel like there's like five key relationships that female entrepreneurs really need to work on and develop, which. Right. Are your business, the relationship you have, your business relationship you have with your team, the relationship you have with your time, the relationship you have with yourself, and then the relationship you have with your money to really step into kind of that leadership role. Right. So what do you see as the attributes to a woman who's really in a leadership. Who has a great leadership role with her business and her money, the money of her business and maybe even herself?

Yeah, yeah. Particularly with money. One of the problems I see is women who use money to define who they are. They want the money to tell them they're good enough, they're smart enough, they're capable enough. So they think if they have enough money, then they'll know that for sure. But when you're a leader, when you take leadership over the money, what you do then is you recognize the money for what it is. It's a tool. It's a tool to be used to fund your business, to help your business grow, to compensate people for working with you, to compensate you. It can buy us new experience. It can give us the power to help other people.

It's a diverse and incredibly useful tool. But what it can't do is tell you that you're good enough, that you're smart enough, or that you're capable enough. So when we expect that from money, we're often left wanting more and more and more because it can't fill that hole. But in a leadership position, what I love to see is women who know their money, they have that relationship in that they check in frequently. So they know how much they have, they know how much they need. And even if they're getting bad news from those, they still recognize that they have the power to change that.

So good. Yeah.

Yeah. It makes such a difference.

It's always amazing to me how many women who run businesses don't know how much money they made last month. They don't have a revenue goal. There's no goal. It's like, we'll just see how it goes, Right. There's just a real lack of attention. And I think part of that is just we're not well taught as women to learn how to think about money. I don't think anybody really is, honestly. Unless you just got really lucky with a parent who had that zone of genius. Most of us are pretty bad at it, right?

Yeah, for sure. Our culture does not help us at all.

No, no.

It'd be. It's very. It's very much an individual thing, as if you got good at money and if you had good education with money. It's not because of the culture that we live in here. Probably in the Western world, I would say.

Mm.

Yeah.

And we take a lot of it for granted, I think, in a lot of ways as well.

Absolutely.

Yeah. I like the way that you're saying that, like, leadership with your money is presence. Right. It's like, I'm here with you.

Yes.

I'm not hiding from you. I'm not mad at you.

How about I'm open to the data that you can give me.

Yes.

Open to the information that you can teach me about what's happening. I'm. My business.

So good. Yeah. Money is data.

Yeah.

Not an opinion.

Yeah.

Your bank account is not an opinion.

Of who you are.

Oh, that's funny.

Okay. So you're also building and growing your own beautiful business. So I'm kind of curious what your biggest leadership challenge has been, General.

Oh, my challenge has been my vision.

I am. It's so. It's ironic because I totally would have been happy making, like $60,000 a year. Yeah. Like, that was kind of like my cap. I was like, yeah, I can do that. And, you know, I was a stay at home mom for a lot of years. Loved that.

But I was also really good with numbers. I really like behavior, like the science of behavior. Find that fascinating when I could put those together. Numbers and behavior. Coaching business. I read business books while I was nursing my babies for absolutely no reason.

Except that I love them as one does. As one does. That's funny. Didn't know that about you, Emily Zamberg. Yeah.

So when that all came together, I could help people with their money, help them figure this out. And not just in a way of this is how much money you have. I can add and subtract and do that. But. But like, what are you thinking about this money and how do you want to use it? And what feels scary to you? And we can go into that. I could do that all day long. I do do that all day long, matter of fact.

But let's. Let's talk about that. The biggest challenge is your vision.

So. Yeah.

You have one.

Do I have one now? Yeah.

Yeah.

What is it?

Well, I have a mission.

Let's go with.

The mission is a little bit more well defined.

The vision I'm working on, the vision I'm working on in expanding it. But the mission is just to not let money be a problem in people's businesses or more of a problem than it needs to be. If you don't have enough money, yeah, that's a problem.

Yeah.

But when you pile on the guilt and the shame, and I'm not good enough. On top of that, that's the problem I can help you with. And once that's taken care of, then we can deal with the not enough money that's actually the much easier problem.

Isn't that so great? I love that making money is not really that difficult, but you thinking about how difficult it is to make money is making it difficult.

Totally. Right.

Because if. If all you did was decide, I'm going to do this and ask everybody who I meet who might buy this, I could make money. But instead I have it's not good enough. What if it's not ready? What if they don't like it? What if nobody buys it? What if I make a mistake? What if I look stupid? Right. And then that keeps us from asking people to give us that.

Yeah, yeah.

And that's at a small scale and that's at a macro scale.

Totally.

Right. Like that exists in really, really, really, really, really big companies too. Not just small ones.

Yeah.

Yeah, that's really good. What has been your journey as a woman who didn't really think she wanted a business? Never really thought about it. So now you have one. And not only that, you've had to hire people to help you deliver on the promise of your business. So how does that gone for you, that transition from being sort of solopreneur? Yeah, I want to help people to now I have people who work for me to help people.

Honestly, I would say it's gone perfectly. And by perfect, I mean exactly how it was supposed to go.

Exactly. So that doesn't mean swimmingly.

That does not mean there haven't been hard things happen as well as it.

Should have was supposed to. Yeah.

Yes. I think.

The one thing that you and Michelle have taught me so, like I went through how to CEO and that was so good with a tactical. This is how to do it. Like, I didn't have a clue on a lot of that stuff. So I got those tactical things down. Oh my gosh. My first hires were beautiful because you taught me to just daydream about who I wanted. And then I found them so wonderful. So how to CEO was so great for that tactical knowledge. Here's a plan. Put it into play. Showing up in the lab. Like, I can come and think I just screwed everything up. Like, it's over and you just kind of giggle at me and you're like, oh, no, just do this. Just say this. Just. And I'm like, oh, I didn't ruin. Didn't.

It's not over.

Right.

Right. So in the moments it's difficult, but you've given me the perspective that, like, it's not over. This moment doesn't have the power to ruin it all. Like, just. Just fix it. Just fix it. And here's. Here's how to do it. So that has allowed me to be so much more relaxed, so much more myself. And then when myself blows something up, as she does occasionally, as one does.

Yes.

Then I can come back and go, chris, what do I do? And we just get it right back on track. And it's never as bad as I thought it was going to be in my head.

Yeah.

Ever.

It does feel bad. You know, the human element of leading people is we're never going to get out of that. Like, the emotion and reaction and all of it. We're always going to have it. But I love that you're saying, right. Like, once you sort of have these basic tactics that you can put into place, then we can kind of work your brain around those and then you know what the next right action is. Right?

Yeah, totally.

But what I think has been so fun about watching you is that you have been able to expand on this vision and do so in a way that's completely Emily. Right. It's yours. It's the way you want your business to run. It's not somebody else's formula. It's the one that you chose for yourself that's got the most authenticity in it, which is, of course, what we all hope for at the end of the day.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

I super love that. So when we think about being a woman who runs her own business, oftentimes, like, you've had a few kids. So you and I. This is kind of my. What. How I like to say it. Like, you know, before you get pregnant with the first baby, it's like, oh, I'm going to have a baby. And then you get pregnant and you realize that there's all these things that happen when you're pregnant that nobody told you was going to happen. It's like, why did anybody give me this part? They told me all the other parts.

Because as soon as you would talk to someone else who had been or was pregnant, they'll be like, oh, yeah. And I would be so annoyed. Like, why wasn't that in the memo? I didn't know that part. So what is some of the tea that you would say is like, this is some stuff that we probably should be talking about that a lot of women who lead businesses don't talk about that. I think that is valuable to let other People know and be validated. Yeah, that's a thing. There's a thing.

Yeah. For sure. One of the things for me is how many decisions you have to make.

Yeah.

Like how when you hire a team, like when you're on your own, you're making decisions, but not all of them are, like, you don't have to run them by anybody.

Yeah, they don't.

You just make them in your head. Yeah. Yeah. You start having a team, and all of a sudden they come to you with questions and you're like, well, I think I know the answer, but now I have to say it out loud to you.

Yeah.

And. And then you're going to put it into practice. And what if I'm wrong? And then we have to. Not only do we have to reel back what I was doing, but now we've got to reel back what you were doing. And feels. Feels bigger. Feels messier. More potential for mess there.

Yeah, Very, very, very sound. I would agree. You know, we've talked a lot lately about decision and thinking fatigue. Right. Which is a real thing. And so I appreciate you saying that. One of the things that somebody else said recently on another podcast interview was the very real.

Conversations or challenges that some women face when they actually become the primary earner in their family.

Oh, yeah.

I'm curious if that's ever been a thing for you.

Yeah. It changes the dynamic of the relationship. Right. All of a sudden it's like, oh, it used to be just one of us was going to work at work, the other one was staying home and taking care of things there. The money balance was very clear. It was all coming from the outside work. And now all of a sudden, it's like, oh, you go to work for a few hours right over there at our house, and you're making a lot more money.

That's an interesting thing to come about now and to navigate and just to be conscious of, like, oh, there are some conversations we're going to need to have here. Yeah.

And I think that's okay because you did stay home. Right. You did. You were primary caregiver. And just like you've said that money's just data. It's not. It doesn't define anybody. Me making more money than you, vice versa, doesn't mean I'm a better person. I'm a more successful person. I just chose something that has a lot more profit, probably.

And.

Right. Has some. Maybe it's a little more lucrative. And earning potential is endless.

Yeah.

When you're an entrepreneur, it's endless.

Also notice Working potential is endless as well.

Oh, that's well said. That might be part of our tea that we have to spill.

Yeah. So there's a little bit more. There's, like. There's new boundaries to draw.

Yes. Well said.

Yeah.

Because I can just open up my laptop and anywhere.

Anywhere in bed, on the couch. At night when we're supposed to be like, we used to just sit here together and talk or watch TV or whatever. Now you're working again.

Yeah.

What are you doing over there?

Nothing. Yeah. I just think we have to tell these truths, and they're. None of them are bad. It's all just like. No, we. Yeah, we're here, too. And, you know, so much of the work that I know I do with my clients is acknowledging where you are unconsciously involved in, like, lots of decisions or feeling uncomfortable with your partner or spouse because of money or working. You know, I've heard it so many times. I work, then I break for dinner and hang out with the kids for an hour, and then I go back to work. Like, so all of that could be true. Is it intentional? Are you doing it on purpose or, like, because you want to or because you've fallen into a habit or because you don't think you have another choice? And anytime I hear people are working, like, late at night and excessive hours, that just tells me you have less time than you do money, which means it's time to buy other people's time.

Oh, there's one right there. Yeah, right there. Not only buy other people's time, but also now you got to train them.

No, no, no. When you hire people, then you just tell them what you want and they do it magically.

Yeah. Chris, have you told them about writing down systems and processes and the amount of work that is?

Yeah.

No, probably not.

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. You've got to train them. And that feels so overwhelming, Right, Absolutely.

Because you hire them when you're already overwhelmed.

Right.

And then you're like, oh, so now not only can you not quite do my work yet, but also I have to take time out of my day to train you how to do that, and I'm going to do it with you. And it's going to be even slower than it was before.

Great. That's going to be fun.

And I check it to make sure it's right.

Oh, and you're gonna make mistakes, too. Awesome. Yeah.

But listen, it gets better. So that's the point, right?

Absolutely. Oh, my gosh. So worth it.

Yeah. But initially it's rough to. It's like my first, very first executive coach that watching other people think is painful.

Right.

Yeah. Okay. So you mentioned, you know, one of the. You talked a little bit about your experience and how to CEO. I'm kind of curious what kind of your lasting, you know, takeaway has been, even though I know you're still in the lab and we still do this work regularly. But, like, what was kind of the, like, thing that locked in for you?

Oh, I would say probably the most powerful thing was.

There'S. There's been a lot. There were so many. But I really envisioned myself standing over my business at the 40,000 foot level or whatever and looking down at it and recognizing the individual roles and responsibilities. One of my favorite things you say that I have adopted as my own is we don't pay people. We pay for roles, we pay for results. So I use that all the time in my coaching as I help my clients, because, of course, they deal with one of their biggest expenses is their people.

Yeah.

And so we talk about that a lot. So that was super helpful to just recognize that the importance of having the structure, the importance of having it written down, having everybody understand, this is your job, I expect you to do this. This is my job. You can expect me to do this. The trust that comes there, not only does the work get done, but the relationship that happens when those roles are well defined.

Yeah.

Is beautiful.

Very powerful. Yeah.

Yeah.

And thank you. I agree with you. Like I say, we just had the lab call. Right. We were talking about, you know, we pay. We pay positions, not people. And I don't mean that to sound heartless because I think people are amazing and I love people. But when we're really looking at it through the lens of the business and the assets of the business, that's what we're doing. If you work with people that you think are amazing and you get really connected, you love everybody, that's fabulous. Right. But we can never get lost in that. And I think that's really valuable that you sort of highlighted that. So thank you.

Yeah. And I consider myself an advocate for the business because so often the CEO, she has to wear so many hats of. She has to advocate for the CEO as an individual, as a person who has a personal life. Right. And needs money in her home life. And then she has to advocate for the business and for her, she has to take care of the business, run the business, make sure there's money for the business.

Yeah.

When I protect the business, I protect everyone's jobs.

So by paying positions, which is the way that we protect the business, make sure the work gets done and not too much money gets spent on any one position. Then we protect the business and we protect everyone's job. So everyone has their livelihood.

Yeah.

Not just this one person that you love so much that you want to hang on to. So you give her more money because you don't know what else to do.

Exactly. Well said. Well said.

Perfectly said.

Okay. So let's just bring it home. And I'm just going to ask you sort of the biggie, which is, you know, what else? What else would you wish and hope every other woman you know, you. You are in the space where you work with female entrepreneurs. What do you just wish all of us knew? Like, knew, Knew.

Can I give a couple things?

You could have more than one. Yeah.

Okay.

Because I'm a giver.

You are. You are. Yeah. I mean, we talked about the first one is probably always that how much money you have or how much money you make does not determine your worth. Mm. Don't ask your money to help you determine your own worth. Maybe your net worth, but not your individual worth. That's so important because for so many reasons. Another thing is that. And this is something that I. I've learned in your program. I've learned other places as well. But being in your program has helped confirm this failure today. When I fail in that interaction I had with that. That my employee today, or a client or whatever it is, whatever that little thing I did, that was wrong, mistake, whatever, it's not going to take my business down unless I let it.

Right?

Right.

Yes.

It's just an experience I needed to have to learn something. Just another data point I can pull from.

My business is not fragile.

Oh, I love that thought.

Yeah, it might have been at the beginning.

I like it for me too. Like, I am not fragile. Like, if I fail, the only way that takes me down is if I indulge the failure. Right.

Absolutely. Yeah.

That's so good. I am not fragile.

I am not fragile. Neither is my business.

I love it.

Yeah.

I want that to be a bumper sticker.

I need a shirt.

So powerful.

Yes.

So many of your interactions. If you don't believe you're fragile, you don't believe the business is fragile. You can weather it, figure it out.

So good. You're a genius.

Thank you, little shaman.

Money shaman that you are.

Okay. If anybody wants to know more about you, where do they go?

My current website is emily sandberg.net.

That will be under what we're reconstructing new website coming this spring. Yes, but. But you can find me there. That's the best place.

Can I say, one of the things I love a lot about your business is that you don't do any social media.

It makes me so happy to. When I meet people who are really successful and there's, like, no social media. Really? Like, it's not necessary. Right. Because where do your clients come from?

No, they come from my other clients. Yeah.

So that's so fun. I love that. That's my. I'm aspiring to that. That's my goal. We've talked about that, though. So that's another podcast.

Indeed, yes, indeed.

All right, well, thank you. Thank you so much for your time today. It's been an honor to chat with you. And as it is all the time that I get to talk to you, and I appreciate you sharing your beautiful words with everybody.

Oh, thank you, Chris. I love. We get. We have the best job helping women.

We do. Yeah.

It's so fun.

I agree. Every day I'm like, billy, okay, we.

Get to do this again.

Yeah. This is fun.

Yes. Thank you, love. Thank you so much for having me.

You bet. Thank you.