How to Get Known for One Thing & Grow Your Business with Angela Simson

So many women are struggling with being seen, creating content, putting themselves out there, getting clear on what they're doing.

The main thing that I see is people speaking to their current clients instead of speaking to the people that they want to hire them. Like if I said to someone, hey, I'm gonna come in and I'm gonna look at the backend systems, I'm gonna look at your messaging, I'm gonna get you really clear and defined on your niche, they're gonna be like, okay, boring. Whereas if I say to them, hey, do you wanna get to 50,000 followers in the next year? They're like, yes, give me the people.

And welcome to the Earn Your Happy podcast.

Thank you for having me. I feel so honored. Like, I, I feel like I've been listening to you for years, so this is a full-on pinch-me moment.

Oh my God, you know what's so crazy? I literally had no clue, number one. Number two, I don't really know how I found you, probably because you just have amazing content. But every time it was like it started feeding me your content, and all of a sudden I was like, I just, I like everything that comes across my feed. And I found myself starting to save it like for inspiration. So one day I was like, I should probably just talk to her in person and ask her some questions about this. Because you know, I think we can look at someone like you and go, maybe she was born that way. Maybe this is just something she's really naturally great at. But according to every conversation I have ever had on this podcast, I find that there is a lot behind it and it's a strategy and it's something that you really had to learn how to do. So I'm excited to dive into that with you today.

Thank you. I often say that probably 50% of people follow me because they just want to use the hooks that I create. Like, people are just following me to copy me. It's fine. Welcome. Thank you.

I mean, it's kind of the goal, you know, if they're like, wow, she's doing something right. Great. That's what we want to do. So exactly, I think we both probably follow so many of the same people. And then we also know that there's a world of really incredible, talented women out there that we get to see in our ecosystem, in our masterminds, in our programs, that we're like, you are amazing. Like, you are the best kept secret that has to get out there. Why do you think so many women are struggling with Being seen, creating content, putting themselves out there, getting clear on what they're doing when they could be like absolutely clear on some of the things in their business. But when it goes to creating content, they just get totally stuck.

Right. And this is why I started doing what I was doing. I was seeing so many women who were just so, so good. And I'm like, you know, you would hear them in coaching conversations or you would talk to them and you'd say, how are you not fully booked? How do you not have people just lined up to work with you? And this is when I really started to get passionate about what I do because I was like, you can be a literal expert at something and be struggling to pay your bills, and that's not okay. And I think the main thing that I've discovered over years of this— and none of this has come naturally to me, I have had to learn a lot when it comes to what works online, what gets you booked, what gets you seen— But the main thing that I see is people speaking to their current clients instead of speaking to the people that they want to hire them. And so, they're using language that they hear in their sessions and on their calls instead of using the language that someone who's about to hire them needs to use. And so, I used to do this. I used to be so bad at this. I started off in health coaching like 14 years ago, and I would go online and I would talk about You know, you're feeling this and you're feeling that. And the problem is, I mean, I don't know about you, but when I pick up my phone, I don't want to feel my feelings. Like, I pick up my phone to distract myself, or like, if, if I want to be, you know, a bit procrastinaty, for lack of a better word. Like, I'm like, I don't want to do that thing, so I'm going to procrastinate. Like, I'm not on there to feel my feelings. And I used to speak so much into feelings words. To try and attract clients. And I think people do that these days. They think about the person that they're working with instead of the person who needs them, you know? And I think we've all heard that thing before of like, you kind of sell people what they need, but you package it as what they think they want, right?

Mm-hmm.

And it's not always the same thing, and it's not always exactly what people— like, if I said to someone, hey, I'm gonna come in and I'm gonna look at the backend systems, I'm gonna look at your messaging, I'm gonna get you really clear and defined on your niche, they're gonna be like, okay, boring. Whereas if I say to them, hey, do you want to get to 50,000 followers in the next year? They're like, yes, give me the people, right? And so, I think it's actually working out what is the problem that they think they have versus what is the problem that you know they have, and speaking more to that. And that's the thing I see most of all, right?

I totally get that right now. I have a new offer right now that I've been doing, and I'm literally in this right now of how am I talking to the person that I actually want in here. And it's crazy because the problem that I was initially talking to was that they wanted to make money from podcasts, right? Like actually go on podcasts and make money. And I'm like, they don't even know that that's a problem or that their messaging is not super clear. But what they do think is that their media kit's not working and they're not getting booked. And I'm like, that's not even the problem. Your messaging is so not clear. But that's what they think the problem is. So when I started saying that, they're coming into the program, which is crazy to me. So it 100 million percent proves your point that you have to figure out what they are thinking is the main problem that's stopping them.

Yeah, totally. And again, it's like most people aren't waking up in the middle of the night thinking to themselves, geez, I wish I could get on more podcasts. Like, they're thinking to themselves, oh my gosh, I wish I had more exposure. I wish I had more credibility. I wish more people knew who I was. I wish I could get my message out there. And so Again, it's putting it in the words that they're actually using instead of what we think they need or what we know they need, right?

Mm-hmm. What is an unpopular opinion about personal branding and social media that you think more women need to hear?

Um, I can be a bit brutal about this. I used to be, and like we were talking before about network marketing, and I remember someone taught me, oh, you just, you know, on social media, in order to really get an audience and really do what you want to do, you just need to document your life. And so, I would wake up in the morning— I don't know if you ever went through this— and I would take a photo of my beach walk, and then here's my cacao, and then here's my outfit for the day, and then here's my workspace, and then, oh, here's my dog that I'm playing with. And I was like, I am so good at social media. I just document my whole life.

Mm-hmm.

And the truth is— and I think this is the biggest misconception of personal branding— No one really cares what you're doing, which is kind of, again, brutal. But I think that I had this idea of a personal brand means everyone wants to know more about me. Like, I think I'm a Kardashian and they want to follow my life and see what I'm up to, and they really don't. Like, they really, really don't. People don't want to see what I'm doing in my life. People don't care what I have. People don't care who I am. People are innately on social media, and this is where I get a bit brutal, people are selfish. They want to scroll, they want to follow you because of what they can get from you, what they can learn from you. And so I think when you're thinking of a personal brand, instead of really thinking of, okay, well, who do I need to be, you have to ask yourself, what do people need? What do people need that they're going to pay for? That they— what's going to get their attention? Not how is she doing that, but like, how can I do that instead? And so, I think the biggest misconception is making it very me-focused, very much about who you are, who you want to be perceived as, instead of what other people need to see. My one mantra I always think when I talk about a personal brand is people are consuming themselves through your content. So I always ask myself, how do I have my content let someone see themselves and see where they can go and what they can do? And that makes a good personal brand. Your morning coffee and your kid's soccer lesson. You know what I mean?

How did you figure that out for yourself? And how did you— I know you said a little bit through the lens that you look through, but if you're working with a client who is going from like kind of documenting her life, maybe she has a— I think let's just say she's a coach. It's a personal brand and she's a business coach. How would she start looking through that lens of adding value?

Do you know what? The way that I figured this out, I just started looking at what I was interested in.

Hmm.

And what would make me stop on someone. Like you said in the beginning, you started following me and you were seeing my stuff over and over again, which I love how the algorithm works as well. That really interests me, and I always get really like— I could talk about it for hours about how the algorithm feeds you what you're slowing down on and what you're looking at. But realistically, when you think about, okay, how do I consume content and what am I interested in? I remember just thinking to myself one day, I saw a girl online, And she had posted something about anti-aging. And I think at the time I was 35, and I was like, oh my gosh, I'm getting wrinkles, and I'm starting to look older, and this is like, what do I need to do? I need to start using proper skincare.

Yeah.

And I remember going and looking at her page, and in that moment I asked myself, what is making me hit follow? Right? Again, I don't care what she uses. I care what she uses that will help me. I don't care her routine. I care what part of her routine can I steal so that I can have what she has. And so really looking at the way I was consuming made me aware of how people actually show up online and do things a little bit the wrong way. And so I say to everyone, if you're running a personal brand, ask yourself, what makes you follow someone? What makes you stop on a reel and look at a hook? And what makes you read a caption? What makes you click on their actual handle to go to their page? It's like, It's never just, oh, she looks interesting, because I could look really interesting, but no one really cares. They go, oh, I can get something from what I'm going to learn from her. I can see a lot through her content that's actually going to help me get where I need to go. You know?

I'm thinking of, you know, for me with your content, interacting with it, I really loved visually how it looked. I loved what you were saying too, but the, the, you kind of had all the things going. It was the hook, The fonts, the visual hooks that you use, you know, how you do your content. It was just kind of like picking apart how you all do it to make it look the way it did and very cohesive.

Yeah.

So for when you're talking to different people, because they probably follow you for this reason and also want to learn how you do that, because it kind of looks like your content has all of the main characteristics that make really great content. Which part felt easy for you? Which part felt hard visually? Is that something that you really had to work on?

Well, I'm a Libra.

Okay.

So like, it's gonna be pretty.

Got it, got it, got it. Yep.

It's, it's, it's gonna be pretty. It's gonna be aesthetic. But like most of my content, um, I just did a post about like, oh, I'm going on a podcast, like top 25 entrepreneurial podcasts in the world. Guess who? I filmed it in my bathroom.

Like it—

so again, it doesn't have to be a fancy space, but I think first and foremost, aesthetically, I do think it's important because Instagram is a visual platform. Like, if you don't get someone's attention quickly, then they're going to scroll past. And I think a lot has changed. Like, I think people don't like overly edited, you know, overly filtered stuff. They kind of want to see things that look a bit more clean. But in my experience as well, when I put up professionally filmed content, it performs So poorly. I don't know if you've ever found this as well. Like when you put out like, yeah, you go get a brand shoot done and you get all this like, you know, high-res footage and then you put it up on a reel and it just like flops.

Yeah.

So I think people know what they expect on Instagram. And yes, I think a part of it is the visual side of things. Um, I always say though, you know, you want to make sure that you're showing up visually as the person that they want to hire. So like, I, I don't know about you, but I don't look like this every day. Like I have 4 kids. Sometimes I have a topknot and I kind of look like a baby panda 'cause I'm tired and I haven't slept and my kid's been up all night or whatever it might be. But it's what version of me needs to show up that my clients are gonna go, yes, she's the one I wanna hire.

Mm-hmm.

So I also feel like back in the day of document your life, it was like, just be messy. Do the topknot and just be in your activewear. And I think there's a place for that. But as well, we're running businesses, so I do think there needs to be a little bit of effort put into the visual side of things. And so, you know, I always say just find like 2 places in your house that you can just film content. And on the days when you're getting ready to go out, like, I have makeup on and a cute outfit, so I'll probably film some stuff today because I can. Um, and then make things— the other thing is make things easy to read. I see a lot of people that put just a lot of text on their screen, and I'm like, I can't read that. Like, it's too much. And so I think making it easy to read, making the visual hook important is like one of my biggest things. And then actually making your content interesting, like not giving them generic advice that they could hear from anywhere. Like if you're a health coach and you're telling people to eat your greens, that, that's not enough for me. I'm like, do better.

You do better, right? How do you figure those nuances out? Because I, I totally agree. Like if you, yeah, if you read that and you were like, this is vanilla or this is not exciting, no one is gonna think that's exciting. I have literally, I don't normally do this, but I've been really busy lately because I launched this accelerator and I normally have more time for content. And I just was putting up like crap content and I was like, that's bad. Like, I don't like it. If I think it's bad, no one's going to stop on it. So I'll archive it. And I'm like, I normally never archive because I just will let it sit even if it's bad.

Yeah.

But there's definitely strategy and thought that has to go into good content for me. And I'll, you know, keep it in my notes app. I'll do a million different things in terms of what I'm launching or what I'm doing and what I want to focus on. What are some strategies for you that you are using, whether it's with Claude, um, AI, whatever you're doing, to kind of find what your favorite topics are, what's really working for you, what you should be focusing content on? Like, how do we find our voice and our topics?

Yeah, so first of all, um, yeah, if, if you don't— if you're not obsessed with your content, don't post it. Like, I, I think I scroll my own page. I'm more obsessed with my own content from an educational standpoint. Like, I'm like, God, that's good. Like, I look at my own stuff and I'm like, she is the GOAT, this girl. I'm like, I want more people like me online because I love my content. I think it's so valuable.

Yeah.

So I think if you're not obsessed with your own content, why would you expect other people to be? Like, I look at your content and I'm like, yes, Lori, like, nailing it. Just Funny, exciting, educational. Like, prepping for this, I was like, I better go through her page and figure out like, what do I need to make sure I do on the podcast? So like, getting interviewed by the queen of podcasting. So first and foremost, be obsessed with your own content. And then when it comes to actually organizing it, I mean, as much as I'd like to say no one copies anyone, like, we're all getting— like I said, most people follow me because they're just like, I'm gonna copy that hook. Or I really like the way that she filmed that video, or I like the way that she's formatted the text on screen. So I use a couple of different things. I have a Notion document that I use. I call it my content system. And every time I see a post, I save it into this Notion system, and I type out what I liked about it.

Nice.

So it might be that I liked the font on the screen, because carousels are blowing up right now. Or it might be that the hook was really interesting. Like I saved one the other day where a guy was like, You know, 5 phrases that should be banned for how good they make your content. And I'm like, oh, I like that angle of banning things or things being illegal. So again, I do think it's a bit of self-reflecting on what do I like and what do I look at a lot. And everyone does this, but what most people do is they scroll and they don't actually use their scrolling time to look at what's really working for them when it comes to what catches their attention. So literally anytime a piece of content catches my attention, I save it into this Notion table. I put a little line or two about what it was that caught my attention. And then when I'm actually creating content, I can go to that and I have inspiration on everything from hooks to visual hooks to, you know, captions, how a caption was set out, how a, you know, when they do like the 4 photos with the text in the middle, like all of that, I have inspiration for all of it. So I never run out of ideas on what to post.

How about when you are coming up to a launch or something that you're selling in your business? What does that look like for you for planning?

So I have a bit of a— I call it like a sales rhythm. So essentially what I do when I'm coming up to a launch of something is I decide first and foremost if I need to grow my audience a little bit more for some reason, because my business is about growth and getting more leads. I'm a big believer if you don't have leads, you don't have a business.

Yeah.

Then I need to actually make sure that I'm proving that I can do what I'm sharing with people that I'm gonna teach them how to do. So I have proof of concept. So I'll go, okay, I'm gonna go and grow by another 10,000 followers in the next month so that when I'm selling into this thing, I've got more and relevant social proof of what it is, the system that I'm gonna use. Then I go into a period of seeding the idea. So the way that I work with content— and this is really good if people ever think to themselves, oh my gosh, I just I don't know what to post. I work off concepts, I call them. And so when something comes up for me— so say I'm having a conversation with a client, or maybe something comes up in this podcast where we're chatting and I think to myself, gosh, that, that would be a really good conversation to have in content—

Hmm.

I write it down somewhere. I have a little notes app with all my concepts that I'm currently running, and I go into Claude or ChatGPT or whatever AI And I've trained it up really well to do this, but essentially I get it to write out 20 to 50 post ideas on that one concept. And this is the part that I think most people kind of don't think about when it comes to a launch.

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I repeat myself. So much. Like, if you actually went through my content, I pretty much say the same thing over and over and over again in just 20 to 50 different ways. And I think that's what creates that omnipresence and that mental real estate for people in their mind about me, is because I'm not saying 75 different things, I'm saying one thing 75 different ways.

I think that's one of the biggest things that I have learned that has actually started to really catapult me into a certain place that I want to be. A lot of us who are creatives find each other, obviously. And I think one of the biggest struggles of creatives is just being so multi-passionate that we want to talk about everything and we can get bored really quickly, right? So it's like, no, I did that. Now I need to talk about something and I'm over that and I launched that, but I need to try something new. And that is like the death of a really beautiful, consistent, large business that we all want and we all dream of. So. You know, when I look at the people that really started to inspire me over like the last 2 years, they beat a dead horse. Like, they— their content is so specifically about the certain thing, and you never get sick of it because like you said, number one, they're saying it in a different way. Number two, you're not seeing— we're just not seeing all of it. So tell me some of the ways that when you find some content that works for you, how do you then go in and look at that content that's working and kind of do different iterations of that? Like, what do you study? What's the most important data that you look for?

Well, first of all, I have a list.

Okay.

I have my 20 different ways to say one thing. So this— and like, I don't know if I can give you resources. I could literally just send you the list and you can put it in the notes or something so that everyone can borrow it.

In the notes, you guys. Yes. Yeah.

So this list for me is like, okay, when I have this one idea, I'm gonna go hard on it. So say, you know, for me, one of the big things that I teach my clients is that I want them to have a business that fits in with their life, not the other way around, because Like I mentioned, I have a lot of children. I have a husband who's starting up 2 big businesses, and we've just— we've got a lot going on. So I'm like, I don't want to be taken over by my work. I want it to really fit in with my life but still be super abundant. So that might be my concept, right? And then I have these 20 ways. So there's the hot take, there's the tutorial carousel, there's the origin story, there's client proof, there's the listicle post, The mythbuster, the B-roll with a long caption, the confession, the mirror, the receipt, the question. And so on this list that I'm going to give you guys, there's an explanation about how to say it. And so I take that one concept, I put this list in, and then I put that into AI, and it basically spits out a whole bunch of different ways to say it. Wow. And that is like, we're done. Like, this is easy now.

That's— I don't know why. I mean, like, I feel like I've seen everything, but I don't know why that just made this so easy. Like, Say the same thing, but in a million— I mean, all of the— in all of these different ways. That's so great. I love that.

Lori, I'm so lazy. Like, I— if I can do things easy, like, I'm gonna do it easy. I, I don't wanna have to complicate anything. So I'm like, if I can hack it, like, my fiancé always laughs at me cuz I listen to podcasts on double speed and I'm like, I'm always looking to habit stack. And he's like, you always want a cheat code. This is the best cheat code because you literally will never run out of post ideas.

Yeah, but you're our cheat code girl now, so that's great. Like, yeah, please go be lazy so that you can tell us how to be, you know?

Exactly what I'm doing for you. Exactly what I'm doing.

God, because I, I want to be more lazy. So, okay, Ang, what do you think, like, is really separating the women that are standing out right now? Because there— I know that we are all seeing the same people over and over and over. Yeah, because, because of the algorithm, because of exactly what we do, we, you know, we like something and we get more and more and more of it. So tell me a little bit about what you think that is and what we should be thinking about in wanting to stand out as an absolute, like, industry icon.

Yeah, I'm gonna repeat what we were just talking about almost, and I feel like all the multi-passionate girlies are just going to be like, I hate this girl, Angie's so annoying.

They need to hear it. Keep saying it.

You just have to repeat yourself. You have to be known for one thing. You have to speak to one person, be the expert in one thing. As you get bigger, I have this rule with my clients. When you're first starting out, one person, one thing, one offer. Do not touch anything else. Stay in one lane. And then once you're like 500,000 followers, go for it. Act like a reality star and talk about all the things if you really want to, but you probably won't make any more money if you do that. Like, it really is just being known for that one thing. It's being known as the girl who does the specific thing. Like, I am the messaging girl, and my page did not blow up at the rate that it does now until I got really clear on that. Like, when I started my business, I, I'm gonna do branding and messaging, and I'm gonna speak to network marketers, and I'm gonna speak to coaches, and I'm gonna speak to service-based businesses. And oh, here's someone with a product-based business, I might let them in as well. So I was trying to be everything for everyone. And it was like I could grow, like I could kind of go viral and grow a little bit, but it wouldn't relate to sales. Because my, like, my biggest thing is I— an audience, a big audience that's not going to buy from you is a freaking waste of time. Like, that— there's no point to it, right? And so I was doing that. I was basically growing for years. I was like, none of these people are buying from me. And I like, why? Like, I've got all these followers, but why am I not making So many more sales? I'm making a few more sales, but why not so many? And then I realized because I'm not known for anything. And so now you can go to my page and you know, this is the girl that talks about messaging and how to use messaging to pull your dream clients into your page so that your content actually sells. Like, I just teach my clients, here's how to post content that has people throw their credit card at you. If it doesn't do that, you're wasting your time. If you're just getting likes, you're wasting your time. So you do need to become known for something, I think. It might've been Alex Hormozi who said something along the lines of like, your business is not your creative outlet. I kind of agree to like, to an extent. So I have like, I have a Substack, I have a secret Substack where I write about stuff that I, that has nothing to do with my business. I will, I'll never share it with anyone. It's like a passion project. This is where I get to just be creative and this is where I get to do the things that, you know, sometimes I'm like, oh, I really wanna play around in this area. I'm like, yeah, I can do that, but it's not, What my business is for. My business is for this, and all my creative stuff gets to live outside of that, like all the other bits and pieces that don't match in. So I think if you're multi-passionate, understanding that your business is like, okay, this is the thing that it's here for. If you wanna make F-you money, like if you wanna go really hard, then let your business be what it's about and have your creativity come out in other ways. Right? If you've got the time, you can have multiple Instagram pages if you want to, like go and do all the other things, but just be known for one thing.

And what do you think, you had mentioned messaging that makes people want to throw their credit card at you. What goes into that type of messaging?

Okay, so first and foremost, like my brain works in systems. First and foremost, to get someone to stop on the post, there needs to be something that has them self-identify and say, oh, this is for me. So I see a lot of people doing content where it's like, They'll start the talking head reel by saying something like, if you're a girl who— if you're a woman running a business, if you're a compassionate girl, if you're a single woman doing this. So I think there needs to be some form of them seeing that this is for them first and foremost, because we need to catch their attention. Like, this is for you. I made this for you. The second thing is giving them a mirror moment where they see themselves. And like, again, this can't be a feeling. And I will die on this hill. If you use feeling words to sell your offer, It's not gonna work. You're never gonna get the amount of people in that you could get in. You're going to get fans potentially, but you're never gonna get the volume of people you could get if you speak into actual lived moments, cinematic experiences they're having, if you talk to feelings. And, and I think as women, I'm interested if you agree with this, we have so many feelings every day. So I can wake up in the morning.

Oh yeah.

Look in the mirror and be like, I'm such a hottie. Oh my God, my hair's like doing so good today. I'm amazing. I can have a great day of cash and be like, oh my gosh, I'm so good in business. And then, I don't know, I can get a message from someone saying they didn't understand something in one of my offers, and all of a sudden I'm terrible, everybody hates me, I'm awful at what I do, I suck, I'm all the bad things. And so my feelings can go from here to here in like 2.5 seconds.

Yeah.

And so I think when we use feeling words, to use in our marketing to sell to people. Again, people aren't picking up their phone and scrolling to feel things. They're picking up their phone and scrolling to not feel things. And then we're using feeling words, which, you know, again, they might not be feeling that that particular day, right?

Can you give us an example of like the mirror moment? Do you have one that you can explain that you do?

So one that I use all the time, I say in so much of my— I've had to stop using it because I said it too much. If you wake up in the morning and before you brush your teeth, you pick up your phone to check the insights on the reel you posted last night, you see that it's got 20 likes and 3 comments, 2 of the comments are from your girlfriends or a former client, then you start scrolling and you see that other coach who has half your audience or half your expertise and she's just sold out another program and you're asking yourself why, then you have a messaging problem. And so she sees herself— because I know But the women that I attract, they're picking up their phone in the morning before they've even gone to the bathroom, and they're checking if the reel performed because they're so worried about the vanity metrics as opposed to what's actually gonna make them money that that feels like the most important thing. So they see themselves in that moment, and that's that relatable moment where people who see relatable content stop on it. Because it's not— again, it's not a feeling, which is very transient. We can feel so many things. It's, okay, wow, I actually did that. Like, that's something that I did, that's an experience that I had. So, you know, fitness and health coaches will talk about going to the fridge, you know, intending to make a healthy meal, but grabbing, you know, the sleeve of cookie dough and just having a few bites and getting back to work. They'll talk about the actual moment, and when someone feels seen in a moment, they actually see that you can be the solution because you understand what they're experiencing right now, and not in vague terms. Because when it's vague, The solution feels vague.

Yeah, that makes— I mean, that makes so much sense. And that's actually so much easier to sit with than like, like you said, we have a million different feelings. It could be, well, you're anxious. Well, some people don't feel anxious. Some people feel, you know, upset or frustrated. So there's so many different words that like moments are more universal because it's truly what we find, what we could have all identify with that moment of waking up in the morning and being like, goddamn it. Why isn't this working? That is so real.

Like all of my clients, I'll say to them, like, if you're screening other coaches' content and putting it into ChatGPT to ask why it worked so well and why it went viral, like, that's when you need me. Like, you don't, you shouldn't be doing that. And so again, it's the mirror moments, right?

That is so good. Yes. Okay. So one was self-identify, 2 is mirror moment. What's the next one?

The next one is give them a call to action. Give them something super easy that they can do. Right. And so, I'm a big fan of giving away a lot of stuff for free. I think last night or yesterday afternoon, I did a post where I gave away a Claude prompt for free, and I think there was like 1,000, maybe 1,500 comments on it overnight. Because again, give away taste testers of your actual work so that people can experience you. I'm a big advocate of this, and I know all the high-ticket girlies will be like, no, but I really like saying to people, Hey, you can just— you can give me a go. Like, you can try me on. You can have like a little sample of my work to make sure you like it. I think that that's really powerful. And so again, they first of all identify, so that hooks them into the post. Then they see an actual moment, like a lived experience, and they go, wow, okay, this girl really knows me. Like, she's totally speaking to me. And then they have an opportunity to go, okay, well, if she knows who I am, if she knows what I'm doing, and she has a solution that I can grab right now, That's just built trust. And that's when people start to binge your content because they go, okay, I've got this one thing or this one person seeing me. And I like to say, you know, I have a post from February 2025. It's a long time ago, like a year and a half ago, and I still get comments on it because people are scrolling that far down my page.

Wow.

That they're literally like, they're binging so much of my content to go, what else can I find? What else can I find? What else can I find? Because I've had them feel seen, had them feel understood, and I've given them something back. And so in my mind, that's like the trifecta of just getting people obsessed with your content.

Obsessed. Okay, so if you had to start over tomorrow and your page got deleted, what would you be doing right now?

So if you needed to build a following, I would— posting at volume, like just 4 times a day. I'm a really big believer of quantity creates quality. So if you want to find out what your dream client— I call her your muse, like the person you create your work, your art for— if you want to find out what she responds well to, the only way to do that is to get data. And the only way to get data is to post at volume. And I think this is a big mistake people make when they're trying to either grow their audience or get more leads into their business through social media, is they try something once or twice And it flops and they don't do it again. So everything I do, I have a rule. If I'm trying something new, I have to try it for 6 weeks.

Hmm.

And then I assess the data. So I look at what actually made— I don't look at likes and views. I don't look at the vanity metrics. I look at what actually made sales, what got comments and shares and saves, because they're the metrics that I think are most important. And I ask myself, okay, how did this actually go? at 6 weeks on how did it feel, how do I think it went. Because again, feelings and emotions are not KPIs. We can't actually measure feelings and emotions when it comes to business.

Yeah.

And so everything is 6 weeks. And so when it comes to growing an audience, if I had to start from scratch, I would just be posting at volume. So I'd be looking at content in my industry that's going viral right now. So again, I'm seeing a lot with carousels. I would definitely be posting A ton of carousels. Like, I would just— if you're not using Claude Design to make your carousels right now, like, learn immediately because it's so easy and so quick. So I'd be posting, you know, 2 carousels a day, 2 reels a day, and I would just literally be putting it out in volume. I would have some free giveaways or low-ticket offers to get people interested in my work, to build up my email list, and then I'd probably build it back up pretty quickly.

Okay, if I have a friend that is thinking about starting a business and asked me straight up, should I use Shopify I, I would not give her a sales pitch because I am obsessed and I use it for Glossy. When I started Glossy, honestly, I don't know any startup person that has it all together. I was figuring out packaging, fulfillment, your website. I mean, literally everything, formulation, hiring team, and I needed everything to work together. And that's exactly what Shopify gave me. There are so many moving pieces inside of a product business, way more than people realize. Inventory, packaging, fulfillment, payments, your website, even the emails going out to customers. Shopify is the piece that actually gives me peace of mind because it's built to hold all of that together in one place instead of 10 different tools fighting each other. Sidekick, their built-in AI, helps me stay on top of my own storefront, even on the days everything else is pulling at my attention. And when someone actually buys, Shop Pay makes checkout so easy. There's no clunky forms losing my sale. So if you're ready to hear of your first sale today, head over to shopify.com/happy to start your free trial today. That's right. Start your free trial at shopify.com/happy. That's shopify.com/happy. Okay. I have to tell you this because I'm genuinely So excited for myself and for you because I finally did the thing that I have been putting off for actual years. I got my Smile Set aligners and it was so much easier than I built it up to be in my head. My lower teeth have always bothered me and been super crooked, and I finally have taken a step in doing something about it. It started with an at-home impression kit that showed up at my door. No dentist chair, no waiting room. I did it myself in about 10 minutes. My case went to SmileSet's affiliated network of state-licensed dental professionals. They reviewed and approved my personalized treatment plan, and my aligners just show up at the door ready to go. The whole thing runs under $1,800 total. That's about 60% less than traditional braces or in-office treatments. And now I'm tracking everything through my SmileSet app. With doctor check-ins available anytime I actually want one. It is all telehealth, so I never have to leave the house for any of it. It's powered by Smile Direct Club technology, professional-grade care without the professional-grade markup. I'm just excited to actually pursue my smile goals instead of putting it off another year. Listeners of our show get an additional 35% discount when they go to smileset.com/earn. With this discount, you can get the smile of your dreams for under $1,200. Go to smileset.com/earn to get started. smileset.com/earn. Let's talk about for your Claude and using AI. How did you get your messaging really dialed in there? I know we all have different ways of, you know, teaching it, programming it, all the things. Do you have anything that you would tell someone to really get it really dialed in for kind of this, uh, these 3 things that you said, the self-identity, the mirror, like really identifying with person so that when you go to do carousels, do your carousels feel like you're always creating from scratch or are you using, like you said, like a main idea and it's, it's like a thought partner with you? What does that all look like?

Yeah, it's definitely more of a thought partner than actually coming up with content. Um, because again, like I look at what I'm inspired by and what I have already got going on in my business and I go, okay, this story from this client, I can take that concept and now I'm going to get Claude to turn it into a bunch of different things. But when it comes to actually training it, I, in one of my programs, In Demand, I actually, the whole program is based on training up your Claude. So we build out skills that actually train up Claude to not just know you, because I think there's 2 really important parts to this. It needs to know you and your voice, how you train people, how you speak to people, what you naturally believe. And so I actually get Cowork to go in And if a client has transcripts from trainings, if they do podcasts, if they write on Substack or something like that, we get Claude to actually go in and pull their voice out of the stuff that's already there. But the most important part, and the first thing that they do in my program, is actually write out about their dream client, about the person. So we talk about what is she doing at 9:00 PM on a Tuesday? Who is she already following? When she talks to her girlfriend out having a margarita, Mm-hmm. How is she explaining her problem? You know, at 3 o'clock in the morning when she wakes up with like a pang of anxiety, what is the anxiety about? What is the story she's telling herself? You know, what are the things that are happening in the moment? Because a lot of people love to use feeling words.

Mm-hmm.

So like, the aligned and confident, anxious, frustrated. So my rule is, what does she do right before? What happens right before she feels that feeling? So if you're talking about your client feeling overwhelmed or frustrated, What happens in the moments before? And that's where you find the little mirror moments. The moment before is because she's scrolling social media and that coach that she's been watching has just sold out her program again, right? Or that girl who just started her social media has gone viral and she's gained 20,000 followers in the last week, and that, that's triggered her frustration. So again, it's more so training up your Claude to understand your client. Even more than it understands you.

That's so good. Um, you know, in terms of— we had talked about when you're launching something, you go and prove out what you're doing. So you, you know, gain a bunch of followers because that's what you're talking about. And we have been, you know, when, when we really look at what we do in terms of launch and throughout the year, there's a big difference between like needing leads, getting leads, posting for leads, and then posting for followers. Can you tell me a little bit about the dance between the two and when to do it?

I only, I only post for leads. Okay.

You don't care about like growth?

No, I don't care about growth. I only want to grow with dream clients. I, so every post I do has to have an identified, either in the hook or in the caption, it has to identify who I'm for. So this is my personal rule. I like my rule.

I think it's a good rule.

But again, I'm running a business. It's not a popularity contest. I, I have no interest in having a big number just for fun. So I post only for leads in my business. So I only post for female coaches making sales, love social media, can't figure out how to use it to get more sales.

Mm-hmm.

Like trying all the things, done all the things. And so if someone's not that, I, I don't particularly need them to follow me, want them to follow me. Now, in saying that, I'm well aware there are some people that follow me because they like my hair. I think I'm like, I know, I get the message.

I'm one of them too, but there's many other reasons. But for sure, so funny, we're on this, I'm literally like, she has my dream hair. Would it be weird if I screenshot this for my hairdresser? I'll just show him later.

The amount of people that—

yeah, you're the visual hook. You're the visual hook. It's totally fine. Um, okay, speaking of, um, you know, identity and figuring out our dream person's identity, when we really think of a woman who wants to be, which is probably every woman who listened to this wants to be like, they want to stand out in the industry. We want to be the person that people are all looking at. What would you say is actually an identity problem versus like a messaging or a content problem when you start talking to someone?

For me, what I found was I always equated knowing everything with being the expert, and that to me was an identity issue. So I thought, I can't be seen to be learning. I have to be so capable. I have to be so the expert in my space. And that was actually a belief that was stopping me from doing what I needed to do online. I wasn't willing to be seen as the learner. And this is what I see a lot in people is it's almost— I mean, maybe not the right word, but like an ego issue of like, I have to look like I've got my shit together. I have to look like— I know exactly what I'm talking about. And I really think that the women who are running the best businesses and watching you and all of the incredible women that you mastermind with and spend time with and collaborate with, what I admire about them is they're willing to be learners and they're willing to say, hey, I'm trying this new thing and here's what didn't work here and here's what did. And what I find in the people that are really not standing out is they're not willing to be a learner. And I think like, not to beat a dead horse, but the whole Jessie Jean thing was like, such a good example of this because she was so willing to just be a learner, and that was an identity shift for her as well. She had, from what I understand, years in digital marketing; she knew what she was doing, but she basically went on and said, no, I'm just gonna be a learner. And I think that's the part where the identity piece needs to come through for a lot of people, of saying, hey, I don't actually have to be the expert because people are more interested in watching me grow and watching what I'm doing so they can learn from it. And that's where your business becomes so, so much easier in order of— in, in terms of getting people to follow along with you. If you're just like, hey, I know everything, and like, I'm so great, and I'm like the expert, it's not really as attractive to people as, hey, I'm learning this and you should come with me. I've got a girlfriend, Valeria. She is a photographer here in Australia.

Yeah.

And she's so good with personal branding and all of the things. And for years she's been saying, I should start personal branding coaching. And so maybe a month or two ago she said, I'm going to grow my audience to 50,000 followers and I'm gonna show people how to do it, and I'm gonna talk about branding, and I'm gonna talk about what I'm learning. And she is growing so, so, so quickly. I think she's gone from 9,000 followers to almost 40,000 in like 6 weeks because she's taking people for the journey, because she put down the identity of, I need to know everything before I can teach it. And she said, no, I'm actually just going to take people along the way as I'm learning it, because that's again, when they look at you and they go, okay, I can learn from this. I can follow this roadmap now.

Okay. So you have 4 kids, you're running this business. You had mentioned, you know, some things that you had struggled with before of like perfectionism potentially, or whatever, you know, you kind of called that. What do you find is like your biggest face-off with yourself every day? Like the, the, the resistance. Like, what would you say the resistance is really around for you right now?

I really like my life, and so my biggest— like, the challenge that I'm in right now is I know that I could go so much bigger in my business, but I have this, this thing of like, what's the cost? So I like my daily life. I, um, I also have like a chronic condition, so I get incredibly tired. I have a lot of pain in my body a lot of the time. And so, there is this level of balance, right? Which doesn't exist. But there is this level of, I really want to take it to the next level. And I see and I know that there's almost this fear of what would it look like? What would maybe have to be sacrificed in order for me to go to the next level?

Right.

And I see this in so many clients as well where they might not even realize, and I see where I sabotage myself because I'm like, well, what will it look like to To really take this to the next level, to really go big. You know, I know in my head I said if I wanted to get to 500,000 followers by the end of the year, I could do that. I know how. It would actually be easy. But then I sabotage myself with like, am I actually ready? And I think a lot of people don't have this awareness, and I'm only just coming to it. I think I've been living this for like maybe a year or two and only just realizing it now. I think a lot of people don't always have the awareness that with growth is going to come a new level of responsibility.

Yep.

And sometimes we sabotage ourselves because we're not fully ready for it.

Mm-hmm.

And so, that's what I'm personally annoyingly navigating is like, okay, do I want to go bigger? What does it look like? I love traveling, and I went overseas last year to speak at an event in Costa Rica, and then one in Canada later on in the year, and I loved that. But then again, I was like, it was taking time away from my kids, and do I really want to take time away from my kids? And a lot of the work is in the US, and that's really far away from here, and do I want to be, you know, taking that time out? So I'm kind of like in this in-between now where I'm like, okay, I can stay where I am or I can blow it up. And I know I could blow it up if I really wanted to, like I could really take it big, but I'm trying to figure out if it's— if it's— if I'm ready, if it's worth it, which I know it is, but that's my internal battle that's going on. It's so real. Every day.

It's so, so real. And then, and then depending on how you grow, my husband and I have this conversation weekly. And we had it our entire careers because we absolutely have grown at the cost of not enjoying our life for like 10 years and like denying that we did. But looking back and going, I don't really know if I enjoyed that whole portion of my life. And that is something that we will not do anymore. So, you know, and I think a lot of times what we see as a really big business and growth, what we forget is that their numbers may not actually be that far off of a small business. Because then when you grow, until you stabilize and get that number very solid, you're paying a lot of money in team to get growth.

Yeah.

So even when— now that I get to be in this world of like, understanding everyone's business, I'm like, but you have 20 more employees than me, and technically the number you actually take home is very close to mine. So do I want the, or like the more organic, like this level, or do I want the ads, the ads team, all of these people, the marketing, all the things, you know? And I think until I get to know Claude even better, I'm, I'm good. It's like I'm in the same position as you. I want like a lot of growth, but not at the cost of— Like, I don't want to be traveling all the time anymore. I did that, and it is very much like, it's draining. And it's, you know, from one trip to another is like, the second you get home, all you're doing is kind of dreading, like, I'm gonna be gone again very soon. So yeah, it's— that's interesting.

Like, it's a, it's a battle every day. But like you said, you know, my business is so lame. Like, I have— yeah, I mean, I'm in my house right now. I have like 2 girls that work for me, but like virtually, and I like, I don't do ads yet. And this is the thing again, I'm like, well, I could go and do ads and put a lot of time and money into it, but I wonder, yeah, again, would it be, would it be worth it for what it would actually come back to? So that's an important conversation.

That's my team right now.

That's my battle. And I think I've got, what do they call it? Like they used to say in network marketing, the golden handcuffs.

Yes.

Of like, I'm like, the money's so good and the life is so good right now. That it's like, okay, well, what am I gonna sacrifice in order to go to the next level? And then I think we see a lot on social media of people having these really high cash months, and it can be so easy to compare. And I definitely get caught up in that as well. And I know that people would compare themselves to me in a way around views and followers and things like that. And I think it's really figuring out what's the life we really want to have, and I'm in that. Yeah, I'm in that conversation with myself right now of really going, okay, what does the next 12, 24 months look like?

Yeah, I think it's one of the most important conversations we can ever have with ourselves because we can be caught up in, like you said, comparing ourselves. There was a great carousel this guy broke down. He said, you know, you— what you see is a $3 million month, but what I actually took home was Oh my gosh, I think he took home $300K, which is still insane, but that's not what we're seeing. Do you know what I'm saying? It's still insane, but it's also like, but people are thinking he's taking home $3K, and he's also probably busy around the clock with the team. And so that's the thing you have to really think about is what does this look like? Is it worth it? What are you growing towards? And you know, because there's growth seasons in our life, so if you know you're going to do that, it's just Especially for women with kids. What's important right now? Where do you need to be? How do you want to feel about this portion of their life? And all the things that I'm sure come with that. But I think it's a really important question. So anyway, I love that you touched on that too, because all these—

And thank you for sharing where you're at. It's really inspiring as well to hear what you've done is so cool. But the honesty of, hey, that 10 years was hard. People don't say that enough. And this is the part where I think that we have a responsibility when we have this audience to go, okay, we need to be honest about the parts that are hard. Like, I always talk about my luteal low. I go really low. Oh no, like the luteal low is real low. Like, I'm like, I go to like, I suck, I'm gonna burn everything down, I'm awful, in like 2 days of just like, okay, I'm, you know, I'm not worthy. And then all of a sudden I'm like, oh my God, I'm such a badass again. But we feel alone in it a lot because the highlight reel of social media can actually trick us into thinking it's different, it's easy for so many people. And I really admire other people online like Leanne, who I've worked with before and who you know really well. I really admire that she speaks so openly about her own challenges and battles that she's had over time. And I think these conversations need to just happen so much more openly.

Yeah, totally. Well, I'm so grateful for you. Where can we find you, follow you? I know you're going to give us that list that we're going to post in comments, you guys, so you can go check that out.

Yeah, I'm gonna give you the list. I'm mostly on Instagram. That's where you're gonna find me. That's where I do my absolute best work. Um, send me a DM. I'm never too busy to get into my DMs. And yeah, we're gonna have to do part 2 to talk about the network marketing thing now.

Oh, I know. We didn't even talk about that. Next time we will. Thank you so much for coming on. You guys go check that out. Go get the list. And until next time, earn your happy. Bye everyone.