The CEO's Guide to Manifesting with Matt Cooke

Okay, so any— anyone now who wants something in life, just imagine that you're standing in front of the mirror with a sad face wanting us to see a smile. We all know the mirror will only show us a smile when we smile. We have to smile first to see the smile in the reflection. We attract into our life not what we want, but who we're being. Remember it clearly, watching Netflix on our laptop, and I rolled over to go to sleep, and out of nowhere, Alison, this sensation started to spread across my body, starting at the base of my feet, encompassing my whole body. It continued to a point where it felt like I was almost hovering above my bed, and the voice said, Matt, it's Mom, can you hear me? Blew me away because my mother had passed away in July 2017. So that shattered my whole perception of reality, and it just made me question reality. Alison, so where is she? What is reality? We sort of forget that we're living in a bit of an illusion, that we think things are physical and solid. Well, they're not. Actually, at its core, it's energy. So the real question is, and in my book I start with self-observation, it's like, well, where's your observation?

Welcome to the Scale It Method Podcast. I'm your host, Allison Maslin. I'm the CEO and founder of Pinnacle Global Network, where we mentor CEOs all over the world to grow and scale companies that change the world. And speaking of world changers, we have a dear friend of mine that I'm so I'm so excited that I get to interview today, and he has come out with an incredible book. We're going to talk about this today. It's called Beyond Wanting. So today's guest is Matt Cooke, a manifestation coach and author of this incredible book Beyond Wanting. And Matt's work challenges one of the most deeply ingrained patterns in high achievers, the belief that wanting more striving harder or pushing forward is what creates results, right? That's what we were all trained, uh, that's what we grew up on. But I think you're gonna look at running your business a little bit differently after this interview. Through his own journey and years of guiding leaders, Matt Cooke explores what happens when we move beyond desire into embodiment, where identity, expectation, and consciousness become the real drivers of outcomes. And so in this conversation, we explore how these principles intersect with leadership, business growth, and quantum science, and how CEOs can apply them in a grounded, practical way without losing your winning edge. All right? So I am living proof that this stuff works, and I'm so excited to have you here, Matt Cooke. Welcome.

Alison, thank you so much. I'm so excited to chat to you.

Yeah. So I just have to say, so I met you on Instagram. I saw you posting about manifestation and quantum physics, and I just really loved the way that you were expressing and explaining this. It just made so much sense. And you know, this is a topic that I love. As well. And it has made, you know, manifesting really is how I live my life. So I would love to hear in your own words how you would describe what manifesting is, if you can define that for our listeners, because I think there's a lot of confusion or misconception about that word.

I love that. Manifestation is the deliberate act of bringing something that you desire into the physical realm using a combination of thoughts, feelings, and actions. Now, if someone had told me that 5 years ago when I was in real estate, I would have laughed them out the room. There was no way that I believed that, you know, your thoughts could magically, uh, bring things into physical reality. But there is science to demystify that. And in a nutshell, That's how it works. It's all about intention. Intention is how you think, how you feel, how you behave, how you show up in the world. Intention is the totality of your being in the present moment. And we are always in a state of manifestation in every single second. The question is, to anyone listening, who are you being right now?

Yeah, what energy are you emitting at this very moment?

Yeah.

And being aware of that. So take us back, Matt. Uh, like, what were you doing before this work, and what was that moment that set you on this path?

Yeah, so two, two main things really. So I'm 33 now, so I'm relatively young to get into, to this, at this sort of level. And in 2018, at the time I was 26, I was the youngest manager in this firm of real estate agents here in the UK, and I was doing well on paper for my, for my age, and I was under just a lot of corporate stress. And I'd imagine anyone listening to this can, can relate to that, you know, if you're in the corporate world. And I was struggling at the time with this feeling of having a really tight chest, like I was really struggling to breathe. And at the time, it's important to note that I wasn't spiritual at all. I was very much suit and tie, 9 to 5 corporate grind. And managing a team and everything else. And I didn't really know who to turn to, you know. I think back then I was proud. I didn't really want to say anything about how I felt. And I just was vulnerable with my wife. And I have a very good relationship with her parents and her grandparents. And at the time, her grandmother said to me, Matt Cooke, well, look, why don't you have some reflexology? Um, it's going to really help. Like, I'll pay for it. Come over to my house. I have this therapist, and I'll arrange for this session for you. It's gonna help. So I was like, you know what, well, I could do with some relief from this pressure I'm feeling, so let's just go for it. So I had no idea what to expect. I didn't really know what reflexology was apart from it's something to do with feet and a massage of some respect. That was sort of it, that's all I knew. So I rocked up, got on the recliner. The therapist didn't know me, I didn't know the therapist, and what I thought would be a simple massage on my feet turned out to be one of the biggest spiritual awakenings of my life. He turned to me and said, so Matt, tell me who you are. And I said, well, I'm 26 years old, I'm the youngest manager in this firm of real estate agents. And he said— he stopped me in my tracks and he said, no, Matt, I didn't ask what you did for a living, I asked who you are. And Alice and I didn't know how to answer that question. Who am I? Who am I? He, he wasn't asking what I did, he asked who am I. And in that moment of realization, I realized and recognized that there was something inside and beneath this corporate shell. And in that moment, I really— the analogy, the metaphor is like, imagine trying— an astronaut who's in space, and you, you're seeing their suit, but you know there's a human inside. And it was like, who is that version of— who is that? And in that moment, I realized straight away that I, I wasn't happy in real estate. That was clearly it, you know. There was something else. It, it was seeking whatever that thing is inside. And that was the initial sort of spark that got me here and it leads to how I got into manifestation. And it leads to—

That's so powerful though, when you think about that, because I think so many of us define ourselves by what we do, not who we are, like the essence of your being, right? We don't think about that so much.

Yeah, it's the— Really. Exactly. It's like we're not— Matt was the name I was given when I was born, you know. I, I, uh, there's, there's an essence of me that was here before I was born that's here right now. The soul, whatever you want to call it, the consciousness, the being. That version of me is here for a reason. It has purpose. What is that though? You know, I think a lot of us get lost in the identity of the, the, this suit we wear. And I realized in that moment cracked me open, you know, only being 26, not being spiritual. But just knowing that straight away started to dissolve some pressure around my chest. And every single evening after work, I was just consuming— I couldn't get enough of it, just sort of, I suppose you could say, motivation to keep me going. I remember listening to Jim Rohn, Bob Proctor, Tony Robbins, and that carried on for about 5 months until the next thing that completely changed my life. And that was February 2019. Lying in bed with my wife one evening, Tuesday evening, I remember it clearly, watching Netflix on our laptop. And I rolled over to go to sleep. My wife carried on watching the show. And you know when you're in that state where you're still aware of the world around you, you're still awake, but you're trying to go to sleep. And out of nowhere, Alison, this sensation started to spread across my body, starting at the base of my feet, encompassing my whole body. What started out as like a soft vibration turned into an intense, tense vibration. It wasn't painful. I allowed it to continue because I was curious. I'd never ever felt anything like that before. It continued to a point where it felt like I was almost hovering above my bed. And then, and then I heard this high-pitch ringing in both my ears, and then it went silent. And it's what, what sounded like a voice at the opposite end of like a sports hall got closer and closer until the— I could hear the voice. And the voice said, Matt, it's Mom. Can you hear me? And I exchanged a few words, and it blew me away because my mother had passed away in July 2017. And as I was exchanging a few words to my mother, my wife nudged me because she was still awake and just said, Matt, who are you talking to? And I turned to tell her and turned back, and my mom had gone. And I mean, how do you deal with that? You know, it's like, I was awake when it happened. I wasn't dreaming. I I'd never experienced anything like that before in my life. Of course I wanted to believe in an afterlife, right? Who wouldn't if you lose your nearest and dearest? But I actually spoke to her, like firsthand proof. I didn't see a medium, I spoke to her. So that shattered my whole perception of reality, bearing in mind I was a traditional suit and tie guy, not raised spiritually, didn't believe in anything other than what I could see and touch. And it just made me question reality, Alison. You know, we can go deeper if you like, but it, it made me firstly want to connect with her again. That was my initial desire. And then exploring— well, okay, well, my mum, she's not here physically, but I've just spoken to her, so where is she? What is reality?

Yeah, yeah.

And as I started to break down reality, literally, like I'm talking our physical reality, our human body, this microphone, what we're all— what we're all seeing, you— we sort of forget that we're living in a bit of an illusion. That we think things are physical and solid. Well, they're not. That it's crystallized, um, uh, atomic structure, like particles, that, that are— that we think is sort of solid, but actually at its core it's energy. Scientifically, if we break down anything, yeah, even this microphone, right?

It's just all energy.

It's just condensed crystallized energy. Yeah, that's all it is, you know. And if we, we, we, we drill down into physical reality, we arrive— and we can go down there— and how this ties into manifestation, we arrive at this subatomic level, this quantum level. So we're only seeing— like, the truth is 0% of reality. We're seeing scientifically less than 0.01% of reality. Over 99.9% of reality is invisible fields of information and energy that's invisible to our sense data. So, you know, my mother, all our loved ones, they exist in that realm we can't see with our senses, you know. And as I was just down there exploring and dabbling with energies, when I first started to hear the words manifestation The Law of Attraction, The Secret, and, and that's— we can go there. That's, that's, that was when I first started to understand that there's more here and that maybe I could use it in my own life.

Yeah, I really, I want to dive into this further, but I want to just kind of touch on that. It's interesting because my dad comes to me pretty frequently in my dreams, and I, I want— like, I don't, I, I don't experience him coming to me in the day, my waking life. But in— you're in that somewhat of an altered state when you're sleeping, right? You're— yeah, so you're, you're able to tap into that other energy. I guess that, that's what I'm getting from what you're saying.

Yeah, like the, the sense of self, like Alison, Matt Cooke, the ego lives very much in the left side of our brain, you know, the analytical, rational sort of identity of who we are. And we're perceiving reality based on what's around us and when we sort of slow down, when we drift out of, out of left brain and into the right side of our brain, more of the intuitive side of our brain. We, we, we go there when we sleep, when the, when the analytical mind rests every night. So that's why dreams are so powerful. But also, every leader can resonate with light bulb moments, you know. If any leader listening to this right now can remember the last time they had an epiphany or an idea out of the blue, it tends to be when we're in idle mode, when we're showering, when we're walking the dog, when we're going for a run. It, it doesn't really happen when we're sort of like on the computer hustling. So like insight always comes from, from the right brain, you know, that right side of our brain, the intuitive side. And yeah, it's fascinating. So that's why for you, for spirit in general, it's so much— they're always trying to communicate, by the way. It's just that through the work, like waking day, we're just in the wrong side of our brain to sort of pick it up. Whereas intuition, insight, light bulb moments, connection with, with a loved one is normally when we're slower. In the right side of our brain, the intuitive side.

Yeah, it's so fascinating. I could talk about this all day. And I, well, let's talk about, I do want to talk about intuition because that is, you know, the more in alignment I've become, the more I've been able to trust my intuition. And I think, you know, we're talking to business owners that are listening to this. And we have so many apps and different things that we tap into to help us make decisions. And I think we forget that we have the most powerful GPS system internally that we walk around with every single day. And I know as a leader, the more that I have trusted my gut, the better decisions that I make.

Absolutely. Well, look, I think it's widely known that Einstein's greatest ideas came from the walk to and from the lab, not at the lab. Edison, that, you know, the founder of the light bulb, the light bulb moment, you know, all these great leaders from like the past century, if you look at what they did, you know, there's a famous one, I think it was Edison, that would take an afternoon nap you know, he'd take with him like a metal spoon and a metal tray, or it was either a metal spoon or a metal ball. And he would have a notepad on his chest and he'd hold the spoon in his hand. And he knew that as soon as he'd fallen into those slower receptive brainwaves that we're talking about, the spoon would leave his hand and it would hit the tray. And as soon as the spoon hit the tray, would wake him up and he'd make, immediately make those notes. And it was the light bulb moment. Like it was the notes in that part of the brain. You know, and it's— and it's even the periodic table, for example, came to someone in a dream. It's like we're connected at all times to infinite knowing, but it doesn't exist in the left side of our brain. The left side of our brain is the rational part that tries to figure and hustle and work things out. And I think in the culture we're in, the distraction we're in with social media, there's a pandemic of how many of us are living a stupid percentage of our life in the left brain and not understanding the importance of being more present. You know, I think as leaders, we think, oh, I haven't got time to be present. I haven't got time to meditate. When actually, you're going to succeed faster by being more present because you're going to get more ideas, you know, that come.

Oh, 1,000%. And I understand, you know, you feel like you got to hustle to get the project done, meet the deadline. You want to hit those goals. And what I have found in my many years of running companies and spending a lot of time talking to you, of course, that the more quiet time that I take, the faster my business grows because I'm not wasting time spinning at the same place focused on the minutia. When you step back, that's where you get those bigger picture breakthroughs. Like you said, when the mind is open, you can have those downloads, those light bulb moments that are going to take you much further than that hustling is going to.

Yeah, it's that great saying, isn't it? Slow down to go faster. But we're just not trained that way, are we? You know, the ego is always looking to hustle. And, you know, it's dangerous to the ego, to that side of us. Like, I can't slow down, you know, I have payroll, I've got to close this round of investment, you know, there's no way I can do this. But every single client I work with, every single time they say to me, Matt, you know, I've got this deadline. I've got to raise this amount of capital. I've got to do this, that, and the other. I just don't know where it's going to come from. And I'm like, well, it's not your job to figure that out. It's get more present, you know. And every time they get more present, they just have the wildest synchronicity that comes their way, or breakthrough, or idea. But it's, it's, yeah, it's understanding and coming to peace with that, that we, we have to account for and make time for being present, you know. Not, not, not 30 years ago, I wasn't in that world. I was born in '92, but you know, so for me, I've never really known anything other than going to work and still working outside of work with like, with like your emails. But for anyone in the older generation, I'm sure you can remember a time where you finished maybe at 5 and there was no email, there was no phone, like you couldn't really, you know. So people in those days naturally spent more time in their right brain, you know, it was more of a 50-50 balance, whereas now it as you, as we all know, it never stops, does it? Really?

Yeah. Well, we have all of these things to make life more efficient, but it actually, it does make it more efficient, but then we just add more stuff.

Right.

Just keep adding more stuff. Right. Let's talk about your book, Beyond Wanting, and you've got to get this book if you want to experience and be able to attract the things that you've been desiring. So let's talk about this because like we're saying, many entrepreneurs are wired to want more, more growth, more success, more impact. What is actually missing, Matt, when we live in this constant state of wanting? How does that actually push things back instead of attract it to us?

I can— I'm going to share several different ways of looking at this. Firstly, the, the simplest, and that is that I want everyone to imagine walking up to a physical mirror, standing in the mirror with a sad face and wanting to see a smile. Okay, so any— anyone now who wants something in life, just imagine that you're standing in front of the mirror with a sad face, wanting a smile, to see a smile. We all know the mirror will only show us a smile when we smile. We have to smile first to see the smile in the reflection. We don't treat reality like that, though, do we? We tend to go, when success happens, when I get here, when this happens, then I'll smile. It's sort of like we're waiting for something outside of us to then smile. And that's not how the universe works. Like, scientifically, it's in the book. I've proven it scientifically. It's called the observer effect. We attract into our life not what we want, but who we're being. And I'm not saying you, you can't be successful by not knowing this, because you can. You can force, you can fight, you can drag yourself through it, but it's probably going to take longer. So let's firstly just think of the definition of wanting. Wanting is haven't got. Like, want means I don't have. So I'm not saying people can't want. Absolutely, I want massive things. But wanting isn't necessarily what gets you there. What gets you there is the future version of yourself that exists in your imagination who already has it. So that's the being. So you have to say to yourself, how does the version of me who has all these things that I want— what are they like? How do they show up in the world? Uh, how do they think? How do they feel? How do they protect their energy? What do they— how do they protect their yeses and their nos? Like, what do they do? How do they behave? And that really is how manifestation works. We have to move beyond wanting and fully embody the version of ourselves that already has it. And to go just slightly deeper, in quantum mechanics, this is amazing thing that I just discussed there called the observer effect. And it really shows us that what turns this infinite field of information and energy that we could label the universe, the quantum field, the Matrix, whatever— what turns it from being just energy that exists in what's called superposition there's infinite possibility there. What turns it from that to this physical stuff is observation, right? It's observation on a quantum level which collapses that energy to the particle, and that's a scientific fact. So that— so the real question is, and in my book I start with self-observation, it's like, where's your observation? So if everyone reflects right now for a moment, imagine being a fly on the wall in your own brain. How are you thinking about yourself and your business every day? Are you saying like, this is just a struggle, I'm not going to get over this period, I don't know what's happening, things are going wrong? Like, you know, like, how are you being? Because if on a quantum level, observations turning energy to the particle— we're made of the same stuff on a macro level, right? So I'd love to I know you and I have done this before, but I'd love everyone to, to experience what I'm about to, to, to show you, to understand really what I mean by observation. So Alison, and anyone that can do this while sort of listening, maybe not if you're driving, but Alison, if you just close your eyes for me.

Okay.

And everyone else listening, and just inside your own mind, not out loud, just say the word hello 5 times for me. And once you've done that, do it again, but this time inside your head again. Shout the word "hello" 5 times inside your head. And then open your eyes. And Alison, what did you experience? Did you hear the word "hello" or did you see the word "hello"?

I saw the word "hello" and my whole body, I could feel it pulsating.

Okay. And then anyone listening now, reflect on what you experienced, whether you heard it or you saw it. Alison, question for you is, who heard it or saw it?

Hmm, I was observing myself see— hearing that.

Yeah, so you'd agree then that the word hello wasn't you? It was separate from whoever saw it.

Yeah, it was like I was observing myself. So I'm here observing myself in another internal voice that is yelling the word hello.

Exactly. So the truth there is, however we want to label whatever saw it or heard it, it's the separation, it's the witness, it's the watcher. I call it the observer or the consciousness. The truth is there's always something separate to the thought. Now, so then how are you thinking about yourself or your business every day? Because you are not those thoughts. You are the separation. That is the true essence of our being, that separation. Now, if we're not practicing that, where is the observer? Where is it? It, well, it's not separate. So what does that mean? It means it's entangled within however we're thinking. So then however we're thinking is the dominant observer of our reality. And what that means then is there's no bodyguard, there's no gatekeeper. So if a thought come— if we're thinking a thought such as 'I'm failing,' for example, well then no gatekeeper, the thought goes and slips straight through the brainstem into the body, creates a chemical reaction called an emotion, and then we act like in accordance with that emotion and we get stuck on this loop. And then if I've just explained that on a quantum level observation creates physical reality and your dominant observation is your negative thinking. Well, if we now understand that the observer is the separation, we have a choice. We have power. We can decide that, no, I'm not going to think that thought today, thank you. Yeah, I'm going to trust and I'm going to believe. And it, it is difficult initially, I'm not gonna lie, you know, especially if someone's gone through a rough patch, you know, your brain's firing through sort of triggers like externally and trying to create this narrative. But what we don't want to do is we don't want that to be the narrative because we know that what it's doing on a quantum level is actually creating physical reality. So manifestation starts with being that observer, catching it, reframing it. And also, I want everyone to imagine now whatever dream you have in business or in life is that you can create a vision, a story, a mind movie of whatever that thing is that you want and rehearse it. As if it's already done. Now, the power of that is that you're visualizing as if it's already done. That observation again is collapsing this wave, and that's manifestation really on a quantum level, you know. So people who don't practice this separation are really manifesting on autopilot, unconsciously, and they're left to probability. They're left to just however they're thinking. And that's why people see so many recurring themes or patterns in their life. The people that practice this, catch it, reframe it, rewire it, rehearse, start to very quickly see these very strange synchronicities starting to happen.

And that's— yeah, we are the common denominator of our experiences. Yeah, for sure. And so here's a question for you. Do you, as you are, uh, pretending or imagining this new reality that you want to manifest? Are you walking through your day seeing yourself in that reality, or are you just living your normal life and then every once in a while you will kind of go into that in your mind? How do you weave this into your everyday?

Yeah. So for me, I'm not a huge fan of the word fake it 'til you make it. I prefer feel it till you make it. So I, I start— I have a morning routine that takes me around an hour, uh, you know, I have a 1-year-old, so I used to be able to have a little bit longer, but around an hour in the morning, that sort of sets me up for doing my meditation. Where I, I was— I always used to like get confused as how meditation and manifestation tied in, but the great thing with meditation is we have an opportunity to slow down our brain and rehearse and visualize. And, you know, the great thing with that is the brain subconsciously cannot discern the difference between a dream or reality. So, you know, everyone can resonate with any time they've had a nightmare, a night terror. You know, you, you wake from that nightmare in the middle of the night, and for a moment you're— you wake and you think that, that dream's real, and you realize it was just a dream. But if you look at your body, your body's reacting emotionally to that nightmare, like your heart's beating and you're sweating. So when you meditate, you can rehearse and feel it. You can genuinely— it's not about faking it. Like, if you rehearse whatever it is in your life that you want as if it's already done, your body's genuinely going to think that it's, it's real, and you're going to feel in accordance with that. So I have a whole process, it's all in the book, about journaling and gratitude and my affirmations that I do. And then really, Alison, what I do is I don't walk around like pretending like it's already happened. I live as if the personality— it has already happened. So, you know, your personality creates your external reality. So for me, it's more going, okay, well, this future version of Matt, how does he think day to day? What are his triggers? What is he conscious of? How does he behave? How does he feel? Does he trust more in the unknown? Like, what is he doing? And that's who I try and be. So my analogy is like, it's like playing tennis. The goal is to try and stay on the baseline. You're going to get triggered, though. You're going to get balls left and right. You're going to be running all over the show every day. It's called a human being. There's always triggers, there's always curveballs, always things coming out of the blue. The question is, though, how quickly can we get back to baseline? And really, the baseline is staying conscious and not getting triggered and falling unconscious. So really what happens is we just get better at being conscious of triggers. And then we, we live our day. We don't try and force or manipulate, like, the synchronicities. We allow this field of intelligence to co-create with us. And, you know, one day we might have an unbelievable, like, manifestation that comes. Some days nothing, and that's fine. You just show up again and you keep going.

Yeah. And so you're more present. You're, you're more aware of your thoughts and your actions. So then you do notice those synchronicities that when you're on autopilot, they could be happening and it just goes right by you.

You're always getting evidence. Look, you know, when I first started doing this work, um, yeah, I think a lot of people resonate with me because I'm just a normal dude, you know, who worked in real estate, and I would never have thought I'd be this spiritual sort of manifestation coach, researcher. And when I first started hearing things like angel numbers, that was just far too abstract and out there for me. But you know what, I love, I love science. Science demystifies the mystical. And you know, you only have to research Pythagoras, who said like numbers rule the universe. And you know, numbers are everything in money, in life, in business, in even a Zoom call. And we get evidence. You know, you only have to be doing this work and then you'll start getting very strange patterns, for example, of like numbers. You might see 11:11 on the clock, on car registration plates, timestamps in your emails. And you know, if you pay attention to that, it starts to become really strange and you recognize that these are the early signs of like the breadcrumbs, if you like, of like the things that you're seeking actually showing. I think we sometimes think it's like a genie in a bottle and all of a sudden, wow, like this huge manifestation comes out of the blue. It's actually more of like a sequential rendering. And if we're present to it, we see the signs, you know. And they don't— might not just be numbers. It might be overhearing a strange conversation. Like, everyone can resonate with thinking about someone and then they phone or email or text. What's going on there? Like, how's that even possible? You know, when you put odds on that. So we're all connected, but we've got to be more present to see it.

Yeah, it's, it's It's just, you know, I haven't talked about this much on this podcast, but my community hears me talk about these things. And you and I have had these conversations, Matt Cooke, for quite some time. And I have— I don't even know, I'd say used manifestation because it's not like a thing, but manifestation has been a big part of my life. Intention, it's how I attracted my soulmate, my husband, and we're celebrating 20 years of marriage this year. And that was after a string of bad choices.

Yeah.

And it was like the light bulb moment was like, okay, Allison, you are choosing to be in these situations. You can choose otherwise. And so I listed out what I wanted in a partner and I set a date even. Which was rather bold, when we would meet. And, you know, he came a week early. And I even said we would get married a year later, and we did. And he was everything that I wrote down. And that absolutely blew my mind. And he was living on the same street as me for 10 years, and we had never met. There were so many So many times that we had crossed paths and had never met. And since then, so many other things in my life. I really believe the success that I have in business, of course, all of the strategies we use in the SCALE UP Method and building your vision and marketing and sales and team and all of those things. And you really need to have clear clear strategy, clear plan, leadership, and all of those things. But to me, the work that you're talking about, Matt Cooke, the work that you talk about in this great book, that is the amplifier to it all. It creates, from my personal experience, so much more magic that you couldn't plan. It's so far beyond anything that I could have ever made up myself. And it actually, it just makes it fun. I love it because like you said, with that intention, you are turning energy to matter basically. And it's like you're, I see it as like you're molding clay of the things that you want to create in your business and in your life.

So true. And I also have a theory that I say, and this originated from, you know, I work with many different people looking to manifest many different things, whether it's business success, whether it's healing from health conditions, uh, people manifesting love. And I want to just share something. I work with some people that look— are looking to manifest something specific. And when I say specific in a relationship, a specific person. So this could be someone that they've previously dated and been disconnected from, or someone that they really have their eyes on. And from this just recurring theme of working with people, I noticed something. They, they thought it was the person they wanted, when in actual fact what they were attracted to was the version of themselves that exists in their imagination when they're with that person. Because that person makes them feel a certain way, makes them feel safe, makes them feel worthy, makes them feel heard, whatever that is. That, that's why. And this sort of insight for me made me realize it's not just specific people. It's— it can— this can be applied in all areas of life, whatever you want. Why don't you think about the fact that actually maybe the reason you want it is because you're attracted to a future version of yourself that exists in your imagination when you— when you've achieved that goal? Now, if that's the case, then the question is, then, are you being them? Are you being that future version of yourself? What's the disconnect? What's the— what's the separation? Is that version of you different in any way? If they are, then that's highlighting straight away what you need to start doing. Because the moment you start being them— and we've spoken about the observation collapse of the wave function— the moment you start being them is the moment you start seeing this magic. It really is.

Yeah, I, I so agree. And I would say, as it relates to the relationship, for me in that moment, I realized I settling. Yeah, like I wasn't stepping up and expecting, uh, as a higher version of myself. And so everything changed in that moment where I just, I set a boundary, I set a standard that I would not go below, and that's when things started to change. And so this idea, and you talk about this in your book, expecting Yeah, like you manifest what you expect. That's powerful.

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. You attract into your life what you believe you're worthy of. Like, you're always in a state of attraction right now. So what do you believe to be true about yourself? You know, it's so— you know, the funny thing is, and I can go really deep and complex, but it's actually really simple. It's just that you are, you will attract into your life who you're being.

Yeah.

So you have to—

How do you, how do you, how do you do this, Matt, though? We're talking to business owners that are having a really rough time with cash flow or they just had, you know, one of their top employees quit and they have a big deadline. So it's easy when things are good. How do they maintain this or think this way or do this practice in those times?

There's a law in the universe called the law of rhythm. And this is the paradox of this. I actually think it's sometimes like it's, yes, we think it's easier when things are going great, but I think the golden opportunity is in the ebb. Rather than the flow. Like, I live in Cornwall here in the UK, and I don't surf, but there's a big surf culture. And when I'm walking on the beach, I love to observe the surfers because what I watch a lot of the time is they're only really riding waves for a short period of time. You know, that's the riding the flow. And then the ebb comes where they're just really bobbing along on the board, you know. And what they're doing is if they're by themselves, they're just observing, they're looking at the next wave, you know, they're really looking. And I think for Anyone who's going through that ebb right now where cash flow is difficult or an employee's left, it's like, well, who are you being in that respect right now? Like, this is the golden opportunity to, to double down on your journaling, to self-reflect, go, okay, well, you know, and look at yourself. This is definitely not a time to fall unconscious and be negative about it. It's a time to double down on what's already working. And, and the real difficulty here and the paradox, of course, is you naturally don't feel like in this moment there's anything to necessarily even feel grateful for because you feel like everything's falling apart. But the real paradox is this is where you really have to go, life's just great, you know, I'm so grateful for everything I have. Like, really, really return to doubling down to gratitude because that right there is, is what always flips it. Always. And look, we all go through it, Alison. I know, I'm sure you do. I know I do. It's the law of rhythm, night and day, you know, it's a, it's a law in the universe. We all go up and down. But it's who you're being in the down. It's who you're being in the down. We're unconscious when it's flowing, you know, 'cause we're just riding that wave, you know? So—

And I find in the down, it forces us to get creative.

Yeah.

And it actually opens up other channels of ideas that you wouldn't get when you're up here 'cause you're coasting along.

When you're, yeah, exactly. You're being carried along like you're, you're being given this, this space in a sense to ride this wave. And I think when you're, when you're going through the difficulty, now is when, you know what, paradoxically again, now is when you do less. Now hear me out, right? Because in, in weeks, in when cash flow's tight, when you've got deadlines, you'd think like, I've got to do more, right? But there has to be a balance of actually getting present and doing less. Because when you get present and you connect with that divinity that the spaciousness between thoughts is when you get the next great idea, when you get that, that idea out of the blue that changes your entire business. That doesn't exist when you're in the hustle. And it, you know, look, I'm not saying it's easy because it's easy to forget this, but it's when we, when we go, okay, this feels really uncomfortable to do this now, but I actually need to step away from the phone, from my emails. I need to go for a walk for an hour without my phone. And I need to double down in presence, you know.

Yeah. Well, it's why we get the best ideas when we're taking a shower. Yeah.

But how many, how long do we take showers for these days, especially a lot of your high-flying CEOs? Probably not very long, you know. So it's like, I know, you know.

And so that's my next question. Having the patience or the trust when the, like, let's say you're doing the work, you're showing up, you're doing all the steps you're sharing, but having the patience and the trust when the results don't show up fast enough.

Yeah.

So how do you work through that tension of like, okay, I'm doing, I'm being, and I'm not seeing the evidence?

Yeah, I think the truth is, Alison, in physical reality, there's a time lag. What do I mean there? I'm going to really simplify this. If I said to you, Alison, go and make yourself a cup of coffee, Now, okay, well, firstly, what you do is you visualize having that cup of coffee. You've probably got it there in your hand already. But actually, if you physically wanted to achieve that in physical reality, you'd have to get up, move your body through some form of space. You'd have to go over to your kitchen, wait for the kettle, make the coffee, and come back. So what am I saying here? There is a lag, a time lag, you know, that I think we forget sometimes. So you set the intention, but we live in space-time, so we have to just trust in that it's actually happening and that it's already on its way. And I think always that is what triggers most of us, you know, that we do the work and there's not the evidence straight away. But here's what I'm going to say. I said this at the beginning. If scientifically reality is over 99.9% nothing, invisible fields of energy that we can't perceive, and the true— and what we are seeing represents less than 0.01%, then what would you rather trust? You know, I know I'd rather trust in something that's almost 100% of reality, that 99.9%. So what does that mean though? It means trusting in what I can't see. It means trusting in the evidence that I can't receive and perceive with my sense data. And that is again a paradox to the ego and who we are. So it's, it's difficult, but we have to in a sense lean in and just really go, do you know what, I'm going to surrender, like let go. Like letting go means letting in. I have this great saying. I say the universe meets you at the depth of your surrender, not at the height of your struggle. You know?

Wow. Yeah, surrender is really, is to me surrender is, I think some people think surrender means I'm giving up, but to me it means now I'm open. Now I'm allowing, I'm stepping back and I'm just going to allow the doors to open. And, uh, yeah, that's when you see all of the magic. And I know you're living proof. You've had so many incredible things that have changed, Matt, in your life since doing this work. Um, and you've got to follow Matt on, on Instagram and YouTube, uh, because he's posting things that are so inspiring every single day. And I know for myself I've just— I'm sitting right now in my villa in Zihuatanejo, Mexico, where my husband and I got engaged in this town 20 years ago. And, you know, it just— like, if you looked on paper at the time, it would have been like, oh, well, that's not going to happen. And here I am. And it is 100%, 1,000%. Because of this work that Matt talks about in this amazing book, Beyond Wanting. You've got to go get it, order it, and it is absolutely riveting. But then do the work, practice it, because it will be the amplifier to what you are holding closest to your heart for your business and your life.

And I say in there, Alison, thank you for that. I was going to say as well, like, you know, your own evidence, your own experience is going to be your most compelling truth. And there's a lot of— there's— I tie a lot of the stories into that book with real life stories of athletes and successful business owners. But there's room in every single chapter to go and embody and the work as well, just the time with what you said, and go and go and go and find your own truth with this, you know. It'd be your most compelling evidence.

Yeah. And, and one thing I will say to this is that I used to do the work, um, I call it vision crafting, but you know the intention work, the journaling, the gratitude. I did it occasionally when I had time, you know, on vacation, and I would see evidence, but it would be sprinkled here and there. And it was when I started the consistent work every single day, no matter what, before I would start my— before I start my day. I did it this morning. That's when it's like you create this flywheel of energy and things just start moving at a much more rapid pace. But then coming from all different places, like strategic partners that I meet out of the blue that I had on my list coming to me. And so, it just, it makes things so much easier. We make it so much harder than it needs to be. So. I love that.

Yeah. Just one word to finish there as well is that that's the magic word, consistency. And I think just for everyone listening who's deciding whether they're going to do this or not, you're already doing it. That's the truth, right? Yeah. And the thing is, you're already being consistent doing it, maybe unconsciously. And that is, that is, that is, that is the real compelling truth here. So it's like, are you going to be consistent unconsciously or consistent consciously? Like Alison just said, the moment she consciously doubled down on doing it was the moment everything started to actually move a little bit faster. So it's, uh, that's why I have this one sort of You're gonna commitment to just never ever miss a day. Every day in every way, never miss.

Every day in every way. Yeah, I love it, Matt. Thank you so much for being here. Thank you. And so we know that you can get the book on Amazon and also how can people reach you if they want to reach out to you? What's the best way?

Absolutely. Yeah, so the book's everywhere all over the world. Amazon, Audible, Kindle, however you want to listen to it. Just search me on all the big platforms. Instagram, Matt Cooke Coach. I have a big community over there. TikTok. You'll find me on YouTube, on various podcasts. And yeah, that's nice and simple. There you go.

I'm so glad we had a chance to do this. This was so much fun. Thank you very much for being here with me on the Scale-Up Method podcast. And for those of you listening and you want to learn more about our work and how we work with CEOs to help them scale strategically and energetically, then go to Pinnacle Global Network. You'll learn all about who we are, our mentors, how we work one-on-one with our clients. And if you want to take it a little deeper and you want to have a one-on-one conversation with one of our CEO strategists, they'll take a look at your your entire business, figure out where the gaps are and what are the steps needed to close those gaps and get you to that next level, you go to myscalesession.com. All right, and until next time, make decisions from where you're going, not from where you're at. We'll see you later. Bye everybody.