"How to Identify Your 6 Core Emotions for Better Relationships"

And so he told me. He's like, will, he's like, you're not getting angry because you're tough. He's like, you're getting angry because you feel weak. And he's like, just like two dogs or two peacocks that are getting ready to fight. It's like you puff yourself up to make yourself feel strong, but underneath all of that is weakness. And that day changed my life completely.

You're listening to Sex with Emily. I'm Dr. Emily, and I'm here to help you prioritize your pleasure and liberate the conversation around sex. Today I'm talking with Dr. Will Sue, a psychiatrist and psychedelic therapy expert about the deep connection between emotional healing and sexual fulfillment. We're exploring how unprocessed emotions, especially anger, shame, and fear, can block intimacy and authentic connection both in and out of the bedroom. Will shares his personal journey from achieving external success while feeling internally miserable to discovering how psychedelics and therapy helped him connect with his authentic self. We'll dive into practical steps for identifying and feeling your emotions, the real reasons behind anger, and why vulnerability might be the sexiest trait of all. We'll also tackle some tough topics. How religious upbringing can create sexual shame, why men's insecurities around their bodies need more attention, and how emotional authenticity can actually increase attraction and improve your sex life. My intention is to help you understand that emotional work isn't separate from sexual work. It's foundational to it. When you can show up authentically and process your feelings, everything else, including intimacy, starts to flow. All right, let's get into it. Will, welcome to the show. Thank you for being here. I'm excited to have you. We talk a lot on this show about just men getting more in touch with their emotions, not being afraid to deal with anger. We actually had a caller last week who said, you know, I've been married for 20 years, and my wife said to me, I want you to be more emotionally available. Can you help me? And I was like, I'm not your therapist, but we can start on the journey. And so I love, Will, that you're so open. You know, maybe you could just tell me about yourself and your journey. We can start there. Will, thanks for being here.

Yeah, great. Thanks for that introduction. I guess me in a nutshell. I'm 40 years old, and so 32 was sort of my second big mental health crisis that I would say, you know, I was at Harvard at that time. I had gone to medical school at UCLA. I went to Oxford to get my PhD and the only Reason I mentioned these things is because, like, on the external, I had said, oh, I had accomplished all the things that I, that I thought would make me happy. And then I'm like, wait, what am I doing? I'm miserable. And I was really just like, what do I do now? And at that time, I showed this photo to the producers before, but this was me around that time.

So it was like, no, okay. Will, is it not me?

Yeah, I mean, I was just not me, you know, And I had created this shell of a person and the things that I wanted to accomplish and what I thought would make me happy, and I was miserable. And so I think, like a lot of people, I just started then, maybe not like a lot of people, and I actually started looking at like, like what got me into this position and what, what do I do to make me happy? And so, yeah, I just took a long look at life. And at that time, even though I work with psychedelics now, that's most of what I talk to talk about publicly. But at 32, I had never tried a psychedelic. I had only smoked pot like five times in my life. I had been raised Jehovah's Witness, and so I was terrified of drugs. I thought they were, you know, these things that were going to take me to hell and they were the devil's work. And then even though I left the church when I was relatively young, in my teens, you know, the lessons stayed with me and, you know, and then the war on drugs and the 80s and say no. And so I was of the mindset up until 32 that psychedelics were addictive and they were dangerous. And so it was sort of synchronicity, long story short, that a childhood best friend had ended up getting introduced to a psychedelic called dmt. And I, like, fought even learning more about it, but eventually he was like, will, he's like, they used to do research on these in the 50s and 60s, and they found that one of them is made in the human brain. And that was like, finally after months, I was like, this is interesting. What's this all about? That was like literally life changing. I found like these papers in the best scientific journals from that time, and I'm like, wait, is the government not always telling us the truth? Is there something that behind this? And so, you know, within a few months of that, I tried my first psychedelic and it was life changing. And, you know, I just started seeing the bigger picture and finding meaning, I think is the most important thing.

You were actually, what we, a lot of us talk about is we always think, well, I'll be happy in the future. Once I get this job, once I make this much money, once I get the home, the house, the wife, the whole thing, then I can be happy, which is so. And then a lot of us do that. We work, we work and then we look up, we go, wait, okay, what is it about? Who am I? What actually makes me happy? So you had that kind of wake up call, you're saying at 32, after being raised Jehovah's Witness. So not only were you where they say no to drugs, I'm curious what you heard about sex growing up. Was that also something that was taboo? Because I know a lot of our listeners too, grew up in very religious homes where sex is restricted, wait till marriage, don't masturbate, don't, you know, we don't have to get into that. I mean, I'm just talking about the mess. I don't know much about.

No, I mean, totally. Like that's what it was. It was evil. It's the work of the devil. You shouldn't have sex before marriage. But it was this thing that was confusing. Cause I was like so unhappy and felt so suppressed in other parts of my life. And I was like, oh my God. I discovered this thing about me. But intense, intense guilt that I think in some ways I still carry some of that trauma in my body. Now I've done a lot of work around sex in the last few years in therapy, but I definitely still have the memory of that in my body sometimes. And so it's still something that I work through.

And so how do you start working through the guilt? Because I do believe that a lot of people, we still carry the messages that we heard as it traveled around sex. What is the first step for releasing that guilt and shame around sex?

Yeah, one of the things I thought that was interesting as I was thinking about the show tonight is that, that how few people even talk about sex. If I think that, like, if I had to guess, I would be overestimating. If I. If in my career, which I'm 40 something, hasn't been like a long, long time. But If I said 5% of people of my clients have talked to me about sex, I think I'm overestimating it. And it's really, it's really just something I think that isn't talked about to begin with. And certainly not into the nitty gritty of all, you know, because I sort of think that sex is really almost like a thermometer or a gauge of where we are and where we are in relation to other people. And so I actually have found that, for myself at least, that I've found a lot of healing around sex. Just dealing and working through other insecurities. You know, I think that we project a ton upon the body. And so I think a lot of work around sex can be done simply by working on insecurities that may not directly relate to sex. But I think there is some things that, just to answer your question, more directly about sex and guilt, you know, for sure, for me, it's been, you know, this thing about delaying gratification, for instance, in religion, right? It's like I remember, like, the last shall be the first. Like, I remember, like at church they always used to say that. So it's okay to suffer, it's okay to not have. Because when we die and we go to heaven, we'll have that. So that was part for me that, okay, sort of like with the achievement, with career, et cetera, it's like, oh, I'll have that later. I can have that pleasure later. Where I realized, again, like in my early 30s, was like, no, that there is no later, you know, So I know I just said a lot.

No, no, that's. That makes so much sense. And that was sort of like the running theme then perhaps for everything, for your happiness, for your joy and for sex. It was all later, later, once I achieve all of these things. And then you said, well, you were already at school and studying, but then you had your first psychedelic experience, which sort of was your first step. What was the first experience?

It's a psychedelic called dmt, which is the active ingredient in ayahuasca, which probably more people have heard of Ayahuasca, but the DMT is becoming relatively well known. I think probably most interesting about DMT is that when you smoke it, it's a very powerful, intense experience, which the way I try to describe it to people is pretty much everything that you relate to this reality, meaning time, space, gravity, a body, me like will is out the door within 20 to 30 seconds. And it's not like you're standing back and watching this. It's as if all of these things that you have taken completely as a part of your reality are removed. And so it can be a very scary experience. And so we use the term ego death quite a bit in the psychedelic community. And so if one isn't, like, properly guided, it can be this pretty terrifying experience if you're grasping and you're trying to maintain ego. But if you actually break through that Phase. It's one of the most beautiful releases that one can have just because all these illusions start to float away. And so for me, it was interesting. It's not often people's first psychedelic, but for me, because I was so scared, to me, like, it was like, oh, if I can have something that works quick and, you know, you're sort of back to normal within 30 minutes. And I was like, okay, I can handle anything for 30 minutes. Except, like I said, time goes away, too. And it's not like you're aware that time is gone. It's like time ceases to exist. And so it ended up being this beautiful experience. And another thing about me, at that time, I would have considered myself atheist. And so I tell people that, like, literally within 20 minutes, I was. I went from being atheist to a devotee of Shiva. I was just like, there is something greater. And some of the thoughts that I had after coming out were like, I've been there before. It's familiar. And it was waiting for me. And so I've been thinking a lot about this. This, the concept of meaning, and how important that is for us to be happy, that we have purpose, that we have a meaning in life. And I think in many ways, our culture right now is suffering from a lack of mean, because just as individuals, we can put these goals in front of us that are really not based in the heart and the soul. It's like society has done that at the societal level. I like to say that psychedelics are making spirituality palatable to the west again. It's helping us bring meaning to a culture which has really been suffering from the lack of it.

Yeah, I think you're right. I mean, I've experienced psychedelics, but never in a therapeutic setting. But I've had some powerful experiences. How do you think it's changed then? Like, if I will at 32 and will at 40 for you? How does that look right now if we look at you?

I mean, I definitely feel like I continue to peel back layers, and, you know, sometimes it's frustrating feeling like, oh, we got somewhere, and then, you know, there's more to work on. But I actually. I mean, spiritually. I mean, we can get into that more deeply if you want, but I think this is why we're here. You know, I think we're here to rediscover ourselves. And it's like, through the illusions, getting through. I think that that's. That's why, you know, we become embodied in human form.

You know, I think that. I think you are absolutely Right. That. That life is about figuring out your purpose and your meaning. What gives you joy, what. What. What doesn't work for you. And I do think it's all there. Like, it's all there when we're born, who we are, but then we put all these other layers on top of it, and then it's sort of like we're peeling it all back to get back to our. Our essence of who we are.

Yeah.

That is the journey.

Beautifully said.

Yeah. So how. I mean, because I'm always talking on the show that I'm a huge fan of therapy. Like, I believe that I will say everybody needs therapy at some point. Like, I think that then you will find why you. You are suffering. It doesn't eradicate it, but you have, like, a deeper meaning and understanding. So the therapy you. Do you often do talk therapy, or is it all like psychedelic therapy?

It's hard to describe because I actually, you know, I had my traditional Western medical training and psychotherapy, but since the psychedelic work, I found a spiritual teacher. God. I had practice and training in breath work and body work and, you know, somatic different somatic therapies. So I don't know what percentage of what I do in the room with a client anymore. Is what I actually learned in any of the institutions that I. Probably 10%, if I had to guess. No, I believe that present in, like, six years, I think it is. So, I mean, it's really about, you know, help people reconnect to themselves and through the resistances around reconnecting, help them bear the pain that's keeping them from that. And it's usually shame or fear or sadness of some sort. And it's like peeling back those layers.

Yeah, peeling back the layers of shame. Getting people. So I want to circle back to something very base level, because not everyone might be wanting to take psychedelics. They'd be like, oh, God, we're not even talking about that. I think it's about. I mean, that's part of it. That's an option. And talk therapy is an option. It's all options. But what about people not actually learning how to feel emotions? Like the act of just being shut down. When you're a kid, you start crying. You know, crying is for, you know, sissies or, you know, if you're a boy, like, man up. And even for me, as a. As a woman, there was no. My house didn't actually show anger. I never saw anyone angry. I never saw anyone really sad. It was just kind of everyone was out for themselves. And so this Whole thing of just. I look at this a lot because I have a lot of listeners who call in. They're just. It's just not clear how to actually feel. We are not given permission to feel. I know that you've talked about how you've learned to get in touch with anger, and I think that we see that more in the masculine, perhaps that anger is sort of a front for a lot of things. But how do you get people to feel things? How to learn to identify feelings.

Yeah. So, I mean, step one is often just getting people to, like. I build a language around emotion, and I like to use six different emotions as, like, the basic ones. And to me, those are anger, sadness, fear, shame, joy, and sexual arousal. And I think about, like, emotions that, like, a child can feel. Right. It's not like jealousy, which is in relation to something else. But those six are basically just like, I can feel them and not have a reason to feel them. And very few people actually know how to identify their emotions, like, when they first come in. Step two is, where are you feeling it? And how do you know you're feeling it? So it's often checking in with, like, is there something in your chest? Notice what's in your body. And there's resistance, but there's also just not awareness. In the very beginning, this took a lot of. This takes a big chunk of time in the very beginning. But it's after we sort of build in a language around emotions is that we end up then being able to, like, work through some of the situations that. Yeah. Will lead to those.

Yeah. Being able to just identify your emotions is something that we're not taught. Right. It's. So I agree that the 6 is sexual arousal. And that's not in a lot of. I've read some books where it's in there, and I think it should be everywhere. Cause I think that we don't learn how to do it. But I remember going to a therapist, and she said. And I went through a lot. I've talked about this on the show, but I had a lot of trauma growing up, and my dad died when I was 19. And I just felt like I. I remember feeling. The only thing I felt was anxiety. And I remember going to a therapist. And she said to me, well, where do you feel that in your body? And I was like, I'm out. She's too sp. I wasn't on my journey yet. I was like, I don't feel any. All I feel is anxiety. Just help me get rid of it. And it wasn't until, like, you know, 20 years of different kinds of therapy that I actually was able to, you know, unpack all of that. And so I guess what I want to say to people, it's a process of learning to identify all of them. And there's so many different modalities now to do it. But you just got to start, because I think that I don't know many people who are naturally who are able to deal with all of these things without a little bit of help.

Definitely I'm glad everyone isn't able to do it naturally, or I'd be broke and looking for work. So. But, you know, I think, you know, one of the things that you touched upon earlier is anger. And for me, that was a big, huge part of my life and a big start to my healing because I think I, like many men, that was my identified emotion for most of my life up until really 30. And, you know, if you ask people that were around me during college, during med school, people I dated, they would be like, will is angry. Will is an asshole. He's a jerk. He's competitive. Which I rarely get called that these days. But it was a therapist that I was working with where he was like, one day, I was just struggling quite a bit and telling him about the conflicts in the relationship that I had. And unlike you, anger was almost a constant, daily thing almost every single day in my family. And so he told me, he's like, will, he's like, you're not getting angry because you're tough. He's like, you're getting angry because you feel weak. And he's like, just like two dogs or two peacocks that are getting ready to fight. You puff yourself up to make yourself feel strong, but underneath all of that is weakness. And that day changed my life completely because I was never able to look at myself in an angry state and feel strong. I was always like, fuck, okay, he's right. Like, I'm feeling really insecure right now. And so the first few years, it was a painful study, but it was just like, what's under the anger? What's under the anger? What's under the anger? And I developed this method where to me, it was clear that three of those other emotions I mentioned are underneath them. Sadness, fear, shame. Sadness, fear, shame. Equal. Weak equal. Not masculine equal. You're not going to reproduce and be attractive. And to give an example, I look at our politics, right? Like, look at. Look at the examples of toxic masculinity. Somehow we tolerate it. We verbalize that. It's not okay, but we tolerate it everywhere. But if Trump or another person cried or he had a nervous breakdown and was like, I'm really scared of Russia, both sides would be like, get the fuck out. Like, that's not acceptable. But anger we tolerate. And so for me, it was just getting underneath every single time, like, for years, just like, why am I angry? Am I sad? Am I scared? Am I ashamed of. And back and forth with all three of those. And eventually just started unrooting more and more and more and more. And then I found the real masculinity under that. Like, the real solidness of just like not really getting shaken or feeling threatened very much at all. I mean, certainly I still get triggered from time to time. I think those are really the main three that get suppressed and lead to anger. Interesting. I think for you, like, I think suppressed joy and suppressed arousal, which are the other. I actually think those are also, when they're suppressed, can lead to anger. I don't actually. I rarely get to that with clients just because there's so much work to do on the other one. But just because of your show, I actually think a lot of people, if they're not able to express sex, also can get angry.

They get angry, it's true. If they're not getting. If they can't express it or they're told to repress it for whatever reason, or someone rejects them, it can also come out of anger. I think you're so right. We're gonna take a break. I'm here with Dr. Will sue and we'll be right back. When I started Sex with Emily, I had no idea what I was doing. I was passionate. Shock, sure. But suddenly I was the host, the producer, the marketer, and the business manager all at once. It was a lot. Honestly, I wish I had Shopify back then because they make building a business so much easier. Shopify is the commerce platform behind millions of businesses around the world, powering 10% of all E commerce in the U.S. think brands like Mattel and Gymshark and so many new creators want to launch your dream store. Shopify gives you hundreds of beautiful templates to make your site shine. No coding needed. Need a little help? Their AI tools write product descriptions, headlines, and even help enhance your product images. And when you're ready to get the word out, Shopify has got built in email and social tools to help you find your people. They're the partner that handles everything from inventory to shipping to returns, so you can focus on your big vision. If you're ready to sell, you're ready for Shopify. Turn your big business idea into. With Shopify on your side, Sign up for your $1 per month trial and start selling today at shopify.com swe that's shopify.com swe. We're talking about how to move through anger and all the emotions to have better communication with your partner, better sex. A lot of us are just stuck in this process and we can help you. So our friend that we spoke of who introduced us, Dr. Jen Fried, is actually on the line to talk. Hi, Dr. Jen. We got all these doctors. What's going on?

Dr. Jen, I love you both so much. And I have a question which is, you know, for men, historically, anger has been seen as powerful. And yes, Will, I agree with you. It's a go to emotion for many men and it substitutes for vulnerable ones. But for women, anger is often suppressed, which leads to low arousal or the denial of energy. And I'm wondering what you think about why women are seen as so unattractive when they own their anger.

Good question.

That's a good question. I mean, I don't know. You guys probably have a better guess, but I would assume it's because we want women to be submissive and behave well and to be kind of dainty and cute. I would imagine so. Yeah. I think of just suppressing emotions in general and the different genders is not a good idea, but I think, yeah, the judgment is in a different frame depending on the gender. For sure.

Yeah.

But what do you think, Emily?

Yeah, no, I think you're right that typically, and I guess why it's so hard these days to be like genders, all men are this and all women are this, which is not true at all. But we can talk about the stereotypes or typically women. Yeah, we're supposed to be seen and not heard and be the perfect partner, the perfect wife. Everything, you know, look great. This goes back to the patriarchy too. Fearing feminine energy, fearing women's in all their emotions. And so I think that we're so skewed the way we actually look at all genders, all emotions. We don't understand any of it. But I think that women aren't supposed to. We're supposed to be pleasant and smile through the pain and we can handle anything. And anger is just. Yeah, scary. I think that an angry woman is terrifying for many people. And that's just because we're not used to it. We don't want it. Then underneath that is that we repress all female sexuality. So I think the years of repression of that, too, is Jen. What do you think, Dr. Jenfried?

Well, I've been thinking a lot about this lately because I'm a very passionate person and sometimes I get angry. And I realize that for me, anger is those lower chakras. It's like the first, second and third chakra. And those also tie into sexual energy. So for women who don't allow or haven't been given permission to have rage or anger even as an emotion, I think a lot of women suffer from reproductive issues and also from repression because they just aren't allowed to be mad or they are rejected.

Yeah, I think you're absolutely right. I think all of this shows up in our body. I can so relate to that. There was never. And I remember my mom even saying in my home, like, oh, I don't do anger. Like, we don't do anger. I've never. I don't think I get any. Oh, God. I have more repressed sexual energy. Shit. Yeah.

Because here's the other thing. Why do we like rough sex? I mean, you know, a lot of women who can't open their mouth and be angry, Will, in the bedroom, act out a lot of domination, submission, and, like, rougher sex, because that's their outlet. But wouldn't it be so crazy good if they could be angry and do that kind of sex or whatever they wanted?

Yes, yes, yes, Jennfried, I would like to see that.

But I have one question for Will, because I.

Okay, that's all I can say. Yes.

Will, as a man that's telling the truth about everything. And I want you to really talk about male insecurities around the penis, because I heard you talk about it before. It was illuminating for me. And I think we don't talk enough about that. You know, we're always looking at women's bodies and the shape of women's bodies. But you've really taught me a lot about the deep insecurities around the penis. So I thought if you could talk about that, that would be.

Yes, we talk about all the time.

See what I've learned.

Jesus, I love this. No, Will, it's true. So many. I always say, you guys are worried more about your penis than women if you're with a man. But yeah, let's talk about your journey to accepting your penis, Will.

Soon. All right. Thanks, Jennifer.

Yeah, thanks, Jennifer.

It's interesting. I think Jennifer's referring. I mean, I had done this, like, this public talk at a GOOP event in San Francisco. And it was funny because it was like a room full of 100 beautiful women. And it was just like, look, we joke about this as a culture. Both men and women do. But, like, what does this actually mean? It means, like, collectively, this is still the thing. And I shared this story when I was in that room with the goop crew, and I was like. I remember when I was like, whatever, it was 12, 13 years old, like, when I first learned about dick size. And I ended up, like, getting my mom's floppy ruler out of the sewing kit, measuring my dick girth and length, and, like, trying to keep an erection the whole time, like, while I'm doing this, like, really horrible thing. And then. And I've never. My guy friends did this. And, like, with my client work, I'm like, every single guy relates to this. Everyone's done it. And still in culture, we're talking about hand size and dick size. And I'm like, yeah, that's sort of funny. But at the same time, the people who are in power in the world, they're also, like, struggling about their insecurity, about their importance. And this is, like, percolating everywhere out into culture. And so it's like, we need to start talking about this, because it's just something that, again, it just doesn't get talked about. And I'm sure it impacts the bedroom, but it's also impacting just culture of just this really insecure masculinity that's out there right now.

Wow. So what did you do, Will? What was this? Can you give us the Cliff Notes? Like, what. How did you get past that? I think a lot of men have measured their penis, I think. Yeah. And they're very insecure. I know that a lot of men worry about it all the time. We hear it every night.

Yeah. And it's like, to me, like. And this is the path back to, like, really, we just mostly just project upon the body. And so it was doing the work over all the other insecurities. Like, one of the things that this brings up, right? Because when I tend to share things about myself, like the story about measuring my dick or, like, getting beaten when I was a kid, I've generally gotten two responses from people after either emails, or they come up and they're like, thank you for being vulnerable, or they would say, thank you for being strong. And I remember depending where I was on the healing journey on that topic, it would resonate. But eventually, after I did the work around those things, they didn't. I'm like, so what if I say I measured my dick size when I was like, 14. And I struggled with that for 10 or 20 years. Why is that vulnerable? If you're a woman and you don't want to date me, thank you. That's actually a favor. Like, no, thanks. Or if you're an employer and you're not and you don't want to give me a job because of that, you're doing me a favor, really. And I feel that now. You know what I mean? And so when I was insecure, though, I did used to worry about those things. And so I like to say it's not really about being strong or vulnerable, because I don't feel those. It's just being authentic. And I think no matter what the insecurity is that we have, we feel it's insecure for a reason. But once we, like, do the healing around it, it's just us. It's just who we are, and we find that it's just, you know, everyone has similar or related insecurities.

We really do.

Not a big deal.

It's not a big deal. So you're saying the power of just stating it, too. Like, that's what we mean by authenticity is just being real. Like, here's. Like, I was. You know, you're only as sick as your secrets and stating things, like the things that. Because the burdens and the secrets and the insecurities we carry on, they weigh on us. They weigh in us. They take it. We can't really shine and get back to that authentic person we were talking about earlier, our essence. And so just stating it, you realize, like, oh, I'm. You feel free. I suppose there's a freedom.

Yeah. And I guess. I mean, I. Again, I had the luck of. I guess, you know, again in my therapy room. Like, this is a thing that all men dealt with. I was very open with friends, and they talk about it, and it was funny. Like, even though this event ate goop again, it was like 100 gorgeous women. And there was one guy in the audience because he was doing some work with them. And he raised his hand after, he's like, thank you so much for saying that. I did the exact same thing with my mom's ruler. And so it was just this. You know, it's always scary in the beginning when I start talking about it publicly, but then I'm just like, no, this is everybody.

This is who it is, everybody that you say the things that you think you can't say. And that is some of the most. The most healing work we could do. So we're talking about being authentic and the Things I think that so many of our listeners, too, and ourselves, we struggle with communication with our partners and asking for what we want because we're so afraid of rejection. We're so afraid of being seen. And that also plays out in relationships, right, Will, that we're keeping all these secrets. We can't authentically be in a real intimate relationship because we're hiding so much. We're trying to show up as our perfect selves. And so ultimately, those relationships are gonna fail as well.

Yeah. And that's the thing. It's beautiful, is like, can we find partners where they can hold this sort of thing? You know? And so with my most recent partners now, I have been as open about my insecurities physically, et cetera, with them. And they've been able. Some of them have been able to hold it meaning, like, they've just been able to, like, oh, like, no big deal. Like, I would share it, but, you know, it always comes with the. With the possibility of being rejected, you know, because I'm someone of the type of. You know, I believe masculinity, femininity is separate than male, female. Right. And I think there is a lot of toxic masculinity. There's male insecurity, but I think members of both genders can play into that. You know what I mean? I remember thinking, there's this meme that goes around the spiritual community of emotionally available and spiritually aware is the new sexy or something. And I remember, like, when I first got it, I'm like, okay, yeah, this is cool. But then at the same time, some women that I've found still, I mean, they'll say that they'll put it up on a meme, but they still are going towards men that are not as open, not as authentic, not as vulnerable. So I think, yeah, there's different things in culture in both genders that continue to support, you know, insecurity in men and in women, you know? And so I think it's. It's just key to select partners and open up to people that can hopefully hold. Hold these insecurities.

Yeah, that's. I mean, that's what we. Yes, you're so right. And I see what you're saying about someone, like, no, I want a man to be a man. I don't want to see you shed your tears. I don't want to see. I don't want to hear that stuff. But then I guess those aren't your people. I always tell people, if someone's not going to be able to hold space for You. And they're not going to want to be an authentic. You know, they're not gonna wanna be and please you and be a wonderful lover. And they don't really care about your needs and desires. To me, that's grounds for dismissal. Like, that is a Less. That is a gift. So not everyone's gonna be for everybody, but I think you all get to decide who you wanna be with. But hopefully it's people who care and who can be vulnerable and be real and be authentic.

Yeah. Yeah. And I think, you know, the thing is, the partners who I have shared and the more I share with women, and especially ones I trust, I. And I've now started hearing from partners and not that they actually think it's a strength, that they actually feel more attracted. And I've actually found that to be the case in my relationships. And so it was also like, again, testing it out and seeing, like, no, this is actually something real. It is something that's felt powerful by some women.

And it also. Because we don't see it as much. Right. The thing is that I think we say we want it, or I want someone who's emotionally available, but maybe if they actually experience it, they're like, oh, that's too much. Or I used to find that I kept saying, like, oh, he's not emotionally available. And then I realized that I wasn't emotionally available. So then I had to do that journey the last 10 years. So it's like, oh, shit, you know, what is it actually like to be that available? But I think that. I don't know. I guess you just know what it's like. If you have real authentic friendships, you want that also in a partner and in a lover. Well, sue, we gotta take a quick break. I'm Dr. Emily. Be right back with more. More sex with Emily. So we're just talking about is the example of being somebody that's not toxic, that's emotionally available, somebody who can. Can be emotive and hold space for you and all these things is something that we don't really see examples of. And we don't. We see a lot of makeups, breakups. We see a lot of drama. We see it being hard. But where do we go to see the actual healthy relationships since we're all still kind of learning how to feel emotions? I don't know how we. Where we. Where we see that. I feel the same way about sex, actually, when people say, okay, Emily, you tell me porn isn't real, but where do I go to see real sex? I'm trying to work on that. I'm like, I gotta make a video series of real sex. But how do you.

I don't know. I think for me, like, one of the things that you bring up is examples, you know, one of the things I think that's happened in Western culture is that we've pulled people away from the collective and family. Right where my family's from, Central America, the family all lived together. So, you know, I don't know. I was thinking about how I have my go to two or three, like male mentors who I can talk to about anything. I've been luckily to find them through the psychedelic community. They've done a lot of their own personal work with or without psychedelics, but they've essentially paid the role of like, uncle or father that I didn't have growing up. And the reason I bring up other countries is that people have kids. But then who's taking care of the kids in these third world countries, like aunt and uncle, grandma, grandpa. There's always a community of like mature adults that is around them. I think in the Western world we have a generation now, a couple of generations of kids that with both parents out of the household, you've got babysitters and essentially immature adults raising these children through their problems. And so I think we're losing the mentorship. And especially with women, we somewhat honor the aging of men, the wise men in Western communities, but we don't do that with women. We don't see them as the wise women that. It's beautiful to have this knowledge and to be able to pass back. It's like, no, you have to be sexy and be like fuckable and all this thing. And that's like the only thing that we honor, you know? And I think so having true male and female mentors and teachers and elders, I think is something that we really miss.

Yeah, I think you're absolutely right. It's funny, I was just having this conversation with someone today. I said, you know, I think the commune lifestyle, or when people say it takes a village, it really does because then you have the parents that you know, the mom. Like, I wish I had a mom that taught me how to cook, a mom that taught me how to organize, a mom that, you know, a dad that taught me, you know, there's so many different skill sets of things. And we are so isolated, you know, we are living in our homes and we're only driving in our cars and we don't have that community anymore. Definitely not in America. And I think you're we need that. So, Will, let's talk about your, like, finding a mentor. Because we talk a lot this too, about men having those. Finding those guys. I always say, be that guy in your group or find men, groups of men that you can share that experience with. Like, how do we. Are there places guys can go? Like, do you know any? Like, how do you find that? How do men start?

I know there appears to be, at least, again, I'll call it spiritual community, the psychedelic community, because there is like, sort of, you know, the Burning man groups and that sort of thing. There is more movements, things. Like there's one called the Men's Project, but there's more of these. Like, you know, let's get close to our emotions and let's talk about it. So there are people doing this now, I think. And so definitely, at least, you know, compared to 10 years when I was first going through this. But for me, it was also, you know, we talked about therapy and how important therapy is to both of us. But it's interesting because, you know, I also think about therapy as how it was a created need, right? We've only had psychotherapy since really, the early 19th century, right? And it's like, so we created this need about being able to be authentic and not judged and have someone that's curious and that, you know, isn't going to get angry at us. But it's like we essentially created this entire industry because we weren't able to be just authentic with each other, you know? So I actually think it's really just about, you know, picking and choosing, like, who in my current community can I. Can I express myself to? And if I can't do that, like, let's. Let's find some new community members, you know, because whether it's like paying tons of money to go to Ayahuasca somewhere or spending hundreds and hundreds of dollars to do therapy, but if we can just be authentic and just find, yeah, just a handful of people in the.

Beginning, I think that that's such a great step. Is it finding a few people that you can do it too? Because I think people are like, oh, yeah, right, I'm gonna show up at work or tell all my friends who I authentically am, I'll be rejected. And the truth is, that could happen. But I always say, like, you gotta start now. Like, then they're not your people. You keep finding, even you just have one person, right? Because I don't think many people inside aren't ready for the truth. They aren't ready for the authenticity But I think we have to start somewhere.

And it is hard right in the beginning, you know, I mean, it is, you know, I say a handful of people, but when I first started this journey, I didn't have that, you know, so it is scary. You're. The other thing that we were talking about, partners, is that, you know, when I started getting more comfortable with partners, I started then just, like, almost like, emotionally diarrhea. Ing on some of them where they could hold some stuff. But then, like, my unconscious psyche was like, oh, can you handle this? Can you hold this? Can you hold this? I found that it was overwhelming for the person I was dating at that particular time. And so I now do believe in, like, spreading the emotional love more. Okay. So, like, you know, this might be a little bit edgier. I tried to bring this up, and this is difficult. I'll hold this for my therapist or, you know, this was too much for my partner, so I'm gonna hold this for my friends. I'm gonna wait till later. So I think spreading out, like. Yeah. Where the authenticity.

You're so right. And this goes back to too. Talking about getting a community or having a culture is that having one person. We put so much pressure in our society that it has to be your partner has to be everything. They have to be your emotional support. They have to be your problem solver. They have to be your best friend. And it doesn't have to be that way either. Your partner doesn't, you know, that we.

Put a lot of emphasis on that. I realized that in just my last couple of relationships, because I. You know, again, you can tell by that, by the way I am. I mean, I am comfortable talking about everything. But I also realized. Yeah. That I can't expect any single person to hold all that for me except my therapist. I pay him, so he.

Exactly, exactly. But I still think. Yeah, exactly. We'll start somewhere with therapy. You know, I believe that we all. We all kind of need that. Right. Well, I can't believe that your patients, you said less than 5% of them are talking to you about sex. Are they talking about relationships? But they're not talking about sex.

Everyone is talking about relationships. That I would say is definitely the 98%. You know what I mean? Everyone is talking about feeling lonely, not feeling connected, whether they're single or in relationships or have kids. Everyone is talking about and feeling disconnected. But, yeah, sex is not one of the things that's talked about often.

Do you ever ask them, do you ever say, so what's your sex Life.

Like, I rarely do unless there's a. There's a reason for it. Actually, now that I'm. We're talking about it, I actually don't know if it's wrong that people are talking about sex, because, like, you know, as we were talking, I feel that, you know, again, sex ends up being really, a lot of it ends up being where we project all of these insecurities, is that if we end up working on the insecurities in other realms, that the sex life comes together. And I think that's what it's been for my experience for me and for my clients, where, like, my sexual experiences have only gotten more pleasurable and connected. But it was not through talking about sex that much with my therapist.

Yeah, no, I think that that's a really good point. I hadn't thought about it that way, that once you. You clear, like, what are my insecurities that I'm bringing into the bedroom? What are they bringing to the relationship? Maybe I've had trauma growing up. Maybe something. I had sexual assault. Something happened. You're bringing all of that into the bedroom, so being able to unpack it, you'll show up more free.

Yeah. It's by proxy. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely.

Yes. That makes so much sense. I hadn't.

Because I actually, when you think about it, like, I always have this. Like this. The saying where I'm like, I learned that I was poor. I learned that I had a small dick. Right. If we want to keep. Like I learned, these are all stories that I told myself that came from the outside. So if we peel back the stories in the other direction, the rest of it'll go away.

We have to ask you the five questions, the quickie questions we ask all of our guests, and we'll just have to have you come back to dive in. More to this. But the questions, Will sue, are what is your biggest turn on?

I'm going to actually. Maybe I'm not cheating. I'm going to say authenticity.

Okay. What's your biggest turn off?

Oh, God. Anger. Yeah. It's even a weird turn off. Anger is my biggest turn off.

What makes good sex?

Authentic communication.

Something you would tell your younger self about sex and relationships.

It's all gonna work out.

Number one sex tip.

Yeah. Just. Just do whatever work to be comfortable and be free with yourself.

I like that. So good. Will, thank you so much for being here. Dr. Will sue, check him out. It was so good to talk to you, Will. And we'll stay connected. I appreciate all your help.

Yeah.

Thank you. All right.

Have a good night.

That's it for today's episode. Thank you so much for listening to Sex with Emily. And if you love the show, please, like, subscribe and leave a review wherever you get your podcasts. And hey, share this with a friend or a partner. It might just spark something. It usually does. You can find me on Instagram, TikTok, YouTube, Facebook, and X. It's all at Sex with Emily. Oh, and I been told I give really good email. So sign up at sex with emily.com for free guides and articles and more ways to prioritize your pleasure.