https://www.listennotes.com/e/5949fefd09e140c5886e033adcc2fac4

Skin care you sip? Here's why I'm hooked. A few months ago, I started sipping Peak's Radiant Skin Duo. And wow, my skin looked brighter, clearer, more hydrated. That glow? Unreal. And get this, I didn't change a single product on my shelf. Just added two sachets, and the results showed up on my face. Sun Goddess Matcha is ceremonial grade, packed with antioxidants that help firm, brighten, and support clear skin. And yes, it supports gut health too, which is so tied to how your skin looks. It's even quadruple toxin screened. Then there's Beety Fountain, my daily hydration go-to. It smooths fine lines, deeply hydrates, and gives you that plump skin glow with zero sugar or weird additives. I drink matcha in the morning, BT in the afternoon, easy, effective, and it works from the inside out. And for a limited time for Sex with Emily listeners, Peak is offering 20% off the Radiant Skin Duo, plus a free starter kit. including a rechargeable frother and glass beaker when you shop. Visit peaklife.com slash Dr. Emily and use code EMILY20 here's to healthy glowing skin from within. Let's be real, even with amazing chemistry, sometimes you just want that little extra spark. And that is why I've been loving high love from Viia. I've been telling you about them for a long time now. Oh, that's spelled V-I-I-A. It's a hemp based gummy and that's all about heightening pleasure, enhancing intimacy and helping you fully drop into the moment. I've used high love so many times I give it out at parties. I bring it everywhere because it's really just about feeling better in your body and also connecting with other people. I have to tell you, it delivers all the time. Whether I'm with a partner or just having a connected night with myself, I feel it in my body. You just feel open, I feel more relaxed. All those thoughts of the day just melt away. It's kind of like my senses just light up. I breathe deeper, I feel better, and everything just flows. So what's in it? Well, it's a beautiful blend of organic hemp and time tested aphrodisiac herbs like macaroot, damiana, horny goat weed. So originally it was a limited Valentine's Day release, but it was so popular they made it permanent. Everything's lab tested, made in the US and shipped discreetly. No medical card needed. Just Good Vibes, great ingredients and a whole new level of pleasure. If you're 21 and over, try Viya for 15 off and get a free gift with your first order. Just go to Viya.co slash Emily. That's V-I-A-A. viya.co/emily and just use code EMILY for 15% off and a free gift with your first order. That's viya.co/emily, use code EMILY. If I said to you, I've slept with 16 people and I'm dating a guy, let's say all he can think about now is 16 dicks in the room with him that I have been with and that he's looking at you, he just sees dicks now behind my head, 16 dicks in the room. Like you can't get that out of your head and then you make a judgment around it. Is there such a thing as too many partners or not enough? Why do we even call it body count and where does that term come from? And more importantly, why does this one little number stir up so much jealousy, insecurity, judgment, and even shame? In this episode of Sex with Emily, we're unpacking all of it, the history, the double standards, and the emotional baggage that still clings to our sexual past. We'll look at how purity culture still shows up in our group chats, why women are judged for the same things men are praised for, and whether your number actually matters when it comes to love, intimacy, and long-term compatibility. So whether you're with two people, 20, or you've completely lost count, this conversation isn't about judging your past. It's about owning it and figuring out what really matters for the kind of connection you want now. so let's get into it. Joining me today is Dr. Scott Lyons. He's a licensed holistic psychologist, a body-based trauma expert, and the author of Addicted to Drama. He's helped over half a million people worldwide break free from stress, trauma, and drama with his signature somatic approach. He's also the founder of the Embodi Lab, truly the go-to platform for learning body-based therapies. And if you want to go deeper, use code Sex with Emily for a discount on any program at the Embodi Lab. Let's get into body count, okay? When you first hear body count, you might think like how many people died in this certain battle or this war? Like what was the body count, right? Yeah. Who, like if you hear about like a hurricane or a volcano, like something like that.

What was the body count?

What was the body count? Like who died? Yeah. so do you know what's happened in recent years? When people are talking about the number of sexual partners have, they're like, what's your body count? Which automatically pisses me off 'cause it's like, how many people have you slayed? And like, it's not a good number, the higher the number is, you've slayed a bunch of body count. Like it just, first of all, it's not sexy. And we're using it to define people's, to define people's sexual experience. And I just loathe that a lot of the generations are like, so what's your body count? It's like the first question they have on the date, rather on a date, rather than like, which is also bad, how many people have you slept with? That's how we used to say back in the day, but body count.

What's your number?

What's your number? Yeah. But body count is already like, like makes it feel like this negative thing, like how many people have you slayed?

How many people have you conquered?

Yeah, yeah, conquered. I just don't love it at all. No. No, and it upsets me because the reason same reason why the conversation has always really irked me, because I've seen so much pain and suffering from couples from people dating who are like, My partner asked me what my number was and I told them and now, like, for example, if I said to you, I've slept with 16 people and I'm dating a guy, let's say all he can think about now is 16 dicks in the room with him that I have been with and that he's looking at you, he just sees dicks now behind my head, 16 dicks in the room. Like, you can't get that out of your head. And then you make a judgment around it.

I don't know, I think it's hot, but I do know what you mean. He's gonna make a judgment about it.

Yeah, he's like, oh, she's been with 16, and I wonder how big they were, and are they bigger than me? And I'm automatically, when I answer that question, gonna make a judgment. It means that you're slutty, it means that you've been with so many, it means that mine isn't big enough, it means that you've done, so I always think it's fraught, this conversation, and I'm just gonna pull some gender things here that typically if a woman has a higher number, There is judgment. Oh, she's been around too much. She's a little bit slutty. She's all these things. And then for a guy too, you're like, oh, he's kind of a player. He's with all these women. And then we also reverse it. And then we feel insecure. We judge somebody if they haven't had as many partners. And in every single time in a relationship, I just see this becoming a problem. And I don't think we need to have this conversation. It doesn't even really tell you anything. Because you're making assumptions that if someone has stuff with a lot of people that it means they're a great lover. If they haven't, it means that they're maybe not as experienced. And I don't know, I've just been with a lot of people who have like slept with a lot of women and I'm telling you they were not the best lovers. They were the guys who were like, I went around, pound away a bunch of women like jackhammer. And I've done it a lot, but that doesn't mean just because you've like tasted a lot of different kinds of foods doesn't mean that you're like a chef. Like, just because you banged away and you've released your semen into a lot of different orifices, doesn't mean that makes you a thoughtful, careful lover who is attentive to someone's needs and pays attention and knows how to please. It means I know how to get myself off in any orifice. And I've done it many, many times, so I've got a huge body count. Does it mean you're a good lover in bed? No. Not necessarily. So the whole thing, I think, should be just thrown out the window. And then they had to start calling it body count, which makes it dark.

Super dark. I mean, that comes from a military background, right?

Yeah.

As we talked about, how many people have you destroyed? And somehow we're evolving that into how many people have you conquered? How many people have you, you know, yeah.

It's so negative.

It's awful.

All the things about sex that makes it really feel like, oh, body count. I'm gonna fuck the shit out of her. Like all the shit people say that's really negative and death like...

I love your voice and you're like, I'm gonna fuck the shit out of her. I don't know where that voice keeps coming from, but I want more of it. I don't like, but I know you are, and I think it's rightfully so, but I don't think most people know where that term comes from. Like when my niece talked to me about the term body count, I don't think she understands that it comes from like that military background of severe violence.

Yeah.

And just even like, clarifying where it comes from can start to give us a little sense of like, whoa, maybe we should find some other terminology if that's even an important question.

I don't think it's an important question. Let me tell you some of these questions that came in from our listeners that are just like, this is just a little potpourri of all the problems that happen, ready? This is from Nina 26 in Seattle. My partner has been with over 20 people and I've only been with one. I trust him, but I can't help comparing myself or feeling like I'm behind. Is that insecurity normal or is it something deeper I need to work on? work through. I hear this all the time. So now they had that conversations, which I do not think you need to have. And all she can think is, he's been with 20. I've only been with one. I'm gonna show up and he's gonna. He's gonna see that I've only been with one person and I'm gonna be like a deer in headlights and he's gonna judge me. And this is already automatically doomed. Yeah. And I don't think that we should be measuring our sexual skill set or prowess. on some arbitrary number that just doesn't really say anything about how you are as a sexual being. You know, Nina could be really present. She could be really in tune with her body. She could be really embodied and be really paying attention to partner's needs. And it can make her a fantastic lover. But now she's going in with some fear and anxiety, worrying that already, before she's naked, she's worried that she's not gonna match up to what he's expecting, and he's probably as happy to be having sex with her. He's not judging her at all. So that's just one of them. Let me just give you the lay of the land.

Give me the lay.

This is another really common one. This is from Jordan34 in Los Angeles. Every time I start dating someone, I panic about when the body part conversation is gonna come up. I've been with a lot of people. Does that automatically make people think I'm not relationship material? So here's a guy on the opposite side of it saying, I don't want women to think I'm like just a player because I've slept with so many people, right? Then we've got Ally in Brooklyn who says, I've only slept with two people and both times I felt judged about not being experienced enough. It's like no matter what your number is, people find a way to shame you. And then you just like shut it down. How does that like history help? Like more mystery, less history. I've not, this does not go well for anybody. That's just a few of them. Yeah. But there is a gay community question here, and I want to know what you think about this. This is from Tariq, he's 31 in Toronto. I'm gay and I've had a pretty active sex life, but now I'm dating someone more traditional. He keeps saying things like, you,'ve done everything already. And I'm starting to feel ashamed of my own experience, even though I never did before. So anyway, do you see all these things based on a number which think about it. Like, I've eaten out in so many restaurants in my life. I'm gonna use another restaurant analogy.

I've probably been to- I also love.

That you said you've eaten out. Yeah, yeah. I've eaten out and I've eaten out. But like, I don't think of myself as an expert. Like, I've had many, many meals.

Yeah. Let's say I've been to Italian restaurants.

You're not an Italian aficionado. No, I'm not an aficionado. I don't remember the pasta from this run and that one. I don't think that I'm particularly a great order. I wouldn't want you to be like, Emily, you ordered the pasta tonight. 'Cause when I'm eating, I'm present, whatever. I just think sex is the same way. It's not the kind of thing, like, just 'cause you've eaten a lot of different... Ravioli.

Ravioli.

Ravioli. Ravioli. You've slurped a lot of noodles. Does it say anything about your sexual prowess? Yeah.

Anyway, what do you think about all this? I mean, I think, again, like, I'm someone who loves to know where did something come from? Okay. What's the history of it? And I think that, like, illuminates so much, so we stopped doing it, because some of the history of it, like, dates way, way, way, way, way back before like the 20th century where we're like talking about body count. Like the value of a woman, literally the financial value of a woman was based on how many people on her sexual activity. So a virgin is worth more. And, you know, in religion, it's also about like a woman, it's always like, you know, about control here. It's about, and often in many religions, it's not just one religion, It was about that they have more higher morality, which was like a value that was really shined upon in religion. And I think that's really important to know is like these sources for controlling our bodies, specifically women's bodies.

Female sexuality.

Female sexuality.

A modality if she did fewer partners. Yeah. And that it was like, it says that women's virginity and sexual purity we're closely monitored to control her inheritance, her lineage, and her family honor. So that's why we used to have all these virginity tests that were like fake and like if women, because we, you were partners, a woman had the more high value she was.

We're talking about transgenerational shame here.

Yes.

That is like so, I mean it's all made up. And I think that's so important to know is like the idea of body count, the shame around body count, even the cheering of body count, it's all made up. Like, it's constructed out of histories of the different ways that we have controlled people's bodies, specifically women's bodies. And so, like, hopefully as you're listening to this and you're going, okay, well, I maybe have had that body count, you know, conversation in the past and you're hearing where its origins come from, maybe there's less desire to have the.

Conversation just based on the origins of it. Yeah, I think so, too. Just knowing that it's like this military term that it means, like, the number of enemy casualties. It's already setting up sex for, like, Like, it's a negative thing if you've had too many counted too many bodies.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's violent. And that goes into sex as violence, as opposed to sex as intimacy, sex as an opportunity to really connect with people more deeply.

Yeah. It's just a loaded concept with so much ego and shame around it.

So much shame.

And I don't-- but it comes up again, and I think it's a-- no one's asked me in years how you sub with. Yeah. But they used to...

I'm going to be really honest and transparent. When you read the first persons and they said they had 20 partners... You judged them. What'd you say?

You judged them.

I had a visceral response in my body where I tightened up. And I was like, Whoa, that's so important to know. I wouldn't cognitively shame that person. I wouldn't be like, But my body responded viscerally And that's important to recognize too, is when someone is talking about their sex life, whether it's one person or 20 people, it's important to register like the subtle cues in our body because that actually is really, it's going to be expressed, right?

Yes, that's a somatics part of it, is that because you're so attuned with the work that you do, you automatically notice that your body was reacting. So many of it just override that and they're like, just get angry or just have a judgment.

And it comes out in different ways, like the behavior of that trigger comes out in so many different ways. Like we start judging them for how clean they are in the kitchen or in the bedroom or, you know, something else. It comes out and manifests in all these different inappropriate ways.

Right. No, I love that you said that because automatically your body tends up, maybe you didn't feel safe or didn't feel like it felt like a judgment or this person, could this person be someone, you know? Yeah.

And I think that the, that's an important distinction is like, Okay, if, you know, where does our visceral responses are, you know, to someone's body count come from? And often it's our own shame, often it's our own sense of needing control, right? And these things- and our insecurities. And our own insecurities, yeah.

Right? And our jealousy. Yeah. So it's all of those things.

When was the last time you had a conversation with a partner about body count? Oh my God, it's been- Or let's change the language.

Know about like, what's your number?

What's your number?

Yeah. I mean, my first time having the conversation, I remember being like in my late 20, early 20s, I was backpacking through Europe with my best friend from college, and we were like, Junior or we just graduated. We were seniors, and we were talking about the guys we slept with, and we really were focusing on keeping our number low. So we're like, how many have you slept with? Because it felt, I remember it being like, I was like, oh, I slept with that. I said, well, I didn't really sleep with him, so it doesn't count. I remember it was so important to me to keep it to like four. And so at that time, 30 years ago, to keep that number low was really important. So the first time was like, I said, well, I'm never really gonna tell the real number or whatever. And then, 'cause it felt like I knew as a woman I was gonna be judged if my number got out. So we kept saying, well, that didn't count, or that didn't really count, or I didn't know his name, so it didn't count her. Or he didn't ejaculate, it didn't count. So that was the first time. But then I think after that, I'm trying to think about the last time, because the older you get, people don't, I don't know, at least in my life, I'm like, I've been single. I've been having a very prolific dating life for most of my life. So it's my job to have sex. So I don't really judge. I don't really count. But you know what they say about men? They say that men, and this is in heteronormative relationships, maybe some people in the room can confirm this, that men, they split their number in half and they add 10. They lie.

They lie.

They say, they're like, they know they separate the 100, so they split it in half or they minus 10, or they do something, there's some formula.

Yeah.

Because nobody really wants to be that honest about it. But yeah, I feel like, well, especially now doing what I do, sex with Emily, I'm sure there's already a judgment around it, but I'm trying to remember if it's ever been a problem, but yeah, no, I just kind of lost count after a while.

Do you wish you would have kept like a journal?

I wish I had a sex journal.

Like a vajournal?

A vajournal? Of all the travels of my vagina on the road. I really wish I did. And I could just be like, this happened and that happened. And we went here. We met all these fun little penises and or big penises and fun people adventures. I sometimes wish I do. I have a lot of great memories. I have a lot of great friends if I go back on my photographs. But yeah, sometimes I wish I tracked my sexual experiences more closely.

What do you think you would get out of that?

I think the evolution of like, I'm really into this 20 years of doing this particular work of focusing on sex that I think to be able to have like this beautiful tapestry of all the lovers and all the experiences would be beautiful. And I probably could compile things together using emails and texts and photographs. So maybe one day I'll just lock myself in my house and do that journey because I have so much information. Like a quilt? Like a quilt. Oh my God, like a sex quilt. A sex quilt.

Of all my lovers.

It'd be like Monica Lewinsky in the blue dress, but I might have like some condoms or some weird things or some phone numbers or cards, but I do have some great, I've had some great lovers and experiences and I want people to, and I don't feel any shame about any of it. So the other night my partner and I were curled up on the couch, phones out, but instead of scrolling mindlessly, we were actually laughing and having one of the most honest conversations we've had in weeks. Why? Because of this cool app we've been using called Paired. And I'll take anything that just takes five minutes a day to strengthen my relationship. You both download the app, you pair together, and it gives you these really fun and meaningful daily questions and quizzes and games, and you can't see your partner's answer until you answer yourself. So it really creates this really fun give and take. It's a safe, honest space for connection. So one question we got asked recently was, what makes you feel lucky in this relationship? And I just felt so good. Like, I'm not gonna lie, hearing his answer just melted me. I didn't know that. I mean, I knew if I was lucky. Whether you're in for just a few dates, you've been together a long time, find the time to connect with your partner and nourish the relationship. Head to paired.com/sw to get a seven day free trial and 25% off if you sign up for a subscription. That's P-A-I-R-E-D.com/sw to sign up today.

And I think this is an important distinction between like really being able to reminisce about the lovers we've had and the experiences we've had. versus what's the numbers you've had?

Yeah, right. How were those?

But I would ask a partner that. And I think like instead of saying to a partner, what's your number or what's your body count, I might say like, what are your favorite, what are your most fond memories of sex in your life? Yes.

What are your favorite turn-ons? What are the most, what is an important pillar of incredible sex for you? What does great sex look like for you? Because think about it. This is literally the question that everyone's asking is, what's your body count? 'Cause they think it's gonna tell 'em something. And we're all telling you all, it's not gonna tell you anything interesting. So, so wise, Scott, to say another conversation is, tell me about your turn-ons. Tell me about what meaningful sex has looked like for you. What kind of sex do you wanna have in the future? That's gonna get us somewhere. That's gonna get us more pleasure, more suitable partners, more orgasms, because the conversation about the body count just gets negative ugly, mostly. You get insecure, you get jealous, you judge yourself. Like it's genuine, like how much better of a genuine curiosity about are we compatible? And by having more thoughtful questions would allow us to, maybe we should do another thing. I have so many ideas. Something they could download from SmartSSX app or something from our community that's like, instead of the body count conversation, have this conversation instead. Yeah.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Have you had that conversation with partners of like asking them about their history with sex?

Yes.

You have. And in a way that was felt really successful?

Yeah, like definitely in recent years. It's like, tell me about what's been some turn-ons or what's worked for you in relationships, what hasn't worked for you. How do you like to be approached for sex? When are you the most, that's the whole sexual intelligence thing. That's my five pillars of sexual IQ is really knowing, what are your turn-ons? What aren't your turn-ons? What are your non-negotiables? What are your fantasies? What are the things that you like? What don't you like? Giving people permission to really decode it.

But I think there's a big difference between saying that and saying it in context of the actual experience. If you were to ask me what my turn-ons are, and I'm like, My turn-ons are like really sweet eye contact while we're making love, like you're doing with me now. And versus like, yeah, I had this partner years ago and the way that he looked at me or the way that she looked at me and said my name during sex. So I'm getting more specific about the partner itself. And that tends to bring up the feelings, the sensations, the sometimes the judgments or the you know, we turn it in on ourself, which is called like retroflexion.

Right? I love that.

And so like, have you done that where it's like you've talked about your kinks, but actually in reference to past partners and should we not?

I don't think we should name names.

Okay.

I don't think we should make with my ex. I think we should make my experience. And this is why people have- I love that.

I love that.

Because this is the part about doing like the work that I talk about in Smart Sex, the pillars of the work is like, really getting clear on, like, what I've learned in my sexual history is, like, when I have a partner who stares into my eyes, that was a really meaningful time for me because it made me realize that the second we look into each other's eyes, I felt safe in my body. I was able to sink in. And so I found that a few minutes of, like, breath work and eye gazing gets me turned on. What about you? Like, I wish we could just, like, talk about it that way, because what happens is, and what we're conditioned to is, Like, if you just said to me, well, my ex, I'd be like.

Who is his ex?

What's his name?

I'd go online.

You're on Instagram. I'm on Instagram. You befriended them. He's hotter than me, like whatever. And so when you take the names out of it, but you're just giving valuable information, that's just so much better. 'Cause we all have the tendency to.

Be like, who's my competition? Who's the ex?

Who's the... It goes there so quickly. That's what I wanna switch. I know.

Why don't we, like, how... I don't know. This is what I'm trying to change. And I just wanna normalize it. So again, if you're listening, you've had that experience, they've talked about their exes in with some detail, and you've kind of gone in and created the narrative and the story in your head about it, even visualized about it, like you said in the beginning, like all those dicks roaming around in your head. As you're comparing, it's a normal thing. That's what we do as humans. But the trick of it is to pull yourself back to the present moment. So I'm visualizing all the people they've ever been with or that and I start to find myself comparing, comparing to despair. And the thing to do, you just did it, take a breath, like tap on your body, like put your fingers and tap on your knees, bring yourself back to the sensation of the present moment and go, whatever happened then is not now and come back to the present moment so you can be with your partner now. If you're in their history, you're not with them in the present.

That's really what we want. We really want to be with them now. You're fucking right. I guess the highlight of this is like tell you that, like, I think we're asking these questions because they're the only ones, they're the most common ones, and we think they're getting us somewhere by understanding how people you sleep with. But the truth is they don't really get us anywhere. So we're trying to give you some information that could actually move the needle in having the sex life that you actually really want, rather than these questions that sort of blow it apart and could send you on a path of.

Destruction.

Destruction, for sure. And also it says 44% of women have felt shame about their body count. One in three people say they'd be concerned of a partner at 10 or more partners. Men with high body counts are experienced. Women with high body counts are promiscuous. We know that, so why don't we just fucking stop talking about it? We already know that that's what's gonna happen. So I would love to just, again, invite people to like, you don't have to answer the question.

Redirect it.

Redirect the fucking conversation. Redirect the sex that you're having in the moment. That's what I like to do.

Yeah. And you can get to know so much about your partner. Like one of our basic needs, like one of my basic needs in a friendship and a romantic relationship is that I feel like I'm known, right? Ugh, that feels good. And I don't need to be known to how many people I've slept with, what I could be known about is like, what has brought me pleasure? What has brought me discomfort? What has been my history in trying to come more into deeper, better sex? But it doesn't have to be the fucking number.

No, forget the number. Forget the number and ditch the number, but lean into Really what pleasure, like what actually feels good to you so you can communicate that with the partner.

Lean into what you've learned without having to talk about the details. I got that from you today. Yeah.

And that's really helpful.

Like I'm an oversharer. I will retract the details. Thank you.

Good.

And like give you the golden nugget of what you can do from what I've learned to give me pleasure.

That's all they really want. Yeah. They don't really want to know. Nobody wants to know. No, they want to know like, One time I learned, like, and you could even use this to your advantage. Like, God, like the hottest sex I have was when this guy really made me feel seen because he came over and he remembered that I liked Kin soda from Aerowave and brought me my favorite chicken. And then he asked about my day and made me feel seen. And then I felt so aroused and turned on that he remembered me.

Like, I just got wet with that story alone.

The aeronautical part.

Yeah, and the chicken. And asking me how my day is.

But like that to me is gonna, then you'll be like, oh, okay, I.

Guess I better do that stuff. Can we go back to like Nina's questions and like get, like, let's help them. Let's help them.

Okay. Let's help them. So this is Nina 26 in Seattle. My partner has been with over 20 people and I've only been with one. I trust him, but I can't help comparing myself or feeling like I'm behind. Is that insecurity normal or is it something deeper I need? to work through.

Both.

Okay.

Both. Like insecurity, I mean, it's helpful to know where does the insecurity come from? Like, is it that he might leave me? Is it that I'm not good enough? Like, unpack what is the belief? What is the thought underneath the feeling of insecurity?

Right.

And it's normal for us to feel some type when we feel like someone has more experience. Like if I went to, I don't know, work at a corporate bank, I'm gonna be a little insecure. They know more than me about banking, right?

Right.

And so either there's a projection that they know more or they have had more experience and know more.

Yeah.

And it's okay to say like, I don't know, in that moment I might go invite them to ask their partner, like what have you learned? And so you each share what you've learned.

Yeah.

And that's to break apart the insecurity and turn it around.

Yeah, I'm totally with you. I think Nina's got to say, Hey, babe, I'm loving our relationship. I'm so excited to, like, for our sex life and to grow. And you know that I've only been with one person. Yeah. And I know you've been with 20 people, and I just want to call it that I got some, I got some insecurities around that. It makes you feel a little bit like, oh, you've all these expectations from me. Um, and I just want to be really present to you and see how we could be really great lovers to each other. And I just want to call it. And I think there's something to just saying that. And his response could be like, oh my God, I'm so attracted to you. We're gonna learn this together. It'll be amazing. That might put her mind at ease. Rather than thinking when she shows up, she just has to perform. Like that's the kind of stuff I would just call. 'Cause I don't think there's something, she says, Is my insecurity normal? Completely. Totally. Is it something deeper I need to work through? Yeah. Yeah. But work it, bring him into it. Yeah. If he's your partner, bring him into it and say, this makes me feel weird. I feel weird. Like, I mean, this is so common. Like, I feel like even my ex, like, had been married for 20 years. I'm like, I haven't been married for 20 years. Yeah. You know more, I thought he knew more about relationships than I did. Like, I don't know. I just think you got to always just be like, this thing gives me pause, and I want talk about it. So I think if she feels seen by him and he's like, oh, babe, no, I just, I'm gonna be present and focused on our sex life. I'm not thinking about the past and I just want to know what makes you feel good. And I promise to be a great communicator about what I need. Because I don't think that great sex is necessarily about the frequency of time you've had sex.

Yeah.

That's gonna make you a better lover.

Yeah. And I think there's something you're naming so clearly, which is when we're feeling insecure, we want to know that someone can catch us or receive us. And so like, if I'm even sharing, Hey, Em, sometimes I feel insecure about talking about sex because you're such an expert and you might say to me, no, no, Scott, you're good. You know enough. That's not necessarily even catching me, right? It's like, Babe, tell me more. Or like, I got you. Do you just want to hug? Do you want to talk about it more? Do you want me to ask questions? Do you want me to, like, what do you need in relation to this? And it's most often that I'm being heard, that you're there for me, so that I can just even talk about it. It's not necessarily that you give me an opposite of what my fear is or my concern is.

I get it. So for this case, maybe what she would want her partner to say, Nina, if she said to him, I'm feeling like I'm a little behind, she might want him to say to her, that's okay. Like, I've got you.

I'm not-- I'm here with you in that sense of feeling behind. What can we do together? Hot, hot.

So, but here's the problem, and here's one of the big things, is that there's always, I've found, there's always people, and it's so interesting, because we co-create a sex life together. Every person you're with, you're creating a sex life together. It doesn't, that's the thing, it doesn't matter who you've been with in the past, the sex with your past person will never be like the sex with your current person because it's the two of you coming together. So if they're coming together to co-create, that stuff is all in the past. So what can we do together to become great lovers to each other? So let's just have an open dialogue to create this, forget about the past. What do you need now? What can we do to make each other feel safe?

Yeah, and I would ask her, what is your expectation that he has in relation to that 20 people, that he knows a lot more, that he knows his way around the body more. Like, what is your preconceived expectations of what is different between the one and the 20? And that's important for us to unpack because if she were to say, well, I just think he probably knows more techniques than I do, then that's something to really You know, you can go read Emily's book or like learn techniques or ask him, like, what did you learn?

Exactly. Like, she could say, my thing is that I have this idea. My belief is that in these 20 times you've learned all these moves. And he might be like, actually, I did a lot of missionary. And it was pretty interesting, but they weren't all so great. But the connection I feel with you is really hot, and I can't wait to Explore more things with you. Yeah. And then you just call it.

Yeah. And I'm gonna say, okay, I don't know how many lovers I've had, but I have learned things. Like I've learned certain techniques or things I've gotten to experiment with on past partners. And I might say I have learned things and I get to bring them forward to you in a collection of different things that I've learned and how I'm so excited to be able to offer you and be with you in the things that I've gotten a chance to experiment with, but never, never in the same way I get to do with you.

Yeah, yeah. That's a beautiful way to say it. Because I also think, like, when we're with somebody new, we get to, like, yeah, maybe you have more modalities to choose from because you've had more experience. But with every single person, it's like, I don't know, you just, you are all showing up as, with different needs and different desires and. I don't know. Again, you get to create it together.

Yeah. I mean, this is a good reframe of like, someone having multiple partners is an opportunity.

Yes, exactly. It's an opportunity and could actually really be a place to learn. Like, I love, like if you're hiring someone for a job to do, you're like, oh, I love that you've worked in so many other companies. Like, what kind of wisdom can you bring that's gonna help this business?

Exactly.

So it's kind of the same thing with sex. Like, how could we reframe this? Like, I love that you've had so many lovers and I haven't.

Show me what's up.

Show me what's up. Yeah. Yeah. So I just think that we, again, because of this system we live in, we tend to judge it. And it's really if we just flip.

It of how could it give me more pleasure and give you more pleasure. And these are the moments again to pull back the history and go, of course there'd be shame here. Yeah. It's been passed on from generations. from various like religious organizations, from historic cultures.

Yes.

And to be like, I don't need to fucking carry that with me.

Yeah, exactly. Because that's, it's really what it's based on is a patriarchal view of female sexuality and trying to control it. Oh wow, there's so many other more questions in here that we didn't get to. Let's see. Wow. I mean, there's so many. Wow, this is a really big issue right now. So we've got, Chris in 27 in Denver says, I told my friends I didn't care about my boyfriend's body count, but when he told me it was over 50, I froze. Now I don't know if I'm being.

Judgmental or if I'm just not ready. Okay, first of all, don't judge your freeze, right? That's already putting shame on top of- you- trauma response.

A trauma response.

Talk about freeze, yeah. Freeze is, could you explain that, Scott? Freeze, okay. Without getting into too many details around how the physiology of trauma works, but freeze, is essentially our evolutionary way of conserving energy. So when we have a reaction that feels like too much for us, we naturally freeze because we don't have the space, the permission, the time to basically process it or metabolize it. So we freeze. So don't judge the freeze. It just means you need a little more time, you need more a little space or support to process that information. And to, you know, and sometimes a freeze is not even about the current moment, right? So freeze might be this current moment, like I hear he had 50 partners and I already connect that to a moment in high school where someone called me a slut, right? And the two combined is too much for this moment in time to process and that's why I freeze. So we'd never want to judge the freeze. It just is a pathway back to going, I need more time to process this. I need more space. I need more support. And I need to see if there's anything from this current moment that is over coupled with the past.

I love that. Because the freeze is sort of a signal of my body doesn't feel safe right now. This is reminiscent of something else.

Yes.

God, I love that. That is such a great point. The freeze doesn't mean that you need to like stop. It just means, it doesn't mean you need to react.

You don't need to over analyze the freeze.

Ah, she's good. Well, here's another one. Lily, 25 in Nashville. I grew up in a really religious household, so my body count is low. I'm okay with that, but I've noticed guys either fetishize it or act like I'm not sexually confident. Can we stop equating numbers with ability? Sure. I mean, yeah, that's what we're trying to do.

Let's do it. Yeah, fuck it. She notices your body count's low, body count, who knows, body count, we're not even gonna talk about that.

For the show today.

Yeah, and I would even say to her, you know, it's interesting that she used the term body count again, and I would say like, this is the time where we get to stand on a pedestal and stop using and shout out to the world. Stop using the term body count. If you need to know more information about someone's sex life, just say, I'd love to know more information about your sex life. Yeah, I'd love to know what your.

Turn-Ons are, what you've liked, what you don't like, what have you learned, but you don't need to have the number doesn't, the number of people you step with does not.

Yeah, let's stop using traumatized language and imposing it on sex.

Yes. I love that so much. Yeah, we know that already leads to insecurity and jealousy and judgment and bias. And, it really takes away from like a genuine curiosity about experience or compatibility, which is if we get rid of body count, we can really learn like, are we actually compatible? But if we like throw in the body count missive, we like miss so much other information. Okay, truly helpful. This was wonderful. I think body count is just dead in the water now. Bye-bye. Bye-bye body count. Let's talk about pleasure. What actually makes you feel good? We're doing it. Thank you, Dr. Scott.

Thank you, Dr. Emily.

That's it for today's episode. Thanks so much for listening to Sex with Emily. If you love love the show. Please like subscribe and leave it a review wherever you get your podcasts and hey, share this with a friend or partner. It just might spark something. You can find me on Instagram, YouTube, Facebook, TikTok and X it's all at sexwithemily.com and I've been told I give really good email. So sign up at sexwithemily.com for free guides, articles and more ways to prioritize your pleasure. Have a question about about sex, dating or relationships, call my hotline 559-Talk-Sex, that's 559-825-5739 or leave a message at sexwithemily.com/ask. And hey, was it good for you? Email me anytime at feedback@sexwithemily.com I'd love to hear what you're thinking.