The Sex and Intimacy Revolution with Dr. Emily Morse

I'm Dr. Scott Lyons, and you're watching or listening to the gently used human. Have you ever wondered why conversations about sex and pleasure often feel like navigating a minefield of awkwardness and taboo? Y', all. Why is it that in a world brimming with information, the dialogue around our sexual well being remains so stifled? And how can we break through the barriers of silence to cultivate relationships that thrive on open communication and profound pleasure? I'm joined today by Emily Morse, bestselling author of Hot Over 200 Things yous Can Try Tonight and Smart Sex, and host of the number one sexuality podcast on itunes, Sex with Emily. Emily has dedicated her career to demystifying the world of sex and pleasure, advocating for open, honest communication as the cornerstone for a vibrant sexual relationship. Together, Emily and I will explore the reason behind our collective hesitation to talk about sex, the benefits of expanding our understanding of what sex can be, and the practical steps we can take to enhance intimacy and pleasure in our lives. Yes, we'll tackle how to approach pleasure thieves like stress and trauma and shame, and discuss the power of mindfulness and creating a safe space for those important conversations. Emily and I had so much fun as we played games to increase our resilience to connect and communicate about sex. And oh my gosh, did I blush. She is heaven on earth, y'.

All.

She is one of my favorite people in this entire world. And whether you are curious about navigating your desires, exploring fantasies, or simply looking to enrich the sexual aspects of your relationship, you are in the right, right place. This episode has it all, so let's get it on. Dr. Emily Morse. Welcome to the Gently Used Human, my love.

I'm so excited to be here. Dr. Scott Lyons.

I'm so excited, too. And I'm going to start with a poem. This is a poem written by a dear friend of mine that I thought would be a beautiful entry into the theme at hand today. And it begins. Spinderella, cut it up one time. Oo oo oo oo Come on. Let us talk about sex, Bab. Let us talk about you and me Let us talk about all the good things and the bad things that make me be let's talk about sex let's talk about sex now to the people at home and in the crowd don't be coy Avoid or make void the topic Many will know anything goes let's tell it how it is, how it could be and how it was and of course how it should be. Emily Morse. Let's talk about sex that is Written by my dear friends Salt and Pepper.

I love it. People usually, a lot of times play that song, but I love hearing the words. I think it's, why don't we talk about sex?

Why don't we talk about sex?

And we're still here trying to get people to talk about it.

I know, Emily, you, I feel like, are one of the main people who have brought the renaissance of pleasure into our lifetime. And I'm so excited to talk to you about sex.

Me too.

Why don't we talk about sex?

Oh, God. I mean, how much time do we have? I mean, there's 90 minutes. Let's go. I mean, we don't talk about sex because we don't have great models of people talking about sex. Many times our parents didn't talk to us about sex. Our neighbors didn't talk to us. Our friends didn't. And when we did hear about sex, it was if we grew up in an environment where it was shunned or it was criticized. We were told not to have sex. It was negative messaging or negative conditioning around sex. And then maybe we saw porn and that was confusing, and we thought, well, is that sexual? So we really just don't have a lot of great places to go where we feel safe and shame free.

Yeah. Now you just asked the question, is that sex? But I think we can ask it more universally. Emily, what is sex?

That's a great question. It's really easy to start with that everyone gets to decide what sex means to them. So I can tell you that if we ask most people on the street, we went up on the street asking, well, what is sex? They would say penetration, man, woman, penis goes in vagina. They had sex or they didn't have sex. Yeah, but I'm gonna argue that we all get to decide what it looks like. And for some people, sex could be making out. It could be mutual masturbation. It could be oral sex. It could be no penetration and, you know, upside down wheelbarrow without, I don't know, thinking about my sex position. It doesn't have to be anything. I mean, it could just be cuddling. We had a great connection. Dirty talk. So I think that we say sex, we think penetration. But I would love to decenter sex on that, because for the majority of people with vulvas. Vulvas, not people think. I'm saying vulva is often car. But I'm saying vulvas, which is the exterior part of the vagina, which is analogous to the penis. We just call it the vagina sometimes. But for women, the exterior part of the vagina is where the magic happens. So penetration doesn't feel good for us as much. Only 20% of women have orgasms from a penis, anything to do with a penis. And so to say that sex, that's what sex is, is leaving a lot of women just not satisfied. That's number one. And number two, the reason why I think sex became defined that way is because of procreation and because of religion. And we were told, like, well, if you're going to have sex, it has to be to make a baby.

Yeah.

It can't be for anything else. Can't be for pleasure. God, you know, God forbid it's pleasurable.

Yeah.

And so that's the messaging people have gotten to for thousands of years.

I love how inclusive you are and the fact that you're breaking down these barriers around these misconceptions of maybe what sex is and the permissions to still define it for ourselves. I think one of the earliest definitions I had, not earliest earliest, but like in my 20s, was like, sex was an opportunity to go from more boundaried individualism to kind of enmeshment for some time and then the permission to go back to individualism. Now it's an evolving. The definition for me. But that's. That's what it was.

Yeah, that's such a. What, A what? An evolved definition of sex. Because. Yeah. Well, when you're saying that, I'm thinking like it is about someone that you feel safe with, connected, and perhaps you both had a pleasurable experience together in a way that involved your body parts.

Yeah.

You know, but that's also saying. So what that says is that you come together and you bound. Is that what it was? You come together, you boundaries and you can leave again. So you're not leaving yourself with this person, but you leave whole.

Yeah, there's some type of like unison or union that happens in sex to me, like whether it's energetic or just connecting or physical. But yeah, that it moves from like individualism into union and back into individuation with the memory of the sort of unison. But I mean, but sex can also just be with yourself. It could be an orgy. It could be a lot of unison.

A lot of unison and a lot of.

Yeah, so that's why, I mean, it's an involving definition.

It's interesting. I would love people just to think about that for a minute. Like, what does it actually mean to you? And when is it the most pleasurable? Like, what kind of sex do you like? And what does it actually mean? So I think it's a great topic to talk about because I don't think that many of us has ever really sat and thought about. Like, not only do we not know what we like and what feels good, we probably never really thought about, like, what. What actually is sex and what makes it good, what makes it satisfying.

Yeah. Now, speaking of funky role models, I'm curious because you were an amazing role model. Like, what was your childhood like in terms of role models? And how did that go? If you're open to talking about it, yeah, totally.

Role models sexually or just how did.

You hear about sex? Where did you first hear about it?

I remember having sex ed when I was in seventh grade. I mean, maybe I'd heard about it beforehand. It was like one day or day class, and it was like boys and girls were in the room together. And I remember, like, I kind of remember looking up the projector and there was like, pictures of, like, ovulation and period involved menstruation. And then I remember one boy in the class raised a hand, said, like, Ms. Jones, can you have sex underwater? And like, that's. She's like, yeah, you could. Like, literally, that's all I remember from the class. That was my sex ed. It was a day. It was a lot of giggling and a lot of embarrassment. And then I remember having sex when I was 17 with my boyfriend I'd been with for a year. It felt very important to wait, but I remember it being, like, underwhelming and not that interesting. I felt like it was more about, again, how I came to feel about sex after that. That it was. It was good, not great. And I didn't really, you know, I definitely didn't have an orgasm, but I just remember thinking, like, okay, check. I did that. And then I remember my mom would say to me, if you ever have questions about sex, please ask. So that was. That was more than a lot of parents did. I know a lot of parents didn't do anything.

Yeah.

And so I think she probably said that to me once or twice. And what I found is parents often do that now, too, I found. But, like, I didn't know the questions to ask because you don't know how textured sex is and how many layers there are. So that was my history with sex.

Yeah.

Pretty much what I knew.

Referring to it as, like, a textured experience. When I was reading your book, there was a moment where I felt so sad. And it was. And it was like, oh, we don't even necessarily know what? We don't know. So for like, coming in to the world or coming into our sex experiences and we don't even know how good or textured or embodied or fulfilling it could be, then we're just left in this, like, muck.

Yeah.

But we might assume, like, that's all it is.

That's exactly it. That's what I thought. I thought that test was just disappointing because then I went on to have sex. And I do Open Smart Sex, my book, talking about my experience of just being underwhelmed, being in relationships all through my 20s. That would be with someone for, you know, a few months. It would be great. At the beginning, the sex would feel so connected and magical and new. And then after a while, that would taper off. And then I was bored, realizing, like, they're always having a good time, they're always finishing. I am not having orgasms. And then I would went through a series of blaming my partners and then thinking I. Something was wrong with me.

Yeah.

And then I thought, this is enough already. Like, this just doesn't seem. Sex is supposed to be this incredible, glorified thing that everyone talks about. Why? Why is it not for me? Am I broken? What's wrong? So that's where I started my journey from a place of, like, I know something's wrong and I like to fix it, like, to get the answers.

I mean, it's interesting that that's your journey and often going back to sex education, I mean, it's more focused on what not to get or how not to get pregnant or all of these things. And like, the potential diseases. It's. I mean, I don't.

It's all fear based.

It's all fear based.

All of sex education is about fear and, like, don't get pregnant. Don't get an sti. Have a nice life. And then you're like, what? That sounds terrifying. Why would I ever want to have sex? And there's no talk about pleasure. No, there's no talk about, like, consent or boundaries or, you know, any of that stuff is completely left out.

Any of that. Which is why I'm saying you are one of the major players in bringing back pleasure, the renaissance of pleasure. And I just really appreciate it. So you went from sex is okay. And then it started your journey of how you became, I don't know, an incredible author. The number one podcast of sex with Emily. Like, the lack started your journey.

Yeah.

And then what happened?

Then what happened?

Then what happened?

Well, which part? So then I just started a podcast heading into my 19th year of my podcast right now.

Congratulations.

Thank you. And I just started really interviewing people about their sex lives and relationships and dating and love. And then I realized after that first day of recording, I think I did like, six episodes in a day.

Oh, my God.

And I remember because everyone was there, we're talking, and I. It was just a whole thing. And I remember thinking. Thinking like, okay, well, this is a movement. This is. People are open and they're talking about it, and we're all learning and realizing that we were having a lot of the same challenges. And it was everybody. It was men, women, single, straight, everything. And people were just married, divorced, like, all ages, all people. And everyone was like, I don't have any information about it. I was like, well, then that was such a spark there. And I just knew that that was getting my journey. And then I started reading, exploring. I read every book on sex. And then I went back to grad school and got my doctorate in human sexuality. And, yeah, that's been my journey. And so since then, it's been the podcast and writing books and speaking and just helping people. You know, my mission is to get people to prioritize their pleasure and liberate the conversation around sex. That's it. Like, how do we. How do we look at pleasure as a practice? And that pleasure is actually productive, and it's a requirement for, I think, living a happy, healthy life and liberating the conversation is just what we're doing right now.

I love that phrase on the pleasure is a practice, as opposed to, like, we should just automatically have it or just default into pleasure or even know what it is. So what is the process and the practices of pleasure activating or how pleasure activate?

Yeah, I mean, so I write, in smart sex, I have something called a pleasure percentage. Because that was the moment where I realized that I had a life that was just like. There was like a pleasure drought. Cause they had me. I was on this retreat, as you can imagine, someone does retreats and teaches them. I was not teaching this retreat. I was on it. And they were like, okay, I want you. This is best way I could explain. And people could do this as well. They said, write down everything you do in a week that gives you joy, that makes you happy, makes you feel good. What do you love doing? And then you write all those things down, or not even a week. What do you love doing? And then they had you look at your week and say, okay. It was like a formula that I put in the book, like math. And it's like, what percentage of time do you do these things? And then I realized I did the math and I realized that, like, only like, 3% of my life was doing things that were actually pleasurable. And I'm not even talking about sex. I'm talking about plans with friends, hiking, you know, cooking. That's not actually one of mine. But, you know, just being in nature, just whatever the things are in my life that I actually gave me joy and gave me pleasure I wasn't doing. So I was like, well, that is just no way to go through life. And then I decided to be more conscious about looking at my schedule. And it's not just about work, but it's like, where could I infuse more joy in our life? Because pleasure begets pleasure. And the more we get comfortable. Comfortable feeling pleasure in our body.

Yeah.

Well, then the more natural be to expect it and to prioritize it in our lives.

I love that you're talking about pleasure tolerance in this moment of like, the more we can become accustomed and connected with our own sense of pleasure, the more our capacity grows for it.

Yes, it's true. Right. Because then you're like, oh, I want more of that. That felt good.

Yeah, yeah.

Because our society is so about, like, pleasure. We don't deserve pleasure. Or only once I check everything off my to do list or it feels selfish. But I would argue that pleasure actually is productive. And the more we bring that into our lives, the more we'll be able to get done and the more we'll be able to show up and be present and aware and good friend, a good lover, all the things.

So if someone isn't able to really connect to pleasure in the bedroom or sexually, then could they focus on other aspects of their life where there could be pleasure as, like, build that pleasure tolerance?

Yeah, they could. That's actually a great way to start because just thinking about how else can I feel good in my life? Because if I'm coming into the bedroom and I'm not feeling it, you know, where am I? Do I think I don't deserve it? Is it hard for me to receive? Is it hard for me to ask for what I want? But the thing about not having any pleasure in the bedroom, which is actually really common.

Yeah.

And I mean from. From like women who experience pain. Like, did you know that 80% of women experience pain during sex at some point in their life? And some of women, it's all the time. And so they really. They have a numbing or they can't feel things. And it could be it could be a lot of things. It could be trauma, it could be physiological. They actually might have an overgrowth of nerve endings. They might have something. You know, there's a lot of things that could be going on, why people are not having it, but then they just kind of accept it. So there's ways to work through every challenge that people have. But a lot of times we're having pleasure because we. We don't actually know what we like. We don't ask for the kind of touch we want. We're really in our heads, you know, whenever. When our. We're in our heads too much thinking too much about what's. And what should I be doing. It is really hard to experience pleasure at the same time that we're anxiety. Like they can't actually coexist. And so most of those thoughts in our heads are keeping us from our bodies.

Yeah. I used to use the analogy of like, if you're not in the lake, like, if you're not swimming in the lake, you can actually feel the quality of water. And the same thing is true of, like, if we're above the lake or if we're in our head intellectualizing it, how the hell would we feel pleasure, really?

We're like professionals at sort of overriding our bodies, right?

We are. And how could we then think that when crossover into sex?

Exactly that. And that's the thing. It's like if you really are going through life not embodied, but then you get into the bedroom and you're like, why isn't it great? Why? I thought sex was magic. We're together, it's supposed to feel great, but it's actually, that is a practice. You don't just come into the bedroom and you know, how you do one thing is how you do everything. So if you're like a stressed out, anxious person in your life, you. You might get in the bedroom and bring that into the bedroom, unfortunately. So we have to like, unlearn, relearn.

Yeah, I really appreciate that. That it's like this idea that it's not some magic switch of like we're in the bedroom and all of a sudden all of these things that aren't in the rest of our life aren't going to be in the bedroom. Like, we need to practice mindfulness, presence, embodiment, everywhere, everywhere, which includes the bedroom. And how might we start to do that? And like, I hear how we might do it in maybe our daily life, but how do we start to utilize that in sexual pleasure life?

Well, I want to normalize the fact that first, that, yeah, most of us are pretty disassociated in the bedroom. We are thinking about pleasing our partner or pleasing ourselves. So it does start to have a. We're worried about pleasing our partner and less about ourselves. Or maybe we are just about, let me get my orgasm and get out. None of those are the ways to experience the most pleasure. And so first thing is awareness. I've noticed that I disassociate. I don't remember what happened, or I'm just sort of faking it till it's over. And so, yeah, first thing is awareness. And then on your own, practicing your own first. It's always great to have, like, a breath work practice or a mindfulness practice. But if you're with a partner, it's okay to say, you know what? Sometimes, like, here's examples of where you might get off. A lot of times sex happens and. And we're just going along with it. We keep moving through sex. And then sometimes I know this happened to me. I look, I'm like, how did we get here? Like, how am I already naked? How is there something inside me? So giving people permission to say, can we just, like, slow down for a minute? You know, I feel like we've gotten really fast, but I. Can we just go back to the. I'd love to look into your eyes. Can we hold hands for a second?

Yeah.

Could we go back to the making out? So to me, just that presence of saying that and saying, I need to slow way down. So I think slowness during sex and giving yourself permission that it's not a script you're following, that we think of sex as so linear. So to be able to, like, slow it down, breathe, make eye contact. Like, some of the great ways to be more connected during sex is. And these are sort of tantric practices. But when I say tantra, people like, oh, God, I gotta go take another course. Or I gotta, like, it takes, you know, two hours. But no, tantra is basically eye gazing and breathing together. And. And that is a game changer for sex. It can help you get into that mindset of presence and embodiment and connection with your partner. So just one of the things would be, like, slowing down. Can we take a few deep breaths? Start with slow touching, too. I mean, if we already talk about what sex feels like, when it's not pleasurable, it goes right to our genitals. But we need some time to warm up. So if you think of sex as something that we just want to, like, slow everything down, slow down your making out, Slow down touching each other. I love telling couples a great way to do it is to slow down. And maybe you take 10 minutes and massage your partner and they take 10 minutes to massage you because there's so much power in touch and massage and relaxing our nervous system and releasing tension and stress. And it's almost like a warmup before a workout.

Yeah.

Yeah, right?

Yeah. I love that. I mean, touch really is our first language. Like, we come into this world, we don't speak German or English or any of that. We speak and communicate through touch. We learn even our sense of presence of another person through touch. And so, like, in this way that you're talking about, like, pleasure and sex is a returning to our primal language, our primal communication. Slow it down, slow it down.

Talk to each other.

Get in the primal.

Yeah. I mean, does that happen? I feel like when someone. When I get them. The reason why I love massage, whether it's my partner or someone. Somebody else, I mean, just like a professional or just some other random man in the street, is that. I mean, it just. Yeah. It resets everything. It releases. I can start over. I feel fresh, I feel connected. And so everyone gets to find what those practices are for them. Sauna bath.

Yeah.

What allows you to slow and feel.

Yeah, yeah. And there's something. When we slow down, we can touch and be touched simultaneously. I mean, like, when we think of, like giving a massage, I feel like a lot of people think it's one directional, as opposed to this bidirectionalness where it's like my hand is on my leg, but my leg is touching my hand. And the same way I'm touching a partner, they're touching me regardless of the act.

That's an active practice. That's true.

Yeah. So we have awareness, we have embodiment. Is there more?

Well, what else could we do? You're asking about more. What was it? More pleasure. More connection.

Yeah. How do we keep building our sense.

Of connection and pleasure.

Really, through, I mean, communication too. Yeah, I mean, communication, probably the thing I've repeated the most is communication is a lubrication. And the more comfortable we feel talking about sex.

Yes.

The more present we'll feel, the more pleasure we're going to have. And so again, yes, body language is really important, but if we don't have the words to talk about sex, we don't really even know how to do it. Which I would tell you is probably most of the people on the planet aren't really comfortable and don't have the tools to talk about sex in a productive way with a partner. So yeah, like just getting comfortable talking about, talking about your pleasure, your desires, what you want admitting that it's awkward if it's the first time you've done it. And I hope after many people listen today, they will do it tonight, they're inspired. And so I just want to recognize that it could be awkward. Your partner might say, what do you mean? Why are we talking about sex all of a sudden? Because, Scott, would you believe that most people think that you, you shouldn't have to talk about sex to make it great. They think that it should just be. Always feel great like it was at the beginning. That's the common belief around it. So the skill set of learning to talk about sex without shame, without judgment and just truly listening is a. Is an important practice.

Yeah, I mean I think you're giving such a good example of like we wouldn't not talk about any other tool or skill set we're developing. Like if you're going to be an engineer, you better learn and listen and be able to talk about engineering. And I don't think we don't think about like that's a skill set, that's a practice. Just like pleasure is a practice that needs to be communicated about.

And the thing is too is that if you think about anything in life that you value and that you want to be good at and you want to enhance your skill set, you got to work at it. You want to be really good at your job, you want to get a promotion, you want to be a great runner, you got to run a lot, you got to train. But you. Sex is like this outlier that because we don't understand it because all of the shame because of all the misinformation about sex and there's a lot of misinformation, we just somehow have all adopted this belief that it just should sort of magically work because our bodies know what to do and we should be able to generate that in the bedroom every time orgasms for all feel deeply connected and so much pleasure and then go about our day. But what else in life is like that?

Nothing.

Zero things that we actually deem important and prioritize for our health.

Yeah. I want to take a moment to give a loud shout out to the Embody Lab which is one of the most incredible resources for body based and somatic therapies. This show is all about healing and the Embody Lab does exactly that. Whether you're on your own journey of transition, transformation and discovery, or enhancing Your skill sets in your career as like a coach or a therapist, a body worker or really any career where you are supporting other gently used humans. The Embody Lab is your place for deep, inspiring and impactful workshops, certificates, master classes and an incredible community of light, like minded folks. I love the Embody Lab and so do so many other people that call it a platform to come home to. Over and over again. The Embody Lab is giving my listeners an exclusive offer. A one time 10% off code to enhance your embodied well being. All you have to do is go to thembodylab.com and use the code gentlyuse10 at checkout.

I mean, I know you've written about that and you've had that experience of actually going and studying and talking to people and refining and that led to what for you?

Oh, for me, sexually, oh my God, I'm such a different person than I was. I mean, first I only have sex when I want to have sex. That was one thing I want to say is that I used to think that sex was a do. I looked at it like a duty and I was doing it. I didn't think I could say no. I didn't think I could stop it. I didn't think I had any agency over my body or over sex. So I think the first thing is realizing that pleasure is my birthright. I'm responsible for my orgasm and I can also have sex on my terms while also being a good collaborator with somebody. So that's really how it's changed. And I've learned different ways that I need to be touched and I've learned how to talk about that. And I just explore and play and have a very like open dialogue about it. My partners, like, I want to know about them and we discuss all the things I talk about. Literally. I practice like scheduling sex or when is it going to be a good time or you know, in most relationships there's always someone who's initiating and someone who's rejecting. So how do you normalize that in your relationship and make sure that you both get your needs met? You're having sex in ways that feel good and.

Yeah, so you want to talk more.

About my sex life, don't you?

I want to talk more about your sex life. I want to get.

I mean, role modeling. So as you talk about communication as lubrication, which is such a great line because I don't know, I find communication the hottest thing like it.

I'm with you, we're with you. I'm like, can we talk about your trauma Right now I'm getting really turned on.

I don't know about you, but, like, when I've had a rupture and repair cycle with my partner, and I'm like, we are communicating. We're talking it through. By the end of that repair, I'm like, take off your clothes. And it's not like makeup sex. I'm not talking about that. But I'm like, oh, my gosh. The depth of communication and vulnerability that just presented itself. It's so hot.

It's the sexiest thing in the world, right?

Sexiest thing in the world.

Yeah.

What are some cues or ways we can help people communicate better? Because there's so much need for it.

So much need for it. Well, I think the first thing would be, gosh, I mean, if they want to communicate about sex. My three T's of communication, timing, turf and tone. And this really works for any awkward conversation. But since I. All the years we were saying, like, what. I hear what you're saying, but how do I do it? When do I do it? Is this. Just remember this. The timing is when you are. Hang in with your partner. It's date night. You're in a good place. You're not halt. You're not hungry, angry, lonely or tired. If you're any of those places, that is not a great time to talk about sex. The tone is curious and open and supportive and light. Even though it might feel heavy. You gotta remember we're having a collaborative conversation. And then the turf is outside the bedroom. And so for many people, they think, well, I'm already in the bedroom. It's happening. If we were cooking, I'd be talking about the recipe in the kitchen. But with sex, it's very. It's different because we're already in an aroused state. Perhaps we're in a roused state. We're like, oh, why don't you ever want sex again? Or we're just. We're going to sleep. It's just better to find a place. And what I often recommend is when you are going on a walk.

Yeah.

Because then you could still be side by side. You don't have to make eye contact, but it's still intimate. Or you're on a road trip.

Yeah.

It's a great time to talk about.

Sex when you're stuck in a car. Stuck in a car.

Nobody can escape now and no one can hear us.

There's nothing like entrapment to help with communication.

And my partner, we had to. When we drive, he's like, okay, we're in the car, I'm like, oh, God. Like, he uses it on me. He's like, so let's talk about this. I'm like, fuck. Okay. No, but that's. But really, that's just a great place to start with sex. And then also in Smart Sex, the communication chapter is pretty weighty. I put a lot of just actual scripts for people to walk through because people want to know, okay, I hear what you're saying, but, like, how do I ask for a threesome? Or how do I ask? You know? So I just. I try to give people some tools to help them, but I think that's a great place to start. Just remember where you're at, how you want to say it.

Dr. Emily, how do I ask for a threesome?

That's why you called me here, too?

Or with a friend.

Well, okay. Do you really want to go into it?

Yeah, let's do it.

Okay, so you don't go from zero to threesome. You're not like, hey, I think it'd be hot for us to go have sex with someone else. Would you be down, let's say, if you're in a relationship.

Yeah, yeah.

There has to be some groundwork. You have to, like, warm up the conversation.

Okay.

So first you want to make sure that you're in a relationship where you already. Maybe you've already talked about. About your desires and your fantasies, but if you haven't, which I found as a lot of couples, perhaps you're out, you're having dinner, you're like, oh. So I thought, let's say you're a couple. We want to talk about a couple who hasn't really talked about these things before. We can start with them.

Yeah. Yeah.

So first you want to start with the conversation about the current sex that you're having. The state of the union. The state of your sex union. How's our sex going? What are we into? Can we both agree we want to be great lovers to each other? Okay, good. I have a growth mindset around sex. I give you growth mindset around sex. Okay, good. So let's talk about it. Like, are there any fantasies you have? Anything you've been wanting to try? Right. Let your partner answer. And I still don't think you might want to jump into threesome, depending on what they say. I've never had a fantasy. I don't fantasize. Like, what about you? So I think it's more like, you know, depending how trustworthy, how confident you feel with your partner. The reason I'm saying don't bring it up is because I see these scenarios where, like, our first conversation can't be, let's bring your best friend into the bedroom.

Right?

No, no, definitely don't bring the best friend into the bed. But I think just conversation fantasies. Would you be open? Can we explore? And then maybe you could say, yeah, you know, I think. And then once you get there, you could say, you know, I think I've had some fantasies about imagining you having sex with somebody else. Like us having sex with someone else. Because I think it would be so hot to see you aroused and turned on with somebody. Is that something that you would be into?

Yeah.

Once you get there, you know, what do they think about that? And when you're bringing up this fantasy, it's really important to make it about the pleasure that you're both gonna have.

Yeah.

And that's about me getting off.

Yeah.

Right? Ye.

Yeah.

I think it just be really hard to, you know, someone else. That's just not going to go with a lot of. A lot of people.

No. So you got to titrate that.

You got to titrate that. You do have to titrate everything. You really do.

You got to read the room.

You got to read the room. So I'm telling you, if you guys have never, like, you could be a few conversations away from threesome. I have this great guide on my site, the yes, no, maybe list, that's been downloaded like, hundreds and thousands of time because people find it just a great tool for couples to sit together. And it has about, like, 80 sex acts on it.

Yeah.

Everything from, like, kissing. Is that a yes, no, or maybe spanking. Is that a yes and no? Maybe threesomes. I mean, you could jump, right? That is on there as well.

That's an entry point.

Yeah, that's an entry point. But it is on there. But then you could sit down and it's a really fun game. Like, oh, I didn't realize that we both like dirty talk. We're both yeses. Why don't we start with that? Because What I found, Dr. Scott, is that most people just need some kernels of places to go. They want some inspiration. They. They don't know what's on the. So it's a fabulous sexual menu.

Yeah. I have done the menu with my partner.

You did?

We did. We did it together. And we basically circled the same stuff, which was great.

Did you know that beforehand that you would have been circling the same stuff or was that.

No, some of the stuff I knew, but the other stuff, I was like, oh. And we both were in alignment almost entirely through the whole thing of things we're not interested in at this point in our relationship.

It's perfect.

And there was one thing he chose that I was like, no, not for me. And it was a really interesting moment. I want to talk to you about this. It's like, what happens when someone is a big yes and someone is a big no. How do you compromise?

Yeah, well, sex is all about compromise too. Because I think people think, oh, God. So we could go back to the threesome thing. So let's say you have the conversation with your partner and you are a yes. And your partner is like, that's a hell no. For me, that is a no. And then you're like, oh, but this is my main fantasy. How do we. What do we do now?

And resentment often builds.

Resentments and judgments. So that's why you have to be ready to talk about, like. So then we get to be curious, open partner, and say, well, so you don't just jump right there. You might say, like, well, I don't know that that's my thing. But tell me more about it. Tell me more about why a threesome is so hot to you. So have them explain it to you. I just love the sounds. Or I love the thought of it. Or I let you know all the things and then you gather more information. So maybe a place to start would be like, well, why don't we. Maybe we could watch some threesome porn together. Yeah, let's watch it together and just, like, see how we feel. Or let's dirty talk it. Let's role play it. Like, would that be satisfying? And maybe I would find the no partner. Like, actually, I actually thought that was hot. Maybe we could try it. And maybe the yes partner is like, that was hot. That scratched my itch for today. Like, that. That was a good place to go. And I love that you're willing to explore it. Even the fact that as my partner, you were willing to watch the porn. Like, that feels good to me. So that's one way to kind of work around these things. If there's other things. Things, you know, usually we can. You know, sex is a. There's just so many ways to play. So your partner might just be no to a threesome, but again, you could expand. I'm trying to think of some other things that people would say no to. But there's always, like, a area for both people to be satisfied. Very rarely is there, like, a hard no. Now if somebody has a. Like a no, that could be that devastating for a couple. I mean, I shouldn't say that, because in every case, there's probably.

Sometimes it's like. Or an open relationship.

Yeah. Open world. That could be a no, right?

That could be a no.

But I feel like if. If it's like, oh, you don't want to talk dirty, like, why? There's just ways to be. Like, why don't we listen to audio erotica together? And we could learn some ways to do it. So a lot of times our really strong nos come from a place of fear or a place of not being enough or a place of not really understanding the question, like, what do you mean by dirty talk? Could you tell me more about what? The dirty talk that's hot for you. Oh, I could call you my daddy. That's fine. But I don't want you to call me a bitch, you know? So it's all a negotiation, and it's all gathering more information and finding what our sexual. Like, what we actually want in the bedroom. And.

Yeah. You know, so that's such great advice. It feels so accessible. I mean, I hear it. I mean, I hear it as a practitioner, as a clinician. People coming in and they're like, I was with a patient a few weeks ago, and they were talking about sex. And I was like, when was the last time you felt satisfied or met and sexually? And he was like, I don't remember. And I said, when was the last time you talked about sex with your partner? And he was like, I never have. And I was like, remind me how long you've been together? And it was 15 years. And I was, like, curious. What gets in the way of you talking about it or communicating? And it was such a shyness. There was, I mean, clearly underlying elements of shame and shyness.

It's so common that people are together that long and they don't talk about it. I mean, I would say that that was probably, I don't know the majority of people, but it's. Yeah. It's China's. It's shame. It's not knowing what to say.

Yeah.

Not even knowing where to start.

Yeah. I mean. And I love in your book, again, the prompts, because you can just begin with, like, how was that for you?

Yeah. How was it?

How was it?

Yeah. What was good? You know, what was good? What would you like to try more of?

Yeah.

What was memorable? Yeah, let's talk about the three most memorable times we've had sex together. Like, that's a great starting point for couples also, if they want to talk about it. Like, okay, let's talk about our three most memorable times. Because there's also also research that has shown that couples who reminisce.

Yeah.

Actually helps them with their connection and intimacy and all that. So what if we reminisce about our sex life?

Yeah.

Oh, that time we were on vacation. Because in those memories is some really useful data.

Yeah.

You're like, oh, that was. I forgot that time. But that was memorable to you. So what does that tell me about your desire and arousal and what might be required for you to be turned on? Okay, let's do that again. Yes. Just. And that's a fun way to do it. It's inclusive, it's open. We were both there, we both did it. And what do we want to do more of?

And memory and fantasy are both physiologically stimulating. So it's like even in talking about the memory, you're getting aroused.

Getting aroused. That's it.

Or whatever the sensation that you had during that experience that was worth bringing back up and talking about.

Yeah. I love that. It's true. You have that you're reliving it in your body again. And so therefore you're connecting more to your partner.

And this is the thing that's interesting about fantasy is like, I think a lot of people think it's like, am I not enough if I want to go into fantasy? But truly it's just another opportunity to have another texture of sex and sensation.

Yeah. Because sex gets stale. It does in long term relationships. It's going to. If I could like normalize something else there, it's going to get. Get stale. There is nobody. That's because what we crave is, you know, variety and spontaneity. And it's really hard to get that in a relationship where you are doing the same things, the sex acts the same way over and over and over again. But that notion of I am not enough, am I not enough is what the refrain that people often have in their head when their partner talks about sex. And so that's why you need to. Do you have to do a lot of. No, no, we're great together. We're so good. But like, how amazing would be of another adventure together. Like, we travel to new cities every year. We try different foods. Like, let's just. It's just another way to expand our connection.

Yeah. I love that positive framework of expanding the connection, the relationship, so it's not perceived as a deficit. Because, I mean, it's so easy for a partner to be like, hey, I want to Try this. And you're like, am I not enough? What am I doing wrong? As opposed to really holding true to the fact that, like, ooh, everything can be improved. Like, going back to being an engineer, your skill sets can always be improved.

Everything can be. But again with sex, because we don't talk about it, we think, oh, well then. And most people do go to that place, if their partner brings it up, they immediately feel shame. I'm not doing enough. I'm a bad lover to you. What's up? And so that's why, you know, if we were giving advice to people about, like, how to ask for a raise, say, or how to ask for something, like, it would be very concrete. It would be. But this is like, it's so gentle. It's so, like, you have to be so mindful that it is a landmine.

Yeah.

Because we haven't ventured on that territory before, so.

Yeah, yeah.

But we are enough. Just about part of the process, Right. Of connecting, exploring, and growing. It's what's going to get people out of their ruts and have more pleasure.

Yeah. Now, what might be some things. You called it pleasure thieves in the book. So, like, we're talking about how to enter in, how to increase pleasure, activate. What are some things that block or get in the way?

Okay, so the pleasure thieves is.

Stress. These are the top three.

Top three.

And I get into more of them in the book. But stress, trauma, and shame, these are the three biggest killers of our sex drive and our ability to have. Have the most pleasurable sex.

Yeah.

So.

So when we're talking about, I mean, stress is normal. Like, we all have stresses, but it's kind of like, especially when it compounds, like, so many stresses, where our energy reserve is in response to the stress and not able to give it to someone else. And trauma's, you know, certainly more serious than that. And so, like, when it's trauma, do you recommend they go see a therapist versus stress trauma? You have specific practices.

Yeah, I have practices for all of it and suggestions. But first, if we want to take, like, stress and anxiety.

Yeah.

First of all, they are one of the top killers of our sex drive because of the physiological response you're having in your body, like arousal and like the cortisol spiking, they can't all live together, and you can't experience them both at the same time. And so if you are experiencing a lot of anxiety stress, it's going to show up in the bedroom. And so just the practices for dealing with your stress and anxiety through therapy Breath work, meditation, naming it, you know, so all those things are going to seep into your bedroom, into your ability to be aroused and then trauma. Yeah, I mean, I think that. I mean, as you well know, trauma isn't going to heal itself.

No.

And people have to think, well, it's been so long now, I can't possibly be feeling that. And as we know, it is living in our bodies. And so there's a lot of great therapies that I highly recommend that, you know, EMDR is great for sexual. Try any kind of sexual traumas. But any trauma, you realize that doesn't matter what the trauma is, it could still be impacting your ability to be connected in the bedroom.

It's really like. I mean, trauma shows up as, like, an anchor sometimes, like pulling you down, away from your partner, or there are specific areas where you are disconnected or dissociated, where you are not fully able to be present to receive or connect with someone.

Yeah. It shows up in so many different ways. You can't receive, you can't give, you can't be present. It's.

Yeah. Or it's scary, or there's too much sensation or not enough sensation there. I just want to really name, like, it can heal sometimes. Like, we're with a partner and we're like, not the best sex of our life. And we might not realize that some of it might be our dissociation, some of it might be their dissociation. And, like, given time and practice, people can come more fully back to their body and the sex just gets better.

Should we get into that? Some of the ways to. Do you want to talk about.

I feel like you were talking about, should we get into sex? No, no.

But I feel like you talk about trauma a lot on your. I do, but is it helpful here to get into, like, how you chose up in the bedroom or how to deal with that with a partner? Like, know. And how to know if you are disassociated or.

Yeah, this is why I don't like the term, like, chemistry. I get it. We have. But it just sounds so, like, magical and mysterious of, like, oh, my God. We just have chemistry where it's like. Okay, first of all, chemistry can just be trauma bonding.

Yeah.

Okay.

Right, Right.

Let's have a moment for that.

Trauma's like, your trauma.

Oh, yeah.

You know, we've all been there, right?

Yeah. So there's that component of it. But, like. Like, sometimes people don't feel like, I remember I had a partner and they would often dissociate during sex. And so I couldn't experience them or feel them feeling me. And it brought up a lot in me feeling abandoned. And I was about to toss this relationship aside because I felt so abandoned. I felt like, oh, we just don't have good chemistry. That's what I kept saying. And I said to my friends, like, well, if you don't have good chemistry, you're never going to get it. And this is when I was younger, like, last week.

And the truth is, that person went to therapy, they did do emdr. They did a bunch of other things, and I dealt with my Abendamine issues, they dealt with their dissociation, and we had great sex and great chemistry, and it was a fabulous relationship. But it's so easy to toss it aside if it's not this, like. Like magic at first.

Yeah. That goes back to the same, you know, thing that, like, we don't really know about sex. We're just gonna close our eyes, hope for the best. Hopefully the magic will be there, and it just could be further from the truth. We are all living in these bodies and bringing our full selves to the table and into the bedroom. And so until we really understand what it's like to be present, to work them. It's a lot of work, though, then, like, saying, like, how are we gonna find someone who's done the work and who has chemistry with that? But again, also recognizing that in every relationship, you get to work on yourselves, you get to grow. You get to work on yourselves individually and as a couple. And so I think if both partners are willing to do the work, you actually find you could create that.

Yeah.

That magic, if you will, or that connection once you realize what's holding you back and what you both want, and then you learn to be. And then you feel safe.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I really appreciate that. And truly, it's like, I can't say this enough. If someone's willing to do the work, stick around for a little while, it's worth giving them a beat and a little. Yeah. Some time and space.

Yeah, it does take a while, but it's. It can be. Yeah. I mean, it does take a while to go through this process. But even just somebody saying, like your example earlier. Yeah, I'm here for you. Like, I'm ready to take a pause.

Yeah.

I'm ready to see how else we can connect.

Yeah.

And see what we can do to work on it. Like, to me, that would be. Be such a. I don't know what I'm saying here. I lost my sense.

Yeah. I mean, so going back to unpack the trauma and stress piece a bit, just from like a nervous system perspective, we call it sensory motor balance. And this is where in trauma there's a sensory impact. Right. There's something that happens usually to us, and we freeze. We're not able to metabolize and process it. So we don't have this balance between incoming information and moving it out or metabolizing it. And so one of the things that can be just super helpful if we're having a lot of stress is to mobilize it. So literally shaking, like shaking our bodies, shaking all the stored energy inside, because then we have room and availability for someone else to meet us. But if we're already full, like, them touching us is going to feel noxious, or we just don't have availability anywhere in our body for someone else. So that's. I mean, that's.

I love shaking. I mean, shaking is like, can we do it together as a couple before we go to the bedroom? I mean, how great. Like these. I think these embodiment practices of breathing, shaking, all the things will help us both be like, okay, we've let it go. We've released the day. We've released things in our body. And that practice, too. Right. Just can help you release trauma over time.

Yeah.

So rolling all the things that you could do and then you both, like, show up a little bit more present maybe each time, or. I mean, it definitely will help you get rid of the day, at least the stress of the day or the anxiety of the day.

Yeah. I mean, this is why a lot of people actually enjoy sex is because of the metoric aspect of it. They're using that as the stress release. Because. Which, you know is. Well, yeah. Do you have opinions about that?

No, No. I think that that's confusing for people because, like, I feel so much better after sex. It is a stress relief.

Yeah.

And so I think that that's true. And that's. That's great. Like, I never want to, like, not gonna shame you and say, like, you shouldn't use sex as a stress relief. And I think it's easier for men because they can. They're pretty much gonna have an orgasm every time.

Yeah.

And orgasm is a relief. It might be temporary, but it is a relief from the anxiety.

Yeah.

And we already covered how for vulva owners. For women, it's not so much so that it turns and it's like, why was I doing this whole thing and I didn't even have pleasure.

Yeah. Yeah.

But connection can Be a stress relief too. Like, sometimes we just want to touch. The touch can be as well. So I think if you're only using it as a stress relief and then you realize you're having pleasure, then we need to work on that.

Yeah, and that's such a nuanced caveat that's so important to recognize that it's like, if you're using sex as a depository for your stress to like release it, then are there other places you can do that so that you actually come in to the connection with someone both more available to begin with, so that like, the streamline of connection is from the get go as opposed to the point of ejaculation when that's the moment you feel better.

Well, I love what you just said about it. You're both more available. Yeah, that's exactly what we're talking about. We're talking about if you're coming in to a sexual situation, whether it's your past trauma, whether it's your past 20 minutes, your day, your life, it's all in there in the bedroom. But these practices that we talk about are helping you literally just be more available. Available for the actual connection with somebody, the mindset, the presence, the body, the touch. And most of us are showing up just like not doing any of this work. And so sex is fraught.

Yeah, yeah. One of the things I love in your book too is kind of this idea of like mapping your pleasure. And you talk about it, and I love that masturbation is in the chapter before pleasure mapping with a partner. And can we talk about, like, how, I don't know, self exploration, what that leads to?

Yes. I mean, I talk about. I call it solo sex in the book, but I really want to rebrand sex. All the terms like masturbation, masturbation triggers.

Yeah.

Solo sex is such an important practice to feeling connected to our bodies and who we are and what we actually like. And it's a way of giving ourselves pleasure, orgasm, knowledge, connection. So I highly recommend it. I don't have to always recommend it to everybody. I find that people with penises are like, I got this. I'm good, I'm doing it. I mean, sometimes they make might, but they need you more. But I feel like with women too, there's maybe more shame around it. There's, you know, not as much permission. And so whenever I tell people it's actually good for us, it's good for our mental health, our physical health. Like, I love giving people like another. It's like, oh, wow, I guess I feel better. It's actually good for me. It's good for my sex life.

Yeah.

But for a lot of us, we grew up places where it was. It was shameful, it was wrong. And we also feel that if we get into a relationship with somebody, I.

Feel like we're cheating on them too.

I can also feel like, oh, my God, master cheating. Or I caught my partner masturbating.

Oh, my gosh.

I mean, that is a very, very common. Common question we get asked because of all this misunderstanding about sex that we've covered. But I just want to let people know that, like, your partner is going to masturbate. They masturbated before they met you. They're masturbated with you. They might do it after. Like, it's just an important part of. And for. That could be a stress relief for people. It could be a way of connecting, of coming home, of learning. But again, for people who aren't having satisfying sex or pleasurable sex or they don't know how to ask what they want, masturbation can also be a great time to figure that out. Discovery, do the work. Discovery, exploration.

I hear that you're talking about the difference between, like, embodied solo play or embodied masturbation versus, like, kind of a reflexive action, which is really different.

Yeah, it's very, very different. Just like, I just got to get off to get through the day or to just put a mindful masturbation practice is really more about. About the presence. And what can I learn about what actually turns me on and what feels good? And, you know, when you're doing that, you can think like, well, how would I explain to a partner how to touch me in this way? Or think about it after? Because we don't want to get you too in your heads. But if you become the expert of your own pleasure and your own body, then you can impart that wisdom to your partners, to your lovers.

I love that you become your own pleasure expert, and then you transmit that to your partner through communication, which is lubrication. And they also become an expert in your pleasure. Wow. I love that.

Yeah. And they're not mind readers, and most people think they are, they're gonna figure it out. They're gonna know, and they don't, and they won't. And even if you told them once, people like, oh, what? I showed them, like, no, it takes a while to learn new things. So, yeah.

And you're not gonna ruin it by communicating.

Probably just gonna get it better or get what you want.

Gosh forbid, that's how you get what you want. They're not just going to figure it out. They don't. So it's like think of yourself. You're writing your own owner's manual and then you get to like pass it off.

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I want to talk about the O.

Okay.

The okay of okay. How important is having an orgasm?

Well, it's a great question and I don't think my answer is gonna be as popular with everybody. But we love orgasms like it is. Like it is the dessert. It's the icing on the cake. It's everything. Orgasms are fantastic and are really, really time. But the more we focus on orgasm as the end goal.

Yeah.

We're less likely to enjoy the journey and the process of connection and intimacy and touch and all the things that we've talked about and we put a lot of pressure on ourselves to orgasm. Not only is it less likely to happen too. Sometimes we're like, oh, am I going to come and is it going to happen? And it won't. So really just focusing on connection and what feels good is definitely the way to go. And you might just find that you have more orgasms afterwards.

Yeah.

However that to say there is an orgasm gap and men are more Likely to orgasm than women. Women take longer to orgasm. So that is like the gap that I'm talking about. And so this is an understanding definitely in heterosexual couples to understand that there is a gap. There are certain things that need to happen so we can have ours too, as a woman. But I think that we gotta do a whole chapter on orgasm. We gotta talk about it. But I don't think that's the end all be all for sex.

Yeah. Now. Now I'm curious because when most of us think of orgasm, they think about a culmination. The symphony culminates and there's an explosive whatever. But is there a sense of that the richness of orgasm could be there the whole time?

Yeah, there is. I mean, you could have an embodied, connected, full body orgasm that's building through your body. And it's not just about that, that one like ejaculation moment or that that orgasm, that the whole experience.

Could feel orgasmic and pleasurable and connected. And that is a great practice.

Have you had that?

I.

Like the whole time it felt like. I've had times where sex felt very orgasmic and pleasurable for longer than others.

Yeah.

And yeah, I have not in a. Yes. I think that I'm also, you know, I know what it takes to get there.

Yeah.

Vacation sex is wonderful sex on the weekend sex when you are with a partner who's also into that. But I have, I'd say I have more present mindful sex than not. But the whole time it feels like an orgasm and not going over. Because there are also other practices of, you know, really, if you look at like other religions, like other, like tantric Taoist practices of men having full body and women too, orgasms and not ejaculating and the experience of bringing the energy over into your body and moving the orgasm. And I have done some practices like that, but I don't live in that space. But I know that there's so much to learn from that and I would love to live in that space.

Just like moving through the world in a constant orgasm.

Yeah, people do. And I think so. I don't think they do every day. I don't think anything happens every day. And I sometimes I have amazing sex. And as I have sex, that's just okay too. Just because it's my job doesn't mean that like I live there. And I think for some people who.

Thank you for normalizing that, I want.

To know, oh my God, there's times I don't want sex. There's times that I know that I'm not gonna have an orgasm. There's times that my partner wants and I don't. I go through everything that everyone else does. I mean, the only difference is I know how to name it, how to communicate about it. Yeah, but I go through all of that. But, yes, I know all the people in, like, the same sex magic space and the sex witch and they have orgasms for days. And I've been friends with them and interviewed them, but I don't live yet in their place. But it would be. Sounds like a nice place to visit and to. To go eventually. Does that make sense?

Yeah, me either. It's.

Do you know what I mean? Tantric and goddess and live all together in a commune and all the things. Like, I. Yes.

I wonder. I wonder. I mean, have had similar experiences. You with you.

Not yet.

Not yet, baby. How does so much of my episodes turn into flirting? I don't know.

But, you know, I've had those experiences where it's like the whole time was, like, just cosmic. And I've had experiences just walking through the world where I feel, like, that sort of cosmic energy, that specialness. But I appreciate that it's not all the time because then it highlights the moments that are.

Right. Well, exactly. Get anything done if you're always in an orgasmic state. Right. Like, these people. Like, yeah, it would be a really hard thing to do. But yes. I mean, I think orgasm can be described, too, as a energetic state that we could feel bliss and pleasure in a lot of different ways.

Yeah.

But orgasm specifically is a, you know, specific, you know, place you go to. But that feeling of arousal in your body and being able to circulate that energy is a powerful practice.

Yeah, it is.

Yeah.

Speaking of powerful practices.

Yes.

I got some games that I want to play.

Oh, fun. Okay, let's play.

So the first one is based on your book.

Okay.

Okay. So you talk a lot about role playing in your book.

I love role playing.

I know. And I have yet to get into it. So this is when I, like, there's no one I trust more to get into role playing than you.

I'm so excited.

So you have a list of role playing options in your book, and I thought we could do a little role playing.

Yeah.

Okay. So I'm gonna read some of these, and they. A lot of them have, like, power dynamics to it, which I think is interesting.

You need the power dynamics.

You do okay.

To elicit the arousal. And sex needs that too. It's that masculine, feminine balance of energy. Someone's leading someone's following. So that's what makes it like, if you're both work, I guess you could both be working at a restaurant. You could both be bartenders. And also. But this is a built in power plate.

This is an aspect of roleplaying that has power play. I got it. I got it. There's a couple in here. Also. One of my favorites is two superheroes.

Okay, so it's really a toss up for me between aliens and superheroes.

Oh, my God. Those would be hard. That's what's so funny. Like, those would be the hard ones for me. I'm kind of like alien.

Well, we can start with that.

Just because I'm not like in the sci fi. Like, that's harder for me.

I love sci fi.

Okay, see, I don't. Oh, but that's what I'm saying. I'm not like alien. I'm not like. But I could. I could be like. Okay, I feel like I need a voice.

Do you want to do alien or superheroes?

Well, I don't know. The power dynamic in superheroes. Actually, that's.

I'm into that. Maybe that's why I'm into it. I don't like power dynamics.

Because if you're both superheroes.

I know, maybe.

Unless I'm a fallen or an old superhero.

Oh, my God. Always in that power dynamic or something.

I don't know. That old is a thing, right? I broke a leg.

Yeah, maybe.

Anyway, okay, so these are double. Okay, so you. It could be alien.

Okay, okay, so you're alien. I'm the person who wants to be abducted by alien.

Yeah.

Okay, here we go.

Okay.

Wait. Who is a power, though? The alien is a power.

Right.

So I'm abducting. I'm abducting.

Maybe I choose ones that don't have power dynamics.

Yeah.

Okay. Hey there, alien. How's it flying through the sky?

You don't look like anything I've ever seen before.

That's right. I'm a hottie too. Hottie. And I'm into your spaceship.

Do you want to go for a ride on it? Have you ever been on a spaceship?

No, I've never been on a spaceship, but I'm certainly into being taken by you and examined.

Really? No, but see. Okay, let me just ignore myself.

Tell me, give me some pointers.

I don't know how to roleplay during role play.

Okay, they will.

You are going to laugh, you're going to giggle, and that might go on for 10 minutes, 20 minutes, might go for five minutes. But eventually one of you Gets to, like, keep it.

Yeah, okay, keep it.

Like, stick. And then eventually you're like, okay, I get it. And then you get into it. And the great thing about role playing is then you actually get into another place. You're no longer like, Scott and your partner. I'm no longer Emily and my partner. I'm like, oh, we're in this thing together. It's a shared experience. We're building a new story. And I might just end up picturing you as, like, someone that I'm about to abduct. And how hot is that?

Yeah.

So it transforms through. So everyone feels awkward. Everyone laughs. But then that's funny and fun.

That's so interesting. I never like that awkwardness. And I mean, it goes.

I'm getting permission. Yeah. I'm going to give people permission. And then you just. Yeah, get into it. I mean, it's fun when there's. I mean, this one is a harder narrative and a hard narrative, but, like, massus impatient or like, things that are like teeth and teacher. And student. At least. I mean, it just. Anyway, we keep going. With Alien.

We had teacher and parent in there.

Oh, yeah?

Was it teacher and. Okay.

Teacher and parent's good. No. Teacher and student. No, But. But anyway, with this one, it's like, no, I've got this. I've got a spaceship. You want to come on it? Like, tell me why you want to?

Like, I want to.

I don't think you're ready for it. Spaceship. You don't look. You're not, like. You're not wearing the right kind of clothes.

Should I take off my clothes?

I mean, not yet, but I have something that you actually have to wear to get onto my spaceship.

Does it have zippers?

It might have. Why? You ask so many questions. I like zippers. We might have zippers. Snaps.

Yeah. Does it snap in the front or the back? Wait, I don't feel like I'm being very sexy.

You're not. You're being very. No, I'm in charge. I'm in charge, okay? Oh, you're not comfortable being in charge.

Maybe I'm super comfortable.

You take charge, Alien.

Oh, get. I'm into bossing, so it doesn't matter.

I could tell you that your clothes are going to be off and you're going to be wearing one of my socks. Spacesuits.

Okay. Do you have my size?

Let's see. You're tall.

I am tall.

And I like the way you look.

Thank you.

Handsome. You've got, like, long, strong arms.

Yeah, I work out.

I can Tell you work out. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So yeah, I think I have something that probably fits you.

Okay. Should I put it on now?

Well, in this process of you getting into the spaceship, which is actually not as easy as it sounds, I actually have to be the one driving and telling you what you can wear, what you can do. So I'm gonna have to go back into my spaceship for a minute and I'm gonna come down with this space suit that you have to put on.

Okay, I'll wait here and please.

But when I'm away, I hope that you could maybe take off your clothes. And when I come back, I'm gonna have something for you.

Okay.

Oh my God. Yeah.

Wait, Are you hot?

I could have.

Are you hot? And both.

I got into my dominant role, which is rare for me, and I was like, yes, I kind of like this.

I was getting into it too. There was a moment, There was a moment.

There was a moment where you're like, yeah, which moment? When I said you were hot?

No, I felt nervous then. I think it was like when you started telling me what I should do. Even in the role playing. Like when you broke character to tell me what to do in the role playing. Oh.

When you broke the fourth wall of the roleplay I was in.

Good.

Yeah. It's certainly something that like, I mean like maybe. Cause I grew up as an actor, but like I did taking on another character is so strange to me in the bedroom because I'm like. I've had to take so many layers.

Off to try to be authentic, to be disassociated. But then I guess from a place of connection, you can still bring in the connected principles while you're trying to someone else.

Yeah.

A fun, easy role play is the sexy stranger when you meet at a bar. So I love, love this one because you don't have to like, it's not as much of a. You gotta like bizarre fantasy. Bizarre fantasy. But. But even just meeting again for the first time. So telling your partner, like, let's meet tonight at 8 o', clock. We're gonna meet at this bar and I'm gonna show up and I'm gonna be someone else. And you're gonna be someone else. Maybe it's your alter ego, it's who you, you know. And it's just kind of fun to get to know each other from a different place and like. Or remembering what it felt like when you first met them.

Yeah.

Like, come here often. Where are you from? And then just. I don't know, it just, it suspends everything else you know about, though, not suspends. It just sort of. Yeah, you see them in a different light.

I love that.

And it's just a fun. I mean, you love acting. Yeah, it's fresh.

It's very fresh. I did more recently wake up next to my partner and I pretended not to know them.

Was that.

That was not a role play. That was just being funny.

How'd you get in my bed?

I was like, who are you? How did you get here? And he was like, what? Are you okay? I was like.

Am I. Who are you?

He played the amnesia patient.

How'd it go? Was it hot?

No, he was scared. And then I was like, I'm fine. I was just being playful. And he was like, was that role playing? I was like, not. Well.

It'S a thing.

It's a thing.

I thought you could do this, Scott.

I can do it.

Yeah. We could do all of it. It's just so. I think in smart sex, I'm really just giving people all the wisdom of almost 20 years of all the tips and tricks, and people could just find kernels that work for them that don't work because there's so much in there to play with. And role playing, I just doesn't have to be for every day, but it can be just a fun place to visit.

Yeah, I love that. So before we get to some of the audience questions, I found some terms online that I thought would be fun to talk about. Okay. You might have heard of these words. I had never heard of some of them. And it's spectrophilia. And this is a phenomenon involving sexual attraction to ghosts or sexual arousal from images and mirrors. So that's.

Yeah, yeah.

Yeah. I mean, like, boo Boo.

People have fantasies or fetishes about so many different things. Like, there's a. Yeah, there's a lot of. But that would be. Who knows? Like, maybe they were watching ghost ghosts or watching a thriller, watching something, and that sort of got linked up to their eroticism in that moment. Maybe they were masturbating and thought they saw a ghost. And then now forever time, that becomes their.

Yeah. Their thing.

Yeah.

That's such a good point of, like, the things that wire together. Could be.

Stay together.

Yeah, Stay together. So it's like. Yeah. The coupling of movies. I mean, I have arachnophobia from watching arachnophobia as a kid.

Really?

Yeah. There's totally. Scared of spiders.

Oh, my God. I'm wondering if there's.

No, no, I've gotten. I mean, I've worked through it. In therapy quite a bit, but. Yeah. And definitely don't feel comfortable swimming in the ocean because of Jaws.

Oh, my God.

Yeah.

Okay.

That one still haven't gotten over.

Oh, no.

But swimming in the ocean, I mean, I go up. I go up to my waist and then back out. This one I really like. I think I'm pronouncing it wrong, but we'll go for it. It's carrhesia, a form of sexual intercourse where the emphasis is on the sensations of connectivity and extended intercourse with orgasms not being the goal. It's kind of what we were talking about.

Yeah, that is what we were talking about. I love that. I love the orgasm not being the goal and just. Yeah. Connection and touch.

Korezia.

Korezia. What's the origin? How do you spell it? Yeah, with C, A, R, K, A.

R, E, Z, Z A or Z Z A if you're Canadian or Australian. Yeah.

Oh, yeah. There's like a product line called that.

Really?

Yeah.

Oh, interesting.

Like a. I think it's like a weed. Like a pineapple or something. I think so, right? I think so.

Cottage. Cottagene is a term used in the UK to describe the practices of engaging in sexual acts in a public restroom.

Oh, okay.

Have you ever done that?

Yeah, I think so.

Yeah.

But not in Europe. What was it called? Exhibitionism.

Exhibition.

Yeah. I fooled around in a public restroom. I'm sure I have.

I would really like to join the Mile High Club. I just want to announce that publicly.

Okay. Yeah, you go ahead and make that happen.

I've been researching on how do people get away with it.

I know I don't know how.

And I've just seen a lot of horse stories. International flights for sure. And I'm about to take a big international flight. It's like 32 hours. And so I was researching them, like, how do people get away with it? And it's just been a lot of very embarrassing stories of getting caught that I've found so far on Reddit.

Yeah, Well, I think you should.

I'm try it, though.

Try it.

I'm definitely going to try it.

Bring some lube on the plane.

I will text you right away as soon as it's.

It is illegal.

Cuckolding.

Cuckolding or cuckolding.

Cuckolding, Sorry. Cuckold.

Cuckolding. Yeah. That's a really common fantasy. Cuckolding the cuckold. And that is a fantasy that. Usually the origins of it, but the gender won't really. Anyone could have this fantasy. But originally it came from a man Having a fantasy about watching his wife have sex with somebody else while he watches. Now, I don't know.

He's being cheated on kind of.

No, but he's present.

Oh, he's present.

So there's a lot of different layers to this.

Okay.

For some people, it could be based on this. It's this transgression. It's this really, like, horror. The thought of my wife being with somebody else is so awful that it's actually humiliating. It makes me feel really bad at myself. But then that is sort of arousing as well. And so. So I want to do this fantasy. Right. I want to see that I want to have. And then in some cases, it's just like. It's just really hot to see my partner being. And again, it can be my partner being pleased by somebody else while I'm watching. So cup holding is typically someone. The partner is like, watching their partner have sex with someone else while they watch. So again, it would be different for everybody. Like, sometimes it's about the process or the fear leading up to it gets transmitted into a rousing puzzle, or it's just hot. But, yeah, cuckolding is actually a really common fantasy.

Do you find it's hard or was there ever a time in your life where you had to work through judging or judgment? Or have you always been, like, kind of judgment free?

I'm the least judgmental person, and I don't know why. I really do not. I do not judge, and I don't. Maybe that's why I can do my job. Because the way I see most things, I can see most sides to things I can understand. I can get to the place of where I see where the person's coming from and sort of of. Yeah, no, but I don't have any judgment. I'm like. Because I also see all the cases of how it works for people, and I understand that. I want it to be consensual. I'm not forcing my partner to go do this thing. And so, although sometimes with cuckolding, they do. But, no, I don't judge it as much. Are you?

No, no. Especially not as a therapist and as a human, which is my primary thing in the world. Judgment is just not something I have inherently in me. I think it's the same thing of, like, when I hear a sexual fetish that's, I would say, definitely out of my league of, like, comfort, I still go, oh, tell me more. Like, I'm curious. And part of the curiosity is like, I wonder where that emerged from or how that like the origin story of that fetish or that desire, that impulse.

The psychology of it, where does it come from? I wish we could all get that way about sex. But most the of obviously we get to like, we judge. We do judge about sex, which is why it's so hard for us to be free. We didn't get to the shame part of the pleasure thief. It's like the shame keeps us from the shame around. Feeling that we're being judged is just debilitating and stops us, a lot of us from having the sex that we want worry that we're being judged. But I think then the more we, you know, the antidote to that is being clear about what we want and our desires and our arousal and pleasing a partner. And then you're just like, and who cares? Like, we always judge others. They're probably not doing what you think they are. The neighbors are probably having freakier sex than you think. Like everything we just don't really know or we assume everyone's having more sex than they are or less sex than they are. Just. And also it doesn't matter. Like the truth is, doesn't matter. Like the more we focus on our sex lives, the better.

And shame isn't just a feeling. It's a state. And it's a physiological state at that. It's a freeze in our nervous system. And there's so many variations of shame and where the origins of that. But do you have a general like, because so many people come to you. I know. And there's an element of shame that's in their body, in their being. And like how do you even begin to navigate.

I mean it is such a process. I mean shame just shows up everywhere. It is a heady stew. But the first thing is recognizing where you came from. Oh, I'm feeling bad about sex. I'm feeling like I'm a bad person. And then recognizing, you know, one thing is to recognize where that came from, what's the origin of that. And then you might realize that this voice in my head actually isn't mine. It was like planted there by a who knows, I like religion or my parents or something I heard. And then once you start to disconnect from that and then create your own sex positive messages, like knowing that you are someone who's deserving of pleasure and pleasure is your birthright and rewriting your story and your connection to sex.

Yeah, it's so powerful. It's so powerful. I mean returning agency to ourselves, which includes like how we get to feel about sex as Opposed to. To what we internalized and what was sort of implanted in ourselves from a parent or a culture or religion. It's just like, yeah, surround ourselves.

Exactly. I mean, it's so. I mean, that's like a. Such a process that I know people can do it. It's a journey because it's like you were, you know, let's say maybe for the first 18 years of your life, you were hearing this message, and maybe you find yourself 10 years later, right? You're almost 30 now, and you're like, oh, but why do I still think this? This is where the work has to happen. And so it's surrounding yourself with more sex. Positive voices, unfollowing people that make you feel bad on social media, practicing talking about sex, listening about sex. I think that's why a lot of people have found a lot of relief in my podcast, Sex with Emily, because they. People like you said, email me. And I didn't get it at first. When I was early on, like my boyfriend, I just drove for 12 hours and listened to your podcast the whole time. And I was like, that's a lot of. That's a lot of Emily. I didn't do that. I think it's because they're hearing it allows them to feel safer, like, oh, it's okay to talk about sex. I feel safer now. This is how you do it. And so that could start to sort of decrease your shame and increase your empowerment.

I haven't really talked about my personal sex life as much on my podcast, but I was waiting to do it more with you because I'm like, normalization does. And hearing people talk about it in a way where it's like an embodied liberation is within them and they're talking about it, I think is contagious. I hope it's contagious. I mean, you're a testament to it.

Yeah, I think it is. And then you realize, like, I think the great thing that happens is it is contagious. And then you realize once you've had really, like, sex positive, affirming conversations, you can't go back.

You can't.

It's really hard to go back to just being blind to it and repressing.

Yeah. Yeah. So, Em, we have some questions from our audience that I'm excited to get your expertise on.

I love it.

The first question is, what's the best way to communicate my sexual desires and boundaries to my partner without causing discomfort or misunderstanding? I mean, we've been digging.

I think we covered probably where I would go with that. But. But yeah, it takes patience. It's not a one time conversation. The sex conversation is ongoing. So just starting with, I'd really love to make sure that we are both in a growth mindset around sex, that we want to grow together, learn together, that you would commit to opening up and like, let's just go on a journey together and figure out what we both love. But I think we go back to the timing, tone and turf, and all those things help.

Beautiful time, tone and turf. Sing it, my friends. How can my partner and I reintegrate sexual activity into our relationship after significant life changes like a child or health issue? May I recommend an alien and an abductor roleplay? Yes.

Something totally different from the norm? No. Well, first, I love this question because the truth is, like, we're always going through life changes, but like, a pregnancy is a really big one. A divorce, a death of a loved one, a disease. Disease, not diagnosis. What do you say? Diagnosis, Health issue, Health issue, health issue. These are all things that are going to kind of disrupt maybe our normal sexual functioning or sexual routines. But the challenge comes. Why it's so hard for so many couples is because if we don't already have that cadence of talking about sex in a healthy way, and then it gets disrupted because like a baby just came out of your body and now your whole life is changed. It's like, and then we haven't talked about it, and then gets put on the back burner because we don't address it. This is when problems happen. But if you do have a challenge over any of these things, this is when you have to say, like, let's really talk about it. You know, my body has changed. I'm still experiencing pain, I'm exhausted because the baby's crying and sleeping and. But yet our sex life is still important to you, babe. And I'd love to find ways in different times that we could have sex. So like just like normalizing it, talking about it, and then like literally troubleshooting like everything else. If you couldn't go to your workout anymore because you had different things to do, let's say you and your partner always worked out together every morning, but now you have a new job, let's say, or the baby, you'd say, when could we do it again? What would be a great time for us? Or maybe we can no longer, you know, go running together, but would you be down with walking? And then, you know, so it's like, when you people get into this, they'll realize that it doesn't need all of these special places to go with it. You would employ the same ways that you talk about other things in your life to sex. But I think with this, it's just like, first, I want to normalize too, that your sex is going to change each decade to decade, which. Each thing. So just saying, like, oh, we're another one of those places where we get to. We get to reimagine our sex life right now with a newborn, with a new job, with this new medication I'm taking, and then you get to play together and like another. Another opportunity to expand.

Yeah, I love that framework. It's such a positive framework of being like, we're in a next incarnation of our evolving life together. Yeah, I love that. That takes out some of the fear and the shame and this concern that, like, oh my gosh, we're in this phase where you're constantly in a phase. Right.

This is a phase. I was in a phase, like three hours ago. Now I'm in a new phase.

Exactly. All right. Could you explain the physiological impacts of having mismatched sexual libidos in a relationship and how to address it?

Yeah, I mean, well, first, that's the most common thing in the world. In every relationship, there's going to be a high desire partner and a low desire partner, and they're gonna come together and have a relationship and there's going to be struggles and challenges. And so what's happening in those moments is, yeah, there's one person who. It's mismatched libido's desire discrepancy. They want it more often than the other one. And so since that happens, you can already see there's an inherent problem there, challenge. So then they get to talk about how many days feel right to you. And then, I mean, if you want to just get down to the days a week or times. But I actually don't love starting there, to be honest. Let me back up. It is important to say, like, well, what does feel right to you? I want sex every day. You want sex once a week. So the easy place to start is like, okay, it looks like we have to have sex three and a half times a week for us both to feel great. And then you get to think about even further. Like, in my book, I talk about the pillars, the five pillars of sexual intelligence, of sex iq. And like, one of those is actually knowing when you are aroused and turned on. Like, what needs to happen for you to be turned on. Yeah, like if you decide that you want to have sex more often with your Partner, what could they know about you to know that you're. Maybe it's when they give you a massage or when the house is clean or you're on vacation or in the evenings and not in the mornings. And once you start to really understand when you're most in the mood and when your partner's in the mood, that's another way to kind of figure out when you could have sex more frequently. But in these times, it's just an understanding of. Yeah. That there's a desire discrepancy. It's gonna be there, and we're gonna have to solve for it rather than making it the problem. Let's learn to manage it.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I love that. So, like, getting to know your own sexual rhythms, that's really important. Yeah. And then also, just, like, what helps you get into that state of readiness or desire? I mean, so that it's not just left up to luck?

Well, that's the thing. Most of us. I don't know why I'm turned on. I don't know why I'm aroused. I don't know what. But we do. Like, if you look back on the time, the last time you were aroused or we can think about last time you were turned on, what was happening to build up to that? Like, what was. What were those things? And so was it time of day? Were you on certain medications or off a medication? Was it cold in the room, hot in the room? What were you wearing? How'd you feel in your body? And, like, these are all such important things to uncover, to understand your own desire and arousal. Runway.

Yeah, I appreciate that. It really says our whole life is not determined just from our hormones. There are other contributing factors that we have.

There's so many factors besides hormones.

Yeah, yeah.

Health.

Yeah.

Confidence, all the things.

The temperature of the room.

Yeah.

I love that. I actually really like that. I like it warm. Just so you know, for the future. Okay.

Last question. How do I address feelings of jealousy or insecurity arising from my partner's sexual history? History or experience?

That's a great question. I mean, with jealousy, we first have to look at ourselves, too, because jealousy is usually telling us something about ourselves. Like, what is coming up for you when you hear about your partner's sexual history? Are you feeling less than? That you're not good enough, that they have more experience than you do, that they know more than you do, and therefore you're going to be an adequate lover? Like, look at all the stories we tell ourselves to keep ourselves or to create this conflict with our partner, when really we get to first recognize that would be the first step. It's like, what's it saying about me? And I think it's. So we don't want to do that because jealousy can feel so ugly and awful and real too. Like, the point, like, I'm really jealous and I need to go after this. But once we can understand, like, oh, I'm actually not feeling, let's say, experienced enough, well, then we get to, what a great opportunity to talk to our partner about it and just say, you know, like, this brought up a lot for me. So when you talk about your past lovers, it makes. Makes me feel less than that I don't have enough experience. And so I want you to know that I'm having these reactions. So maybe you don't want to hear them talk about their exes anymore. Yeah, but. Or maybe you want them to reassure you that they love the sex that you're having. Or maybe there is something else they want you to do, but we don't know until we actually get underneath that jealousy and see what it's telling us.

Truly, I appreciate that. And there's something you said about reassurance is that, like, there's this idea that asking for reassurance means you're needy or messed up. And I want to differentiate, like, asking for reassurance, and if you can't receive it, that's where you got to go do your own work. But asking for it is actually fine. Right?

I know. Yeah. And when I said that, I was like, oh, wait, I went there too. Because, like, oh, well, if I have to ask for it, it's not real. How do they're not lying to me, you know? Another way to do that, though, is. Yeah. To say, like, I need to know that I'm a great. And if there's something else that's lacking, like, what a great time to talk about what we could both do to make this really hot.

Yeah.

So maybe reassurance less than, like, more. What could we do together to make this the best sex we both ever had? What would that look like? What would that take? Yeah, Because I gotta say, this whole thing about a lot of us, sort of, this is very common, actually, that people are like, my partner has had so many more lovers, and I'll never be able to stand up to that. And it just. Every time you're with somebody is a new opportunity to create a new sexual union. You're both bringing your own energies to the table. And I just think we could leave the past and the past and focus on what we have and what we can create together.

I love it, I love it, I love it, I love it. And Emily, Dr. Emily, thank you for being on the Gently Used Human, guiding us all into the pleasure renaissance that you are bringing us towards.

Thank you for having me.

My pleasure.

I love being on your podcast. I love talking to you.

Talking to you. Where can people find you and get connected with you?

I'm all over I'm Sex with Emily on all social media. My podcast is Sex with Emily Emily. We release two a week. I have a shop with Emily's site on my on my website's all my favorite sex toys and products and things that make you feel good. But find it all at Sex with Emily.

Go find and hang out with Dr. Emily. She is the absolute best. Thank you all for listening to the Gently Used Human. Until next time.

Thank you for listening to the Gently Used human podcast with Dr. Scott Lyons and friends. Visit visit gentlyuse.com for fun extras including submitting your questions for advice from a Midwestern mom. And don't forget to spill the tea and gossip about the show with all your friends and frenemies. And show some love by giving us five stars and leaving a review in your favorite apps. This helps us connect with all the other gently Used humans out there. Oh, and by the way, you, you look fierce today.