Trust Your Gut & Not the Pill with Dr. Jolene Brighten

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Look into his eyes. They're the eyes of a man obsessed by sex.

Eyes that mock our sacred institutions.

Bedroom eyes, they call them, in a bygone day. Hey, Emily, you got a boyfriend?

Cause my man E here, he just got his heart broken. He thinks you're kind of cute.

A girl's gotta have her standard.

Oh my.

Do women know about shrinkage? Isn't it Common knowledge. What do you mean, like laundry? It shrinks.

Can we not talk about sex so much?

Are you kidding me? Oh my God. That feels so good.

Being bad feels pretty good. Well, you know, Emily's not the kind of girl you just play with.

You're listening to Sex with Emily. We're talking about sex, relationships and everything in between. For more information, go to sexwithelmily.com do that now. Have you not been there lately? It is awesome. We've got posts and blogs and all the things to help you have better sex and relationships, which I know what you're all about. So thanks everyone for listening. You can also catch me Monday through Friday from 5 to 7pm on Sirius XM channel stars 109 for more sex talk, which is really cool. If you want a free subscription, you can go to sexwithemily.com sxm and here's the cool thing. You don't even have to get a subscription to Sirius. I mean, they would like it. But if you want, you could call us 888-947-8277. I can still answer your calls that way. As always, follow me exwithemily across the board on all social media. But I'm so excited to welcome my guest, Dr. Jolene Brighton. Hello. She wrote the book beyond the pill. A 30 day program to balance your hormones, reclaim your body and reverse the dangerous side effects of the birth control pill. And she's a functional naturopathic medical doctor on a mission to give women's health the respect it deserves, which it does deserve. And there is something called post birth control syndrome. And I friggin. We all kind of know this, right? Like of course there is. You can get your period back, you can resolve acne, you can enhance fertility, you can get your moods back. Maybe you're not depressed, you didn't need an antidepressant. Jolene. Dr. Brighton. Dr. Brighton.

You can call me Jolene. It's all good. We're besties now. I feel like I heard you had orgasm. You had me in orgasm.

I did.

Okay, good.

No, but really, this is such an important book. Because this is a movement. Because in reading your book, it's like first of all, men and women, everyone needs this information. And first of all, just so you can find her, it's rjolenebrighton. B R I G H T E N Everywhere.

Right?

And Twitter and website. On Your website is Dr. Brighton. We'll put this all on the everywhere. You're listening to this. Let's just start with the Pill is that it kind of reminded me of, like, Vietnam, right when they came back, and like, Agent Orange and all the. And then they're finding out. I mean, I know that's very extreme, but as a woman who took birth control pill, I'm not taking it now in my 40s, but in my 20s. And all these things, side effects and things that can happen as a result of it, like depression or anxiety. You're the only one speaking about this in this way. I believe the side effects and that the impact it has, whether you were on it for a month or 10 years, or the impact it can have when you go off of it. How do you regulate hormones, which are not very. We don't understand them very. Our doctors feel like they don't understand. We don't have a lot of information, and this book is just a wealth of knowledge that I think everybody needs to read and understand. And we're gonna explain a lot to you today. But does it feel that way to you? Like we've kind of been duped?

Oh, yeah. I feel like, you know, there's just so much that it was like we don't even have the right to question or talk about. And I did the pill for 10 years, and there was so much that I never knew about hormonal birth control, so much about. I didn't know about my body either. And I was just past the pill. It's almost like, in a way, as I look back at my own journey, and from what I've heard from so many patients, it's almost like we are past the p. To shut us up as quick as possible. And what shutting us up looks like is shutting down your symptoms. And that's your body's way of communicating. So that was your body literally speaking to you, and yet you were past a medication with no discussion about side effects or what would be taking place. Like most doctors, you know, and women and clinicians, like, we're not thinking about the pill as a medication as much as, like, oh, no, this is like a tool of women's empowerment. And, like, there's all these kind of spins on it. And yes, it is. And we have to remember it's also a medication.

It is a medication. Someone said, are you on any medications? And you'd say, oh, just the pill. We don't even think about it. But what we didn't realize was that even if you've been on the pill or not on the pill, what I think is so fascinating here is that women are, like, never given any information about what it actually means when you get your period and how your body changes and what we all hear about the cycle. And we know it's about 28 days or 30. 28 to 32 days. But the fact that day by day, that there's so much information that our body's telling us in our cycle. Day one, day seven, and what day nine means and day 12 is information that we really need to have. And is it because. Do we not know this stuff because people really didn't know this before? Or is it. Is it. Is it because we didn't really care? The information's out there. Like, why don't we know this?

I think that there's two big reasons. And it's, you know, and this is very reductionistic, so I can admit that. But I think it's shame, and I think it's a lack of respect. I think that there's a lot of shame about the female body. I think that we are supposed to. I mean, look at what they do on commercials. Let's pour some blue Windex to represent a menstrual cycle that you're having your period. And it's like, that is a very covert way of telling us this is something you should be ashamed of. And, like, how many of us. And you're probably gonna nod your head right now, and I'm no, better hide a tampon before we go to the bathroom. Like, we sneak it up our leave. Yeah, right. Like, totally do that. And, you know, it's all these things of, like, we're supposed to be ashamed of our body, and we get the narrative that our body's betraying us and that being a woman's just awful. Your period makes you the lesser. Like, that is all old, old story, narrative.

That's not true. Totally.

But this lack of respect, you know, is something that we didn't even start, like, studying women's bodies, like, until, like, a couple decades ago. Like, we were studying men and then saying it's the same for a woman, which makes zero sense, like, to be like, you're a man and you have ejaculate, but you're a woman and you gestate an entire human within your body. Like, you have this potential, and you go through these life cycles and all this stuff goes on and, like, to just say, we're the same. It makes zero sense on a physiological level. But I also think that there is. When you look at, you know, a lot of how we approach the female body, it's a lack of respect. Like, what other system is it okay to just shut it down and act like it's just, you know, it's a frivolous system to exist in the first place, except for the female reproductive system. And I think this lack of respect is also that, like, you know, we're not even going to take the time to really understand and study the complex pathways of a woman. I'm doing air quotes for people who can't see me because it's just too much, it's too complicated for a woman to understand. And doctors shouldn't be burdened with this. And we have these interventions and we just do that. And if we had more respect, I think we'd see more solutions for women beyond birth control. So beyond the pill, beyond hysterectomies, beyond ivf, we would be looking at other ways to really support a woman's body. And so this book, when I set out to write it, I mean, it's called, called beyond the Pill because I wanted to give women root cause solutions to their hormone imbalance, to what they experience as women beyond passing them birth control. And if they chose to use that, totally, they're right. Whether it's for symptom management or for pregnancy prevention. But they should also know what they're getting into, how to monitor their body and how to stay safe.

Well, let's talk about that, because whether you're on the pill or not, I don't, I'm not telling everyone just go off the pill right now. Although I think that's the direction we're heading in.

Yeah, no, I don't know about that.

Well, it was saying non hormonal birth control pills.

Well, I love non hormonal birth control options. But like, it's something that I'm really careful to walk a line of like.

We don't know then I'm just angry right now.

Yeah, I mean, it's, it's like understandably so. Right. But like, you know, part of my background is that I worked in a homeless youth clinic for two years. And these are women who, you know, they're at high risk for sexual assault. So the ability to control reproductive health is a health issue. It's not just a women's rights issue, it's a health issue. But in addition, there's something that we are only now seeing to get more play and more people talking about menstrual inequality. Like, how freaking expensive is it to buy tampons? And then if you buy the cheap ones that are full of chlorine and all these other things, and it's an Assault on your cervix. But, like, never mind. Whatever.

Just like, I thought they were at the dollar store.

Did you see this Joe Rogan, his stand up when he was like, tampons were obviously invented by men because they're just like, you're bleeding. Just shove something up there. And I. I died laughing. I, like, still, I go back to that and I cry laughing because I love so hard. Um, but with that, it's like these women who are living on the street, they can't afford tampons, they can't afford pads, they can't afford these things that, like, men definitely take for granted, but like, many of us have. And with that, being able to administer a depo shot so that they shut down their period, like, that's an amazing tool for them to have. And so I walk the line with it because we never really know what happens behind closed doors in a woman's life. And we really. We know what's happening in our life and we try to understand people from that position, but we can't really understand what does it look like for her. And so, you know.

No, you're right. That's true. Okay, I hear what you're saying, because we have to. We still have to take care of being. Of being safe and having safe sex and making sure we don't get pregnant. We don't want to get pregnant. I understand that. What do we not know, like, about our period, about our hormones? Like, what are the main things that we just don't get?

Yeah. Well, in 2015, ACOG, who governs obstetricians and gynecologists, they arrived at the place where they recognized that your period is the fifth vital sign. 2015.

How long we've been bleeding for freaking ever. I know.

It still is something where I'm like, when people are like, there's no more women's movement. We. We got everything we need. Like, there are people who spin this story. And I'm like, yo, they just recognized our period is, like, essential. Like, as of three years ago. Like, well, now, four years ago, I don't even know what day it is, apparently. But with that, you know, this is something where I take you through the book of, like, okay, firstly, we go into the lowdown of your hormones so that you can understand key players in your menstrual cycle, but also your overall hormonal health. Like, I set out to basically heal everything that sex ed teachers had, like, you know, basically wreaked havoc on in women's lives. Like, I walked away when I Finally got sex ed, and that wasn't until high school. And I was like, great, I know how to put a condom on a banana, but I'm not sure what my body's doing every day.

No idea.

And that's really what I wanted to do for women, is say, okay, here's what you need to know about your hormones. Here's how a natural menstrual cycle works. If you understand, hey, this is when estrogen rises, when testosterone rises, when progesterone rises. You can start to identify when things are not operating correctly. And then we go into the take back your period chapter, which is where every major period problem we face that women are past birth control for. I actually go into, this is what might be going on. This is what your doctor should test, and this is what you can do right now.

So give me an example.

Heavy periods. This is one. The other thing is that this book is helping women know what's normal and what's not normal. It's not normal to bleed for more than seven days. It's not normal to bleed through a tampon and pad. It's not normal to have to wake up and what. I mean, tampon and pad. I mean, you're simultaneously using a tampon and pad and it fails, right? Yeah. It's not normal to wake up in the middle of the night and need to change whatever, you know, period products you're using. Like, these things are not normal.

Even if you're on the pill or off the pill.

Even if you're on or off the.

Pill, no matter what.

And if you're on the pill, your periods usually are like, three days.

Right?

Exactly. So, yeah. So this is not normal.

Well, you're saying.

Let me back up.

Because people will go on the pill to suppress these symptoms. Yeah.

Let's talk about what's going on.

Yeah. Wait. But instead of doing that, then having a band aid solution of a pill, you can actually. You don't have to live with it. Like, we used to just think, that's our lot in life. I'm gonna have cramps. I'm gonna bleed through the bed. So totally. So then what do you do? So then you could say that could be a symptom of out of whack.

Well, I love that you say, you say a band aid because it's exactly what it is. It's a hormonal band aid. So it's like you're not seeing the symptoms anymore. But, like, just like a band aid does not heal the underlying issue. Like, if you've Got a wound, your body's gonna heal that. And you know, with the hormonal birth control, it will mask it, but you won't. So let's say it's iron deficiency anemia. Iron deficiency anemia can lead to heavy periods. Hypothyroidism can lead to heavy periods. Like, it could be fibroids going on. So there's reasons that we have this. There's lab testing. Your doctor can do simple blood tests. I mean, a CBC out of pocket, That's a complete blood count. Just a really quick dirty screen for, you know, anemia. Like $10. Like that we could do and check rather than putting her on birth control and understand if that's what's going on. And then there's things that you need to do at home. Like, if you heavy periods, it doesn't matter whether or not you are overtly. You got the diagnosis of iron deficiency anemia. You have to eat iron, you have to eat B12, B6, and you have to get folate in. We need those things to grow and build red blood cells and make them healthy. And if you're bleeding that much, you are losing red blood cells. You need to up your stores. And so I take women through, like, what do you need to do in terms of food, lifestyle and supplementation to make sure that you're protected? And as you mentioned, with acne, that's a big one. But what could acne be due to? It could be due to maybe you have depletions in vitamin A and zinc, maybe your microbiome, the good gut bugs are skewed in your gut. Maybe you have food sensitivities, maybe you have poor liver detoxification or poor bowel movements. Now you're putting things, your toxins out through your skin. Guess what? The pill actually makes all of those things worse. But it may shut down the androgen production, which might be what's going on with your acne. Acne is rarely just one thing, just for everybody listening. That's why, like, you know, you get on a pharmaceutical and you're like, why didn't it fix all the things? Because there's usually multiple things going on, but. So you might get put on the pill. But what if you have this, this acne going on because you have polycystic ovarian syndrome.

Exactly.

You have pcos. You're already at higher risk for stroke, heart attack. So cardiovascular issues, diabetes, hormonal birth control also raises the risk of those. And so given you might have a specific genetic mutation. So now you're trading Acne for a blood clot. You should know that you should have.

The informed test, because I'm thinking about young Emily. So me in my 20s, like, I barely, like, pay my rent on time or figure out how to make my bed or, you know, like, I'm three jobs. I'm trying to make my way an adult, and I still sometimes have, you know, adulting is challenged. So I'm just thinking about being a young girl and knowing, like, what would I. Maybe there'll be more resources now, but would I have known to get vitamin A and folate and how I got a book for that. I love all of your recipes. I guess I'm just thinking people are probably more resourceful than I would. I have cooked it. But these recipes are amazing. And that you have a solution. Like, you have a plan.

Oh, yeah.

You have supplements and plans and things that people can take now, which I think is genius. I took all your tests.

That's awesome.

It's got amazing tests in the book.

I'm a big fan of quizzes.

I like quizzes.

I mean, of course, we grew up with Cosmo, right? Honestly, I swear, I only went to the gym in my 20s to get the Cosmo.

I did the pink. My pink marker. I did the quizzes, and I was like, oh, this is. I mean, it just kind of like a. It's just. It's like every single thing that. Where was those? Where were they?

You know, I saw someone really brilliant. I wish I could take credit for this brilliance, but they actually screenshot. So on their phone, they took a picture, and then they filled it out on their phone. And people are doing it with their iPad as well. And then they're. They're do. They're archiving the file, and then they're coming back 30 days later doing the same thing. And there are women now. Cause the book's been out for two months. They're like, I have my before and after, and then I'm refining with the second one. And so then I'm gonna have, like, three months out. I'm like, I need to get you.

An app or something.

Oh, my God. Yeah. Why haven't I thought of that?

I don't know. No, you need an app.

You're brilliant. That's why I'm here. I'm hanging out with you.

Yeah, we need to hang out more. I already know we will, but I. But yeah, though, that's smart, because you guys should be the quiz. You're like, oh, yeah. I got excited. I was like, I'll take the quiz. And then you realize that, like, you know all the different categories tells you where you might have, like, for me, it was like low estrogen. And you go to low estrogen. This is what I need. So you could even skip around and be like, these are the things I need to be taking.

It's designed to get in and get out. Yeah.

Because who has time? But like, I want to send this to every single woman I know. But it's also important for, for like, for men too. Like, I think you're so right. This shame around the period. Like, I do I even hear, well, not with the girls. Maybe I'm like, yup, you put your tampa. You put your tampon up your sleeve. Or on the airplane the other day, like, I don't want people to know. But I just. And I. Even on the show, I'm gonna admit it, like, it's been, you know, maybe like five, ten years ago when I was like, oh, I never want to talk to a guy about my period. It's not sexy. It's not. But it's something that, that happens. And I think the more that we normalize it and we talk about it, we could all so much help each other. Women just have to. This information, if you're hearing this right now, I mean, share this with your friends. I mean, share this information about taking control of your health. Because I gotta be honest with you, and I say this on the, on the serious show, a lot of people calling in, they're going to their gynecologists and they're not getting these kind of answers. Women, for example, who are going through low libido, fertility challenges, it's more like. Or even acne, they're just getting pills and told to go home. And it's not that gynecologists aren't like, didn't go to school and they're not working hard, and they just don't have all of these answers. Which are new, right? New.

It's different tools. And that's what we have to look at is it's like your gynecologist isn't bad. I mean, they believe what they learned in school, which is, this is the pill for every female ill. And it will fix you and it will cure your symptoms. And like, if you believe it can help, why wouldn't you prescribe it? But it's a lack of tools. Like, that's their tools. And that's not because they're a bad doctor. It's just. It's a different philosophy. And it's an important approach, but more, you know, allopathic medicine is more of acute care. And what we're facing with hormone imbalances, they didn't happen yesterday, it didn't happen today. It's something that's taken place chronically. It's been over decades. So what we're facing now, you know, here I am in my 30s, and I look back at like, whoa. Yeah, those times where you were like, you know, metabolic obscenity is. Is what I call it, where you eat in a way that literally cusses out your body. Like, that's what I did through my teenage years. And I'm like, oh, my goodness. Like, I hope everything I'm doing now takes care of my bones. Because I didn't know then that, like, oh, you know, what you're eating, how you're feeling yourself. That has everything to do with bone health. You know, 14 year old me was like, that's an old person thing. What are you talking about?

Bones. I'm fine.

Bones. I have bones. But, yeah, no, but, like, you think back of like, wow, what we arrive in our 60s, our 70s, our 90s, like, experiencing is we set that foundation ahead of time. And so with your gynecologist, like, they're great for doing a screening exam. Please don't mistake a screening exam for preventative medicine. Having a, you know, annual exam and a pap every three years is screening. It's a screening tool. It's not. We get in our head like, oh, I'll just wait and go to the doctor and then I'll get that. Preventative medicine. Preventative medicine is what you put at the end of your fork, how you talk to yourself, how much time are you sleeping and spending in bed? And like, all of these kinds of things that they really, they're not sexy and they're not, like, they're the kind. Honestly, they're everything your mom told you to do. And she was right. And I know, come on, we all want to eye roll. Right? Right.

Exactly. Right. Right. Be nice to yourself. Sleep, rest, eat your vegetables. All the things. Let's talk about the pill and the impact it has on your libido. Because, I mean, until I started studying sex, I didn't realize that the pill was one of the culprits. And I just remember my experience going on the pill. It was so unfortunate because I went on the pill literally the day I went off to college. So I just kept thinking, it's freshman year, it's stress, it's anxiety. I no longer wanted to have sex. With my boyfriend anymore. I longer. I mean, there was a million different problems I had.

And then it's, oh, because you're just going to college. And it's all these changes, even when you go to your doctor. And it's a very common prescription of like, oh, you're going to college, here's your pill. Study hard, see you later. And no discussion about the fact that like, I was away from home. Things could go wrong with this. And what should you look out for?

Right, so how many cases of women, what percentage have an impact on their sex drive, what they want, their desire?

Yeah. Well, what's. We don't have great data on, like, like how many women are, you know, reported? Because it takes a woman reporting and talking about this on, like, how many women can we say conclusively that the pill is the reason for their low libido? Because as you know, a low libido is usually multifactorial. And we can get ourselves into a place where it's like, you start the pill now, you have pelvic pain, you have pain with intercourse, you're having vaginal dryness. I've talked with physical therapists who are helping women with vaginismus and you know, various conditions and they have said to me, women on the pill, I've seen women in their 20s have vaginas look like they're in their 50s because they're being deprived of these natural hormones and their tissue can start to atrophy, to shrink. They don't have healthy pink tissue and healthy mucosa making secretions. And so why this is important, we're gonna talk about what the pills does specifically to your libido and your hormones. But why this isn't piece is important is because maybe you got on the pill, you still had a bit of a libido. You weren't one of those women that crashed your libido they started having pain with. And you weren't, you were having inability to orgasm. What organism in the world is going to continue to participate in something that causes pain? So now we've got pain avoidance. Nervous system gets set and hardwired where it's like, oh my God, stay away. Like, that is painful. There's a penis coming at me. I don't want anything to do with that. And like now either your communication starts to break down with your partner. You think you're broken, something's wrong with you. Your doctor's really good at being like, yeah, libidos and all this business, that's normal. That's part of being a woman. And maybe you'll get some solutions. I mean, this was my story through my twenties. And my doctor, doctor recommended I cut off my nerve. Like, just cut your pudendal nerve. And that was a female doctor. And I was married at the time. This is not my husband. Now, this is. This is. You know, you guys, I'll be honest, I've been divorced because don't get married in your early 20s, Jolene. That was bad. It was just not a good decision for me.

Till you're 30?

Yeah, no, that's actually with my son. I'm like, just wait until you're 30.

That's why I said, I will.

Actually, if you wait until you're 30, I will pay for you guys to live together. Like, please just wait until your brain is developed.

Please wait till you understand life.

But, you know, with all of that, you know, this is something where, you know, when it comes to sexual dysfunction, as. And it's really. It's really sexual adaptation, like, we need to change that with women because we say you have sexual dysfunction, but it's not that you're dysfunctional. It's that you're having a physiological adaptation which is completely appropriate in your survival. You're not broken. Things are not wrong with you. We just have to go to the root of what is making your body adapt in that way. And that's something that's very much part of my message, is like, you're not broken. Not broken.

Well, we all blame ourselves, women. We normalize pain. We normalize inability to orgasm. We normalize so much. We blame ourselves for everything.

Oh, totally.

And we have nowhere else to go for it. And we just all, we all commiserate. I got my period and we just. Yeah, we don't realize that painful sex, inability to orgasm, like, all that we can get through totally.

And so with the pill specifically, we know that the pill alters the genetic expression in your liver. So, yes, people listening. I just said this medication alters your genetics in your liver. So you express higher amounts of the protein, sex hormone binding globulin. Now, it does this. This is a physiological adaptation to keep you safe. Because, yes, the pill is low dose, comparatively speaking. It is not low dose. It is comparatively speaking, to the first iterations in the 50s and 60s that were killing a lot of women and causing a lot of issues. And they lowered the dose over time. However, it is still a high enough dose that you take it and it passes through your liver. Your liver gets a shot at detoxifying it and trying to Break it down. But it's still high enough that it shuts down brain ovarian communication. So it's a low dose relative, but.

In reality one that was, you know, harmful. Very harmful to women. Yeah.

So with that, if sex hormone binding globulin goes high, it goes high. So it can protect you. It's grabbing onto these excess hormones because overstimulation of any hormone on the receptors is bad news news. But with that, it's also going to grab onto testosterone. So the pill can specifically shut down ovarian production of testosterone by up to 50%. And, you know, it might be higher in some women given, you know, their genetic makeup. And then we've got elevated sex hormone binding globulin. Now it's grabbing on to any testosterone that you do manage to make because.

Testosterone is also important for women.

Absolutely. Oh, God, it's so overlooked. And it's not just about libido. I mean, if you take the pill and you feel like, I woke up, I kicked ass and I repeated every single day and then I start hormonal birth control and my kick ass is gone. Where did it go? Testosterone. It could be testosterone. Testosterone's if you are. I start hormonal birth control and I'm crying throughout the day and I have no energy. That could be testosterone. That can be one of those reasons. So testosterone is super important in women's health. And it's, it's just like progesterone is super important in men's health. We just have different variations of it.

You know, that's the thing about getting also your hormones tested too, because I've tried different way. Like, is it blood tests? I've done the Dutch test.

I love the Dutch test.

Do you like it? You peed on the stick like seven times. I got my results. I wasn't sure. Yeah, yeah. So that is a good way to do it. People are like, oh, everyone's got all these different thoughts. I thought the Dutch test was good too. Some people haven't heard of it, but anyway, getting them tested, would you recommend that? Would you? Young people should get them tested. Their hormones are just kind of. You're talking about regulating. I'm.

Oh, I think we should get, we should get lab testing done while we're healthy. I mean, I think that's a big shortsighted approach in modern medicine is that we wait until you have symptoms and then the symptoms justify lab testing. And like, where does this come from? It comes from hospital administrators and insurance companies and all of that. I'm not Hating on doctors here. But with that it's like you have symptoms. Now that justifies me ordering the lab test. And now your labs come back and they say, well, they're not normal. Normal for who? Normal for who?

In this range. That's like in this range.

So if you take thyroid for example. Thyroid reference ranges are set on a, you know, basically they take the collection of the population that is getting thyroid testing, they average it out and they say that's the normal, that must be.

Normal of the population that's actually getting tested. They have access to the data and.

Why do we order, what did I just say? Why do we order testing? You have symptoms. Oh, so likely you're hypothyroid. We also see elderly people got this test. So are we comparing a 60 year old to a 20 year old year old and saying that should be the same, like completely different life cycles that you're at. So it's a big issue. And I think this is why I advocate for people to get their lab testing while they're healthy. You have your baseline, you know you're normal when you are doing the waking up, kicking ass, you know where you're at. And then when something changes now you can actually compare it and say, this is where I was, this is where I am now. Although my doctor may have said this is normal. When they see a significant change from where you were were, it gives a little pause and makes you look at things differently. But you know, so it's, you talked about like this book being a movement. I don't think I didn't set out for it to be a movement, but there's so many themes that have come out of it.

I feel like it's, I get angry, I read it, I'm like, yeah, no, I know. I said I think this is a movement. Because I, even if it's just a movement that I want women to, to take control of everything they put in their body and to understand their cycle. There's so much you can know about like the color of the blood, which days you're menstruating on, right? Like are your, your stools like what they, it looks like when you go to the bathroom? Right? Part of it, yeah.

All this stuff we're not supposed to.

Talk about, but that stuff, it's such a relief when you understand it. And so I do think it's a movement just for women to take control of their sexual health, just whatever it is, their periods, their. When you're going to a doctor and you don't just like take the pill and, and you know, go to sleep. Like, think about these things, read these things, understand it. Because, because the whole other thing is that when women are on the pill for so long and they go off the pill and they try to get pregnant and we've been told like, oh, that's just easy, just go off the pillow. But it's not. So if you.

My goodness.

Right. That's a whole nother. I mean, that's the thing. Like, I literally could have you over 10, like a 10 part series because everything I read, I came in, I'm like, Jamie, I don't know. Before I do this show, I want to talk to her about everything. Okay, we're going to take a quick break and we come back even more. Dr. Jolene.

So let's talk about something lighter here. Because you say women have four different types of orgasms throughout their monthly cycle. What are the four different ones we can have?

Yeah. So I am not an expert in this arena, but this is something that there is an actual sexual device called Lioness. Have you heard of this?

Yes, I have heard of it. It's in East Bay. They're doing it in Sanford.

I believe they are. I met them in LA at an event. And so they have recorded data of women not on hormonal birth control and found that there are four different orgasms that can happen throughout the cycle. And they have ones where they're like the mountains and the pe. Aches and the like there's. And they actually can, they can measure this. Now what's fascinating about this though is that I, I want to work with them more to be like, is it where they're at in their menstrual cycle that gives them. And it seems to be like where you are in your menstrual cycle. You can have different types of orgasms. So this is something where it's like, if you're on hormonal birth control, you're missing out on the smorgasbord of orgasms. You're missing out on the fact that you have all this data that you walk around with in your body. Like data of living in your body. Whenever a patient comes to me, I pass them a journal. I'm like, you have to start charting all of this information. They're like, what? I thought you're doing lab testing, right? Lab testing only is one snapshot in time. It only has value if I threw like, view it through the lens of your story. When it comes to lab testing, there also has to be certain days that you test. So I just had a woman who wrote to me, and she's like, my doctor said that my progesterone's fine, but it's super low. And I feel so confused. And he's like, there's no problem here with ovulation. I'm like, well, when did you test progesterone? Day 11 of my cycle. Did you ovulate? No, I ovulated, like, later. Okay. You only get progesterone following ovulation because you need the corpus luteum in the ovary to actually secrete that. And she's like. She wrote me back and said I went to my doctor. And he was like, I don't know where you learned any of that. That's not true. You can test hormones any day, Any day of a cycle. And I was like, you learned it in physiology.

I know. It's such true, right? The progesterone. I even know that's true because I've been talking to doctors, trying to figure out this whole journey for myself of what. What I'm supposed to do and how I'm supposed to test it. And a lot of them have. Some are like, the Dutch test isn't great, or you have to use saliva to test yours.

Well, and it just depends because, like, the Dutch test is indirect measurement of progesterone. But with the Dutch test, you get something you don't get in typical blood, which is estrogen metabolites. And I don't really care what your total estrogen is if I don't also know what you're doing with it. You can take the quiz. And women will get confused sometimes because. Cause they're like, my quiz says I have low estrogen, but then it says I have high estrogen. And how is this a thing? Well, you may have low estrogen in the follicular phase, and then you may have estrogen dominance in the luteal phase, or you might have lower estrogen levels, but you're making potent 16 hydroxy estrone. And that is stimulating all the bad things to happen, like growths in your uterus, growth in your breast, heavy periods, lots of clots, all of that. And so that's what's nice about the Dutch, is you can see the metallic metabolites. I also really value knowing where your adrenal glands are at when I explain hormones.

Explain that.

Yeah. Well, we want to talk about hormones. When I talk about it, it's like a pyramid. And the foundation of that is that's gonna be your adrenal glands. And Blood sugar comes into play with that. So insulin's in the mix with that as well. Right above that is thyroid hormone. And at the very tippy top is your estrogen, progesterone and testosterone. So your sex hormones. And everybody wants to chase the sex hormones because those are the symptoms that make them feel like they're crazy in their own body. But why would you keep the tip of the pyramid trying to build it up, make it strong, when the foundation just keeps crumbling? And so we need to look at what is going on with the adrenal function. In the conventional paradigm, you look at acth, which is a brain hormone that says to the adrenal glands, make cortisol. And they measure cortisol one and done. That doesn't really work because cortisol. So with the Dutch test, you're going to take at least four points throughout the day because cortisol has rhythm throughout the day. And you need to see when is cortisol high, when is it low. But in addition, are you making cortisone? Because maybe I got like the 10.

Pager, I didn't know what to do with it.

Yes, I know, I remember.

Yeah.

But you might get the standard test, you might get the standard blood test and it says your cortisol's, you know. Oh, it's like low, normal. But then when you look on the Dutch test, it might be that actually your cortisone, the inactive one, is through the roof. That is something that's telling us you don't have an inability to make cortisol. Your enzymes are breaking it down. They're trying to make it inactive. Why are they doing that? That. Well, too much cortisol will aid you at the cellular level. Yes, Women, that will be like gray hair and wrinkles. But it's also like death of your tissues. It's not a good thing. So your body protects you, it breaks it down. But it might also be because you've got infections going on or you've got thyroid issues. And so you have to dig deeper and look at that. And so that's something I love about.

The Dutch, though I'm the only one. I mean, I went to a naturopath and he did it. But that's. I don't think a lot of people know about it. You talk about in your book, too.

I do talk about it in my book because the other thing is I talk about melatonin and that's something where everyone's like, oh, melatonin helps you sl. And it's like, yeah, and if you don't have it like night shift workers, you're at higher risk for breast cancer. So this is something where when the doctor says, oh, you have a family history of ovarian cancer, the only way to prevent it is the pill. There's actually a lot of ways, you know, to prevent it. And melatonin is one of those.

Well, so there's a lot of things. What about pms, for example? I think that that's the other thing that women just assume, well, that's our lot. And light. I'm gonna have pms. I'm gonna want. Cause So I was thinking about this. So I went on the pill when I was 18. I hadn't had an orgasm yet. And it still has always been like, I. I never thought about masturbating. It was more challenging. And then I started having this PMS that I was like. So I felt like for a week of the month, I was going to like my whole life. You want to kill everyone. You're crying, you're sad. And then I'd feel like, finally I get my period. And literally that day I'd be like, oh, thank God, I feel better. But then I felt like for a while I was spending the next three weeks cleaning up for that week. That I was a disaster. Totally. Yeah. And my dad had died when I was 20, so I always tried to 19. So I'm just. It's so hard to tell my 20s, it was very hard time, but I was like. But then I went to a doctor when I was like 26, 27, I was like, I think I'm depressed. Like, well, you could take the. What was the purple pill then? It was like Zoloft. But it was. It was for pms.

Sorry. I just went to Prilosec, but then.

It was called something. But it was like for pms. But it was a pill. It was like Prozac. But once I was like, great. And it helped me with those symptoms and I was like, oh, maybe I'm not depressed, but how do we naturally then without going on the pill, if we are having pms? Cause what can we do at a base level?

Oh, there are pages and pages of that in my book. Because, you know, PMS is not normal. I thought it was.

Can I just buy this book? Because it is such a weird. When I read. I read it in a day. Like, it is fascinating to me and it just makes me like, it just. It makes me feel like I finally got the keys. This body of mine that I didn't really understand before. Even though I do a lot of work and it's my job. But I even went to a doctor a few years ago. He's like, well, hormones. We just don't know a lot. He looked at me and I was.

Like, yeah, there's this thing called PubMed, Stanford, you're Dr. Hormones. It'll come up.

You have that information so.

Well, doctors are learning a lot. They are learning a lot. We know a lot more and that's why we have a lot more specialists and a lot more people focused on things. And with pms, you know, people, they make all these jokes. There's so many jokes out there about women and about how our periods make us the lesser and how PMS is like the weirdest and she's just a bitch and all these things. And in reality, it's a sign that something's off. And a lot of the times it can come down to estrogen dominance. And so I'm gonna go, is it okay that I go there with your dad dying and what happened? Okay, so likely you have this incredibly stressful event like take place. And what happened is, is that as you're coping with that, your body's like, I have not evolved to know whether this is a lion or this is like an acute stressor of a loss of a loved one. Like, your body doesn't know what is sending the fear and the danger signal.

Sympathetic and parasitic nervous system is right, yeah. Okay.

Yeah.

Yes, yes.

Your body loving you, keeping you safe, wanting you to survive shifts you cortisol production. And like, let's put our energy into cortisol. So the brain is signaling survival at the expense of reproductive health. Because why on earth would you want to get pregnant when you can't run from a lion very easily? There might be. What if you're not eating? Because that's usually happens when someone passes. We, we, you know, calorically restrict.

I was anemic. Yeah.

I was like, yeah. And so with that, your body doesn't know if there's a famine or not. You can't support a whole nother life in your body. Babies are really noisy. If there's predators around, that's a problem. And so your body protecting you will sh you into this state of survival at the expense of you maybe ovulating or producing your progesterone. And so when you don't get those progesterone levels up so you have to ovulate, everybody listening whether or not you want a baby ovulation, that we focus on the menstrual cycle as if, like the period is the main event and.

Really the period event.

No, the period's the wah, wah, get pregnant. And the main event is really ovulation. And so with that, you know, if you ovulate, and we all want to ovulate through our fertile years because what is left behind is the corpus luteum. It is the only way for you to get significant, substantial progesterone up to challenge that estrogen. So that can be a relative estrogen dominance. Now you're in your 20s, you're in college, you're at the mercy of dorm food, root food, you know, like remembering back of like, so bad. Like, how much broccoli did you really eat? But with that, now we've got. How are you feeding your microbiome? Were you fueling liver detoxification, which is packaging up the estrogen? And are you pooping every day? Like, I don't know if I was even pooping every day.

I wasn't healthy at all. No, I wasn't healthy. I was studying and it was like that whole, like, I was a marathon runner.

Oh, yeah. So you were like, fight A flight is my jam.

Fight or flight? I was like running. I was like, you know, just survival mode. Yeah, for sure. And not healthy and not eating a lot of protein and not, you know. Oh, God. There was such. It was just the whole low fat thing.

Oh, totally. I did that too. Stupidest thing. No, stupidest. Not the stupid. One of the stupidest things I've done in my life is like, let's take the pill and be on a low fat vegetarian diet. And I'm like, oh, I did that too. Double up the no libido action right there. Because without fat, you don't build your sex hormones.

I had no fat. I had no fat in my 20s. Oh, no, I didn't know.

I was like. I convinced myself I hated butter and cheese.

Yeah, same.

Nobody hates butter and cheese.

Butter and cheese. Exactly.

And then today I'm at bulletproof conference, like, putting back, like, bulletproof buttered coffee.

Exactly. Bring it, bring it. Yeah, exactly. It's true. So that's. Yeah. That's what? Probably there was a lot of things going on, but there wasn't. But now I guess there's more information about how I would have said, solve that now. What about gut health? That's a whole thing too. That's.

Yeah.

How come we're just learning now that the gut second brain, like, what, What? We've been around for a long time.

Totally.

Were we just not doing the work Were we not?

We just were like, what are we lacking in medicine? Like, humility and curiosity. We think we conquer something, we put a flag in it and we're like, next, moving on. And like, we think, we think we know more than we actually do. And nobody wants to hear a doctor say, like, we don't know that much, but we really don't know that much about the human body. We're still discovering anatomical structures. There was just a study that came out last year showing in the rodent model that if you remove the uterus of a rodent, they can't navigate a maze. Oh, snap. Are you saying that our uterus is not just a baby container that's expendable, that you just cut out like that willy nilly because it might actually be interacting with our brain. And yet about 66% of us are Alzheimer's patients are women. Like, should we be maybe looking at the, these like puzzle pieces, so to speak, and putting them together? But you know, I have been in the medical and health arena for over 20 years now. And I remember when the microbiome was taught as just a bunch of freeloaders who lived in your gut. They made a little bit of B12, vitamin K, but other than that they didn't really do much. Like, it was very much like glazed over. And I, I'm, I'm a bit of a hoarder with my, like my school stuff. And I just like two years ago cleaned out all my binders from undergrad. Okay, I should have screenshotted all of them where it was like, microbiome, bunch of freeloaders, like it was in there. I was like, that's amazing. But with all of that, it's, you know, that was what, that was the dogma. We have to recognize that, like there is this dogma in medicine. It is belief, which belief is not part of science. Like, we do have our belief, but it turns into a hypothesis and then we test it and then we ask, is it true? Is it not true? And so, you know, with the microbiome, I think that part of it is that there's been this open mindedness to it, but it's also been that like our technologies are advancing so we can recognize that, like we didn't have the ability to do a lot of what we do now, 10 years ago, 20 years ago. And so there is technology catching up. But look at what we were doing before then. Appendix. No one needs an appendix. Just take it out. And now we're like, wait a minute, your appendix is actually like A little storehouse of these good guys who come out and they throw down against bad guys, like when you need them.

Yeah, that's what I've heard about the appendix too. Like, no, we need that. That's where stuff's happen. Just getting rid of body parts.

You know, a tried and true rule is that if your body continued to evolve and it retained these things, it wasn't for funsies. Okay. And just because, like, you didn't figure it out, like, we haven't figured it out yet, doesn't mean that it's frivolous or expendable. And that's a bit of like, what we've seen in women's medicine. Like, why have we not seen advances in reproductive technology? Why have we not seen advances in treatments and therapies? Because we passed you the pill. It ain't broke. Don't fix it.

Exactly.

And you'll just take it because you're the one who will get pregnant.

Like, this is my thing. Hasn't. It has not evolved. That's the thing. There hasn't been innovation. There hasn't. Well, now I guess there are more technologies. But as far as.

So, yeah, but that's like in the last handful of years, in terms of.

Your book is the first I confirmed. I mean, but there's been things that have said the pill's bad and I kind of knew it. I'm like, I'm glad I'm past that age. But I didn't realize that you could be taking it and go off it and you could never get back on track to how you were. Like, there's some work to do. Tell me about the results that you've had or the feedback you've had. The book's been out for two months. I want everyone to read this. But what have you gotten? People follow this. The 30 days plan, which I want, want to do. What kind of results have you gotten.

From people to you?

It has been mind blowing.

Yeah. I mean, so much of it is like, you, you put a book out into the world. I actually was like, having panic before the book came out. I was like, what if it's not great? What if it's dumb? What if I put too much into it? What if I'm just being a woman and I'm going through the thing women do, by the way, don't shame yourself for it. The entire human species is here and exists because we do this. We put other people first and we, like, question everything.

That's what this. Women do. We do that. We are so hard on ourselves. Yeah, but we're warriors, but we have to get out of our heads, get out of our own way. But, yeah, okay, so you put it out there, of course, and you're like, I don't know.

Well, it's just been astounding. Like, the things that I thought, well, like, this is gonna be really key takeaways. Like, when I talk about menstrual blood being full of stem cells and how they're actually using it in some studies, like, to, like, regenerate tissues. I thought people would bounce on that and be like, whoa, that's amazing. And like, no, no, that's not the thing. And the things have, like, what has it been?

What have.

The biggest thing has been. I knew it. All this time. I knew I wasn't crazy. I knew I wasn't alone. I knew I wasn't the only one. I knew it wasn't in my head. And I've had women in their 60s and 70s writing me, saying, I read your book, and it literally healed my. My fertile self. Like, through those years, like, that, I thought all these things were wrong with me. My doctor never believed me. I didn't realize I was still carrying that wound forward and thinking that I was this really mess, messed up, like, person. And yet I read your book, and I finally feel like I. I know. I know what was going on. I, like, healed my body. There have been women who. So acne. I will say acne is acne, too.

Because I have a friend or 40, still taking the pill for acne. I'm like, dude, get off that.

And what happens when you stop your acne? So it's not fixing it, but with that, you know, acne is usually the last thing to heal. So with acne, it's something that we see. We. And I say to people like, you know, if you. If you have acne, think about, would you want that acne on heart? Would you want that acne? Would you want, like, these p. Pustul little infections on your heart, your liver, your kidneys, your gut? Like, no, you wouldn't. And so your body is putting it on your skin instead, because that's a safer, more benign place. And the healing it takes to heal acne, and for good, it's internal. So your body's gonna prioritize healing your gut, healing your liver, healing all of these organs first. And you can't see that. So it's very frustrating. You also feel like maybe you're doing something wrong. And there's people out there promising, like, you can heal your Hormones. And in a matter of weeks, and it's like, well, you can start to feel better, but your menstrual cycle is more than a couple of weeks. So, like, we can use a little common sense to know that, like, it's not you that did anything wrong. It's just that you need to work with your body, and it takes time. But with acne, I've been kind of blown away by some of the results women have been getting, because usually acne is something that's going to be like three months, six months, sometimes even longer for some women to really get resolution. And there was a gal on Instagram who posted a few photo of before and after her skin in two weeks and then again at 30 days. And I was like, oh, my gosh, I couldn't even believe she just fell.

On your diet and your plan and stuff.

Like, she. She bought all the supplements.

She did.

Like, she did everything. And there were other women who were like, you know, I had. I had thought I was doing everything right for my acne. When I got into your book and I started to figure it out, like, I was doing all of these things, but I really only had to do, like, these five things. And my skin healed. And women who are writing me and then. And they're like, I didn't even. Like, I didn't even ever think that I would be able be able to be off of hormonal birth control and not have acne. Women who are on the pill right now, so you can get on the pill and it can make your skin worse. So, yeah, I actually, of all places, I was doing an interview and it happened to be in the Refinery 29 building. I get to talking with the receptionist. She pulls out her camera and is showing me photos of her skin, of when she like, her skin before she got an IUD placed and how bad she have cystic acne she developed after getting her iud. And then she's like, and then I got the IUD removed, and look at my skin. Like, it started to heal, but it still has persisted. And I was talking to her about my book and talking about all these things. She's like, oh, my God. Like, because I'm just being told I have to take Accutane or take this or take that. I'm like, but there's a root cause to this, and you have an opportunity here to be able to heal it. You have to be patient. And it sucks because that's supplements, too.

It's all. You just got to keep doing it. And you Got to be patient. And you can heal it, though, like, so most. Is most acne because of hormonal.

It can be hormonal. It can be triggered. So dairy is a big one. And I talk about in the book that you've got to be off of it for at least six weeks. That's how long it takes the antibodies in your immune system to die down and give you a break there. There's an area that we really haven't explored in depth enough, which is the skin microbiome. We know that if you alter the gut microbiome, you alter the vagina, you alter the mouth, like, you start altering flora. So your skin could totally be on par for that as well. Well, so there's usually a gut component to it. Liver detoxification. There's usually foods that are triggers, which is great when you can figure out.

Like, no gluten for women. Right?

Yeah. You know, gluten's one. I will say what's interesting about it. So I. I've had so many patients who go to Europe and have no issue with gluten. And celiac is different. Celiac is very, very different. But with people with gluten sensitivities, it's looking more, you know, back. I don't know. I think there's probably. I don't know how long ago it was that glyphosate was coming up. People were questioning the pesticides, and is gluten really the issue? And they were called crazy. And now we're starting to see. And it's like the. It was clinicians like me who were like, why can't a patient go to France, for example, and eat a baguette? Eat a whole baguette, no problems. But they get a crouton on their salad, and their body goes crazy. And if you look on. So I had the privilege of recently living in France, and they are strict about their food. They are like, okay, like, if you are a belangerie, you can only use certain ingredients. None of this, like, modifiable junk. Nothing. No fillers. None of the. None of this, like, artificial stuff that we put in. And so I think that's a piece of it as well. But they have. It's a lot more respect for food. Whereas in the United States, like, I'm a foodie, I live in Portland, I got mad respect for food and for my farmers and the way it gets to me. But it's also that, like, there was this trend that really, you know, pushed the food industry. We all have to recognize that, like, what we want to vilify corporations. They do match and meet the needs of what the consumers are asking for. So we're all playing a role in this, which gives you power. That's not blame. That's power. But we started wanting convenience. We wanted cheap food. You can't make cheap food. Like, you can't make. You can't make a hamburger for 29 cents, and it'd be a legit hamburger. Like, that doesn't happen.

Exactly.

And so, you know, that's part of what's happened in the food supply in the US and we've certainly seen that in, you know, other countries when you go. So I remember when I was in commercial Costa Rica, small, remote mountain town, how different people looked there. And I go back a decade later, and here is KFC and McDonald's and all these places now in this, like, obscure rural town, I thought it was. And how much larger the population was. Like, how. How their adiposity had increased. And it's like, you know, this isn't a question of, like, oh, is this, like, you know, body image issues? No, this is a question of, like, whoa, if that fat is around their organs, then they're at higher risk for these other issues. So it is something that gluten tends to be really problematic for a lot of people in the United States. I talk about it in the book of, like, this is probably gonna be the one you can't bring back. If you have acne, you probably can't bring back dairy. But you may be able to figure out, like, well, if I'm at a party, I can have a piece of cheese if I want to, or, you know, I can, like, have, like, you know, that. That salad with some cheese on it. But if I do that three days in a row, okay, I'm gonna be in trouble.

You said have discipline, too. And there's so many alternatives now. Like, different kinds of cheeses. The good. The vegan cheese. Like, those. They're good.

There are so many alternatives. You know what's really good are the cashew cheeses and the nut cheeses and the nut yogurts. Like, I just. So my. My son has a dairy sensitivity, and my husband just came home with, like, cashew yogurt. And I was like, shut up. What is that? I actually spent a Sunday making homemade granola at home just so I could have it with that yogurt. It was that good.

Oh, my God, Cash, I'm writing this down. I don't even know. I mean, that's the thing. You gotta make modifications here. But hopefully, like I do think that people, they read your book and they understand that this is really empowering.

Yeah.

And that it's really like we, you might even be ahead of what your doctor is telling you. They might not even agree with you. Right. Cause we're not saying for women, like if you had to, you know, they don't, we don't want you to go off the pill. Cause I always say to women before I've, you know, last few years or whenever, when they call in, it's like, well, go to your doctor if you're having side effects, there might be a different kind of pill you can take. It might not be work just because your friend's taking the same pill. There's other ones for you. So what would you suggest? Would you. For women who are kind of going, ah, it's on the book.

Yeah. Well, and this is the thing, if I did my job right in the book and a lot of women have told me I have, is that I want to dispel the fear in women's medicine. We make a lot of fear based decisions which serves no one ever. And some of that fear is I'm afraid of this. So I'm going to go on birth control. I'm afraid of having that. I'm going to start birth control now. I'm afraid of coming off of birth control because of X, Y and Z and we're like just completely reactive. And so I really wanted to dispel that fear, lay it out there for you, help you understand your body. So this book is designed to help you build a user manual to your body.

And it's so well done. It's so, I think it's just, it's just so much information there. You'll know what to do.

You will know what to do.

Thank you for writing this book and I'm so glad that you are out there because I think that every woman, share it with your partner, share it with everybody. Because I think that it's time that we get those. We get the manual, we get the instruction manual, we start to figure out why, you know, our bodies are doing what they're doing. And you're gonna realize it's so much of it has to do with the foods we eat, the hormones, the pills we're taking, all the things and then that all that has a, could have an impact on your sex drive too, which is. So what have you, have you seen a lot with people's sex drive coming back?

And yeah, so this is something that the Research says that the sex hormone binding globulin and if you guys are like, wait, what she talk about? Rewind, go listen again. With that being elevated, researchers went and looked at women like five years out and they said, said okay, hold up, that protein stays elevated above what a non pill user ever was. So they, what they concluded is it's unlikely it ever returns to the pre pill state. And so you know, this has been something where doctors are like, libido's gone, it's gone. But epigenetics, epigenetics for the women. And that is something that clinically with the protocols that are in the book. So the protocols are in the book are actually developed from working one on one with my patients. So thank my patients for trying to trusting me and for keeping their data and reporting back to me so we could test the hypothesis. And then we test it, they report their data, we figure it out. And what we found is you can lower that sex hormone binding globulin, you can get your hormones back on track, you can reverse everything that's gone on with your gut. Even if you went on to develop an autoimmune disease in your gut, it might take you five to 10 years to reverse that. But these things are possible. And I've seen this with real life patients and I have heard the stories online and what I think is super cool about this book is that I never set out to give women permission. I don't think we need permission for anything. But in a way what women have said to me is, it's gay. It gave me permission to talk about this. Now I talk about my period. Now I talk about it. And women are saying like, I don't hide my tampon. I talk with my friends about what's going on and they're coming out and talking about their sex drive, talking about their libido. And you know, last time when we were recording the radio, we were talking about, you know, how medicine thought it had us all figured out. And, and, and right now, like we said how cocky medicine can be about our bodies and yet we just figured out the clitoris is this giant massive instructor like structure. It is like a space alien inside our body. How did we miss it?

How did they even teach it? I don't even know that it's in manuals right now. And in France it just got into their manuals. Like two was it this year, last year they just included the clothes, clitoris and some teaching manuals. And schools like, oh really? That's what it is. It has Legs, people. Every time to this day, the clitoris has legs. There's so much to know, and I just want everyone to be. To be. To be knowledgeable. It's your body, it's your life, and all the things that you're dealing with. A lot of the symptoms that you're dealing with that you don't even know might have to do with your hormones. They probably do, first of all, and you can do something about it. So everybody should read this book, beyond the pill. Dr. Jolene Brighton. She's very entertaining, too. I already love her and the second I met her, but she's on Instagram all the time at Dr. Jolene Brayton. B R B R I G H T E N. It's also in our show notes. I love that you're doing the live, so you can just watch it. She's walking you through the book. It's like a book club.

Yeah, no, that's what I set out to do was do a little virtual book club and take people chapter by chapter through it. And I just had this idea. I was, like, laying in bed and I was like, I'm gonna do that so I can, like, help answer.

You know, I put this in the moment.

Well, I put this book out into the world, and it's very much something that, like I said, said I. I intended to put the medicine in women's hands, and I did want to create change in women's medicine by supporting women. Like, it's not going to come by me, like, yelling at doctors, you need to change this. But I do call them out in the book and I challenge them. But it really was going to come by putting the medicine in women's hands and women being the walking, living proof, showing everybody what is possible and all of that. And then women started saying, like, this is a movement, and here's all the things that have changed. And, like, women using hashtags and being like, I'm one of, like, Dr. Brayton's defenders. And I'm like, wait, what are we talking about here? And, like, but with that, I'm like, wow, we did start a movement. And I don't like. And that's really why I'm here and doing. What I'm doing is I'm like, I need to be on the ground with these women supporting them. You know, sometimes authors, they put a book out there and that's it. And it just goes. And it's like, I wanted to find a way, like, how do I keep supporting women to move through this book to understand how to use this book to answer any questions. Because you write the book as a clinician and you're like, this makes total sense. And you have all these, these editors, but maybe it doesn't. And how can I help answer it?

Yeah, you're like, challenge you too. You said like last time. You're like, yeah. If you don't believe, like, ask me, ask the question. So I love that you're so available because it is a lot to take in and so wherever you're at, it's important to, to learn.

There's a mom right now who I like. Seriously. I cried when she sent this to me. She bought the book, she read it for herself. She is nearing perimenopause. She's like, after 30 days, she felt the best she ever felt. Her eyes husband was like, you look amazing. Our sex is amazing. Like every energy is up. All this stuff that she wrote off as she was just getting older and it was going to be impossible for her to ever feel well again. She passed the book to her 19 year old daughter. And, and because she's like, my 19 year old needs to do this. Like read this. Because she's thinking about using birth control and every night her 19 year old is reading it aloud to her 16 year old. I'm like, oh, that's my God.

That's the dream. I, I want kids in school, I want teachers to be reading this. I want, I see groups of women everywhere getting together.

There are all kinds of virtual book clubs popping up all over the Internet. Women are starting book clubs like in starting communities to support each other. It is, we need to phenomenal.

Women is a big thing that women need women. It's not just like, oh, I should have a lot of friends. This yoke since we are so isolated and lonely now and the phones and we don't leave our house. But like women need to be supporting women. Your friends are your fuel. They're your life. Like it's, it's just I wire up.

Your progesterone gets up.

Exactly. No, it's true. They do. They spike your progesterone. But like, and I've known this. Like my friends have always been. I feel like what days when I get down and you know, Jamie seen this in the office, I'm like, oh, and I'll come back. Like I had lunch with my friends. Like I just, I forget it. You need that hit, you need that rush from the, from women. And you could be that person, you could be that friend in your group that's like, let's get together and do this together and figure out our health. We don't have to suffer every month and just bitch about your period and bitch about all the cramps and all the things you're going through in your.

Life supporting each other, but you get to bitch. Okay, no, you can fucking bitch and.

Eat ice cream, but you shouldn't feel.

Like you have to. And you shouldn't feel like you're at the mercy of your cravings or any of these things.

We don't have to live with it. That's the thing. We don't have to live with it no matter where we are at. So thank you for this book. Thank you for coming in. I'm so happy you wrote this book, Dr. Jolene Brighton. Should we give her the five questions?

Ooh, quick, five questions.

Did we do it last time? I don't think we did.

I don't think so, because I've never heard of this.

Okay, ready? We're gonna give you five questions.

Oh, God.

All of our guests answer. What's your biggest turn on?

Oh, my biggest turn on? Besides doing the dishes.

Wow.

I. Man, I'm like, I love the way my husband smells when he gets really sweaty. Are we talking about physical things?

Anything. Anything. I guess, yeah. Physical or what turns you on? But that's good scent.

Yeah. No, the way he smells is so incredible, Which I never noticed him until I got off the pit pill, and then I noticed him, and I, like, can't get enough. And so. Yeah, that's definitely one of those things. He's like, I got. I got really lucky. And my husband's one of those people that his pleasure is derived from pleasuring people. Like, he's one of those people.

Yeah.

So it's just people. I know.

Those are the kind of men, if you want to go down on me and get pleasure all day, that is.

Yeah, right.

And you're happy? We're all happy. Okay. Biggest turnoff.

Biggest turn off. Neediness. Clinginess.

What's something you like to tell your younger self about sex and relationships?

Oh, that. Like, you should definitely be having orgasms and that your sexual needs are just as important. And don't fake it. Never fake it.

I love that you prescribe orgasms in here, too. Number one. Sex or dating or relationship tip.

Oh, I don't know that I'm a dating expert. Sex, relationship, tip. All of that communication, you need to talk about it and explore your own terrain. Like, if you don't know your own body, how can you communicate to someone else about It.

Exactly. That's why we all need to masturbate and then communicate. Masturbate, communicate.

Is that a hashtag yet?

Because it should be. We've got so many of them. My new one is meditate, masturbate, manifest. Oh, my God, I'm making T shirts.

Wait, say that again.

Meditate, masturbate, manifest. That's every day. Perfect order, right?

Right.

Because you want to meditate first thing. Because then you'll distract yourself.

Well, yeah. And you'll be in the right, like brain waves and you'll be super calm. It'll be easier to orgasm when. When you orgasm, you're naturally in a state of gratitude, swimming with endorphins like you've already accessed, like the higher ups in all the ways. Is such a brilliant. Why have I not been doing that? This is like mind body alignment. We should be at the biohacking conference talking about this right now.

I think you're right. I think you're right. You're absolutely right. Something random that gets you in the mood.

Something random that gets me in the mood. Oh, you know, you really should be asking my husband these questions.

What gets him in the mood?

What gets him in the mood? Looking at me like, random, like, I'm not even kidding. Like, I will actually hide sometimes to change my clothes if I know I have to be out of the house on a period of time. Because if I am, like, I'm just like, you know, going to change my shirt and then there he is. I'm like, where were you? You weren't even in the room.

Like, adorable. I love your relationship.

Oh, but what was the question?

I don't know. Random that gets you in the mood. Something random that gets you in the mood.

Random thing that gets me in the mood. Oh, my God. I will say nerdy talk.

Yeah.

Like, if there is something like really, like, mind blowing nerdy, like new epiphany, like, seriously, like the.

The.

Oh, my God. You should meditate and then have an orgasm. That kind of gets me in the mood right there.

I just turned her on.

Something a little. Little bit at random, though. But like, that's no sapiosexual.

Someone's get turned down by words. Brains. I'm the same way. I told you.

Yeah, yeah. Talk nerdy to me.

Right? Talk nerdy to me. Yes. That's a good T shirt too. Okay. Thank you for being here, Dr. Durleen. You're doing great work. I appreciate it.

Thank you. And I wish I answered those questions a lot better. You're awesome.

It was fun. No, we have. You were awesome.

No, thank you so much. This was so much fun.

All right, guys, I hope you enjoyed the show. Wow. I did. That was good work, you guys. Good information. Thank you for listening. I love you all. Thanks to my amazing team, Ken, Michelle, producer, Jamie and Michael. Was it good for you? Email me feedbackexwithemily.com.

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