Turning Off to Get Turned On with Tiffany Shlain

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Technology took away so many boundaries. You can work from anywhere, you can work from your bedroom, you can work from vacation. It's like, no, no, no, that's actually not so good. Let's bring those boundaries back.

Yes.

Yeah, let's have bedroom be for sex and sleeping or reading and let's bring some boundaries back and we're going to feel more joy. This whole chapter I wrote in the book about boundaries is that boundaries actually can make you feel free because if you know when you're working, you know when you're off and there's no boundaries anymore. And people just text when email, whenever there. And you know, we're affecting so many other people with the way we use technology too. So I talk about the research in the book that when you text someone, when you get interrupted, it takes you around 20 minutes to get back into what you were doing. So we text with abandon now and we should just be mindful because what I'm about to communicate to this person, is it so urgent that I'm taking them out of what they're doing.

Thanks for listening to Sex with Emily. I'm Dr. Emily, and on today's show I'm joined by author Tiffany Schlain to talk about the importance of taking a day to unplug. Not just from electronics, but from work, relationships, and whatever other stresses life throws at you. Topics include. While it may seem impossible, taking a break from technology for one day isn't as hard as it seems. The benefits of truly unplugging and reconnecting with your partner and family. With less time for tech, there's more time for sex and tips on having your own tech Shabbat, whether you're single, married, or have kids. All this and more. Thanks for listening.

Look into his eyes. They're the eyes of a man obsessed by sex. Eyes that block our sacred institutions. Bedroom eyes, they call them in a bygone day. Hey, Emily, you got a boyfriend? Cuz my man E here, he just got his heart broken. He thinks you're kind of cute. A girl's gotta have her standards. Oh my.

The women know about shrinkage.

Isn't it common knowledge?

What do you mean? Like laundry?

It shrinks. Can we not talk about sex so much? Are you kidding me? Oh my God, I feel so good. Being bad feels pretty good. You know, Emily's not the kind of girl you just play with.

You're listening to Sex with Emily. We're talking about sex, relationships, and everything in between. For more information, check out sexwithemily.com and we are. Sex with Emily on all social media. All right. Intentions with Emily for each show, join me in setting an intention. I'm gonna do it. I encourage you to do the same. So what I mean is like right now, when you're listening, think about what you want to get out of the episode. It could be, wait, there's no way I can cut off technology for a full day. I'm curious to see what this is actually like. Well, my intention is to show you the importance of taking a break from technology and know that it's not as scary or as impossible as it seems. And it actually can truly help you reconnect to yourself and your loved ones. I've been doing it and I'm telling you it works. All right. Tiffany Schlain is an Emmy nominated filmmaker, founder of the Webby Awards. I was actually her first Webby Awards in the late 90s. She's been a speaker at universities, businesses, as well as Ted women. And her original series the Future starts Here has received over 40 million views. Now she has her book 246 the Power of Unplugging one day a week. And I met Tiffany over 20 years ago. Our parents actually met on a trip, and they thought that we would like each other, and they were right. And I'm truly in love with all the work she's done. It's a subject we absolutely need to get on top of. Learn more about and how to deal with technology, social media for today's highly connected world. Okay, guys, enjoy the show. And again, I apologize for the audio, as this was a Skype interview. I'm so inspired by you, Tiffany. Your book, 246 the Power of Unplugging One Day a Week. When you first hear about it, you know, I think that a lot of us like, oh, God, well, that sounds like a great idea, but I could never do that. We couldn't. We're all, like, really addicted to technology. So if you could tell me your story about just starting how you knew this would work.

Yeah, I mean, I think it's good to mention. Well, first of all, you and I go way back.

Yes.

We've known each other a really long time. I think we probably first met when I was running the Webby Awards, which really long time ago, but before that.

But honestly, we have a history. I mean, you were so. I mean, Tiffany, you're such an impressive person and such a pioneer. We did meet because our parents, like, matchmaked us. Like, they met on a trip somewhere, and they're like, oh, I have a daughter in San Francisco. She should meet your daughter and your son, because they fixed me up with your brother. Like, he's a Jewish doctor. You'd like him. But then we hit it off. We were, like, in our early 20s. And then you just continued to break through all these barriers. And I've been so impressed in watching your career in San Francisco. And the first thing, yeah, it was the Webby Awards, which was like, when the web was first getting going, I was like, oh, my God. You were just amazing that you pulled that together.

I love technology. I've loved it since the early days. I just don't love the way it has changed the way people are existing around. Over 10 years ago, I just felt like I was distracted all the time. Like, I was never anywhere. I was in a constant state of nowhere. And I had this very dramatic period of a couple days where I lost my father and my husband, and my daughter was born. And it was really. I felt like life was grabbing me by the shoulders and being like, focus on what matters. And I did not like the way I was living, I just didn't feel good. And I. I'm Jewish, I should say, but I'm not religious. And you know, my husband and I had done Shabbat dinners occasionally, which are beautiful. Those of you that don't know, it's like a weekly meal with family and friends. You light candles. It's really wonderful. Most Jews I know don't do it. If they do it, they do at dinner. But the real. If you are a religious Jew or an observant Jew, you take a full day off of rest. But of course, I didn't really have anyone in my life that did that right.

But I was part of this group called Reboot that was doing a national. A national day of unplugging. But after I had lost my father and my husband and I did it and we turned off for one day a week and it felt so good. And they were just doing in one ceremonial day. But I remember that day, I felt like I got my soul and my presence back and all the screens were off. I felt so good. And Ken and I just never stopped doing it. I mean, it's been over 10 years and every week on Friday night we have people over for dinner. So it's very social thing. Friday night.

Yeah, I'm going to come next time. I'm just telling you I want to come. It sounds like a really good time. And I'm sure being it's a dinner party. I pre invited my in reading your book. I'm like, I could totally see that. I'm there, I'm making the challah. I'm in. I'm just telling you I want an invite.

You don't realize how much people are interrupting any experience, especially dinner parties. Pulling out a phone, walking away to take a text. And like there's no phones. People come over on Friday night to our house. They know we call it our texture box. Yeah, there's no phone. So it's like the best, most social fun night. Great conversation, laughter, cooking fun. And then Saturday is this kind of delicious, more quiet day of just like reading, like we don't read anymore. Mapping, journaling, painting, music, going out in nature. Just all these things that we don't seem to really do anymore because we're always interrupted by.

Exactly. And I want to get into the tech Shabbat thing because I really, by reading your book at the end of it, I'm like all of there was so much in it that made so much sense to me. What was so amazing though is that you 10 years ago you did this or 11 years ago. I mean, now it's at this all time high. Now it's, it's way worse than it was. You just again had the foresight with technology to know that this isn't going to be good. We need to put some limits on this. Can we just talk for a minute? What are the phones doing to our brains? Like literally rewiring them and we're checking it 100 times a day.

Absolutely, yeah. I mean, we're basically in, I think, a Frankenstein moment where the technology none of us were designed to be on and available 247 with no downtime and we're never not staring at that phone. And I think, you know, yes, I started doing this 10 years ago and the longer we were doing this, the crazier everyone's become. And then finally I was like, I have to write this book. Here's this free, simple practice that's actually thousands of years old and can like save everyone. Pretty much the way I feel, because it feels like people have no perspective. They're never not on the network. It's destroying our democracy. We're being manipulated to stare and click on things because that's how people sell us things. And they're winning. There's thousands of engineers and their job is to keep you glued to the screen and have you click on the most things and they drip out notifications. So you're like an addict for being validated and notified and stressful news and email, blah, blah.

Yeah.

And we're at a moment where I'm like, okay, this is ridiculous. I don't know anyone that doesn't feel addicted. I don't know anyone that doesn't feel like they're struggling with their partner, with their kids, or just with themselves about their on the screen. Too much.

Yeah.

And I believe in us humans that we can rise up and say, okay, this is good, but not all the time. So I think the big question of our time and why I wrote this book 24 6, is what I feel like is to give people a guide and really bigger thoughts about technology of when do you. When is it good to have it on and when should you turn it off and when should you zip it up and put it in your bag? During the week and when should you actually turn it completely off? What I think one day a week. And the more I researched. Again, I'm not a religious person, but I have great respect for ideas baked into religious dogma and Shabbat. This idea of a day of rest is so brilliant and the more that I thought about it and read about it, I feel like everyone, everyone needs to take Shabbat and just like yoga. Everyone, just like yoga and meditation. Those are practices. I do both of those. I'm not Buddhist or Hindu, but I have great respect for those space. And they, those practices have brought great balance and joy back into my life.

Yeah. No say.

And you're so thinking about the body.

Exactly. And this is a practice. Yeah. We could all do it, but we get to make it up. It could be a few hours a day at first. You could start. I mean, I'm all for just like trying it and going for it, but you can find your day, you can find your time. But I've even found. And I find that I've had that too, with the, the scrolling. You literally can feel drunk sometimes and you can feel like, like you. When you're on your phone for an hour and then your eyes are bugging out and you're like, what did I just do? I did nothing. I feel bad and self loathing. Yeah. And so even for me, just sleeping with it outside the bedroom has been like, huge, you know, and like just getting an alarm clock, huge. I feel like. Yeah.

There's so many things you can do throughout the week that make things better, like wearing a watch. So when you look at the. Look for the time, just look at your wrist instead of going down the rabbit hole on your phone or alarm clock in your bedroom. I get pleasure out of opening up a book and writing things down so I'm not distracted by a million other things.

Yeah, I get it. I'm bringing that back too, because it never worked for me. Because we also grew up because we're the same age. Like we grew up in the 90s having to carry notebooks everywhere and write it all down. And it's actually better for your brain. Like, you talk a lot about the benefits of journaling. Yeah.

Yeah.

I want to bring it back.

There's so much you were asking about the brain. And anything you do repeatedly is rewiring your brain. Anything. I mean, having sex.

Watching tv. I mean, the way that I feel when I'm online is I can never get enough. I can't get enough stressful news, I can't get enough email, I can't get enough notifications, I can't get enough fomo. I'm just like, I'm in a constant state of never being satiated. And when I turn the screens off, what I notice immediately is I feel so appreciative and grateful for What I already have. So it immediately reverses my outlook. And then I think just so much about what your show is about is about being in your body and being in touch with your body. And when you're. When you're staring at a device, I mean, first of all, your whole body starts to atrophy. You're just. Your neck is crunched down, the most unflattering position ever. You're looking down, your shoulders are slumped. You're totally forgetting about your body, right? And I think if you take time and say, I'm going to put that away, put the phone away, I'm going to turn it off, and you know what? The whole world's going to exist and I'm going to reconnect with myself or my partner or the people right in front of me. Because what's happening is that everything is more important than what's right in front of you. And that's a really sad state to live in.

It's really sad. And I've been saying this too, like, and you talk about this in 24 6, is that we. Everyone's looking down now. We're not making eye contact. Eye contact is intimacy. So when I hear from couples and individuals every single day, like, this epidemic of loneliness, this epidemic of living with their partners and still feeling alone and not feeling connected and not feeling intimate, a lot of it is, you know, we. It's because of the phones, because of our technology, even if it's like the television. And I think if we could somehow get people to say, okay, like, I've been talking a lot about phones outside the bedroom. Like, phone should be for sleeping and sex. But I think it's getting so extreme now that we're not even realizing how bad it is that, that I like the idea of your. Of this. Just maybe when you get home from work, you each take an hour and you connect, or it's minutes and you look into each other's eyes and you hug. Before, when you get at the end of the day and at the beginning of the day, and there's just, like, rituals around connection and intimacy and eye contact and practicing it and then taking that out into the world, what's happened.

With the phone is it's just blurred every line. So you walk into the room, you're on a call, you're looking at your phone, you don't really make eye contact, you don't make connection. And every boundary, whether you're going to the coffee shop, everyone's kind of faking their way through it. Just like Faking orgasms, like faking connection.

Exactly.

Because we're just like grunting our way through. And I should tell you, the more I've read about Shabbat and I go into this in the book, because it's so fascinating, is that Shabbat is supposed to be a joy. It's like a double mitzvah to have sex on Shabbat.

There you go.

Scholars say have sex on Shabbat, connect, have joy. So it's not about what's being taken away, it's like what you get back. Like, I swear my. My Friday night to Saturday night is literally my favorite day of the week. It's when all my favorite moments of the week happen on or on that 24 hour period.

Right. I want to go back to that. And then I want to talk about exits entering, because this just happened like literally 10 minutes ago. That chapter really struck me because you talk about how we do walk in with the phone and. Okay, so to my defense, I only have a six minute commute to my office. And that's typically when I make my phone calls. I call my mom, I call my friend. So I always walk in, my team is sitting here and I wave and I'm on the phone. I'm like, hey guys, I'm on the phone. So today, Tiffany, because of your book, I finished my call out on the steps and I did not want to walk in on the phone and be like, hey, everyone, hey. One second, one second. Because. Yeah, and I, because I was like, that is not a way that is not present, that is not real. And that look, I'm not saying hi to everybody and looking in their eyes. And so Jamie, my producer sitting here, I don't know if she noticed that, but I finished the call on the porch, so. So thank you for that.

I'd never thought about it before.

A thousand. I'm so glad. Well, I'm sure you enlightened so many people on the thousand things with intimacy. And I'm really hoping with this book 24:6 is that just to kind of wake people into. They were literally. You walk down the streets of LA or New York or anywhere and everyone's head is down as they're walking and it's like, is this the world we want to live in? And couples are just sitting together on their phones and it's like, we all know relationships and intimacy take connection and there are those uncomfortable moments. Even what the phones do is just. Just numb us to all of that. So we never really have to deal. But that means the Intimacy is never going to be there either because we're faking our way through.

Exactly. Like we. That's such a good point, is that we're not in the uncomfortable moments now. We have our phones. But back in the day, I mean, I say this all the time. And you probably, because I know you have two young kids, which we'll have to get into as well, are teenagers right now. A 16 year old I have.

Yeah, right.

And 10 year old. And people we're going to get to that too. Like we were like, mom, my kids will never do that. Well, yeah, you're the parent. Like they can do that. But even we remember, like I met people waiting for my car wash. Like maybe I didn't have a book for me, but we waited, you know, we'd wait for 30 minutes. But even the other day I went to yoga and I left yoga class. It was like a Sunday afternoon. It wasn't like a busy morning, it wasn't Monday morning. And we got out, it was like a 4 o' clock class. And by the time I got out, there was like three of us on these chairs and or four chairs, three people to my left. One was actually a cute guy on his phone. They were all on their phones like automatically after yoga. So you know that it's happening everywhere. And I think when people complain that they're single and they don't meet anybody, I'm like this, there are more single people in America and in the world than ever before. But I believe that our phones are hijacking these experiences where we could really have connection, even if it's just a hello, when you meet your new best friend.

The in between moments are when life happens. It's when you get closer to someone. If you work your way through that awkward moment or you say hello to someone, I mean, people have fallen in love just with eye contact. And think about how many opportunities we're taking away because everyone's staring at our own little devices and staring into our own little truths. Because right now in our country, with our democracy, I mean, everyone's listening to their own world. And I think that's another element too is it's created a lot of, you know, divide instead of connect. I never thought when the early days of the web that the offshoot of connection would be disconnection.

Right.

But again, I'm not anti tech. Like there's so many ways that tech is wonderful and it allows people to look up stuff about sex that they never would have the courage.

Exactly. They're listening to podcast Right. Turn off your phone after the podcast right now.

Yeah, but I think it's the question that's just thinking, when is it good to have it on and when should you turn it off? And I think to really understand, connecting broadly is meaningless unless you also connect deeply. And this other writer who writes about this subject, he said this thing I just found so brilliant. His name is Cal Newport. And he was saying, being on social media, you feel both connected and lonely all at the same time. I was like, oh my God, that's it. You're connected and lonely all in one moment.

Exactly.

And you're never, you're never gonna get to the bottom of the Internet. You're always gonna be scrolling.

Right.

It's never gonna feel satisfying. And I mean, I think when I was thinking about your show and just like the idea of kind of understanding your own needs, I think what's happening is the phone is such a false. I wish like every time you picked up the phone there was like a pop up menu that said, what need are you trying to fulfill?

Exactly. What do you really want right now? Are you hungry? Do you want to call a friend? Should you really do your laundry.

List? More positive ways you can spend that? Click of.

I like this idea of an app that pop. I know there's like all these habit tracker lists and stuff, but what if it's like time to. You haven't masturbated yet today, this week you've only masturbated one. Because I'm always trying to encourage people.

But do something else that's licking your wrist. That will give you much more pleasure.

Exactly. Like way more pleasure. And I even find myself like, I, I think we, a lot of us do this. Like, I, I just started watching tv, which is weird. Like most people watch it all the time, but I'm watching shows.

But then I'm on my phone. Yeah.

But then I'm like watching TV and my phone. I'm like, why am I doing both? And I just feel bad about like, I, I. And I, and I live alone, so no one's looking over my shoulder, but it just feels wrong. And I have to put those restraints. And so what I also like is that in, in 24 6, you talk about like rules and boundaries too and like that. It's okay. I wrote down a quote, it was by Kierkegaard that you have, which I love. That anxiety is the dizziness of.

I think that was from. It was so interesting because it's like, wow, we have so many opportunities right now. There's so much going on. There's so much buzzing and beeping and everyone's wanting us, and we're pulled in so many directions that that's creating so much of our anxiety. So I feel like until people actually try this, like, shutting down their phones, whether they're alone or with a partner out, even if it's for an hour, it's almost like I always say, you're never going to regret having sex. Going to the gym, meditating, or I think, turning off your phone, taking time off.

Yes. I love that you just added that in because I think we need to think about our relationship to our phone. Like, we need to think about it with nutrition and nature and exercise and our sex life and our relationship to our phone. Like, it. It's affecting so much of every single moment of our day.

Yeah.

And if you want to think about your overall well being, you think about what you eat, how often you're having sex, how much you're drinking, how much you're in nature, all of these things. And we need to think about that in the same visual palette of, like, what does it mean to live a good life today? And does it mean to live a good life to be every moment of any moment you get, you're going to open your phone instead of maybe taking a moment to just think or just try to listen to your inner voice or just, you know, write in a journal or read something in an undistracted way, or stare out the window in daydream. Because there's so much research on how the most creative ideas come from when you're daydreaming. And there's. We've created a society where there isn't a second where we're not gonna look at the phone to be distracted, entertained, or stimulated at any moment.

Right. We no longer have that. Like we did. We're just walking without the phone, hiking without the phone, nature. And I like that you include all of that in your book about. About nature. You have a chapter on, like, connecting to nature. Because I've also been talking about a lot of that on the show, how important that is. Even if you just put your feet on the ground at night before you go to bed just to, like, ground with the earth. Like, things that we just don't do anymore that are actually really healing and like, journaling and practices of gratitude. And I love that Ken doesn't like gratitude, but he likes appreciation. Because I think gratitude. Your husband. I think that's funny because I'm like, yeah, I get it. Gratitude is Kind of like a. Such a. Like, it can be kind of a little cheesy. You're like, gratitude. Namaste. If it's not your jam, like, what do I appreciate? Like, make it work for you. So I like that there's not so much that's, like, so restrictive. It just sort of like, here's just some tools. Because, yeah, it is a new. It's a relationship with the phone that we have to learn how to monitor, like, an addiction, like anything else. And it is like food and exercise, but with the phone. Yet. That's why I think your book is so inspiring and such an easy read in the sense of, like, there's so many nuggets in it that. That will help people think about. Like, well, how can I. Like, Because I haven't seen anything like, this much like your Webby Awards. Like, oh, this is actually a tool for monitoring your use of the phone. Like a diet book, but for your phone, because we don't. Yeah, it's okay. And you're not gonna die. Turn it off. Like, it's gonna help.

And also, I think, like, I'm. I'm sharing with everyone this practice I've done for. With. For over a decade with my husband and our two daughters. One's almost 17, one's almost 11. And I should say that they love it too. And people can't even imagine. We have a teenager who loves to turn the phone off, but they're overstimulated too. I mean, she's in her most stressful year of high school. She's in her junior year of high school, and she has so much homework every night, and she loves one day a week. She can't do homework. She can't respond on social media. She just gets a break. And there's so much research that proves if you take a true break, you will be so much more productive, so much better to contribute to the world the other six days. But we're never getting a break. Right now, I'm telling you what we have done and what has really worked and all the things we've negotiated over the last 10 years. And the truth is, the thing is, it's not hard. It's so easy to prepare for it, to let other people know. And we all existed before the smartphone. Although you and I, if we've lived half of our lives online and half of our lives off.

Exactly.

I really see the difference. And, you know, I'm turning 50 in April.

Yeah.

Somebody was like, well, what does it feel like to turn 50? What have you learned. And I'm like, like, this is the single best thing I've learned is this very ancient practice that I'm kind of updating in a non religious way. And I'm trying to share it because it can just bring such joy back into people's lives. And we started now the book has been out for like four months. And we started a Facebook group called 24246 Living. There's all these people now that are doing texturebox or just living more mindfully with tech. It's so much fun and Jewish, not Jewish. With kids, without kids, single. And they're all so much better.

Well, what I love is. Okay, so we'll put that in the show notes as well. We'll put a link to your Facebook group for people to join because I think it's really helpful to have a group to see how everyone else does it because everyone has kids, different ages, different families, they live alone. But I think that the tools are so practical and then to know that other people are able to do it and how you, like, print out directions, you know, get a printer, get a landline if you have to. All right, we're gonna take a quick break. When we come back, more with Tiffany Schlane.

Could you tell me what the studies have shown what people feel when they take a true break from technology?

First of all, people, if you don't have a phone in your bedroom, I'm sure you've gone over this on your show. You're going to sleep so much better because, you know, the blue light from the phones, they found a link with the same kind of plaque that Alzheimer's patients have on their brain. And a lot of people, they wake up in the middle of the night, they check their phone, and then you're not going to go back to sleep as easily. There's so many, so much research just on just having sleep and then in terms of just letting your brain go into a different mode, it's so important to the parasympathetic nervous system. You know, what calms your body down and what gets the cortisol level high? Well, what gets the cortisol level and like fear and stress level is like reading stressful news, having work emails interfere with your leisure time. All of those things which we're doing all the time. And then the things that calm it down are being in a room with other people, eye contact, eating meals together, a true night's sleep, being out in nature. All of this research confirms that that calms you and it makes you more centered and grounded. And the phone is doing the opposite. So, you know, we live in the 21st century. A lot of us, you know, we're online a lot, not at all advocating not to be on, but to really be mindful of how much. I mean, look at the percentage of your day that you're staring at a screen.

Yeah.

And think, could I spend 1/7 of my week recharging, regenerating, you know, just regrouping and being in my body and being in your soul and being. It's just so. It's. There's so many benefits. And in the book, I talk about the kind of short. I mean, when we first started doing it, just time felt so much longer on Saturday. And what's the one day you want to feel long is your day off. But then the longer I've done it, the more bigger benefits I've seen. I'm a filmmaker, so it's always about being as creative as possible. And I really started to notice that my most creative ideas would happen on Saturday, my day without screens. And I was like, huh. And that's very much backed up by. There's something in neuroscience called the default mode network, where your mind starts making connections of things that are already in your mind.

Yes.

And that's usually where creativity comes from, is unusual connections. But right now we're spending all of our time with so much new input coming into our brain. We never give our brain a chance to kind of process what's already in there. So on my Saturdays, I do a lot of daydreaming and I'm just not putting any more new input in. And I have the most creative ideas then.

That is. Makes so much sense. Yeah, that's exactly what. I've had those experiences too. Lately. I've gone away for these. Like, it's so extreme. But I'll go to this, like, wellness spa for like a week and I really won't look at my phone. And then last week and I did it again for four days. They're all firing all the synapses. I came up with all the ideas and all the clarity. And it's just like, it was. It is mind blowing because right now I'm. Oh, you're right. There's always stuff coming in. There's literally no time to just think. And we're in our cars. Yeah. We're on the phone. Like my six minute commute. I'm on the phone. Like. Like, when am I going to think? You know, I mean, I do meditate in the morning, but that's also Organized, like we just need a day. And it feels so. I mean, it is. I mean, I'm telling you this, I'm so fascinated because in my little experience with it, it is a total reset, a reboot. And I feel clarity.

Reset. Mm. And that's the way I feel pretty much every week that I have the deepest vacation at a retreat center somewhere else. Every week that I'm just in my own home because just by turning off the network and no one can get to me. And I know if you're single, which you brought up, but I'll tell you something. If you say for one day I'm just gonna hang out with myself or a friend, but I'm just gonna reground myself in this very present way, that will do it too. And I think that, you know, also I have a chapter on silence in the book because the more I read how important silence is in the day, because I'm like huge. And like any moment I'm going to put on a podcast or I'm going to optimize every moment. And then I really try during my day, like when I'm driving, I think because I'm like you. I also call my great friends and my family and stretch. I'm like, I'm just gonna drive because I think I want to make my brain more supple and I'm going to give it a break. And that's pretty much what you're doing. But if you give your mind a big break, I kind of think I think of rest as a technology. Like, if you think of technology makes you more efficient and productive and all these things. Well, a true day of rest, which in my interpretation is no screens, is going to reboot you in a really powerful way.

Yeah, it really does. And then I'm sure, like, again, like, if you're in a relationship, I think it helps. Helps the relationship with yourself for sure too. Even if you're meeting. First of all, if you're meeting up with friends, you can make a plan like we used to and just not change it and just say, I will see you there tomorrow. I'm not bringing my phone. Like, remember, it's what we had to do. Like, if we had plans for dinner, I would see you there. We had no out, but it's just totally, you know, I don't know, I.

Just feel like people just feel slippery now. I think people like change and cancel way more now because they can. And I find when I'm make a plan on texturebone, I just show up and it's just. And it's. It's kind of this beautiful analog way of existing. And again, one day a week, it reminds me, I have a question about something. I have to just ponder the question, which is also great. I'm like, I don't know the answer. No. Holy. I'm not going to know the answer. And that's kind of fun because it, like, it strengthens your curiosity. You're not going to wonder. Kill it on Google and know immediately. So I think there's. There's just a joy in doing things differently. I mean, I'm sure you talk about this with sex like, yes, do something different. It's gonna revitalize your sex life.

Absolutely. We're all so bored with our sex life. Yeah. It's been the same thing all the time. If you and your spouse. Partner, just say, we're not gonna. We're gonna come from work, we're gonna leave our phones at the front, we're gonna turn them off, and we're gonna spend the next four hours. Even if you're doing what you know, you're watching a movie or. But if something comes up, you're like, who is the director of that film? You gotta write it down and look it up tomorrow. Like, it's okay. Because we don't even realize. Like, that's. Yeah, we don't realize that. Picking up the phone, oh, my boss texted and now I'm late. Oh, I gotta get back to so and so. And then you're off. And that's why I don't enjoy social media as much, because I. I really don't. Because I feel like, oh, if I'm out, I don't do a lot of the stories if I'm with friends, you know, the stories, like an Instagram. Because I. I feel that I know myself. I want to take the story. Then I'll be like, what font do I choose? What I have to do. And then 20 minutes go by and I'm out of the moment. And I just. I don't know, maybe it's our. I just. I don't enjoy it. I've lost a connection. Someone who already has attention problems, challenges. That. This just helps me so much, having those rules, at least when I'm out, but then trying it with a partner and seeing how you'll feel like it. It's like you always have a third there or a fourth. If you both have phones, it's like there's always something else there, but when you turn off the phone, it's really just the two them. Of. Of you. Like, you don't have your iPad, you don't have your computer.

It's really not competing, the whole outside thing. I mean, you know, on some level, you have a show, I have a book. It's important. I do enjoy meeting and connecting with, you know, people who've read the book, or. That's the beautiful part.

Right.

But when it starts to encroach is when it's just taking you away from being present with your own life. Technology took away so many boundaries. You can work from anywhere. You can work from your bedroom, you can work from vacation. It's like, no, no, no. That's actually not. Not so good. Let's bring those boundaries back.

Yes.

Yeah, let's have bedroom. Be for sex and sleeping or reading. And let's. Let's bring some boundaries back and we're going to feel more joy. This whole chapter I wrote in the book about boundaries is that boundaries actually can make you feel free. Because if, you know, when you're working, you know when you're off, and there's no boundaries anymore, and people just text whenever they email, whenever there. And, you know, know we're affecting so many other people with the way we use technology, too. So I talk about the research in the book that when you text someone, when you get. When you get interrupted, it takes you around 20 minutes to get back into what you were doing. So we text with abandon now, and we should just be mindful because what I'm about to communicate to this person, is it so urgent that I'm taking them out of what they're doing? And. And when you're with a group of people, when you. You pull out your phone, I say it's like a yawn. Everyone's gonna pull out their phone.

Exactly.

So is that a good moment to make everyone disconnect? And when you're out at a meal with a friend that took 20 emails to set it up, you put your phone on the table. It's immediately gonna make everyone less present. Everyone. Even the people around you at other tables. So people need to be aware of how much they're affecting other people too. So it's like boundaries in your own life and really being intentional about how you're affecting other people.

It is really being intentional. It's being intentional, and it is having boundaries with yourself and just saying like, and others, but saying, I'm not gonna pull it out during this meal. Like, even just having that intention, I'm really gonna limit it when I go out with friends or I'm Gonna limit it tonight when I come home. And then just trying it out. Like, I think that it's. What I love about this is you're pointing out this thing that we don't even realize how. That we're always on like, that it is 24 7. We haven't even thought that there's any other way. Because there's this unspoken rule. If you don't get back to a text, you're disrespectful, you're. Someone's not gonna like you. There's like an urgency. And that urgency, we pay a price. And I believe that's why we are all so much more stressed and anxious. And teenagers and kids have anxiety now. I'm like, did they always have anxiety? Like, I know I've had anxiety, but really everybody all the time. And, And. And it used to be like, come on, we can't blame everything on the phone. But I kind of seeing that we can. Like, a lot of things I believe are problematic because of the phone. So I think that just, you know, having some rules around it and Is great. And in your book. I also want to say something else here. What I love is that in your chapter, when you talk about what brings you joy, I've been thinking about that a lot lately, because I don't think that we spend enough time in the joy space. We spend a lot of time in the doing space, the fear space, the worry space, the anxiety space. But what gives us. Or sad, but what gives us joy? And so. And the things you talk about are like, you know, make a list of it. And I remember one time I went to retreat a few years ago, and they had us write down joy, all the things that we love doing. And then she had us do this formula of, like, what percentage of our lives are we actually spending doing it? And mine was like 0.06%. And I was like, oh, my God, so lame. But if I had one day and a lot of us had those numbers, I wasn't the only one. But like, you just wrote some things like, you know, cook a meal with family and friends, listen to her play music, go to a farmer's market, play baseball, play sports, paint, sing, dance. And it's like, if we just took a moment. And I still have that joy list that I wrote for this retreat. And I think about it because I'm like, have I done that stuff? So I just love that you. That you. Because it just. It's like people think, well, what am I going to do? Do the joy things. Because those Actually really do scientifically make you happier and that less anxious.

And I think. Anyone? Yeah, anyone. Listening, thinking, I am going to try this. I'm going to try to get my partner to try this. I'm going to try to get my kids to try this. And I really go into detail in the book about what I think are the best approaches, because you definitely don't.

Want to say some of the best approaches.

You don't want to say, say we're turning a screen for the day, because that feels like you're depriving people of something instead. And I have all these different kind of strategies in the book. But to say, what do you wish we did more of? Let's all write a list of what we did. We wish we did more of together on our own.

So good.

Basically fill the day with that. It'll be your favorite day of the week. It's actually. I look at it as the reward to my week. It is the reward for all the hard work I do a week. This is the reward. It's all the things that bring me joy. And sometimes that joy is doing nothing. Like, when I've had a really stressful week, it's like being lounging and doing absolutely nothing that counts. But I think writing a list of what brings you joy is so good. Or even if try to think of what brought you joy as a child that you just don't do anymore. Like, there's so many things that I'm with you that we need to think about. How often we're living where we're not in that space at all. We're not even in touch with it. And I, you know, on this text about it, I've had so much time, becomes, like, luxurious. Like, I learned I picked up the ukulele, I watercolor. I told these things that I don't know because I have this day that's like the longest, most fabulous day. And there's nothing vying for my attention except just what I'm doing for the people in front of me. And I feel connected. I think that's the last thing I want to say, because I feel the most connected to myself and to Kenya and my kids on that one day. And the rest, you know, I'm a working mother. We're all, you know, million things going on. But that one day, it just, like, completely reconnects me to myself and to Ken and the girls.

Yeah, I mean, I think that's exactly it. It's connection. And so many people with kids right now, they're just battling they're like, get off the phones. No phones here. But just to have a whole day of connection and to say, what do you wish we could do more of? And I. And in hearing what you were just saying, it's so interesting. Interesting because if the phone is like our 24 hour entertainment center, which it is, it's always with us, we. Why it would never feel like, well, here's some time to paint, here's some time to. Because there's always something to do on the phone. It's like, I can't even think of another example like that in our lives. But clearly we're not doing the things that are making us happy. And because it takes a little bit of effort and that would mean that we're not glued to our phones. And if the phones are created to make us more addicted to them, well, obviously doing a great job. Hours go by when we're just still on the phone or we're staring at it, or now listen to this podcast, or now listen to this thing, and then we're not doing those things. So you have to actually remove the source. But start by writing down things you wish you would do more of so you can plan around it, which is very smart.

Yeah, well, even like I'm reading this, this book now that's not come out yet, but.

Also just about the influence of screens in general, because I think I do say phones, because to me that was a big marker. And the difference, because the web, before the iPhone came out, you at least left it at home and you went out and about your day and you didn't have the web with you. And the minute the iPhone came out, it was the moment that, that went with you everywhere. But I think even ignoring the phone for a second, because I do a lot of my work on the screen. I mean, I'm sure you do too. And it's just really looking at your whole day. I mean, look at it like a nutrition plate. Like, you know how there's like, you need to use your vegetables and your food and have a certain amount of water and just like think of your day like that. Like, how many hours are you standing on screen? What else are you really doing? How many hours are you sleeping? Supposedly the amount of hours we're standing on screen, sleeping, sex, eating, combined. And just think, can I carve out some time? Like my time in the morning since the election? I don't. This is, this is one of the things I do the other six days is I don't look at my phone when I wake up. And this is so huge for me, me, because I used to wake up and look at my phone, and it was an inevitable mix of, like, stressful news or an email. And I would just. That's how I'd start my day. And especially when Trump won, it was, like, very stressful way to start my day. So now I started and ended by doing something called the five Minute Journal, which is like a journal, even for people that don't journal, even though I love to journal. And it just asked me three things, like, what are three things you're grateful for? And what. What are three things that would make today grateful? And just spending 10 minutes thinking about my day and not letting my day. The whole tone of my day get set with my phone is so huge. And then at the end of the day, it says, what are three great things that happened today? And they're asking very different than what you thought were going to be great. And then it says, what's one thing you wish you did differently? So a little bit of reflection, and I'm telling you to start and end my day with this book that takes me a total of five minutes to do. It has just been. It's like, who's setting the tone for your day? Are you gonna let the whole world and everything you can't control see between kda, or are you gonna set. And I know this word is also another cheesy word that's set an intention for the day, but it made such a huge difference in the way I'm living my days.

I found intuition. I love this. I want to do this. I want to get this journal because I have so many journals by my bed.

And then I start five minute journal.

Five minute Journal. Well, you made me feel good because I have so many journals, too, that it stresses me. I actually talk about this in therapy. And she's like, I'm like, but I have so many journals. And then I'm like, I feel like I. I have to go back and read them. And then what if I don't have this journal? And she's like, it's okay. And if you never go back and if you just write a piece of paper and throw it away, that's okay, too. I'm like, is it, though? Is it? Don't I need all my journals? But I'm like, tiffany has a journal. I know.

The biggest thing is. And I think this is also a way to think about it for all your listeners. It's like, replace the phone with something that brings you joy. And actually writing In a journal. Not everyone's a journaler, but for me, it's very entering. I just find it very calming. And so I've replaced looking at the phone in the morning with this other thing. And, you know, we also have a no phones at the table rule. I mean, just little. Like at the end of the book, I ask a series of questions to really identify. When does it not feel good? Because that's another thing. How many screens do you have in your house, your family? You feel like it might not be you, it might be your partner that can never get off the screen. I should tell you that a lot of couples, since the book came out, like, inevitably, it'll be the husband or the wife. Oh, my God, my wife will never get off the phone. And I got her the book, and now she's getting an appetite or vice versa. There's always someone in the relationship that's like, one notch more addictive than the other. But because I go into so much of the why, you know, why is it not great to be on your phone this much? The neuroscience, the physiology, the research, the history, the this and the that. It kind of walks people through why they should quit, you know, and again, knowing that thousands of engineers and behavioral scientists, their sole job is to glue you to the screen.

And they've won in talking about how there's always one partner who's like, that's great, but my spouse would never do it. That's just like the sex conversation. Well, I want to talk to my partner and tell him I want. Want to have more sex, but they'll never do it. Or I want to ask for him to spank me, but I know he won't. It's like, no. Actually, we. A lot of times we say no to things that are change and that are scary and that we don't know how to do, and we think impossible, so we just say no. So I think that the fact that you. This kind of. Your book, 24Six, eases people into it with a lot of good tools, I think is really helpful. Just like sex. Just have the conversation.

I love the link. I can talk. I love this, like, link. It's so similar. I mean, it's really. It's about boundaries. It's about needs. It's about being in touch with your body. It's about being present. It's about communicating. I mean, it's the same.

It is. It is the same thing. And, Tiffany, if I could cut. How many studies have come out that are like millennials aren't having Sex. Because of the phones. People aren't even. People choose their phone over sex. People choose chocolate, food, phone over chocolate. It's like. And people. We kind of laugh it off, but. But I do think it is, you know, taking away from joy in our life. And that includes, you know, sex, connection, intimacy. So, Tiffany, this. You're amazing. I'm so glad you're writing this book. You're amazing.

This is so connected. I feel like we need to co author something about the connection of these two things. They're so connected.

I think we could. Well, Tiffany, we ran into each other at the what Conference. We hadn't seen each other in years, and it was such a delight to.

See you and tell your listeners that you. You were starring one of my movies.

Oh, my God. That's right. Let's talk about that. Let's talk about your movies. I played the. No, no.

It was just years ago, and I had just met you, and I put you in one of my movies. And whenever. And actually, it's showing at a film festival next month. And whenever I see you in there, and I've thought since I've seen it, I need to reconnect with Emily. And here we are.

Oh, I'm so glad. Yeah. Where can you people. Well, we're gonna have all this, the show notes, but I know you're Tiffany Schlane. S H L A N on Instagram.

Yeah, yeah. Tiffanyshlain.com I'm on Instagram, Twitter, and Facebook. And then the website for the book is 24 6, and the 6 is spelled out s I x life dot com. And there's a lot of short films I made about the subject. There's the Facebook group and just a lot of resources and all the research.

We'll put all this. I love that you have the Facebook page for everybody too, because that's just good to have a community around it. So I think you're doing great work and all your films and everything. Okay. So, Tiffany, now I have to ask you the five questions we ask all of our guests are just quickie questions.

Okay, ready? Okay.

Okay. What's your biggest turn on?

Oh, my goodness.

I think a good connection before. Yeah, Foreplay.

Perfect.

That we feel connected. That's my biggest turn on before.

It has to be anything too. Yeah. Biggest turn off.

When is it all related to sex? I was going to say when somebody says they want to pick my brain. I hate that expression.

No, that's fine. That is a turn off. I know. You're like, ew. What makes good sex Ew.

Don't do that.

What makes good sex.

What makes good sex is if.

You truly are connected. And. And it's. It's an. Well, that's interesting. I mean, I've been married for so long. I was gonna say it's like an authentic connection.

Yeah, that's true though.

But I think it is. It's. For me, I mean, again, I've been married for a long time now, but it's just that, like, I know when we're really feeling connected, it's just so much better.

Yeah. Something I'm sure you are now more so with Tex Shabbat. Something you tell your younger self about sex and relationships. Sex or relationships like when I met.

You, that the more you feel comfortable with your body. I mean, I think for so long I wish I was thinner. I wish I was taller, whatever it is. And then once you really like start respecting your body and everything it's helped you do and love your body, you're gonna, you know, your partner will too. I mean, just being more comfortable with yourself. That's what I love about getting older. I just find a lot more things funny and yeah, I don't take myself as to seriously and everything, you know, laughter. I mean, that's work.

Exactly. That's great. It's true. So true. Okay, number one sex tip.

Number relationship. It could be a relationship tip.

Okay. Okay. I hear a good one.

Make sure that you. I mean, every Saturday night, Ken and I have a date night. And even with young kids, we figured it out. So we always went out just the two of us. And it's. I see so many people do not make that a priority. And it's just, I think if, you know, it's like a pyramid. Like happy person, happy couple, happy children. And you have to make time for yourselves and a good sex life and yeah, having a relationship that's outside of being parents.

Yeah, no, I think that's so true. I always talk about you have never had a date night. Like with young kids. It's so important to prioritize it. Thank you. Yeah. Thank you so much for this. I appreciate you so much. I'm so happy to connect. Congrats on the book and oh, so.

Great to talk to you. Have a great day.

Okay, talk to you soon. I appreciate all of you for listening and thanks to my awesome team, Ken, Kristen and Lisa Bryant, our interns, producer, Jamie and Michael. Was it good for you? Email me feedbackexwithemily.com.

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