Episode 109: Sportuality with Jeanne Hess

And welcome everyone to the Weekly Yes And podcast. My name is Travis Thomas. I'm the creator of the Weekly Yap and the host. This is episode 109. What are we at, 109? Is that really? Yeah, I'm checking. I'm double-checking. 109. So episode 109, I'm interviewing Gina. Hesse, who is the longtime volleyball coach at Kalamazoo College in Michigan. So yes, we've got another Michigander showing up on the Weekly Yap, representing my roots. And this is going to be a fun conversation today. Jean had— like I said, she's been coaching at Kalamazoo College actually for 35 years, I believe. And back in 2012, she wrote a book called Sportuality.

Sportuality.

How cool is that, right? It's one of those book titles like, oh, that concept. How did I miss that one? It's so perfect. It's so genius. But once you hear from Jean, you'll hear that this is something that she has been thinking about for a long time now and how she is able to sort of kind of combine sort of the ideas of whether sport and spirituality and then how that plays a role in coaching. And again, she's been doing it for 35 years. And so she's learned a few things along the way. So we're talking about how do you bring values? How do you bring character? How do you bring sort of that mindset into a team environment? And she does a beautiful job talking about that. And I met Jean through another coach who I got connected to from another coach. And so again, just this idea of you meet interesting people, they connect you with other interesting people, and Jean is no exception to the rule. So today's podcast is episode 109 of the Weekly Yes! And podcast, but because we are talking about Such a cool concept here, especially spirituality and sports. This is also going to be a part of the Inspired to Give podcast as well. If you haven't checked out Inspired to Give yet, it's inspiredtogive.org, of which I am a contributor. This podcast often shows up on there, and sometimes I have some guest blogs and contributions there as well. So inspiredtogive.org, you'll be able to find this there. But if you are already listening to it, you have already found it. So glad you are listening. And again, if you ever want to go to iTunes and give me a review or give me a rating, a positive one preferably, but be honest, I would be happy for that as well. And you can go to my website, liveyesand.com, and sign up for the newsletter so you'll get all my goodies as I send them out. So I'm doing some cool speaking right now. I'm in Tampa right now getting ready to speak to a baseball organization. I'll be in Colorado next week working with the Link School again, and then in Flint in October Doing an event for Flint on mindfulness and it's going to be a fantastic event. I can't wait for it. So more details on that to come. So let's jump in though to episode 109 with Jean Hess. Again, she took time. She's in season right now, super busy, but she took time for the Weekly Yes! And podcast. So please welcome Jean to the Weekly Yap.

Hi, everybody.

And please welcome to the weekly Yes! And podcast, Jean Hess. Jean, how are we doing today?

We are doing fine. Thanks for having me, Travis.

Great. Thanks, Jean. And now for those of you who are listening, Jean is up in Kalamazoo, Michigan. She is the volleyball coach at Kalamazoo College. And even though I live in Florida now, I am still deeply connected obviously to home, to the state of Michigan. And so it's always fun to talk to someone from Michigan, especially A city that we can shorten to K-Zoo. And so it's great to have you here. And so, Jean, you have been coaching volleyball for 35 years. That's amazing.

Yes, I have.

That's amazing.

Yes, 35 here at Kalamazoo College, and then 4 years in high school prior, after a high school and college playing career. So yeah, I've been doing volleyball for a long time.

And we were just talking sort of off-air before we started, and this is obviously where we're coming into a big transition for you because you've announced this is your last year of coaching as you start to think about other things. And so what's the motivation for sort of retiring now, and what are you inspired to do?

A lot of it has come out of my practice of Sitting and knowing, and knowing that it's time. So 35 years is a long time to be at an institution like Kalamazoo. I have seen the evolution of the college. I've seen students grow and change, and I've seen myself grow and change into a mother and now a grandmother. So some people say, oh, is it just for the grandkids? And I'm like, well, no, but yes. But my oldest grandson is 5, and I feel like I've missed a little bit of his life. So I'd like to be more of a family presence, but I also know there are other things that I have to do. And so I'm comfortable leaving this in the hands of someone else.

Yeah.

And I trust that process. How many people do I tell to trust the process? And now I have to tell myself to trust the process, that retirement isn't an ending but a beginning, right? You know, and, and it's the beginning of something different, and I'm excited for it.

Yes, it's a new chapter, it's a new game, whatever, whatever metaphor we want to use, right?

Actually, yes, turning the page.

And, and yet another one. So, Jean, you and I got connected, uh, because, uh, in a very roundabout way. I know a family who has a son who's a golfer at Kalamazoo. I got connected to the coach I have only had email connections with a coach and he says, you need to talk to another coach who is you, happens to be you, and introduced me to this idea as well as a book that you published in 2012 called Sportuality. I really didn't need to know too much more about it beyond the title and I was like, yes, I already love it. So please tell our listeners what exactly is Sportuality.

Sportuality was born out of my need to write things down that I had been saying for years, and I found myself talking about this idea of competition. And competition truly is an idea that we've created among ourselves. And I studied Latin for a long time. I studied Latin throughout high school and then through my time at University of Michigan, and I go back to etymology of words and Original meanings of words. And so when you truly look at the word competition, it literally means to work with. The Western idea that we have with competition is working against. And when you say he's really competitive or she's really competitive, it's really in a negative tone saying they're competitive and they have to win and— or else it's just— All is lost.

Right.

Competition in its truest sense means to work with. And so if you were looking at me talking about this, I'd be bumping my fists together and say, this is what competition is. We're competing against one another, and the only way to win is that you eliminate the other. When you compete in a sportual sense, You are grateful for the competitor, you welcome the competitor, and you compete at the highest level with someone, and they make you better and that you make them better. That is true competition, where you're working with another. And then as I, in my mind and in my practice, as I thought about this idea of competition and truly we have created the war mentality through The us versus them idea of competition, of the other, and eliminating the other rather than working with the other, negotiating with the other, and bringing the greater good out of the other. So that word is one, and then there are 11 other words that in— when used in sport in their original meanings and— or meanings that I have begun to believe them as, that they can bring greater meaning, greater— a greater idea, and just really— so finding joy in the games, greater joy to the games as we think about these words. So that's that. I could go through the words if you wish, but—

Well, I think we could probably spend our entire time just on that concept alone.

Yeah.

Of the true meaning of competition compared to the way that we've adapted sort of competition to mean. I know that you said that so beautifully. That's a concept that whether I'm working with youth or college or professional teams, that's one of those main concepts that is such a huge mental shift for athletes and even coaches to get behind is this idea that yes, you're You're pushing each other, but it's not pushing against, like you said, it's actually sort of pushing with. I remember Timothy Gallwey in his Inner Game of Tennis book talking about how the surfer seeks out the largest wave because the wave provides the greatest challenge and opportunity for the surfer to grow. But he's not— so he's embracing that challenge. Essentially what we should be doing as we look at our teammates or the opponent is really sort of appreciating and embracing that challenge, but not in an against sort of fashion.

No, it's a yes, and with the idea of gratitude, like, thank you for being here. And not demonizing, not creating in a negative light these people that have come to Yeah.

Well, before we move on to some more of the concepts, how do you as a coach, how do you work with your players to sort of buy into this idea or help sort of shift their perspective?

We work a lot with our mission statement, what we've said that we're all about, and then with our stated values of Mindfulness of competition, of compassion, and of joy.

Yeah.

Which happen to be the values of the Golden State Warriors. So, um—

You're in good company.

What's that?

You're in good company.

I know. Well, yes, we are in good company. But, um, yeah, we're— we talk a lot about that, and we just have that— we try and create that language of unity, of commitment, and then, like, one of the words Another word that I have and that we talk a lot about within the team is community, which literally means to have charge of together. And it means it's the unity to become one and to continually become one again after any sort of separation.

Yeah.

So we, our little team, is a little community. We have charge of it, but we also are residents of a larger community and then a larger community and obviously then the global community. Those are 2 of the big ones that we work with, with the competition and community with the team.

And so on a typical day, on a typical practice, you're in season right now. And so what are some of the practical ways that you keep that sort of front and center as a coach when working with your players to get them to remember sort of these bigger values that you all are playing for?

If you have a suggestion for that, I'd love to know. But again, it's— they know. And at the beginning of the season when we all get together, I put the values out. And as I use the language, they get that. And I find it just on a regular daily basis, like you said, what do you do on a daily basis? It's just repeating the words, repeating the words, talking about competition, talking about community and having charge of this together. And other things like— Education, education to draw forth. And I'm like, I'm not putting in you, I want to draw forth your best person. I want to draw forth your best player. I want to draw forth from you who you are. And therefore, we're going to push you. We're going to make you struggle. And I heard a quote yesterday that talked about Jesus' idea of peace, where it's not necessarily peace, but it's not that you're not struggling.

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

But it's in the presence of love, so that his peace is actually love, and it doesn't mean there is no struggle. So to embrace really the struggle and to move forward and find that unity, the community, the true competition. And I will say it's not as easy as it sounds or as we think it is. Everybody comes with their own agenda. Getting to the one agenda is very difficult.

That makes me think too, just the idea of whenever you start speaking about values and that some of our core values are love and compassion and teamwork. In sports, a lot of times you start talking about those kinds of values and people will automatically assume, oh, that must mean that it's not a very competitive environment or maybe you're soft and maybe you don't really care about the result. And without making the connection that you can actually have— that one actually supports one another.

Yeah.

It's sports teams that have high respect, trust, and value doesn't mean they don't have high levels of conflict and competition. It's just that they're operating from values, maybe a stronger foundation of values that allows for more honesty and allows for more candor and actually allows for more of a competitive environment because it's built on trust and respect. Have you seen that in your coaching?

Absolutely. And I've seen it grow over the years. But where at this point I am much more able and willing than I was as a young coach to initiate and to sit in the hard conversations. What we consider the really difficult conversations of, this is what I see, this is where you need to be, or you should not be a part of this anymore, kind of thing.

Right.

So those are some of the hard conversations. You know, where I feel you need to grow to be a better member of our community. So yes, I've grown in my coaching as I've truly considered all of these ideas, and I know they work because I know I have alums who come back and say, I get it now. You know, they're like, I get it. And maybe it's not immediate. I know that this process is not immediate. I know that you don't plant a seed of an idea and it grows into a flowering fruit tree in the next day. I get that.

Or 4 years, right?

Right, no, exactly. And maybe I am more willing to accept an outcome, but knowing that the seeds have been planted. The young ones are impatient. There is an impatience there and they want things immediately. I suppose as an older coach that I know that that's not possible.

Yeah.

We have to do the hard work. You've got to do the hard work. You've got to continue the discipline. You have to continue the commitment. Our mission statement says to teach excellence, commitment, respect of self and others in a culture of trust. So yeah, that takes sometimes a long time to continue to develop.

Right.

Yeah.

To get into sportuality here a little bit more as well, you and I have seen, just like most people have seen, how obviously sports only continues to get bigger, which means the business continues to get bigger, which means youth sports has turned into into a billion-dollar industry. And so you're getting kids coming into your program who a lot of times maybe haven't had the best example or maybe the best intentions for what youth sports, the intent of youth sports. What are some of the ideas you're really trying to share or instill? What are some of the things that you do with your team or with players as they come into your program?

Wow, that's so rich. So one of the things I just say in the volleyball culture, in the youth volleyball culture, that we cannot have a team of more than 8 players so that everybody has this, you know, that everybody plays. Playing is actually a right and not a privilege, and it's something that's given and not earned. So those are some of the things that I find that we have to continue to teach is this dedication, this commitment, this discipline, even though there's not a guaranteed outcome. And you continue to go at it, and it grows you no matter what. My youngest son who played baseball, and he was at Western, he went down through the IMG Academy, he trained, was drafted by the Detroit Tigers, and after his 3 years of service to the Tigers in the minor leagues, came back home and was finishing up his degree. And he said— We said, well, why don't you go back and give back? to the community that gave so much to you as a youth, like with his baseball training facility? And he said, you know, I don't like where youth sports has gone. And this is a 26-year-old.

Right, right.

And so he's saying, you know, he sees this youth sport. And now, you know, as I have been talking about the ideas of sportuality and this idea of sport and business Yes. Does come up on a regular basis because you do hear, you know, in Scripture and in wisdom tradition language that money is the root of all evil. And so, as we put a price tag on it and money on it, there is this more of a sense of urgency and expectation and all of these kind of things. But Kevin, when he said that, was like, Wow. So they— it— what is happening here, um, with, with the people actually making a living off of youth, where a lot of, um, there are surgeons, right? There are so many more surgeries happening on youth and children.

Yes.

Where some surgeons have actually said that to, to do too many— like, to throw too many curveballs or to play youth football or whatever is actually child abuse. I mean, that is where it's become, right? Because we're seeing our children as commodity. We're seeing our children's bodies as a commodity and not as a physical entity attached to a mind and a spirit. What sportuality Does is connect all of those and says, yes, your body is important because the word holy literally means to become one. And that's holy— in the chapter that I write on holy talks about health and how to take care of the self and the physical self and the mental self and to be wholly, or W-H-O-L-L-Y, wholly participating in something. So yes, I believe that as we commodify things, whether it is education or sport or health, that the people in general, the community of people, sometimes suffer. So I, I think there are questions that we do have to answer there. Why are we doing this? Why?

That was just coming to me. I was like, yes. Right? What are those questions as a parent listening to this podcast who has a child in youth sports? What questions— because it's so easy without even thinking about it to get so wrapped up in, well, I guess I need to have my child doing this and I guess they need to be doing this and I guess they need to be doing this. Why? Well, because all the other kids are doing this.

Right.

So what are those questions to help a parent have pause and say, wait a second. What questions should I be asking?

Ask their kids what do they love, and not because I love it.

Yeah.

What do you love to do? And there was a little girl in a restaurant the other day, and she was so sweet. She was about 2 years old, eating with her parents, and they saw that I had a volleyball shirt on. Oh, should she play volleyball? And I'm like, I don't know. Only she knows, right? As a child, as a youth, I think the best models maybe come from the East where it's just train them in gymnastics and dance and body and awareness and let them play outdoors and let them play rather than teaching them organized sport until they're well over 10, 12, 13, 14 years old.

Yeah.

To bring out their inner athlete first. So educate them in the ways of play and sport early, and have this sense of body confidence. And boys too, both of our boys had gymnastics as youth here at Western Michigan University. They did a little clinic, and they would just go and they'd get comfortable with their bodies moving through space.

Right.

And that's really an important thing that we forget get to teach our children. So I think if we can teach our children that self-awareness, that body awareness, but then also what we were talking before the podcast began with this whole mindfulness with children, I think that's important too, you know, to be asking the critical questions. Is this something I love? Because as a parent, when your child comes to you and says, I don't want to play this anymore, and we've invested our entire, like, our entire social life around the parents on their team, there goes what we thought we were too.

Yeah.

I think we really need to be cognizant of who we are as parents and what we're trying to help our children achieve. A lot of it is a scholarship, and I see that through the volleyball clubs. If I go into a club or You know, I have— we have this person on scholarship, this person on scholarship, all over the walls. And so— but I do know that they experience the same issues of physical health, of mental health, and even of crisis of spirit that we do at Division III, that any child does growing up, that just because you receive a scholarship does not make you immune to issues of, you know, the heart.

Yes.

So, and I think we as parents also have to say, like, what are we afraid of if our child— so if our child isn't on the all-star team when they're 8 years old, are you afraid they're not going to pitch in the major leagues? You know, we have to— what is the fear? We have to look at what we're afraid of.

And are we going in with the expectation that they are going to be pitching in the major leagues? And that's the standard that we're holding them to, or the standard of the Division I scholarship.

Yeah.

And obviously, being involved in youth sports myself, I've seen— and working at IMG Academy— the number of kids that I worked with or work and continue to work with, that they actually get to the point where they've been offered a college scholarship, that thing that they were in pursuit of. And but by the time it's been offered to them, they are burned out. They don't even— they don't want to play anymore.

Absolutely.

And so, yeah, so to what cost, you know, especially with youth sports, to what cost Are we making this thing so important?

And how are we feeding our kids? What are we feeding our kids mentally, spiritually, physically? What are we feeding them? And so at Division III, the last thing I would like is a burned-out athlete because they come here and it's— we don't offer scholarships for athletic ability and we challenge them greatly in the classroom. And the students that graduate from here with a career in college athletics are so much farther along in terms of leadership and confidence and conquering the world, and with then with the academic skills to do this, to be able to actually do that. I really relish and I love the Division III model. And yes, I will miss— I will terribly miss working with these young athletes who are so Gifted in the classroom and in life. They just— their trajectory is just beyond mine. And my— I went to Michigan. I was supposed to be a doctor. That didn't ever happen because I played volleyball.

Right.

But I am here so that I can help others, other young women actually achieve that while competing at a pretty high level.

Right.

And while being able to get those lessons of sport and then take them out into what it is they want their career to be. Now, because we're women, is that an advantage? Because we know we're probably not going to go pro in most things. And is it more of a problem for boys? You know, because every boy that's born is an automatic pro athlete, right? So I— or in my circles anyway, the circles in which I travel.

Yeah.

You know, you wonder if they're going to actually go pro, but— and that their sport actually will serve them in their life in the future, you know, that they can continue to have joy. My goal for people that go through my program is to, when they're done playing their collegiate career, They can look back with joy and they can look in it as joy and they can say, I remember it with fondness and with joy, with love, and they connect back. And that's probably the most important thing for me. And I would hope that for any parents that they can ask their children, do you love this? Do you have joy in this game? And can you simply say to a child after a contest, I love watching you play. I just love watching you play.

Yeah.

Because it gives me great joy. If you can answer that question, that will bring you and your child closer together.

Right, right. I love that feedback too. I've used that myself. Especially as a coach and parent, there's plenty of times maybe after a game where You know, the competitive coach side of me wants to go, all right, I've got to give, you know, I've got some points they need, I need to make sure they hear. And I catch myself, I'm like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, no, no, it's really not my job. And just to give that feedback, wow, I really love watching you play.

I love watching you play. And actually, yeah, because I was glad my kids played baseball because I can't give them much feedback. The only feedback I can give them was, wow, I just, I simply Yeah, I love that. Because I could see their awareness. I could see their integration with their teammates. It made me feel good to watch them. And a hard thing for me as a coach and a parent was then being the parent watching someone else— like you said, someone else coaching my kid. And to have the same thought about the joy in the games as I have when I coach it. So it's not easy. It's always tough. There's always going to be a struggle, but it doesn't mean an absence of love.

Right, right. Now, Jean, tell us about the Sportuality Box Score. How does that work?

Oh, the box scores are things during the chapters— well, let's see— that let you kind of reflect on the idea. So, community chapter, the box score says, why are you drawn to people who have heart? What does your life reflect? How does your life reflect what is in your heart for yourself and for others? Can you see what is in your heart manifest in your community, your team, your family? Do you realize that your emotions affect your performance? How do you manage and access those emotions? And so, yeah, so just little— they're just little box scores of things that kind of help you make it real for you, because I put in the book anecdotes of things that I know. And that are in my experience, but this is saying, what is your experience in this particular— through this particular word, this particular idea?

Yeah, yeah, I love that. I love that. And I just thought of this idea or this question that I think would be really helpful because I think a lot of times, again, we're going back to youth sports and talking to parents here, Or even talking to any players who might be listening, it's helpful to know, for you as a college coach, when you get a chance to talk to maybe a young player or a youth player, someone who might be interested in playing at the collegiate level, beyond just their ability, what are those things that you are really sort of conscious of as a person or as a character that you're really interested in that maybe parents aren't always thinking about?

What a great question. I love sitting with young people who are curious, who have questions. When you say, oh, do you have any questions? Well, no, I'm good. Who truly have, you can tell their wheels are turning. I love a curious mind. I also love someone who just says, I would do anything to play my sport. I love my sport, and here's why I love my sport. Some don't know why. And if you don't know why this sport is resonating with you, sometimes then it's more about the outside forces affirming that for you, either parents or coaches or friends.

Right.

And so I would rather sit with a young person that is curious, that is obviously thinking about the process and seeing where they want to be and knowing where they want to be in life and knowing that this process of sport can help them get there. Currently at Kalamazoo College, we have a group of young people We don't have a phys ed major. We don't have, like, sport management programs. We do have a business major. We have a lot of athletes who are very interested in staying in this business of sport. And so, we have had young people, our students, put together a student organization that is sport and business careers, or business sport careers, where— They can stay in sport and they can stay in this whole idea of sport and still earn money, you know, because sometimes in academia there is a disconnect between athletics and academics. And I love to see where a young person is able to make that connection. And they're bright, they can articulate their purpose, and they can say, this is what I What do I want out of my academic career? As I talk to a young person who's just even, maybe even just beginning the college search process, but I do ask them to journal. Journal this because after a while they all tend to run together and your memory doesn't serve you well with one versus the other. And like really think about and consider Why did you feel that way? Because as you go through and talk to coaches, as you go through and meet with other colleges or places where you might want to end up, how did you feel? How did you feel? Because as I ask my team, like, why did you choose this college? I don't know, I just felt— it just felt right. There's that— that's that spiritual piece of things. That's the, you know, the feeling that That which is unarticulated, that it is simply known, that I just knew I had to be here.

Yeah.

So those kids, the ones who have a sense of themselves and where they fit in the world, those kids are truly fascinating to me.

Yeah, absolutely, I agree, and there's a sense of ownership Right? There's a sense of ownership and accountability that goes along with that when you can tell that, you know, that young athlete or that child has put some thought into why exactly they play this game or love this game in the first place.

Yes, yes. And one other thing I love in children and young people and any— well, anybody actually is— and it's one of the sportual words— is humor. I love a good sense of humor. Not that you can make me laugh, or that you— maybe that you can laugh with me, right?

Yeah.

And the humor, the word literally means to be fluid and flexible like water, to flow around and through an issue with ease and grace, you know? And everything isn't the end, that if I bump up against a rock in the middle of the river, then I don't have humor. But as my humor allows me to flow around that rock and into safer waters. And this sense— it's a sense, it's a 6th sense, a 7th sense, whatever sense it is— but it's a sense of humor, to be fluid and flexible, to flow around and through issues. And sometimes it's funny, and sometimes we laugh at ourselves, we laugh with others, but I would rather have funny people on my team. And I found that when When a team is able to laugh among itself and with others, there's a lot more joy.

Yeah.

And it's a lot more fun. And so this idea— so in addition to the academic piece and the curiosity piece, I think there's this sense of humor that is cultivated in young people that we should cultivate in young people to allow them to play With ease and grace.

I love that.

To know themselves.

Yeah. And I love getting to that root of what humor is all about, the free-flowing. It reminds me of Bruce Lee talking about to be like water when he— I can't quote him directly, but it's a beautiful analogy that he uses that life is like, you know, to be like water. It's strong, and yet fluid at the same time. Now, Jean, I'm super respectful of your time because you are a coach in demand in season. You've got players that have meetings for you. But before we let you go, how can people find you and your book?

Oh gosh, Sportuality does have a Facebook. Sportuality: Finding Joy in the Games. We have a Facebook page. I am on LinkedIn. I am also on Facebook. Sportualitybook.com is the website for the Sportuality book, and it can be purchased from Amazon or from Balboa Press.

Perfect. I'm looking at the website right now. It's a fantastic website. So the website again is sportualitybook.com, and again, it is on Amazon and Barnes& Noble. Jean, thank you so much. I'm really grateful. You're in season. I know you're super busy, but I thought this was just an idea, a concept, a conversation that would be really valuable to the weekly Yes! And audience. So thank you so much for your time.

Yes, and thank you. I am so grateful to you and finding out about you through Mitch Wilson, our golf coach, who I revere and who is just an amazing coach on his own, was a wonderful connection. So I appreciate Mitch and I appreciate you for what you're bringing to the greater good of everyone here. So thank you.

Thank you, Jean. I appreciate that. And thank you, Mitch, who I look forward to meeting in person as well at some point.

Fantastic.

Have a great day, Jean.

You too, Travis.