Episode 97: Unleash the Athlete with James Leath

I can't stand it. I know you're living. I'm sitting here.

Happy New Year, everyone. Happy 2018. Welcome to the Weekly Yes! And... podcast. I'm your host, Travis Thomas, the host of the Weekly Yap and the creator of Live Yes! And... Happy New Year! This is episode 96, I believe. Full transparency, it's still 2017 when I'm recording this. I'm not actually in the new year. So I'm in the past talking to you in the future. It's mind-bending. I know it. But no, first podcast of 2018. Happy New Year, everyone! And really excited that my first podcast of 2018 is interviewing a gentleman who is a fantastic guy doing fantastic work. His name is James Leith.

Hi!

And we are going to talk to him in a few minutes, but just want to again welcome everyone into the new year, remind everyone that it is the new year, and with the new year we all make resolutions. We have tweaks and changes that we want to make to ourselves and to our year, but most of us end up falling flat as the year goes on, whether we make it a day or a week or a few months. Eventually, a lot of those resolutions we commit to fall flat. And I am here To help you this year with, again, Get Unstuck in 10 Days, or 10 Days to Get Unstuck. The next one is starting January 8th. You can sign up on my website under events. For $30, you will get unstuck with 10 days, 10 activities, 10 videos, access to our Facebook group, one-on-one access to me, a free e-copy of my book, 3 Words for Getting Unstuck: Live Yes, And, and just a fun and great way to start off the new year, look at one specific aspect of your life you want to thrive in and just go at it. So again, that starts in— well, it is 2018. That starts on January 8th. And if you put the promo code YES in, you will save $5 on the course of $25. Come on, please. That is one cup of coffee at Starbucks. Don't fact-check me on that one. So here we go, episode 96. We're talking to James Leith. James is the former head of leadership at IMG Academy. Most of you may know the IMG connection because I worked at IMG Academy as a leadership coach. James came in after I was gone, so we never worked together, but we— actually, we worked together once where IMG brought me back to do a conference and James and I presented together. We hit it off big time. James has since left IMG recently to start his own company called Unleash the Athlete. I've been reading James' blogs and again following him for a while now. He's doing great work. to get him on to tell his story. His story is awesome. I mean, again, I don't want to spoil it for you, but we're talking mascot. We're getting some inside scoop at what happens to a college mascot who turns leadership expert. I love it. It's such a great story. James is a great guy. So without further ado, let's jump into this week's YAP with James Leath. James, how are we doing today?

I'm good, man. How are you?

Good, James. Excited to finally get you on the You and I connected for the first time just over 2 years ago, I think, and I was really impressed and really enjoyed hearing your story about how you ended up doing what you're doing. And I know that has continued to evolve. You know, you now have— you're the founder of Unleash the Athlete, and you just formally left IMG Academy as the head of leadership. So tell us, James, about Unleash the Athlete and the work that you're doing and why you're passionate about it. Yeah.

Well, I appreciate the intro. Uh, you know, it actually starts a long time ago, probably 15, 16 years ago now, where I was introduced to this world of improv that I've learned a lot from you and listening to your show. And I haven't caught you live yet, but man, I can't wait to see you live. And, uh, that's gonna be a lot of fun. But I love to watch your videos and I follow you on Instagram. I was at a show, my very first improv show maybe 16 years ago and thought this was amazing. Like, they're making up stories right on the spot. And they would use my suggestions. There was only like 20 of us in the audience. And one of the suggestions they took and they go, you know what, can you come up here? I said, okay, I'll go up there. You know, there's like 19 other people in the audience. So I'm good. So I get up there on stage. And when the bit is done, they kind of— one of the guys leaned over, his name is Charles Gooch. He's like, hey, do you want to stay on stage? And I've never been afraid of the stage. I'm like, yeah, I'll stay. So I stayed for 2 years. I was there for 2 years and I just loved it because where else in the world can you say something and they just say yes and they move on? You know, I mean, it's the crux of your business. And so I just love that idea. And at the same time, I was playing football. I was done with college and I was chasing a dream and to play up in the pros. And I was playing on the semi-pro team and we were struggling one day at practice and I'm at the water trough thing and I just started one of these— I don't remember what game it was, but I just started one of these games where it's kind of like a warm-up game where it's alphabet story or something like that.

Sure.

And my guys— I'm the only white dude on the team. And so I have to kind of— I've got this bravado when I'm there. I'm like, hey, what's up, fellas? How you doing? And what happened is they just all turned into little kids. They were just having fun and we were laughing and stuff. All of a sudden, I saw the demeanor of practice change. I tried to look for other reasons why it did, but it really had to do with just kind of goofing off around the water trough instead of talking trash on the coach or complaining about something. I was like, there's something here. Well, I was also coaching. I started doing some improv-type games at practice, the football practice. And the kids were really responding well to it. And so I had no idea that years later that it would be something where I would, I would do it as a full-time gig. I had no idea that was even possible. But I kept on doing improv, no official training until I took a course down in Los Angeles, and just, just kept using it. And so it evolved over time. And when I finally found IMG Academy, Literally the title, I think it was improv coach. Do you remember?

Yeah, for me, yeah, for me, I think it was improv and leadership coach, which I, which I'm like, this is a joke, right? This can't exist.

Right, right. Well, I'll back up a little bit. In college, I wanted to be a college football player. That was my dream. I wanted to play at Fresno State, and I was offered a preferred walk-on and And a few weeks later, I limped off. I got hurt pretty bad and ended up not playing there. But what happened was the cheer team said, hey, we know that, you know, you're not playing football. Would you come and cheer? And I said, no, I'm not gonna do that. They go, well, we actually want you to be the mascot. I said, yes, I will do the mascot. And so I got to combine my love for sports and being an improvisational guy, because a mascot is all about being just spontaneous.

Yeah.

For the moment type thing. And I can't talk, and so it's all body. And the other thing great about a mascot is I have a VIP access pass to anywhere I want to go as long as the play is not actually going on. So in the middle of a football game, if it's a timeout— and I— and that was the mascot's name, Timeout. And I want to run across the field, I can just run across the field. And I did. If I want to go hang out in the end zone and flirt with the other team's cheerleaders, I totally can. All appropriate. I can go up in the stands, basketball games. I would literally stick my big old head in the huddle during timeouts and listen to our coach, Ray Lopes, talk to the basketball team. And so I had this access to all these coaches. And they trusted me. They also knew me off the field and off the court. I remember one time at a football game, long story short, this mascot wouldn't talk to me, didn't want to play, which that's a big thing in the mascot world. And he ends up third quarter going over and he was a dog too. I was a bulldog and he was a bulldog. And he like lifted up his leg and peed on the goalpost. Like showing disrespect. I'm like, finally he wants to play. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So I run over to him and I'm like, all right, man, let's go. And, uh, I kind of push him and I look towards the ESPN camera and I kind of do like the muscle man pose. And all I remember is the guy from behind the camera, he starts pointing at me and screaming. I can't hear him, but at the last second I turn around and I see 2 huge feet coming towards my face. This guy was like Adam Sandler in The Waterboy, like coming at me and trying to kick me in the face. He wants to fight for real. I got that real quick. I get on top of him. He's trying to rip my helmet off. My boss comes over. I'm just like, I'm like, what is going on? And so then we go into the tunnel and I take my helmet off. He takes his helmet off and he goes, oh, dang it. I'm like, what? What was all that about? He's like, I thought you were somebody else. I'm like, you're trying to fight me? Like, you thought I was someone else, dude? We're there, we're entertainment. He's like, yeah, well, a couple years ago I was in the locker room and the other timeout, like, we actually fought. And so it was a total misunderstanding. And so then the next day I get, I get a text message like, dude, you made top 10 hits of the week. I'm like, what are you talking about? He goes, yeah, it's on ESPN. Like, so apparently when I saw the feet, like, I grabbed them, slammed them down, and got on top of them. And ESPN was like top 8 of the week. So, and, and I still haven't been able to find it, but somebody told me that.

Oh, that's fantastic.

So I'm on the treadmill Sunday morning and I'm running and I'm just exercising, and the head football coach, the guy who offered me the walk-on, he comes next to me. His name is Pat Hill, and he's jogging next to me. And, uh, I'm like, I wonder if he remembers me. I'm just jogging and he kind of takes a break and gets both feet on the outside of the treadmill, looks over, he's like, hey, Leith, Great hit. I was like, oh my gosh, that was the most amazing thing ever. He goes, if we hadn't scored in the 3rd quarter, we were going to give you the trophy for the best play of the game. Like, oh, that was fantastic. And so I was able to like to merge my love of athletics and my love of the yes and philosophy, and it turned into what I'm doing today with my business at Unleash the Athlete.

Oh, I love it. I mean, there's so much there. There's so much there to talk about, you know, because to the, the, the player to mascot, uh, transition, it's, it sounds like a Disney movie, James. You know, uh, you should actually make sure you secure rights to your story before Disney snags it.

Um, it's funny, I never even thought of that, but that, like, you have this like overzealous athletic mascot who's still like reliving his playing days, like That's hilarious. Yeah.

And then, you know, you go on, you know, to getting your master's and going into the world of sports and leadership and coaching. There's a real story arc there. You know, there's a real story arc there. I'm just saying. So tell me, so take us— actually, you know what? I don't think a lot of people, myself included, have had an opportunity to go inside the mask of an actual mascot. So as you make that transition from athlete into To mascot, you know, what was that like for you? What was that skill set? Because like you said, you can't talk, so you're having to do everything through nonverbal communication and body language. So, you know, take us inside the mask. What were some of the difficulties, but what were some of the key sort of learnings that you had taking that role on?

That is a great— I've never been asked that question. That's a good question. There's, there's pros and cons. Uh, there's some that are pros and cons. So like the pro and con, number one, uh, women really like mascots. I noticed that, uh, they would, they would pay attention to the mascot and they would always assume that we were guys for whatever reason. That was my experience. And again, this was 10, 11 years ago.

Yeah.

And so they would, they would grope me and that's a pro and a con. Like, you know, there's, there's like, it's like, oh, I get attention. But then you realize, I'm in a dog suit. She has no idea what I look like or who I am. And this is kind of sexual harassment.

Right.

This is weird. And so then you get all this attention, which is a pro. And as soon as you take the mask off, let me give you an example. I lived about half a mile from campus with a guy who had cerebral palsy, and I was his nighttime caretaker. And so I would ride my bike in the dog suit to the games. Down this street called Bulldog Lane, Barstow Avenue. And I would ride in the middle of the street and people loved it. And I'm wearing a helmet, so if someone's an idiot, like, wants to run me over, I'm kind of safe. But I mean, that became kind of like a tradition and people would like talk about how, oh, I saw, I saw Time Out on the street. And so I would, I would do that and everybody would pay attention. Everybody's like, hey, T.O., what's up? And then I'd go home, I'd take the mask off, I'd take the suit off, and I'd ride my bike home. And I tried one time to ride on the street and people were not having it. They were like, get out of the street, bum! You're an idiot! I'm like, oh, that's right, I'm not wearing the suit. And so you have to remember that you're no longer in that identity.

Right.

And, and so, but then there would be other times where I'd be on the field. Uh, I'll give you an example. So Derek Carr, yeah, the Raiders, they come to IMG every year when they play Florida teams. And last year when he came, because I was the mascot around when he was, uh, when he was at Full Fresno State, the last time they came I was like, I gotta go see Derek. Like, I wonder if he remembers me. And so I go down into the weight room, and IMG has amazing weight room facilities, and, uh, I kind of see him. And he's a funny guy. I don't know if you ever follow him, but he's, he's an amazing leader. His players love him. I remember watching him, like, the defensive line these Big dudes are like doing dumbbell presses on the benches. They've got, you know, they've got one of me in each hand and they're just going. And he'll go over there and like stick his finger in his mouth and put it in their ear like while they're lifting. And they love it. Like, they're just like, come on, DC. And I'm sitting there watching them. I'm like, this is their leader. They like their leader. Like, this is why the Raiders have been more successful than in the past. So anyways, that was a side note. I see him and I go, I go, DC! And I yell it really loud. He kind of turns around. He's got 2 weighted vests on and he's doing pull-ups. And he sees me and he goes, T.O.! And I'm like, my metaphorical tail is wagging, right? Like, oh yeah.

Oh yeah.

So I go over and I hug him. And then I remember I was like, do you remember the last time I saw you? And he goes, remind me. And I said, you scored at Fresno State. We chest bumped, I got on all fours, and then you walked me across the end zone. And he goes, yeah, yeah, I remember that. But see, the thing is, is that's improv. That— we made that up on the spot. We literally chest bumped, I got on all fours, he saw it and goes, yes, and I'm gonna walk you.

Yes.

And it was just fantastic, right? And so it's little things like that. You make these connections. The, the women's volleyball team loved timeout. They included me, or the dog in their team huddles, their prayer afterwards. I mean, they really embraced him. Softball team, same thing. The men's basketball team, they just, they loved it. And so I had a lot of fun. And a side note from that is that it made me, you know how people are like fanboys or girls and they see someone and they're like, oh my gosh, that guy's amazing.

Yeah.

Well, what I didn't realize is that when I got to IMG and all these famous Athletes would come through, I didn't have that sense of like, oh my gosh, it's so-and-so, because I had gone through that at Fresno State, right? You know, you're just like, oh wow, hey, it's nice to meet you, Cam Newton. You know, can I get something for you or something? You know, it's like no big deal. Uh, and so that, that whole like being in the mass thing. And the other thing is it's extremely warm.

Yeah.

Yeah. One of the biggest cons was I had— I was wearing an ice pack as a, as a, like a vest of ice.

Oh, wow.

And I had to wear these, uh, surgical gloves and then put the, the dog gloves over it so it wouldn't be all wet. Because you high-five— if you high-five a mascot and his furry hand is wet, that's disgusting. And so you have to be aware of what you look like, but you have to be aware of the experience that that they have. You know, it's like when you bring somebody on stage for improv, you want that guest, that visitor to have a good time as well as the audience. So you're like, you know, planting, hey, say this or do this. You know, you try to help them out so that way they look good because, you know, one of the rules of improv is that if everybody looks good, you look good.

Right.

The more you help somebody out to look good, the better. And so we would have visiting mascots and I would set them up for success. I'm like, hey, this is what you're gonna do. You know, whether I'm gonna rappel down from the scoreboard And then you're going to come in and you're going to save me because that last few feet are really scary for me for some made-up reason. Then they become the hero even though I'm the one that just rappelled 40 feet from the ceiling. It's all about the experience and showing them and the entertainment for them.

I love the example that you give about you and Derek Carr in the end zone. It's interesting because I don't think a lot of people, especially when you're watching on TV, I don't think it registers for a lot of people that the mascot is not talking. Right? Because it's such a big personality. I think people are assuming like, oh, they're probably still talking through the mask and they're leading cheers or they're instructing people to do things, and they're not. So you are having to communicate completely based on nonverbal communication.

Totally.

And then now, obviously, as a mental coach and as a leadership coach, as far as what you teach now and your improv background, you and I both understand Just how nonverbal communication and leadership is and how you react and how you respond just through body language alone, the impact that has on others and giving people the impact to sort of yes-and your idea like Derek Carr did with you in the end zone.

Yeah. It's funny to watch Instagram and you see all these parents who have their young kids And the kids are just terrified of Santa. That's like a rite of passage.

Yeah.

That you have to cry on Santa's lap. And so, you know, a lot of my friends have young children, and so you get to see those and you laugh. And I have pictures of myself being terrified of Santa. But the— one of the biggest challenges as a, as a big dog with a, uh, with his mouth open, there's a blight and it's, and it's darkness in there because that's what I see through. But then there's these sharp teeth, and a 3-year-old sees that Well, a 30-year-old sees that and like, oh cool, it's a dog. A 3-year-old sees that and says, that thing's gonna eat me, I'm gonna die right now, I'm terrified. And so I can't go, hey, no, everything's okay, it's gonna be all right, you know, I'm a person in here, because they literally think that there's a walking dog with a Fresno State football jersey on. That's, that's their real life. And so one of my favorite challenges is seeing some kid who's scared of me And then being able to make them smile. So I would cover my eyes, which is like my forehead, you know?

Right.

I could still see them. So I'd cover my eyes and I'd pretend like I was scared and I'd get really small. I, you know, I'd get down to their level and they'd come up to me and I'd kind of like shudder. So it lets them know like, oh wait, so he's maybe scared too. And then finally get to the point where they just like open up their arms, which is total vulnerability for a kid. And I just grab them, and that's a huge win. And though that's probably one of my favorite moments of being a mascot is when you win over a kid, because a 3-year-old is not going to a basketball game to watch basketball. They're watching the mascot the whole time.

Yeah.

So being aware of that and being aware of— and the way I translate that into when I'm working with teams is that if you're the star, they're watching you on the On the court, but they're also watching you on the bench, and they're watching you during warm-ups, and they're watching you kind of like you know not really pay attention to the game when you're not in. Like you're always being watched, and especially recruiters that the recruiters that I've talked to and big names come came through IMG, and and I still am working with some of them. And it's interesting that they one of their things is they're they're there to read body language, and they're there to watch the athlete. When the play is done, because they already know the athlete's good. The video, they've got the huddle video, highlight film, all that stuff.

Sure.

But this one coach came and one of our quarterbacks overthrew the ball. Receiver went for it and then missed it. And then I thought the play was over, so I started talking to the recruiter. He goes, hold on, wait a second. And I didn't know what he was looking at. And it was about 10, 15 seconds afterwards, he goes, okay, what were you saying? And I go, what were you— if you don't mind me asking, what were you watching? He was like, I came to watch what happens after the play in practice. And I said, well, what happened? He goes, well, he just left the ball there. There was nobody out there to get it. He turned around and he walked towards the huddle. I go, what's that mean? He goes, that means he won't play for us.

Oh, yeah.

I was like, oh, like right there, one that he— that kid. And he didn't— he went and signed with somebody else. But he's like, he's not going to fit our program. Because he's, he's not paying attention to the details. And he's got this entitlement attitude where the ball was overthrown, so it's not his fault. And then he's not gonna go get the ball. So I'm watching the ball, the ball literally stayed out there for 5 or 6 minutes, nobody got it. And it was maybe 10 feet from the guy who could have gotten it. And that was just such a life lesson for me. It's like, people are watching you when you don't think that they're watching you.

Absolutely. Yeah, I love that. It's interesting, you use the analogy of you as a dog and a 3-year-old. A lot of times, that dog is your star player in the huddle or on the team, and that 3-year-old is the rest of the players on the team. How is he or she going to respond to them? Are they presenting themselves in a way that is invoking trust and support? and camaraderie amongst their other team players, or are they keeping them scared and intimidated, which we both know only hinders the overall teamwork and collaboration?

Yeah.

All those skills that— where are kids getting this type of training outside of the work you've been doing and the work I'm trying to do and different people are doing? James, tell us then. In your yes-anding of life, how do you go from player to mascot to head of leadership at IMG Academy?

Okay. So I was coaching and I was teaching at the high school that I went to, and there were massive cuts in California in 2008. Gosh, it was a while ago, about 2007, 2008. Our district, they got rid of 300 teachers. I was in my first year of teaching, and so towards the end, the superintendent, he called me in and he was my old football coach. He's like, hey, we held on to you as long as we can. We're letting you go. I'm like, I went here. I teach special ed. I'm working with the varsity. There's no— really? He goes, it's literally a matter of budget. It has nothing to do with your talent. And that really— that phrase really stuck with me because—

Yeah.

It showed me that it doesn't matter how good you are in certain environments, the decision is being made for other reasons. And so I decided, okay, well, I'm no longer going to pursue being a teacher in an academic sense at a high school. What I want to do is become like a resource. to these coaches and these teachers. So I started personal training and I started working with a bunch of different teams and I stopped working with just one team as a coach. Instead, I came in and I helped them with mental conditioning. I helped them with planning practice. Up to that point, I already had about 8 or 9 years of planning practices and being a coach and so I could offer some value. So then I went and I got my master's in performance psychology. And it's just such a fascinating field of study because it has to deal with all these nerves that you get when you're on the stage, whether it's the actual theater stage, whether it's a police officer or a doctor or an athlete at any level. Because the nervousness that a 10-year-old experiences at their first at-bat when their dad is in the stands is real. And that's— it's extreme. And it's obviously when you're a 29-year-old at the Olympics, the stakes are much higher, but the feeling is the same and you're still nervous and that's, that's your world. And so I just wanted to dive into that. And so when I found IMG Academy, I actually applied to be a mental conditioning coach. And when I met the hiring manager, or one of the hiring managers, he says, you know what, you're more of a leadership kind of guy and I think you should pursue that. And so I did, and I was hired. And I, I called you because, you know, I know that you had been there, and you gave me some great advice on what to look for and what to expect. And just really decided that I was gonna, I was gonna use all my experiences to work with most of the, you know, some of the most elite athletes in the world. And so I was there for 2 years, and I, I was able to focus primarily on leadership and character development. Which has to do with the communication and the identity portion and the connection to your team and the culture of your team, and not so much the science of being a better athlete, but actually the science of being a better person, which in turn makes you a better athlete.

Right.

And so my father became ill in June, and so I kept on traveling from, from Bradenton, Florida to Dallas, Texas. And my, my boss was very, uh, comforting. He helped me out. He allowed me to go. But it came to a point where I was just like, this is too much travel. I need to be there. And so I resigned at ING and, uh, didn't know what I was gonna do because when I was there, I was, I was all in. That's kind of been my thing. Like, when I'm somewhere, I'm all in there. And so I didn't really have any backup plan. And I just decided, you know, I should probably keep doing what I'm doing in some capacity. And so I thought, what would I— from 10 years from now, what could I be doing that I'd be still happy that I'm doing? I was like, well, I'm doing it. I was doing it at ING. I was doing it before with different teams. So I started Unleash the Athlete. The story behind that is that athletes are tethered by all these outside distractions and all these people and all these expectations. And if I could give them the tools and the strategies that I wish I had when I was a younger athlete, And I can unleash them to be better, then that's what I want to do. So, our curriculum is based around leadership development, the communication tools, the identity pieces, but then also mental conditioning, which is the breathing, the meditation, the goal setting, the imagery, the visualization. So, you merge all these things together and give these athletes at any level— I work with grade school all the way through the pros. It really just kind of unleashes them and helps them to get to their best at a more consistent basis.

Yeah, I love that. Again, we'll get into here in a minute your new venture of Unleash the Athlete. I want to talk more about what you want to do with that. But for our listeners out there, James, you— and in those couple of years at IMG Academy, you probably logged over 1,000 hours of teaching hours working with youth college, professional, elite athletes. What are the 2 or 3 nuggets from working with athletes over and over and over again that you feel are often the most overlooked or most valuable when it comes to just the quality of leadership or performance?

Great question. I think that one of the most overlooked things when athletes Or just a person, a high-performance person, is distraction management.

Hmm.

One of the blessings of being at IMG as an athlete is there's not a whole lot of distractions because Bradenton's kind of far from any real trouble that you can get into in Tampa. You gotta, you gotta get— I mean, that's a 45-minute drive. And so when you're here as a visiting athlete, they're very intentional about having no outside distractions. And there's professional athletes walking around the campus And there's no media hounding you. There's no mingling with the students that go there. You're very much there to train, which is why so many Olympians train there. And so I think having that just ability to really focus and not be distracted is huge. And one of the things that I'll teach my athletes is the simple distraction of the phone and taking control of the notifications. And that you don't need to hear a ding at 1 o'clock in the morning when somebody sends you a sales email.

Right.

And turn that off because that'll wake you up. And so you, you lose that, that amount of sleep because it wakes you up and then you're out of REM sleep and then now you have to get back into it. And the best drug you can possibly take as an athlete legally, it's sleep. Getting enough sleep that your body can regenerate itself because you don't build muscles On the bench, you build muscles on the bed. You know, you break down the muscles on the bench. I've never said that.

That's great. You— wait, wait, hold on, hold on, man. Hold on. Capture that for a second.

That was fantastic.

Say it again.

I'm gonna use that one.

Say it again.

So you don't build muscles on the bench, you build them on the bed. You break down muscles on the bench.

There it is right there.

Build up.

Beautiful.

Beautiful. So that's, that's it. And if you can unleash an athlete and can unleash a person to go and be better and not have to be so bogged down by all the distractions in life— do you ever watch The Dave Chappelle Show?

Yes, I do.

So one of the first episodes was he— one of the questions that he postulates is, what if malls were like computers and going around on the internet. And so he would go around the mall and every pop-up ad that you would see like on the computer was somebody that'd run out of the store and they'd yell at him. And it was— there were some really obscene things, but he'd be walking and all these pop-up ads would just come up out of nowhere. And he was just like, leave me alone. He's like, how do I get rid of all these pop-up ads? He's like, well, they're part of life. And, uh, they would, they would distract him. He's like, I'm here to buy some boots or whatever it was he was there to buy. And then he finds himself in like a perfume shop and eating hot dogs and all this other stuff, and he finally goes home and he's like, dang it, I didn't even get the boots.

Right, right.

You know, he was so distracted. And so, I mean, how many times have we done that where we go to the store to buy one thing and we spend $100, we get home, we're like, dang it, we didn't get the eggs. It's the only reason we went to the store. Yeah, distracted by everything. Yeah, so that's huge. That's really big. I think the other one is just learning very basic principles on how to communicate.

Hmm.

To an audience personally. So like being able to present and having all those hours logged, like you said, presenting was, was such a blessing to me because I was able to really understand like what an audience is going through and how to respond if an audience member or an athlete is not interested or they're too interested or they're late or they're like all these different things. And so getting all these, all these different different situations as a presenter. That was a big blessing.

Again, we're talking about skills that most coaches— actually, let's be honest. Most coaches at the top level aren't building in practice time into their sessions. So, you trickle that down to youth sports and there's just no time for that type of— well, there is, but it's not built into the overall And then, quite honestly, a lot of coaches who are sport-specific don't maybe necessarily have that skill set or that tool set to know how to properly teach some communication skills, some team-building skills, some character skills, which hopefully brings us to the work that you're doing now. For those of you who are listening, I really highly recommend that you go to James' website. You sign up for his blog. James, you write beautiful, beautiful blogs on the topic—

Thank you.

—of leadership, of helping parents, athletes, And again, to speak to that audience a little bit, especially parents and coaches, what are some— kind of one of those one or two top things that you feel every parent or coach needs to know in order to support a youth athlete?

Wow. That's another couple hours right there. There's a company called Changing the Game Project. that I've worked with for a few years now, and John O'Sullivan, one of his favorite things to tell parents is when that ride home when the kid lost or won, they don't really want to talk about the game. The best thing you could possibly say to them is, I love to watch you play. That's it.

Yeah.

I love watching you play. Then you just leave it at that and let the kid enjoy the experience. And so many parents, they want to take over the experience. They want to take over and make sure that the kid has everything. I saw a baseball dad a few weeks ago carry his 11-year-old son's baseball bag all the way to the dugout, hang it up, pull out a baseball bat, and hand it to his son. Okay, go warm up. That's what he tells him. Because I'm standing there and I'm watching this whole thing. And I don't know about you, but I'm thinking this kid doesn't have a chance. There's no way. There's no way. I mean, I, I literally— and it sounds like a cliché, but I had to ride my bike 3 miles after school to practice wearing my bag through a community that was all about getting in trouble. And like, it was kind of like a very bad community. And so I'm— it's like exercise for me. I'm getting through there really fast because I don't want to get beat up. And steal my bag. But then I had to ride home through that. And so that made me appreciate the experience. That whole— that made me appreciate it. And that father is robbing his son of any kind of ownership in that experience of playing baseball.

Yeah, that's funny. You know, this morning my son does a pre-academy soccer training 3 mornings a week. We're getting ready to leave this morning. You know, it's like, you know, 7:40, 7:45, and, you know, I'm ready to go. And, uh, he looks at me, he's like, hey, did, did you get my water bottle? And I'm like, why would I get your water bottle? I'm like, you, you know where your water bottle is.

Thank you.

And, you know, it's like, not to say I haven't, you know, I'm in the kitchen getting ready, I'm like, all right, I'm gonna fill his water bottle up this morning. And, you know, But he looked, and I'm like, no. It's funny, but yeah, you mentioned that. Again, I have been guilty of that, and I catch myself guilty all the time of going, whoa, whoa, whoa, this isn't— We're going to give our kids everything. Yeah, exactly. Their experience doesn't need to be served up on a silver platter. The privilege is the opportunity to play, and it is. Boy, I tell you what. As a parent, it is tough. It is tough to watch your child fail. But if you can allow yourself to let them fail, the benefits and the growth— I mean, obviously, please, that's what I try to teach. But the benefits and growth are so valuable. And for parents to be able to take a step back and— You know what? Your kid forgot his glove. at practice, don't sprint home and get it for him, right? That's going to be a tough practice of him sitting there and not practicing. He's probably not going to do that again.

You know what? He'll probably also learn how to field with no glove.

Right, right.

Which is a great skill. So, when we give our kids an easy way out, we take away from them a lesson on how to be successful. Yeah.

Yeah.

And, and I, I worked at a— I did a presentation for a school in Jersey a few years ago. It was an all-boys school. And I walked— there's one door to get in and out of this whole school, and it's a big glass door, and there's one sign on it, and it's in like large font, like 40 or 50 font, and it says, if you're here to bring your son his lunch, turn around and go home. Isn't that great?

Yeah.

Like, thank you.

Yeah.

That's fantastic, you know. And so I— that's what— for parents, and, and it's, it's very difficult to see your kids struggle, and it's— and you want to give them everything. But as an adult, we have the privilege of knowing that through adversity comes triumph. Through that kind of pain, managed pain, right? If the kid is you know, knife sticking out of his arm, you know, I'll be like, hey, be tough, you know, like take the knife out. But like, if whatever, whatever struggles they're going through, that's how we learn. And we can rob our kids of— I wrote, I wrote this article a couple months ago called The Zipper Phenomenon, where I watched this woman let her son struggle with the zipper of a jacket.

Hmm.

And she could have very easily gone down and just be like, zip. And he was like, Mom, I can't do it. And she's very calmly, She's like, yes, you can. Mom, I can't do it. And finally, when he does it, it's that beautiful moment where he looks up at mom and goes, I did it. And when parents ask me, how do I make my son mentally tough? That's how you do it, right? You let him struggle, right? Jocko Willink has this great podcast. He's a— Discipline Equals Freedom is a book that he wrote. And someone asked him, how do I get my son to stop partying during college? And he goes, stop giving him money. That's it.

Right.

That's how you do it. If someone will text me or email me, how do I make my son or daughter more mentally tough? I'm like, well, have them get a job.

Right.

And their response, but they play baseball all year long. I said, well, that's very sad because they shouldn't. Because by the time they get to the place where you think you're going to get your investment back, they're going to be burned out and not want to play baseball anymore.

Yeah. Yeah. Well, I mean, we know this, right? Parents are often the biggest obstacles to their children's success, not because they don't love them, but because they love them too much.

Precisely because they love them. Yeah.

Absolutely. Yes. And I can't think of the gentleman's name. He's the blind gentleman who now teaches other blind people to live a full life through echolocation. And he basically says, he says, the biggest obstacle from blind people living full, rich lives is the loving family around them because they don't want to see them hurt or get hurt in the process of learning. And I think you can take that to any degree as far as parents. And I see that in myself all the time. All right, man. Well, let's talk about Unleash the Athlete.

Hold on.

We've got to talk about the coaches real quick.

Oh, yes, absolutely.

Go back. Thanks for catching me.

Absolutely. The thing that I found with coaches is that they think that mental conditioning and leadership development is an addition to practice when it's very much a part of the practice. That's what you and I teach as coaches. It doesn't have to be an additional thing. It just takes a little forethought. If a kid is struggling on, let's say, the basketball shot, then you break the shot down. You let them struggle a little bit. Or if they make an error in a football game. I remember this one kid, he fumbled. And so he starts coming out and I meet him halfway and I go, Matty, what are you doing? He goes, I'm coming out. I go, why? He goes, I fumbled. I was like, why'd you fumble? He said, I had my arms wrong. I go, can you get your arms right? He showed me. I was like, good. Get back in there. You're getting the ball. He scored the next play.

Wow.

And years later when I talked to him about it, he remembers that situation. That I trusted him to make up for his mistake. Whereas a lot of coaches would have taken him out. Go sit down. You fumbled. You're making an a-hole out of me.

Right.

Hold on. It has nothing to do with you. The kid is human. And Derek Carr fumbled yesterday on the goal line, cost the Raiders the game. Do you take him out? Derek, go sit down, you loser.

Right.

No. You don't take him out. He knows what he did wrong and As parents, we want to talk about the mistakes on the way home from practice or the game, and that's one of the worst things you can do with a kid. Or as a coach, if you can leave them in and they— and there's a difference. If the kid makes a mistake and he's like, I don't care, Coach, okay, take them out. But if the kid makes a mistake and knows they made the mistake and acknowledges it, leave them in there. See what they can do. Now, if they make another one or the same one, now it's coaching ball. You take them out, you need to teach them the technique. But those little situations, that's how you build leaders. And if you tell kids, hey, I need you guys to step up, and they're 8th graders, they don't know what that means.

Right.

Especially if you're in a community where these parents, they give them everything that they want and they have all the best gear and stuff. Why do they need to step up? Mom and dad will step up if there's a problem. And so that's— it's one of the things that I try to tell these parents and these coaches is that You know, if you make things difficult in practice, it's going to be a lot easier for you in the game.

Right.

Because they've gone through that anxiety. You can't, you can't expect adversity to be absent in practice and expect them to be a leader during the game because you can't have leadership if you don't have adversity. There's no reason to step up if there's no, no kind of problems going on.

Yeah, I love that. I love that. And, and, and yeah, turning, uh, turning leadership into, uh, having that be something that is talked about and addressed, uh, in practice, in training, and as, as a coach to build that time in. Uh, yeah, so I love that. All right, man, Unleashed.

Now we can talk about Unleashed.

Ah, yes. All right, so there we go. All right, so what, what, what, what's your goal? What's your, what's your vision? What ultimately Are you fired up and wanting to do with Unleash the Athlete?

Well, there's 2 things I'm really excited about. The first is pretty easy. It's online courses. I've got a couple online courses that are going to be released over the next few months that an athlete or a parent or a coach can take and just learn the basics of sports psychology, leadership development, improv for athletes, or even some basic team-building activities. Those are the 4 courses. They'll be on my site. Like I said, they'll be released in the next couple months. The thing that I really love is going and working with teams, going and working with a staff of coaches. I know you do very similar work. It's a lot of fun to watch. Whenever I see you do rock-paper-scissors cheerleader—

Yes.

It's just no matter who you do, it's always a winning activity. It sets Yeah. It sets these anchors for the coach to be able to go back and be like, do you remember the energy that you had when you played that stupid game when Travis was out here, when Coach Leif— like, do you remember that? And the kids would be like, yeah. And be like, okay, find that energy. And so what I find in my work is that what I'm doing is giving the coaches the ability to kind of put down an anchor and be like, remember when you learned that? Like, let's work on that. Or, uh, I'll do, you know, like when all the kids, they get out on a tarp and you have them flip the tarp without getting off the tarp, you know?

Right, right.

It's one of my favorite activities. What I find during that activity is the kids, they start communicating, but they're rude to each other because that's how they communicate. That's, that's all they know. And so when I'm in session with these kids, um, even adults, when we do it with adults and somebody says something that's kind of off-putting Or rude. I'm at practice, and so I can literally like just stop. All right, so Person A, you said this to Person B. Can we all agree that was kind of a jerk thing to say? And, you know, the guy's like, oh. So I'm like, hey, hey, no judgment, but did you see how that person would be shut down because of the way you said it? So let's erase that, and then give me someone else. Who? What can you How can you say what he wanted to say, but in a nicer, more accepting way?

Right.

And that's a lesson for everybody. So now all of a sudden we're learning that what you say matters and how you say it matters and who you are when you say that matters, all because we're on a tarp and we're trying to flip it over without getting off the tarp. And so it's these little tiny activities that are experiential, and I could stand up there and lecture All day long, just like when you and I were in high school and college, and that's how they taught, and they wonder why we didn't learn anything.

Yeah.

Or I can get them on the tarp, or I can get them outside, or give them a hula hoop, or do all these other things, and during their, their experience, coach them up. One of my favorite things to do is— it's actually right before the tarp— is I have them take off all their shoes. And I'm very nonchalant about it. I go, all right guys, uh, everybody take off your shoes, line them up over there on the wall, and then get on the tarp. So I've got 2 tarps, they're all in there. There's 25 kids.

Yeah.

And they're split in half. And we do this exercise and all the stuff I just talked about. And then I go, okay, and the shoes are behind me intentionally, they're all on the wall. And I go, I want you to imagine you're at a tournament and you walk in And the only thing you know about the other team is how they lined up their shoes. Take a look at your shoes. And I'll turn around, I'll look at those shoes, and it's just all over the place. They're upside down, they're untied. I go, what does that communicate about the team who owns those shoes? And then they just start ripping the team. They forget that it's their shoes and they're the team, but they're like, they're undisciplined, you know, they don't match, they probably don't play very well, they're not paying attention to detail. I go, so already That team has a disadvantage because the other team has a sense of confidence that, look, if that's the way they treat their shoes, they probably in the rest of their life is not very good. I go, so what if you came in and the shoes look nice? I go, I'm gonna give you 30 seconds and I want you to fix them. And so then they go over there, they tie them, they put them in color order and size, and like it's just beautiful. And I step back and I go, all right, Close your eyes, and then when I count to 3, I want you to open them. And what do you see? And so I go, 1, 2, 3, and they open up their eyes and they see the shoes lined up. And I go, is that intimidating or what? They go, yeah. So then I get text messages from coaches weeks later of shoes and bags lined up on the sideline.

Yeah, I love it.

The detail.

Love it.

It's that idea of making your bed, right? You know, if you make your bed in the morning, When the Navy SEAL gets out of his bed and he's inspected by his instructor and he's all dressed up, the instructor doesn't look at him. He looks at the bed. If the bed is made perfectly, he can assume that his outfit looks good too.

Right. Right. I love that. I love that. Again, for a coach who is listening or a parent who is listening, that takes 5 minutes. 5-minute activity at the beginning of practice. Whether it's the shoes or their bags, their bags that are just strewn across the sidelines when they get to the field, right? Same idea, same principle, but instead of you standing on a soapbox and giving them a lecture about how messy and disrespectful they are, you turn it into an actual fun, insightful activity.

Well, yeah. So you have these coaches. They're wearing their sunglasses. The sun is behind them and they're yelling at the kids.

Right.

And they're like, why aren't the kids paying attention? It's like, first of all, you're comfortable because the sun's behind you and you have sunglasses on.

Yeah.

You're standing up and you're yelling down at these kids. Why don't you turn around, take a knee, take your sunglasses off, take a beat and relax and have a conversation with these kids?

Yeah.

That will be more powerful than the almighty coach with the sun in the background yelling at his or her players.

Yeah. Yeah.

And you can give a role to every player, like every week, say, okay, Jordan, you're in charge of the sidelines looking good, and if it doesn't look good, you will have to pay the price. They do it good for one week, and now, all right, Jordan, I want you to nominate somebody. Nominate Chris. Now Chris does a terrible job. Now he's got to do bear crawls across the football field. And so what does that teach Chris? It teaches Chris that he needs to learn how to communicate effectively to his teammates, get your stuff lined up. That's leadership training. That's, that's not in a John Maxwell book. You're not going to read that in a John Gordon book or any other Johns out there who write books. Like, but what you're going to do is you're going to instill a sense of confidence and leadership experience in the kids that no certificate or education is going to actually give them. It's that experience of, I had to do this when I was a kid.

Right.

And it grew from there.

Right. Again, it's not rocket science. I say this all the time. If it's rocket science, I wouldn't be teaching it. But it does require a certain level of humility, of vulnerability, and some self-awareness from coaches to realize that there's a whole lot more going on to coaching and performance than what drills you're running at practice. And so I love that. James, man, you and I could talk. This is— I'm sure this is part 1 of many podcasts to come. So, all right, how can people find you on the internet, on social media? How can they follow your newsletter? Go ahead and shamelessly plug yourself.

Well, I mean, thank you. It's been a pleasure. It's always fun talking to you. I'm on Twitter, Instagram, just James Leaf. That's my name. That's another thing I teach the kids is like get their name in social media. No one's gonna give a scholarship to Swanky Pants 249 or whatever. So yeah, James Leaf on Twitter, on Instagram, and then that's my website is Unleash the Athlete. And like I said, I send out that coach note every week. It's just little— it's like 500 words I think I'm up to like 78% last week read it on their phone.

Yeah.

Which just blows me away that people are reading so much stuff on their phone.

Yes.

Yeah. I try to keep my phone— if I could have a 3G phone that size where it's kind of rounded, the iPhone, I would keep that. I mean, it doesn't even work anymore. But like, these phones are getting bigger. You've got these laptops in your pocket, so people are reading from them. It's great.

Awesome, man.

So that's it.

Awesome. Well, hey, man, it's such a pleasure to have you on. Again, I know we'll be doing this again and excited to see what ways we can collaborate again moving forward. Thanks so much, man. There's so much good. Again, for all you listeners out there, I'm such a fan of James and what he's doing. I know you will be, too. Make sure you connect with him. James, man, thanks for jumping on the app.

Oh, it's my pleasure. Yeah, thank you. Thank you for having me.