The Hidden Hurt Behind Dismissive Partners

Shopify's Point of Sale system helps you sell at every stage of your business. Need a fast and secure way to take payments in person? We've got you covered. How about card readers you can rely on anywhere you sell? Thanks. Have a good one. Yep, that too. Want one place to manage all your online and in person sales? That's kind of our thing. Wherever you sell. Businesses that grow grow with Shopify. Sign up for your $1 a month trial at shopify.com Spotify shopify.com Spotify hi.

This is Charles Michael Davis. Toyotathon is on so stop by your local Toyota dealer for incredible year end deals on the cars, trucks and SUVs known for their legendary reliability like the stylish and efficient Camry, the Ready for anything RAV4 or check out a rough and rugged Tacoma or Tundra, all with great financing and lease options available to qualified customers. Visit buyatoyota.com to find out more. Toyota let's Go Places.

The Subaru Share the Love Event is on from November 20th to January 2nd. During this event, Subaru donates to charities like the ASPCA, helping support more than 142,000 animals so far. When you purchase or lease a new vehicle during the 2025 Subaru Share the Love Event, Subaru and its retailers will make a minimum $300 donation to charity. Visit subaru.comshare to learn more.

Welcome to Dear Dr. Tracy, the podcast that dives deep into the messy, beautiful world of relationships. I'm Dr. Tracy, clinical psychologist, relationship expert, and your go to guide for navigating relationships, boundaries in laws, and everything in between. Whether you're striving to rekindle the spark, set healthy limits, or build deeper connections, this is the space where real talk meets health expert advice. Together we'll tackle the tough questions, untangle the sticky situations, and uncover the small shifts that lead to big transformations in your relationships. So grab a coffee, settle in, and let's rewrite the stories you tell yourself. This is Dear Dr. Tracy, your guide to creating relationships that feel good.

Today's podcast comes from a recent event between Greg and I. So I'm sitting here with Greg and it is.

It is surprise.

We are talking about what happened between the two of us recently when you said something. And I absolutely love these podcast conversations with you because they put you and I right into the realness of everyday life. Just because I'm a couples therapist, just because Greg lives with a psychologist does not mean we're exempt from having these real moments. And then I love when we have A moment. And then it applies to the community and to our listeners because there's so much richness in that. And I remember having this and thought, okay, we have to take this one to the podcast. We need others to hear about this, because you and I were learning through it, and I just know so many other people are going to learn alongside us. Are you ready for the moment?

I'm not sure. I just want to say, I think it's really important for listeners to understand, yes, you have this expertise, but you're also a person. We also have our struggles like regular people. Slightly more, like, acutely aware of it, but it doesn't. It does. It totally doesn't exempt us. Do we spend more time on it than some? Maybe. But that's. That's who we are, and that's okay.

All right. This situation was. I was sharing something with you, and to be honest, I can't even remember what I was sharing. It might have been a logistics piece. It might have been something, how I felt about something. And then you said, you're right. And instead of the relief that would come from your partner saying, you're right, something inside of me actually tightened. Like, it just was like, this isn't landing. And I had this dialogue inside of me that was like, why do we feel disconnected in this moment? Why do I not feel seen, heard, and soothed? Do you remember the moment? And we probably joked about it as well.

I don't remember what you said. I do remember saying that many times.

Which is such a trope in relationships where people are like, happy wife, happy life.

Yeah, that's bullshit.

Yes, dear. Yes. Know your response. If your wife is upset, just say, yes, dear. That's not the fucking species. We don't buy into that. So I wonder if you think when you say that kind of comment, you're right. What were you hoping to happen?

Probably just to move past it.

Yeah.

Especially if it was maybe something uncomfortable. Just like, here's a positive affirmation to what you're saying. Valid. It's validation. I'm using air quotes for those people listening.

Hmm. You were trying to.

Let's get on to the next thing.

Oh, yes.

Maybe trying to control the outcome.

So your intent really was to soothe, to validate, to move forward. But the impact was I felt dismissed.

Placated. Or is it dismissed?

Pardon me?

Placated or dismissed?

It was dismissed. I. I felt like you didn't understand where I was coming from, that, you know, the story in my head was that you weren't interested in understanding what the story was.

Did you think I wasn't listening?

I didn't a minute that you weren't listening. It felt more like you wanted to just end the conversation. That that's what that comes up. So today Greg and I are talking all about dismissiveness. And I want to emphasize isn't about not caring, but it's, I think something much deeper than that. And it's tricky because when you go to that dismissive place, I go to the he doesn't care. And so I wanted to break this open and talk about what is happening here. Like this is actually about overwhelm. This is about our nervous system. This is about is even about learn patterns. But I also then want to talk about the tools to move forward so that partners who find themselves in this position can try something different. So I polled my community and I want you, Greg, to give me your reactions. So here are the top 10 that my community shared are the responses from their partner where they feel dismissed.

Okay, I haven't seen these.

Number one. Don't you think you're being a little sensitive?

Oh, that's so interesting. Because in preparing for this, I had listened to an excerpt from Jefferson Fisher, the car lawyer guy who's the communication expert.

Yes. Jefferson was on the podcast.

Oh, that's right, sorry. And he flagged this one specifically. And he told you to pull out the word sense out of sensitive. I forget the specifics, but it was like his response to this I'm totally derailing us was the response is, I sense something isn't right for you, or maybe you should.

So check that out. So instead of you saying, don't you think you're being a little sensitive, that you should instead say, I'm sensing something is happening for you.

Yeah.

Or is that supposed to be my reply?

I think it could be either. Right.

Oh, that's interesting.

Yeah. So that's so random. That was the first one because I.

Sensitive is a trigger word for me. If you're going to say to me you're being sensitive. That one was just flowing. Fly me off the handle because I am sensitive. It's taking me a long time to accept and acknowledge that.

Me too.

Yeah, right. For both of us. And we did grow up hearing that.

I didn't grow up hearing it. I grew up felting it. Feeling it, internalizing it. That might be different than your experience.

I think so. Because my internal experience wasn't that my emotions were wrong, but the external experience was that I was too much, too sensitive.

Mine was the opposite. I never Heard it from my folks.

Interesting.

Yeah.

Okay. Number two, everything will be fine.

Classic.

Is. It really is a. Like, hey, we're. It's fine.

It's pretty dismissive if, like, when you actually sit and talk about the topic of dismissiveness and then you hear this, like.

Yeah, yeah, it's pretty dismissive. And it's kind of like the.

It's lazy.

I'm lazy. I'm picturing it like, I'm at the airport and I forgot your passport. And you're like, everything will be fine. It's not fine. All right, number three, you're going to need to blank. You're going to have to blank. Be the bigger person.

That sounds like a 90s parenting.

Oh, yeah. You're going to need to be the bigger person or you're going to have to be the bigger person.

And don't you think.

Yeah. It really puts you in a box by saying your feelings don't matter. You just need to step up. These are all partners as words, by the way.

Right?

They all three so far. Flavor from 90s parents parenting.

Yeah, I think so. But not only that. It. It puts the onus back on you to do the right thing instead of the person who's dismissive to act differently. Right. So I have to be the bigger person. I have to now do the right thing. That's backwards.

I was thinking of it in a different example, but I really like that you added that there. You're gonna have to be the. Well, you're gonna have to be the bigger person. Yeah. Okay. I get it. It is this kind of like flipping. It's. It's on you. Yeah, it's like a. Like I'm flicking my finger. There you go. Bing. Back to you. Okay. Number four, I've been too busy. Burned out. Feels like I'm not worth his time. So. Oh, this is probably like, hey, love, I'd love to have a date night. I really miss you. I miss us. And then you get, I've been burnt out or I'm too busy.

Yeah, that seems a little contextual if this is in the couple's dynamic. I don't know. Like, it's certainly dismissive, but it's not, as it's not a trope like some of the other ones might be, is my interpretation.

It is. So right here, it's the. I'm so your partner comes to you and they. And this is. I think this is such a beautiful thing. I'm reading Super Communicators right now, by the way. And so I love Their first question, which is, what kind of conversation are we having right here? But then when I switch into the Gottman language, Gottman is, this is a bid for connection. I am looking to connect with you. I'm reaching for you. And instead of your partner, so you reach for me. You say, I miss you. I'd love to spend time with you. And instead of me entering into your world, I like, burn the bridge and say, I'm busy. Right? Instead of me saying to you, it doesn't. And just here's the other thing too. Just because someone misses you or need something doesn't mean you have to give it to them instantly. That's not how relationships work anyways.

Okay, interesting.

Number five, I'm tired too.

Yeah, it's the one upping or the comparison trap, I suppose the one upping.

This one reminds me of early postpartum and in all of like, thumb thump.

I go under the bus. Keep going.

Number six. It's not a big deal. Number seven, Just don't worry about it.

That's like not hearing someone or not being like. The lack of ability to, like, empathize. Like, just don't worry about it. Well, it's easy for, like, it's easy for me to say.

I think one of my friends and I were talking once about, like, just don't be anxious about it. It's. Well, sure, if I could not just be anxious and not have this normal emotion, don't you be scared.

Skydiving.

But don't you think I would have already not felt that way if I could just not is interesting though, because these common. These common statements really show this quickness in them. I think they're probably quick. They have been repeated many times and people have probably heard them themselves. Okay, we. Number eight, we will figure it out. Spoiler. We never do that.

Definitely came from a wife.

9. Sorry. Because it's rarely follow up with change. Oh, yes. So that's the empty. Sorry. So you say, oh, you know, love, I was thinking about the coffee mug scenario. Oh, the coffee mug. I asked you to put it away. And I've had to go around picking up 5 of your coffee mugs around the house and you're like, sorry, but like, what's the change? How are we actually navigating this together? Number 10, don't you think you're. Oh, this one showed up twice. Don't you think you're being a little sensitive?

Whoa.

Well, I think it's pretty common. Yeah, I had it in my notes too.

Did you?

Not even seeing your list.

Right. So a lot of it comes into these themes around minimizing, around this kind of platitude slash reassurance. Like it's this fake reassurance.

Yeah. I interpret a lot of it as reactivity. It's quick, it's like cutting. It's like, I'm going to deal with this, then I'm going to. I'm out. Peace out.

This podcast episode is sponsored by HelloFresh. If your home feels anything like ours right now, busy, full, a little chaotic, then you'll understand why I love HelloFresh. Truly. We've kept their recipe cards, shared them with friends, and made dishes we never would have thought of on our own. And during the holiday season, having everything come together in one bag so feels like such a relief. And this isn't the hellofresh you remember. They've seriously leveled up. They're bigger. The menu has doubled. You now get a hundred options every week. Seasonal dishes, global flavors and bigger portions that actually keep everyone satisfied. They're also healthier. You can choose from 15 plus high protein meals weekly like grass fed ribeyes or lamb chops, plus veggie packed recipes with two or more vegetables per dish. And honestly, it shows. 91% customers say they feel healthier with HelloFresh and three out of four parents say their kids are eating more veggies. And I also love that hellofresh is even tastier than before. Steak and seafood recipes delivered weekly for no extra cost with three times the seafood options, plus cozy fall dishes like beef, chili or honey glazed pork tenderloin. I also love that every week there's new seasonal produce too, like leeks, broccolini, Italian eggplant, all of these little things that make meals and stop Greg and I from feeling like we're in the food rut. Greg and I use HelloFresh and I just know that your family will love it too. The best way to cook just got better. Go to hellofresh.comtracy10fm to get 10 free meals plus free breakfast for life. That's one per box with active subscription free meals applied as a discount on your first box. And it's for new subscribers only. Varies by planning. That's hellofresh.com Tracy10FM for 10 free meals and free breakfast for life.

Let's talk about why people are so defensive.

And I think there are defensive or dismissive.

Sorry. Well, dismissive is a defense, right? I got distracted. The dog is at the door. I can hear him wanting to push in because earlier he snuggled with me while I recorded. Okay, so why are people so dismissive? And this, I think, can be a really individual piece. This is not a one reason for all. It could be contextual. It could be relational.

Has to be, doesn't it?

Absolutely. But I think, you know, I think about the nervous system and what happens in our body and that oftentimes this defensiveness and dismissiveness because they go together as these kind of Ds that hurt our relationship. There's deflection, dismissiveness, defensiveness, derailment. But it's a fight response. I'm coming at you and I'm fighting it off. Like, this is uncomfortable. I don't feel good. So I'm going to go into fight mode. But we also might go into flight mode, which is like, I want to get out of here.

Yeah. That's what a lot of it feels like to me. That's my interpretation, your.

Your feeling of it, which is the quick, I'm out. The flight mode. The flight, yeah, because it's like there's something uncomfortable happening between us and I don't want to stay in this, and so I need to kind of like, say something and leave that. I think that's what it was when you said, you're right. It felt very much like a, oh, you're in. And then you're just leaving me here.

Interesting.

But then I also think too. So we think of what are the different states that the nervous system goes into. I talk about fight, flight, freeze, Fawn. So freezing is also the like, sure, we can do that, or, sorry, it's like this, like, immobilization. And so they don't know what to say in that moment. But then also to that fawning. The fawning is that false reassurance. It's the, I'm going into pleasing you and saying, everything's gonna be fine. It's fine. And so I think that we'll figure it out. We'll figure it out. Meanwhile, the flight's taking off in an hour and you don't have your passport. So I think, you know, when we think about dismissiveness, and I think this is sometimes where we lose a lot of the nuance in relationships. Because I think of all of the comments online where people are like, if he's doing this, that's a red flag. You need to leave him. And we lose actually having the understanding of what's happening in someone. So while we don't want to keep dismissing our partners, I think it's important to be able to say, oh, this is Something my partner's body and nervous system has learned to do in the face of connection. What do you think about that?

Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. I, I think it's what you just said, though, that this is in the face of a lot of connection, in the face of a opportunity for connection. I think, particularly speaking as a man, like, a lot of, like, our reactions, we are not seeing these as opportunities for connection. We are seeing this as a problem, something that's coming into us that we are internalizing and trying to move on from, get out of.

So answer the question. If I can problem solve, then it means, what about me then?

You know, I'm a good guy. I fixed it. I. I'm, you know, I solved the problem. I made her feel better. It's. Isn't that what we're supposed to do?

It's what you've been socialized to do, which is to solve and to fix and to do. And that your sense of worth or your identity comes from that rather than this ability to sit in true connection. And to know that if I come to you with a problem or saying that you hurt me in some way, I'm not coming at you. I know sometimes it can feel like it.

Well, I think it does. Which provokes these kind of reactions, right? Yeah.

So if I even slow that down a bit more, then. Because what's provoking that underneath it, deeper, is often this feeling of helplessness, this feeling of, I don't know what to do here. I have to hurry this along. This is uncomfortable. I don't want to sit in discomfort.

Yeah.

And when we come into true connection, it is uncomfortable. You don't always have to know the solution. You just have to be present. Like, it's your presence that your partner wants, and that's the part of healing.

Interesting. It is socialization, because I'm even thinking, like, again, like, we probably are rewarded for problem solving, moving on quickly at work. We're. We're rewarded with our buddies. Like, oh, I fixed my dirt bike. Look at, you know, like, versus. When we're being relationship relational or in relationship, it's. It's the opposite. It's slowing down and, like, internalizing the hard stuff. But it's like, we don't get any reward. Air quotes, reward for that overnight. Our brains aren't used to that.

So men are rewarded for solving. And I, and I get that.

I mean, I'm generalizing, but I know.

But I do think that there is this element in here where it's like, if I can Problem solve and move forward. And I think that is why it is important for us to understand that your intention is not always necessarily negative. It's not ill intent. But we do then want to look at impact. I'm going to make sure we get to that impact piece. I'm going to put a pin on that right there. The other reason why someone might be dismissive is let's look at attachment strategies. Because, you know, I love talking about attachment style, but when we think about the anxious person, they're seeking closeness, they're going to interpret dismissal as abandonment. So if I'm coming to you and I'm saying, this is really important to me, and you're saying it's not that bad, if I'm anxious, I'm gonna feel like you're leaving me out in the cold.

Yeah.

I'm gonna feel not seen. I'm gonna feel like I don't matter. I'm gonna go right into those stories. That's the. That's the anxious piece of believing that I am not worthy to be loved and to be paid attention to. And the avoidant person then is someone who seeks distance. They create. They want space. And so they're going to see emotions coming at them as a threat. So if I come to you and I say I'm hurt about something, that is going to lead you to want to pull away. And so right there, that's the negative cycle. This is one of the lessons inside Be Connected. My relationship program that I absolutely love is my attachment strategies, because you go through it and you understand each attachment style, what you need to work on, and then also what your partner can work on to help support you. And then when you learn to go through your negative cycle inside the program, it just helps make so much sense for why you do the things you do in your relationship.

I think what's also cool with Be Connected is, like, if you're stuck in your cycle, you can open up the app and ask your highly trained AI for a little help and a script to get out of that cycle. And it's. It's trained on all your stuff. Yes. AI is what it is, but in.

The moment, this one is trained on me, though.

That's right. Yeah. I'm just. There's a connotation with it, but, yeah, it's really cool. And it's.

It's like we're hearing at your fingertips the members. Since we launched Dr. Tracy AI, the members are the ones saying to us, I got into the spiral with my partner, and then I asked this question. And then I was able to repair much faster and have a plan forward.

Yeah, it's this like pattern breaker. Like it's, you know, you got like something to go to instead of just.

Spiraling or getting some generic answer where chat GPT is like, absolutely. You have a right to yell at your husband because you're so angry at him.

The over validation. This is not that.

Anyways, the last piece around why people dismiss. I think there is this gender socialization. We've already touched on that. Right. So we are, as women, socialized to attune, to emotionally track and connect in that space. And I just said this to a couple recently because he is like, oh, I'm a man. And I didn't like that he said this, but he's like, oh, I'm a man. I'm stupid. You know, I don't get this emotional stuff. I'm like, no, no, no. You know, you have that inside of you, but you're just not trained and socialized to see it that way. So men are socialized to fix, move forward, move past. And we do need to look at those roles that we bring into relationships. And I think this is something that I had said to you recently is the acceptance that I can turn to my best friend and she will sit in that dark hole with me and validate me in a way that is never before. But then when I come to you, you're just different.

Yeah.

And that's okay. I. I accept that. Because your partner is not supposed to fulfill all of those roles.

This podcast episode is sponsored by Native Path. I want to share something I've noticed. As winter hits and the holidays pick up, my joints always get achier and my skin looks tired faster. And honestly, when I'm not consistent with my collagen, I feel, feel it immediately. That's why Native Path has become such a game changer for me. Here's something I didn't know. By age 50, most of us have lost half our collagen. Half. No wonder we're dealing with stiff joints, brittle bones, thinning hair, and skin that feels older than we are. But here's the good news. Native Path collagen peptides help refill that gap. What I love is how clean they are. There's just one ingredient, and it's third party tested for purity. There's no fillers and no junk. Plus, Native path has over 5 million jars sold and 8,000 five star reviews. So I want you to know I'm not the only one noticing a difference and enjoying using Native path. People are seeing smoother, more youthful skin, stronger and more flexible joints, and even fuller hair in as little as 14 days. And their electrolytes, I've been trying them and truly the best, especially in this time of year when we're all dehydrated and running on fumes. Imagine waking up feeling like yourself again. Feeling comfortable, confident, pain free. Right now you can visit getnativepath.com Tracy for a special bundle deal at a fraction of the retail price. And I love that it's backed by a 365 day risk free guarantee. But supply is tight and demand is soaring. And I know this offer isn't going to last. So don't let another day go by feeling those achy joints. Visit getnativepath.com Tracy today.

I was just thinking as you're talking about what's this like for female to female friendships? Yeah, it's different.

It is. And when I think about that friend particularly, I remember even at some point saying to myself, save the good stuff for Greg because it's easy to turn to the female friend who can validate me and get me so quickly but then it's really quick to then turn to her first rather than coming to you. And I want to give you that good stuff first.

Is that where females tend to get in trouble with friendships when one is actually dismissive? Because it's somewhat atypical.

I mean I think in any relationship dismissiveness would feel, would feel hurtful.

That's fair.

But that would speak to our expectations in, in a relationship in general. Right. Are you expecting your female friend to, to offer that to you? But I do think there's this other piece too where we look at what did you experience growing up?

Yeah.

What was modeled, what was modeled to you? How, how did your parents respond to those hard moments growing up? Ask your partner that. Get curious about it.

I mean, I would imagine I'm a little older than maybe the average audience but like a lot of 90s parenting was highly dismissive. And teachers too. I hate to say it, I don't want to paint a bad brush but man, think of some of your experiences.

And I can, I can tell you exactly the one that rings true in my head and I give it too much attention. Grade 7 gym teacher who said you're, you can still do gym even when you don't feel well. That lives rent free in my brain and I hate that.

Yeah.

Because that was 1997 and that's the time where nobody was learning to listen to their bodies and we Learned to just push through. There are times where you should not be pushing through.

There are times where you probably should. But sure. Anyways. Interesting.

So let's talk a little bit about how we look at some of the deeper meaning of dismissiveness and why it's so painful. Because I think it's easy to say, okay, well, that's not my intent, so let's just move forward. But I do think there's something important in here, and it is that dismissiveness. While again, could be well intentioned in partnerships, it does activate some of those old scripts that for many of us have that that might not be what you're intentionally doing. So when you said, you're right, it did stir up in me. I don't matter like that. That's just this, like, template that I will automatically go to in those moments. But I know so many other people have these inner narratives or inner child wounds that sound like I'm too much. I don't matter. I'm alone in this. I'm a burden or my needs are a burden. Or if I don't handle this, then nobody else will. I'm being rejected. I am being abandoned. These are these old pieces of us that can show up in those moments. And oftentimes, if we're not aware of them, then we get reactive. And that's the moment where if you say, you're right, we'll go back to the original example. You say, you're right, and I don't feel heard and connected. My inner child starts to scream, saying, you're all alone in this. Guess what I do when I feel alone? I go into my angry protest. That is what. And that's what kids do. Kids do it when they feel alone, when you're not giving them their attention. Oh, yeah, watch this. I'll kick you.

Yeah.

Oh, kicking didn't work. I'm gonna throw my toy at you. Then I'm gonna run down and slam the door and write on the wall. So there's just these moments here, though, where our old inner child shows up and that becomes really painful. So I think there is something worth examining here of if your partner has dismissed you. So for all the people who sent in their responses, I'm so grateful for them. But let's also think about and do that right here. As you're listening, ask yourself, when my partner dismisses me, what's the old part that shows up for me? And you can go even a little bit deeper. How old am I in that position? How old am I in that Part. What does that part need to feel safe and soothe? Because that's our inner work.

So does that help them? My mind immediately goes to. So then how do they respond to that? Maybe we're going to get to that.

Like, how do I then respond to your. Right, yeah, yeah, right. We're going to get to that.

Okay.

No, but in that moment, because here's the thing, your partner will always mirror back old wounds, and your partner can be part of healing that. And at the same time, there is a moment for us to do some of the healing for ourselves. I've done a lot of my own inner child healing around the message of I'm too much and I'm too sensitive. I've hung out with that little seven, eight year old and just given her lots of love and telling her, that's your superpower. And so then that story doesn't kick up and flare so much when these hard moments show up in a relationship, as they inevitably do. All right, let's talk about how couples can navigate dismissiveness. So I really want to first speak to what happens in the moment. We want to slow this down. And this could be either you or me. Either partner.

So the dismisser or the receiver or both.

Both.

Okay.

The tricky piece here is that you have to be able to catch it, which is pausing. And I know Jefferson Fisher talks about this all the time as well. He says to pause, to stop.

Yeah.

And it is. It's such a therapist intervention, but it really is slow it down. You could say something like, so if you feel dismissed by your partner. So your partner says, don't you think you're being a little too sensitive? Give yourself a B and say, I think we're missing each other. Can we try again? And I think there's this other piece here for you that before those quick things come out, you're right. Don't you think you're being too sensitive? It's fine.

Yeah.

You have to slow down and recognize that when your partner comes to you, it's for connection. She's looking to you because you matter to her and she wants you. You're the antidote to the pain that she's feeling.

Right. And not just listen to respond. Because I think that's what we're doing.

Right. Absolutely. And also, too, I think, you know, something you and I have been trying to do more of is really keep our phones away so that we're not being pulled in different directions.

Very good point.

And so then we can be curious. Right. So if one person comes to You. There's an opportunity to be curious about what's happening. Okay. So that's number two. So step one, slow the moment down. Step two, use curiosity. So one of you could say, what does this bring up for you when I share this.

Oh, that's good.

If you could slow down and say, something's happening here. Do you want to tell me more about it? Or even from the super communicators, what kind of conversation are we having here? Do you need me to problem solve or do you need me to just listen?

Oh, that's your thing. You've said that.

Oh, I've said that so many times. But over the years. Absolutely.

It's good, though.

Yeah.

So if you feel it also buys you some time.

Yes, of course. But time for you to regulate.

Yeah.

Because your body goes into fight, flight, freeze or fawn. I'm coming to you looking for connection, but you've, like, you've left the station.

Yeah. I gotta pick a path real quick and boom.

But you don't.

I know.

And that's something. That's something that you and I have talked a lot about because I know that your go to is defensive or shutting down. And it's so powerful when you can just slow down and instead have. And I say this to couples. Have a statement that is your go to, which is, tell me more about that or something's happening. Can you tell me more? So that would be like, even before you enter into dismissive. But this is when dismissiveness happens.

Okay.

Okay. So then you're gonna name the strategy. You're gonna name what just happened. And you might say something like, I think something's happening right here. Can you stay in this conversation with me? I don't know. How would that feel for you to hear that?

I think pretty good. I. It's like you're asking for more information. That specifically is saying, I want to keep talking about this.

Yeah.

I want to know more. I want to learn.

Yeah.

I'm curious.

Yep.

What you have to say matters.

All of those things are so reassuring to hear. And you. So here's the other thing. Both partners have to do the body work as well. Right. It's not just us staying in our head. And like, I. I sometimes think that I see you, like, doing train tracks or, like, loops or something of, like, where's the. Where's the solution? How. How do I.

No, it's like thought bubbles. Like, what. Where am I going?

I think you're trying to open doors. It's like you have 10 doors in front of. You're like, hang on, door one. No, that's not a door two. No, that's not it. And like, you're looking up, and when our eyes. Actually, I think when we look up to the left, we're thinking. Like, you're. You're thinking in your head so much. But instead we have to get into our bodies. Don't open the doors, Craig. Just come into your body, into our body, and just breathe, Ground yourself. Be present, be present.

So, you know, that's hard, though.

For us avoiders and problem solvers.

Like, I know. You just want to make it go. I know.

And I think that's where I'm not to totally derail. But, like, maybe I'll speak for some of the dudes here. Like, pause, do this, do that. Like, yeah, sounds great. Easy. But how do I do that?

You breathe.

You do all the body work you're talking about.

You just breathe. Actually, I'll reference back to Chantal and Rain and how great their podcast episode was. I know you and I both really enjoyed that conversation. And the work that they do is that. Well, they. Rain talked about catch, pause repair, cpr, but it's also, they've done that heart to heart work where they put their hearts on each other's, their hands, each other's heart, or they've done the staring into each other's eyes. I've done it with my clients for years, and every client is like, oh, no, this is awful. And then within 30 seconds, it completely changes you down. Regulate your nervous system. So that's the other reason why phones are so disruptive in our life right now, is because we're not looking at each other. We're not getting information from our faces.

Gross. It's so.

I know, but when you.

I was just in the public setting for the last hour, and it.

Oh, I'm sure you saw it there a lot.

Just rails my brain.

But then if we can just remember to look at your partner. So she comes into the room and she says, the person at work did it again. This is so frustrating. Look at her in the eyes. Just look at her. You don't have to say anything.

We have totally stopped doing that as a society.

I know.

I can just. I'm picturing a couple like this. Your example, she's coming in saying this, and I'm on. In this example, let's say it's you and me, and I'm on the couch and I'm not even looking up for my phone.

You don't see the pain.

How Often does that happen? I'm sure the listeners are just nodding their head going, yeah, we need to tackle phones another. Another day.

Okay, so listen, let's also then finish up with repairing in real time. Repairing is not. I'm sorry. And moving on. Repairing is understanding how you impact the other person. How it must have felt for them just to even hear that hurtful thing. But then also to say, I really do want to move forward with this. I really do want to understand what's happening for you. And so you. I also love this idea that listen, in communication, we're not going to get it right all the time. Give yourself a mulligan.

Yeah.

You know, you might get it wrong. Say, oh, okay, I can just see your face change right there. That didn't land well. Can I try again?

Yeah, we've done that before. And also, you probably will have to have this conversation more than once. Yeah, right. It's gonna happen again.

Yeah.

And you have to do it again.

Right.

That's something.

Right? So the. Oh, that came out from me. Let me try again. Right. And yes, you will have to have it over and over again. Okay. When we think about the things that we've talked about here. So I'm talking about slowing down the moment using curiosity. So asking what's happening for either of you, you want to name what actually just happened between you two. Like, oh, I think something was just missed here. Like, I think that that's meta communication and it's so powerful. And then being able to ground your body, connect with your partner and then if you did dismiss them, repair. And remember this piece. When you make a mistake in your relationship and you own the impact, you are changing the entire dynamic between you and your partner. It is not you saying that you are a bad person and that you're never going to get it right and that you're such a failure in your partnership, it means I value our connection and I see that I matter to you. That's everything. I love having these real moments with you because they are constantly deepening my understanding of myself, but also of you and our relationship. And then I love bringing it to this community here. And I just want you to know that if dismissiveness is something that you've experienced in your relationship, that shows up. This is not a red flag. You are not necessarily going to need to end your relationship, but instead it's repairable. And that great couples, couples who are masters, that's the gottman word they talk about the master couples who are satisfied at long term follow up they get stuck, too. But what they've learned is they learned how to repair faster. And so all couples do not get taught how to navigate this stuff. We are constantly repeating what we learned and moving forward. Okay, I'm curious from our listeners, just thinking before we wrap up, where do you fall in the dismissiveness pattern? Are you the one dismissing? Are you the one feeling dismissed? And what do you wish your partner would know about you? So this is an interesting question. What do you wish your partner would know about you in the moments where they give you that quick reply? All right, if you're looking for more support, be sure to check out my online relationship program, Be Connected. If you're looking for something to support you every single day for the next 30 days, grab my 30 days to us. It is one of my favorite challenges in this community because it's based on my pillars of a strong relationship. And each day you get one small thing to help you improve your connection. And if you are looking to tackle these types of conversations with your partner, be sure to download my 10 scripts on how to respond to your partner when they get defensive. That's one of my favorite and most downloaded freebies that I have.

It is. I was looking at that today, and I have that.

I've got the link. Sorry, go ahead.

Nope.

And I have that in the show notes, one of my favorites. I hope people will get that one because just having. And I just said this earlier to someone, rehearsing scripts is helpful because in the moment when you feel triggered, it's not going to help me to do. And you know, I'm sure I've done this with you. Oh, there you go again. You're always dismissing me. Like, that's not helpful. But if I can rehearse a statement of how to respond to you, then it is going to completely change the cycle. And it might not at first, but it's going to change it for how you feel. All right, Anything to add?

Well, I just think with the scripts, too, it's like, oh, a script. Like, I don't talk like that. Yes, You. You will instinctively put your own language on it, but the. The core theme will work.

Yeah.

So grab it. It's free.

Amazing. All right, thank you for having this conversation with me and thank you for clicking Play and joining us on the podcast today. If anything resonated for you, I would love for you to share this with someone that you love and care about. And until next time, take good care of you. Remember, this podcast episode is for educational purposes only. And does not substitute for the care from a licensed mental health care provider. Until next time.

Foreign.

As a therapist, I see how many people struggle, especially this time of year. My clients often increase their sessions because the emotional load rises and getting support becomes essential. But for so many, the biggest barrier isn't wanting therapy, it's finding the right therapist at the right time at the price that doesn't feel impossible. That's why I'm such a fan of Rula. Telehealth has made therapy more accessible, but Rula takes it a step further. Their mission is to make high quality mental health care easy and affordable for everyone. And they've removed so many of the barriers that normally hold people back. Here's what you need to know. Rula takes most major insurance plans and sessions often average just $15, sometimes even zero, depending on your benefits. They partner with over 15,000 licensed therapists and psychiatrists, giving you real options and a genuine chance to find the right fit. Plus, their providers are carefully vetted and Rula stays with you through the process, making sure you're getting the support and progress you need. Getting started is simple. Rula asks a few questions and then matches you with in network therapists based on your needs and preferences. And what I love is that you can schedule right away, sometimes as soon as the next day. So if you've been thinking, I know I need support, but I just don't know where to start. This is your moment. Go to rula.com Tracy to get started. That's R U L A.com Tracy for convenient quality therapy that's actually covered by insurance. And when they ask where you heard about them, please let them know it was from the show. It helps us continue to bring you these conversations and resources you rely on. You deserve care that fits your life, your needs and your schedule. Rula can help you take that first step.