From Fired to $50M in Deals (Mike Mathweg - Money Stories Ep 10)

We're on track to close $50 million.

So you sold your company, you were working for the acquirer, you had more money than you ever had in your life coming from this exit, on top of the world, and then you're no longer needed.

I honestly felt like a failure. How do I face my wife and my kids? What do I do? My entire identity, my entire career was in the insurance industry.

What do you think was the key to success for going from this low point to this rocket ship ride of growth?

I would've never been able to do this by myself.

Hey, welcome to the Money Stories Podcast. Today I am joined by my dear friend Mike Mathweg, runs Relentless Consulting, which helps insurance agencies grow and eventually exit. And I, I, I'm really excited for this conversation because Your journey over the last couple of years is just incredible. So I'd love to start with how you came into my world, how we got to know each other, and what you're kind of going through at that time.

Well, thanks for having me. I got in your world. It's going to be really weird to say, by slid in your DMs.

It's cool. It happens. It happens to the best of us.

But no, I— it was a little over a year ago. You were— I actually ran into Dan on Instagram, and then through his stories, that's why I ran into you when you guys were on your ski trip.

Yep.

And Dan said, if you want to know anything about money and your relationship with money, talk to this guy. So then I followed you on the good old IG and then commented on what I thought was an Audi, which I definitely ended up not being an Audi. And that's how we kind of met. It was unique.

And what were you going through at that time?

I— a lot.

Text on the journey.

I was going through— I sold my company about 15 months prior to that. And I was fortunate and came into a decent amount of money. And I was young. I didn't really know how to handle it. But I also was smart enough not to do it by myself. So I had people in my corner to help manage it. But I always was kind of the guy that's like, hey, if I got money, I'm going to spend it. Which me to the point, but moving forward, it definitely wasn't the personality I needed. So I needed help on the relationship with the money as well as like kind of what to do next, because I was getting to a point where I was unsure on my future at the company that I was at. And it actually kind of worked out.

Okay, so there you are, and what happens next?

I think 2 months after us working together, I got the 12-minute— or excuse me, the 12-word call: Mike, you're no longer needed, you're terminated. So it was a real reality check of going from like a complete high to a complete low.

So you sold your company, you were working for the acquirer, you had more money than you ever had in your life coming from this exit, on top of the world, and then you're no longer needed.

Yeah.

How did that feel?

It was heavy. It was— I honestly felt like a failure, even though selling the company before I was 30 like I've accomplished so much in my life. But at that point in time, I was like, how do I face my wife and my kids when Dad just lost a job after selling a business, being on top of the world? And I was just— it sucked. I don't know the better word to say it. It just was, what do I do? My entire identity, my entire career was in the insurance industry. And when you get all of that ripped away from you in a matter of 12 words, you just sit in it. And then a lot of limiting beliefs set in.

Like what?

Am I a fraud? Did I get here by Luck. What's next?

The, the contrast, right, from, from going from this, this peak experience standing on the mountaintop, all of a sudden having it ripped away from you. Like, it's, it's no wonder these, that these limiting beliefs set in. What was the low point?

The low point, I, because of the work we put in before this happening, the low point was 48 hours of just what is next and just sitting in it and being like, okay, my back's up against the wall, it's go time. And really leaning on the people in my circle to get me through it. And it wasn't I was— once again, I was fortunate where it really wasn't a money issue, right?

You had enough to live.

I had enough to live that my life wasn't going to change. I was actually at Disney World the next week after I got fired, so it was not— it wasn't really about the money, but it was more or less the identity of like, who's Mike now? When Mike has been the insurance guy.

Totally. What'd you learn?

My role in the insurance just shifted. It wasn't Mike as the salesperson anymore. It was Mike as this is how you buy or sell an agency. It just shifted on what I was focused on. In the insurance industry.

So how, how was Relentless born?

You asked me a question, what's my cure for cancer? And of course the smart Mike answer was, if I knew, we wouldn't be talking. But it was, I'm able to help other people structure, scale, and then sell their business in the insurance industry. Industry, because that's what I was able to accomplish in less than 5 years.

You have a unique skill set.

Yes. So that's exactly what we went to market with. Relentless is here to help you structure your business, scale it to the next level through acquisitions or organically, and then make you attractive to buyers.

And, you know, who could have known what came next, but, you know, and that's a story we'll get to, but okay. You've just been fired. You go through, you know, who am I without this business? The shame, you know, and then, okay, I'm going to step into something new. And that's something new. Isn't just a new job. It's putting yourself out there. So what was that experience like for you?

I've always been on social media, but I've never thrown myself out on social media. And it took a lot of reps to do things like that, share my story. What really shifted is when I decided that I'm not doing this for me. I'm doing this for who I needed at that point in time in my career. So I just kind of shifted my mindset that, hey, I'm creating this content for other people, not for me, because I can go implement this tomorrow for myself, but somebody else might need this right now for them. So I think actually one of your good friends said, You put out content for who you need on your darkest days.

Yeah, that's my good friend Dan. He gets a lot of shoutouts on this show.

So that's kind of where I shift. I was like, you know what, when I was scaling my business and buying my first acquisition, what did I need at that point in time? And now I just shift the mindset like, you know what, that's who this is for.

Yeah, I mean, look, because Unless you're a full-blown narcissist, right? Smashing submit on a, on a video on Instagram is pretty terrifying. It's going to bring up all of your insecurities, right? And so in order to do something like that, you've got to tie it to service. You've got to tie it to something bigger than yourself. So you start building a personal brand. You start, you start sharing your hard-earned wisdom that you won through blood, sweat, and tears. Online and tell me kind of what comes next for Relentless. How did it go?

It just kind of took off. Like, people I knew in the industry asked me to go speak at events and just sharing on how do you acquire books of businesses, how do you sell books of businesses. And it's just through social media, people just said, Mike, I want your help. And it's just one thing led to another. I picked up a private client here, helped out with the transaction there. Last year we did 8 transactions. This year we're on pace to do 15 and we're on track to close $50 million. In acquisitions this year. It's just—

it's a rocket ship ride.

It is wild that just a little over a year ago was the day my life changed.

And what do you think was the key to success for going from this low point to this rocket ship ride of growth?

Mentorship. Like, I would have never been able to do this by myself. And leaning into relationships as well as leaning into asking for help. I think as an entrepreneur, where I struggled earlier in my career, just not asking.

I can do it all myself.

And only having one other person to lean on. Where now it's like I have my board of directors that I lean on for certain things, where it's not just like, hey, Mike said do this, I'm gonna go do this. It's like, well, I'm gonna challenge Mike, okay, why, and dig deeper to go to that next spot.

And backing up a little bit, how did you grow up with money and what drove you to become an entrepreneur in the first place?

Growing up, my parents did everything they could to give my brother and I a great life, and we're extremely fortunate to be the childhood I had back in the '90s when I grew up, kind of young, I played hockey. And hockey was not a cheap sport. We traveled a lot and equipment was not cheap. Yeah, but my parents did everything they could to give us a good life. We didn't— we weren't the richest people, we weren't the poorest people, but I also looked at Every time my mom and dad had a fight, it was something to do with money, and I grew up thinking that was normal. So in my early marriage years, like, we would kind of bicker back and forth about money, and more or less was like we just weren't on the same page. With money. And now it's like, we're a lot more in sync together because it's not all about how much money we have. It's just like, what do we want that money to do for us? What experiences does it want us to have? And I became an entrepreneur because not the best employee.

Unemployable is what I'm—

unemployable.

Yeah, I, I—

earlier in my 20s, I was working at a bank, and I had a great manager at the time. He let me enjoy my Wednesday afternoons and golf with the seniors in golf league. But I kind of just came accustomed to that life and it just— other people just don't like that. So I became an entrepreneur when I was 26, I would say, and have been an entrepreneur longer than I have actually had a job.

And what was the hope? Like, like in— okay, yeah, you're unemployable, so you probably have no other choice than to go into business for yourself, but What were your goals, aspirations, dreams? Like, what— why'd you do it at that point?

Flexibility. I wanted to become an entrepreneur because, one, I'm in 100% control of my time as well as the outcome. And being able to sit back now and look at like, okay, I have a— what have I accomplished? Not because it was handed to me, but because I built it. I took the risks. And when it comes to risk, I took the calculated risk, not just the high risk. And being able to live a life of options because we travel a lot. We like to go down south for months at a time. And being an entrepreneur, you're able to do that. And as long as I have a computer and a phone, work doesn't stop.

So, so really, first and foremost, it was to create a life of freedom. How did money play into that vision for you?

I say this two ways, but money, it really wasn't a main driving factor. Like, was it nice to be making money? Yes. But was it— was more important to be able to have the optionality and the freedom to do what we want to do. I learned young that when you do the right thing, the money will come. And that's kind of what I took into the Relentless is like, I do a lot of speaking gigs for free because I know The opportunities and the money will come when it comes. When it comes, it comes.

Totally. As a reward for service.

Correct. So I looked at, like, when I was an insurance agent, I looked at just the reps. How can I serve somebody and make a very complex system, health insurance, clear as mud? And over time, it just started pouring in.

Totally. So, so really what I'm hearing is that for you, money has always been a byproduct of actually creating value, of actually, you know, being in service of, of the people that need your help.

Correct.

What does success look like to you?

I laugh because I've been thinking a lot about this lately, ever since I was in Denver a year ago. A year ago, it was— I didn't know what success looked like, true, what true success looked like. I thought success looked like the Rolex, the cars, the houses, the jets. I thought that's really what success looks like because that's what I allowed to feed my mind when I was building the first business.

Yeah. And it makes sense, right? I mean, that's, that's what society— that's what Instagram tells us success should be. Right? Getting a Rolex, getting a Range Rover, getting a jet, like whatever, whatever that— but, but it, it tends to be rooted in very materialistic things. And everybody knows I enjoy materialistic things, right? But there's got to be something more. So what is that something more started to, to shape out for you?

Now I look at success as freedom, financial freedom, freedom of time, freedom of mind. Like, that's true success. And it's a work in progress. Like, there's certain times where I, I'm not as present as I want to be. It's not because something's going on, but just because my mind's on work where I can get to a point where it's like, you know what, we're good across all aspects of life, not just the money. Because if you look at— if you look at success when it comes to money, probably already there in most eyes. But to me, that's just a byproduct of what I've done.

Totally. And if we're not using that money to create the life that we want, what's the point? So how do you think— how do you think about now using money in service of the life that you want to build?

I look at money now as time-saving, and how does it allow me to live the life that we want? By doing things we just would rather spend our time doing something else. Like one example that everybody in my neighborhood makes fun of me about is I don't cut my own grass and I haven't for 5 years because I'd rather spend that time with my family.

And you know, a lot of this, you know, when we talk about money stories, we talk about our relationship with money, right? There is the immediate family, the the way we grew up with money within our household, but then there's also a cultural money story that is impressed upon us. And so what was that cultural money story? It sounds like you cut your own grass. Like, what are some of those cultural values that you grew up with that have been shifting for you?

[Speaker:TYLER] I would say there's a lot. Like now, more recently, Like one is just the simple of eating out. Most people eat out once a month, once a week, and it's just, it's that, it's cleaning ladies, cleaning companies. We're almost to the next one of a house manager where it's just allows us because of our— the success we've had. Because it's not just all about my success, it's also the success I had with my wife, because I wouldn't be here today without her. Like, so this isn't just Mike's success, it's our success. It's just giving us the freedom of doing the things that gives us energy and allows us to spend times with the family.

So what do you, what do you say to those people who make fun of you for not cutting your grass? How might you shift their mindset?

I think you got to try it because one, it's not that expensive. And two, once you like— we've done this with some friends, like we've talked some friends into letting somebody clean their house once a month. And now they just won't stop. So it's— the thing is just you need to loosen up the purse strings a little bit or make sacrifices in some areas compared to others. Like maybe you don't go out to eat once a month and actually cut— cover somebody to cut your grass. Or the main reason I don't snowplow anymore is because My back sucks. I used to shovel snow and then laid up for 2 days. So it's just give it a shot, try it once and see, one, that you can afford it. And two, what do you do with that time?

Yeah. And it doesn't have to be spent on work, right? Like it could be spent playing with your kids or doing, or doing, you know, anything that you want to do or taking care of yourself, you know, doing an activity that you enjoy.

Yeah, because I started having someone cut my grass so I can go golf. Yeah, because I would rather go golf with my son or my wife than go cut grass for an hour.

Totally. I think it's so interesting, right? So, so first there's this materialistic version of success— Rolexes, Range Rovers, and all of that— and then there's also the buy back your time kind of, kind of mindset is like, okay, wait a minute, I can actually use this money that I've earned through my blood, sweat, and tears, through, through my hard work to start creating experiences. Um, and how are those two linked? Like, like, as you take this journey from materialism to maybe more this buy back your time mindset, what does that journey look like for you?

It challenges me to think Should I be doing this or not? And if the answer is not, then is it something that can be cut out completely, or is it something that can just be delegated? But it's, it's just a lot of deep work. It's like, okay, is this something that goes back to something that serves me, and what is it around it that serves me?

Well, I'd love to poke on this a little bit. We recently had a conversation about a Rolex. Walk us through, walk us through that. I'll leave it there.

Yes, I had a feeling this was going to come up. So to give context to the listeners is when I sold the company back in 2022, I was being fed that I needed to be successful. You need to have the Range Rover, you had to have the Rolex. That's what you needed to be successful. So I went out and we closed. I think 2 days later the Rolex showed up. Ordered it the day of closing. It showed up 1 or 2 days later. And I, I wore that thing every single day. Yeah, every day, all day. Like, that was my— man, Mike, I'm successful because I have this stupid expensive thing on my wrist. But the more, more I've been working on my relationship with money and what does success look like, it made me challenge, like, does this Rolex really mean what it used to mean? And as you can see today, it's nowhere on my wrist. It is actually no longer even in the WatchBox. It's sitting in a drawer, in a box, waiting to be sold.

What was the mindset journey around that? Like, like, how did this— how did this come about?

It also— the other thing that comes up on it is that the memory it gives me.

Yeah.

Because I bought that because that's what I thought success looked like. I bought that because my old mentor told me I need one. And since last year when I was let go from the old company, it brings back those memories of pain, of Mike, you're a failure. Mike, you don't deserve it. And honestly, it's a watch. I could— to me, I'm the same person with or without it. I'm the same person with a real one or a fake one. Like, it doesn't mean anything to me anymore because honestly, if you're going to spend that much money for watch. It's like, okay, am I being a good steward of my money?

Yeah, well, and I mean, a few, a few things come up for me here because, you know, I am an advocate of creating experiences for yourself, and sometimes those experiences can include material possessions, right? And, and I've gone through a similar journey with cars. Like, I, I, you know, for me, success, for me, arriving meant being able to buy a supercar. I had supercars on my wall as a kid, And, you know, so when I started making money, I bought myself a supercar. Incredible experience at that time. And it meant so much to me to, to create that feeling of, of arrival and success. And then over time, it just became less and less important, right? My, my self-worth was no longer tied up in that thing. And that required introspection, right? And the thing is, so many of us just go on autopilot. And, you know, we have, we have attachment to these things because they meant something about who we were at that time. And I, and I think the work that is really cool that I want to commend you on is, is allowing yourself the opportunity to say, hey, this meant something to me then, it doesn't necessarily mean now, and reevaluate that relationship. And that's not something everyone's willing to do. How did you learn? How did you start stepping into to being able to reevaluate relationships with things like the material success?

I honestly not really sure. Like, it just kept on showing up in my world. It's like, okay, is this— is this needed? And it just started by— honestly, started by buying a fake one. Because the one I had was so heavy and it was hurting my wrist. And I was like, okay, I want to see what it's like to not have a real one. And then I just went, wore that one every day. And honestly, like, it doesn't define me. And it also— what also helped me come up with, especially just the watch side of things, it's like it brought back so many memories that no longer serves the direction I'm going that it was kind of easy to think of something else.

Yeah, totally, totally makes sense. And you know what I would just say to people listening is you can give yourself permission for your relationship with success, with things, with, you know, your relationship to money to evolve over time. And it doesn't mean that you were wrong for buying the Rolex in the moment, right? It just means that, oh, it doesn't mean the same thing to me as it did all those years ago.

Agreed. Because the mindset shifted rather quickly because last year I was still thinking like, hey, success looks like by having these material items. So I bought my wife one. And then it just over time, it's like spending that year, that time with you a year ago and really sitting with, okay, what does success look like? And I remember drawing on that whiteboard, my beautiful art because I'm Picasso. And just going through it. Like, success— when I was drawing it on the board, there was no watch. There was experiences. There was a plane. I don't know if that meant a private jet or if that just means traveling, right? But it's just It just doesn't come to mind. And that's where I now look at it's like, okay, when I, when I think of success, what's the first thing that comes to my mind? It is the opportunities that I'm able to create, one for myself, but more importantly for others. Because I was just in Vegas last week and somebody I learned this from buy back your time. It's like I now take car services mostly everywhere I go, and I now have a driver in Vegas. And somebody's like, why don't you just use an Uber? I'm like, because I would rather give this bit— my money to this small business because I know what he's going to do with it. He's able to support his family. He's able to achieve his goals and dreams. And it's more of that kind of relationship building.

Yeah, I love that. So switching gears maybe a little bit, right? Like, what are some of the— there's the tactics, right? And, and obviously when you're buying and selling books of insurance, there's the tactical stuff, but What are some of the mindset, you know, tips or tricks that you, that you help people with? And like, what do you, what do you wish you knew?

You need a team behind you with it because it's, especially in the acquisition world, you're coming across a lot of money in a short period of time and it's like, If you're the person that has no money in your bank account and you get a big check, it's the same thing's going to happen. So you need to build a team like the board of directors I used earlier. Like, you got to have that team on your side to help you be a steward of the money. And I think ever since you told me that, like, that is where I go all the time. It's like, hey, I'm not going to tell you what to do with the money. 'cause that's not my job. But think about it. Like, what do you want to do?

Be intentional.

Do you have people in your corner that can help you with this? And not say, hey, give me all your money and let me invest it, because that's not the case. It's just be intentional with what you do with it.

You know, I think intentionality is such a mispoint, right? Because we're told by society that, you should just grow money no matter what. Like, that's, that's the number one goal is just like when you get money, make sure that you're investing it and get the highest returns. But I don't think we often stop to think about what am I actually trying to do? Like, what is my end goal here? Like, what kind of life do I want to create? And it's that intentionality. I think that's the missing piece for most folks.

It 100% is, because when I start working with clients, always ask the question, what is your exit? Because it allows us to craft a plan to achieve that exit. And like, I can tell you, Mike, get in your car and drive. Where are you gonna go? Granted, it's a badass car, like, we'll have a lot of fun, but it's like, where are we going? And that's where it's like, okay, what's that exit? Now let's get us there. And when it comes to the money, it's like, what do you want to do with that money? Do you want to give it? You want to save it? You want to spend it? Like, you got to give that dollar a name for something.

Totally. And, and when you start to dig a layer deeper with people thinking about an exit, how do you help them connect with that intentionality?

Ask a lot of questions. And I think I've picked this up from you. It's like, ask why they just give the surface level, because there's always something underneath that level. And it's like, okay, You tell me you want X amount of dollars.

Why?

Well, because so-and-so said so. That's not the case. No, it's like, let's go deeper. Like, where is it? Like, do you want— do you have this number because you have X, Y, and Z that you want to achieve with it? And just ask questions. That's the biggest thing that I do all the time is like, I just challenge them deeper level?

Yeah, I mean, I think, I think uncovering that, that, and usually, right, for most people it comes back to service, right? Or it comes back to a greater why. And if you can help people step into that and uncover that right now, they're really building that meaning, purpose, and fulfillment beyond the material success. And I think that's the only way you can start to shift that, you know, what society tells us success looks like into cultivating it for an individual is, okay, what's that next level? Like, what's that deeper meaning behind this for you? Like, what do you actually want to create? Then it makes it so much more easier to make your goals inevitable because it's about— it's not about you ultimately.

It's not. And that also put a big part in like the success, like what does success looks like? Because Others will look at me and say, Mike, you're very successful because what I've been able to accomplish. But it took me a lot of deep work to be like, okay, what does success really mean for me? And come up with my own definition. And it's a work in progress.

Like, I think that's, that's something I try to give people permission to is to say, for now, right? You have a definition of success for now, and let's keep the flexibility to change what that definition looks like a year, 5 years, 10 years from now. And this is why I think that legacy is so overrated, right? I prefer impact to legacy. Impact is present. Impact means what am I doing right now? And my impact can change over time, right? When people think about legacy, that's so heavy. It's like, this is what I'm doing for the rest of my life, or this is what I'm going to create after I'm dead. Like, who cares, right? That's so inflexible. There's a heaviness associated with that. How can I get people to move from legacy to impact? Because that's a, that's a present tense type of, type of verb, right? And so how do you think about impact?

I feel impact too. For me, like, there's financial impact and there's time impact because not everybody is able to give the financial impact. Like, you can donate to— like, I'm part of an organization in my hometown where there's 100 guys that get together every single quarter and donate $100,000 every quarter. Like, that is a huge impact that we're able to make. On a quarterly basis through the organization, but it doesn't mean that has to be for— that's not for everybody. So it's just being able to like, what do you want? Like, what do you stand for? And I love when you just said like, impact is now, legacy is down the road. Honestly, once I die, I don't care. Like, my family will be able to do live the life they need to live, and they'll be able to continue making impacts once I'm gone, both financially and with their time. So I really love that because I don't think I've ever looked at it that way, more towards the legacy side.

Yeah, well, I mean, kind of like money is a byproduct of service, legacy is a byproduct of impact, right? If you're impacting in the present moment, legacy takes care of itself, right? And I think so many of us are focused on building now so that we can create this result later. And it's like, hey, you don't have to actually choose. You can create the results now And that thing that you're so worried about creating later will just take care of itself.

I agree.

So, you know, you obviously found a lot of success as a young man. What would you go back and tell yourself 10 years ago?

10 years ago, Mike, I would, I would have told myself, go slow to go fast instead of just go fast. Because 10 years ago, I was running 1,000 miles per hour. But I also learned when I failed, I failed fast. So it kind of goes both ways. It's like, okay, if you know something's not working, stop and change course. Don't just keep redoing the same thing over and over and over again. I would have been also willing to ask for help much quicker. It's like our first ever acquisition was not as good as everyone thinks it is. And I probably would have done more acquisitions quicker. I love acquisitions. It's a lot of fun. Yeah, but I would have definitely been asking for help by more than just one person. Build that board of directors, have that 8 to 10 people in your corner that, hey, you know what, before I make any rash decision, I need to throw it at some people.

Yeah, I love that. Right. I mean, there's, there's two ways to learn, right? There's the, there's the slow way, which is do it yourself, or there's the fast way and usually the less painful way and usually the less expensive way, which is let me find somebody who's been there and done it beforehand and take that playbook. And like, it doesn't necessarily mean it's going to look exactly the same for you, but at least you could shortcut some of that pain.

Yeah. And the big thing that I come across now with people, they're like, well, it's expensive. And I'm gonna be honest with you, when I hired you, I had no idea where the heck I was gonna come up with the money. I had the money, but I just didn't know. I was like, okay, am I gonna— like, where's this gonna come from? But I just knew that making that investment— it's not an expense, it's an investment in yourself— would pay dividends for years to come. And I would say it was a pretty solid investment. There's a decent ROI. And don't just look short term. Like, that's the biggest thing that I come across with people. They're like, well, this is expensive. What's actually expensive is you do this by yourself and make mistakes. Like the first acquisition I made, we lost a good chunk of the revenue overnight. Would it have been more expensive to hire somebody to avoid that, or did we actually lose by trying to do it ourselves? I think that's definitely the thing that I see now. It's like, you know what, 10 years ago Mike, well, once again, I was not even an entrepreneur back then, and it was— that was party Mike. But just definitely build that board, invest in yourself through somebody else, not by yourself.

Yeah, I mean, well said, and, and I couldn't agree more. I mean, the, the best investments that I have ever made has also been in coaching, personal work, and, you know, yes, sure, there is often a monetary ROI, right? Like when we started working together, you were able to kind of use the frameworks and the playbooks that I give you and build this new business. So yes, there's a dollar and cents, but I would argue what I've seen from you, the returns go well beyond the money. So what are some of those returns? Like, what is— what does that look like for you? How do you think about that?

Those returns are— there's too many. It's just like, one, also like not drinking, like the return of not drinking and the person I became in the past 15 months of just not consuming any alcohol. Like, is there any monetary value on that? No. But I can tell you right now, if I would have been going through this termination by myself, oh, 100%, I would have relapsed. Like, there's no questions asked. Also, just the mindset, the mindset shift through the challenging work that we've done. Once again, there's— can you put a price tag on that? No, but that was well worth the investment.

Well, and you know, one of the things that I think is so unique is the way you show up and the way you attack the work, because not everyone, you is willing to be challenged. Not everyone is to take that, that hard look, right? And so yes, by investing in coaching, you know, you're going to get challenged, but you— it also is upon you then take that ball and run with it. And, and not everybody's willing to do that. And so, you know, you know, when I or another coach or a mentor challenges you, how do you think about taking that on?

I sit with it first and be like, okay, does this— how does this sit with me? Because there's some things some people say that I'm just like, you know what, like, is that actually— are you saying that for me? Are you saying that just because it sounds good? And I will always, when somebody asks me a question, I will always think about it. I just won't let it go right over my head. And I look at the work as two different ways. One, I do it, nothing changes, or I do it and something changes. So why not just do it? The other thing I notice is that it allows me to challenge myself in the way I think. 'Cause there's some coaches and I would say you've probably, it's happened with you too. I don't remember exact example, but you'll ask something and I'll come up with a quick answer, but then when I actually sit with it, it's completely opposites. And I just look at it, it's like, you know what, what's the worst that's gonna happen?

Totally.

I invest 5 minutes and I'm the same person, or I invest 5 minutes and something changes.

Maybe you find a new way of being, right? Yeah. And I think it is so critical to give yourself that, that space and that time to sit with some of these questions and go, okay, yeah, here's my first answer. Is that really what I think? Is that, is that actually true? And in giving yourself that space, I think really does pay dividends. So I love that advice for people. So what's next? What's, what's next for us? What are you excited about?

Acquisitions?

Yeah.

Yeah. We're very— we're making a push this year that we're kind of shifting to a little bit more of the investment bank side of the world, doing more sell-side agreements. So doing more heavy in acquisitions this year, which is very exciting because I was able to take two clients and get them bigger offers than I had, and we're the same size. So that was very exciting to do and just honestly see where it takes us because it can shift. I— one thing I love that you have helped me with is it's very simple, but you gave me the— you tell me all the time, give yourself the permission to go do something and whatever it is, permission to challenge myself permission to spend the money. Like, you called me out the other day on Instagram and it was just needed. And it's just, I'm giving Relentless the permission to adapt when needed because right now it's, we're doing a little bit of this, a little bit of this, a little bit of that. But it's like, you know what, If the opportunity comes and something shifts, I'm gonna give myself the permission to sit with it. Does this serve me? Does this achieve the goals I have? The answer is yes, we pivot.

Yeah, I love that. It's, it's, it's the permission to try stuff on, right? And I think as entrepreneurs, we can tend to be so myopic and go, okay, this is this is the way I've done things, this is my model. And it's, it really is that flexibility where, where beauty and art is truly created is, hey, I'm going to try this on. And by the way, it may not go well. That's okay. Right? It doesn't always have to go well the first time, but I know with enough reps of trying things on, I'm, I'm going to stumble into greatness.

Totally agree. Give yourself permission to pivot is the biggest Give myself the permission to change my mind in 5 minutes if it no longer serves me.

Yeah, I love that. Mike, thanks for being here. Where can people find you? Where can they learn more about Relentless?

You can follow me on Instagram, Facebook. It's pretty basic, it's just @MikeMathwig, mikemathwig.com. Pretty much just Google my name and you can find Everything you need to know about me.

Cool. Well, thanks so much for being on. Thanks for being a great client. It's, it's great to spend this time with you and I appreciate you, man. I appreciate the way you're showing up in the world.

Thanks for having me.

Cheers.