Oxford MBA Lessons: How to Build Real Impact as a Social Entrepreneur w/ Julian Gerhart

You don't have to work at nonprofit and you don't have to work with kids or in charities or puppies or whatever to have an impact. Like you can still work in like a normal company and you can ask the questions like how we can make this more effective or efficient and how can we more sustainable or how we can, you know, include this sort of group in our activities and that's, that's great impact, right? You don't have to necessarily work in a like typical impact company or like impact organization or nonprofit. So it's just like this sort of perception that you can still have a lot of impact even though you're not in traditional industry.

Hi everyone. Welcome back to MBA Golden Buzzer. Today I'm joined by Julian Gerhardt, an Oxford MBA graduate and a former founder. Today we're going to talk about what drew him to Oxford, how the MBA shaped his entrepreneurial mindset and, and the real lessons he's learned. Navigating early stage ventures from building something from scratch to supporting a fast scaling team. So if you're thinking about an MBA but want to stay entrepreneurship focused or if you're wondering how to make bold moves after graduation, this episode is for you. So Julian, thank you so much for joining me. For our audience, do you mind just giving them a little introduction about yourself, your background?

So hello. Hello. Thank you for having me. My name is Julian Gerhard. I come from a small country of Slovakia in the heart of Europe and I study my undergrad in Denmark. And while I was there I realized that I'm really angry at school system back home in Slovakia and that I want to change it. So I decided to go back and I launched a social venture called Zmudri and I like to explain it as a some sort of a Slovakian Khan Academy. So we made video courses for high school kids about topics that they need in everyday life but they don't learn that at school such as financial literacy, how to find a job. And then we shifted more towards civic skills, civic education, teaching critical thinking, media literacy because we found these topics very, very important and not covered sufficiently in school curriculums. So that was something that I've, I've done as my, as my sort of a full time job or like my big life mission. And then I decided that I would like to tackle another challenge. So I applied for, for Oxford mba. I picked Oxford because it was very social impact focused and also social entrepreneurship focused. They also has Kohl center for Social Entrepreneurship and very lucky to have Skoll scholarship as well which enabled me to, to take the MBA course. So that's why I picked it. And I was really, really happy and privileged that I had the opportunity to, to do the MBA in, in such a wonderful place.

And when you went into the Oxford mba, what were you thinking about your venture? Were you thinking about using the MBA to scale it to try to do something different?

That's a very good question. I mean, it was. Well, first of all, it was very difficult to make a decision to even like go to Oxford. Cause I was thinking, okay, like, what's going to be with my venture and what's going to happen and what's going to be my future? So initially I thought a lot about, yes, I'm going to be exposed to new perspective and I'm going to meet new interesting people and learn about new things that I could eventually apply to the venture. But I was also, I had an open mind in terms of whether I want to continue or I want to start something new or I want to join somebody else. But still I could use the knowledge to support my venture on the way and in a different capacity than a director. So I was, I had an open mind and. But I knew for sure that there's a lot to learn. And what I, I saw a huge opportunity in learning about different business models or how we can maybe look at, rethink how we, how we actually operate. Because we're, we're mostly nonprofit focused, even though there are some like commercial models that we also do implement. But it's a, it's in a smaller, smaller scale. But maybe there are different, some models that we could use. That. That's why I was like, I wanted to be exposed more to people who are more for profit or just business driven. So I could see how they think and how that could support my thinking as well.

And did you think about applying to US Schools at all? Was that ever kind of on your radar?

I was, I definitely was and I, I think I've applied to some as well. But I, but it was, I knew that Oxford is like my number one, my number one focus. And also the element of scholarship was really important for me because as a social entrepreneur, I didn't really have that much, that many, that like that many euros on my bank account. And Oxford was like the Skull Scholarship was amazing in that term. So I knew this is like my number one choice.

Awesome. Awesome. And you mentioned kind of going in. Not having complete certainty about this is exactly what I do. I want to scale my venture. When people are going to start the mba, they know they want to do something with entrepreneurship. Would you recommend that they kind of sit down and say, okay, here's my exact plan. I want to develop my business plan, scale my venture, or kind of go into it with a little bit more of an open mind?

I think both approaches are totally fine. I'm type of a person who likes to plan things and who likes to have a good idea of what I'm doing and some sort of a control over what I'm doing. I don't like just jumping into things and then figure out what do I want and who I am. Both approaches are fine. Like, things like MBA are amazing in a way that you meet a lot of different people and a lot of different perspectives and a lot of different types of expertise. So there's a high chance you might explore something new.

Yeah.

So. So if you, if you decide that, okay, I just want to explore something new and figure out whether this is. This is an area I want to go into. MBA is really is really good opportunity because you get in touch with so many different people and especially in places like Oxford. Oxford is not like business school, is like one of many schools that they have here, and they have lots of people from lots of different fields, so you get to meet those people as well. So that's. That's like a huge addition that you're part of a huge ecosystem of different perspectives of different people. So not only MBA is diverse in itself, but also you've got this wider university. And to be frank, like, I would say there were more entrepreneurial, entrepreneurial opportunities in the wider ecosystem than only in the business school. So that's definitely. That's definitely a good approach. But also I think maybe some people think in a way that, oh, I'm thinking about entrepreneurship and I want to do MBA to explore entrepreneurship, or I think I need an MBA because that will help me in my entrepreneurship. I would encourage, or from my experience, from my perspective, I think don't necessarily need MBA to start something. Something new. Entrepreneurship is just about doing stuff, you know, being bold, being brave, having a vision, and just to start. So you definitely don't need MBA necessarily to start something new. It's. It could be very helpful if you approach it correctly, but it's definitely not a prerequisite.

And you mentioned that you took advantage of some of these other entrepreneurial opportunities within the wider Oxford community. Can you share what maybe some of those were?

Yeah, there were like a lot of societies or, or programs where it could just. Just join sort of like lecture series about entrepreneurship. Or it can network with people or there was this entrepreneurship society and they hosted entrepreneurial fairs where there were like different startups or different ideas and you can just go and talk to them or you had a pitch an idea. So we were in a big auditorium, there were like 60 people and 10 people pitched. These weren't like, like tangible startups, they were just ideas. And I pitched myself as a, not as my idea, but I pitched myself. I was just like, hey, I'm Julian, I have this experience and I'm like thinking about, I don't know, like something new. I'm here to explore things. So this is what I am, this is, this is what I've done. If anyone thinks I could be interesting to them or they want to talk to me, feel free to reach out. And I had amazing conversations after and people were, were, were sharing their, their perspectives and sharing their ideas. So that was very helpful. I would even say that there's too much of it like too many societies and too many, too many like programs. So it was kind of chaotic a little bit. But yeah, people are really entrepreneurial, entrepreneurship focused here. So there are plenty of things that you can join.

And I think Oxford of course is known for its rich history and tradition being one of the oldest universities in the world, of course. But what surprised you most about the day to day MBA experience there?

I'd say like two things. One is more positive, one is more, a little bit more negative. The positive thing was that of course, you know, like Oxford has a very good brand and everybody knows the Oxford brand, but once you're there, you, you fully, like, you have an opportunity to fully feel it. And it was amazing to see like how many different talented people are working in Oxford or studying in Oxford or they just come to Oxford just to give a lecture to, just to meet someone. If you invite very interesting people, I don't think a lot of them would say no to Oxford because it's such a, such a strong brand and you have an opportunity to meet like a Nobel, Nobel Prize laureate one day and then Hollywood superstar next day and then on the third day a CEO of like a tech company. That's just normal thing in Oxford. You could just bump into them somewhere on the street because they're heading to give some sort of a speech or lecture somewhere. So that's, I mean it's not that surprising but it's still like I was still surprised and I was still like still, it still was such a nice feeling that I'm like part of this community and I have access to it. And second thing, just you mentioned like, it's very old, very traditional universities. Even though it's such a prestigious university, such a prestigious institution, there are still so many things that like, are very rusty and they don't really work very well, like the IT systems and stuff like that. And you would think, oh, interesting. Yeah, you would think, like institutions like Oxford would have figured it out. So, so that's like, that's some sort of a, I don't know, like a legacy thing where you would. I see it in a, in, in a positive way that, you know, if institutions like Oxford haven't figured these things out, that it's like it's still okay for me to make mistakes.

That's true. They've had almost a thousand years. I'm good.

Yeah, exactly.

And I think when people are looking at MBA programs for a lot of people, having a lot of international diversity and countries represented is a big draw. Right. And it looks great on a brochure, you know, 68 nationalities or whatever it is every year represented. But what does that actually look like in reality? How does international diversity shape your learning and your perspective in a, in the classroom or in the wider community?

Yeah, so I'm going to be very candid here. Definitely, like the global experience and like the exposure to different cultures, different, different sort of nationalities is amazing. And it's such a great opportunities. And I got to learn about lots of different challenges and problems I never thought about before. And it opened my eyes, like just an example, like I always thought before that the global hunger is just like a money problem. And that's like, we can just solve it with, with money. And it just. Maybe they're not enough people who are motivated to give their money into this. But it's pretty much like the, the commodity problem. But then we had some sessions about this and I've realized that it's much more complex than I thought. And you learn about like those different things you've never thought about before, which is amazing. But also what I, what I kept noticing is since we were, we're like 300 plus people on 60 plus nationalities that it's like quite difficult for people to operate there and quite difficult to be inclusive enough. People, like at the beginning they have this ambition of, yeah, I'm gonna, I'm gonna talk to everyone. I'm gonna be like super open minded. But I would say like a huge majority of students eventually like just stayed in their own bubbles, usually ethnically based bubbles. So they kind of ended up sticking to their own or to the people who, who are similar to them, which is understandable, but it's also kind of like a missed opportunity as well. That was one of the challenges that I, I, I wanted to kind of like, solve or at least contribute to solving. So I launched a program. It's called Engage mba. Basically, I. People applied to this program, like the MBA MBA students, and I mixed them into different groups and they were supposed to meet every month, like for three hours, these groups, and just talk, like very candidly, without any computers, without any mobile phones. And they received like a very specific structure. How should they talk and what sort of the. How, what sort of questions they should ask and that they should give update to each other. It really forced them to like, be present in that moment. I tried to make those groups as diverse as possible. And then so I noticed, like, for those who were doing this, it was extremely helpful and they were very grateful that they made amazing friends. But it was difficult for them to meet, like, on a regular basis. It was difficult to, like, get out of that comfort zone. So, so yeah, we have this diversity there, but we're still not very good at, like, utilizing it fully and, you know, getting out there. So still a lot of work to do on our side.

But I love that idea, even if it's just to get out of your kind of comfort zone and not have the phone, not have the computer for three hours. We very rarely do that, just to kind of connect with people around us. I hope they've kept that, I hope they kept that up. That's a really good idea. And let's talk about entrepreneurship at Oxford. That's, you know, one of the things that you had a lot of experience with going in. What kind of support or momentum did you find there for founders?

So as I mentioned, there were a lot of societies and some sort of like, groups or. We had entrepreneurship center at Saeed Business School. We had entrepreneurship project as a part of our curriculum. So basically you had to form a group, you picked your own group and you had an idea and you worked with it for two months, which I think it was, was a very good, very good experience for, for anyone basically, even for people who know that want to go to consulting or investment banking. But still it was, it was to get into the entrepreneurial mindset. It's always very refreshing, even though you want to be investment banker or something else. So, so there's a, there's a lot of support in, in that matter. We also had like a sort of student led VC or some sort of group that made investment into, into startups and that was made like the MBAs had to apply to become like the part of this seed fund. So that was, that was also a great opportunity to like get into this world. And also like I noticed that a lot of classmates were just talking to each other and presenting their ideas and they approached. There were a lot of different entrepreneurs even far more successful than I am and they approached them and asked them like how you've done this and asked for feedback. So there's a lot of like support system within the cohort itself and within the people. If you want to like do entrepreneurship and you're serious about it, you've got plenty of ways to be supported.

So you founded a company before the mba, but then you actually ended up moving into a chief of staff role afterwards. What inspired that pivot and was the MBA part of that at all?

I was kind of certain that I'm not going to join my, my venture, the one I started before my mba that I want to like, like join a different company or a different, different startup. And I was approached by former MBA of Oxford again utilizing the network probably the best way how to find a new opportunity to join the mental health startup startup which, which was based in Oxford. So for me it was, was like definitely my prior startup experience was very helpful because once you have something like this, people who are in startups and entrepreneurs treat you way differently that when you have a corporate experience or experience from large companies. So it was, it was quite easy for me to have conversations like this and I wanted to see how things work in different companies or different organizations because I was building everything out of scratch, from scratch when in my own venture and every single move I've done I was doubting like is this the best way how to do it? Is this like the. I have no idea what I'm doing here and I guess that's how a lot of entrepreneurs feel. So I just wanted to see how it's done at a different company, a different organization. And that's, that's the reason why I wanted to join some, something else. And I'm glad like this, this network of Oxford helped me.

Yeah, absolutely. When you're the entrepreneur, everything's on your shoulders. All the decisions are on you. Even when you're on vacation, you still have to be plugged in because who know, kind of nice to be on the other side of things for a while, right?

Yeah, precisely that. That was one. One of those things that I found frustrating on the journey is like there's no one above you, basically. And for many people that's a good thing. And of course it's a good thing in many contexts, like you're, you're, you're the boss and you're the boss for yourself and stuff like that. But in certain situations, you kind of like want to have someone who you consult with or like who navigates or who gives you some sort of guidance. I mean, you could have mentors for sure, you could share things with them. But still, at the end of the day, it's your decision to make and, you know, you have the best context, so it's still on your shoulders. And many times I was in a position, I was like, I wish I was the dumbest in the room right now. And I want to be in a place where I'm like the dumbest in the room and I can't wait for this.

Yeah, that's a good kind of shift of perspective. Right. And also just gives you the chance to, to take a little bit of that pressure off for a while. Right. Which is probably a nice kind of reset in your career. And what did you do with your venture while you were in the mba?

So I managed to hand it over to two other people. So we were originally six co founders and now none of the original co founders is in the venture, which is good news in a way that we were able to hand it over and other people running it. And I think they're doing a great job. So I'm still. We have like internal board where we make sure that things are strategically fine and okay, but we're not involved in like operations and day to day stuff. So. So it's still running very well. And I'm a type of a person who like, really cares and who's like, I like being control and I like when a thing's done my way. And so it was like, very difficult for me to like, you know, just stand by and watch and not intervene. But it was a good learning experience for me as well, because it's definitely a good skill to have to like, delicate and trust. So. So I found this very challenging but rewarding at the same time.

And I've talked to some clients who think, you know, they've just started a venture maybe six months before the MBA or they're, you know, thinking about, I hate my job. I want to leave and start something right before the mba. And I always say, you know, really think about it, because having one foot in each camp can sometimes be really difficult. You know, the realities and demands of being an entrepreneur and of the mba. Is that advice that you would give people to that they can do it all, that they should try to do it all or maybe pick?

Yeah, I would definitely, from my experience, I would definitely recommend to pick because MBA in itself, it's like even though I was 100% in, I felt like I needed 200% to be in to, to take the most from MBA. And I just cannot imagine doing MBA and also like running your own thing at the same time or working. And I saw some people doing that, to be honest. Like when I, when there were some people who were running their own venture at the same time working on something, I felt like they're not really there. They're not really part of the NBA experience. I don't really see them that often and which I felt kind of like, I felt bad about it because they were very smart and very talented people and I just wanted to spend some time with them or like hear their perspectives. I wanted to see them in class and ask the questions, but they were not there because they were busy. So I think they were missing out a lot. And we were missing out as well because we didn't have them there. So knowing that NBA is particularly requires 200% of you. And the same goes for entrepreneurship even more. I, I probably wouldn't, wouldn't advise to do both.

Some people are out there doing it, but yeah, you know, I don't know if you get the, the most out of both if you do it that way.

Some people manage to do that and, and I, I would probably pick their brain because it seems like an impossible skill to have. But from my experience, I would probably.

How do you sleep?

Yeah.

And I think working within entrepreneurial ventures and startups can sometimes be chaotic and require you to learn on the job and, and do things, face. What's one challenge that you faced post MBA that you couldn't have predicted and that the MBA didn't prepare you for?

Hmm. I, maybe I'm gonna answer in more like general way. I feel like, or I wish MBAs and that goes globally, not just Oxford. We're more focused on like soft skills or like personal skills or an interpersonal skills and ethics skills. I don't know if I can call like that. There are a lot of like heart skills, the great majority of hard skills you can just learn on the way and it just takes you few weeks or a couple of months, but you pretty much just learn by doing. And if you're smart enough, you can learn anything. But like what really makes you stand out. What really makes you exceptional person or successful, potentially successful entrepreneur as well, or successful, whatever. Are like those people skills, like, what kind of a person are you? Are you a good person to work with? Are you a good communicator? Can you pitch your idea very quickly? Can you speak concisively and persuasively? Are you, are you a nice person to work with? Are you ethical? Yeah. Do you have to make like ethical decisions? Can you be trusted? And stuff like that. And these things like there are often overused and like everybody talks about it, but I don't really see like, I wish we had more, more content and more activities focused on that. Because I saw also with my MBA classmates, very smart people, very great hard skills. Maybe the soft side of skillset was a bit neglected also, including myself. There's so many soft skills and personal skills that I lack and I wish I could develop better. And you can only develop it when you work with people. So that's something I kind of missed a little bit. And that's something I would welcome if the MBAs focus on that. Because I feel like, well, MBAs are probably going to be like future managers, like senior managers and CEOs. And basically I bet like job of CEO is mostly people skills and not really like super technical skills about product that they're working on something. So yeah, that's probably something. I wish MBA prepared me more.

I love that. I love that too. And thinking about too, like with pitching yourself, pitching your company as well, it all really comes down to kind of communication skills and so the softer skills, right?

Yeah, precisely. And like there's so many times I see like even entrepreneurship, like people have amazing ideas, but like when they start talking about it, I'm lost after like one minute. And I can't imagine VCs or investors, like, they must be getting lost even more because they get to hear those things all the times. So just like even being able to like pitch your idea in 60 seconds as a skill and a skill in itself, and it's like so obvious, but at the same time so neglected all the time. It takes time. And even for myself, I still feel like I'm talking about my venture for six or seven years and I still feel like I can still talk more effectively about it. I can still handle my pitch in a much better way. It's a very underestimated skill, but very important one.

MBA programs, if you're listening, we have feedback. And one of the things that I think is so interesting is that you've worked in a social venture. Right. So you have a lot of additional pressures beyond the tip, local business and scaling and all of those that you have as well. And what do you think that social ventures really need from business professionals today? And what's something that you'd say is totally overrated?

So what I liked about MBAs when I was part of a cohort, I felt like they get things done. That's what I felt like there was some sort of a problem or I don't know, like we were struggling with accounting or there were some people who have never done accounting before and we had an accounting class. Somebody who had good experience in accounting was like, okay, I'm going to organize this session and like next week and I'm going to teach you guys some basics of accounting. Who has problems with that? So feel free to come. It was just, you know, just like I see a problem, go ahead. I approach it and I'm just, I have this, some sort of the doer approach. So I think like, at least from my experience, when we were hiring people, we were hiring a lot based on attitude and based on like your mentality rather than skills. Because as I mentioned, most of the skills are quite learnable. Of course, I mean if you're a doctor, a lawyer or something. Yeah, that takes years to learn. And I'm probably not going to hire for attitude only if I hire a doctor. But like 90% of the stuff I guess is just like pretty much like common sense stuff that you need to need to learn on, on the way. And so if you're an MBA and looking for a startup, make sure you, you can prove that you have to some sort of a. Yeah, like I'm going here, I'm going to solve this approach and not this. There's some sort of a. Well, I'm the smartest person here because I have like Harvard and McKinsey experience. When I speak with the startup founders right now about these opportunities, they don't really like when somebody spends like three months crafting something that the startup founders already know or some sort of a mission or a strategy or whatever. So, so this sort of going and get things done attitude and also just like genuine interest in the problem or in the mission. So there's like genuine interest to solve, sort of solve the problem that we're here to solve. I think that's what social entrepreneurs are looking for because that's like the, you know, the fuel which drives your performance, drives your engagement. Hiring, I think is the most difficult part of running the business. Or running the organization because it's so such a high risk involved. And there are not that many ways how you can, like, mitigate the risk because you never know, like, with the people. And people can say literally anything during the interview. So it is difficult.

And when you are hiring, how do you try to gauge the alignment with your mission? Because, yeah, that is a really difficult thing. It's easy to maybe put it into ChatGPT, get the perfect script. How do you try to gauge that?

I'm just trying to figure out, for example, to what extent are they knowledgeable about what we do. And when I see that the person is, like, not really familiar what we do, I'm kind of become skeptical quite easily. My co founders laughed at me that I look like a teacher trying to test their students, like, about their knowledge. But sometimes I've just like, asked those questions, like, what do you say about this video, what we've done? Or like, you mentioned that you like our courses on financial literacy. Well, like, what did you like about those videos? I mean, maybe a little bit of a tricky question, but I just wanted to see, like, have you actually seen the videos or you're just talking to impress me? So if you really, if you're genuinely interested in our mission, then you should know what we're actually doing and you should have done your research. So that's like the very first step. And 90% of people fail in that first step because they don't do their research that much. So that's like. Yeah, that's the, that's the number one thing I do. And then it's just, I guess, intuition. I don't think that there are a lot of ways how I can truly test their alignment with, with their mission before they actually start working.

The more you do it, the better you get. Like, I guess with everything, right?

Yeah.

And a lot of MBAs, I think, whether they're in the social entrepreneurship space or not, talk about creating impact. What does that actually look like to you?

That's a fantastic question. That's why we can spend an hour talking about this. Yeah, I mean, a lot of people chose a lot. Or they told me, like, we, we chose Oxford because it's impact focused and it has this impact. Although like every MBA right now claims that it has impact focus. So it begs the question, like, what is the impact? And like, which MPA program really means it and stuff like that. I don't really like, to be honest, that sort of like this distinction or this. There's sort of a virtual line between like non profit and impact and like business as seemingly like two opposite worlds. Which I think it's, it's a very bad way of looking at things because I think you can have a lot of good impact having a for profit entity doing just like pure business which is for profit driven, but you still have a lot of very good impact. Like there's a saying where there's a, there is an approach like every entrepreneurship is social entrepreneurship actually, which I think, I mean even if you're like what, let's say you're, you're producing mugs. So that is an impact. Right. But I mean people able to drink their tea or something.

True. We all need mugs.

So I, I, what I try, what I try to, to talk about when I was interacting with, with the MBAs is like you don't have to work at non profit and you don't have to work with kids or in charities or, or puppies or whatever to, to have an impact. Like you can still work in, in like a normal company and you can ask the questions like how we can make this more effective or efficient and how can we more sustainable or how we can you know, include this sort of group in our activities and that's, that's great impact. Right? You don't have to necessarily work in a like typical impact company or like impact organization or nonprofit. So it's just like this sort of perception that like you can still have a lot of impact even though you're not in traditional industry. And I've also noticed a lot of like, for people from more traditional MBA industries like consulting or investment banking, that for example us school scholars or like social entrepreneurs, that we're some sort of like saviors of the world or something. That we're like soft people who are just like trying to you know, save the world and we don't know anything about earning money and stuff like that. But like you know, sometimes, sometimes running a nonprofit or organization like this requires like way more difficult approach or like way more, less soft approach or being more you know, commercial oriented or.

Yeah.

Or stuff like that. And even like basics like people don't know how actually nonprofits operate. They don't know that nonprofits actually can make a profit. They can like sell the products, sell the services. They just can't like use the profit for shareholders or something, something like that. So it's even like those basic concepts are very foreign to people. They still don't understand it. Imagine nonprofit as an entity where people kind of like live from air and love and they Just hug the trees and do good stuff. And it's just like that's what we do. There's like basic misconceptions even among MBAs who are like very smart, knowledgeable people. Right. So that's what I was like trying to clarify. I even had like fundraising workshops for MBA where I just explained them how we as nonprofit operated and how those like grand writing work and what sort of income you could have and you cannot have and how you work with the money. So that totally like clarified things for them. I'm not sure if I'd really like this sort of impact focusing language because it's much more intertwined and it's much less black and white. And you even working in very traditional non impact industries, you can still have a lot of impact. You just need to start asking the questions and start thinking about how you can like contribute to better world.

I really love that. I remember working with a client, it's been several years now, but she worked in a makeup company and it was, they helped launch the first expanded shade range in their country's history and got amazing feedback from people who felt like, you know, it's the first time I feel like I belong. It's the first time I feel like I actually matter because, you know, for the last hundred, several hundred years, nobody's cared about me, nobody's cared about me wanting to look better. Um, and that makes a huge impact in your life, right? Just like a mug, you know, you don't have anything to drink out of that makes a big impact on your day to day. So I love that idea of reframing it. And you don't necessarily have to go out and work for a nonprofit. Of course that, that is also a great career path. But there's a lot of ways to look for impact in whatever career path you choose if you want to. And there's a lot of roads towards that.

Precisely. And there's also like one thing that made me think about because like when you're, when you're for example, you're running the venture that I have and which is, I mean it sounds like you're naturally have an impact when you make video courses for kids that like the activity in itself sounds like, oh my God, that's like so cute and it's just so helpful and it's important that you like, you keep challenging yourself in that way because let's say we create a video course and it has a lot of good feedback and a lot of teachers say that, oh, it's such an amazing Video course. I love it, kids love it. And I just always use it in my classroom. Is that like, is that a proof of your impact? Is that like really an impact? What are you trying to do here? Are you trying to make a video that everyone likes? Or you're trying to actually teach somebody something? Or you're trying to make them change their behavior? Or you're trying to make them change their behavior but towards a good thing? Or like you can still ask test scores. Precisely. And it's like at the beginning I was like super happy that we had got like great feedback and great numbers and, and, but then I started asking those questions and that made me realize like, oh my God, like I'm not even sure if I have an impact. And, and can I prove it actually? Like, just because somebody likes your book or your course or whatever doesn't mean it's actually like helpful. And even if it is helpful, it doesn't mean that makes them change their behavior, their attitudes towards something. And even if they do change those behaviors and attitudes, it's still not prove that that's like really good for them or for society. So, and what I'm trying to say is here is just like, don't be sugar coated, I don't know what's the right word here, but like, don't be quickly satisfied with the activities that you do. That may seem like being a nice thing to do or impactful, but actually you don't really get into like the root of it and you don't really ask the question of am I truly making a difference here? And am I not, for example, accidentally creating something negative? Like you could also accidentally like cause some problems with your activity without like being very, you know, knowledgeable about this or like without intentions. So yeah, that's also when I'm kind of like trying to understand myself as well, but also kind of like make people not to be very satisfied very quickly with superficial activities.

How did you create those metrics for impact for yourself? Because now my brain is buzzing like, oh my gosh, that's such a conundrum. How did you solve that? How did you go about kind of, of defining those metrics for impact?

It's a good question and it's still a process. Like for example, in our venture would say we had like three levels. The first level was just the numbers of like how many views and what's the engagement. So that gives us some understanding of like whether it's interesting or not, but that's all. And secondly, the second level is like, how they answered in the tests and the quizzes and what they got out of it. So some sort of a understanding of whether they liked it or not and what they took out of it. And then we had impact measurement where we had a group that did not use our courses and then we had a sim similar group that used our courses and we compared how they performed after a couple of months. So that was a bit more like qualified impact measurement. And we saw some sort of differences which of course made us happy. But still it was like, okay, is this enough, enough of a proof? Are we picking the groups in the right way? Shouldn't be sure. We focus on different metrics. Shouldn't we do like different activities? So it's that that part of being an adventure can become very frustrating and it can become very, goes into like philosophical level as well. Question your entire being and, and businesses don't have it. I mean their only impact is the, the bottom line. Right? Like it's, I, I make a profit, I don't make a profit. It's very simple and very straightforward. But with nonprofits, it's or like very impactful convent ventures, it's, it's much more complex but exciting at the same time because it begs to ask very exciting questions. So to answer your question, it's still a process and I, and I still don't know.

It's a moving target. And so let's get into our Fast Pass Insights part of the podcast where we'll go through some rapid fire questions. Our first one, what is one word you would use to describe the Oxford MBA experience?

One word. I would say it's intense. It's just so intense. And I would say the social aspect is so intense. It's, it's. If you're an introvert and you really get the energy from being alone, prepare for being challenged. And prepare that you have to say no many times because. And that was like one of the hardest things to do during the NBA. Like say no to activities and say no to people because there's just so much and you really have to preserve energy and you're going to be sick many times during the year. It's just going to be so draining physically, mentally. So you have to be like, no, I'm just not going to that party or no, I'm not going to that lecture because I just need to rest right now and being okay with the fact that you're not going there, so not have fomo. So intense. I would say it's probably the best.

Word for me that's Good advice. Yeah. Saying no and protecting your energy, we hear that a lot. And avoiding burnout that way. And what professor would you say made the biggest impression on you?

So we had a lot of very impressive professors, so it's really hard to pick, but I'll probably talk about Agni. So Agni was our, she was teaching machine learning and AI and I really liked how structured and specific she was. And she was very diligent in preparation and she was very energetic during the lectures. And I just like when people really care about what they're doing and they're like preparing themselves. You could just like see that she, she made sure this is going to be a good lecture and a good course and she got prepared and the output was like, like worth the Oxford brand. And it's just like so refreshing when you can benefit from like a product or service and you can work with person who's just like very good at what they're doing. And it's, it's still kind of rare in general, but it's just so refreshing to work with that sort of people. So I really like that how she approached it and I like that we talked about AI and machine learning and like, and it's not in this like fancy way in terms of, okay, these are the top, hottest ChatGPT prompts that you can write. But we went to do like the core and the base, the basis of it. Like what is machine learning? How does it, how does it work, how it started in 20 or 30 years ago. So like getting into like the, you know, the, the real foundations and not just like superficial fancy things you see many times on LinkedIn.

So that was all those Instagram courses. Awesome. And what's the biggest mistake you wish you could have avoided as a first time founder?

As a first time founder. So many, so many, so many. It's kind of like hard to answer this question because like those mistakes help you to, to you know, like grow and learn. But I would say for me I'm kind of like, as you may have noticed between the lines that I'm kind of like a strict person. I just have like sort of like expectations and like requirements or I like to work with people who really care and who really engaged and, and many times you as an entrepreneur, but also like a manager in general. You have to learn how to be more maybe forgiving or maybe not take so many things too seriously even though you're like super care about them and know that this is the most important thing to do and you really got to Be responsible, but still like you're working with people, you're working with emotions. So maybe not being strict all the time about too many things. And learn where what's the, like the compromise of like, you know, being less strict and at the same time still have some sort of like maintaining some sort of quality. That's like a very difficult skill for me to, to navigate in. And I've definitely maybe was in the past more strict than I should have been. So that's something. If I had an opportunity to, to improve in the past, I would have done it. But at the same time it was a journey for me. Right. I mean I was like, learn.

So it's a good learning journey. We're all getting better every day.

Exactly. I mean, yeah, it's just, just like working with people, it's, I think it's the most, most difficult job. And some people say it's even like real psychopaths do it, which is crazy. But yeah, it's, it's just, it's difficult and it's like you learn only by doing and there's no way any book or any online course or any advice from anyone experience, like you just, just really have to like live through it. Right?

Yeah.

So it's kind of like hard for me to avoid it.

And what would be your golden buzzer insight for MBAs who want to build entrepreneurial careers? Something that could maybe save them a lot of trial and error.

So what was really, really helpful for me was so when I had this idea of when I returned from, from Denmark and when I knew that this is what I want to launch in Slovakia, I was super inefficient and ineffective. When I was alone, I was just like talking to everyone, but I really hadn't, I haven't done any work, but once I joined with other people and once we formed like co founding team, we were six, which is a lot, definitely not a good idea. But like it was so helpful all of a sudden when I was like in a team of people. So finding someone to start something with and not being alone is probably like my number one learning or number one recommendation. Because you have this sort of accountability all of a sudden. You have the sou, you have the people who give you instant feedback and you immediately learn to work with people from the start just to have someone who, to start with. Because I can't. Like entrepreneurship is so alone and even it's alone, like if you're, even if you are in a group of people, you still might feel very lonely. So I Cannot imagine how lonely it must feel if you're just on your own. For me, it was very helpful when I. When I had a group of people I could.

I could work with and for our final round and if you could go back and relive one part of your Oxford MBA just for the fun of it, what would it be and why?

It would be the mbats. I don't know if you've heard of it.

No, no.

So it's MBAT is like NBA tournament, and it's held in Paris every year. Actually, there was an MBAT last week or this week? No, last week. And it's like the. It's like the Olympics of NBA in Europe.

Fun.

Which is exciting. Yeah. So it's like Oxford, Cambridge, LBs. It's in Paris, in HEC campus. So a couple of Spanish, French, German schools. So it's like around maybe 10 or 15 MBA schools who are participating. It's basically you participate in, like, a lot of. Lot of different disciplines in sports. Also, like computer games, board games, dancing, competition.

Cool.

It takes three days in Paris, and then, you know, you're basically like the points for. For your school and those different disciplines. And at the end of the day, there's like, a big winner who has which school has the most points. So it's like you really prepare for it during the entire school year. You plan it. We have, like, MBAT officer, MBAT team. We design our merch. You have to practice for those competitions because, like, you really want to win. So it really strengthens your team spirit. And it's just like, when we're there, we're all cheering for each other, so it's just lovely experience. A lot of, like, competition as well between the schools. So you get to know other guys from other schools as well. So that was very interesting and very intense.

That sounds fun. What did you compete in?

And Oxford, by the way, won six times before. We were six times in a row. Then we ended up third, so we're the first cohort. And now last week, Oxford won again. Yeah, there was something wrong with our cohort, I guess. And I competed in tennis because I was playing tennis before competitively as a junior. Also in trivia. That's like, you know, tests for nerds.

I know. Well, I competed in that in high.

School, in Counter strike as well. That's like a computer game, so. Yeah, it was like, different. Different categories, so. Cool.

I love, too, that it's not just sports that other people can get involved and everyone can find something that they can compete in that's really cool. Well, Jillian, thank you so much. It's been such a pleasure to have you. Amazing insights about entrepreneurship and ventures and the MBA experience itself. So I really appreciate your time. It's been great to have you.

Thanks for inviting me. And yeah, good luck with all the applications and happy to help and support anyone who asks for help. So feel free to reach out if there's anything I can help with.

Well, thanks so much. That's very kind offer. I appreciate it. And if you guys listening are interested in applying to Oxford and would like help working on your application, we have a 98.9 success rate working with applicants just like you. So if you're ready to build your path, visit ellenlawleyce.com or check the link in the description below and learn more about working with us us. So thank you so much. We'll see you in the next episode.